MLK day
A Planet Visitor
assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
This is a day to personally reflect on your individual contributions to
EQUALITY, or the lack thereof. Because only TRUE EQUALITY can
fulfill that dream. This is a day for inward contemplation. To paraphrase
Lincoln... and I hope not tritely.. "That from (this) honored
dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which (he) gave
the last full measure of devotion.."
This is a day to honor the dead... to Honor Martin Luther King, Jr.
The man, his principles, his dreams... and yes -- his memory as well.
But let's not forget he is MORE than a 'memory.' He embodies the
very principles which should guide our lives. Where will we be 34
years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and hate still be half-full,
or will we have finally emptied it? I certainly don't know, but I do know that
the answer lies in the future behavior of each and every one of us.
PV
Donna Evleth
Dans l'article <27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net>, Desmond Coughlan
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> a écrit :
> le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:36:11 GMT, dans l'article
> <fsWW9.113395$Sa3.2...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
> <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>> What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
>> assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
>> 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
>> come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
>
> Normally, the whole of news:alt.activism.death-penalty considers you a
> perverse joke. In the main, your 'purpose' on this newsgroup is to make
> us all feel good at being normal, and especially, at not being _you. You
> make us laugh, but unfortunately for you, we don't laugh _with_ you, but
> _at_ you. You're recognised as the most inefficient, most inept, least
> educated, most unsophisticated, most violent, least honest, most sexually
> depraved poster that is currently posting to this newsgroup.
>
> In short, you're a disgusting, laughable prick.
>
> However, that being so (and no one would even contemplate stating the
> opposite), this thread will make no one laugh. That the repulsive moron
> who believes that all Germans are stupid, who will never trust an Arab, who
> believes that study after study showing inherent racial bias in the
> administration of the death penalty in the United States, only shows that
> it is 'pro-black', who does not hesitate to call a German 'Adolph', who
> exhibits rampant homophobia in almost every post, who believes that
> 'anti-Semitic' can only refer to the Jew and not to the other half-dozen or
> so Semitic races, who mouths platitudes against a woman's right to choose
> who uses her body, that such an example of sheer, _blinding_, proactive
> stupidity, should seek to hijack the day when his own kind cut down a brave
> young man in the prime of his life ... is beyond the pale.
>
> Martin Luther King Day is not for your kind, Scum. If it were not for you,
> there would be no Martin Luther King Day, for the man himself would not
> have been killed. _You_ bear his blood on your hands. As long as your
> kind exist, then the black will forever be excluded, forever the victim,
> forever a 'second class citizen'.
>
> You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
>
> --
> Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
> desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
> http: // www . zeouane . org
> http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
I thought about Martin Luther King today. I have been thinking about him
for several days now. His non-violence as a basic principle of life is what
I admire the most. He was a great man, cut down too soon, a victim of the
very kind of violence he so abhorred.
Donna Evleth
Richard J
This is the day off from work when a bunch of us teachers used to get
together to hunt feral hogs. I guess each celebrates in his own way.
Teflon
Larry Smith
"Richard J" <ric...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3E2C3EE1...@hotmail.com...
> This is the day off from work when a bunch of us teachers used to get
> together to hunt feral hogs. I guess each celebrates in his own way.
>
> Teflon
King should be given a lot of credit for the wisdom of his methods, and for
the
dream of improving the lot of the black, and - we hope - for all who suffer
under class discrimination, exploitation, greed.
Not just black people suffer.
There has been improvement in the conditions for black people in the USA but
they still don't, and probably never will, have an even playing field to
attain the goals many would set for themselves. But then, neither do most
of us.
Playing fields are often slanted by factors other than race.
Most improved for blacks is life in the American South. According to recent
studies, the North has not done well in its obligation.
Rev. Don Kool
Desi Coughlan wrote:
> A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> explained ...
>>What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
>>assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
>>'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
>>come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
Desi,
> The whole of news:alt.activism.death-penalty considers you a
> perverse joke. In the main, your 'purpose' on this newsgroup is to make
> us all feel good at being normal, and especially, at not being _you. You
> make us laugh, but unfortunately for you, we don't laugh _with_ you, but
> _at_ you. You're recognised as the most inefficient, most inept, least
> educated, most unsophisticated, most violent, least honest, most sexually
> depraved poster that is currently posting to this newsgroup.
>
> In short, you're a disgusting, laughable prick.
Happy to have cleared things up for you,
Don
--
*************************** You a bounty hunter?
* Rev. Don McDonald, SCNA * Man's gotta earn a living.
* Baltimore, MD * Dying ain't much of a living, boy.
*************************** "Outlaw Josey Wales"
Richard J
Playing fields in the US are more often slanted toward socioeconomic
than race now. Because African Americans have many of their community
in the lower socio economic stata, they also have a proportionately
harder time making some gains.
The gains are starting to show, however. If some blacks would stop
continuing to use the white man as the blame for all their problems and
accept responsibility for the consequences of their actions, their
progress would be faster.
Teflon
John Rennie
>
snip
> The gains are starting to show, however. If some blacks would stop
> continuing to use the white man as the blame for all their problems and
> accept responsibility for the consequences of their actions, their
> progress would be faster.
>
> Teflon
>
Rather a tall order, Richard. After all the whites ARE to blame for most
of the economic ills suffered by the blacks. Until you and your ilk
recognise that the blacks haven't got much of a chance.
Dr. Dolly Coughlan
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:32:52 +0000
>
>le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:25:57 +0000, dans l'article <3e2c3e70$0$29455$79c1=
>4f...@nan-newsreader-02.noos.net>, Donna Evleth <dev...@noos.fr> a dit ..=
>.=20
>
>{ snip }
>
>>> You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
>
>> I thought about Martin Luther King today. I have been thinking about h=
>im
>> for several days now. His non-violence as a basic principle of life is=
> what
>> I admire the most. He was a great man, cut down too soon, a victim of =
>the
>> very kind of violence he so abhorred.
>
>I agree, Donna, and that someone whose very _raison d'=EAtre_ on AADP is =
>to
>espouse violent death, should seek to claim that he shares the values of
>one of the 20th century's most peaceable campaigners for equality amongst
>all men ... Doctor King is spinning in his grave, right now.
>
>--=20
>Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
>desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
>http: // www . zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:32:52 +0000
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>
Poor Desi, drunk again! The Dr. Dolly Coughlan archive exists because Desmond
Coughlan lacks conviction in his words. He won't allow his posts to be archived
in Google. Please feel free to use it to your advantage.
Dr. Dolly Coughlan
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:12:50 +0000
>
>le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:36:11 GMT, dans l'article
><fsWW9.113395$Sa3.2...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
><abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>> What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
>> assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
>> 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
>> come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
>
>Normally, the whole of news:alt.activism.death-penalty considers you a
>perverse joke. In the main, your 'purpose' on this newsgroup is to make
>us all feel good at being normal, and especially, at not being _you. You
>make us laugh, but unfortunately for you, we don't laugh _with_ you, but
>_at_ you. You're recognised as the most inefficient, most inept, least
>educated, most unsophisticated, most violent, least honest, most sexually
>depraved poster that is currently posting to this newsgroup.
>
>In short, you're a disgusting, laughable prick.
>
>However, that being so (and no one would even contemplate stating the
>opposite), this thread will make no one laugh. That the repulsive moron
>who believes that all Germans are stupid, who will never trust an Arab, who
>believes that study after study showing inherent racial bias in the
>administration of the death penalty in the United States, only shows that
>it is 'pro-black', who does not hesitate to call a German 'Adolph', who
>exhibits rampant homophobia in almost every post, who believes that
>'anti-Semitic' can only refer to the Jew and not to the other half-dozen or
>so Semitic races, who mouths platitudes against a woman's right to choose
>who uses her body, that such an example of sheer, _blinding_, proactive
>stupidity, should seek to hijack the day when his own kind cut down a brave
>young man in the prime of his life ... is beyond the pale.
>
>Martin Luther King Day is not for your kind, Scum. If it were not for you,
>there would be no Martin Luther King Day, for the man himself would not
>have been killed. _You_ bear his blood on your hands. As long as your
>kind exist, then the black will forever be excluded, forever the victim,
>forever a 'second class citizen'.
>
>You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
>desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
>http: // www . zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 18:12:50 +0000
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Kwag7693
Date: 1/20/03 9:03 PM Eastern Standard Time
>> The gains are starting to show, however. If some blacks would stop
>> continuing to use the white man as the blame for all their problems and
>> accept responsibility for the consequences of their actions, their
>> progress would be faster.
>>
>> Teflon
>>
>
>Rather a tall order, Richard. After all the whites ARE to blame for most
>of the economic ills suffered by the blacks. Until you and your ilk
>recognise that the blacks haven't got much of a chance.
I know that claim is a dogma of the left, but do you bother to actually look
into the issue at all? How exactly are lighter-skinned people who are living
today responsible, on the whole, for the economic conditions of darker-skinned
people, on the whole? In the US, at least, there are a large number of
federal, state and private policies that are explicitly discriminatory in favor
of racial or ethnic minorities and even the allegation of organized
discrimination against minorities brings stigma and often prosecution. Why
wouldn't you assume that perhaps it was the ideas held by the person who fails
to succeed economically that contributes to their failure, especially when so
many people who immigrate to the US, often arriving impoverished and often
illegally, achieve at least moderate economic success?
Kevin
Fred
"Kwag7693" <kwag...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20030120213307...@mb-fe.aol.com...
...
>
> I know that claim is a dogma of the left, but do you bother to
actually look
> into the issue at all? How exactly are lighter-skinned people who
are living
> today responsible, on the whole, for the economic conditions of
darker-skinned
> people, on the whole? In the US, at least, there are a large
number of
> federal, state and private policies that are explicitly
discriminatory in favor
> of racial or ethnic minorities and even the allegation of organized
> discrimination against minorities brings stigma and often
prosecution. Why
> wouldn't you assume that perhaps it was the ideas held by the
person who fails
> to succeed economically that contributes to their failure,
especially when so
> many people who immigrate to the US, often arriving impoverished
and often
> illegally, achieve at least moderate economic success?
Why does Heather get a call for a job interview, and Lashondra
doesn't, all other things being equal?
F
Kwag7693
Date: 1/20/03 10:07 PM Eastern Standard Time
>Why does Heather get a call for a job interview, and Lashondra
>doesn't, all other things being equal?
According to the UC study to which I think you are referring, Lashondra was
approximately 50% less likely to get a call. If we assume that 33% or less of
the population is irrationally bigoted against race, and I think that is
probably overstating the case since perhaps fewer people were just highly
bigoted, that means that 66% isn't. Like I said, we have many examples of
illegal immigrants (not a popular group) achieving fair economic success, and
many immigrant groups as a whole do quite well in the US; I think Occam's razor
would dispense with a vast coherent racist conspiracy much more quickly than
assuming the mindset among certain persons in an ethnic minority is not
conducive to achieving economic success.
Kevin
JIGSAW1695
From: "John Rennie" j.re...@ntlworld.com
Date: 1/20/2003 9:03 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <X%1X9.839$A56.7...@newsfep2-win.server.ntli.net>
>
snip
==============================
Spoken like a true racist, John.
Fred
I recall a lamentably large number of tests in which a black person
or couple was told that an apartment was not available to rent, while
a white person/couple was told 15 minutes later that it was.
F
Richard J
> "Richard J" <ric...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:3E2C93F8...@hotmail.com...
>
>
>
> snip
>
>
>
>>The gains are starting to show, however. If some blacks would stop
>>continuing to use the white man as the blame for all their problems and
>>accept responsibility for the consequences of their actions, their
>>progress would be faster.
>>
>>Teflon
>>
>
>
> Rather a tall order, Richard. After all the whites ARE to blame for most
> of the economic ills suffered by the blacks.
At one time, I agree we did cause them problems and still do cause some.
We underwent integration half a century ago, John. In the 60's most
if not all of the really important non discrimination laws were passed
and implemented fully by the 70's. At what point though do blacks
recognize the fact that we aren't the violent black criminals who prey
on other blacks, that we aren't the cause of fatherless children in
their community, etc?
I've had the opportunity to see applications from several area
businesses and have yet to see one that asked what race the applicant
was. I worked my way through college in both my degrees. Working for
my bachelor's degree, I worked in a feed mill next to other men my age,
some of whom were black and some Hispanic. I didn't make more than they
did, but I did go to class at the university before I worked eight hours
on swing shift. What I did, others can do, but to do it, they have to
stop saying they cannot and blaming others for the color of their skin
and go do it.
Until you and your ilk
> recognise that the blacks haven't got much of a chance.
Bullshit. They have basically the same chance I did, and exactly the
chance my kids did. My kids didn't go to some special school. They
went to public school like most of the black kids do. My kids worked
while they attended college. My youngest son didn't start out with rank
in the service, he earned it by passing exams and working his arse off.
He isn't done yet.
>
>
They have exactly the same chance my kids had in school, and when it
comes to getting grants, my kids had no chance at all. I had a couple
of books when I used to write grant applications for our school that
contained listings of all the federal and state grants for students.
Perhaps 5% of those grants were open to all students. Most, excepting
the Pell Grant, were specifically designated for minorities, and some
more specifically designated for blacks.
I've watched through the last two or so decades as the major emphasis in
Texas schools changed from individualized instruction and getting each
student to be the best they could, to closing the achievement gap
between minorities and whites. Instead of bringing white students up
the the level of blacks, we brought blacks up slightly and lowered the
whites. We taught to mediocrity. Sheer insanity.
You do no one a favor by giving them easier admission standards. What
you say to them in essence is that they are not as good as the white
students, and they can not make it without getting special treatment. I
ask you, is that the message we should be sending, or should we teach
all students that you earn what you get in life by your own excellence?
There has to come a time when blacks have to stand on their own
initiative without blaming whites for everything. We don't help them
reach that point by giving them easier entrance requirements, but by
demanding excellence and giving the same opportunity to succeed.
Teflon
A Planet Visitor
"Desmond Coughlan" <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> wrote in message news:27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net...
> le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:36:11 GMT, dans l'article <fsWW9.113395$Sa3.2...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
<abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
> > assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
> > 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
> > come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
>
<clip the most perverse, disgusting comment that desi has ever provided
to this newsgroup. Beating out even his *giggle* at the death of Mamie
Till Mobley. He finds the assassination of MLK to be a subject of ridicule.
Little wonder so many have seen him as mentally unhinged>
As we appreciate the comments of David Irving, who proves that anti-Semitism
is alive still today... we appreciate your same form of contribution here, which
proves that racism is alive still today. As you demonstrate vividly what a
truly racist swine you actually are. I would not contaminate this thread
repeating the disgusting contributions you have made to racism. But they
have been many.
God help you. God help all such as you. God protect others FROM you.
And God protect others from others like you. You can now return to
praying for escaped murderers.
PV
> --
>Racist desi
A Planet Visitor
"Desmond Coughlan" <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> wrote in message news:kcfh0b....@lievre.voute.net...
le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 19:25:57 +0000, dans l'article <3e2c3e70$0$29455$79c1...@nan-newsreader-02.noos.net>, Donna Evleth
<dev...@noos.fr> a dit ...
{ snip }
>> You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
> I thought about Martin Luther King today. I have been thinking about him
> for several days now. His non-violence as a basic principle of life is what
> I admire the most. He was a great man, cut down too soon, a victim of the
> very kind of violence he so abhorred.
I agree, Donna, and that someone whose very _raison d'être_ on AADP is to
espouse violent death, should seek to claim that he shares the values of
one of the 20th century's most peaceable campaigners for equality amongst
all men ... Doctor King is spinning in his grave, right now.
Murder is violent death. That is what YOU espouse. In your
PRAYERS for the safe escape of those who murder. You disgusting
swine. You represent the personification of total evil, having turned
this thread into the most sickening diatribe ever seen, because you
are unable to deal with the reality of your evil. Unable to recognize
the intense hate you have for others which presumes the torture
and murder of those you hate, as a domestic cat tortures and kills a
sparrow, is quite acceptable to you.
I will not respond to any more evil that you direct toward me this
thread. Since it represents a direct insult to the very meaning of
his life.
PV
--
> Racist desi
Dr. Dolly Coughlan
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 21:44:42 +0000
>
>le Tue, 21 Jan 2003 06:46:50 GMT, dans l'article
><u16X9.113982$Sa3.2...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
><abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>>> > What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
>>> > assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day
>of
>>> > 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
>>> > come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
>
>> <clip the most perverse, disgusting comment that desi has ever provided
>> to this newsgroup. Beating out even his *giggle* at the death of Mamie
>> Till Mobley. He finds the assassination of MLK to be a subject of
>ridicule.
>> Little wonder so many have seen him as mentally unhinged>
>
>Regrettably, it is often necessary to break a few eggs to make an omelette.
>Your pitiful attempt to appear 'just' by soiling the name of Dr King with
>your mouth, made the breaking of those eggs necessary. I will not stand
>idly by, as the George Wallace of the 21st century, hiding behind anonymity
>whilst loudly proclaiming himself to be 'accountable' for his words, tries
>to hijack the name of a great man whose death is a direct result of the
>policies of his kind. His blood is on your hands, and on the hands of
>every white racist prick like you. Preach to your own stunted kind as much
>as you wish, but don't expect to come on to AADP, try to appear moral when
>you're anything but, and expect me to sit and let you get away with it, you
>revolting, racist, murderer lover piece of shit.
>
>Now hold out your hands in front of you, and cry, 'Will these hands ne'er
>be clean ??' Now put on your pseudo-intellectual hat, and pretend that you
>knew who said them.
>
>> As we appreciate the comments of David Irving, who proves that
>> anti-Semitism is alive still today... we appreciate your same form of
>> contribution here, which proves that racism is alive still today.
>
>FuckWit proves that he was at the back of the queue when brains and honesty
>were being given out. His juxtaposition of David Irving with me, when at
>no time have I uttered one racist statement, is laughable. Or would be, if
>all of AADP did not know that in fact, _he_ is the racist. Just as he
>hinted once that I had said that I would like to 'stand across the street
>and kill the Jew'. Just as even now, he somehow perverts (a verb which is
>close to his heart) my criticism of a white racist prick like him,
>mentioning Martin Luther King, into _my_ somehow being racist.
>
>No doubt about it, FuckWit is beneath our contempt. Indeed, no poster here
>with any moral backbone or intellectual honesty, can do anything other than
>spit on him, when he posts. If, that is, we do not resent his dirtying our
>saliva.
>
>> As you demonstrate vividly what a truly racist swine you actually are.
>> I would not contaminate this thread repeating the disgusting
>> contributions you have made to racism. But they have been many.
>
>As 'JPB' has already observed, the thread from which FuckWit disappears, is
>the thread in which his thrashing has been particularly savage. One can
>only hope that the next time he looks in the mirror, that tears roll down
>his face. Tears of shame. And that he bloodies his fist, as it slams into
>the mirror, such is his hatred of himself. It will never equal the hatred
>felt by all reasonable people, of what he represents. Of the subjugation
>of the black.
>
>{ snip remainder of the World's Most Stupid Man's imprecations to his
> imaginary deity }
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
>desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
>http: // www . zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
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erlin.de!uni-berlin.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Thu, 23 Jan 2003 21:44:42 +0000
>Lines: 66
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><27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net>
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>
>
Poor Desi, yet another drunken lie! The Dr. Dolly Coughlan archive exists
A Planet Visitor
"Desmond 'I'm a racist and proud of it' Coughlan" <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> wrote vomited in message
news:aonp0b....@lievre.voute.net...
> le Tue, 21 Jan 2003 06:46:50 GMT, dans l'article <u16X9.113982$Sa3.2...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
<abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
> >> > What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
> >> > assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
> >> > 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
> >> > come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
>
> > <clip the most perverse, disgusting comment that desi has ever provided
> > to this newsgroup. Beating out even his *giggle* at the death of Mamie
> > Till Mobley. He finds the assassination of MLK to be a subject of ridicule.
> > Little wonder so many have seen him as mentally unhinged>
>
desi admits he has acted as a 'mentally unhinged' egg, to turn himself
into a racist omelette. Not necessary, desi... everyone already knows
you are... you didn't need to come 'mentally unhinged' to prove it any
further. So apology accepted.
> Your pitiful attempt to appear 'just' by soiling the name of Dr King with
> your mouth, made the breaking of those eggs necessary. I will not stand
> idly by, as the George Wallace of the 21st century, hiding behind anonymity
> whilst loudly proclaiming himself to be 'accountable' for his words, tries
> to hijack the name of a great man whose death is a direct result of the
> policies of his kind.
LOL... You racist swine... you pitiful racist swine... you pig of an ignorant
racist swine. Get the picture? ... you racist swine. And notice..
not one exclamation mark. Simply a very refined, dignified, totally
detached observation of your posting history.... you miserable racist
swine.
desi cannot stand that I continue to provide evidence of his racism...
using his own words. While he just hysterically bangs his head in
frustration, raging on and on, yet unable to provide even one quote
from my words that would show I've ever displayed any racism.
While I provide quote after quote of his words, clearly showing that
he's simply a sickening racist swine.
<racist swine insults clipped>
> > As we appreciate the comments of David Irving, who proves that
> > anti-Semitism is alive still today... we appreciate your same form of
> > contribution here, which proves that racism is alive still today.
>
> FuckWit proves that he was at the back of the queue when brains and honesty
> were being given out.
Sure, desi... but that doesn't change the fact that you're an anserine,
pseudo-intellectual racist swine. You are so sad.
> His juxtaposition of David Irving with me, when at
> no time have I uttered one racist statement, is laughable.
Yes, desi... but it's not nice for a witless, uneducated racist swine
to lie. The list of your racist comments is long.... verrrrrry looooog.
And denial is only a loooong river in Egypt.
> Or would be, if
> all of AADP did not know that in fact, _he_ is the racist. Just as he
> hinted once that I had said that I would like to 'stand across the street
> and kill the Jew'.
Actually, it was more than a hint... you boorish, moronic racist swine.
You've demonstrated words that imply just that... accept it in the
pejorative, if you wish... but make no mistake.. it's closer to home
than you think in respect to your views on the Jews... that you've
referred to as committing 'butchery.'
> Just as even now, he somehow perverts (a verb which is
> close to his heart) my criticism of a white racist prick like him,
> mentioning Martin Luther King, into _my_ somehow being racist.
>
I never doubted that 'perverts' are 'close to your heart,' you perverted,
corrupt racist swine. Nor did I ever assume you would be
able to see yourself in the mirror... eisoptrophobia.. you know.
You ghoulish, sadistic racist swine.
> No doubt about it, FuckWit is beneath our contempt. Indeed, no poster here
> with any moral backbone or intellectual honesty, can do anything other than
> spit on him, when he posts. If, that is, we do not resent his dirtying our
> saliva.
>
Not nice words... but certainly in line with your view that abolitionists
should seek out, torture and murder retentionists... you maggot-infested,
morally cancer-ridden racist swine.
> > As you demonstrate vividly what a truly racist swine you actually are.
> > I would not contaminate this thread repeating the disgusting
> > contributions you have made to racism. But they have been many.
>
> As 'JPB' has already observed, the thread from which FuckWit disappears, is
> the thread in which his thrashing has been particularly savage.
I still would not sully this thread with even one of your racist comments,
you degenerate, vicious racist swine. There are quite a few already
out there... and they will always be available for me to report on you,
you vile, disgusting racist swine.
> One can
> only hope that the next time he looks in the mirror, that tears roll down
> his face. Tears of shame. And that he bloodies his fist, as it slams into
> the mirror, such is his hatred of himself. It will never equal the hatred
> felt by all reasonable people, of what he represents. Of the subjugation
> of the black.
>
> { snip remainder of the World's Most Stupid Man's imprecations to his
> imaginary deity }
>
Clipping your own stuff again. Do you mean the one where you
prayed for escaped murderers to 'make it to Mexico,' you crass,
dissolute racist swine? Or do you mean the one where you
pronounced yourself a messenger from 'echo $DEITY' to announce
that He had given retentionists to all abolitionists to
torture and murder, as the domestic cat tortures and kills the sparrow,
you maniacal, coocoo racist swine?
Gentle reader -- the purpose of this thread began quite innocently,
with a tribute to a civil rights leader. I expected little or no remarks,
other than comments on HIS (MLK) works, or even disagreement
with those works. I was simply opening a door to recognition of the
day. I never anticipated the INFINITE hate that desi feels for Black
Americans, although I knew he was an impotent racist swine.
I recognize, and most Americans recognize (desi, the degenerate,
corrupt racist swine, agreeing with a racist philosophy, being
out of that particular loop), that America still has a very long road to
travel to end racism. The same racism that desi would rather see
perpetuated in the U.S., since it meets his agenda, both as a racist,
and being able to point his finger at America, and pretend he is not,
even though everyone here knows he is.
Note gentle reader, that my benign post was immediately turned into
a raging caldron of racist swine desi's hate... that consummate evil,
hallucinating racist swine. Seething anger, crazed ravings, and a
psychotic decent into the depth of the most depraved example of
racism one can imagine erupted from the dark depths of his soul.
A soul so contaminated with venom-filled poisonous hate for ALL
Americans, was now given an 'opportunity' to demonstrate that
any previous display of his racism would be seen as only a precursor.
A precursor to his admission that he dwells in a black globe of existence.
A globe so intense that time, space and energy become nothing in
the face of that all-consuming hate for his species, which he focuses
on Americans... All Americans...
A black globe of hate so intense, and so compressed that it functions
similar to the concept of the Schwarzschild radius...so compact and
so dense, that the very concept of rational thought, understanding, intellect,
dignity, respect for one's fellow man cannot escape, held tight by
the gravitation-like pull of desi's hate. We can expect no form of
rational content to emerge from that crucible of raging racism. All
humanity is lost and can never emerge from the black hole created by
desi's black globular world of racism. Not a pretty picture... gentle
reader. But racism is never 'pretty.'
It isn't often easy to 'look' racism in the eye.. but we have a special
opportunity to do so here... to look at desi and see the anger.. the
raving... the depraved indifference that seeps out of his probably
tortured inner person. We ask ourselves... What makes such a
person? Why would someone attack a tribute to MLK? What drives
such a man? Is it possible that nature could have done this? Or
was it the circumstances of his youth? How can someone be so
consumed with hate for his fellow man? How can someone not
CARE... as desi shows he doesn't care... by using that 'special word'
of the most depraved meaning, in reference to blacks, OVER and OVER?
We ask ourselves, gentle reader. But the answers really have
eluded us, as long as those such as desi, the raving, lunatic
racist swine presume that they have a voice. Racism HAS NO
VOICE. No voice of reason... only a strident, shrill whine. As
desi displayed here. The whine of a racist.
PV
> --
> Ayatollah desi |Superlunary and Most Exalted
> |Spiritual Leader of the Universal
> |Right to Life Church. (umm... get
> |away from me -- you filthy black
> |starving child in Africa) 'My church'
> |isn't for you.
> http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
Am I obsessed with fighting 'evil'? Damn... I'm 'Superman' when
it comes to fighting desi's 'forces of evil.' References to a post which
insightfully pronounced of desi --
"'Cancerous' is almost a compliment when one views most of
desi's comments -- other forms spring more easily to mind --
it is a parasitic diarrhea of the brain... it is crazy chick disease
transferred to our thinking process -- it is a swarm of latrine flies
settling on our ability to process information --- it is maggots
feasting on the bodies of numberless victims of murder. It is
madness. utter madness. It is Desmond Coughlan."
Every evil, vile thought that has ever swept across this group from
desi's pen, as Genghis Kahn (or Attila the Hun, if you prefer) swept
his broad scythe of rape, death and destruction, in long, broad,
excruciating strokes across Europe, stand as stark images of his
perverse character. And we stand witness to that depravity.
A Planet Visitor
"Desmond Coughlan" <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> wrote in message news:qceu0b...@lievre.voute.net...
> { infantile change of 'Subject:' line left intact, as testimony to FW's
> puerile [1] 'debating' tactics }
>
> le Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:55:43 GMT, dans l'article <z48Y9.122454$Sa3.3...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
<abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
> { snip }
>
> >> Regrettably, it is often necessary to break a few eggs to make an omelette.
desi.. taking time-out from his 'cross-burning' activities admits --
> That regrettably, I had to use stronger than usual language, to express my
> revulsion that 2003's 'version' of George Wallace, was trying to 'garner'
> credibility, by associating his name with the name of a great man whom his
> kind had cut down, rather than confer equality; rather than abandon their
> institutionalised apartheid; rather than treat the black man as their
> equal.
>
> Yes, it is regrettable that I was forced to do so. I apologise to the
> group for my strong language.
As well you should. Attacking a poster for personal reasons, about
a post that was meant as nothing more than a tribute, is attacking the
concept of that tribute, more than the poster. Your pitiful attack on
me personally, doesn't bother me one bit. It's something I've become
accustomed to, since you've called me a pedophile on seven different
occasions, for no other reason but to provide an insult, since there
is absolutely no evidence in any of my posts that I hold such a
depraved character. While your character in that respect can be brought
into question, since it rather pushes the envelope of our sensibilities,
in the way you salivate all over this newsgroup about those having only
entered puberty for a short time.
And that goes to the heart of this dialog as well. You will never find
anything from me but the admission that the U.S. is a racist society,
and I abhor such racism... having gone so far as to state that 'we
are a nation without honor,' until we solve the problem of racism.
While my calling you a racist, is clearly substantiated by YOUR OWN
WORDS. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=bjsY9.175491%24j8.4366725%40twister.tampabay.rr.com&oe=UTF-8
<clipped....>
...A pitiful bleating vitriol from desi, hoping to dissuade from the fact that he has
been proven a racist. The very fact that racist swine desi ATTACKED a tribute to
MLK, regardless of the poster, demonstrates once again, that any expression
of the need for civil rights and an expression of a hope for achieving those
civil rights for those we realize are truly disenfranchised, will be met by a
reply from desi. A reply containing the most unbelievably crass, insensitive, filthy,
ferociously offensive, loathsome, unclean, vile and evil racist zealot ravings
a rational person can imagine. David Duke -- meet your counterpart -- Desmond
Coughlan.
God Bless Texas
to opine:
[random string of epithets excised]
Wow, who left the door open?
--
All Chat no Cattle
Dr. Dolly Coughlan
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: the whine of a racist desi
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 01:04:21 +0000
>
>In alt.activism.death-penalty God Bless Texas
><nowhic...@nospam.nowhere.com> wrote:
>
>> Since the Texans scored their last touchdown, Desmond Coughlan saw fit
>> to opine:
>>
>> [random string of epithets excised]
>>
>> Wow, who left the door open?
>
>LMAO !!
>
>Look, do you dumbass fuckers have to make this quite so easy ??
