When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because of the "frequency" of release...

[Arlen _G_ Holder]

When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because of the "frequency" of release...
o I will point them to this factual post from today on iOS newsgroups

On Sat, 19 Oct 2019 09:03:48 -0700, sms wrote:

> <https://www.zdnet.com/article/ios-13-1-3-brings-a-bunch-of-bug-fixes-to-iphone-and-ipad-but-no-relief-for-calls-and-battery-bugs/>.
> I guess I will upgrade from 13.1.2 to 13.1.3, but I'm hoping that the
> dropped call problem gets fixed in a subsequent release not too far in
> the future.

Hi Steve,

I'm going to express an "adult" concept about iOS "frequency of release".
o Particularly since iOS 13 has clearly been frequently released

Always keep in mind my strategic goal is to bring TRUTH & REASON here
O Where I combat the idiocy of the apologists - with facts.

One FACT that the apologists love to latch upon
o Is that they feel the FREQUENCY of release of iOS somehow, in and of
itself, "protects" them (e.g., from security flaws)

The adult fact is that the "frequency" of iOS release, in and of itself,
does absolutely nothing, in and of itself, to protect against security
flaws.

In fact, it can easily be argued that Apple cares more about iOS schedule
o Than iOS quality

Since we KNOW of examples where Apple shipped clearly flawed releases
o KNOWING FULL WELL they were hugely flawed

Apple did it with iOS 10.x (broadcom issues)
o And Apple did it with the first release of iOS 13.0
(There were security hole Apple confirmed existed - way back in July!)

In these cases, it's a FACT Apple _still_ shipped insecure iOS releases
o That they _knew_ were insecure at the time they shipped them

Clearly, they _knew_ iOS 13 was _less_ secure than iOS 12
o And yet, Apple _still_ shipped the iOS diarrhea on schedule

The point here is clear:
o Apologists incessantly claim that the FREQUENCY of release protects them

And yet, it's a diarrhea of releases.

Hence, Steve, there's a strategic REASON I use that term for iOS.
o It's to bring TRUTH to this iOS newsgroup about what iOS really is.

HINT:
o The mere frequency of release provides NOTHING of any inherent value.

It's the QUALITY of the release that matters, Steve
o Not the frequency.

> It doesn't seem to be an issue in very strong signal areas so I'm
> postulating that there was some change in 13.1.2 that changed the
> minimum signal level that the phone deems adequate to not disconnect a
> call, even then the signal actually is sufficient to maintain a connection.

This is good to know where there are always details in the flaws Apple
misses in QA testing.

It's clear Apple has never done sufficient testing of iOS
o In real-world conditions

There are so many proofs of this that I don't need to quote them.
o Google recently proved beyond question iOS was untested, for years.

And Apple did NOT dispute that Google proved iOS was untested
o Apple just didn't like the way Google said it.

--
Bringing factual truth and adult logic to the Apple newsgroups.

[Arlen _G_ Holder]

On Fri, 25 Oct 2019 08:56:51 -0700, sms wrote:

>> Is it safe to update to the new iOS yet? Is it even worth it?
>
> According to "Cult of Mac" 13.2 may be out as early as next week
> <https://www.cultofmac.com/660640/ios-13-2-launch-date-beats-solo-pro/>.
> But it's probably safe to upgrade. I guess there will be no 13.1.4 if
> 13.2 is coming out soon.

Hi Steve,

FACTS:

I write facts and logic and sensible thought processes.
o Where the proof what iOS is, is shown below - using facts & logic

As you're likely well aware, I update my iOS when it's needed, where, I
first learned that Apple cares not about testing iOS in the real world when
I moved my first iPad from iOS 7.0.0 to iOS 7.0.1.

You'd think that tiny of a move wouldn't change much...
o And yet, it broke millions of connections in the real world

Going to Apple's web site, I learned, first hand what Apple thinks
o The real world is "not supported"

Hence, I learned for the rest of my iPads to never update the iOS release.
o I also kept track of what Apple says they do versus what Apple does

I've noticed what reporters noticed, which is that Apple ships poop
o That they _know_ is crap.

