Those poor, oppressed, hypocritical Americans
St.George
MARY JO WHITE, the United States Attorney for the Southern District of New
York, announced that JAY COHEN was convicted today in Manhattan federal
court after a two-week trial of operating a sports betting business that
illegally accepted bets and wagers on sporting events from Americans over
the Internet and telephones. COHEN was convicted of conspiracy to violate
the Wire Wager Act and seven substantive violations of the Wire Wager Act in
connection with his operation of World Sports Exchange ("WSE").
COHEN was the first defendant to stand trial in a series of Internet
offshore sports gambling cases that were the first prosecutions brought
under the federal Wire Wager Act. Ten defendants have previously pled
guilty.
At trial, the evidence demonstrated that Cohen, president of WSE, a
sports betting company located in Antigua, caused WSE to take bets on
various sporting events and contests from Americans. As the evidence at
trial demonstrated, among other things, COHEN solicited Americans to call
WSE through the use of toll-free 800 telephone numbers, and to contact WSE
via WSE's Internet website. The Wire Wager Act makes it a crime to, among
other things, use telephone lines in interstate or foreign commerce for the
placement of sportsbets, or for the transmission of information assisting in
the placing of bets on sporting events and contests. As demonstrated at
trial, through advertisements placed in various United States newspapers and
magazines, WSE invited customers from throughout the United States to
contact WSE by telephone or by Internet and open a sports betting account;
to wire transfer money to WSE to fund that account; and then to bet on
American sporting events and contests using that account.
<end excerpt>
Mr. Cohen, convicted in the above case, was yesterday sentenced to 21 months
imprisonment, and fined $5,000
This case is very interesting for two reasons.
(1) Firstly, it highlights the hypocrisy of the recent American whining
over the attempted action by France to restrict YahooUSA from offering
certain items for auction that contravened French law. Angry Yanks queued
up to stridently assert the sovereign right of nations to make and enforce
law within their own borders, and ask how dare France attempt to dictate,
and even criminalise, actions in the U.S. that are legal in the U.S.
It seems, unfortunately, that the Americans are slightly less reticent in
the farcical prosecution of people purely for actions not only in other
countries, but which are LEGAL in said country. In this case, Mr Cohen ran
a wholly LEGAL Antiguan bookmaker, and accepted bets on the Superbowl, among
other events, yet upon entering the U.S. later was promptly arrested and
imprisoned.
Looks like the U.S. has given up any moral right to whinge at the French for
attempting to stretch _their_ law overseas....
(2) This case also highlights the lack of freedoms endured by the
self-same Americans who criticise continental Europe (and even Great
Britain!) for same. So cowed by their leaders are they, that 'free'
U.S.citizens, with an opinion on the likely outcome of the Superbowl, must
risk FEDERAL PRISON to enhance their enjoyment of said event!
I am constantly amazed by the sheer level of ignorance of their own lack of
freedoms are those who so often crow about the lack of such elsewhere!
Still, such lack of self-awareness is manna to those oppressive governments
who wish to continue such oppression. Make no mistake, as the above case
demonstrates, this is no antiquated legal technicality - rather an actively
enforced and recently strengthened piece of federal legislation.
Even worse, though, is the further blatant hypocrisy that enables certain
forms of gambling to be criminalised in 49 states, when the 50th exists
virtually SOLELY on such 'immorality'!
It is a pathetic situation that such harsh federal laws can be passed,
preventing this supposedly society-destroying activity, but all such
legislation _specifically_ excludes Nevada!!
It's like passing a federal law against child-molesting, but excepting Iowa,
say!
Bloody hypocrites - either it's 'wrong' or it's not, but for the _federal_
authorities to discriminate in such a way between, say, residents of hotels
on either side of Lake Tahoe, is ridiculous beyond belief! It's stupid
enough when adjacent _states_ have different state laws on the same thing,
but I thought the whole point of federal law was to provide one law for the
whole nation....
blan...@my-deja.com
From the nation that brought us prohibition, what do we expect?
American's should realize that they are no more or less free than the
residents of any other mature democracy, and that it is all a matter of
degree and balancing different priorities.
Sincerely,
David.
----------------------------------------------------------
ius est ars boni et aqui
law is the art of the good and the just
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
JIGSAW1695
From: blan...@my-deja.com
Date: 8/17/00 1:11 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <8nfs4s$nus$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>
Sincerely,
David.
===============================
A profund commentary on the death penalty. It really gets to the heart of the
matter.
Jigsaw
John Rennie
"JIGSAW1695" <jigsa...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000817021754...@ng-fb1.aol.com...