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
>desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
>http: // www . zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
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>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: the whine of a racist desi
>Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2003 01:04:21 +0000
>Lines: 18
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
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>X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1043543298 31500294 212.198.68.117 (16 [91468])
Dr. Dolly Coughlan
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: the whine of a racist desi
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:35:38 +0000
>
>{ infantile change of 'Subject:' line left intact, as testimony to FW's
> puerile [1] 'debating' tactics }
>
>le Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:55:43 GMT, dans l'article
><z48Y9.122454$Sa3.3...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor
><abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>{ snip }
>
>>> Regrettably, it is often necessary to break a few eggs to make an
>omelette.
>
>> desi admits
>
>That regrettably, I had to use stronger than usual language, to express my
>revulsion that 2003's 'version' of George Wallace, was trying to 'garner'
>credibility, by associating his name with the name of a great man whom his
>kind had cut down, rather than confer equality; rather than abandon their
>institutionalised apartheid; rather than treat the black man as their
>equal.
>
>Yes, it is regrettable that I was forced to do so. I apologise to the
>group for my strong language. Language that no one on the esteemed group
>that is news:alt.activism.death-penalty will be used to hearing from me.
>However, I do not 'apologize' (sic) to you. That you are a fuckwit is no
>longer a matter of debate. That you engage in racialist abuse aimed at the
>minorities in our society, is a fact easily verified by 'goggle' (sic).
>That you accuse _others_ of the very racism that you spew onto
>news:alt.activism.death-penalty like a poison, is taken for granted, but
>not taken seriously. All of that is known to all on the newsgroup, and you
>are the laughingstock of the newsgroup now, thanks in no small part to the
>work of news:alt.activism.death-penalty's 'garbage disposal men', dirt and
>my good self. In that respect, you are harmless. We have 'tamed' you,
>just as several years ago, I 'tamed' Scooter-Boy [2], or 'Drewl' as he was
>universally known at that time. You, and he, are nothing but pathetic
>jokes on news:alt.activism.death-penalty, held up as shining examples of
>how _not_ to post. You can do no harm here in 99% of cases; I have seen to
>that.
>
>However, when your hands, dripping with the blood of Martin Luther King as
>he lay dying in his friends' arms, type the sort of 'fowl' (sic ... ho, ho,
>ho ...) and pathetic attempts to bask in the reflected glory of a proud and
>noble visionary for whose death you are indirectly responsible, I will not
>remain silent.
>
>This group is not known for the moral character of its posters. This was
>demonstrated only a few months ago, when only three people here had the
>guts to stand up and be counted, when another poster engaged in a heinous
>episode of emotional blackmail [3].
>
>Thus no one should be surprised that only I had the courage to cast you
>down, as you glorify in the death of Dr King. As you gloat whilst
>thinking of white slaveowners raping their female slaves. As you ejaculate
>over the pictures of lynchings, whilst regretting that 'we can't done and
>show 'em boys whose [sic] boss today, y'all ...'
>
>{ snip repeated screams as FuckWit expresses his frustration that I am 'on
> to' him as the filthy racist that he is, followed up with some more
> 'fabrications' that he attributes to me, ended with the now customary
> claim of 'victory' }
>
>You have been shown up for the racist that you are, FuckWit. Accept it,
>and try to live with your shame.
>
>[1]
>url:http://groups.google.com/groups?ie=ISO-8859-1&as_umsgid=rC7o9.56678%2
4g73.1937553%40twister.tampabay.rr.com&lr=&hl=fr
>
>[2] url:http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/scooter-boy.jpg
>[3]
>url:http://groups.google.com/groups?q=spastic+group:alt.activism.death-pe
nalty+author:Rennie&hl=fr&lr=&ie=UTF-8&scoring=d&selm=S%258w9.628%24J45.60
637%40newsfep1-win.server.ntli.net&rnum=2
>
>url:http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl1228146609d&dq=&hl=fr&lr=&ie=U
TF-8&selm=pmo3sugd6fs6qptrl3h7go1f132el9o63f%404ax.com
>
>
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl3474140743d&dq=&hl=fr&lr=&ie=UT
F-8&selm=3dc1eda9_6%40goliath.newsgroups.com
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
>desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
>http: // www . zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty,austin.general
>Subject: Re: the whine of a racist desi
>Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2003 16:35:38 +0000
>Lines: 71
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
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>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/drewls_wifes_scooter.jpg
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>Xref: lobby alt.activism.death-penalty:296124 austin.general:327584
Desmond Coughlan
[ From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> ]
[ Subject: Re: MLK day ]
[ Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty ]
[ Message-ID: <27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net> ]
<Thanks to having my own NNTP server that does not expire any posts, this
is the original text, my response to FW, when he attempted to assuage his
guilt at having the blood of Martin Luther King on his hands.>
le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:36:11 GMT, dans l'article <fsWW9.113395$Sa3.2633235@twister.
tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
> What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
> assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
> 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
> come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
Normally, the whole of news:alt.activism.death-penalty considers you a
You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
--
Desmond Coughlan |Yamaha YZF-R1
desmond @ zeouane.org |'Ze Ouane!'
http: // www . zeouane . org
http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
--
Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
http://www.zeouane.org/
http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
\ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
| | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
|_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
JIGSAW1695
From: Desmond Coughlan pasdespa...@zeouane.org
Date: 2/23/2003 3:19 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <oumni-...@zeouane.org>
You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
Desmond Coughlan
===============================
Sounds like Dezi is trolling again!
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:34:47 +0000
>
>le 23 Feb 2003 21:31:31 GMT, dans l'article
><20030223163131...@mb-cn.aol.com>, JIGSAW1695
><jigsa...@aol.com> a dit ...
>
>{ snip repost of my classic slapping down of FW's racist attempts to wash
> MLK's blood from his white trash hands }
>
>> Sounds like Dezi is trolling again!
>
>Sounds like Shit-For-Brains is the most retarded, sister-shagging, 'asshole'
>(sic) to post to news:alt.activism.death-penalty ...
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
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reader.com!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!fu-berlin.de!un
i-berlin.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 21:34:47 +0000
>Lines: 19
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
>Message-ID: <ncrni-...@zeouane.org>
>References: <oumni-...@zeouane.org>
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>User-Agent: tin/1.5.14-20020926 ("Soil") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.5-RELEASE (i386))
>
>
Dolly Coughlan Jr, the legend continues!
As Desi lies, the archive grows!
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 20:19:04 +0000
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
>Path:
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t!newsfeed.fjserv.net!feed.news.nacamar.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!e117
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>-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 20:19:04 +0000
>Lines: 64
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><27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net>
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A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le 23 Feb 2003 21:31:31 GMT, dans l'article <20030223163131...@mb-cn.aol.com>, JIGSAW1695 <jigsa...@aol.com> a dit ...
>
>{ snip repost of my classic slapping down of FW's racist attempts to wash
> MLK's blood from his white trash hands }
>
>> Sounds like Dezi is trolling again!
>
>Sounds like Shit-For-Brains is the most retarded, sister-shagging, 'asshole'
>(sic) to post to news:alt.activism.death-penalty ...
>
Quite right, desi. You obviously were not trolling... you were simply trying
to hide from your racism. And you've went into hyperdrive in that denial....
because it has been so effectively PROVEN by me. Your only hope of
escape is to continue with your lies, and hope someone -- JPB/dirt --
ROTFLMAO -- support you. You see, desi... I use YOUR WORDS
to prove your racism... you have NOTHING but lying accusations.
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi |Superlunary and Most Exalted
|Spiritual Leader of the Universal
|Right to Life Church. (umm... get
|away from me -- you filthy black
|starving child in Africa) 'My church'
|isn't for you.
http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html Am
I obsessed with fighting 'evil'? Damn... I'm 'Superman' when
it comes to fighting desi's 'forces of evil.' References to
a post which insightfully pronounced of desi -- "'Cancerous'
is almost a compliment when one views most of desi's
comments -- other forms spring more easily to mind -- it is
a parasitic diarrhea of the brain... it is crazy chick
disease transferred to our thinking process -- it is a swarm
of latrine flies settling on our ability to process
information --- it is maggots feasting on the bodies of
numberless victims of murder. It is madness. utter madness.
It is Desmond Coughlan." Every evil, vile thought that has
ever swept across this group from desi's pen, as Genghis
Kahn (or Attila the Hun, if you prefer) swept his broad
scythe of rape, death and destruction, in long, broad,
excruciating strokes across the face of humanity, stand as
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>[ This is a repost of the following article: ]
>[ From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> ]
>[ Subject: Re: MLK day ]
>[ Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty ]
>[ Message-ID: <27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net> ]
>
> <Thanks to having my own NNTP server that does not expire any posts, this
> is the original text, my response to FW, when he attempted to assuage his
> guilt at having the blood of Martin Luther King on his hands.>
>
TRANSLATION -- "I will decide when I want my posts to expire. Usually
when I wish to hide my words. And I will now try to find a way to do
_damage control_." desi... you're a racist... why even bother denying it?
>le Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:36:11 GMT, dans l'article <fsWW9.113395$Sa3.2633235@twister.
>tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>> What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
>> assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
>> 'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
>> come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
>
And the rest of my tribute was --
"This is a day to personally reflect on your individual contributions to
EQUALITY, or the lack thereof. Because only TRUE EQUALITY can
fulfill that dream. This is a day for inward contemplation. To paraphrase
Lincoln... and I hope not tritely.. "That from (this) honored
dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which (he) gave
the last full measure of devotion.."
This is a day to honor the dead... to Honor Martin Luther King, Jr.
The man, his principles, his dreams... and yes -- his memory as well.
But let's not forget he is MORE than a 'memory.' He embodies the
very principles which should guide our lives. Where will we be 34
years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and hate still be half-full,
or will we have finally emptied it? I certainly don't know, but I do know that
the answer lies in the future behavior of each and every one of us."
PV
Repeating "This is a day to honor the dead... to Honor Martin Luther King, Jr."
desi then presumed IMMEDIATELY to INSULT the day, the man
and the memory. With the following obscene racist insult to that man.
>Normally, the whole of news:alt.activism.death-penalty considers you a
>perverse joke. In the main, your 'purpose' on this newsgroup is to make
>us all feel good at being normal, and especially, at not being _you. You
>make us laugh, but unfortunately for you, we don't laugh _with_ you, but
>_at_ you. You're recognised as the most inefficient, most inept, least
>educated, most unsophisticated, most violent, least honest, most sexually
>depraved poster that is currently posting to this newsgroup.
>
>In short, you're a disgusting, laughable prick.
>
>However, that being so (and no one would even contemplate stating the
>opposite), this thread will make no one laugh. That the repulsive moron
>who believes that all Germans are stupid,
My words --
"And, I would also imagine that most Germans
(arguably the most intelligent race on this planet), would
also cry when they see the stupidity displayed by one of
their own. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=eHGd5.2607%24U56.72197%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
Mu words to another German poster --
"From comments such as you make, have come the references to
the Germans being Brilliant in the collective sense, and Arrogant in
the individual sense." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=osGh5.1567%24Z6.73876%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
Of course, your claim is a lie. There are stupid people all over
the world. You are stupid. But I certainly wouldn't call all the
Irish stupid. Phraseology such as that, I leave to you... in your
bigoted views of ALL abolitionists... ALL Americans... ALL
"smelly auslanders," and your implication that ALL Germans
_smell of sausage_.
> who will never trust an Arab,
Another lie... If I even implied that, it would be about the LEADERS
of the Palestinians, whom I trust as LITTLE as the LEADERS of
Israel.
> who
>believes that study after study showing inherent racial bias in the
>administration of the death penalty in the United States, only shows that
>it is 'pro-black',
These are the statistics for those on DR -- from
url:http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/drrace.htm
White murderers on DR average about 2,000
Black murderers on DR average about 1,500
Then... see
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/race.htm
Here, it is noted that ALL murders are committed by 51.5%
Blacks, and 46.4% Whites. Yet, Whites outnumber Blacks
on DR by 4 to 3 (see above 2,000 - 1,500).
> who does not hesitate to call a German 'Adolph',
When ANYONE fits that profile, I'll certainly call him ANYTHING.
Such I call you a RACIST... since YOU fit that profile.
who
>exhibits rampant homophobia in almost every post, who believes that
>'anti-Semitic' can only refer to the Jew and not to the other half-dozen or
>so Semitic races,
Quite certainly it CANNOT, without trying to rewrite the English Language
See --
http://home.earthlink.net/~onetimeuse/OED%20Online%20-%20anti-Semitism.htm
Quoting -- Anti-Semitism -- "Theory, action, or practice directed against the
Jews. Hence anti-Semite, one who is hostile or opposed to the Jews;
anti-Semitic a."
It is unfortunate that this word was coined as it was, but there is no doubt that
linguistically and semantically it is applied ONLY to the Jews, and is of more
recent origin. I would think that you _claiming_ to be Jewish, would be well
aware of the origin and specific meaning of that term.
> who mouths platitudes against a woman's right to choose
>who uses her body,
Let ANY human, try to enter a doctor's office and DEMAND
that his/her viable right arm be AMPUTATED. The wagon to
the _funny farm_ will be right along. The fact is a viable fetus
is certainly more INDEPENDENT from that woman than her
right arm, yet you presume she can DEMAND that this
semi-independent LIFE be amputated from her body. How
very moral of you!!! While you also presume that murderers
should be freed if the only choice is freeing them or executing
them.
> that such an example of sheer, _blinding_, proactive
>stupidity, should seek to hijack the day when his own kind cut down a brave
>young man in the prime of his life ... is beyond the pale.
>
You seemed to find it offensive to provide such a tribute.
>Martin Luther King Day is not for your kind, Scum.
LOL. MLK is for EVERYONE who believes in human equality.
He is OBVIOUSLY not for YOUR kind, you racist monster.
> If it were not for you,
>there would be no Martin Luther King Day, for the man himself would not
>have been killed.
Rubbish.. you as well as pulled the trigger, as you posted your
hideous insult to him in your remark to my post.
> _You_ bear his blood on your hands.
You will NEVER be able to wipe the shame of that blood from
YOUR hands, in respect to your ugly, sickening insult to him,
as long as I still contibute to this group. I will CONSTANTLY
remind you of the insult you provided to a tribute to him. That
is why you are FEVERISHLY trying to do _damage control_ as
your racism is being exposed.
> As long as your
>kind exist, then the black will forever be excluded, forever the victim,
>forever a 'second class citizen'.
>
You're the racist... and everyone can see it. You became OUTRAGED
that SOMEONE could presume to provide a tribute to him. You're an
insult to our species. A throwback to a time when Blacks were handled
like chattel. And your kind would hope to PERPETUATE that impression
of Blacks.
>You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
>
Yes... you certainly are.
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi
Ayatollah desi
Another choice comment from desi, that I will be reminding him of --
"I would rather see the extinction of the human race, than allow one innocent to
be put to death by the state." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=87wvtkfeg2.fsf%40lievre.coughlan.fr
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Mon, 24 Feb 2003 07:56:54 GMT, dans l'article <uojj5v8gts5fjht4n...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>>>{ snip repost of my classic slapping down of FW's racist attempts to wash
>>>MLK's blood from his white trash hands }
>
>>>> Sounds like Dezi is trolling again!
>
>>>Sounds like Shit-For-Brains is the most retarded, sister-shagging,
>>>'asshole' (sic) to post to news:alt.activism.death-penalty ...
>
>> Quite right, desi. You obviously were not trolling... you were simply
>> trying to hide from your racism. And you've went into hyperdrive in that
>> denial.... because it has been so effectively PROVEN by me. Your only
>> hope of escape is to continue with your lies, and hope someone --
>> JPB/dirt -- ROTFLMAO -- support you. You see, desi... I use YOUR WORDS
>> to prove your racism... you have NOTHING but lying accusations.
>
>Really, ROTFLMAO !! FW 'has went' (sic) over the edge into ballistic mode,
>such is the hammering that he has received the past month from me, dirt,
>'JPB', and in fact just about everyone on AADP who matters and even a few
>deathies. LOL ... watch him jump, watch him repost his 900 line spam
>response to 'JPB' ... watch him repost his long list of 'racist' statements
>by me, which even _he_ ... sorry, 'HE' (sic) has admitted do not constitute
>racist statements by me ...
>
Oh, I've ALWAYS asserted they were YOUR racist statements. Simply that
a few of them presumed to CLAIM they were from another, does not mean
they were not YOURS, you racist swine. It is sickening that you would hide
behind the facade of CLAIMING those slurs came from another, when they
did NOT. That makes you a racist of the worst kind... the one who tries to
convince others he is NOT... so he can spread his racist poison under the guise
of not being a racist.
> 'He was NOT [sic] claiming that "philosophy" as HIS [sic] OWN [sic] ...
> He was claiming it was mine'
>
CLAIMING, sport. A murderer can CLAIM he is not a murderer... but that
_don't mean shit_, if he IS a murderer. You are a RACIST. You can CLAIM
you are not... but that _don't mean shit_... because you ARE a racist, by the
very words you post here.
>... and further on .. .
>
> 'Because he was not attributing to himself.. he was falsely attributing
> it to me.'
>
You do understand the word "falsely," don't you????
>url:http://groups.google.com/groups?ie=ISO-8859-1&as_umsgid=al4p4v8astnc40tb22g717s9oc84oca6g1%404ax.com&lr=&hl=fr
>
>FuckWit .. the tame hamster of news:alt.activism.death-penalty ... LOL !!
>
desi... the resident racist liar of news:alt.activism.death-penalty ... :-(
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi
Words of condemnation from another reasonable abolitionist to you on another day --
"I *never* lie on the newsgroups, Desmond - a distinction that you most
definitely do not share." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=8a9hju%24suv%241%40lure.pipex.net
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 15:41:03 +0000
>
>le Mon, 24 Feb 2003 07:56:54 GMT, dans l'article
><uojj5v8gts5fjht4n...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor
><abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>>>{ snip repost of my classic slapping down of FW's racist attempts to wash
>>>MLK's blood from his white trash hands }
>
>>>> Sounds like Dezi is trolling again!
>
>>>Sounds like Shit-For-Brains is the most retarded, sister-shagging,
>>>'asshole' (sic) to post to news:alt.activism.death-penalty ...
>
>> Quite right, desi. You obviously were not trolling... you were simply
>> trying to hide from your racism. And you've went into hyperdrive in that
>> denial.... because it has been so effectively PROVEN by me. Your only
>> hope of escape is to continue with your lies, and hope someone --
>> JPB/dirt -- ROTFLMAO -- support you. You see, desi... I use YOUR WORDS
>> to prove your racism... you have NOTHING but lying accusations.
>
>Really, ROTFLMAO !! FW 'has went' (sic) over the edge into ballistic mode,
>such is the hammering that he has received the past month from me, dirt,
>'JPB', and in fact just about everyone on AADP who matters and even a few
>deathies. LOL ... watch him jump, watch him repost his 900 line spam
>response to 'JPB' ... watch him repost his long list of 'racist' statements
>by me, which even _he_ ... sorry, 'HE' (sic) has admitted do not constitute
>racist statements by me ...
>
> 'He was NOT [sic] claiming that "philosophy" as HIS [sic] OWN [sic] ...
> He was claiming it was mine'
>
>... and further on .. .
>
> 'Because he was not attributing to himself.. he was falsely attributing
> it to me.'
>
>
>url:http://groups.google.com/groups?ie=ISO-8859-1&as_umsgid=al4p4v8astnc4
0tb22g717s9oc84oca6g1%404ax.com&lr=&hl=fr
>
>
>FuckWit .. the tame hamster of news:alt.activism.death-penalty ... LOL !!
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
>Path:
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tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!e117.dh
cp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-fo
>r-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 15:41:03 +0000
>Lines: 46
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
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>References: <oumni-...@zeouane.org>
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A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>Another classic 'hammering' delivered to FW. This was when he had stamped
>his feet and threatened to 'tell mummy', that I had smacked him down after
>his blatantly racist attempt to 'obtain forgiveness' for his role in the
>death of Martin Luther King ...
>
How totally pathetic. Obviously my exposing desi as a racist has critically wounded
his attempts to portray himself as _morally driven_ in this group. When in fact, he
is bereft of any _morality_, and is only consumed with a raging hate for those
different from the French, who he has this psychotic belief he is one of. It is desi
who must ask forgiveness. From this group, and the offer of an apology to this group
and our entire species. He should begin to explore his _life unexamined_. To see if
he can possibly FIX, what is most assuredly BROKEN in his life. He should
DEDICATE his life to recognizing his shortcomings in demonstrating respect for
our species, and forever abandon uttering one more racist slur, or putting one more
racist slur in his thoughts onto these pages.
>-----
>
>{ infantile change of 'Subject:' line left intact, as testimony to FW's
> puerile [1] 'debating' tactics }
>
>le Fri, 24 Jan 2003 09:55:43 GMT, dans l'article <z48Y9.122454$Sa3.3100078@twist
>er.tampabay.rr.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>{ snip }
>
>>> Regrettably, it is often necessary to break a few eggs to make an omelette.
>
>> desi admits that he is a racist.
>
>That regrettably, I had to use stronger than usual language, to express my
>revulsion that 2003's 'version' of George Wallace, was trying to 'garner'
>credibility, by associating his name with the name of a great man whom his
>kind had cut down, rather than confer equality; rather than abandon their
>institutionalised apartheid; rather than treat the black man as their
>equal.
>
Actually, your presumption of _breaking a few eggs_, caused you to don that
white peaked hood of the KKK, rather than that of any cook. What is most
certain is that any attempt to DESTROY a tribute to MLK, for whatever
reason... is RACIST in intent. That was your INTENT when you remarked
that you intended to "break a few eggs" to make your racist omelette. It is
unfortunate that your hate for me, boiled over into another expression of your
racism. I deplore the fact that you DESTROYED the very essence of my words.
You certainly cannot hurt me, since you are an impotent fool. But you certainly
EXPOSED yourself, for the evil racist you are.
>Yes, it is regrettable that I was forced to do so. I apologise to the
>group for my strong language.
As well you should. And I now detect that you realize how destructive
your words were, to the force of that tribute.
> Language that no one on the esteemed group
>that is news:alt.activism.death-penalty will be used to hearing from me.
LOL. As I've said... not since the departure of Mike, has there been a
greater racist posting to this group. And what is even MORE DANGEROUS,
is that Mike never tried to hide it... we KNEW what we were dealing with.
But YOU are a more insidious monster. Hiding behind that facade of
CLAIMING you can BE a racist, because you presume to see it in others.
I have provided 28 instances of racist comment we are "used to hearing from"
you.
>However, I do not 'apologize' (sic) to you.
There is no reason to. Since you did not insult ME. You insulted the
man, the works and the memory of MLK... since THAT was what my
post was about. This is one time I have not even presumed to ask you to
apologize to me. You owe ME no apology. You owe it to this group
and our species. I would not want you to apologize to me. You cannot
injure ME, by posting a racist comment. It is impossible for you to do
so... thus you certainly cannot apologize for NOT injuring me. Were
I even to accept any apology you might offer to me, it would be accepting
racism.
My sole purpose since your disgusting, and evil remark to my tribute,
has been to EXPOSE you, not to seek an apology from you to me.
Nor could I ever accept an apology from you... since it has no meaning,
as you did not insult me. You CANNOT insult me, if I provide a tribute
to MLK. You can only insult the man, the works and the memory of
MLK. Were you to offer an apology to me, and were I to accept, I
would become a PARTY to your racism. Accepting that you can
make such a malefic, wicked malodorous racist comment, and BE
EXCUSED by ME for doing so. It is not within my power to excuse you.
That excuse belongs to a higher power than me. And it will take more
than a few pithy words from you to make that apology. It will take a
life-long commitment to a new found integrity. If you have the inner
strength to assume such a challenge. Which I seriously doubt that you
have.
> That you are a fuckwit is no longer a matter of debate. That you engage in
> racialist abuse aimed at the >minorities in our society, is a fact easily verified
> by 'goggle' (sic).
Once again, desi... When you start off your comment with "That
you are a fuckwit," it sets up a pattern to the words you will
offer that follow. It's crystal-clear that it will be followed by
something more incredibly stupid than anyone can imagine. And
it's all _down-hill_ for _logic_ or _articulate_ output from
you from that point on.
And it displays another method you often use. When EXPOSED for the
racist you are... you presume that you can falsely accuse another, and
escape detection of your own racism. I am quite secure in the certainty
that I have never expressed a racist comment, either here, nor in at least
40 years. I learned at that point in my life, how destructive racism is.
You still have that lesson to learn. The only way you could accuse me
of racism... is if you accused EVERY person who supports the DP of
racism. Is THAT your accusation? I'd be interested in hearing that, if
it is. I believe if you do, I can prove your hypocrisy, yet again.
>That you accuse _others_ of the very racism that you spew onto
>news:alt.activism.death-penalty like a poison, is taken for granted, but
>not taken seriously.
You mean those 28 direct QUOTES from you, that demonstrate most
vividly your racism? You'll find no words of MINE, express such vile
thoughts. They are YOURS. Your inner-most racist emotions, brought
forth, while presuming you may do so at will.
> All of that is known to all on the newsgroup, and you
>are the laughingstock of the newsgroup now, thanks in no small part to the
>work of news:alt.activism.death-penalty's 'garbage disposal men', dirt and
>my good self.
As desi looks around furtively for some _friends_. The company you keep
rather discloses your racism, rather than hides it. I am reminded of
your cry-baby appeal for _help_ from other racists, who might agree
that they see no racism in your attack on a tribute to MLK. With your
pathetic -- PLEASE...PRETTY PLEASE... HELP ME PEOPLE!!!
Unable to defend your own words... it becomes necessary for you to
say -- help me, dirt... help me, JPB... help me, Hugh... help me, Peter...
help me... ANYONE. Please HELP ME!!!
> In that respect, you are harmless.
I don't think you find me _harmless_, sport. I am sure not one person here
ACTUALLY finds me _harmless_ in the destruction of your raging hyperbole,
your hate for certain races, your bigotry, your lies, your pitiful expressions of
your own _soaring intellect_ (sic), and your disgusting and obscene insults that
you heap on certain posters here. Insults which contain nothing but _mindless
drivel_. I believe you are truly FRIGHTENED by the fact I have been _keeping
record_ of your more disgusting comments, and EXPOSING you for the fraud
and the racist you are. And take this to the bank === You have only THREE choices.
1) Continue your current course and expect me to continue to expose you. 2) Cease
your current course and expect me to not comment on what does not need to
be exposed. 3) Leave this group. That's ALL the choices you have, sport.
Since presuming you have defeated me... by insulting me, or my words... is totally
impossible for you to achieve your current objective of silencing me, and continuing
on your current course. Especially when you presume that you are insulting ME,
when you insult a tribute to MLK. The fact is, you have shown that my WORDS
could express the loftiest of ideals and you would attack those WORDS, and the
concepts behind those words. You certainly cannot presume to be attacking ME,
for expressing a lofty ideal. You can ONLY be seen as attacking the ideal itself.
> We have 'tamed' you,
>just as several years ago, I 'tamed' Scooter-Boy [2], or 'Drewl' as he was
>universally known at that time. You, and he, are nothing but pathetic
>jokes on news:alt.activism.death-penalty, held up as shining examples of
>how _not_ to post. You can do no harm here in 99% of cases; I have seen to
>that.
>
It has never been my purpose to DO HARM. You confuse YOUR purpose
with mine. It has been my purpose to EXPOSE the harm you do. In that respect,
you cannot stop the tide of my exposing you. Nor can any of your henchmen.
The TRUTH should NEVER do harm. Only lies... the lies you perpetrate...
have the capacity to do harm.
>However, when your hands, dripping with the blood of Martin Luther King as
>he lay dying in his friends' arms, type the sort of 'fowl' (sic ... ho, ho,
>ho ...) and pathetic attempts to bask in the reflected glory of a proud and
>noble visionary for whose death you are indirectly responsible, I will not
>remain silent.
>
You certainly didn't. You managed to insult that man, his works, and his
memory. All in one KKK oriented, hate-driven racist comment. My post
BEGAN with the words -- "This is a day to honor the dead... to Honor
Martin Luther King, Jr." You then presumed IMMEDIATELY to INSULT
the day, the man and the memory. I see you now doing a great deal of
_damage control_. But the fact is you knee-jerked to that tribute, with
what is essentially your SUBCONSCIOUS feelings about that man.
Your racism was exposed totally. As it is each time you use a racial slur,
and expect it to pass _moral muster_.
You are as a vicious old man...with leering features and stooped posture.
Obviously rubbing your hands together with a malevolent smirk on your
face as you offer your racist slurs, showing a side to yourself which is as
cankered as man can be to his fellow man. You're also a BIG crybaby,
desi. And you are very concerned with the fact I'm exposing all of your
smarmy racism, and disgusting sophistry. Exposing the narcissism of
your belief in your Imperial presence here, and the accompanying
persecution complex you have, when you claim there were all those
"others who sought to force me off the group." Your prosecution
paranoia in this group is positively palpable.
>This group is not known for the moral character of its posters.
Simply stating another truism. Certainly not as long as you post here.
> This was
>demonstrated only a few months ago, when only three people here had the
>guts to stand up and be counted, when another poster engaged in a heinous
>episode of emotional blackmail [3].
>
You mean when YOU engaged in it by calling John Rennie a foul, disgusting
obscene name, that you seem to use whenever you find yourself unable to
communicate in a rational manner? Yes, you certainly have used emotional
blackmail on many levels, at many times... See [4], [5], [6] and [7].
>Thus no one should be surprised that only I had the courage to cast you
>down, as you glorify in the death of Dr King.
Strange that you would call a moral weakness called racism, as _courage_.
Only you had the racist instinct to respond to a tribute to MLK. You
cannot presume to attack me, without the clear understanding that you
are attacking WHAT I SAY. That you are blind to this fact, is because
you subconsciously (or perhaps even consciously) , hold some definite
racist objections to WHAT I SAY.
> As you gloat whilst
>thinking of white slaveowners raping their female slaves. As you ejaculate
>over the pictures of lynchings, whilst regretting that 'we can't done and
>show 'em boys whose [sic] boss today, y'all ...'
>
Now, descending into insane images as you did with the pictures which
brought you to a sexual climax in describing the murder of a 17 year-old
girl, with an exposed pubic area. Whenever you become frustrated because
of the clear proof of so many flaws in your character, you react EXACTLY
as you have reacted here. We are, of course, speaking of the HERE AND
NOW, and YOUR PRESENT racism. But instead, you would presume to
connect me with act of racists in the past. Yet we have only your PRESENT
racism under examination here.