While iOS 13.0 is a well-documented recent case, there is more poop
o Remember, Apple _confirmed_ the iOS 13 fatal flaws way back in July

*And Apple shipped iOS 13.0 poop anyway* ... to millions of customers.

If that poop didn't show Apple cares more about schedule than quality
o Remember the even worse BroadPwn Broadcom 10.3.1 & 10.3.3 fiasco

Apple had the BroadPwn Broadcom fix in hand (CVE-2017-3544)!
o And yet, Apple _still_ shipped iOS 10.x poop on schedule!

Virtually begging people to replace it only 10 days later, Steve.

Steve - you usually comprehend facts (not always, but usually).
o You don't have to characterize iOS as "poop" like I do

But you do have to realize Apple ships "it"
o Even when Apple _knows_ it to be poop.

--
Assessment of fact indicates Apple cares more about schedule than quality.

[Arlen _G_ Holder]

As you know, I've studied the Apple Apologists.
o Particularly how they relate iPhones to Android.

Hence, I can PREDICT every post they make in response to facts:
o What are the common well-verified psychological traits of the Apple Apologists on this newsgroup?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/18ARDsEOPzM>

To that end...

This new thread today is CLASSIC for showing exactly how Apologists think:
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/RVG11ARB8r8>

Here's the opening post, just to give you a clue how they "think" that the
mere fact that iOS "updates often" makes them, in and of itself, "feel
safe", even as the sordid facts on iOS 13 show clearly that Apple ships on
schedule, but 'what' they ship is an untested release (as Google proved).

On Mon, 28 Oct 2019 08:31:22 +0100, Joerg Lorenz wrote:

> Guess what!
>
> I bought the best and the safest phone on this planet: an *iPhone 11*
>
> By far the best camera.
> Best energy-management.
> Totally safe.
> Updates for the next 5 years at least.
>
> Never ever an Android as primary smart phone!

--
PS: PG&E is extending the power outage to Thursday so I'll be running on
the generator until then, where the cell towers are still up so far.

[Arlen _G_ Holder]

On Thu, 31 Oct 2019 05:30:55 -0700, sms wrote:

> I upgraded yesterday. No unexpected data usage this morning.

Hi Steve,

I'm glad I leave my iOS devices on the version they're born with.
o Two times I updated iOS in the past few years taught me too much

For my 3 iOS devices, in toto, I've updated twice:
a. The first time was the iOS 7.0.0 to iOS 7.0.1 disaster
b. You'd think Apple would test their iOS in the real world
c. But Apple didn't care one bit they broke connectivity in the real world

Did Apple _know_ iOS 7.0.1 broke connectivity with millions of devices?
o Or, did Apple just not care (nothing on their web site, for example)?

It doesn't matter (they probably knew but it still doesn't matter)
o Because iOS 7.0.1 proved that they don't care about the real world

On the Apple web site, it says the real word is "not supported".
o Apple doesn't give a shit that they break Linux connectivity

The second time was around iOS 10 days where the grandkids started using
the device (for an adult, the novelty of iOS wears off quite quickly) and
their games were complaining about the version.

That was about the days that Apple _knowingly_ shipped a highly insecure
release containing what they _knew_ they would be fixing in just 10 days,
which was the Broadcom bug, even though Apple had the fix in hand.

What did I learn first hand in those two events?
1. Apple doesn't give a shit about the real world
2. Apple cares more about schedule than safety

Both have been proven in spades by knowledge of iOS bugs
o For example, they _knew_ iOS 13 was critically buggy in June
o And shipped it "on schedule" anyway

These facts tell me that Apple marketing is cleverly marketing to fools
o Since fools "feel" safe simply from the "frequency" of release

--
Bringing adult logic and real-world facts to the Apple newsgroups.