I have stated before Jiggy, you are very quick to chide
ant-dpers for being off topic but when it comes to Kool and and his many
aliases you not only refuse to condemn, you join in. While we are off
topic again, it isn't it about time you and the rest of your ugly friends
(sic) stopped the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some sort of
perverted pleasure from this exercise, the rest of us dont.
Desmond Coughlan
[snip]
} I have stated before Jiggy, you are very quick to chide
} ant-dpers for being off topic but when it comes to Kool and and his many
} aliases you not only refuse to condemn, you join in. While we are off
} topic again, it isn't it about time you and the rest of your ugly friends
} (sic) stopped the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some sort of
} perverted pleasure from this exercise, the rest of us dont.
Thanks for the support, John, but in fact, Jigsaw, Drewl (and his
personae such as desisixtx, becky, david_mcdonald, billybob etc.)
are in my Score file as -9999. That means that I don't even see
their posts before slrn hoses them for me.
Bliss ...
--
**********************************************************************
* Desmond Coughlan Network Engineer Forum des Images Paris *
* dcou...@vdp.fr http://www.forumdesimages.net/ (01) 44.76.62.29 *
* PGP Public Key: http://www.coughlan.net/desmond/pgp/pubring.pkr *
**********************************************************************
JIGSAW1695
Date: 8/17/00 3:21 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <8nhe1j$m11$1...@newsg3.svr.pol.co.uk>
I have stated before Jiggy, you are very quick to chide
ant-dpers for being off topic but when it comes to Kool and and his many
aliases you not only refuse to condemn, you join in. While we are off
topic again, it isn't it about time you and the rest of your ugly friends
(sic) stopped the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some sort of
perverted pleasure from this exercise, the rest of us dont.
===============================
As I said before John, Desi said we "shoot the niggers" in America.
I demanded that he apologize for his racist statement. He did not. He will
not.
I have read several comments made by the anti DPers , especially Europeans,
about racism in the US, but no one,...no one... not even you... brought up
Desi's comment about shooting "niggers".
So I will ask you directly John, to condemn Desi with the same vigor that you
often condemn Don Kool for his stand.
If not, does that qualify you as being a self-rightious hypocrite??
As for Don Kool, I have sent him several messages via E-mail complaining
directly to him. that is all I can do. And I think that he has mellowed over
the past year or two.
Regarding ".....the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some sort of
perverted pleasure from this exercise....."
I gotta tell you John, I dont consider condemning Desi's racist remark as a
"peverted pleasure".
All Desi has to do is apologize for his "nigger" remark and he might do it with
a little prompting from those of us who oppose racism and have acted against it
with more than words.
Do you have the courage to make that request of him, John???? Or are you going
to just sit there and write message to a NG that only a few impassioned people
read condemning the same racism in others that you refuse to condemn in Dezi.
Jigsaw
John Rennie
Whilst you were away in NYC (got it right this time) I vigourously defended
you against the charge of being a racist nearly half a dozen (er . . that
means six) posts were exchanged with Desmond. I finally got him to admit
that you were a racist because you supported the DP - I asked him if all
other retentionists were racists - no reply to this one. During the
course of this exchange I asked him to produce one post from you where you
had made a racist remark - no reply again.
Now be careful Jiggy old dear, I am about the only anti -dper friend you
have on this ng (not quite true, there are one or two others but we are
diminishing fast) so you had better treat me gently. Knock off the
nonsense with Desmond. If he wants to play 'silly buggers' let him be.
blan...@my-deja.com
jigsa...@aol.com (JIGSAW1695) wrote:
> ==================================
> I have stated before Jiggy, you are very quick to chide
> ant-dpers for being off topic but when it comes to Kool and and his
many
> aliases you not only refuse to condemn, you join in. While we are
off
> topic again, it isn't it about time you and the rest of your ugly
friends
> (sic) stopped the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some
sort of
> perverted pleasure from this exercise, the rest of us dont.
>
> ===============================
> As I said before John, Desi said we "shoot the niggers" in America.
>
> I demanded that he apologize for his racist statement. He did not.
He will
> not.
This occured before my return to the newsgroup, so I have done a little
digging on deja, finding this post by Desmond:
06/19/2000
This is Jigsaw you're talking to, Dave ... you missed one: you can whip
out your legally held firearm (they'll take ma gun off me when they pry
it outta ma cold, dead fingers!!), exercise your right to self-defence
and shoot a nigger. You won't be prosecuted, hell, if he hadn't benn
black, ah wouldna ha' to shoot 'im, goddamit ...
> I have read several comments made by the anti DPers , especially
Europeans,
> about racism in the US, but no one,...no one... not even you...
brought up
> Desi's comment about shooting "niggers".