>{ snip repeated screams as FuckWit expresses his frustration that I am 'on
> to' him as the filthy racist that he is, followed up with some more
> 'fabrications' that he attributes to me, ended with the now customary
> claim of 'victory' }
>
There is no 'victory' for me here. Only an overwhelming sense of sadness,
WHENEVER I see racism rear its ugly head, as I saw it when you insulted
a tribute to MLK. On cannot find _victory_ in recognizing racism. One
can only find that deep well of grief, that Men can exhibit such behavior
toward other Men. It is an outragous insult to our species to presume that
we should determine who is the _victor_ here. Since it presumes that
racism has the POSSIBILITY of emerging as a _victor_. You presuming
YOU are the 'victor' is even a greater insult to our species than the actual
insult you provided in your original comment. I never presume to do anything
other than EXPOSE your racism. I find it sickening that you would even
believe either of us can be the _victor_ here. But that was the feeling that
I came away with, when you asked others to VOTE on who was the
_victor_ in your dialog of racism.
>You have been shown up for the racist that you are, FuckWit. Accept it,
>and try to live with your shame.
>
Actually, I provided the tribute. You showed yourself as a racist in your
remark directed at that tribute. That's FACT... not the fiction you would
invent.
PV
>[1] url:http://groups.google.com/groups?ie=ISO-8859-1&as_umsgid=rC7o9.56678%24g7
>3.1937553%40twister.tampabay.rr.com&lr=&hl=fr
>[2] url:http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/scooter-boy.jpg
>[3] url:http://groups.google.com/groups?q=spastic+group:alt.activism.death-penal
>ty+author:Rennie&hl=fr&lr=&ie=UTF-8&scoring=d&selm=S%258w9.628%24J45.60637%40new
>sfep1-win.server.ntli.net&rnum=2
> url:http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl1228146609d&dq=&hl=fr&lr=&ie=UTF-
>8&selm=pmo3sugd6fs6qptrl3h7go1f132el9o63f%404ax.com
> url:http://groups.google.com/groups?q=g:thl3474140743d&dq=&hl=fr&lr=&ie=
>UTF-8&selm=3dc1eda9_6%40goliath.newsgroups.com
[4]url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=a9h9tu%245rd%241%40newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk
[5]url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8o8gdj.iit.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
[6]url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021110212937.12309.00001154%40mb-fo.aol.com
[7]url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=diablo-7F7BB2.00235902032002%40newsroom.utas.edu.au
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=L7Po8.12823%24K52.2085263%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=DUTo8.16901%24K52.2590863%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=0Dbg8.11590%24j93.3613806%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=FlVf8.13270%24TV4.1933557%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=5qzg8.20855%24j93.5666102%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=OvuV9.128771%24j8.3431971%40twister.tampabay.rr.com
PV
>
>--
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Tue, 25 Feb 2003 23:51:00 GMT, dans l'article <i0ln5vkicqqru7627...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>>>Another classic 'hammering' delivered to FW. This was when he had stamped
>>>his feet and threatened to 'tell mummy', that I had smacked him down after
>>>his blatantly racist attempt to 'obtain forgiveness' for his role in the
>>>death of Martin Luther King ...
>
>> How totally pathetic.
Obviously my exposing desi as a racist has critically wounded his attempts to portray
himself as _morally driven_ in this group. When in fact, he is bereft of any
_morality_, and is only consumed with a raging hate for those different from the
French, who he has this psychotic belief he is one of. It is desi who must ask
forgiveness. From this group, and the offer of an apology to this group and our
entire species. He should begin to explore his _life unexamined_. To see if he can
possibly FIX, what is most assuredly BROKEN in his life. He should
DEDICATE his life to recognizing his shortcomings in demonstrating respect for
our species, and forever abandon uttering one more racist slur, or putting one more
racist slur in his thoughts onto these pages.
>
>Ho, ho, ho ... 329 obsessive lines snipped. Did anyone read it ? I know I
>didn't. I got to the customary declaration of victory, also known as the
>Saddam Hussein Special (which FW was considerate enough to put on the first
>line in this particular post), or gimmick n° 38, and just hit 'delete' all
>the way to the bottom.
>
I notice that desi has clipped his admission that he _broke a few eggs_ to
create his disgusting omelette of racism directed against MLK. So this
was desi's comment --
"Regrettably, it is often necessary to break a few eggs to make an omelette."
And this was my reply --
Actually, your presumption of _breaking a few eggs_, caused you to don that
white peaked hood of the KKK, rather than that of any cook. What is most
certain is that any attempt to DESTROY a tribute to MLK, for whatever
reason... is RACIST in intent. That was your INTENT when you remarked
that you intended to "break a few eggs" to make your racist omelette. It is
unfortunate that your hate for me, boiled over into another expression of your
racism. I deplore the fact that you DESTROYED the very essence of my words.
You certainly cannot hurt me, since you are an impotent fool. But you certainly
EXPOSED yourself, for the evil racist you are.
And then he presumes to apologize for his comments. But believes it
will bother me that he does not apologize to me -- har har har. I would
find it macabre to even presume an apology to me would mean anything.
Since he did not insult ME. He insulted the man, the works and the
memory of MLK... since THAT was what my post was about.
Repeating my words which he has insured he has clipped --
This is one time I have not even presumed to ask you to apologize to
me. You owe ME no apology. You owe it to this group and our
species. I would not want you to apologize to me. You cannot
injure ME, by posting a racist comment. It is impossible for you to do
so... thus you certainly cannot apologize for NOT injuring me. Were
I even to accept any apology you might offer to me, it would be accepting
racism.
My sole purpose since your disgusting, and evil remark to my tribute,
has been to EXPOSE you, not to seek an apology from you to me.
Nor could I ever accept an apology from you... since it has no meaning,
as you did not insult me. You CANNOT insult me, if I provide a tribute
to MLK. You can only insult the man, the works and the memory of
MLK. Were you to offer an apology to me, and were I to accept, I
would become a PARTY to your racism. Accepting that you can
make such a malefic, wicked malodorous racist comment, and BE
EXCUSED by ME for doing so. It is not within my power to excuse you.
That excuse belongs to a higher power than me. And it will take more
than a few pithy words from you to make that apology. It will take a
life-long commitment to a new found integrity. If you have the inner
strength to assume such a challenge. Which I seriously doubt that you
have.
>Now, anyone care to try to spot some more gimmicks in FuckWit's obsessive
>300-liner ..?
>
>url:http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/gimmicks/
>
>LOL !!
>
Proving that my words meant nothing to you... although they should have
provided you some direction in which you could refocus your life and
your posts... and end the hate that you hold for so many... Americans...
Blacks... Arabs... Jews... Retentionists... even the British at times. Only the
French, remain the anchor to your existence, because you have no other
anchor to your life. And strangely enough... I have the distinct feeling
that THEY reject you.
>--
>Ayatollah desi |Superlunary and Most Exalted
> |Spiritual Leader of the Universal
> |Right to Life Church. (umm... get
> |away from me -- you filthy black
> |starving child in Africa) 'My church'
> |isn't for you.
See: ---- The Wizard that is desi ----- picture and comment which follows --
url:http://home.earthlink.net/~onetimeuse/sparrow.jpg The Wizard's words --
"I engage in 'abuse' of deathies as a matter of course. That's what they're there
for. `echo $DEITY` gave them to us, much as She gave sparrows to the
domestic cat. They're our playthings. They have no relevance in the real world,
except to remind us of the dark side to human nature, that can exist in all of us.
They're like child rapists. Nazis. Torturers of small animals. All this pretence of
'let's be civil to one another' is nauseating. How can you be 'civil' to garbage ?"
Just passing by
> On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 02:35:29 +0000, Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
> wrote:
>
> >Another classic 'hammering' delivered to FW. This was when he had stamped
> >his feet and threatened to 'tell mummy', that I had smacked him down after
> >his blatantly racist attempt to 'obtain forgiveness' for his role in the
> >death of Martin Luther King ...
> >
> How totally pathetic. Obviously my exposing desi as a racist has critically wounded
> his attempts to portray himself as _morally driven_ in this group.
< All remaining lies from PV clipped >
At no time has PV done any such thing. No such racism of Desmond's has
ever been exposed because none exists, as anyone will discover by
simply carrying out their own research into these preposterous lies of
PV's .... starting with this link:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03022...@posting.google.com
Desmond recently invited everyone to state where they stand on these
questions by casting their own votes; I will now take this opportunity
to do just that. Having thoroughly read and studied both PV's original
MLK tribute and Desmond's reply to it, on the basis of what I believe
is the only possible view any rational person can form from the
evidence, I happily and humbly submit my own votes to the questions
raised.
1. Is Desmond a racist? No.
2. Was Desmond's reply an attack on "anyone" paying a tribute to MLK?
No.
3. Was Desmond's reply in any way disrespectful to black people? No.
4. Is PV lying? Yes.
A Planet Visitor
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<i0ln5vkicqqru7627...@4ax.com>...
>> On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 02:35:29 +0000, Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Another classic 'hammering' delivered to FW. This was when he had stamped
>> >his feet and threatened to 'tell mummy', that I had smacked him down after
>> >his blatantly racist attempt to 'obtain forgiveness' for his role in the
>> >death of Martin Luther King ...
>> >
>> How totally pathetic. Obviously my exposing desi as a racist has critically wounded
>> his attempts to portray himself as _morally driven_ in this group.
>
>< All remaining lies from PV clipped >
>
You mean _the TRUTH_ of desi's racism... placed here in desi's own words.
>At no time has PV done any such thing. No such racism of Desmond's has
>ever been exposed because none exists,
Actually that presupposes that you support each and every racist epithet, ever
placed on these pages by desi. You SUPPORT his use of ALL of these degrading
phrases, and EXCUSE his insults to Blacks and other races that he has placed here.
You SUPPORT his uses of --
1) "Gimmie da money, honkey mothafucka, oh ah toast yo ass !!" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021001212904.09987.00002409%40mb-fp.aol.com
2) "'Gimme da dough, mothafucka o ah toast yo ass !!'" Somehow it always ends up to
be a Black in his descriptions of a 'typical' robber. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8oeie1.66i.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
3) "smelly 'Jigaboo' Ausländer." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020826212933.13843.00000967%40mb-mu.aol.com
4) "I even 'tweaked' your nose a few days back, by using the word 'jigaboo'" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020830212951.10684.00000093%40mb-cu.aol.com
5) "same bestial beating administered to LDB's now almost 'jigaboo' buttocks" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020924212907.06896.00002017%40mb-mv.aol.com
6) "Paris is an oasis of safety, be you jigaboo (ho, ho, ho ...) or not." You agree
that a racist insult can be 'funny.' See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021006212910.00278.00004368%40mb-md.aol.com
7) "Say, LDB ... how come your "ass" [sic] is so jigaboo these days ?' ... " See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021024212927.18726.00000072%40mb-fe.aol.com
8) "France (the Greatest Country on the Face of the Earth, BTW) did not 'lose' the
match against those jigaboo (*snigger*) upstarts, QZD." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020605201554.23403.00000133%40mb-fo.aol.com
9) "I cream in my pants when they execute a dumbfuck nigga fry black fucker," See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021103212919.08236.00000659%40mb-cg.aol.com
10) "FW seems to have a masochist streak that leads him to present his 'jigaboo'
(*chuckle*) buttocks to the assembled throng on AADP and _beg_ to be spanked." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030112212942.01911.00000668%40mb-mu.aol.com
11) "If we start to bring money into the equation, then we cut
overseas aid because after all, they're 'only niggers'. . . and so on." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=848250093.891.3%40maudit.demon.co.uk
12) "Talking of pointy hats, Don: lynched any "niggers" lately?" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=33aa5cc2.10949086%40news.pratique.fr
13) "Look, Chuck, the murdering niggers ... I mean, blacks who kill
in this country, get due process." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8308au.h8.desmond%40tortue.coughlan.net
14) "or 'niggers' as they're called in his neck of the woods," See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8npdg3.4a5.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
15) "waiting for some delinquant (as Jigsaw would call them, 'niggers')" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8ojg49.5v9.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
16) "it was German beer ... now, if only I could get the smell of sausage out of the
bloody bottles" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8tud5u.2dn2.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
17) "Indeed, perhaps if the floods that are presently threatening Germany,
had been controlled before they swept across into Europe, from the Czech
Republic and Poland, then this fair continent would have been saved the
same fate as the smelly 'auslanders'." See -
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020821212944.09631.00000655%40mb-fc.aol.com
18) Then, there was his recent remark that making favorable comments about
the past civil rights efforts of Mamie Till Mobley, as her death was reported, here
in this newsgroup was a racist comments posted by a racist. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030113200243.01707.00001214%40mb-cu.aol.com
19) And then his hysterical outrage that someone could possibly suggest that
MLK be recognized as having contributed to civil rights on MLK day. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030120212929.19751.00000260%40mb-cu.aol.com
20) "the 'onery ragheads' * that are Arabs" In fact, placing that (*) specifically
to state at the bottom, that the 'phrase' was Copyright by ME. Yet only HE
had ever used it. Certainly not ME. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021024212936.18726.00000083%40mb-fe.aol.com
21) "not that Iraq has anything to do with al'Queda either, other than
that it's ruled by 'filthy ragheads'" Again, SPECIFICALLY attributing
it as MY 'philosophy. And this was the one you presumed was a pejorative,
yet he expressly attributed the 'words' to MY' philosophy.' I can thus
presume that YOUR philosophy is that 'Judge Zobel is a crook,' since
that is simply a pejorative... obviously you presume a double-standand. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021016212913.06142.00000353%40mb-ch.aol.com
22) "Hey, why bother, right ? They're only ragheads ... 'Arab cunts'" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020921212909.09987.00001502%40mb-fp.aol.com
23)"'What the fuck, it's only ragheads ?" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020908212925.09987.00000590%40mb-fp.aol.com
24) "The half-million Iraqi children who have died since the sanctions were imposed,
are, to quote LDB, 'ragheads', and thus are unimportant." Obviously, he CLEARLY
expresses that he is QUOTING me... but it is a LIE. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021113212902.00704.00001232%40mb-ba.aol.com
25) "The maniacal laughter as yet more 'ragheads' (sic) were killed in Palestine."
See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021024212915.18726.00000061%40mb-fe.aol.com
26) "but they were all 'ragheads' (Copyright (C) 2002 LDB)" Expressly again claiming
the term is MINE... yet it BELONGS only to him. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021115212931.11087.00001599%40mb-fi.aol.com
27) And then we have your most recent racist comment, where you AGAIN FORGED it into
the post of Don Kool. See
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030222212909.26864.00002230%40mb-mq.aol.com
This rather demonstrates EXACTLY why you do not archive your posts. Since it permits
you to get away with things such as this, to the unsuspecting eye.
28) "'Police said that the alleged killer bragged at a local bar that he was
going to "kill the ragheads responsible for 11 September".'
And desi remarked --
"LDB gets around, doesn't he ..?"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021119212904.23768.00001714%40mb-md.aol.com
You have now announced you find NOTHING WRONG with racist slurs.
You SUPPORT their use... and do not believe they are harmful in any respect.
> as anyone will discover by
>simply carrying out their own research into these preposterous lies of
>PV's .... starting with this link:
>
>http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03022...@posting.google.com
>
So you agree that someone who offers homage to MLK should be called a
"a disgusting laughable prick," and a "fucking, disgusting_ lowlife"!!
What IS to be found in desi's racist reply to my tribute, was that desi found
that the mention of the assassination of MLK was a subject of ridicule.
That you cannot see that this is EXACTLY what someone from the KKK
would call ANYONE who offers such homage to MLK, is only an indication of
how you have let the most degenerate poster in this group, pick your moral
pocket. In your shameful indifference, you have allowed an ignoble, wanton,
ignominious comment, offered by a racist, to kill in you any respect for other
races. And all because of a soft, white piece of flab... called the _Great White
Whale_.
>Desmond recently invited everyone to state where they stand on these
>questions by casting their own votes; I will now take this opportunity
>to do just that. Having thoroughly read and studied both PV's original
>MLK tribute and Desmond's reply to it, on the basis of what I believe
>is the only possible view any rational person can form from the
>evidence, I happily and humbly submit my own votes to the questions
>raised.
>
LOL... big surprise!!! Did anyone actually think you would offer anything
rational to this dialog? Not a chance, sport. This is not about any 'vote,'
unless you believe racism can be _put to a vote_. Of course!!
<time to vote>
All those in FAVOR of racism--- raise your hand.
And up pops JPB's hand!!
<voting over>
All it shows is that you SUPPORT racist comments, and have become part
of desi's entourage of fulsome evil little goblins, in servile allegiance, currying
favors under the aegis of Satan himself, in the form of desi. I cannot imagine a
more disgusting coterie of cackling gnome-like demons, than those who have
allied themselves with that monster. A monster who once called on abolitionists
to consider themselves domestic cats, and consider retentionists - sparrow
"playthings."
>1. Is Desmond a racist? No.
>
28 EXACT QUOTES of his words, which repeatedly express racist views
and racist slurs... stand witness to a different answer. Clearly, it is understood
that I hate desi, for all that he stands for here, and desi certainly hates me, since
I have so often exposed him. So, let's look at the MLK dialog OUTSIDE of any
personality disputes. I offered a tribute to MLK, and never once mentioned or
even considered desi as relevant to that tribute. While, if we remove personality
differences from desi's comment, as I did in MY tribute, desi responded by
ATTACKING that tribute. I did not attack desi in my tribute. Thus, setting aside
personalities, desi did not attack ME... but MY WORDS. Only a racist
would presume to attack a TRIBUTE to MLK. I have never considered desi's
comment to be an attack on me. I have ALWAYS considered it to be an
attack on MY WORDS in that tribute. Donna recognized that, when I had paid
a tribute to Mamie Till Mosley, and chided desi for offending THAT tribute, as
well. desi was still smarting from her recognition of his insult to THAT tribute,
and could not contain his rage that anyone would offer a further tribute so closely
following the tribute to Mamie Till Mosley. Thus, donning himself in his white
peaked hood, with his blood-red with rage beady eyes peaking out, he again burst
forth with yet another insult to yet another tribute to a civil rights leader,
planting his flaming KKK cross right into the heart of AADP.
>2. Was Desmond's reply an attack on "anyone" paying a tribute to MLK?
>No.
>
Of course it was. Since I was the ONLY one having done so on that day.
>3. Was Desmond's reply in any way disrespectful to black people? No.
>
Of course it was. It was a defamatory, disgusting piece of trash, that desi has now
said he apologizes to the group for having offered. While presuming he is
_punishing_ me by pronouncing he will not apologize to me. Presuming that I have
even considered it an insult to me, and not what it actually was... an insult to the
WORDS. I would be a PARTY to his racism were I to look at any apology he
might offer to me, as anything other than a racist trying now to HIDE the fact he is
a racist. I would spit on any apology he offers to me. He needs to apologize to
GOD... and to NATURE... and TO MAN. And to make it a life-long commitment
to do so.
>4. Is PV lying? Yes.
Hardly... since I have never offered ANY RACIST COMMENT, in my words to
this group. While you have become one of desi's drones, simply because we have
had differences in another area. How typical of someone who functions from
rage and obsession. But I can presume that you will follow desi's lead, and
next call ME a racist, for having pointed out desi's racist persona. That has been
desi's devious defense of HIS OWN RACIST WORDS.
PV
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:08:55 GMT, dans l'article <j8tq5v4j814bbahm6...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>{ snip }
>
>>>< All remaining lies from PV clipped >
>
>> You mean _the TRUTH_ of desi's racism... placed here in desi's own words.
>
>ROTFLMAO !!
>
> 'He was NOT [sic] claiming that "philosophy" as HIS [sic] OWN [sic]...
> He was claiming it was mine'
>
> [...]
>
> 'Because he was not attributing to himself.. he was falsely attributing
> it to me'
>
> [...]
>
> 'He WANTED [sic] to have others think that what he said was MY [sic]
> "philosophy"'
>
> (url:http://groups.google.com/groups?ie=ISO-8859-1&as_umsgid=al4p4v8astnc40tb22g717s9oc84oca6g1%404ax.com&lr=&hl=fr)
>
A murderer WANTS others to think SOMEONE else committed the murder, so he will
often CLAIM another did it. But the fact is, HE is the murderer... just as YOU are
the racist. I will keep using this logical comparison to PROVE that you CLAIMING
YOUR racist words are from someone else, does NOT absolve you from being a racist.
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi
Words of wisdom from another reasonable abolitionist to you on another day --
"You do more to further the retentionist cause than any retentionist poster which is
why PV and Jiggy are so pleased to have you back with us" See -
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=GJI18.39489%24_x4.6245263%40news2-win.server.ntlworld.com
How very true.
Just passing by
< Once again, all PV's lies & spam clipped >
There are only two necessary replies to anything and everything PV
posts here. The proof of his lies can be found here:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03022...@posting.google.com
The reasoning for his lies and the truth about the insecurity he tries
very hard to conceal, can be found here:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0302...@posting.google.com
A Planet Visitor
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<j8tq5v4j814bbahm6...@4ax.com>...
>
>
>< Once again, all PV's lies & spam clipped >
>
ROTFLMAO... TRANSLATION -- _I'd better hide the evidence_.
>There are only two necessary replies to anything and everything PV
>posts here. The proof of his lies can be found here:
>
>http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03022...@posting.google.com
>
You mean the post that I totally destroyed in my reply, which can be found here:
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=ebdj5v4pbvrfbmotuqndkm7omvhklj56d0%404ax.com
A post which remains unanswered except for your pitiful excuse of reposting MY
words, which were and remain --
"One wonders... if there is a God... why no thunderclaps and
windstorms, no driving pellets of hail and brimstone, and no
upheavals of the earth are brought down on desi? Why doesn't the will
of God descend in virtue to silence his wicked crimes against man and
nature? And why has he found a henchman to play on a satyr flute that
his words are not cancerous and baneful? Plainly, Satan has shown his
malefic form here in _desi the deil_.... and just as plainly JPB has
simply become his emotionally stunted and misshapen, goblin follower.
Frankly, they both demonstrate that evil is a disease of mankind that
will not be easily eradicated." (A Planet Visitor, Feb. 22, 2003)
>The reasoning for his lies and the truth about the insecurity he tries
>very hard to conceal, can be found here:
>
>http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0302...@posting.google.com
You again mean the post that I totally destroyed in my reply, which was never
answered which can be found here:
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=v6hr5v82b4u50cvg1s4vc734vrmm4qgh1n%404ax.com
PV
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Thu, 27 Feb 2003 06:55:26 GMT, dans l'article <jcdr5vkb5jqkr17nl...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi |Superlunary and Most Exalted
> |Spiritual Leader of the Universal
> |Right to Life Church. (umm... get
> |away from me -- you filthy black
> |starving child in Africa) 'My church'
> |isn't for you.
The words of desi in his favorite post -- "I engage in 'abuse' of deathies as a
matter of course. That's what they're there for. `echo $DEITY` gave them to us, much
as She gave sparrows to the domestic cat. They're our playthings. They have no
relevance in the real world, except to remind us of the dark side to human nature,
that can exist in all of us. They're like child rapists. Nazis. Torturers of small
animals. All this pretence of 'let's be civil to one another' is nauseating. How can
you be 'civil' to garbage ?" To seen what desi hopes to make of the retentionist --
see url:http://www.things.org/~muffy/pages/kitties/death.html and
url:http://home.earthlink.net/~onetimeuse/sparrow.jpg
Just passing by
> [ This is a repost of the following article: ]
> [ From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> ]
> [ Subject: Re: MLK day ]
> [ Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty ]
> [ Message-ID: <27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net> ]
>
> <Thanks to having my own NNTP server that does not expire any posts, this
> is the original text, my response to FW, when he attempted to assuage his
> guilt at having the blood of Martin Luther King on his hands.>
>
< Article snipped >
So that was the post which provoked one of the angriest and most
dishonest reactions I, at least, have ever seen on usenet. Even by
PV's standards, the vitriol and lies were particularly intense. The
anger was revealed in some of the most absurd prose imaginable
(demons, goblins and much more) and the lies were concentrated on the
equally absurd claim that Desmond had exhibited racism and that his
intention in writing that message had been to attack the very idea of
"anyone" paying a tribute to Martin Luther King.
So what was really behind the attempt by PV to falsely accuse Desmond
of racism? Is anyone really convinced by this so obviously false
indignation about racism that PV is currently acting out? Have you
seen the kind of language he has been using? If that were genuine -
which it most certainly isn't - it would make the Rev. Al Sharpton
look like the Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan.
So no: like much else about PV, it is fake. Ask yourself why, if PV
really was as anti-racist as he is trying to look, he would spend his
time ranting about it here, in a death penalty newsgroup where racism
is seldom even discussed, let alone displayed. He would be posting
these rants on some newsgroup used by the KKK or neo-nazis. Or maybe
he would post to a dedicated anti-racist newsgroup - I'm sure there
are many out there.
So clearly PV is using this anti-racism as a mask - the only question
is ..... to hide what? I believe it is to hide his frustration at his
continued failure to make any ground whatsoever in his "mission" to
discredit Desmond, whose intellect, writing ability and wit PV knows
he could never compete with.
But why the anti-racism act? Why that, specifically? Study some of the
background to the battles between PV and Desmond and you will see that
it was Desmond who first - at least in any significant way - accused
PV of being a racist. Prior to that, there were no such rants from PV
about racism - neither that which he is accusing Desmond of nor
general racism in society. PV only decided to don this anti-racism hat
of his after Desmond began accusing him of racism. It is the extreme
reaction ploy - appear to become the total opposite of what you are
accused of, and then accuse your accuser of what he was accusing you
of.
JIGSAW1695
From: unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by)
Date: 3/4/2003 7:04 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>
Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> wrote in message
news:<oumni-...@zeouane.org>...
> [ This is a repost of the following article: ]
> [ From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> ]
> [ Subject: Re: MLK day ]
> [ Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty ]
> [ Message-ID: <27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net> ]
>
> <Thanks to having my own NNTP server that does not expire any posts, this
> is the original text, my response to FW, when he attempted to assuage his
> guilt at having the blood of Martin Luther King on his hands.>
>
< Article snipped >
So that was the post which provoked one of the angriest and most
dishonest reactions I, at least, have ever seen on usenet. Even by
PV's standards, the vitriol and lies were particularly intense. The
anger was revealed in some of the most absurd prose imaginable
(demons, goblins and much more) and the lies were concentrated on the
equally absurd claim that Desmond had exhibited racism and that his
intention in writing that message had been to attack the very idea of
"anyone" paying a tribute to Martin Luther King.
===============================
Desmond was soundly chastized in the past for using the word "nigger" in at
least one of his posts. It was used in a derogatory and insulting way.
Dezi is indeed a racist.
JIGSAW1695
From: Desmond Coughlan pasdespa...@zeouane.org
Date: 3/4/2003 4:25 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <o6ifj-...@zeouane.org>
le 04 Mar 2003 19:26:46 GMT, dans l'article
<20030304142646...@mb-ft.aol.com>, JIGSAW1695 <jigsa...@aol.com>
a dit ...
{ snip 'JPB' thrashing FW }
> Desmond was soundly chastized in the past for using the word "nigger" in
> at least one of his posts. It was used in a derogatory and insulting
> way.
>
> Dezi is indeed a racist.
By which criterion, you're also a 'racist', as you've just used the 'N'
word in your post, Jigsaw.
I hope (but don't for a second imagine) that the lesson has been learned.
Desmond Coughlan
===============================
Dezi, pay attention. You may learn something.
The word I used is in quotes and attributed to you.
You are supposed to be the self-proclaimed expert in grammar and word usage.
But the above statment made by you casts doubt on you educational achievments.
Jigsaw
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 21:25:12 +0000
>
>le 04 Mar 2003 19:26:46 GMT, dans l'article
><20030304142646...@mb-ft.aol.com>, JIGSAW1695
><jigsa...@aol.com> a dit ...
>
>{ snip 'JPB' thrashing FW }
>
>> Desmond was soundly chastized in the past for using the word "nigger" in
>> at least one of his posts. It was used in a derogatory and insulting
>> way.
>>
>> Dezi is indeed a racist.
>
>By which criterion, you're also a 'racist', as you've just used the 'N'
>word in your post, Jigsaw.
>
>I hope (but don't for a second imagine) that the lesson has been learned.
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/gimmicks/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
>Path:
>lobby!ngtf-m01.news.aol.com!ngpeer.news.aol.com!feed1.newsreader.com!news
reader.com!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed00.sul.
t-online.de!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin
.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noo
>s.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2003 21:25:12 +0000
>Lines: 25
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
>Message-ID: <o6ifj-...@zeouane.org>
>References: <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>
><20030304142646...@mb-ft.aol.com>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.fr (212.198.68.117)
>X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1046813741 62398643 212.198.68.117 (16 [91468])
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le 04 Mar 2003 19:26:46 GMT, dans l'article <20030304142646...@mb-ft.aol.com>, JIGSAW1695 <jigsa...@aol.com> a dit ...
>
>{ snip 'JPB' thrashing FW }
>
>> Desmond was soundly chastized in the past for using the word "nigger" in
>> at least one of his posts. It was used in a derogatory and insulting
>> way.
>>
>> Dezi is indeed a racist.
>
>By which criterion, you're also a 'racist', as you've just used the 'N'
>word in your post, Jigsaw.
>
Another lie by desi. And a typical pitiful racist EXCUSE. It presumes there is
SAFETY in using a racist slur, since someone placing your words in QUOTES,
can be called a racist as well. Only when FALSE QUOTES are offered can
such be presumed as racist. In Jigsaw's case, he was EXPOSING YOUR
RACISM. As I've been doing for almost three years now. Having first
recognized your racism in May 2000.
>I hope (but don't for a second imagine) that the lesson has been learned.
>
The lesson we should all learn, is that you have now argued that anyone who
quotes your racist words, becomes a racist. How very convenient for you,
desi. You can post all the obscene racist slurs you wish, and anyone who
mentions them, as proving you did so, automatically becomes what YOU'VE
PROVED yourself to be.
Let me assure you, that I will CONTINUE to report each and every one
of your racist slurs. Because you are the greatest disgrace this newsgroup
has ever endured. A racist who would presume to not even be honest
enough to admit he is.
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi
Another EXACT QUOTE from desi -- but desi would call anyone who
QUOTES him, as a racist -- yet these are desi's words -- totally and
completely... without even an attribution to anyone else --
A Planet Visitor
>Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> wrote in message news:<oumni-...@zeouane.org>...
>> [ This is a repost of the following article: ]
>> [ From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org> ]
>> [ Subject: Re: MLK day ]
>> [ Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty ]
>> [ Message-ID: <27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net> ]
>>
>> <Thanks to having my own NNTP server that does not expire any posts, this
>> is the original text, my response to FW, when he attempted to assuage his
>> guilt at having the blood of Martin Luther King on his hands.>
>>
>
>< Article snipped >
>
Ah... so we might see the _context_ of what you are talking about ... let's
put it back in... shall we?? - This was it
-------------------------------------------
My tribute --
What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
desi's sickness --
You _fucking disgusting_ lowlife.