[Arlen _G_ Holder]

On Sat, 2 Nov 2019 09:09:04 -0700, sms wrote:

> On 11/2/2019 8:11 AM, badgolferman wrote:
>> I sure theye not holding their mouths the right way when looking at
>> their phones...
>>
>> https://www.macrumors.com/2019/10/31/ios-13-2-safari-refreshing-poor-ram-management/
>
> A better explanation of this issue is here
> <https://www.slashgear.com/ios-13-2-might-be-more-aggressive-in-killing-background-apps-01598108/>
>
> BTW, 13.2.1 is out, but it's not for the iPhone, it's only for the
> HomePod, so we'll have to wait for 13.2.2.

Hi Steve,

You're not an apologist, and neither is badgolferman, which is refreshing
as you can discuss both the good and the bad to Apple's release strategy.

All I care about are two things adults should care about:
o FACT (specifically comprehending the facts)
o ASSESSMENT (specifically combining facts to make reasonable assessments)

To that end, I thank you for that pointer to slashgear as to what's
apparently wrong with iOS memory management in the latest sordid set of
(always insufficiently tested) iOS 13 releases (which _started_ with huge
security holes Apple _knew_ about way back in July - but (yet again) -
apparently Marketing schedule took priority over product quality (the proof
being in the "flux" of the many unscheduled impromptu iOS releases as
people found the bugs Apple never tested for in the real world).

As adults, we comprehend facts & make reasonable assessments of those
facts, where this is a summary of that article you kindly referenced:
o iOS 13.2 might be more aggressive in killing background apps
<https://www.slashgear.com/ios-13-2-might-be-more-aggressive-in-killing-background-apps-01598108/>

1. "aside from [iOS13.2] bricking HomePod speakers"
2. in iOS 13.2, background apps are being massacred against users' wishes
"Switching to another app for a few minutes would kick apps like
YouTube or Safari out of memory."
3. historically, it's a fact iOS hardware is notably deficient in RAM
"iOS has always been rather thrifty in its use of hardware resources
partly because it has also been stingy in such hardware,
particularly RAM."
4. killing apps is a trick iOS uses _because_ it has less RAM than Android
"[iOS is] notorious for keeping background apps in check to
prevent filling up memory."
5. the iPhone 11 with 4GB of RAM is behaving as if it only has 2GB of RAM
"is acting as if the iPhone 11, which has at least 4 GB of RAM,
behaved as if it had only two."
6. Apple might claim this as a "feature"... but ... clearly...
"users definitely count it as a bug"

See also badgolferman's original URL:
o more iOS 13.2 woes
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/UliDEH-Axqo>

And see a related thread truthfully comparing Android & iOS RAM management:
o Facts: How does RAM memory management truly compare between Android & iOS devices (the facts, not unsupported marketing claims)
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/kWt8gt1-VAA>

--
Usenet is where adults gather to share items of technical value.

[Arlen _G_ Holder]

Facts...

Published today....more proof that the mere _frequency_ of release, just
like the frequency of an iOS 13 diarrhea, isn't in and of itself, any mark
of quality, except to the Apple Apologists.

"Apple iOS 13.2.2 has landed and it's both an essential upgrade
and a negligent mess."

Apple's sixth rapid-fire update since September addresses
the appalling performance problems introduced by iOS 13.2
but introduces new ones and ignores major ongoing issues."
<https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2019/11/08/apple-ios-1322-release-should-you-upgrade-iphone-update/>

Not only did Google prove Apple never tested iOS for years, but even Apple
engineers recently published more than a half dozen reasons Apple never has
ever tested iOS in the real world.

And likely never will.

It's so much _easier_ to advertise quality - than to actually deliver it.
"iOS 13.2.2 may be an emergency fix, but it is creating its own
problems. Despite supposedly addressing the ongoing cellular data/network
issues (more in the next section), the fix doesn¢t appear to be successful
for those impacted and - worse still - it is introducing the problem for
others previously unaffected"

There is a reason iOS is called a diarrhea of buggy releases!