Indeed? In that very same thread, Dave Proctor, who I believe is
largely anti-death penalty in his stance, posted, on the same day:
That is not even remotely funny, Desmond.
Sounds like condemnation to me, Jigsaw.
And, as I have only just found out about this comment, let me add my
rebuke. It is not funny, Desmond, to use that word, even in jest. It
is in terrible bad taste, and well beneath you. In fact, I'll go a
little further than that - you claim that Jigsaw is a racist, yet
proffer no proof for that assertion other than the fact that he
supports the death penalty that is inherently racist. Please provide a
concrete example of Jigsaws direct racism, or stop claiming that he is
one. And never, ever, use the "N" word in this forum, even, no
especially if you are attributing it to someone else without the merest
shred of proof.
> So I will ask you directly John, to condemn Desi with the same vigor
that you
> often condemn Don Kool for his stand.
Kool does not have a stand, Jigsaw, he is a troll who gets his jollies
out of posting bilious garbage under various guises AND, it would seem,
by impersonating Desmond at times, along with other members of his
family. You damn well should at least ignore him. Condemnation would
be preferable, but you encourage the sod.
> If not, does that qualify you as being a self-rightious hypocrite??
>
> As for Don Kool, I have sent him several messages via E-mail
complaining
> directly to him. that is all I can do. And I think that he has
mellowed over
> the past year or two.
Mellowed as in stopped posting under Desmond's name, you mean. I read
a post of his to Shona the other week that was as nasty as any I've
seen. He is a mysoginistic insult to the human race, and should be
treated with the disapprobation he so richly deserves. You can
certainly do more than just complain privately. You may have noticed
quite a rash of emails to Desmond recently when he stepped over the
line, and also to Florian, by anti-DP posters. But I've never seen a
criticism of Kool by any member of his own side.
> Regarding ".....the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some
sort of
> perverted pleasure from this exercise....."
> I gotta tell you John, I dont consider condemning Desi's racist
remark as a
> "peverted pleasure".
Ah, but you go a little further than that, unless Desmond is lying.
Tell us, did you try to get him fired of late by bombarding his boss
with complaints?
> All Desi has to do is apologize for his "nigger" remark and he might
do it with
> a little prompting from those of us who oppose racism and have acted
against it
> with more than words.
OK - Desmond - apologise for your innappropriate remark. It is never
acceptable to use that word, as it causes untold offence. No excuses,
just do it.
> Do you have the courage to make that request of him, John???? Or are
you going
> to just sit there and write message to a NG that only a few
impassioned people
> read condemning the same racism in others that you refuse to condemn
in Dezi.
How about you, Jigsaw, the next time on of your side makes an
innapropriate post, will you condemn? Somehow, I doubt it.
Lucas Stults
> This is Jigsaw you're talking to, Dave ... you missed one: you can whip
> out your legally held firearm (they'll take ma gun off me when they pry
> it outta ma cold, dead fingers!!), exercise your right to self-defence
> and shoot a nigger. You won't be prosecuted, hell, if he hadn't benn
> black, ah wouldna ha' to shoot 'im, goddamit ...
Ah, the stupidest of the Davids chooses to elucidate us with his
boundless idiocy, yet again...
S Moir
I don't blame you for being sore about being called a racist for such a
nonsense reason. I'm sorry if you feel that we should have all jumped in and
defended you. John certainly did.
I didn't, mainly because it seemed to be part of an ongoing "thing" between
yourself and Desmond, which i felt I had no right to be getting involved in
as a newcomer.
I join with everyone else in asking Desmond to stop this, and agree that the
n word is a no-no.
By the same token, an awful lot of posters were conspicuous in their absence
when i got the following post from don. (i've attached it in it's raving
entirity so that you can fully appreciate it). One thing to note before you
read it; the three word line which reads "no, it's not" is all I posted-
this was to stop don from bullying Marek into thinking that he couldn't
discuss dp in Cz. All that follows after is don's own work.
I did get support, which I was very grateful for, from three of the "regs"
here, which made me understand don is only here to push buttons, so I no
longer bother with him, but I'm surprised that you say he has a stand- and
if he has mellowed over the past year or two I shudder to think of what he
was like beforehand.
Anyway, I'm straying from the point- if you want people to protest the more
outrageous personal attacks that seems to be fine with most folks, as long
as it happens on both "sides". St George has said just about the same thing
on one of the other threads.
Yours
Shona
=====================================================
> > > Does not. Death penalty can not be given in CZ since 1990.
> >
> > Mark, the topic of this newsgroup is the just Death Penalty in the
> > United States (the greatest country on the face of the Earth, BTW),
> > no in CZ.