----------------------------------------------------
Now.. before even going any further... you will find that desi's QUOTE of
my words, left out a part of my tribute... perhaps fearing that it would
be too obvious that his insult was intended to destroy my meaning. Thus...
THIS was my entire comment --
----------------------------------------------------
"What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
This is a day to personally reflect on your individual contributions to
EQUALITY, or the lack thereof. Because only TRUE EQUALITY can
fulfill that dream. This is a day for inward contemplation. To paraphrase
Lincoln... and I hope not tritely.. "That from (this) honored
dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which (he) gave
the last full measure of devotion.."
This is a day to honor the dead... to Honor Martin Luther King, Jr.
The man, his principles, his dreams... and yes -- his memory as well.
But let's not forget he is MORE than a 'memory.' He embodies the
very principles which should guide our lives. Where will we be 34
years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and hate still be half-full,
or will we have finally emptied it? I certainly don't know, but I do know that
the answer lies in the future behavior of each and every one of us.
PV
-----------------------------------------------------
And I enjoy every opportunity to repeat that tribute in its entirety.
A tribute which desi has claimed he intended to DESTROY MY
MEANING in those words. Have you seen the FILTHY words
he used to CONTAMINATE, DESECRATE and DEBASE
what was a tribute to MLK, I had offered? The disgusting,
revolting images he brought forth. It is his method... in all cases.
Such as when he described the murder of a 17 year-old-girl,
and insured he mentioned that she wore no panties and her
pubic area was EXPOSED as she fell dead after being shot
by her murderer. He is not satisfied unless he can put the
UGLIEST spin possible on EVERY comment he provides here.
He has some very unhealthy mental problems. And I cannot
see how anyone who reads his posts could not be aware of
those problems. And then he pathetically claims that I attempt
to demonize HIM... when he does a very effective job of
demonizing HIMSELF. And certainly ATTEMPTED to first
demonize ME, and my meaning.
>So that was the post which provoked one of the angriest and most
>dishonest reactions I, at least, have ever seen on usenet.
Yes... the one where desi, the racist swine, admits that he intended
to DESTROY the MEANING of my words, which formed a tribute
to MLK...You will find that my tribute PROVOKED him into one
of the angriest, most dishonest, and most disgusting racist comments
ever offered in AADP.
> Even by
>PV's standards, the vitriol and lies were particularly intense.
Huh??? You mean that coming from desi, of course. Since my tribute
contained absolute no vitriol and lies. Unless you are claiming that my
tribute contained some vitriol and lies. Is that what you are claiming?
I'd be interested in hearing if you believe my tribute DID contain any
vitriol or lies, and essentially what words in my tribute you feel qualify
for those insults. Specifically, what particular sentence or comment
in MY post, do you find contains vitriol and lies?
> The
>anger was revealed in some of the most absurd prose imaginable
>(demons, goblins and much more) and the lies were concentrated on the
>equally absurd claim that Desmond had exhibited racism and that his
>intention in writing that message had been to attack the very idea of
>"anyone" paying a tribute to Martin Luther King.
>
Of course it was... and later on, he ADMITTED that was his intention,
since he later said "So I destroyed _your_ meaning."
>So what was really behind the attempt by PV to falsely accuse Desmond
>of racism? Is anyone really convinced by this so obviously false
>indignation about racism that PV is currently acting out? Have you
>seen the kind of language he has been using? If that were genuine -
>which it most certainly isn't - it would make the Rev. Al Sharpton
>look like the Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan.
>
What? Are you so obsessed that you would ALSO denounce a tribute
to MLK? What drives that kind of racist passion? Read my ORIGINAL
words. What essentially do you find wrong with them? Now read desi's
words. They essential form an INSULT to the MEANING of those
words. And that insult to the meaning is what you now state you support.
If ANYONE is supporting the works of the KKK, it is in your support
of the KKK comments contained in desi's racist post.
>So no: like much else about PV, it is fake. Ask yourself why, if PV
>really was as anti-racist as he is trying to look, he would spend his
>time ranting about it here, in a death penalty newsgroup where racism
>is seldom even discussed, let alone displayed. He would be posting
>these rants on some newsgroup used by the KKK or neo-nazis. Or maybe
>he would post to a dedicated anti-racist newsgroup - I'm sure there
>are many out there.
>
Oh, yeah... sure. Claim I should leave racism to spread its venom here,
and post to KKK or neo-nazi groups. What an utter moron you are.
I am HERE... I see RACISM HERE. I will most certainly STAY HERE.
And I will most certainly ATTACK RACISM HERE. You will not chase
me away... so racism can run rampant HERE. You would prefer that
I leave so racism can simply run its course HERE. I suppose we could
set up a sign that says. == TO ALL RACISTS -- post to AADP and no
one can speak out against you == Call it a racist _safety zone_. What a
sad evil little goblin you actually are. Claiming that racists can say what
they want here, and those opposed to it, should voice their _objectiions_
elsewhere.
>So clearly PV is using this anti-racism as a mask - the only question
>is ..... to hide what? I believe it is to hide his frustration at his
>continued failure to make any ground whatsoever in his "mission" to
>discredit Desmond, whose intellect, writing ability and wit PV knows
>he could never compete with.
>
Yeah, right... calling everyone who disagrees with him a "Fuckwit," or
a "deathies," is REALLY a _hard-act to follow_. It's really tough to
deal with articulate comments such as those one-word insults. ROTFLMAO.
The fact is dealing with desi is one of the more simple tasks anyone
could imagine. All he actually has going for him is that he spews out
so MUCH ignorance that one can hardly keep up with it. Even given
that I'm retired... the man is an utterly unbelievable gushing fountain of
obscenity, racism, stupidity, and drivel. You stick a finger to plug one
of those characteristics, and another one gushes forth twice as strong.
But dealing with them INTELLECTUALLY is a task that a 15-year-old
could handle.
>But why the anti-racism act? Why that, specifically? Study some of the
>background to the battles between PV and Desmond and you will see that
>it was Desmond who first - at least in any significant way - accused
>PV of being a racist.
>
> Prior to that, there were no such rants from PV
>about racism - neither that which he is accusing Desmond of nor
>general racism in society. PV only decided to don this anti-racism hat
>of his after Desmond began accusing him of racism. It is the extreme
>reaction ploy - appear to become the total opposite of what you are
>accused of, and then accuse your accuser of what he was accusing you
>of.
Actually, sport... you are even more stupid than I first imagined. I have
recognized that desi is a racist for almost THREE YEARS NOW. Beginning
almost IMMEDIATELY after I entered this group. My VERY FIRST post
to this group was on April 16, 2000. Now... pay attention. On May 27, 2000,
a bit over one month from my first post, I FIRST recognized his racism, see --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=4dGX4.292%24TZ2.14070%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
In that thread, desi had posted these words -- "'Wow, did you see the way that nigga
bucked when my slugs hit 'im ..?!'"
AF Tech responded by posting "So, you're a racist too." Recognizing what most
already knew. I then posted to AF Tech, fully agreeing with his assessment of desi's
racism.
Then see on June 19, 2000, less than a month after that --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=xZr35.11560%24ds.329162%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
Again, desi posted ANOTHER racist slur, with his comment "the good ol' boys don't
like them niggas comin' in from South America an' stealin' tha wimmyn, and causin'
all that crime, now ..." And I remarked -- "Pardon me??? Who's the one demeaning
with the racist slur here? I sense that you really get a perverse thrill by posting
the word?"
Then see on Aug 14, 2000, less than 2 months after that --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=wB1m5.2704%24Cc2.119579%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
Now quite clearly I have seen him for what he really is, with my words --
"Desmond Coughlan is a fundamental racist, using every possible
opportunity to exploit and twist the words of others while exhibiting
the qualities that all easily recognize as bigotry and prejudice"
Then again the very next day, Aug 15, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=E3mm5.5733%24Cc2.222091%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
When again speaking of desi, I posted -- "his voice is stridently racist, without
a hint of objectivity."
Then again two days later, Aug 17, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=K22n5.12074%24Cc2.437031%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
When he posted one of his racist postings I remarked AGAIN -- "In case anyone
has any illusions about Desmond NOT being a racist, let me repeat part of a post
from him..:" And I related that racist post.
Then again on Aug 20, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=rPXn5.4870%24Nz4.243149%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
And now very explicit. My words to another -- "You see, DESMOND
is the racist!!!! His protestations notwithstanding, Desmond is the most
dangerous form of a racist. He avows racial tolerance, but underneath
that facade lies a deep vein of hatred for all things other than those outside
of his tiny world" You see I was ALREADY aware of his METHODS
of being a racist, but hiding behind that facade. Two and a half YEARS
AGO.
Then again on Sept 25, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=IeKz5.17225%24Vu5.842450%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
My words about him -- "his disgusting anti US, racist, arrogant, self-righteous, and
simply stupid comments."
And these only represent the first few months of my posting to AADP.
Further, you are a fool if you believe that I have not spoken out about
racism here, and elsewhere, before my ugly encounter with desi's
insult of MLK. My posts recognizing racism in the U.S. are many here.
I have called the U.S. a nation without honor, as long as racism still exists.
I have said it in MANY ways... and said it EXACTLY in THOSE words ---
that "we are a nation without honor," in respect to racism in twenty-four
posts to this group. The first being on May 17, 2001... See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=nFUM6.236758%24fs3.40067795%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
A very interesting post, which includes these exact words from me --
"4. Our disenfranchised: One word again - Disgrace. We are a nation
without honor, until we fulfill our commitment to equal rights to the
LAST FULL MEASURE. We've taken relatively baby steps in
achieving equal rights in my lifetime, IMHO. I can only hope that the next
generation does a better job than my generation has done. My father's
generation did not even pay lip service to equal rights, lacking even an
understanding of what it MEANT. My generation has ONLY paid lip
service to equal rights. The next generation needs to IMPLEMENT
TRUE HUMAN RIGHTS."
I am not unaware of the harm that racism does to our very spirit as a
species. While desi is part and parcel of generating that harm, by being
a PART of it, rather than a vocal opponent of it. His words, which form
racial slurs are meant to DIMINISH the RACE, rather than diminish
racism. EVERY racial slur he begins, only serves to diminish that
particular race. And you are a fool, for supporting him. But that's YOUR
problem... not mine. Since I will NEVER accept racism... and I will
ALWAYS speak out against desi's displays of such racism. And I
will NOT leave this group to satisfy your affection for that racist.
PV
Just passing by
add a few footnotes to my own previous one, giving regard to some of
PV's reply to it.
Firstly, PV seems (or pretends) to think that my reference to his
vitriol and lies was in respect of his original MLK tribute. So I am
happy to make clear that that reference applied not to the MLK tribute
itself, but to his subsequent reactions then, and still now, to
Desmond's reply to it.
PV also repeated his lie about Desmond having admitted intending to
destroy PV's *claimed* meaning, rather than what Desmond sees as his
*real* and concealed meaning, by again reproducing half a sentence and
adding a period at the end. His earlier defence of that being
acceptable under American English rules remains utter nonsense. There
are slight differences between American and British rules regarding
the placement of periods, but in neither is it acceptable to give half
a sentence the appearance of it having been a full one.
For example, if I wanted to extract only the first part of the final
sentence in the above paragraph, I would do so thus:
"There are slight differences between American and British rules
regarding the placement of periods....."
Look at the difference: a single period would have failed to indicate
that there were more words in the original sentence. I say again: PV
did what he did to deliberately deceive people because he knew that if
he had reproduced Desmond's entire sentence, nobody would have been
convinced by his (PV's) interpretation of it.
PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
but they do no such thing.
Take the first one: I have read every word PV wrote there and the
words "racist" or "racism" are not among them. The nearest PV comes
to even approaching the periphery of that issue is to remark on
Desmond's strong pro-European views. PV wrote: "1) All things foreign
to Europe -- most especially the U.S. of A. His comments in this
regard border on the insane, but nevertheless remain a threat to
anyone within earshot." Condemning racism? Don't make me laugh!
Compare that to the kind of language PV has been using (with
transparent insincerity) over the past two weeks.
The next link PV offered was to a reply of his to a Desmond post in
which Desmond had repeatedly condemned racism. PV's response was to
criticise Desmond, not for being racist, but for going too far in
attacking others for it. PV's words were: "Why keep returning to
racist... is something going on in your subconscious, humm?" Including
that link was a big own goal by PV.
I will read the remaining links PV offered later, but I am in no hurry
as I will be adding any new observations as further footnotes to this
post, rather than in direct reply to PV.
What is emerging is more and more evidence of PV's current vehement
"anti-racist" position being one of convenience, and bearing little or
no resemblance to his postings during previous years. I will do some
more checking through the archives to find further examples of this
inconsistency, and will add them here from time to time.
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
> PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
> he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
> posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
> but they do no such thing.
Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
Not by a country mile. He stands out from other conservatives by
expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring. It may be
all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
Mr Q. Z. D.
--
Drinker, systems administrator, wannabe writer, musician and all-round bastard.
"They've got to be protected/All their rights respected ((o))
Until someone we like can be elected." - Tom Lehrer ((O))
JIGSAW1695
From: "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks
Date: 3/6/2003 12:05 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>
In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
> PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
> he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
> posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
> but they do no such thing.
Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
Not by a country mile. He stands out from other conservatives by
expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring. It may be
all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
Mr Q. Z. D.
===============================
Q! is correct on this one.
What say yoe, Dezi?
A Planet Visitor
>As it is not my policy to reply directly to PV's posts, I will instead
>add a few footnotes to my own previous one, giving regard to some of
>PV's reply to it.
>
ROTFLMAO... I cannot BELIEVE how obsessed you are. You must
be a mental case. If you continue to post... at LEAST... don't claim
that every post is your LAST. Since no one else is here. You now
claim to be posting to yourself. When what you REALLY need to do to
yourself... is look in the damn mirror.
>Firstly, PV seems (or pretends) to think that my reference to his
>vitriol and lies was in respect of his original MLK tribute. So I am
>happy to make clear that that reference applied not to the MLK tribute
>itself, but to his subsequent reactions then, and still now, to
>Desmond's reply to it.
>
Yes... desi's insane attack on my tribute... my tribute which you now admit
contained no vitriol. While desi has argued that I am the one who demonizes.
Yet he most certainly attempted to demonize both me and my meaning.
You have NEVER answered my question in respect to my tribute and desi's
immediate reply. Who was the FIRST to demonize? Before you even began
obsessively defending that racist... who was the FIRST to demonize in this
MLK Day thread? It was desi, of course, in his immediate knee-jerk
ACT meant to DESTROY THE MEANING in my words.
>PV also repeated his lie about Desmond having admitted intending to
>destroy PV's *claimed* meaning, rather than what Desmond sees as his
>*real* and concealed meaning, by again reproducing half a sentence and
>adding a period at the end.
I wasn't the one who used the WORDS "Destroy" and "Meaning." desi did.
>His earlier defence of that being
>acceptable under American English rules remains utter nonsense. There
>are slight differences between American and British rules regarding
>the placement of periods, but in neither is it acceptable to give half
>a sentence the appearance of it having been a full one.
>
Actually, you are totally incorrect here. And can provide no references
to what you state, other than your opinion, which is obviously biased
since I so totally destroyed you in another argument. While I have
provided a great number of references supporting EXACTLY my
use of that period to end my sentence. You know, if you make claims
you should be able to back them up with some source. I know you
are unfamiliar with that method... with you finding that calling everyone
_corrupt_ or claiming someone was _framed_ meets your
_standard of evidence_. But do try to follow along.
>For example, if I wanted to extract only the first part of the final
>sentence in the above paragraph, I would do so thus:
>
>"There are slight differences between American and British rules
>regarding the placement of periods....."
>
>Look at the difference: a single period would have failed to indicate
>that there were more words in the original sentence. I say again: PV
>did what he did to deliberately deceive people because he knew that if
>he had reproduced Desmond's entire sentence, nobody would have been
>convinced by his (PV's) interpretation of it.
>
How very desperate you have become. Perhaps you could also apologize
for having taken the liberty to place words in a FALSE QUOTE from me
in quotation marks? As I have done. Or would your credibility be placed
in jeopardy? The ENTIRE meaning of desi's INTENTION was encapsulated
in those few words -- "So I destroyed _your_ meaning." More than that,
simply contained his racist reasoning for doing so. It is similar to the
KKK covering his face with that peaked white hood, and carrying that
flaming cross to burn down the home of a Black, as his INTENTION
to DESTROY. It is absurd to presume that any REASONING for doing so,
can be seen as a normal human reaction. What followed in desi's words,
after DESTROYING that home... was his pathetic REASONING for doing so.
If we accept THAT... we also accept the INTENTION and the ACT
itself. Do you find that one can express REASONING to DESTROYING
the MEANING of a tribute to MLK? When will you EVER answer
direct questions, instead of slithering around this issue?
>PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
>he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
>posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
>but they do no such thing.
>
Of course they do. Is your brain on holiday?
>Take the first one: I have read every word PV wrote there and the
>words "racist" or "racism" are not among them.
The previous post had ALREADY CONFIRMED what he IS. I
simply AGREED with that observation. There is no way that it could
not be seen as claiming he was racist.
> The nearest PV comes
>to even approaching the periphery of that issue is to remark on
>Desmond's strong pro-European views. PV wrote: "1) All things foreign
>to Europe -- most especially the U.S. of A. His comments in this
>regard border on the insane, but nevertheless remain a threat to
>anyone within earshot." Condemning racism? Don't make me laugh!
>Compare that to the kind of language PV has been using (with
>transparent insincerity) over the past two weeks.
>
Umm... the previous post had already USED that word... and I was
in total agreement with it.
>The next link PV offered was to a reply of his to a Desmond post in
>which Desmond had repeatedly condemned racism. PV's response was to
>criticise Desmond, not for being racist, but for going too far in
>attacking others for it. PV's words were: "Why keep returning to
>racist... is something going on in your subconscious, humm?" Including
>that link was a big own goal by PV.
Rubbish... it was a clear identification that desi used a racist slur... not
to IDENTIFY racism, but to BE A RACIST.
>
>I will read the remaining links PV offered later, but I am in no hurry
>as I will be adding any new observations as further footnotes to this
>post, rather than in direct reply to PV.
>
Sure you will. Who do you believe you are kidding? You read the
first two, but didn't have TIME for the rest!!! Well, let's look at the
rest. All of them over 2 and a half years ago ---
My post on Aug 14, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=wB1m5.2704%24Cc2.119579%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"Desmond Coughlan is a fundamental racist, using every possible
opportunity to exploit and twist the words of others while exhibiting
the qualities that all easily recognize as bigotry and prejudice"
See the words "FUNDAMENTAL RACIST"?
Then again the very next day, Aug 15, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=E3mm5.5733%24Cc2.222091%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
When again speaking of desi, I posted -- "his voice is stridently racist, without
a hint of objectivity."
See the word "RACIST"?
Then again two days later, Aug 17, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=K22n5.12074%24Cc2.437031%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"In case anyone has any illusions about Desmond NOT being a racist, let me repeat
part of a post from him..:"
See the word "RACIST"?
Then again on Aug 20, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=rPXn5.4870%24Nz4.243149%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"You see, DESMOND is the racist!!!! His protestations notwithstanding, Desmond is
the most dangerous form of a racist. He avows racial tolerance, but underneath
that facade lies a deep vein of hatred for all things other than those outside
of his tiny world"
See the word TWICE of "RACIST"?
Then again on Sept 25, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=IeKz5.17225%24Vu5.842450%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"his disgusting anti US, racist, arrogant, self-righteous, and simply stupid
comments."
See the word "RACIST"?
Do you have a reading disability?
And ALL of those OVER TWO AND A HALF YEARS AGO.
>What is emerging is more and more evidence of PV's current vehement
>"anti-racist" position being one of convenience, and bearing little or
>no resemblance to his postings during previous years. I will do some
>more checking through the archives to find further examples of this
>inconsistency, and will add them here from time to time.
You do that, sport. And while you're looking -- pick up a few more racist
comments from desi... they're much easier to spot than you can imagine.
In fact, while I was looking for those posts that I've called him a racist,
I ran into two more of his comments that CONTAINED the very racist
slurs I have already noted. The count is now up to 30. And you could
help by trying to find more of them. Otherwise... Your support of a racist
has become sickening to me.
PV
Just passing by
> In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
> unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
> > PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
> > he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
> > posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
> > but they do no such thing.
>
> Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
> Not by a country mile.
Mr Q.Z.D., I have never called PV a racist. If you believe otherwise,
then find an example and show it here.
> He stands out from other conservatives by
> expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
> social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
Yes, "on occasion". My purpose is to show how selective he has been in
choosing those occasions.
> He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
> being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
And again, the degree to which he takes that route depends more upon
how many points he (wrongly) believes he can score against his arch
enemy, Desmond, than upon any wider convictions he may hold, as I
intend to show.
> To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring.
See my first answer. While on the subject of false accusations of
racism, can you see any racism in Desmond's reply to PV's original
"MLK Day" post? I certainly can't.
> It may be
> all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
> it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
>
> Mr Q. Z. D.
I respect your and anyone else's decision to ignore my posts if you so
choose.
Just passing by
> On 5 Mar 2003 06:04:59 -0800, unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
> >His earlier defence of that being
> >acceptable under American English rules remains utter nonsense. There
> >are slight differences between American and British rules regarding
> >the placement of periods, but in neither is it acceptable to give half
> >a sentence the appearance of it having been a full one.
> >
> Actually, you are totally incorrect here. And can provide no references
> to what you state, other than your opinion, which is obviously biased
> since I so totally destroyed you in another argument. While I have
> provided a great number of references supporting EXACTLY my
> use of that period to end my sentence. You know, if you make claims
> you should be able to back them up with some source. I know you
> are unfamiliar with that method... with you finding that calling everyone
> _corrupt_ or claiming someone was _framed_ meets your
> _standard of evidence_. But do try to follow along.
Yawn!
As PV is almost certainly the only user of this newsgroup who would
need this very basic information that even small children would be
aware of, proving to him, I will make an exception to my own rule of
not directly responding to his posts.
The link:
http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/perEllip.html
The relevant part of the page reads:
_______________________________________________
Rule 3. If words are omitted at the end of a quoted sentence, use
ellipsis marks followed by the necessary ending punctuation mark.
Examples
The regulation states, "All agencies must document overtime...."
The original sentence read:
The regulation states, "All agencies must document overtime or risk
losing federal funds."
__________________________________________________
And just to drive this very simple point home, here is another link:
http://www.grammartips.homestead.com/dots.html
And once again the relevant part of the page reads:
____________________________________
When you see three spaced "periods" in a row, you are in the presence
of an ellipsis. What this means is that something has been left
out--usually, a part of a direct quotation.
As you probably know, a direct quotation must be presented exactly as
it is in the original. If you have to make a change in the quotation,
you must signal your reader that you are making a change.
_____________________________________
This is another of the many reasons I have stopped directly replying
to PV. Everything, however obvious and simple it is to anyone else,
has to be spelled out for him over and over and over again.
John Rennie
"Just passing by" <unimpre...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com...
> "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote
in message news:<jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>...
> > In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
> > unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
>
>
> > > PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
> > > he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
> > > posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
> > > but they do no such thing.
> >
> > Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
> > Not by a country mile.
>
> Mr Q.Z.D., I have never called PV a racist. If you believe otherwise,
> then find an example and show it here.
What you posted was this:
"What is emerging is more and more evidence of PV's current vehement
"anti-racist" position being one of convenience, and bearing little or
no resemblance to his postings during previous years. I will do some
more checking through the archives to find further examples of this
inconsistency, and will add them here from time to time."
There's implication enough there to suggest that PV is a late convert
to anti-racism and that being accepted that he might, just might, have
been racist before being converted. I've read non flame fest posts from
PV over a period of nearly five years now and I assure you he has written
the finest attacks on racialism one could have wished for. Your
comment above that his present position bears "no resemblance to
postings during previous years" could not be more incorrect and again
implies that he has at least flirted with racialism.
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
> "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote
> in message news:<jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>...
> > In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
> > unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
> > > PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
> > > he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
> > > posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
> > > but they do no such thing.
> >
> > Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
> >
> > Not by a country mile.
>
> Mr Q.Z.D., I have never called PV a racist. If you believe otherwise,
> then find an example and show it here.
I think that John's post addresses what I might otherwise have said at
this point.
> > He stands out from other conservatives by
> > expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number
> > of
> > social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
> Yes, "on occasion". My purpose is to show how selective he has been in
> choosing those occasions.
I disagree. He has let such concerns find voice when (IMHO) he has
simply _forgotten_ to be as stubborn and inflexible as he usually is.
> > He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of
> > it
> > being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
>
> And again, the degree to which he takes that route depends more upon
> how many points he (wrongly) believes he can score against his arch
> enemy, Desmond, than upon any wider convictions he may hold, as I
> intend to show.
The majority of the posts to which I refer date back to _well_ before
the current stupidity with Desmond started. Of that much, I can assure
you.
> > To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring.
>
> See my first answer. While on the subject of false accusations of
> racism, can you see any racism in Desmond's reply to PV's original
> "MLK Day" post? I certainly can't.
To label Desmond a racist would likewise be ludicrous. There hasn't
been a bona-fide racist regularly posting to a.a.d-p. since Frankie (or
FRANK, as he was known to some)[1] and that was well before your time.
> > It may be
> > all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
> > it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
> I respect your and anyone else's decision to ignore my posts if you so
> choose.
I don't wish to ignore your posts. You have given PV one or two right
royal spankings, IMHO[2]. You've been both amusing and convincing. It
is disappointing, though, to see in you a stubborn determination to
undermine PV at every turn, regardless of whether or not his position
should actually be undermined.
Mr Q. Z. D.
[1] - Even Donnie could not really be termed a racist, as his glowering, all-encompassing hatred and envy is directed at almost _all_ human beings, regardless of race.
[2] - and _no_, PV, you will not be able to convince me otherwise so don't start...
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
jigsa...@aol.com (JIGSAW1695) wrote:
> Subject: Re: MLK day
> From: "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks
> To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring. It may be
> all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
> it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
> ===============================
> Q! is correct on this one.
I am almost _always_ correct, Jiggy, as you should know by now. ;)
> What say yoe, Dezi?
He's made his point and I've read it. I am inclined not to comment upon
it as I've been more involved today in the Desmond/PV thing than I think
is really sensible.
John Rennie
"Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote in
> > I respect your and anyone else's decision to ignore my posts if you so
> > choose.
>
> I don't wish to ignore your posts. You have given PV one or two right
> royal spankings, IMHO[2]. You've been both amusing and convincing. It
> is disappointing, though, to see in you a stubborn determination to
> undermine PV at every turn, regardless of whether or not his position
> should actually be undermined.
>
> Mr Q. Z. D.
Agreed!
Just passing by
> "Just passing by" <unimpre...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com...
> > "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote
> in message news:<jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>...
> > > In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
> > > unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
> >
> >
> > > > PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
> > > > he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
> > > > posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
> > > > but they do no such thing.
> > >
> > > Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
> > > Not by a country mile.
> >
> > Mr Q.Z.D., I have never called PV a racist. If you believe otherwise,
> > then find an example and show it here.
>
> What you posted was this:
> "What is emerging is more and more evidence of PV's current vehement
> "anti-racist" position being one of convenience, and bearing little or
> no resemblance to his postings during previous years. I will do some
> more checking through the archives to find further examples of this
> inconsistency, and will add them here from time to time."
>
> There's implication enough there to suggest that PV is a late convert
I accept that part.
> ... and that being accepted that he might, just might, have
> been racist before being converted.
But I totally reject that part. If you want to read things into what I
have written that are not there, either overtly or by implication,
then I can't stop you from doing that. But I can refer you to a fairly
recent post of mine to PV in which I told him: "I am not calling you a
racist; I am calling you a liar."
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03021...@posting.google.com
Do I need to make what this is about any clearer than that?
I believe that the intensity of PV's recent (i.e. since Desmond's
reply to his original MLK Day post) attacks on racism are at best an
exaggeration of his real feelings on the matter, and at worst a total
sham. I also believe that he is using the racism issue in an attempt
to "put one over" on Desmond by falsely accusing him of making racist
comments in that MLK reply and in another post in which Desmond
referred to a certain anti-Arab term of abuse in an entirely innocent
manner.
> I've read non flame fest posts from
> PV over a period of nearly five years now and I assure you he has written
> the finest attacks on racialism one could have wished for. Your
> comment above that his present position bears "no resemblance to
> postings during previous years" could not be more incorrect...
Then watch this space. I would not have made the comment you refer to
if I didn't believe it could be backed up - and it will be.
> ... and again
> implies that he has at least flirted with racialism.
It implies nothing of the kind. I have, on many occasions, accused PV
of lying, of deliberately distorting the words of other posters and of
running away from challenges. I would never have made such accusations
if I had not been confident of proving them. What I am accusing him of
now is not racism, but of, at the very least, exaggerating any genuine
anti-racist feelings he may have for the purpose stated above, and
again I am confident of being able to establish that. But, on the
basis of the postings of his I have so far seen, I could not hope to
prove him to be a racist, and so have never accused him of being one
.... whatever you or anyone else wrongly imagine you can read between
the lines of anything I have written. It isn't there, whether you
think you can see it or not.
So from some implication of PV being a racist you wrongly suggested
was in my post, let me move to the totally unambiguous accusation from
PV that Desmond's reply to his original MLK post was racist and that
Desmond was attacking "anyone" who would pay a tribute to Martin
Luther King. I'm sure you have read that reply, so what do you think?
Was it racist? Was it an attack on "anyone" paying a tribute? Was it
disrespectful to black people? PV has claimed it was all of those
things, but I have yet to see anyone agree with him. I believe that
Desmond has been wrongfully accused over that reply. In your view, am
I right or wrong to believe that?
John Rennie
"Just passing by" <unimpre...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com...
snip
> So from some implication of PV being a racist you wrongly suggested
> was in my post, let me move to the totally unambiguous accusation from
> PV that Desmond's reply to his original MLK post was racist and that
> Desmond was attacking "anyone" who would pay a tribute to Martin
> Luther King. I'm sure you have read that reply, so what do you think?
> Was it racist? Was it an attack on "anyone" paying a tribute? Was it
> disrespectful to black people? PV has claimed it was all of those
> things, but I have yet to see anyone agree with him. I believe that
> Desmond has been wrongfully accused over that reply. In your view, am
> I right or wrong to believe that?
A reasonably question, JPB, but as I will not to comment on Desmond
or his posts for reasons unconnected with this news group I cannot
answer you. My apologies.
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:40:02 +0000
>
>le Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:30:10 -0000, dans l'article
><3SQ9a.1173$Yj5...@newsfep3-gui.server.ntli.net>, John Rennie
><j.re...@ntlworld.com> a dit ...
>
>>> So from some implication of PV being a racist you wrongly suggested was
>>> in my post, let me move to the totally unambiguous accusation from PV
>>> that Desmond's reply to his original MLK post was racist and that
>>> Desmond was attacking "anyone" who would pay a tribute to Martin Luther
>>> King. I'm sure you have read that reply, so what do you think? Was it
>>> racist? Was it an attack on "anyone" paying a tribute? Was it
>>> disrespectful to black people? PV has claimed it was all of those
>>> things, but I have yet to see anyone agree with him. I believe that
>>> Desmond has been wrongfully accused over that reply. In your view, am I
>>> right or wrong to believe that?
>
>> A reasonably question, JPB, but as I will not to comment on Desmond or
>> his posts for reasons unconnected with this news group I cannot answer
>> you. My apologies.
>
>Well at least you used my name this time ... :-)
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/gimmicks/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
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>
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>
>
>
>
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>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:40:02 +0000
>Lines: 29
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Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 18:11:24 +0000
>
>le Thu, 06 Mar 2003 05:05:01 GMT, dans l'article
><jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>, Mr Q. Z. Diablo
><jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> a dit ...
>
>>> PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something he
>>> had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his posts
>>> from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said .... but
>>> they do no such thing.
>
>> Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
>> Not by a country mile. He stands out from other conservatives by
>> expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
>> social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
>> He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
>> being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
>>
>> To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring. It may be
>> all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
>> it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
>
>As in the case of that other famous racist, Jigsaw, you are allowing
>yourself to read and believe what FuckWit _writes_, rather than what he in
>fact _means_, Q..
>
>To begin with, it would be downright unusual for FW _not_ to be a racist,
>considering his background and age. Someone who left school at 15 and
>whose only 'diplomas' come from what uneducated people like to call the
>'University of Life', and whose social stratum is roughly equivalent to
>British working classes of the 1970s ... sorry, '1970's' (sic), have always
>provided the 'grassroots support' for racism. However, that itself is not
>sufficient to call him a racist.
>
>What _is_ sufficient, however, is his frequently expressed opinion that the
>death penalty is 'pro-black'. Study after study has revealed blatant bias
>in the administration of capital punishment. FuckWit seeks to hide this.
>When you defend a racist system, you become a racist.
>
>As 'JPB' has pointed out, his 'desi [sic] is a racist' angle serves two
>purposes. One is to hide his own racism, as in all probability he is
>profoundly ashamed of it (as well he should be), and two, he knows that
>intellectually and morally, I outclass him, and he cannot hope to engage me
>in debate, without being roundly thrashed and made to look like an
>uneducated baboon whose dentures have been knocked out. He thus seeks to
>'demonise' me, hoping that others on AADP will agree that I am 'racist'.
>As yet, no one but his pet performing seal (aka Jigsaw) has bothered to
>dignify his allegations with a response.
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/gimmicks/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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n.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 18:11:24 +0000
>Lines: 55
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><jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>
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A Planet Visitor
>
>"Just passing by" <unimpre...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>news:21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com...
>> "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote
>in message news:<jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>...
>> > In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
>> > unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
>>
<I have purposely clipped the other dialog between you and JPB>
>I've read non flame fest posts from
>PV over a period of nearly five years now and I assure you he has written
>the finest attacks on racialism one could have wished for.
>
You have no idea how much those few words moved me. Or how much
I appreciated you posting them.
PV
>
>
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Thu, 06 Mar 2003 05:05:01 GMT, dans l'article <jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>, Mr Q. Z. Diablo <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> a dit ...
>
>>> PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something he
>>> had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his posts
>>> from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said .... but
>>> they do no such thing.
>
>> Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
>> Not by a country mile. He stands out from other conservatives by
>> expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
>> social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
>> He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
>> being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
>>
>> To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring. It may be
>> all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
>> it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
>
>As in the case of that other famous racist, Jigsaw, you are allowing
>yourself to read and believe what FuckWit _writes_, rather than what he in
>fact _means_, Q..
>
Sure... let's not be misled by what is written, when one can so easily
lie and presume that it is UNWRITTEN but true. While the one who
has WRITTEN so many racist comments, containing racist slurs, can
presume to DECLARE what is not written, must be true.
Of course, I might ask -- what did my TRIBUTE to MLK that began this
entire thread MEAN? And why did you admit you intended to DESTROY
that MEANING? Remember that tribute?? The first post in this thread --
-------------------------------------------
What would MLK say today? The 'dream'?? Realized 34 years after his
assassination? Does anyone think it has become reality? This is a day of
'RECOGNITION.' Not in platitudes to ourselves of 'how far we have
come.' But in the awareness of 'how far we have to go.'
This is a day to personally reflect on your individual contributions to
EQUALITY, or the lack thereof. Because only TRUE EQUALITY can
fulfill that dream. This is a day for inward contemplation. To paraphrase
Lincoln... and I hope not tritely.. "That from (this) honored
dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which (he) gave
the last full measure of devotion.."
This is a day to honor the dead... to Honor Martin Luther King, Jr.
The man, his principles, his dreams... and yes -- his memory as well.
But let's not forget he is MORE than a 'memory.' He embodies the
very principles which should guide our lives. Where will we be 34
years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and hate still be half-full,
or will we have finally emptied it? I certainly don't know, but I do know that
the answer lies in the future behavior of each and every one of us.
PV
----------------------------------------------------
Those were my words. Now why don't you tell everyone what they
MEAN?? Since you were determined to DESTROY that MEANING.
>To begin with, it would be downright unusual for FW _not_ to be a racist,
>considering his background and age.
<rage on>
Of all the bigoted statements you have EVER placed in this group... That
is without a doubt the MOST bigoted. You have just accused EVERY
American over the age of 65 as being a racist. You FUCKING IDIOT!!!!
> Someone who left school at 15 and
>whose only 'diplomas' come from what uneducated people like to call the
>'University of Life', and whose social stratum is roughly equivalent to
>British working classes of the 1970s ... sorry, '1970's' (sic), have always
>provided the 'grassroots support' for racism. However, that itself is not
>sufficient to call him a racist.
>
<rage off>
Oh... I get it.. you were just engaging in your usual hyperbole, which has
no meaning whatsoever.
>What _is_ sufficient, however, is his frequently expressed opinion that the
>death penalty is 'pro-black'. Study after study has revealed blatant bias
>in the administration of capital punishment. FuckWit seeks to hide this.
>When you defend a racist system, you become a racist.
Umm... desi... YOUR words -- "Whilst the death penalty as presently administered
in the United States is unquestionably racist, most of the persons posting here in
support of it, aren't."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8agiq4.imp.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
Now... what the fuck does that even MEAN? Other than an absurd catch-22
argument. Giving you the presumed safety of claiming an unbiased view
of those who support the DP. While still giving you the opportunity to call
ANYONE who supports the DP, a racist for doing so. Typical desi hyperbole.
If you believe the DP is racist (there is no evidence it is, and I do not believe
it is), then you obviously must find everyone who supports a racist process
must be a racist. Or it's just more of your two-faced hypocrisy. Your argument
presumes something on the order of one can support the KKK (which is racist),
but not be a racist for doing so. And that particular comment of yours, is typical
of why I have come to so thoroughly despise you. Since you are so two-faced.
You try to hide behind this facade of morality, yet come out with the most
idiotic contradictory claims. And I'm sure it is one of the reasons you hope to hide
your posting history.
The facts are --
There is racism in America
Without any doubt.
There is racism in the Justice System
In my very firm opinion.
There is no racism in the DP
Absolute no proof that any exists.
If there were any racism in the DP then the number of Black murderers selected for
execution would be higher. That has nothing to do with racism... it is a simple
proven statistic. Or do you presume that Black murderers are not RESPONSIBLE
for committing murder? See ---
url:http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/tables/vracetab.htm
In 2000, the DOJ reported 7,523 White murder victims, and 7,393 Black murder
victims. In that report it is noted that 94% of all murders on Black victims
were committed by Black murderers. That represents 6,949 murders committed
by Black on Black. Now these are FACTS... having no racist significance. Since
they demonstrate FACT, and not opinion.
Further, the DOJ has continually investigated any possible racism in the
application of the DP... by examining SPECIFIC cases of those Blacks
sentenced to the DP, and has found no reason to believe any racism is
involved in selecting those murderers. They meet every criteria necessary
in terms of aggravating circumstances, prior behavior and possible future
threats. See --
url:http://www.immigration.gov/graphics/aboutus/congress/testimonies/2001/6_06_01.pdf
But is that because Blacks are RACIALLY more prone to violence?
ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! What it means is that WHITES have so
demeaned Blacks, for so many years, that even Blacks see THEMSELVES
as _expendable_.
Racism is endemic in our society. It is insidious, and pervasive. And the Black
has come to see himself as of less value than a White. The Ghettoization of
the Black in America is a national disgrace. That is the reason for so much Black
murder on Blacks.
It is a disgrace of monumental proportion in the U.S. But OBVIOUSLY
only supports the conclusion that LESS BLACKS are proportionately
sentenced to the DEATH PENALTY, since even juries tend to see
Black VICTIMS as not of sufficient _value_ that their murderers need
to be executed. This is borne out in EVERY statistic regarding Blacks
sentenced to the DP. There is generally a 4 to 3 ratio of White murderers
to Black murderers on DR. Usually running 2000 White murderers to every
1500 Black murderers. But Blacks commit more murders than Whites
(51.5% compared to 46.4% for White murderers), even though they represent
about 14% of the total U.S. population. Are you presuming that the only
way the DP could be seen as racially balanced would be if we executed
MORE BLACKS because they murder more Blacks??? Or LESS
WHITES because they murder less Blacks??? Both sound racist to me.
Racism in the DP, is non-existent in the sense that the Black is discriminated
against by BEING executed.
We need to find a REASON behind this ugly phenomenon, of Black on
Black murder, rather than presume we can EXCUSE murderers. Blacks
commit MORE murders, because racism has reduced them to not even
finding enough self-esteem to see themselves as EQUALS to Whites.
They have been subjected to the worst form of discrimination. One
cannot even comprehend (I know that I cannot) how each day must go...
with the almost certain belief that at least one racial innuendo... a furtive
glance... an ugly confrontation.. a racial slur (you DO know what they
are don't you?)... or.an evil word will not be encountered. And it begins
even before the SCHOOL YARD DAYS begin. Not a single day.
The fact is, having been so deprived for so many years, Blacks have
even come to THEMSELVES BELIEVING it means nothing
to murder one of their OWN. Turning brother against brother, because
of the low self-esteem driven into them by those who would presume
themselves better. Who would have them see themselves as less than
what they are, for so many years. They thus see themselves as ALREADY
a _damaged commodity_. And the rage issue, coupled with that low
self-esteem builds up as well. Is that a Black problem... inherent to something
within their genes?
Don't be absurd. Of course not!!!!
We... the Whites... have CREATED that feeling within the Blacks in the U.S.
Through disenfranchisement, and the insults we have heaped on that race for many
years, and continue to do so... which you seem to be a part of in those racist slurs
that fall so easily from your pen in disrespect to Blacks. While the murders they
commit on whites are generally expressions of an inner rage felt because of the
realization of having been treated as I speak of by Whites, and the realization
that they are not given RESPECT... which has generated the word which has
almost become an anthem to the Black American... dissin' -- the greatest
insult... disrespect. And consequently those murders Blacks commit on Whites,
generally meet the levels we find contain sufficient aggravating circumstances, and
malice necessary to justify execution. All brought about because of racism...
Violence brought about... MURDER brought about... not because of
the DP... but because of racism.
But then we have the Justice System. Where racism DOES play a role.
The fact is, I find the Justice System to be racist, and believe many
Blacks are unfairly convicted based SOLELY on the fact that they are Black.
And I find that Blacks who murder Blacks are probably more easily
convicted of those murders, simply because juries feel that _it just isn't that
important_ when a Black murders a Black, presuming in advance that _he
must have done it_. But by the SAME token --- When it comes time to
SENTENCE... it is usually that same feeling among jurors that it _just isn't
that important_ to sentence a Black to execution for murdering another
Black, that keeps many Blacks from being executed. While unfortunately,
the byproduct is that it also keeps some Whites from being executed for
murdering Blacks. Not because they are White... but because their
VICTIM was Black. But keep in mind Whites commit 6% of murders
against Blacks, while Blacks commit 94% of those murders against Black
victims. It would be a tragedy if we sentenced Blacks to the DP in
PROPORTION to the number of murders they commit. Because I
believe many Blacks are unfairly CONVICTED of crimes, including
murder. But having been convicted of murder, they generally are less
likely to be sentenced to the DP because 94% of their victims are
Black. Statistics certainly support that observation.
So Blacks are caught on a two-edge sword. They are seldom sentenced to
the DP for murdering one of their own (as Whites are not as well), while an
examination of the murders they commit against Whites, can generally be
seen to meet EVERY criteria we use to determine who should be executed.
All that BECAUSE of racism, but certainly not RACIST in who we execute.
Since the Black murderers sentenced to the DP MEET EVERY criteria
of those we generally execute. And I will not EXCUSE murder, if it meets the
criteria I expect that society determines justifies execution.
Now I understand what your argument has been... that we must look at the
victim's race to determine if racism is in the DP. But the VICTIM is NOT
the one being sentenced to the DP. Those being executed are the only
humans that have any validity to any racism in the DP. And you have often
said that 'the dead cannot be helped, honoured, shamed, libelled, or hurt in
any way. But suddenly here, you would claim that the dead CAN be factored
into racism in the DP. So the argument in respect to the DP, MUST be a
comparison of ALL murderers and ALL sentences to the DP, to examine
any racism in a sentence to the DP. And, as I said... Blacks commit
51% of all murderers, yet represent 43% of those sentenced to the DP.
Further, I would be concerned if Blacks sentenced to the DP, represented
the same percentage as Black murderers. Since I believe many murders
of Blacks on Black do not meet the criteria I support for society to consider
execution.
I understand full well the responsibility that Whites owe to Blacks in respect
to having so disrespected them for so many years, that the Black has come to
disrespect HIMSELF in many ways. But in the end, I cannot be a party to
EXCUSING murder. When we fix racism in our SOCIETY, and God
willing it will be within those 34 years I have spoken of in the first post in this
thread, we will find that Blacks murder at the same rate as Whites, and thus the
ratio of those sentenced to the DP, will more closely mirror the population
averages of the separate races. But as long as 14% of our population, commit
over 50% of our murders, we can expect that to translate into the same numbers
sentenced to the DP. Yet the fact is... Blacks commit 50% of our murders,
because of RACISM. While, that just doesn't translate into racism in the DP.
>As 'JPB' has pointed out, his 'desi [sic] is a racist' angle serves two
>purposes. One is to hide his own racism,
Ah, but JPB has just denied ever calling me a racist. While you certainly
have PROVEN you are. That is what upsets you more than anything...
the fact that _I_ have PROVEN YOU... to be a racist. And have done
so, not through any _imaginary process_, but through YOUR OWN
WORDS... these words of YOURS --
1) "Gimmie da money, honkey mothafucka, oh ah toast yo ass !!" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021001212904.09987.00002409%40mb-fp.aol.com
2) "'Gimme da dough, mothafucka o ah toast yo ass !!'" Somehow it always ends up to
be a Black in his descriptions of a 'typical' robber. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8oeie1.66i.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
3) "smelly 'Jigaboo' Ausländer." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020826212933.13843.00000967%40mb-mu.aol.com
4) "I even 'tweaked' your nose a few days back, by using the word 'jigaboo'" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020830212951.10684.00000093%40mb-cu.aol.com
5) "same bestial beating administered to LDB's now almost 'jigaboo' buttocks" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020924212907.06896.00002017%40mb-mv.aol.com
6) "Paris is an oasis of safety, be you jigaboo (ho, ho, ho ...) or not."
Apparently finding your use of racial insults 'funny.' See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021006212910.00278.00004368%40mb-md.aol.com
7) "Say, LDB ... how come your "ass" [sic] is so jigaboo these days ?' ... " See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021024212927.18726.00000072%40mb-fe.aol.com
8) "France (the Greatest Country on the Face of the Earth, BTW) did not 'lose' the
match against those jigaboo (*snigger*) upstarts, QZD." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020605201554.23403.00000133%40mb-fo.aol.com
9) "I cream in my pants when they execute a dumbfuck nigga fry black fucker," See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021103212919.08236.00000659%40mb-cg.aol.com
10) "FW seems to have a masochist streak that leads him to present his 'jigaboo'
(*chuckle*) buttocks to the assembled throng on AADP and _beg_ to be spanked." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030112212942.01911.00000668%40mb-mu.aol.com
11) "If we start to bring money into the equation, then we cut overseas aid because
after all, they're 'only niggers'. . . and so on." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=848250093.891.3%40maudit.demon.co.uk
12) "Talking of pointy hats, Don: lynched any "niggers" lately?" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=33aa5cc2.10949086%40news.pratique.fr
13) "Look, Chuck, the murdering niggers ... I mean, blacks who kill
in this country, get due process." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8308au.h8.desmond%40tortue.coughlan.net
14) "or 'niggers' as they're called in his neck of the woods," See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8npdg3.4a5.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
15) "waiting for some delinquant (as Jigsaw would call them, 'niggers')" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8ojg49.5v9.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
16) "it was German beer ... now, if only I could get the smell of sausage out of the
bloody bottles" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8tud5u.2dn2.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
17) "Indeed, perhaps if the floods that are presently threatening Germany,
had been controlled before they swept across into Europe, from the Czech
Republic and Poland, then this fair continent would have been saved the
same fate as the smelly 'auslanders'." See -
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020821212944.09631.00000655%40mb-fc.aol.com
18) Then, there was your recent remark that making favorable comments about
the past civil rights efforts of Mamie Till Mobley, as her death was reported, here
in this newsgroup was a racist comments posted by a racist. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030113200243.01707.00001214%40mb-cu.aol.com
19) And then your hysterical outrage that someone could possibly suggest that
MLK be recognized as having contributed to civil rights on MLK day. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030120212929.19751.00000260%40mb-cu.aol.com
20) "the 'onery ragheads' * that are Arabs" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021024212936.18726.00000083%40mb-fe.aol.com
21) "not that Iraq has anything to do with al'Queda either, other than
that it's ruled by 'filthy ragheads'" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021016212913.06142.00000353%40mb-ch.aol.com
22) "Hey, why bother, right ? They're only ragheads ... 'Arab cunts'" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020921212909.09987.00001502%40mb-fp.aol.com
23)"'What the fuck, it's only ragheads ?" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020908212925.09987.00000590%40mb-fp.aol.com
24) "The half-million Iraqi children who have died since the sanctions were imposed,
are, to quote LDB, 'ragheads', and thus are unimportant." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021113212902.00704.00001232%40mb-ba.aol.com
25) "The maniacal laughter as yet more 'ragheads' (sic) were killed in Palestine."
See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021024212915.18726.00000061%40mb-fe.aol.com
26) "but they were all 'ragheads' (Copyright (C) 2002 LDB)" See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021115212931.11087.00001599%40mb-fi.aol.com
27) And then we have your most recent racist comment, where you AGAIN FORGED it into
the post of Don Kool. See
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030222212909.26864.00002230%40mb-mq.aol.com
This rather demonstrates EXACTLY why you do not archive your posts. Since it permits
you to get away with things such as this, to the unsuspecting eye.
28) "'Police said that the alleged killer bragged at a local bar that he was
going to "kill the ragheads responsible for 11 September"."
And you remarked --
"LDB gets around, doesn't he ..?"
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021119212904.23768.00001714%40mb-md.aol.com
29) "Jigsaw lives in Florida, last time I heard, Eugene. Down there, the good ol'
boys don't like them niggas comin' in from South America an' stealin' tha wimmyn, and
causin' all that crime, now .." See
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn8krq2r.3al.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
30) "'Wow, did you see the way that nigga bucked when my slugs hit 'im ..?!'"
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=4dGX4.292%24TZ2.14070%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
31) "the good ol' boys don't like them niggas comin' in from South America an'
stealin' tha wimmyn, and causin' all that crime, now ..."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=xZr35.11560%24ds.329162%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
If, in this whole process of calling you a racist, I can FINALLY get you
to stop making racist slurs here in this group, my purpose will have been
achieved. I only wish you to see yourself. To understand that when you
provide such insults you are insulting only two entities -- YOURSELF, and
the race you have directed that slur against. You certainly have not insulted
someone who is neither a member of the race you are insulting or someone
who has never made such racist slurs themselves. For example, you
certainly cannot injure ME, through your sickness, since I am positively
not a racist... I know that well... nor have I ever used the slurs that you
claim are mine. And your EXCUSE that I'm a racist because
of MY AGE and BACKGROUND is laughably pathetic. Actually, a
background in the military has been distinctively recognized as DILUTING
any racism on the whole in the general military population. It demands a
cooperative effort in many general assignments. There are many other
professions that provide a divisive influence... such as those in their
30s, trained in French Feminist Literature.
> as in all probability he is
>profoundly ashamed of it (as well he should be), and two, he knows that
>intellectually and morally,
Intellectually, you have as much intellect as a fruit basket.
Morally, you're one of the most disgusting racist worms that I've ever read.
> I outclass him, and he cannot hope to engage me
>in debate, without being roundly thrashed and made to look like an
>uneducated baboon whose dentures have been knocked out. He thus seeks to
>'demonise' me,
LOL... can you POSSIBLY hear YOURSELF??? Can you read that back
and not see the utter pomposity and pitiful whining complaint to Mr. D., that
you are _better_, although you realize you've been pummeled, more by
YOUR OWN WORDS, than any of mine.
Actually, you hoped to demonize me... in your reply, that you found necessary
to APOLOGIZE to the group for your racially offensive language and insult to
the MEANING of MY TRIBUTE -- Your disgusting insult to that tribute was --
---------------------------------------------------------
I can't remember when a more disturbing demonstration of latent racism
has been brought to the fore, than in that sickening insult to a tribute
to a civil rights leader. There is no doubt in my mind, that you had
your white hood on, and your flaming cross firmly planted when you
proceed to enter them into Usenet. And you DARE call me a racist,
after that sickening outburst.
> hoping that others on AADP will agree that I am 'racist'.
>As yet, no one but his pet performing seal (aka Jigsaw) has bothered to
>dignify his allegations with a response.
Once again... desi is _caging for votes_. Why not call Mr. D. someone
who needs to "redeem" himself? or tell HIM he needs to find some
"backbone"? As you presumed to insult ALL members here, if they
didn't _vote_ for your racist soul. And tried to chase them from the
group if they didn't _vote_ for racism. Again -- YOUR WORDS --
---------------------------------------
"This is your chance to redeem yourselves. This is your chance to show the
newsgroup that you have backbone. So far, only dirt and 'JPB' have
bothered to stand up and ridicule FW when he called me a racist, based on
words that were designed to call _him_ a racist. Whatever your 'vote', be
it for me or against me, I accept it. But either stand up now and be
counted, or at least have the decency to leave the newsgroup, for you are
nothing but pawns of a sick, perverted lunatic who demonises all those with
whom he cannot debate."
And in conclusion ---
My God.. but you are an evil little man.
PV
>
>--
> Ayatollah desi
A Planet Visitor
<jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote:
>In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
>unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
>
>> PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
>> he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
>> posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
>> but they do no such thing.
>
>Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
>Not by a country mile. He stands out from other conservatives by
>expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
>social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
>He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
>being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
>
>To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring. It may be
>all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
>it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
>
Might I say... thank you for those kind words.
Being from the U.S., I have seen racism toward Blacks more first hand
than many from other nations. And I believe I can see the destructive
force it holds... and how even a simple word, can act to detract from
Man's humanity toward his fellow Man. In the final analysis, it can create
a devastating atmosphere which breeds violence and murder. It should
be obvious to ANYONE how the ghetto can create hopelessness and
despair. Which is a large part of the problem in the Middle East, that
leads to violence, as well. And I realize only too well, the insidious
effects of racism against Blacks in the U.S. being responsible for
elevated levels of violence and murder in the U.S. I also accept that
I am helpless to change much of what I see, other than my puny efforts
might make only that tiny difference. But I also realize I would be morally
derelict in my own mind, were I not to remark that I am repulsed by it.
And I hope I have taught my children to be repulsed by it, as well..
My original comment in this thread, expressed both hope and fear for the
future of the U.S. in respect to racism against Blacks. In which MLK stood
as the U.S. symbol in passive opposition to such racism. A glass still half-full
or hopefully empty of racism against U.S. Blacks in the next 34 years. I
will not be around to realize where that glass will be in 34 years. I often
wonder if that is actually a curse, or a blessing in disguise. My life has certainly
been bountiful in the extreme, in comparison to the lives of most humans. My
children will bear part of the burden of emptying that glass. Other Americans
will also... and THEY need to examine how they wish that glass to be in 34 years.
If I have taught my children well, they will do their part. Other Americans must
do their part.
I feel I have the right to express such emotions, and not be criticized for doing so
by those who I know are less familiar with the actualities existing in U.S. society.
And I was speaking of U.S. Society, as a member of that society, to other
members of that society, since that day was a part of that society, and is
certainly not commemorated as a special holiday in other nations. Thus, I was
nauseated that anyone, most especially a non-American, could take issue with
those words, and try to presume they could demonize that meaning, admit they
intended to destroy that meaning, and wanted to demonize the one who had
posted those words in the process. Had that poster BEEN an American,
I could have more easily found it simply another comment by a rabid U.S.
racist White Power groupie. But the fact is... it came from someone who
presumes himself to NOT BE a racist. Yet, IMHO... his words, in the past
several years as I've examined them, refute that claim. He seems to find some
_perverse pleasure_ in offering racist slurs. That has always been my opinion.
I often recall his words here to JUSTIFY my opinion. But others must decide
for themselves. My mind has already been made up.
I understand how difficult it was for you to enter into this dialog, wishing to not
become a part of a rather vicious argument. I would not try to change that
view, and only wished to thank you for those kind words.
PV
Just passing by
nothing to say? Is he lost for words? If so, I can think of a word he
could use: he could say "sorry". Not to me, because it was not my
sentence he deliberately altered to completely change the meaning of
(at least not this time) but Desmond's.
But then, come to think of it, it was me whom he called stupid for
trying to educate him in the language he clearly has (or pretends to
have) so much difficulty communicating in, and me whom he tried (in
vain, of course) to confuse with extracts from his Webster's Handbook
and some web link - both of which were referring to a totally
different and unconnected rule to the one in question.
So, on second thoughts I think I too am owed an apology. But I don't
mind waiting behind Desmond in the queue.
A Planet Visitor
>"Mr Q. Z. Diablo" <jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote in message news:<jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>...
>> In article <21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>,
>> unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
>
>
>> > PV's response to my allegations that his "anti-racism" was something
>> > he had only recently discovered, was to provide some links to his
>> > posts from year 2000, which he claimed disproved what I had said ....
>> > but they do no such thing.
>>
>> Regardless of anything else one might say about PV, he is not a racist.
>> Not by a country mile.
>
>Mr Q.Z.D., I have never called PV a racist. If you believe otherwise,
>then find an example and show it here.
>
ROTFLMAO -- Of course you've called me a racist... and you are
blind if you cannot see it. If you now state that you have never called
me a racist, then you must agree that you believe my original tribute to
MLK did not COME from a racist (or else you ARE calling me a racist).
So given that my post did not come from a racist.... desi's remark
to it, DID brand that post as coming from a racist. Directly calling
me a racist. So in effect, if desi called me a racist for posting a tribute to
MLK... and you DEFEND him doing so -- that most certainly
means you ALSO view me as a racist. Otherwise you would have
DISAGREED with desi having called me one. If you AGREE with desi,
then you have in fact, agreed with desi's conclusion in his reply.
I will not repeat ALL of his sickening insults he provided to the
meaning of me words. But clearly he CALLED me a racist, in exact
words... and you DEFENDED him doing so, which certainly means
YOU have also called me a racist -- His reply contained these words--
which you DEFENDED --
------------------------------------------------
I will not stand idly by, as the George Wallace of the 21st century, hiding
behind anonymity whilst loudly proclaiming himself to be 'accountable' for
his words, tries to hijack the name of a great man whose death is a direct
result of the policies of his kind. His blood is on your hands, and on the hands of
every white racist prick like you. Preach to your own stunted kind as much
as you wish, but don't expect to come on to AADP, try to appear moral when
you're anything but, and expect me to sit and let you get away with it, you
revolting, racist, murderer lover piece of shit.
--------------------------------------------------------
So you will notice that he DIRECTLY called me EXACTLY a "racist."
Thus, in your AGREEMENT of his words... you are also calling me a racist.
Or else you would assert that you DISAGREE with desi's words. Something
I am SURE your obsession will not permit you to do.
>
>> He stands out from other conservatives by
>> expressing (as he has on occasion on a.a.d-p.) concern about a number of
>> social issues, not least of which has been lingering racism in the USA.
>
>Yes, "on occasion". My purpose is to show how selective he has been in
>choosing those occasions.
>
Rubbish... I have ALWAYS, from my very first posts here, been as aggressive
as possible regarding two human acts that I find reprehensible, which I believe
relate DIRECTLY to the subject of this newsgroup. Those two human acts
are RACISM... and ON-DEMAND ABORTION. I oppose them both --
And always will. My view on the DP could more easily change a thousand-fold,
than it could on those two issues. Issues that I consider fundamentally to be
unchangably and immutably immoral in their practice, IMHO. The issue of
800 or so MURDERERS executed in 25 years is an insignificant piece of
trivia in COMPARISON to those two issue which affect thousands more
lives. Would I support the DP to erase racism in America, or on-demand
abortion in America.... IN A FUCKING INSTANT.
>
>> He is highly intolerant of racism and racist language to the point of it
>> being quite easy to derisively label him "politically correct".
>
>And again, the degree to which he takes that route depends more upon
>how many points he (wrongly) believes he can score against his arch
>enemy, Desmond, than upon any wider convictions he may hold, as I
>intend to show.
>
I attack my _enemies_ where I find them. As we all do. desi is a racist, IMHO.
Racism is certainly my _enemy_. I would not deny that for one moment.
I will report that opinion, as long as I can provide some foundation which
supports that opinion. Should I no longer see it in desi, I would no longer
find it necessary to keep repeating it. But each time... desi seems intent on
TOPPING himself., offering yet another racist slur. He is certainly not the
only poster here that I have called a racist. I am perhaps the ONLY
RETENTIONIST here, who has called Don Kool a racist. See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=zlMT6.412294%24o9.64856285%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
and see --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=dnul5vcqgn15hnr0eal2hpb45a40ojv3iu%404ax.com
>> To label PV a racist is no more than juvenile point-scoring.