> No, it's not
Actually it is my tall enough to set a beer on her head while she
sucks my cock young murderer lover friend.
You're four foot and shit plus young enough to be deceived my young
eurotrash murderer lover friend. The only thing you now about
proven murderers is that you want to knee walk in the steps of
proven murderer lover karen richey and swallow as much proven
murderer cum as possible. As somone who loves you with the spirit
of Jesus Christ, I am here (as an ordained minister and as your
friend and mentor) to tell you that what you are planning is not
only wrong but blasphemeous. Do what you and your proven murderer
friend wish to do but do it swiftly and without remore for thine is
the power the glory and the power Amen and Again and Agin and
Againn.....................
Yours in Christ,
Don
JIGSAW1695
From: "John Rennie" Jo...@rennie.2000.greatxscape.net
Message-id: <8nhlif$fu$1...@news5.svr.pol.co.uk>
"JIGSAW1695" <jigsa...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000817163106...@ng-ca1.aol.com...
>
> ===============================
> As I said before John, Desi said we "shoot the niggers" in America.
>
> I demanded that he apologize for his racist statement. He did not. He
will
> not.
>
> I have read several comments made by the anti DPers , especially
Europeans,
> about racism in the US, but no one,...no one... not even you... brought up
> Desi's comment about shooting "niggers".
>
> So I will ask you directly John, to condemn Desi with the same vigor that
you
> often condemn Don Kool for his stand.
>
> If not, does that qualify you as being a self-rightious hypocrite??
>
> As for Don Kool, I have sent him several messages via E-mail complaining
> directly to him. that is all I can do. And I think that he has mellowed
over
> the past year or two.
>
> Regarding ".....the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some sort of
> perverted pleasure from this exercise....."
> I gotta tell you John, I dont consider condemning Desi's racist remark as
a
> "peverted pleasure".
>
> All Desi has to do is apologize for his "nigger" remark and he might do it
with
> a little prompting from those of us who oppose racism and have acted
against it
> with more than words.
>
> Do you have the courage to make that request of him, John???? Or are you
going
> to just sit there and write message to a NG that only a few impassioned
people
> read condemning the same racism in others that you refuse to condemn in
Dezi.
>
>
> Jigsaw
=======================================
Whilst you were away in NYC (got it right this time) I vigourously defended
you against the charge of being a racist nearly half a dozen (er . . that
means six) posts were exchanged with Desmond. I finally got him to admit
that you were a racist because you supported the DP - I asked him if all
other retentionists were racists - no reply to this one. During the
course of this exchange I asked him to produce one post from you where you
had made a racist remark - no reply again.
Now be careful Jiggy old dear, I am about the only anti -dper friend you
have on this ng (not quite true, there are one or two others but we are
diminishing fast) so you had better treat me gently. Knock off the
nonsense with Desmond. If he wants to play 'silly buggers' let him be.
==============================
<<sigh> I guess you are right.. but it still irks me to no end that a
no-account bloody little grub like Desi has the balls to accuse some one of
racism without facts and then use racist comments himself.
Oh well,,.,,,, your right...but still....
JIGSAW1695
Date: 8/17/00 9:56 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <170820001956079944%stu...@ebold.com>
===============================
Desi wrote the above paragraph starting with "This is Jigsaw your talking to
Dave....
.... Shoot a nigger..." which I found offensive.
Jigsaw
Dave Proctor
news:170820001956079944%stu...@ebold.com...
> In article <8nhp8b$vpo$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, <blan...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > This is Jigsaw you're talking to, Dave ... you missed one: you can whip
> > out your legally held firearm (they'll take ma gun off me when they pry
> > it outta ma cold, dead fingers!!), exercise your right to self-defence
> > and shoot a nigger. You won't be prosecuted, hell, if he hadn't benn
> > black, ah wouldna ha' to shoot 'im, goddamit ...
>
> Ah, the stupidest of the Davids chooses to elucidate us with his
> boundless idiocy, yet again...
The only thing stupid that David did was not enclosing it in quotation
marks. This was written by Desmond.
--
Dave
Studies have shown that if your parents did not have any children, you
probably won't either.
A Planet Visitor
a racist, let me repeat part of a post from him, on 8/3/00 9:43
AM: Quote:
*I use the métro at all hours of the day. I ride my bike to work
and back ... not once have I had a revolver stuck in my face,
accompanied by the eloquent words, 'Gimme da dough,
mothafucka o ah toast yo ass !!'*
Now any thinking person would recognize this statement for
what it is. Putting a face to robbery. I never received any
comment from Desmond concerning this obviously racially
motivated post, nor do I expect one, because when the bottom
line is reached, it is obviously that Desmond is not only biased
against the US, but is also biased against a certain segment of
the US society. His obvious attempts to cover up this prejudice,
by screaming just the opposite, is simply as transparent as
his entire persona.
Dave Proctor <dap...@spambait.ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:Ho1n5.3084$ug2....@news5.giganews.com...
blan...@my-deja.com
Lucas Stults <stu...@ebold.com> wrote:
> In article <8nhp8b$vpo$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, <blan...@my-deja.com>
wrote:
>
> > This is Jigsaw you're talking to, Dave ... you missed one: you can
whip
> > out your legally held firearm (they'll take ma gun off me when they
pry
> > it outta ma cold, dead fingers!!), exercise your right to self-
defence
> > and shoot a nigger. You won't be prosecuted, hell, if he hadn't benn
> > black, ah wouldna ha' to shoot 'im, goddamit ...
>
> Ah, the stupidest of the Davids chooses to elucidate us with his
> boundless idiocy, yet again...
And, once again, Lucas chooses not to read the entire post before
opening his mouth. That's if you're not being deliberately
misleading. The above quote is by one Desmond Coughlan, and there
follows a long paragraph, this time actually by me, taking him to task
for it. Tell me, Lucas, when was the last time you added something
constructive to this discussion here.
blan...@my-deja.com
"Dave Proctor" <dap...@spambait.ozemail.com.au> wrote:
> "Lucas Stults" <stu...@ebold.com> wrote in message
> news:170820001956079944%stu...@ebold.com...
> > In article <8nhp8b$vpo$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, <blan...@my-deja.com>
wrote:
> >
> > > This is Jigsaw you're talking to, Dave ... you missed one: you
can whip
> > > out your legally held firearm (they'll take ma gun off me when
they pry
> > > it outta ma cold, dead fingers!!), exercise your right to self-
defence
> > > and shoot a nigger. You won't be prosecuted, hell, if he hadn't
benn
> > > black, ah wouldna ha' to shoot 'im, goddamit ...
> >
> > Ah, the stupidest of the Davids chooses to elucidate us with his
> > boundless idiocy, yet again...
>
> The only thing stupid that David did was not enclosing it in quotation
> marks. This was written by Desmond.
> --
While it might have been wiser to use quotation marks, given the
average IQ of the nutter element here, it wasn't really strictly
necessary, as I placed it in a seperate paragraph, headed by a notation
to the effect that it was posted by Desmond on 06/19/200. This is
normally sufficient to avoid confusion, all of which is besides the
point, because Lucas deliberately tried to make it look like I'd made
the remark, a ploy that fooled, I'm sure, no-one.
blan...@my-deja.com
As you had every right to, a fact which I agreed with in my post
earlier today. Desmond stepped out of line on that one, and deserved
to be slapped down for it. Had I been around then, I would have told
him so, as Dave Proctor did at the time. Incidentally, are you
planning to respond to anything I raised earlier, or just ignore it
like you do all the difficult questions?
blan...@my-deja.com
"S Moir" <smsc...@cableinet.co.uk> wrote:
> By the same token, an awful lot of posters were conspicuous in their
absence
> when i got the following post from don. (i've attached it in it's
raving
> entirity so that you can fully appreciate it). One thing to note
before you
> read it; the three word line which reads "no, it's not" is all I
posted-
> this was to stop don from bullying Marek into thinking that he
couldn't
> discuss dp in Cz. All that follows after is don's own work.
> I did get support, which I was very grateful for, from three of
the "regs"
> here, which made me understand don is only here to push buttons, so I
no
> longer bother with him, but I'm surprised that you say he has a stand-
and
> if he has mellowed over the past year or two I shudder to think of
what he
> was like beforehand.
That was the post I was talking about, Shona. It was quite the most
despicable personal attack I've ever seen on usenet, and deserved to be
roundly condemned on all sides. Sadly, only a few of us bothered. It
was that post that led, a short while later, to our successful
moratorium on the bilious reverend's bile spewing posts, since when
he's had hardly anyone to engage in dialogue with.
In a way, I'm quite pleased he posted that - it certainly painted him
in his true colors far better than anyone else ever could. What I'm
sorry about is that a decent, honest, and thoroughly nice person like
yourself had to be the recipient. You certainly don't deserve it.
> Anyway, I'm straying from the point- if you want people to protest
the more
> outrageous personal attacks that seems to be fine with most folks, as
long
> as it happens on both "sides". St George has said just about the same
thing
> on one of the other threads.
Never a truer word spoken. Robust discussion here is all very well,
but when someone steps over the line, there should be universal
criticism of that individual. This applies to both sides of the
discussion. I'd be willing to bet no-one can come up with a post from
a death penalty supporter that is actually critical of something one of
their own said, even where it is as vile as Kook's posting.