>
>See my first answer. While on the subject of false accusations of
>racism, can you see any racism in Desmond's reply to PV's original
>"MLK Day" post? I certainly can't.
>
Actually, if you contend that I am NOT a racist, thus presuming that my tribute
to MLK was a tribute from a non-racist, then desi's comment... having called
me a racist, in an attempt to DESTROY a tribute to MLK certainly makes
HIM a racist. And the fact that you AGREE with him having called me a racist,
for providing that tribute to MLK, MUST mean you also AGREE with that
same conclusion he reached, and thus YOU ALSO believe I am a racist.
But strangely enough, when CORNERED... you'd try to lie your way out of
such a logical conclusion. Perhaps everyone is _corrupt_, JPB. Since
that seems to be your most effective _evidence_ in any of your arguments.
>> It may be
>> all part of the fun of a.a.d-p. but don't expect the rest of us to take
>> it seriously or, indeed, to take notice of it.
>>
>> Mr Q. Z. D.
>
>I respect your and anyone else's decision to ignore my posts if you so
>choose.
ROTFLMAO -- TRANSLATION == _if you don't like what I say--
then don't comment on it_.
Damn... you can be frighteningly stupid of how it works here, JPB. You
put your words up... and ANYONE can comment on them. If you do
not expect that to happen... DO NOT put your words up. But do not
contend that one should IGNORE you, when you DO put your words up here.
I get so sick of people implying that their words are so sacred that anyone
disagreeing with them should ignore them, rather than comment on them.
Do you have any idea what kind of _license_ that presumes is implied in
what one can say about ANYTHING, and not expect to be rebutted??
I found that you rather enjoyed it when another poster seemed to AGREE
with you on another issue. Apparently your skin only becomes sensitive
when others DISAGREE with you. And I have a strong suspicion that it is
YOU who now wishes you had not entered this particular "MLK DAY,"
thread.
PV
A Planet Visitor
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<nnqd6vk0vda24cci6...@4ax.com>...
>> On 5 Mar 2003 06:04:59 -0800, unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
>
>
>> >His earlier defence of that being
>> >acceptable under American English rules remains utter nonsense. There
>> >are slight differences between American and British rules regarding
>> >the placement of periods, but in neither is it acceptable to give half
>> >a sentence the appearance of it having been a full one.
>> >
>> Actually, you are totally incorrect here. And can provide no references
>> to what you state, other than your opinion, which is obviously biased
>> since I so totally destroyed you in another argument. While I have
>> provided a great number of references supporting EXACTLY my
>> use of that period to end my sentence. You know, if you make claims
>> you should be able to back them up with some source. I know you
>> are unfamiliar with that method... with you finding that calling everyone
>> _corrupt_ or claiming someone was _framed_ meets your
>> _standard of evidence_. But do try to follow along.
>
>Yawn!
Typical.
My QUOTE of his words was quite accurate in his stated PURPOSE.
His PURPOSE was to destroy the meaning of my words. The fact
that he claimed a racist MOTIVE for doing so, can hardly be seen
as a REASONABLE motive. Unless of course, YOU believe racism
can provide a REASONABLE motive.
.
PV
A Planet Visitor
Ah... but that is simply stating a paradox... since YOU AGREE with
desi... and desi has called me a racist... thus, you most certainly have
ALSO called me a racist, through agreement with another having
called me such. As does desi... you seem to enjoy hyperbole.
Speaking out of both sides of your mouth at the same time, one
side in denial, the other side in agreement.
>Do I need to make what this is about any clearer than that?
>
Actually you could not be more confused.
>I believe that the intensity of PV's recent (i.e. since Desmond's
>reply to his original MLK Day post) attacks on racism are at best an
>exaggeration of his real feelings on the matter, and at worst a total
>sham. I also believe that he is using the racism issue in an attempt
>to "put one over" on Desmond by falsely accusing him of making racist
>comments in that MLK reply and in another post in which Desmond
>referred to a certain anti-Arab term of abuse in an entirely innocent
>manner.
If you contend I am NOT a racist... then of course, you must agree
that desi made a racist comment. Since he called me a racist in his
comment. Because then you agree that my words stand as coming
from a non-racist, and stand as a tribute to MLK. But desi has
CALLED me a racist for providing such a tribute. And you have
AGREED with his comments. If you cannot follow the thread...
trust me... no one else can either. The thread leads to you having
presented one of the the most convoluted argument ever to hit the
internet. To defend desi's comment you must AGREE that I am a
racist... since HE has called me one in response to that tribute I
provided. If you DISAGREE with desi's comment, and feel I am
not a racist.... then YOU must agree that calling someone a racist
for providing a tribute to MLK, who is NOT a racist, can only
come from someone who is himself a racist. One of us must be
a racist in your view. If you agree with desi, then you are calling
ME a racist, as he has done. If you disagree with desi, which you
certainly have not done, then you must agree that desi is a racist
for ACCUSING ME of being a racist... one who you would now
claim is NOT a racist, who has provided a tribute which is certainly
a tribute to one having dedicated his entire life to opposing racism.
To oppose that tribute by calling the author a racist - is racist itself,
if the author is NOT actually a racist.
>> I've read non flame fest posts from
>> PV over a period of nearly five years now and I assure you he has written
>> the finest attacks on racialism one could have wished for. Your
>> comment above that his present position bears "no resemblance to
>> postings during previous years" could not be more incorrect...
>
>Then watch this space. I would not have made the comment you refer to
>if I didn't believe it could be backed up - and it will be.
>
That'll be the day. You will find no racist comment from me... ANYWHERE
here. desi presumes it is racist for me to have referred to STATISTICS as
being racist. But that is impossible. Statistics are FACT. Racism is an
OPINION. A sickening opinion... but nonetheless, one that cannot be
supported in FACT. I cited the FACT that 51.5% of all murders are
committed by Blacks, and Blacks represent 43% of those sentenced to the DP,
as demonstrating that no racism exists in sentencing to the DP. Nothing
to do with racism in society, or racism in finding of GUILTY in the justice
system. Both of which DO exist, the first of a certainty in American society,
the second most probably in my very strong opinion. But note that I speak
ONLY in respect to SENTENCING to the DP. But that cannot
be argued in a RACIST context, since it simply provides statistics.
If there was racism is who we EXECUTE, it would show up as a
percentage of that race being SELECTED for execution, GREATER
than the percentage of murders that race commits.
The FACT is that RACISM is responsible for that elevated MURDER
RATE of Blacks. The fact is Whites are largely responsible for creating this
atmosphere of despair among Blacks, that cause them to trivialize their
own existence. The reason behind this ugly phenomenon, of Black on
Black murder, which constitute 94% of all murders on Black victims,
is because racism has reduced them to not even finding enough self-esteem
to see themselves as EQUALS to Whites. The fact is, having been
so deprived for so many years, Blacks have even come to THEMSELVES
BELIEVING it means nothing to murder one of their OWN. Turning
brother against brother, because of the low self-esteem driven into them
by those who would presume themselves better. Who would have
them see themselves as less than what they are, for so many years.
Blacks thus see themselves as ALREADY a _damaged commodity_.
And the rage issue, coupled with that low self-esteem builds up as well.
Is that a Black problem... inherent to something within their genes?
ABSOLUTELY NOT!!!! It would be absurd to believe that. Rather,
the fact is ... WE... the American _public_ are responsible for the
ghettoization and disenfranchisement of so many Blacks.
You would be wise not to try and tell ME about racism in America,
since I am aware of its insidious character much better than you could
EVER be. Or desi... who believes in NOTHING, except that which
might further his particular agenda, regardless of how distorted it might
be. And who finds some _perverse pleasure_ in providing racist slurs
at any time he feels like doing so. Why do you think that is? Why has
HE provided so many racist slurs, while OTHERS have not?
>> ... and again
>> implies that he has at least flirted with racialism.
>
>It implies nothing of the kind. I have, on many occasions, accused PV
>of lying, of deliberately distorting the words of other posters and of
>running away from challenges.
You can accuse whatever you wish... but _proof_ would be nice.
Something you never seem to find necessary to provide. Such as when
you argued that claims of _corruption_ provided sufficient _evidence_
to prove your case.
> I would never have made such accusations
>if I had not been confident of proving them. What I am accusing him of
>now is not racism, but of, at the very least, exaggerating any genuine
>anti-racist feelings he may have for the purpose stated above, and
>again I am confident of being able to establish that. But, on the
>basis of the postings of his I have so far seen, I could not hope to
>prove him to be a racist, and so have never accused him of being one
Ah, but you AGREED with desi calling me one... which is most
certainly the SAME as calling me one.
>.... whatever you or anyone else wrongly imagine you can read between
>the lines of anything I have written. It isn't there, whether you
>think you can see it or not.
>
It's there all right... and you are bothered that OTHERS have seen it.
>So from some implication of PV being a racist you wrongly suggested
>was in my post, let me move to the totally unambiguous accusation from
>PV that Desmond's reply to his original MLK post was racist and that
>Desmond was attacking "anyone" who would pay a tribute to Martin
>Luther King. I'm sure you have read that reply, so what do you think?
>Was it racist? Was it an attack on "anyone" paying a tribute? Was it
>disrespectful to black people? PV has claimed it was all of those
>things, but I have yet to see anyone agree with him. I believe that
>Desmond has been wrongfully accused over that reply. In your view, am
>I right or wrong to believe that?
Of course it was ALL of the things you state. First, if you presume that
I am NOT a racist... as you now seem to claim (but which in typical
hyperbole is proven to actually NOT be your claim since you agree
with desi having called me a racist), then you must admit that my tribute
DID NOT come from a racist, and thus represented a responsible
comment regarding a day that AMERICANS pay tribute to that civil
rights leader. Now desi went about DESTROYING that tribute, by
calling me a racist. But you contend I am NOT a racist, thus you certainly
cannot agree with desi having called me one... yet you DO AGREE
with desi having called me one. Chee.... you are one confused sucker.
PV
Just passing by
PV(I must avoid this becoming a habit). I will make it as short as
possible.
A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<9uui6v4if8nd0m36l...@4ax.com>...
>
> If you contend I am NOT a racist....
I don't and never have done. I have never stated any view on whether
you are or are not a racist, and that is because I haven't seen enough
evidence - one way or the other - to form any such view.
> >
> >Then watch this space. I would not have made the comment you refer to
> >if I didn't believe it could be backed up - and it will be.
> >
> That'll be the day. You will find no racist comment from me... ANYWHERE
> here. desi presumes it is racist for me to have referred to STATISTICS as
> being racist. But that is impossible. Statistics are FACT. Racism is an
> OPINION. A sickening opinion... but nonetheless, one that cannot be
> supported in FACT. I cited the FACT that 51.5% of all murders are
> committed by Blacks, and Blacks represent 43% of those sentenced to the DP,
> as demonstrating that no racism exists in sentencing to the DP. Nothing
> to do with racism in society, or racism in finding of GUILTY in the justice
> system. Both of which DO exist, the first of a certainty in American society,
> the second most probably in my very strong opinion. But note that I speak
> ONLY in respect to SENTENCING to the DP.
< further long paragraphs going on and on and on about this matter,
clipped >
Save it, PV. I have read all that in earlier posts of yours, and it is
not the material I intend to base my claim about your bogus
anti-racism on.
> >It implies nothing of the kind. I have, on many occasions, accused PV
> >of lying, of deliberately distorting the words of other posters and of
> >running away from challenges.
>
> You can accuse whatever you wish... but _proof_ would be nice.
> Something you never seem to find necessary to provide. Such as when
> you argued that claims of _corruption_ provided sufficient _evidence_
> to prove your case.
All of the above (i.e. your lies, your distortions and your running
away) have been proven many times. As to backing up my claims of
corruption, here is just one of many I could provide:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0209...@posting.google.com
And after you have read that again, expand the page to show the whole
thread. Then look at your own "reply" to that post (the one that
begins: "ROTFLMAO.. Did I say JPB was obsessed?") And what did you
offer to counter that evidence I provided? Absolutely nothing! Just
the words, "I no longer find you interesting," followed by your usual
"GENTLE READER" spam that you post every time I leave you completely
cornered and unable to deal with the evidence I have posted.
So don't confuse you running away from evidence I provide with me
being unable to provide it. I ALWAYS provide evidence of the claims I
make about the LW case, whether it be concerning the medical evidence
that proves her innocence or the corruption she was a victim of, and
you ALWAYS run away from that evidence.
I said I was going to keep this short, didn't I? I must try harder
next time.
Just passing by
A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<9uui6v4if8nd0m36l...@4ax.com>...
> Of course it was ALL of the things you state. First, if you presume that
> I am NOT a racist... as you now seem to claim (but which in typical
> hyperbole is proven to actually NOT be your claim since you agree
> with desi having called me a racist), then you must admit that my tribute
> DID NOT come from a racist, and thus represented a responsible
> comment regarding a day that AMERICANS pay tribute to that civil
> rights leader. Now desi went about DESTROYING that tribute, by
> calling me a racist. But you contend I am NOT a racist, thus you certainly
> cannot agree with desi having called me one... yet you DO AGREE
> with desi having called me one. Chee.... you are one confused sucker.
>
> PV
Earlier in this thread both John and Mr Q.Z.D. insisted that you are
not a racist, and, as you can see, I didn't argue with them on that
point. Equally, when Desmond has insisted that you are a racist, I
haven't argued with him either.
Now, anyone but you would look at the above situation and conclude the
obvious - i.e. that it means I hold no view on the matter. But only
you would conclude that it means I hold both views on the matter.
You truly are one of a kind.
A Planet Visitor
>So what's happened to the "last man standing"? Where is he? Has he
>nothing to say? Is he lost for words? If so, I can think of a word he
>could use: he could say "sorry". Not to me, because it was not my
>sentence he deliberately altered to completely change the meaning of
>(at least not this time) but Desmond's.
>
Perhaps YOU should apologize to the group for deceptively stating you
have not _called_ me a racist... yet have certainly done so, by supporting
the statement of another who did. Your words --
"I have never called PV a racist." But that is not true. Simply through
AGREEMENT with someone who has... and a very violent and
obsessive agreement on your part... you call me the same as he has
called me. You have done so by AGREEING with the words of
someone who HAS called me a racist. And who did so, in the most
obscene method possible... calling ME a racist for providing a tribute
to MLK. Can there POSSIBLY be any evidence of racism in
providing such a tribute? How is that possible? Unless one is himself
a racist, motivated by his own racism, toward DESTROYING the
MEANING of those words, which desi has ADMITTED was HIS
purpose. These are the words you have AGREED with... which makes
them as much yours as desi's, since through agreement you find the
SAME feeling -- desi's words to me --
----------------------------------------------------
I will not stand idly by, as the George Wallace of the 21st century, hiding
behind anonymity whilst loudly proclaiming himself to be 'accountable' for
his words, tries to hijack the name of a great man whose death is a direct
result of the policies of his kind. His blood is on your hands, and on the hands of
every white racist prick like you. Preach to your own stunted kind as much
as you wish, but don't expect to come on to AADP, try to appear moral when
you're anything but, and expect me to sit and let you get away with it, you
revolting, racist, murderer lover piece of shit.
--------------------------------------------------------
Now... do you AGREE with those words from desi?? Understand
that they were in response to my providing a TRIBUTE to MLK.
Or do you now call him a liar? You cannot argue that you AGREE with
him calling me a racist for providing a tribute to MLK, without also
admitting you do as well. And if you DISAGREE with his words... then
you must call him a liar. That is about as logical a conclusion as possible,
and I'd like to see how you intend to weasel out of it. Either you
AGREE with desi... and thus agree that I am a racist for having offered
a tribute to MLK... or you DISAGREE with desi... and thus HE is a liar.
Chee.... that seems to place you in some kind of dilemma.
>But then, come to think of it, it was me whom he called stupid for
>trying to educate him in the language he clearly has (or pretends to
>have) so much difficulty communicating in, and me whom he tried (in
>vain, of course) to confuse with extracts from his Webster's Handbook
>and some web link - both of which were referring to a totally
>different and unconnected rule to the one in question.
>
LOL. desi certainly MEANT (which is what we examine here... and
not your pitiful excuse of a _period_), that his INTENTION was to
destroy the meaning of my words. And he used the EXCUSE of calling
me a racist to do so. But you now seem to say that YOU do not see me
as a racist. Thus, you need to accept his _excuse_ is INVALID, and
must be based on his own racism. His invalid excuse meant only to HIDE
HIS OWN racism, with his true INTENTION to destroy the meaning
of my tribute to MLK, because his own racism could not permit that
tribute to have MEANING here in this newsgroup..
>So, on second thoughts I think I too am owed an apology.
Easy enough --
I apologize for having believed you were smart enough to understand
not to speak from both sides of your mouth... with one side saying _yes_,
and the other side saying _no_. I apologize for you having made a
fool of yourself in front of the entire group. In the name of our species, I
apologize for you being from that same species. Unfortunately, you
seem to lack sufficient self-embarrassment to apologize for yourself,
thus I will do so in the name of our species. I also apologize for desi
being a racist. After all... he is also from the same species, and as you,
also lacks the capacity of expressing embarrassment. SOMEONE
MUST apologize in the name of our species. So let it be me. Since
I am certainly embarrassed in respect to both of you being from the
same species as I am. Not only to AADP for the presence of both
of you here... but to whatever higher power might exist as well... and to
the great mass of our species... I humbly apologize for desi and for
you.
> But I don't mind waiting behind Desmond in the queue.
Ah... but desi has already offered his _apology_ for his ignorance to this
group... in his words -- "I apologise to the group for my strong language."
Although he owes a much greater apology to our species, which might put
him on the first step to the _moral recovery_ he so desperately needs.
So where is YOUR apology to the group for claiming you AGREE with
desi in respect to calling me a racist... but claim you've never called me
a racist? Doesn't matter, actually... since I've done it for you. See
how easy that was?
And remember desi's pathetic WHINE, which became the entire subject
of the thread -- changed into "The whine of a racist desi"? When he
_whined_ about the _moral character_ of others, as he demonstrated
most forcefully his OWN LACK OF SUCH? And accused another
poster here of _emotional blackmail_? Jesus... talk about pot... kettle...
black... desi INVENTED that concept of _emotional blackmail_ in this
group. The flaming hypocrite. I can remind you if you have forgotten.
PV
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:07:34 +0000
>
>le Fri, 07 Mar 2003 07:22:04 GMT, dans l'article
><r0ig6v08cmkjimm0p...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor
><abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>{ snip }
>
>>>I've read non flame fest posts from PV over a period of nearly five years
>>>now and I assure you he has written the finest attacks on racialism one
>>>could have wished for.
>
>> You have no idea how much those few words moved me. Or how much I
>> appreciated you posting them.
>
><barf !>
>
>Whereas the rest of us just wonder why you didn't point out to John that
>you weren't posting as 'A Planet Visitor' five years ago, Necro.
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/gimmicks/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
>Path:
>lobby!ngtf-m01.news.aol.com!ngpeer.news.aol.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news
feed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!skynet.be!skynet.be!fu-berlin.de!uni-berl
in.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: MLK day
>Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:07:34 +0000
>Lines: 26
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
>Message-ID: <m4bmj-...@zeouane.org>
>References: <fsWW9.113395$Sa3.2...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>
><27eh0b....@lievre.voute.net> <oumni-...@zeouane.org>
><21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>
><21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>
><jonathan-EE419D...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>
><21b1da28.03030...@posting.google.com>
><0xL9a.530$uT1.93008@newsfep2-gui>
><r0ig6v08cmkjimm0p...@4ax.com>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.fr (212.198.68.117)
>X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1047035621 61572342 212.198.68.117 (16 [91468])
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Fri, 07 Mar 2003 07:22:04 GMT, dans l'article <r0ig6v08cmkjimm0p...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>{ snip }
>
>>>I've read non flame fest posts from PV over a period of nearly five years
>>>now and I assure you he has written the finest attacks on racialism one
>>>could have wished for.
>
>> You have no idea how much those few words moved me. Or how much I
>> appreciated you posting them.
>
><barf !>
>
Too bad that no one has ever said that about YOUR posts, sport. All yours
seem to draw are huge sighs of anguish from reasonable abolitionists.
>Whereas the rest of us just wonder why you didn't point out to John that
>you weren't posting as 'A Planet Visitor' five years ago, Necro.
>
That would be because I wasn't, sport. Although it has been exposed
that YOU post as both Desmond Coughlan and Don Kool. As I recall
that another poster revealed the truth -- Good ol' Lucas Stults reported.
And for the benefit of newbies here... this is what was disclosed --
---------------------------------------------
"....there are many new arrivals that will mistakenly believe that
"Don" and "Des" are different people.
Newbies: The "Don/Des" experiment is one of the longest
running gags in the history of the Usenet, second only to the
"Joe1orbit" fraud. In case any of you haven't gotten it yet, all
posts written by "Don Kool" or "Desmond Coughlan" (as well
as several other aliases) are written by one person: Kelly
Bringhurst of Greensboro. The details of this fraud are plainly
outlined in Kelly's excellent paper; "The psychology of mass
manipulation and the group mindset on the internet".
To quote from Kelly's work: "(usenet trolling) is most effective
in large groups of young people, preferably females, particularly
female college students, who have nearly NO ability to rationally
and logically distinguish between Reason and Hyperbole. When
attempting to induce an irrational emotional response from such
people, it is best to avoid even tangental relevance to the topic of
the newsgroup, because in doing so you may inadvertantly spark
an actual debate. Rather, your goal should be to encourage
partisans on either side of an issue to argue over the most trivial
and irrelevant topics imaginable."
Veterans on this list find it hilarious when Newbies respond to
"Don/Des", since most of us have known about the fraud for years.
Especially humorous is Kelly's tendancy to write identical posts,
including the exact same insults and off-topic tirades, with either
the "Don" or "Des" attribution chosen entirely at random.
Word on the street is that Kelly no longer personally oversees the
"Don/Des" project, but has turned the care and upkeep of it over
to several undergrad students, who have vowed to keep the farce
going for as long as the Usenet exists. Apparently, their goal is to
set some sort of record for the longest troll in history."
----------------------------------------------------
Yes... the troll goes on. Poor desi... the definition of a hebephrenic schizophrenic
ill with eisoptrophobia. A walking basket-case for a full-post-doctoral thesis in
psychiatry.
PV
>--
> Ayatollah desi (or Don) -- what day is it?- okay-- this is desi's day.
A Planet Visitor
>Another very brief exception to my rule of not replying directly to
>PV(I must avoid this becoming a habit). I will make it as short as
>possible.
>
ROTFLMAO... Jesus, JPB... have you no shame????
>
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<9uui6v4if8nd0m36l...@4ax.com>...
>>
>> If you contend I am NOT a racist....
>
>I don't and never have done. I have never stated any view on whether
>you are or are not a racist, and that is because I haven't seen enough
>evidence - one way or the other - to form any such view.
>
But you AGREE with desi's comment. And he has called me a racist.
You're just pulling that funny stuff again. Talking out of both sides of
your mouth.
>
>> >
>> >Then watch this space. I would not have made the comment you refer to
>> >if I didn't believe it could be backed up - and it will be.
>> >
>> That'll be the day. You will find no racist comment from me... ANYWHERE
>> here. desi presumes it is racist for me to have referred to STATISTICS as
>> being racist. But that is impossible. Statistics are FACT. Racism is an
>> OPINION. A sickening opinion... but nonetheless, one that cannot be
>> supported in FACT. I cited the FACT that 51.5% of all murders are
>> committed by Blacks, and Blacks represent 43% of those sentenced to the DP,
>> as demonstrating that no racism exists in sentencing to the DP. Nothing
>> to do with racism in society, or racism in finding of GUILTY in the justice
>> system. Both of which DO exist, the first of a certainty in American society,
>> the second most probably in my very strong opinion. But note that I speak
>> ONLY in respect to SENTENCING to the DP.
>
>< further long paragraphs going on and on and on about this matter,
>clipped >
>
>Save it, PV. I have read all that in earlier posts of yours, and it is
>not the material I intend to base my claim about your bogus
>anti-racism on.
>
Huh??? Exactly what does that MEAN??? "Bogus anti-racism."
If you claim my anti-racism is BOGUS... then you are claiming it
is RACISM. And you ARE calling me a racist.
>
>> >It implies nothing of the kind. I have, on many occasions, accused PV
>> >of lying, of deliberately distorting the words of other posters and of
>> >running away from challenges.
>>
>> You can accuse whatever you wish... but _proof_ would be nice.
>> Something you never seem to find necessary to provide. Such as when
>> you argued that claims of _corruption_ provided sufficient _evidence_
>> to prove your case.
>
>
>All of the above (i.e. your lies, your distortions and your running
>away) have been proven many times. As to backing up my claims of
>corruption, here is just one of many I could provide:
>
>http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0209...@posting.google.com
>
How very pathetic. Accepting the _word_ of the _Great White Whale_
in her testimony as presuming it to be gospel. You know... those under
trial for crimes... have been known to lie. LOL
>And after you have read that again, expand the page to show the whole
>thread. Then look at your own "reply" to that post (the one that
>begins: "ROTFLMAO.. Did I say JPB was obsessed?")
And I repeat -- ROTFLMAO.. Did I say JPB was obsessed?
> And what did you
>offer to counter that evidence I provided? Absolutely nothing! Just
>the words, "I no longer find you interesting," followed by your usual
>"GENTLE READER" spam that you post every time I leave you completely
>cornered and unable to deal with the evidence I have posted.
>
Yes... I believe all your phony _evidence_ was dealt with Chapter and
Verse... Nine chapters I believe, in my post --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=CZw5a.7959%24163.334217%40twister.tampabay.rr.com
>So don't confuse you running away from evidence I provide with me
>being unable to provide it. I ALWAYS provide evidence of the claims I
>make about the LW case, whether it be concerning the medical evidence
>that proves her innocence or the corruption she was a victim of, and
>you ALWAYS run away from that evidence.
>
Rubbish... every bit of your _evidence_ was offered by the defense, and
REJECTED at both trial and appeal.
>I said I was going to keep this short, didn't I? I must try harder
>next time.
That's be the day.
Now, where is that apology to the group and to humanity in general for your
lack fo embarrassment in respect to speaking from both sides of your mouth?
PV
A Planet Visitor
>Just a short (for real this time) addition to that last post of mine.
>
LOL... God... you can be droll, when you want to be.
Want to bet that your post here is NOT the last to the thread MLK
Day? But it certainly should be... since you seem to lack any ability
to find yourself embarrassed with your two-faced approach to claiming
to not call me a racist, but claiming to agree with desi, who called me
a racist.
>
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<9uui6v4if8nd0m36l...@4ax.com>...
>
>> Of course it was ALL of the things you state. First, if you presume that
>> I am NOT a racist... as you now seem to claim (but which in typical
>> hyperbole is proven to actually NOT be your claim since you agree
>> with desi having called me a racist), then you must admit that my tribute
>> DID NOT come from a racist, and thus represented a responsible
>> comment regarding a day that AMERICANS pay tribute to that civil
>> rights leader. Now desi went about DESTROYING that tribute, by
>> calling me a racist. But you contend I am NOT a racist, thus you certainly
>> cannot agree with desi having called me one... yet you DO AGREE
>> with desi having called me one. Chee.... you are one confused sucker.
>>
>> PV
>
>Earlier in this thread both John and Mr Q.Z.D. insisted that you are
>not a racist, and, as you can see, I didn't argue with them on that
>point. Equally, when Desmond has insisted that you are a racist, I
>haven't argued with him either.
>
So, you really don't know SHIT.. is what you're saying. How refreshing!
As I remarked to another poster yesterday. You are a poster who
agrees he knows nothing... in a group where everyone knows everything.
If someone says I'm not a racist... you agree with them. And when another
says I am... you agree with him. What a hypocrite.
>Now, anyone but you would look at the above situation and conclude the
>obvious - i.e. that it means I hold no view on the matter. But only
>you would conclude that it means I hold both views on the matter.
>
No... you CLEARLY AGREED with desi's comments. By such
agreement you agree with his assessment that I am a racist. You
clearly stated that he was attacking me... you UNDERSTOOD that...
and accepted that his attack on my... calling me a racist was
something you found AGREEMENT with. You wrote "He was
attacking you and only you." And you found AGREEMENT with
his attack... you SUPPORTED him calling me a racist... because
these were his words --
---------------------------------------------------
I will not stand idly by, as the George Wallace of the 21st century, hiding
behind anonymity whilst loudly proclaiming himself to be 'accountable' for
his words, tries to hijack the name of a great man whose death is a direct
result of the policies of his kind. His blood is on your hands, and on the hands of
every white racist prick like you. Preach to your own stunted kind as much
as you wish, but don't expect to come on to AADP, try to appear moral when
you're anything but, and expect me to sit and let you get away with it, you
revolting, racist, murderer lover piece of shit.
--------------------------------------------------------
He calls me a racist.. you agree with his comments in respect to his
remarks to me regarding my tribute to MLK... thus, you are clearly
calling me a racist through his words.
>You truly are one of a kind.
Unfortunately... you are not. Your kind has been a disease of our species
since we emerged from the cave. Now, perhaps you can answer the question
that was posed to you -- in the case of the MLK Day thread... who was
the FIRST to demonize? Did I try to demonize MLK? Of course not!
My tribute could NOT have been more from my heart. Did I try to
demonize desi? Shit, I never gave that old racist a thought in my tribute.
My thoughts were focused on AMERICA... and not some racist pig in
another country. It was MLK DAY in America. I was concerned with
racism in AMERICA... not some nitwit on the other side of the Atlantic.
I never expected him to open his big yap... even though I know he's a
racist, I at least gave him credit for better sense than to attack a tribute
to MLK. But desi, immediately tried to demonize ME... yet he claims
that I always demonize him. The point is, that when I offered an anti-racist
post... desi tried to demonize me. Yet there was no reason to do so...
since I've never posted a racist slur against Black Americans. While
when I demonize desi... it is ALWAYS because of a racist slur
that desi has posted...
Further, you will find that, contrary to your sickening claim that mine is a
new-found anti-racism, I have been a vocal opponent of racism within
this group from the first day here. It was DISGUSTING of you to
presume your argument could be based on claiming it was a recent
development in my posting style, and you have NEVER addressed
ADMITTING that you attempted to USE that foolish belief in your
distortion of my posts. It was a form of character assassination of the
worst kind... CLAIMING that I was USING anti-racism, although
not really BELIEVING in it. Which clearly implies that I don't take
racism SERIOUSLY, and that I was using it ONLY in respect to desi.
If not calling me an outright racist... then certainly presuming to imply
I am blind to it, unless I can USE it to my advantage. It was hateful...
and you were rightly marked down for it, by others. Those exact
others that I fully expected WOULD mark you down for it.