<McDonald's sickening rant snipped on grounds of decency. No-one needs
to read that twice in one day>
JIGSAW1695
Date: 8/18/00 12:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <8nicbq$klm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>
===============================
Sorry...I got lost with all of this.... ask it again please.
Jigsaw
blan...@my-deja.com
Here is my earlier, post, Jigsaw. With added quotation marks so Lucas
doesn't get all confused again.
In article <8nhp8b$vpo$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
blan...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <20000817163106...@ng-ca1.aol.com>,
> jigsa...@aol.com (JIGSAW1695) wrote:
>
> > ==================================
> > I have stated before Jiggy, you are very quick to chide
> > ant-dpers for being off topic but when it comes to Kool and and his
> many
> > aliases you not only refuse to condemn, you join in. While we are
> off
> > topic again, it isn't it about time you and the rest of your ugly
> friends
> > (sic) stopped the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some
> sort of
> > perverted pleasure from this exercise, the rest of us dont.
> >
> > ===============================
> > As I said before John, Desi said we "shoot the niggers" in America.
> >
> > I demanded that he apologize for his racist statement. He did not.
> He will
> > not.
>
> This occured before my return to the newsgroup, so I have done a
little
> digging on deja, finding this post by Desmond:
>
> 06/19/2000
>
> "This is Jigsaw you're talking to, Dave ... you missed one: you can
whip
> out your legally held firearm (they'll take ma gun off me when they
pry
> it outta ma cold, dead fingers!!), exercise your right to self-defence
> and shoot a nigger. You won't be prosecuted, hell, if he hadn't benn
> black, ah wouldna ha' to shoot 'im, goddamit ..."
>
> > I have read several comments made by the anti DPers , especially
> Europeans,
> > about racism in the US, but no one,...no one... not even you...
> brought up
> > Desi's comment about shooting "niggers".
>
> Indeed? In that very same thread, Dave Proctor, who I believe is
> largely anti-death penalty in his stance, posted, on the same day:
>
> That is not even remotely funny, Desmond.
>
> Sounds like condemnation to me, Jigsaw.
>
> And, as I have only just found out about this comment, let me add my
> rebuke. It is not funny, Desmond, to use that word, even in jest. It
> is in terrible bad taste, and well beneath you. In fact, I'll go a
> little further than that - you claim that Jigsaw is a racist, yet
> proffer no proof for that assertion other than the fact that he
> supports the death penalty that is inherently racist. Please provide
a
> concrete example of Jigsaws direct racism, or stop claiming that he is
> one. And never, ever, use the "N" word in this forum, even, no
> especially if you are attributing it to someone else without the
merest
> shred of proof.
>
> > So I will ask you directly John, to condemn Desi with the same
vigor
> that you
> > often condemn Don Kool for his stand.
>
> Kool does not have a stand, Jigsaw, he is a troll who gets his jollies
> out of posting bilious garbage under various guises AND, it would
seem,
> by impersonating Desmond at times, along with other members of his
> family. You damn well should at least ignore him. Condemnation would
> be preferable, but you encourage the sod.
>
> > If not, does that qualify you as being a self-rightious hypocrite??
> >
> > As for Don Kool, I have sent him several messages via E-mail
> complaining
> > directly to him. that is all I can do. And I think that he has
> mellowed over
> > the past year or two.
>
> Mellowed as in stopped posting under Desmond's name, you mean. I read
> a post of his to Shona the other week that was as nasty as any I've
> seen. He is a mysoginistic insult to the human race, and should be
> treated with the disapprobation he so richly deserves. You can
> certainly do more than just complain privately. You may have noticed
> quite a rash of emails to Desmond recently when he stepped over the
> line, and also to Florian, by anti-DP posters. But I've never seen a
> criticism of Kool by any member of his own side.
>
> > Regarding ".....the silly persecution of Desmond. You may get some
> sort of
> > perverted pleasure from this exercise....."
> > I gotta tell you John, I dont consider condemning Desi's racist
> remark as a
> > "peverted pleasure".
>
> Ah, but you go a little further than that, unless Desmond is lying.
> Tell us, did you try to get him fired of late by bombarding his boss
> with complaints?
>
> > All Desi has to do is apologize for his "nigger" remark and he might
> do it with
> > a little prompting from those of us who oppose racism and have acted
> against it
> > with more than words.
>
> OK - Desmond - apologise for your innappropriate remark. It is never
> acceptable to use that word, as it causes untold offence. No excuses,
> just do it.
>
> > Do you have the courage to make that request of him, John???? Or are
> you going
> > to just sit there and write message to a NG that only a few
> impassioned people
> > read condemning the same racism in others that you refuse to condemn
> in Dezi.
>
> How about you, Jigsaw, the next time on of your side makes an
> innapropriate post, will you condemn? Somehow, I doubt it.
>
S Moir
<blan...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8nicsl$l9c$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Thanks David-
I'm no saint, and can say some terrible things in the heat of the moment-
when I do I can understand getting a nasty reply back, and once I've cooled
down I have no problem with admitting that i was wrong and eating humble
pie.
But there is nasty and there is deranged- and yes, I'm glad he posted it
too, as it let everyone see what the distinction between nasty and deranged
can mean. The moratorium certainly seems to be working, so the incident had
a happy ending.
Apologies to all for reposting it- I just thought that if jigsaw read it he
would understand that there have been below-the-belt blows on both sides,
but I don't know if he even bothered to read it- once again no-one who
shares don's side of the debate has bothered to pass comment.
So come on Jigsaw- human nature means that, in any mix of people, there will
always be personalities that clash and folk who will just never like each
other, so why not just draw a line in the sand, shrug your shoulders and
leave it be.
Lifes too short and all that.......
Shona
Larry Smith
"St.George" <st_george99@***hotmail.com> wrote in message
Essentially, I agree with everything you say.
John Rennie
I am sure I would have strongly defended you as wel
but as I have long kilfiled Kool I didn't see the original attack. This is
the best way to ignore him. However study of his mail to you and the
attacks on Desmond which of course being Desi he repeats in full, certainly
do reveal a character with sexual hangups. He obviously does get vicarious
thrills out of his posts which suggests that he has a most unsatisfactory
sex life (I won't say love life, love is an emotion denied to such people).
S Moir
"John Rennie" <Jo...@rennie.2000.greatxscape.net> wrote in message
news:8njlr8$dor$1...@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
don't worry John- i did think afterwards that a lot of people probably
didn't see it due to killfile- I've just got the hang of that function and
now see what it can do.
It's great- it totally deletes irritants, until a balloon like me reposts
it- sorry!
Now that I am getting into the ways of this ng I realise that most of the
regs here are good people with things worth saying- I won't get my underwear
in a twist over what happened.
All water under the troll's bridge, and I won't go trip-trapping again!
Shona
Shane in UK....
jigsa...@aol.com says...
> Desi wrote the above paragraph starting with "This is Jigsaw your talking to
> Dave....
> .... Shoot a n*****..." which I found offensive.
>
> Jigsaw
>
For $deitys sake Jiggy, Don't keep posting the n word. Desmond may
have well wrote it but if you keep perpetuating it makes you as bad as
Desmond is.
--
Rev. Shane
"Personally I don't approve of the blasphemous fake ordinations you
have applied for."
"Rev" Don Kool 03.08.2000 on alt.activism.death-penalty.
Anti Death Penalty Supporter.
Shane in UK....
abc...@abc.com says...
> In case anyone has any illusions about Desmond NOT being
> a racist, let me repeat part of a post from him, on 8/3/00 9:43
> AM: Quote:
>
> *I use the métro at all hours of the day. I ride my bike to work
> and back ... not once have I had a revolver stuck in my face,
> accompanied by the eloquent words, 'Gimme da dough,
> mothafucka o ah toast yo ass !!'*
>
> Now any thinking person would recognize this statement for
> what it is. Putting a face to robbery. I never received any
> comment from Desmond concerning this obviously racially
> motivated post, nor do I expect one, because when the bottom
> line is reached, it is obviously that Desmond is not only biased
> against the US, but is also biased against a certain segment of
> the US society. His obvious attempts to cover up this prejudice,
> by screaming just the opposite, is simply as transparent as
> his entire persona.
With respect there PV, Desmond is not just carping on about a "A
segment of the US Society." It goes against the grain in *ANY*
society.
A Planet Visitor
Shane in UK.... <evilmo...@yahoo.co.uk > wrote in message
news:MPG.140831661...@news.btinternet.com...
> > a racist, let me repeat part of a post from him, on 8/3/00 9:43
> > AM: Quote:
> >
> > *I use the métro at all hours of the day. I ride my bike to work
> > and back ... not once have I had a revolver stuck in my face,
> > accompanied by the eloquent words, 'Gimme da dough,
> > mothafucka o ah toast yo ass !!'*
> >
> > Now any thinking person would recognize this statement for
> > what it is. Putting a face to robbery. I never received any
> > comment from Desmond concerning this obviously racially
> > motivated post, nor do I expect one, because when the bottom
> > line is reached, it is obviously that Desmond is not only biased
> > against the US, but is also biased against a certain segment of
> > the US society. His obvious attempts to cover up this prejudice,
> > by screaming just the opposite, is simply as transparent as
> > his entire persona.