Nor have I EVER posted a racist slur here... certainly not against an
American Black, since I fully realize the devastating POWER those
slurs contain. But desi would aim that weapon DIRECTLY at this
group... and in his racist rage... fire away. And then presume to
call ME a racist, for offering a tribute to a civil right leader. Not
ONCE... but also when I mentioned the passing of Mamie Till
Mobley, another civil rights leader who had lost her son to a
murdering racist. He insulted me in that instance as well. Because
he is a CLOSET RACIST. And hide behind the facade of calling
ME a racist, because I post ANTI-RACIST comments. ANYONE
who would ATTACK someone who posts a comment which offers
a tribute to a civil rights leader MUST have a more devious agenda.
It is absurd to claim that such a tribute, must itself have come from
a racist. It can ONLY brush the one who ATTACKS that tribute,
as a racist. And you AGREED with his attack. So it appears you
are agreeing with a racist, and calling me a racist as he has done.
But go ahead... hide behind that phony crap that you don't agree
that I am (when you post to John and Mr. D)... and you don't agree
that I'm not (when you agree with desi).
PV
Just passing by
> On 8 Mar 2003 04:47:18 -0800, unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
> >All of the above (i.e. your lies, your distortions and your running
> >away) have been proven many times. As to backing up my claims of
> >corruption, here is just one of many I could provide:
> >
> >http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0209...@posting.google.com
> >
> How very pathetic. Accepting the _word_ of the _Great White Whale_
> in her testimony as presuming it to be gospel. You know... those under
> trial for crimes... have been known to lie. LOL
It is very rare for any of your lies to actually anger me. Most of the
time they just amuse me, and I enjoy exposing them, and, in the
process, also exposing your total inability to construct a real
argument on any topic without, sooner or later, resorting to your
trademark lies, signalling that you know you have been cornered and
defeated. But I will admit that the lies above most certainly do
provoke real anger in me.
So, from that post linked to, here is what I wrote after firstly
establishing - beyond any possible argument - that LW had, in spite of
many misinformed rumours to the contrary, never admitted having
angrily dropped the baby or being "a little rough" with him:
"These allegations were made by Det. Sgt. William Byrne. So at this
point, we know that the allegation is nothing more than one person's
word against another."
If my post had ended at that point, what you wrote above would have
been a fair comment and I could have no argument against it. But it
did not end there. I then wrote:
"So one of them - either Louise or Sgt. Byrne - is lying. I will now
show you, with facts, which one it is."
But what you have done is totally ignore that, and, more importantly,
the indisputable facts that did indeed follow. From that point onwards
I presented you with an unanswerable argument for it having been
Byrne, rather than LW, who had lied. I extracted parts of Byrne's
testimony from the trial transcripts and showed the clear
inconsistencies that were exposed by LW's brilliant attorney, Andrew
Good. And I effectively challenged you or anyone else who might argue
that Byrne had not lied, to answer these questions:
If LW had said what Byrne alleged she had said ....
1. Why did he not arrest her there and then?
2. Why did he instead call her a "borderline hero"?
3. Why did he make no mention of this alleged confession in his report
to his boss, Capt. Marchand?
4. Why did Matthew McCue, who was also present, not hear the alleged
confession?
But you ran away from answering any of those questions at the time,
and, as we can see from your words above, you are still running away
from those questions now. Instead you offer this utterly pathetic lie
that my only argument was that people should accept LW's word and
nothing more.
Every time you behave in this totally dishonest and thoroughly
disgusting way, you increase my determination to expose your lies,
distortions and false fronts on other issues that are of less
importance to me than the LW case. But you already knew that.
Just passing by
> Want to bet that your post here is NOT the last to the thread MLK
> Day?
No, because neither it nor this one will be the last. I will, however,
be concentrating more on additions to my own posts rather than on
replies to yours.
> No... you CLEARLY AGREED with desi's comments. By such
> agreement you agree with his assessment that I am a racist. You
> clearly stated that he was attacking me... you UNDERSTOOD that...
> and accepted that his attack on my... calling me a racist was
> something you found AGREEMENT with. You wrote "He was
> attacking you and only you."
And this is where this entire side-argument of yours sinks. What you
cannot do is provide a single comment from me which gives any view on
the GENERAL content of Desmond's first reply. Everything I have
written about that reply has been concerned with disproving your
allegations that it was racist, that it attacked "anyone" (rather than
just you) who offered a tribute to MLK and that it was disrespectful
to MLK or black people generally. So when you say, "No... you CLEARLY
AGREED with desi's comments," you are simply blowing meaningless
hot-air and you cannot provide a single word of mine to back that up.
You see, one of the differences between you and me is that I generally
try to look ahead before I write something. I am very conscious of the
risk of writing something that could later be reproduced to reveal an
inconsistency in my arguments or perhaps even to show me completely
contradicting myself. With very few exceptions I am always very
careful to ensure that I don't fall into any traps of my own making
and so choose my words very carefully before I post them. You once
came very close to exploiting probably the only exception to the above
that has ever occurred in exchanges between us (i.e. the Rule 25 (b)
(2) matter) but since then I have been even more careful to avoid ever
giving you any ammunition to fire at me.
You, on the other hand, appear to write the first thing that comes
into your head, and sometimes do so when in an apparently highly
emotional state. That is why you regularly find yourself having to
dream up these bizarre excuses and totally unbelievable explanations
of what you "really meant" every time your own earlier words come back
to haunt you.
You also defeat yourself when you try to misrepresent what others have
said. Sometimes you do it by deliberately and blatantly altering their
sentences (such as in the recent added period example), but other
times you try to present deliberate misinterpretations that you think
are subtle and unnoticeable, but are anything but that to anyone who
has been following the entire debate. Here is one such example from
your latest post:
> And then presume to
> call ME a racist, for offering a tribute to a civil right leader.
But Desmond, to whom you were referring there, did not call you a
racist FOR offering that tribute. He called you a racist IN SPITE OF
your doing so, and accused you of using that tribute and exploiting
MLK Day for your own personal ends. That is very different from the
picture your above words attempt to paint.
And you then proceed to construct your entire argument on this false
premise that Desmond had attacked the very idea of ANY Martin Luther
King tribute, when the truth is that he was attacking you and nobody
else. You then act as if this false premise is an established, proven
and uncontested fact, and write things like:
> So it appears you
> are agreeing with a racist, and calling me a racist as he has done.
These are very amateurish tactics you use in your attempts to fool
people, and I often wonder if you really believe anyone is being taken
in by them.
A Planet Visitor
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<l7jl6vkcqrjpgu9cn...@4ax.com>...
>> On 8 Mar 2003 04:47:18 -0800, unimpre...@yahoo.com (Just passing by) wrote:
>
>
>> >All of the above (i.e. your lies, your distortions and your running
>> >away) have been proven many times. As to backing up my claims of
>> >corruption, here is just one of many I could provide:
>> >
>> >http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0209...@posting.google.com
>> >
>> How very pathetic. Accepting the _word_ of the _Great White Whale_
>> in her testimony as presuming it to be gospel. You know... those under
>> trial for crimes... have been known to lie. LOL
>
>It is very rare for any of your lies to actually anger me.
LOL... you fill the very precise definition of a hypocrite, JPB.
You're FURIOUS... because OTHERS have detected your
distortions... which lead directly to a loss of any credibility you
might think you had built up in the _Great White Whale_ affair.
You should have stuck to that, instead of branching out into
defending desi... which is ALWAYS a bad idea. Since he's
even been known to turn on those who offer him the hospitality
of their homes.
> Most of the
>time they just amuse me, and I enjoy exposing them, and, in the
>process, also exposing your total inability to construct a real
>argument on any topic without, sooner or later, resorting to your
>trademark lies, signalling that you know you have been cornered and
>defeated. But I will admit that the lies above most certainly do
>provoke real anger in me.
>
You realize of course that you haven't actually SAID anything in that
long diatribe... don't you?
GENTLE READER -- what previously followed here was simply
more of JPB's ravings that the world is _against_ the _Great White
Whale_. Even after NINE CHAPTERS of totally destroying any
possible argument that JPB might have. All of JPB's _evidence_
here... relates to trial transcripts. Those transcripts formed the basis
for the jury to reach a decision as to who was _lying_ and who
was _telling the truth_. JPB would imply that the _Great White
Whale_ doesn't lie... but that great conspiracy... now in the form
of Officer Byrne... who is branded as part of this great conspiracy,
"framed" that poor tub of lard. Sorry, JPB... it just doesn't fly,
since the jury... 12 strong... looking both the _Great White Whale_
and Officer Byrne in the face, decided that the _Great White
Whale_ was trembling sufficiently to recognize she was a
consummate liar, who had bounced Matthew Eappen a few
times like a basketball, and convicted her of murder. Lucky
for her, they could not show she did it _purposely_.
<pathetic drivel clipped>
BTW -- Who demonized first in the MLK Day postings? And
why did you imply I was a racist, by agreeing with desi calling
me one? And why did you state that I was a _new_ anti-racist,
who only attacked desi after he attacked me? It would seem
that YOU are totally dishonest, and have some thoroughly
disgusting habits of neglecting to examine your own hypocrisy.
PV
A Planet Visitor
>A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote in message news:<mtjl6v0o32fd6hsv3...@4ax.com>...
>
>
>
>> Want to bet that your post here is NOT the last to the thread MLK
>> Day?
>
>No, because neither it nor this one will be the last. I will, however,
>be concentrating more on additions to my own posts rather than on
>replies to yours.
>
I never for one moment believed I'd lose that bet, you obsessive fruitcake.
Nor will I lose the bet that there will not be another post from you, intending
to make even a bigger fool of yourself.
>
>> No... you CLEARLY AGREED with desi's comments. By such
>> agreement you agree with his assessment that I am a racist. You
>> clearly stated that he was attacking me... you UNDERSTOOD that...
>> and accepted that his attack on my... calling me a racist was
>> something you found AGREEMENT with. You wrote "He was
>> attacking you and only you."
>
>
>And this is where this entire side-argument of yours sinks.
TRANSLATION == I'm about to resume providing my lies.
> What you
>cannot do is provide a single comment from me which gives any view on
>the GENERAL content of Desmond's first reply. Everything I have
>written about that reply has been concerned with disproving your
>allegations that it was racist, that it attacked "anyone" (rather than
>just you) who offered a tribute to MLK and that it was disrespectful
>to MLK or black people generally. So when you say, "No... you CLEARLY
>AGREED with desi's comments," you are simply blowing meaningless
>hot-air and you cannot provide a single word of mine to back that up.
>
Rubbish, you DEFENDED him in his statements calling me a racist,
and you DEFENDED his admitted purpose of destroying the MEANING
of that tribute. The fact that you did not say EXACTLY that something
such as == You're a racist, is not an excuse. Because you certainly
AGREED with another who had called me a racist. I didn't see you
telling him that you disagreed with him calling me a racist. But you sure
did a lot of scrambling to attack me for finding his disgusting destruction
of a tribute to MLK to be cloaked in HIS racism. And two reasonable
posters here... both certainly not biased toward me... found that you
HAD implied I was a racist -- requiring you to do some scrambling
which did not make you look very good.
>You see, one of the differences between you and me is that I generally
>try to look ahead before I write something.
And then disregard what you've written before, and try to lie your way
out of it... as you're trying now. Rather than look ahead... why not
look BACK at what you've already written, so you don't end up saying
stupid contradictions?
> I am very conscious of the
>risk of writing something that could later be reproduced to reveal an
>inconsistency in my arguments or perhaps even to show me completely
>contradicting myself. With very few exceptions I am always very
>careful to ensure that I don't fall into any traps of my own making
>and so choose my words very carefully before I post them. You once
>came very close to exploiting probably the only exception to the above
>that has ever occurred in exchanges between us (i.e. the Rule 25 (b)
>(2) matter) but since then I have been even more careful to avoid ever
>giving you any ammunition to fire at me.
>
You're a fool.. a stupid fool. A stupid fool who is among the top ten
here in providing stupid comments. And you are obsessed with me.
Why? Because you are _in love with the Great White Whale_.
Mr. D. rather picked up on that. And you cannot STAND that I have
exposed you as a _chubby chaser_. Want to be reminded of what a
reasonable unbiased viewer of your dialog toward me in the MLK
tribute said to you? -- Mr D. posted -- "It is disappointing, though,
to see in you a stubborn determination to undermine PV at every turn,
regardless of whether or not his position should actually be undermined."
In his usual diplomatic manner... he was telling you that you are _full of
shit_ in the MLK Day thread. And recognizing what I have just said...
you're obsessed with me... and have hitched your wagon to a very
unsavory person, simply because you see him as my enemy. But
that only means you would go to any lengths... even support someone
who ADMITTED he meant to DESTROY THE MEANING of a
tribute to MLK... simply because of your obsession with me.
>You, on the other hand, appear to write the first thing that comes
>into your head, and sometimes do so when in an apparently highly
>emotional state. That is why you regularly find yourself having to
>dream up these bizarre excuses and totally unbelievable explanations
>of what you "really meant" every time your own earlier words come back
>to haunt you.
>
It seems as though John Rennie and Mr. D., although on opposite sides
of the pole regarding the DP than I am, found your posts to be highly
agitated and very hypocritical.
>You also defeat yourself when you try to misrepresent what others have
>said. Sometimes you do it by deliberately and blatantly altering their
>sentences (such as in the recent added period example), but other
>times you try to present deliberate misinterpretations that you think
>are subtle and unnoticeable, but are anything but that to anyone who
>has been following the entire debate. Here is one such example from
>your latest post:
>
>> And then presume to
>> call ME a racist, for offering a tribute to a civil right leader.
>
>But Desmond, to whom you were referring there, did not call you a
>racist FOR offering that tribute.
Argggg... of all the stupid things you've said... that happens to be the
most stupid. He CALLED ME A RACIST. That implies every
aspect, including FOR offering that tribute. What kind of convoluted
logic are you using? Oh, yeah... the kind that would claim everyone
was _corrupt_ in the conviction of the _Great White Whale_. What
he calls me is a racist, who had the temerity to offer that tribute.
Clearly, he was calling me a racist FOR offering that tribute, since it
was his comment in respect to my offering that tribute. He directly
ADDRESSED my offering that tribute. FOR my offering that
tribute. Your sickening attempt to twist that into presuming his
remark calling me a racist wasn't directed against my offering that
tribute makes me want to puke. And you SUPPORTED him calling
me a racist. Which means YOU called me a racist. And OTHERS
saw that as well. "
> He called you a racist IN SPITE OF
>your doing so, and accused you of using that tribute and exploiting
>MLK Day for your own personal ends. That is very different from the
>picture your above words attempt to paint.
>
In spite of:".. what a piece of work you are, JPB. That's just sick...
you really are some sort of disgusting animal, to presume that someone
who has NEVER posted a racist word here, would offer that tribute
as an EXPLOITATION of MLK. You are sucking at the tit of desi...
all because of some huge ball of flab. You turn my stomach. He
was calling me a racist FOR offering that tribute. Since if I had NOT
offered it... the entire fucking thread would not exist. Can you possibly
absorb that information? FOR having offered that tribute... he called
me a racist. Your logic is just so weird... since even if it were exploitive,
his calling me a racist would have been FOR my having exploited that
day.
>And you then proceed to construct your entire argument on this false
>premise that Desmond had attacked the very idea of ANY Martin Luther
>King tribute, when the truth is that he was attacking you and nobody
>else. You then act as if this false premise is an established, proven
>and uncontested fact, and write things like:
>
But he had attacked the very MEANING of that tribute... he admitted
that. Quite clearly his purpose was to sour that tribute... to DESTROY
ITS MEANING. In effect, he might as well have pulled the trigger
that killed that man. Because desi's PURPOSE was to DESTROY
the MEANING of that tribute and that day. desi could not STAND
that _I_ would offer it... not because I am a racist... but because it was
ME. And you are wrong... he attacked me FOR offering that tribute.
That you cannot see that... makes you his special emotionally stunted
and misshapen, goblin follower. He attacked me FOR my having
provided those words. He said "Doctor King is spinning in his grave,
right now..." FOR my having offered that tribute. He attacked me FOR
SEEKING TO "hijack the day."
His words -- which certainly speak to insulting me FOR providing
that tribute and not IN SPITE OF providing that tribute were --
"Regrettably, it is often necessary to break a few eggs to make an omelette.Your
pitiful attempt to appear 'just' by soiling the name of Dr King with
your mouth, made the breaking of those eggs necessary. I will not stand
idly by, as the George Wallace of the 21st century, hiding behind anonymity
whilst loudly proclaiming himself to be 'accountable' for his words, tries
to hijack the name of a great man whose death is a direct result of the
policies of his kind. His blood is on your hands, and on the hands of
every white racist prick like you. Preach to your own stunted kind as much
as you wish, but don't expect to come on to AADP, try to appear moral when
you're anything but, and expect me to sit and let you get away with it, you
revolting, racist, murderer lover piece of shit."
>> So it appears you
>> are agreeing with a racist, and calling me a racist as he has done.
>
>These are very amateurish tactics you use in your attempts to fool
>people, and I often wonder if you really believe anyone is being taken
>in by them.
Sorry, sport... but you should recognize there were two posters here,
who certainly felt you HAD called me a racist, simply through your
IMPLICATION. Which makes you a lying sack of shit... who has
never been able to do much more than slither from post to post.
Mr D. perceived that you had called me a racist... in spite of your
denial, when he wrote "Regardless of anything else one might say
about PV, he is not a racist." And "To label PV a racist is no more
than juvenile point-scoring" He was addressing that comment to
YOU... and in spite of your denials... HE perceived you were calling
me a racist. And he thoroughly _put you down_ in your pathetic
attempt to backtrack and argue it was my _newly developed anti-racism_
And John Rennie did as well - when he posted to you - "Your comment
above that his present position bears "no resemblance to postings during
previous years" could not be more incorrect and again implies that he
has at least flirted with racialism."
Both of those posters SAW what you say was not there. But, gee...
one wonders why they saw it... unless it was IMPLIED by you. What
they both said, in more diplomatic terms than I intend to use with you...
is that you're a fucking hypocrite.
And you never have addressed these comments I provided over
two and a half years ago about desi and my perception of his racism.
My post on Aug 14, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=wB1m5.2704%24Cc2.119579%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"Desmond Coughlan is a fundamental racist, using every possible
opportunity to exploit and twist the words of others while exhibiting
the qualities that all easily recognize as bigotry and prejudice"
See the words "FUNDAMENTAL RACIST"?
Then again the very next day, Aug 15, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=E3mm5.5733%24Cc2.222091%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
When again speaking of desi, I posted -- "his voice is stridently racist, without
a hint of objectivity."
See the word "RACIST"?
Then again two days later, Aug 17, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=K22n5.12074%24Cc2.437031%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"In case anyone has any illusions about Desmond NOT being a racist, let me repeat
part of a post from him..:"
See the word "RACIST"?
Then again on Aug 20, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=rPXn5.4870%24Nz4.243149%40newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"You see, DESMOND is the racist!!!! His protestations notwithstanding, Desmond is
the most dangerous form of a racist. He avows racial tolerance, but underneath
that facade lies a deep vein of hatred for all things other than those outside
of his tiny world"
See the word TWICE of "RACIST"?
Then again on Sept 25, 2000 --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=IeKz5.17225%24Vu5.842450%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"his disgusting anti US, racist, arrogant, self-righteous, and simply stupid
comments."
See the word "RACIST"?
Do you have a reading disability?
And ALL of those OVER TWO AND A HALF YEARS AGO.
I didn't even BOTHER looking at 2001 and 2002!! So who's the hypocrite
with your words -- "Prior to that, there were no such rants from PV
about racism - neither that which he is accusing Desmond of nor
general racism in society. PV only decided to don this anti-racism hat
of his after Desmond began accusing him of racism. "
Are you ready to admit you are a fucking liar? With your CLEAR accusation
that I only recently referred to desi as a racist? Now comes the crunch... do
you have the GUTS to admit you don't know jack shit about my views?
And where is the answer to the question of WHO was the first to demonize
the other in the thread MLK Day? Did I attempt to demonize desi in my
original tribute? Of course not... did desi attempt to demonize me in his
reply? Of course he did. Why did he do so? FOR my providing that
tribute. Quite different from what you presume. Now return to being
desi's trusty little goblin... because the thought of you turns my stomach.
PV
Just passing by
in this thread and that will attempt to show that the very recent
apparently fanatical stance against racism taken by "A Planet Visitor"
has been nothing more than an act. In future posts I hope to show,
again through comparing PV's recent output with that from previous
years, just why he has recently attempted to present himself as
something quite inconsistent with his writings from a period before he
deemed it personally convenient to appear as he does today.
Initially these posts will concentrate only on comparing those
postings by "A Planet Visitor" that have appeared in this newsgroup,
but in the future they will move on to entirely different and even
more revealing areas that will also cover other newsgroups and which
will rely on a method of research which I briefly mentioned in a post
to PV yesterday (i.e. the reference to D.W. Foster's book).
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03032...@posting.google.com
The purpose of this and the posts that will follow it is not to
attempt to claim that PV has only very recently begun *mentioning*
racism, but that the intensity of his "anti-racism" has recently
reached a level that was never seen from him until he began exploiting
the issue as ammunition for what he sees as a personal crusade that is
unrelated to the question of racism. Firstly, as an illustration of
what I am referring to by PV's "apparently fanatical stance against
racism" here are just a few examples of his very recent comments:
_____________________________
"You will never find anything from me but the admission that the U.S.
is a racist society, and I abhor such racism... having gone so far as
to state that 'we are a nation without honor,' until we solve the
problem of racism."
"And I shudder at the thought of using those most VICIOUS, must
BRUTAL, most DEGENERATE, most MALIGNANT, most CANCEROUS, most SAVAGE,
most SPITEFUL, most UGLY phrases he has offered as insults of Man
against other Man. Those racist words he uses to describe Blacks."
"Were you to offer an apology to me, and were I to accept, I would
become a PARTY to your racism. Accepting that you can make such a
malefic, wicked malodorous racist comment, and BE EXCUSED by ME for
doing so. It is not within my power to excuse you. That excuse belongs
to a higher power than me."
This next one was addressed directly to me:
"I have taught my children better. Apparently your parents did not
teach you to be as revolted by insults directed against one's fellow
man. I am sorry for your lack of proper nurturing."
"There is no 'victory' for me here. Only an overwhelming sense of
sadness, WHENEVER I see racism rear its ugly head, as I saw it when
you insulted a tribute to MLK. On cannot find _victory_ in recognizing
racism. One can only find that deep well of grief, that Men can
exhibit such behavior toward other Men."
"I would be a PARTY to his racism were I to look at any apology he
might offer to me, as anything other than a racist trying now to HIDE
the fact he is a racist. I would spit on any apology he offers to me.
He needs to apologize to GOD... and to NATURE... and TO MAN. And to
make it a life-long commitment to do so."
"Where will we be 34 years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and
hate still be half-full, or will we have finally emptied it? I
certainly don't know, but I do know that the answer lies in the future
behavior of each and every one of us."
"It is an outragous insult to our species to presume that we should
determine who is the _victor_ here. Since it presumes that racism has
the POSSIBILITY of emerging as a _victor_."
____________________________
Looks impressive, doesn't it? Not even Rev. Jesse Jackson could lay
claim to such an array of intensely anti-racist quotes over such a
very short period as those above span. But we do know that when Rev.
Jackson uses such rhetoric, he means it. We know that because he has a
long and consistent history of opposing racism; one that goes back to
the days when he was a close colleague of Martin Luther King himself.
http://www.anusha.com/king-jes.htm
But any such "long and consistent history of opposing racism" by PV is
much less easy to establish and prove. In fact, the further back one
traces PV's posting history, both in this group and others, the more
evidence one finds of his indifference to racism. Which brings me to
an episode in this newsgroup from as recently as July of last year.
One of the worst examples of racist violence imaginable was the brutal
murder in Jasper, Texas, of Mr. James Byrd, a totally innocent black
man who was dragged to his death after being tied to the back of a
truck by three white men, for no reason other than his colour.
Evidence later emerged that the men had also cut Mr Byrd's throat with
a knife.
That crime, and the death sentences passed on two of the men convicted
of it, have been discussed in this newsgroup on many occasions since
the end of the trial back in 1999, but I have been looking only at the
threads that included such discussions since early 2000, when, as I
understand, PV began posting here ... and there are dozens of them. So
how many of those threads might we reasonably expect the man who
insists he is totally and utterly devoted to fighting and exposing
racism - to a far greater extent than anyone else here has ever
boasted of being - to have contributed to?
Before speculating about the answer to the above question, let's just
remember the above recent statements PV has made here on the subject
of racism If he is to be believed, PV is about as anti-racist as it
is possible to be. Such language could, if expressed with any
sincerity, only have come from someone with an unflinching dedication
to actively combating racism whenever and wherever he found it;
someone whose anger and rage at racism would have been demonstrated in
many of those discussions here of the extreme example involving Mr
Byrd.
But that wasn't what I found when looking for PV's name in those
threads. In fact I have been unable to find a single example of PV
ever mentioning James Byrd or anything relating to that case.
Could it be that he was ill, or just not posting here during the
periods that others were discussing that case? No: in all but one of
the threads I have checked, there is evidence of PV having posted in
other unrelated but contemporaneous threads.
Could it be that PV simply didn't notice anyone else discussing that
case? No: on July 19 of last year, PV was arguing that the death
penalty in the US was not racially biased against blacks. Arguing that
the DP was indeed so biased, ironically, was Desmond Coughlan who
challenged PV to state the last time a white murderer was executed in
Texas for killing a black person. In his reply PV was unable to offer
any such examples and instead offered the theory that such murderers
may not have deserved the DP, or as he put it: "Perhaps because none
of those murders committed met the necessaries for an execution." PV
then threw down his own challenge which was: "Can you provide an
example of a white who murdered a black that you believe justified the
DP?"
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=PLZZ8.82426$XH.18...@twister.tampabay.rr.com
Had PV, a death penalty supporter and (now) an *apparently* fanatical
anti-racist, forgotten about the James Byrd case? If so, another
poster was on hand to remind him of that gruesome murder. In a direct
reply to PV's challenge, this person posted seven paragraphs dealing
exclusively with the James Byrd case, detailing the crime itself,
comments from the police chief, the trial and the sentences.
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=10b91a3a.02071...@posting.google.com
And PV's reply? There wasn't one. Not even something thanking the
poster for reminding him of that case, and taking the opportunity to
add his own words of condemnation of those evil racist killers? No,
not even that - he just ignored that post.
Instead he posted a second reply to that challenge of Desmond's, this
time calling Desmond a moron for asking such a question, which he (PV)
described as "mindless drivel".
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=X4I_8.96226$XH.23...@twister.tampabay.rr.com
Fortunately, not everyone ignored that poster's contribution about Mr
Byrd. One other retentionist did reply, and condemned the racist
murderers as animals. What a shame that PV, the self-proclaimed
paragon of anti-racist principles who presumes himself fit to lecture
everyone else about racism, couldn't bring himself to do the same.
_______________
NOTE: In anticipation of a rather predictable response, I should point
out that I am already aware that five days before posting that reply
to PV, the writer angered many people by overstepping the generally
accepted rules of "netiquette". That may have given PV a reason to
dislike the poster, but not to ignore the matter she had raised in her
reply to him. I am also aware that PV described that poster as "one of
the worst forms of vermin that infests our species" at about this
time. But anyone considering that to be a good reason for ignoring her
reply to PV about James Byrd should remember that PV has, many times,
used similar language to describe Desmond, and yet still replies to
almost his every post.
I have added this note to hopefully thwart any attempt to obscure this
matter by pretending that it is primarily concerned with "Mrs Emma
Peel" (the poster in question). It is not about her, but about James
Byrd.
John Rennie
> This is the first of a number of posts that will periodically appear
> in this thread and that will attempt to show that the very recent
> apparently fanatical stance against racism taken by "A Planet Visitor"
> has been nothing more than an act. In future posts I hope to show,
> again through comparing PV's recent output with that from previous
> years, just why he has recently attempted to present himself as
> something quite inconsistent with his writings from a period before he
> deemed it personally convenient to appear as he does today.
>
> Initially these posts will concentrate only on comparing those
> postings by "A Planet Visitor" that have appeared in this newsgroup,
> but in the future they will move on to entirely different and even
> more revealing areas that will also cover other newsgroups and which
> will rely on a method of research which I briefly mentioned in a post
>
>
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0303251055.474d9529@posting.g
ogle.com
>
> The purpose of this and the posts that will follow it is not to
> attempt to claim that PV has only very recently begun *mentioning*
> racism, but that the intensity of his "anti-racism" has recently
> reached a level that was never seen from him until he began exploiting
> the issue as ammunition for what he sees as a personal crusade that is
> unrelated to the question of racism. Firstly, as an illustration of
> what I am referring to by PV's "apparently fanatical stance against
> racism" here are just a few examples of his very recent comments:
>
> _____________________________
>
>
> is a racist society, and I abhor such racism... having gone so far as
> problem of racism."
>
> "And I shudder at the thought of using those most VICIOUS, must
> BRUTAL, most DEGENERATE, most MALIGNANT, most CANCEROUS, most SAVAGE,
> most SPITEFUL, most UGLY phrases he has offered as insults of Man
> against other Man. Those racist words he uses to describe Blacks."
>
> "Were you to offer an apology to me, and were I to accept, I would
> become a PARTY to your racism. Accepting that you can make such a
> malefic, wicked malodorous racist comment, and BE EXCUSED by ME for
> doing so. It is not within my power to excuse you. That excuse belongs
> to a higher power than me."
>
> This next one was addressed directly to me:
>
> "I have taught my children better. Apparently your parents did not
> teach you to be as revolted by insults directed against one's fellow
> man. I am sorry for your lack of proper nurturing."
>
> "There is no 'victory' for me here. Only an overwhelming sense of
> sadness, WHENEVER I see racism rear its ugly head, as I saw it when
> racism. One can only find that deep well of grief, that Men can
>
> "I would be a PARTY to his racism were I to look at any apology he
> might offer to me, as anything other than a racist trying now to HIDE
> the fact he is a racist. I would spit on any apology he offers to me.
> He needs to apologize to GOD... and to NATURE... and TO MAN. And to
> make it a life-long commitment to do so."
>
> "Where will we be 34 years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and
> hate still be half-full, or will we have finally emptied it? I
> certainly don't know, but I do know that the answer lies in the future
So that's it is it JPB? Very poor stuff as I anticipated it would be
because I have taken a close interest in this group and in the non
flame posts of PV. It all seems to hinge on the fact that 1) he didn't
comment on the Byrd case and that 2) he believes the DP is not
colour biased.