>
> segment of the US Society." It goes against the grain in *ANY*
> society.
>
segment of the US Society," when he employs words easily
recognized by any American as having a distinctly racist undertone.
See it for WHAT it is, and not what you would like to BELIEVE
it is. I find it impossible to believe that Desmond DID NOT see
what he was saying as anything less than racial in intent, regardless
of how unenlightened you may believe he is as to prejudical,
bigoted, and racially identifiable mouthings. If he had simply
said, "All right MF, give me all your dough," no question would
have been raised as to his meaning. But if you say the words, you
have to understand the implication, and pay the piper for uttering
such garbage.
JIGSAW1695
Date: 8/19/00 1:48 PM Eastern Daylight Time
Message-id: <MPG.1408306fa...@news.btinternet.com>
In article <20000817221228...@ng-ce1.aol.com>,
jigsa...@aol.com says...
> Desi wrote the above paragraph starting with "This is Jigsaw your talking to
> Dave....
> .... Shoot a n*****..." which I found offensive.
>
> Jigsaw
>
For $deitys sake Jiggy, Don't keep posting the n word. Desmond may
have well wrote it but if you keep perpetuating it makes you as bad as
Desmond is.
=============================
I'm posting a quote, and it is always in response to a comment. However, a
truce of somewhat has been engineered and agreed to go along with it provided
it is bi-lateral.
Jigsaw
Shane in UK....
abc...@abc.com says...
> > With respect there PV, Desmond is not just carping on about a "A
> > segment of the US Society." It goes against the grain in *ANY*
> > society.
> >
> With respect there Shane, Desmond IS just carping about "A
> segment of the US Society," when he employs words easily
> recognized by any American as having a distinctly racist undertone.
> See it for WHAT it is, and not what you would like to BELIEVE
> it is. I find it impossible to believe that Desmond DID NOT see
> what he was saying as anything less than racial in intent, regardless
> of how unenlightened you may believe he is as to prejudical,
> bigoted, and racially identifiable mouthings. If he had simply
> said, "All right MF, give me all your dough," no question would
> have been raised as to his meaning. But if you say the words, you
> have to understand the implication, and pay the piper for uttering
> such garbage.
>
Good point there PV, That was one thing I hadn't considered.
The use of such words I feel is inflammatory and could be well done
without in these circumstances. However, Usenet is a free medium to
whatever country uses it. As far as racist and wierd views on life are
concerned, what about the French trying to censor Yahoo!? Now if that
is fuckwitted, I don't know what is.
Shane
Shane in UK....
jigsa...@aol.com says...
:-)
Desmond Coughlan
[snip]
} > For $deitys sake Jiggy, Don't keep posting the n word. Desmond may
} > have well wrote it but if you keep perpetuating it makes you as bad as
} > Desmond is.
} > I'm posting a quote, and it is always in response to a comment. However, a
} > truce of somewhat has been engineered and agreed to go along with it provided
} > it is bi-lateral.
} Righto Jiggy, no more to be said about it for the time being then!
A truce ?
Who said anything about a truce ?
Actuaally, I'm just eaten an a lovely chinese restorant, with los of
red wine ... so anytone who wants a teuce ... theyt can ave it !!!
youre all wonderful !!!
:-))
--
**********************************************************************
* Desmond Coughlan Network Engineer Forum des Images Paris *
* dcou...@vdp.fr http://www.forumdesimages.net/ (01) 44.76.62.29 *
* PGP Public Key: http://www.coughlan.net/desmond/pgp/pubring.pkr *
**********************************************************************
A Planet Visitor
Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net> wrote in message
news:slrn8q8ka7....@lievre.voute.net...
> On Wed, 23 Aug 2000 18:33:38 +0100, Shane in UK....
<evilmo...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> [snip]
>
> } > For $deitys sake Jiggy, Don't keep posting the n word. Desmond may
> } > have well wrote it but if you keep perpetuating it makes you as bad as
> } > Desmond is.
>
> } > I'm posting a quote, and it is always in response to a comment.
However, a
> } > truce of somewhat has been engineered and agreed to go along with it
provided
> } > it is bi-lateral.
>
> } Righto Jiggy, no more to be said about it for the time being then!
>
> A truce ?
>
> Who said anything about a truce ?
>
> Actuaally, I'm just eaten an a lovely chinese restorant, with los of
> red wine ... so anytone who wants a teuce ... theyt can ave it !!!
>
> youre all wonderful !!!
>
> :-))
right now, if I didn't have to put down my beer to do so.
A PV