1) What there to comment about on the Byrd case? Are there
any arguments about it? Has anyone defended the action of the
white murderers? It is exceptional because it harps back to
a time (not that long ago) when such crimes were numerous
but now they are not. I just don't see why PV had to comment
upon it.
2) I think that you didn't research that deeply. I challenged
PV time and again about the inherent bias in the judicial
system against blacks when they murdered whites. He
pointed out, with some force I might add, that the system
was against blacks for minor and major misdemeanours as
well as for murders and was probably less unfair for
murders than lesser crimes. It's not a complete answer by any
means but it's PV's answer.
I realise that PV's unfair mode of posting has got under your skin;
strawdogs are produced regularly, one's arguments seem to
go through the mangle and re-emerge looking as if an idiot
on a bad day had made them, one's speculations become
assertions and he is not above the odd outright lie which
he feebly defends as being a 'implication'. He's annoying,
cantankerous and always looking for flame fests and he does
react without humour and far too violently against insensitive
remarks about race as I probably do about the terms
'spas' or spastic.but he's a major part of this peculiar news
group and his non flame posts which alas are fewer and
fewer are read avidly by many of us. You too have the
makings of such a contributor but in the meantime best
leave this hobby horse alone.
Just passing by
> So that's it is it JPB?
No, John, that isn't "it". As my very first sentence above reads,
"This is the first of a number of posts that will periodically appear
in this thread .... etc"
> Very poor stuff as I anticipated it would be
> because I have taken a close interest in this group and in the non
> flame posts of PV. It all seems to hinge on the fact that 1) he didn't
> comment on the Byrd case and that 2) he believes the DP is not
> colour biased.
Then once again you have misread what I have written. The post was
concerned with the Byrd case but not with the fact that "he believes
the DP is not colour biased". The brief references to that view of his
were entirely incidental and I attempted to make no point from them,
as you will see if you read it again.
> 1) What there to comment about on the Byrd case? Are there
> any arguments about it? Has anyone defended the action of the
> white murderers? It is exceptional because it harps back to
> a time (not that long ago) when such crimes were numerous
> but now they are not. I just don't see why PV had to comment
> upon it.
I think for a number of reasons, not least because another poster
effectively directly invited him to do so. Also because others who do
not set themselves up as such anti-racist champions, attacking others
for not conforming to their own professed standards, did contribute to
those threads that PV chose to ignore.
> 2) I think that you didn't research that deeply. I challenged
> PV time and again about the inherent bias in the judicial
> system against blacks when they murdered whites. He
> pointed out, with some force I might add, that the system
> was against blacks for minor and major misdemeanours as
> well as for murders and was probably less unfair for
> murders than lesser crimes. It's not a complete answer by any
> means but it's PV's answer.
As I said above, and as I pointed out to PV recently, I do not intend
to use PV's views on alleged racial biases in the justice system as
material for what I believe is his bogus anti-racism. I have no
interest in PV's views and arguments on that matter and have never
commented on them. What you wrote above refers to a non-issue in
respect of the points I am raising here.
What this is about is something that you, in spite of having been a
regular here for so long, appear to have failed to notice: the very
extreme change that has occurred in the language PV now uses when
discussing the question of racism. And that change will be focussed
upon in the future far more than it has in this post, as will what I
believe is the underlying reason for it.
Finally, you seem to find the fact that I have used PV's absence of
comment on the James Byrd case objectionable. Perhaps you think that
this method of focussing upon what a person *has not* said rather than
on what they *have* said is somehow unfair. If so, then one wonders if
you felt the same way about a recent posting from PV which used
precisely this method to attack Desmond. I refer to this one:
http://www.google.com/groups?selm=fgr57v8lp5b07erl6...@4ax.com
In that post PV revealed the results of his own searches on a former
poster called Frank for the purpose of attempting to show that Desmond
had not attacked racist comments from that poster. PV wrote: "I cannot
even remember when he even concerned himself with the well-recognized
racist who previously posted here. FRANK. Did he ever mention FRANK'S
racism? I can't remember, and cannot seem to locate a post where he
did." PV followed up that post with another one listing posts in which
he (PV) had referred to Frank and smugly concluded with the words, "I
think my point is made."
I didn't notice you replying to that post in similar terms to those in
your reply to me.
John Rennie
"Just passing by" <unimpre...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:21b1da28.03032...@posting.google.com...
news:<ugrga.1226$8s5...@newsfep3-gui.server.ntli.net>...
> > So that's it is it JPB?
>
> No, John, that isn't "it". As my very first sentence above reads,
> "This is the first of a number of posts that will periodically appear
> in this thread .... etc"
Let's concentrate on something you and I agree
about and feel deeply about - this fucking useless war.
JIGSAW1695
From: "John Rennie" j.re...@ntlworld.com
Date: 3/27/2003 5:45 AM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <EDAga.1609$ck7....@newsfep1-win.server.ntli.net>
===============================
Come one Johnm, admitt it. Your feelings have nothing to do with the war. It
has everything to do with your insane hatred for America and everything
American.
Jigsaw
PS: No Appeasement for Peace! Ever!!
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
jigsa...@aol.com (JIGSAW1695) wrote:
> Come one Johnm, admitt it. Your feelings have nothing to do with the war.
> It
> has everything to do with your insane hatred for America and everything
> American.
I hope that the above is intended entirely in irony, Jiggy.
JIGSAW1695
From: "Mr Q. Z. Diablo" jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks
Date: 3/27/2003 5:04 PM Eastern Standard Time
Message-id: <jonathan-A73315...@newsroom.utas.edu.au>
In article <20030327055108...@mb-fw.aol.com>,
jigsa...@aol.com (JIGSAW1695) wrote:
> Come one Johnm, admitt it. Your feelings have nothing to do with the war.
> It
> has everything to do with your insane hatred for America and everything
> American.
I hope that the above is intended entirely in irony, Jiggy.
Mr Q. Z. D.
===============================
ironying.....I dont do no freakin' ironying.
I have the maid do it for me.
A Planet Visitor
>This is the first of a number of posts that will periodically appear
>in this thread and that will attempt to show that the very recent
>apparently fanatical stance against racism taken by "A Planet Visitor"
>has been nothing more than an act. In future posts I hope to show,
>again through comparing PV's recent output with that from previous
>years, just why he has recently attempted to present himself as
>something quite inconsistent with his writings from a period before he
>deemed it personally convenient to appear as he does today.
>
TRANSLATION == Racism means nothing to me. Other than I
will vigorously defend racist slurs, if they are posted by the enemy of
my enemy. I will now try to contend that PV is a racist, and perhaps
others might NOT see that I have defended an attack on a tribute to MLK.
Which, in effect, was an attempt to defend desi when desi admitted to
destroying the MEANING expressed in that tribute. But what do I
care about racism? As long as desi will _stick up for me_. ==
>Initially these posts will concentrate only on comparing those
>postings by "A Planet Visitor" that have appeared in this newsgroup,
>but in the future they will move on to entirely different and even
>more revealing areas that will also cover other newsgroups and which
>will rely on a method of research which I briefly mentioned in a post
>to PV yesterday (i.e. the reference to D.W. Foster's book).
>
>url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.03032...@posting.google.com
>
TRANSLATION == I intend to lie through my teeth... as I have done
throughout my presence in this group. My love and affection for the
baby-killer, knows no bounds of decency. After all... isn't everyone
who finds her guilty - corrupt? Doesn't that make PV corrupt by
definition? ==
>The purpose of this and the posts that will follow it is not to
>attempt to claim that PV has only very recently begun *mentioning*
>racism, but that the intensity of his "anti-racism" has recently
>reached a level that was never seen from him until he began exploiting
>the issue as ammunition for what he sees as a personal crusade that is
>unrelated to the question of racism.
I have always suspected desi was a racist, and used the racist slurs he
had offered in the past to draw some attention to his hypocrisy, and
covert racism, that he would try to hide under a phony facade. It was
certainly my right as a poster to relate those racist slurs he had provided
in the past, and offer my opinion as to the racism I see within them. I
will continue to do so, regardless of your crazy defense of his doing so,
by you claiming he implies they are coming from _somewhere else_,
thus you argue he can lie with impunity, even if they haven't come from
_somewhere else_. Nonetheless, racism was never raised to the level
it has been raised to, until recent times here. Because of two events,
one started by desi, and the second by you --
1) desi most certainly demonstrated he IS a racist, through an attack
on a tribute to MLK. This is undeniable. He admitted he intended to
DESTROY the MEANING of that tribute. This placed the issue of
racism squarely into focus here. It grew so bad in that dialog that he
was forced to insult the ENTIRE GROUP (except for his two lackeys --
you and dirt), by calling EVERY member here sycophants (a word
which aptly describes you), insulted them by stating they had no
backbone, demanded that they redeem themselves, and then had the
total affront to tell every member that if they did not _vote_ for his
brand of racism, they must leave the newsgroup, as they are only
pawns. How rational does that sound?
2) You found yourself losing touch with reality in respect to an entirely
different issue... that of the baby-killer known as the _Great White Whale_.
In that regard, you saw me as a great threat to your obsessive affection
for that female-Michael-Jackson, and recognized that desi was the greatest
focus of my disgust in respect to the many very evil distortions and lies he
had posted here so often. He thus became your _friend_... Someone
you NEEDED very badly. In your desperate search for a friendly-crutch
for your other lost-argument. One you would defend REGARDLESS of
how disgusting his comments. Even to the point of defending a racist... and
casting a shadow of racism on yourself, through such an effort. It reached
a peak, when you hysterically argued that a _period_ had changed the
MEANING of his words which clearly stated he wished to destroy my
MEANING in that tribute. You STILL have not addressed the question as
to who was the first to demonize in this thread right here, which BEGAN
with my tribute. I am certain you never will.
> Firstly, as an illustration of
>what I am referring to by PV's "apparently fanatical stance against
>racism" here are just a few examples of his very recent comments:
>
>_____________________________
>
>
>"You will never find anything from me but the admission that the U.S.
>is a racist society, and I abhor such racism... having gone so far as
>to state that 'we are a nation without honor,' until we solve the
>problem of racism."
>
Said more than once. In fact, looking ONLY for the words "disenfranchised"
and "disenfranchisement," which I have used to refer to the situation of the
Black American, you will find it appears a total of 98 times in various posts of
mine. Beginning on June 17, 2000, two months after my first post here. See
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=X2C25.3365%24ds.88776%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
>"And I shudder at the thought of using those most VICIOUS, must
>BRUTAL, most DEGENERATE, most MALIGNANT, most CANCEROUS,
>most SAVAGE, most SPITEFUL, most UGLY phrases he has offered as
>insults of Man against other Man. Those racist words he uses to describe Blacks."
You've not seen where I have EVER used those words as coming from me.
NEVER. They fill every definition I have provided, as far as I'm concerned.
You, and desi may find them trivial, but that reflects on YOU and not on ME.
They will never reflect on me, since I will never use them.
>"Were you to offer an apology to me, and were I to accept, I would
>become a PARTY to your racism. Accepting that you can make such a
>malefic, wicked malodorous racist comment, and BE EXCUSED by ME for
>doing so. It is not within my power to excuse you. That excuse belongs
>to a higher power than me."
>
Quite clearly, accepting any apology from him, would be an acceptance
that one can apologize for BEING a racist. It will take more than some
silly, meaningless words from him. It will take a long time through
DEMONSTRATIONS before nature that he no longer is a racist. And
excusing his comments is certainly not within my power. Nature must
provide it. Do you find some reason to object to that line of reasoning?
Do you believe YOU can excuse racism? Oh... I forgot... of course you
do... if it happens to be coming from the enemy of your enemy... ALL
can be forgiven.
>This next one was addressed directly to me:
>
>"I have taught my children better. Apparently your parents did not
>teach you to be as revolted by insults directed against one's fellow
>man. I am sorry for your lack of proper nurturing."
>
That's rather self-evident. I have always claimed you are an object of
pity. That belief has only grown as far as my opinion goes. Every
post rather demonstrates how emotionally fragile you actually are.
I find it hard to believe this is some sort of physical anomaly you
were actually born with. Correct me if I'm wrong. But if it is not
an inherited malady, I can only presume it has resulted from an
inadequate emotional growth process, brought about by that lack
of proper nurturing.
>"There is no 'victory' for me here. Only an overwhelming sense of
>sadness, WHENEVER I see racism rear its ugly head, as I saw it when
>you insulted a tribute to MLK. On cannot find _victory_ in recognizing
>racism. One can only find that deep well of grief, that Men can
>exhibit such behavior toward other Men."
>
Quite true... racism is symbolic of Man's FAILURE. We cannot find
any _victory_, when we see it infects our own species. Just as we
cannot find any _victory_ when we execute a murderer. After all,
he is also of our species. What we should and must feel, is a great sense
of sadness. Sadness that a man has committed an act... a murder... so
depraved that even lower animals seldom demonstrate. And has driven
us to the point that we must incapacitate him for our own safety. Just
as we must feel the same sadness toward a racist... who so clearly
demonstrates our failure as a species. Strange that you would presume
to feel differently....
>"I would be a PARTY to his racism were I to look at any apology he
>might offer to me, as anything other than a racist trying now to HIDE
>the fact he is a racist. I would spit on any apology he offers to me.
>He needs to apologize to GOD... and to NATURE... and TO MAN. And to
>make it a life-long commitment to do so."
>
I believe that is much a repeat of what I said previously. Clearly it takes
a life-long commitment to erase any racism within oneself. One cannot
change, and then revert BACK to a racist nature at will, as one changes
TV channels.
>"Where will we be 34 years from today? Will the glass of prejudice and
>hate still be half-full, or will we have finally emptied it? I
>certainly don't know, but I do know that the answer lies in the future
>behavior of each and every one of us."
>
A rather self-evident truth. We have certainly proved ourselves as
nothing but fools to this point in our evolution, since that glass is still
half-full. We are only what we can become. And what we become
does depend on us. Words cannot describe how I feel about desi
trying to DESTROY the MEANING in those words.
>"It is an outragous insult to our species to presume that we should
>determine who is the _victor_ here. Since it presumes that racism has
>the POSSIBILITY of emerging as a _victor_."
>
That's another self-evident truth. And let's not forget ---
My various attacks on racist FRANK... who was a retentionist which can be
found in --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=ks6a7v8ae631sm2o9ebhiba6ona6t0j0or%404ax.com
My various attacks on racist desi... who is a racist swine, which can be found in --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=40ua6vcg4pnit535hj1a4n1avsm44i3291%404ax.com
A post which lists references to seven different mentions of my seeing
racism in desi, ALL dating back more than two and a half years ago.
The first only a bit more than a month after I first posted to this group, over
two and a half years ago. And which rather proved he cares NOTHING
about racism itself, but does care very much about attacking the U.S., and
a racism which I have always admitted exists. But I do not employ racist slurs.
And I am not infected with the racist poison that runs through his veins.
While you have presumed to DEFEND that racist... and even LIED by stating in--
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0303040404.6ec39dbc%40posting.google.com
"Prior to that, there were no such rants from PV about racism - neither
that which he is accusing Desmond of nor general racism in society.
PV only decided to don this anti-racism hat of his after Desmond began
accusing him of racism. "
Where is your admission that you LIED, JPB? Since my posts noting
racism in desi, and my society in general have been at least in the hundreds
here in this newsgroup, and certainly many dating over two years ago.
>____________________________
>
>Looks impressive, doesn't it? Not even Rev. Jesse Jackson could lay
>claim to such an array of intensely anti-racist quotes over such a
>very short period as those above span. But we do know that when Rev.
>Jackson uses such rhetoric, he means it. We know that because he has a
>long and consistent history of opposing racism; one that goes back to
>the days when he was a close colleague of Martin Luther King himself.
>
>http://www.anusha.com/king-jes.htm
Well... that's the height of your pitiful hypocrisy!! Defending a poster who
stated he intended to DESTROY the MEANING of a tribute to MLK... and
now presuming to post that URL, as if YOU give a damn about racism...
MLK... or Jesse Jackson. YOU DON'T!! It's all just bullshit on your part,
since you've NEVER expressed any view toward racism EXCEPT to DEFEND
someone who intended to destroy the meaning of a tribute to MLK. In
the very first post in this thread. What's YOUR position on racism???
Oh, yeah... it's whatever desi's position is. Nothing is further from your
mind than racism in the U.S. It's ALL ABOUT THE GREAT WHITE WHALE
WITH YOU. As if you CARE about MLK or Jesse Jackson. You turn my
stomach.
>But any such "long and consistent history of opposing racism" by PV is
>much less easy to establish and prove. In fact, the further back one
>traces PV's posting history, both in this group and others, the more
>evidence one finds of his indifference to racism. Which brings me to
>an episode in this newsgroup from as recently as July of last year.
>
You will NEVER find any "indifference to racism," from me. It has
become more evident as time has gone by here that some posters are
racist, IMHO. When I don't see it, I have no reason to comment on it,
since this is not a group devoted to racism, per se. Nonetheless, there
are some here, most especially desi, who seem to feed off of racism,
and you have become his grotesque racist admirer. As I have already
shown, it took me only a bit more than one month posting here, to
recognize that desi was a racist. And that opinion has only been strengthened
as time has passed here, which naturally elevated my mentions of his
racism. Nor will your pathetic defense of his racism cause me any
concern, or reason to stop mentioning it when I see it in ANYONE.
>One of the worst examples of racist violence imaginable was the brutal
>murder in Jasper, Texas, of Mr. James Byrd, a totally innocent black
>man who was dragged to his death after being tied to the back of a
>truck by three white men, for no reason other than his colour.
>Evidence later emerged that the men had also cut Mr Byrd's throat with
>a knife.
>
>That crime, and the death sentences passed on two of the men convicted
>of it, have been discussed in this newsgroup on many occasions since
>the end of the trial back in 1999, but I have been looking only at the
>threads that included such discussions since early 2000, when, as I
>understand, PV began posting here ... and there are dozens of them. So
>how many of those threads might we reasonably expect the man who
>insists he is totally and utterly devoted to fighting and exposing
>racism - to a far greater extent than anyone else here has ever
>boasted of being - to have contributed to?
Exactly what was I supposed to comment? In fact, John King and Lawrence
Brewer were both sentenced to the DP. While Shawn Berry was sentenced
to Life without Parole for 40 years. All sentences I thoroughly agree with.
And this all happened before my first post in this group. Are you presuming
I should argue that they should NOT have been sentenced to the DP?
That's desi's argument! I find their execution to be totally justified, and have
never expressed any belief other than justice was served. I believe it
firmly supports every conclusion I have drawn here, that racism is an
insidious problem in the U.S. Not always as overt as that act. But that
murder demonstrates forcefully that racism is rampant in the U.S., which is
essentially what I have been saying. In point of fact, that was one Black
murdered by Whites... but other aspects of racism... which have caused
Blacks to see THEMSELVES as _less than equal_ has created an
atmosphere of violence which makes that one murder pale. That murder
simply was an expression of a pus-filled sore that was squeezed. Clearly,
the fact that 94% of Black victims are murdered by other Blacks, shows
how racism has worked to denude Blacks from any expression of their own
self-worth. Clearly, the fact that almost exactly as many Blacks are murdered
as Whites, yet Blacks constitute only 13% of our population should make us
understand what racism has managed to destroy, in a much larger sense than
that one senseless murder. Which everyone should realize met every criteria
imaginable for the DP. But there are other aspects that create even more
murders, for which the true creators of those murders, through racist
disenfranchisement and ghettoization, will never be brought to any justice.
We are, in fact, consuming our own. And racist slurs, and insults offered
to those who would pay tribute to MLK, only function to perpetuate that
feeling of inadequate worth, among Blacks themselves. No one can
convince me otherwise.
>Before speculating about the answer to the above question, let's just
>remember the above recent statements PV has made here on the subject
>of racism If he is to be believed, PV is about as anti-racist as it
>is possible to be. Such language could, if expressed with any
>sincerity, only have come from someone with an unflinching dedication
>to actively combating racism whenever and wherever he found it;
>someone whose anger and rage at racism would have been demonstrated in
>many of those discussions here of the extreme example involving Mr
>Byrd.
>
I would have certainly expressed rage had they NOT been sentenced to the
DP. It would present a good argument for racism in the DP in Texas,
had they NOT been sentenced to the DP. In point of fact, looking over desi's
contributions to the Byrd murder, we have NOTHING of substance from
him. His last post mentioning Byrd was on Oct 2, 1999, fully six months
before I ever posted here. Doing a search of "Byrd" "Texas" and desi's
posts, we find a grand total of SEVEN posts from him, ALL prior to my
posting to this group. And in every one of those seven posts desi only
offered some rather silly comment, hardly deserved of being seen as an
examination of that murder. Or the racism in the MURDER. You see
desi isn't concerned with racism in America, he is only concerned in implying
there is racism in the DP. He has only concerned himself with arguing
racism in the DP, yet the murderers were sentenced to the DP. In fact,
desi argued AGAINST sentencing those two to the DP, since he opposes
the DP in any case... You can find that at --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=87vh911siw.fsf%40lievre.coughlan.fr
Where he calls the sentence of the DP to Brewer -- "Another miscarriage of
justice in Texas." So apparently desi finds those who murder Blacks in
racist murders do not NEED to be executed. While I certainly believe
society needed to take the action it did.
And you will find it AGAIN at --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=87ogmg5fq7.fsf%40lievre.coughlan.fr
Where he _argued_ with David, that even those who murder in such racist
acts, do not _forfeit a right_. You see, desi would imply that there is racism
in the DP, yet would oppose a justice system expression of revulsion over
such a racist murder, which would punish with the DP for ANY REASON,
including a racist murder of any kind.
Then we have where he threatens a fellow abolitionist ---
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=87n2205fg0.fsf%40lievre.coughlan.fr
Where he posted "Don't get in my way, or you will regret it." to an abolitionist
in the dialog of the Byrd murderers sentenced to the DP. That was an interesting
thread.. since Sharp, began that thread by posting "A very deserved sentence."
Mystery then remarked "Should not be death by injection! Should DRAG HIS
ASS BEHIND A PICKUP! an eye for an eye." And desi came in to rather
DEFEND those racist murderers by presuming that King would never be
executed. While providing ANOTHER of his classic racist slurs against
Blacks. Looking at those posts of desi referring to Byrd, ALL posted prior to
any post of mine to this group, we have -- those I have noted above... another
which makes a facetious remark having nothing to do with the Byrd murder --
"Did you hear about the Australian abortion clinic? There's a year long waiting
list!" Another simpleton comment regarding the KKK branch in Paris. Another
with only a reference to one of his non-existent URLs. Another which simply does
a kiss-ass to someone, and states the obvious that the Justice System is racist...
but does not address the fact that the DP in the Byrd case was certainly not a
sentence which could imply racism in the DP. And another one... totally laughable,
which argues the DP in 1608 as relevant to today's use of the DP. There is, in fact,
NO OUTRAGE from desi in respect to the MURDER... he doesn't really
CARE about Byrd being murdered, if it can be twisted into another form. There
is only his implication of racism in the DP... yet those murderers WERE sentenced
to the DP. And desi OPPOSES their execution. In fact desi has NEVER
discussed the murder itself, as to its horrendous nature. He has ALWAYS
USED that murder, to perpetrate a fraud. He has never spoken of racism
itself, outside of the context of calling the DP -- racist. You tell me one place
where he has spoken of the disenfranchised or the poverty, or the hopelessness,
or the despair of Blacks? All he has spoken of is intended to argue against
the DP, while ALWAYS presuming that Blacks are those who would rob him.
Little wonder that I find him to be a covert racist, hiding behind a rather
transparent facade.
Both the murder of James Byrd, and the sentences to the DP occurred
before my posting here. Yet both the murder and the sentences DID occur
while desi was posting here, quite vigorously. And it seems the murder
never concerned him, and the sentences to the DP were actually opposed
by him. Something I would never do. In point of fact those murders are
exactly what I have expressed over and over... the nature of racism in the
U.S. brought into brutal light. Often covert, always insidious. Here shown
in all its ugliness. Racism -- demonstrated in that murder in the most forceful
example one could possibly imagine.
Now --- you can look at two of my posts -- both as far back as 2000
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=2XqF5.2670%24uw4.112383%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net
"But my abiding concern for civil rights, above all other factors, tends to
shade my other conservative views. For too long, minorities have
stood in the shadow of the majority. This is a problem much more important
that the DP, abortion on-demand, or even violence in our society, combined.
For almost 140 years, it has been a cancer. And it continues as the most
destructive feature of our society. This must, and will, change. I've said this
before, but it needs repeating. I often reflect on how deeply my
generation has failed in this respect. I can only hope that following
generations can learn from the mistakes of my Father's generation as well
as my own." And --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=iEJF5.75490%24O95.6377564%40typhoon.tampabay.rr.com
A rather lengthy offering which expresses how I feel about
racist slurs... containing this remark --
"Civil Rights is a problem which festered for almost 300 years,
erupted for 5 years, festered for another 135 years, and continues
to this day to fester and destroy every human instinct of equality
of ALL humans. It disgusts me when I see comments such as yours
expressing the typical racial and social stereotypes, from your safe,
secure and insulated position of being "Whitey." It's larger than a
US disgrace... it's larger than a mankind disgrace... it's a disgrace,
and an insult to our maker."
Now both of those were before REAL racism erupted in
full force here, which has been FED by your obsession with
the _Great White Whale_. Your DEFENSE of racism
is totally disgusting. and actually would PERPETUATE
racism, in your denial of its force.
>But that wasn't what I found when looking for PV's name in those
>threads. In fact I have been unable to find a single example of PV
>ever mentioning James Byrd or anything relating to that case.
>
I have never mentioned it. I have always expressed outrage at racism
itself, and never found the need to mention James Byrd, since his
murderers were sentenced to the DP. Something I presume YOU
would oppose. So who between us, could be more closely associated
with the defense of those racist murderers? Someone who supports
the execution of those racist murderers, or someone who opposes
the execution of those racist murderers?
Exactly what was I supposed to say? That I OPPOSED the murderers
being sentenced to the DP? No... I leave that _argument_ to desi. In
point of fact, I was purposely not responding to that piece of vermin.
>Instead he posted a second reply to that challenge of Desmond's, this
>time calling Desmond a moron for asking such a question, which he (PV)
>described as "mindless drivel".
>
>url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=X4I_8.96226$XH.23...@twister.tampabay.rr.com
>
>Fortunately, not everyone ignored that poster's contribution about Mr
>Byrd. One other retentionist did reply, and condemned the racist
>murderers as animals. What a shame that PV, the self-proclaimed
>paragon of anti-racist principles who presumes himself fit to lecture
>everyone else about racism, couldn't bring himself to do the same.
>
>_______________
>
>NOTE: In anticipation of a rather predictable response, I should point
>out that I am already aware that five days before posting that reply
>to PV, the writer angered many people by overstepping the generally
>accepted rules of "netiquette". That may have given PV a reason to
>dislike the poster, but not to ignore the matter she had raised in her
>reply to him. I am also aware that PV described that poster as "one of
>the worst forms of vermin that infests our species" at about this
>time. But anyone considering that to be a good reason for ignoring her
>reply to PV about James Byrd should remember that PV has, many times,
>used similar language to describe Desmond, and yet still replies to
>almost his every post.
If you already knew then why did you presume I needed to respond?
Actually, she posted the name, address, phone number and door to
door directions to Richard's home. Presumably hoping someone might
take some PERSONAL ACT against him or his family. See --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=10b91a3a.0207141005.1e152a5%40posting.google.com
I find that form of behavior about as close to vermin as I can imagine.
Actually it was the reason I did not respond to her. I responded to
her one time, prior to her disclosing Richard's address, and have never
found her from that moment on to be worth anything more than a pile
of shit.
>I have added this note to hopefully thwart any attempt to obscure this
>matter by pretending that it is primarily concerned with "Mrs Emma
>Peel" (the poster in question). It is not about her, but about James
>Byrd.
It is certainly about HER, in respect to why I never remarked on her
comment.
John Rennie is right... when you stop defending racists and child-killers,
you might have something reasonable to say. But your obsession with
the _Great White Whale_ has actually caused you to become emotionally
unhinged.
Now, as to some of YOUR comments --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0210190921.266bc312%40posting.google.com
desi posted -- "not that Iraq has anything to do with al'Queda either,
other than that it's ruled by 'filthy ragheads'." You _defended_ those
words by saying --
"So clearly Desmond was not stating that Iraq was ruled by "filthy
ragheads" at all, but simply using that common pejorative term in an
ironic or sarcastic manner to attack those who do hold such views."
Ah, yes... the old _common pejorative_, which can EXCUSE all
sorts of behavior.
And then most recently --
url:http://www.google.com/groups?selm=21b1da28.0303040404.6ec39dbc%40posting.google.com
"Ask yourself why, if PV really was as anti-racist as he is trying to look, he
would spend his time ranting about it here, in a death penalty newsgroup
where racism is seldom even discussed, let alone displayed. He would be
posting these rants on some newsgroup used by the KKK or neo-nazis.
Or maybe he would post to a dedicated anti-racist newsgroup - I'm sure there
are many out there."
Apparently you do not appreciate posting anti-racism comments here.
Presumably you feel this is a group which should enjoy total freedom to
express racist comments as much as everyone feels like it, and no one
can remark on it being seen as both offensive and racist. Certainly that has
been your _defense_ for desi... and now seems to be the road that you
wish to travel.
PV
A Planet Visitor
<hysteria clipped>
Give it up, John... JPB will certainly continue to make an ass of himself
in respect to defending racism, regardless of what you say. He's an
obsessive fruitcake... and you and I both know why... although you'd
never admit it. But you know if you disagree with him too much... he'll
probably call you a "deathie," as another fruitcake did in HIS hysteria.
PV
Just passing by
I am not going to allow this one to be reduced to a flame-war. I will
happily respond to any factual errors you believe I have made but to
nothing else. What I will respond to are any errors you believe I have
made in respect of any dates that I have cited, any words I attribute
to you that you deny having written, any words of yours that you
believe I have presented out of context or any other such matters
relating to inaccuracies that can be proven with facts to be such.
In that regard I will now point out and correct one such error that I
made and that you obviously failed to spot.
I wrote: "...... but I have been looking only at the threads that
included such discussions since early 2000, when, as I understand, PV
began posting here ... and there are dozens of them."
Having since double-checked that I must now admit that it is
incorrect. The number of threads in question totals less than two
dozen and so I now happily withdraw the words "and there are dozens of
them" and apologise for that error. Although the error was
unintentional and not particularly significant, it is important to me
to correct it as I want any specific background information I provide
here to be beyond any dispute now or in the future.
What I will not be responding to are any unrelated matters, any rants
about goblins or similar and, of course, any spam.