--
Apple apologists always prove to believe exactly what marketing feeds them.

[*Hemidactylus*]

Arlen _G_ Holder <_arlen....@halder.edu> wrote:
> Facts...
>
> Published today....more proof that the mere _frequency_ of release, just
> like the frequency of an iOS 13 diarrhea, isn't in and of itself, any mark
> of quality, except to the Apple Apologists.
>
> "Apple iOS 13.2.2 has landed and it's both an essential upgrade
> and a negligent mess."
>
> Apple's sixth rapid-fire update since September addresses
> the appalling performance problems introduced by iOS 13.2
> but introduces new ones and ignores major ongoing issues."
>
> <https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2019/11/08/apple-ios-1322-release-should-you-upgrade-iphone-update/>
>
> Not only did Google prove Apple never tested iOS for years, but even Apple
> engineers recently published more than a half dozen reasons Apple never has
> ever tested iOS in the real world.
>
> And likely never will.
>
> It's so much _easier_ to advertise quality - than to actually deliver it.
> "iOS 13.2.2 may be an emergency fix, but it is creating its own
> problems. Despite supposedly addressing the ongoing cellular data/network

> issues (more in the next section), the fix doesnąt appear to be successful

> for those impacted and - worse still - it is introducing the problem for
> others previously unaffected"
>
> There is a reason iOS is called a diarrhea of buggy releases!
>

Wow you would think my iPhone would flat out explode in my hands and burn
down a city block there chicken little. Or chicken spittle as you froth at
the mouth in your rabid crusade against us ignorant apologist folk who are
clearly out to destroy the world. You have the list that proves it. Facts
and such.

[Joerg Lorenz]

Am 10.11.19 um 00:28 schrieb *Hemidactylus*:

Is it possible for you not to feed this mentally impaired Troll?
All users would appreciate it if you could set a correct FUP2.

[Arlen Holder]

FACTS:
Apple admitted, in an internal company meeting, that SCHEDULE clearly had
priority over QUALITY in iOS 13.

"The timing of the iOS 13.1 update was moved up by a week to Sept. 24,
compressing the time that iOS 13.0 was Apple's flagship OS release. New
iPhones are so tightly integrated with Apple software that it would have
been technically impossible to launch the iPhone 11 with iOS 12, and since
13.1 wasn't ready in time, Apple's only choice was to ship with 13.0 and
update everyone to 13.1 as quickly as it could."

Dateline today... (moments ago)...
o Inside Apple's iPhone Software Shakeup After Buggy iOS 13 Debut
<https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-11-21/apple-ios-14-features-changes-testing-after-ios-13-bugs>

"The testing shift will apply to all of Apple's operating systems,
including iPadOS, watchOS, macOS and tvOS. The latest Mac computer
operating system, macOS Catalina, has also manifested bugs such as
incompatibility with many apps and missing messages in Mail."

"Software chief Federighi is overhauling development and testing of iOS 14
to make it easier to spot problems early."

We've heard this before, from Federighi himself, multiple times
o INHO, this is yet another marketing spin of imaginary quality

HINT: Remember the infamous internal letter where Federighi complained that
Marketing ran the schedule - not Engineering!

Given iOS 13 proved the point that iOS is a buggy diarrhea of frequent
releases, it's not surprising that Apple marketing went (yet again) into
high gear to create the imaginary illusion that Apple cares about quality
when the proof is clear that Apple cares more about schedule than quality.

HINT: Apple _knew_ about iOS 13 huge security holes in July!

o Apple is changing the way it develops software internally following iOS
13˘s buggy debut
<https://9to5mac.com/2019/11/21/bloomberg-ios-14-ios-13/>

"Software chief Craig Federighi and lieutenants including Stacey Lysik
announced the changes at a recent internal 'kickoff' meeting with the
company's software developers. The new approach calls for Apple's
development teams to ensure that test versions, known as 'daily builds,' of
future software updates disable unfinished or buggy features by default.
Testers will then have the option to selectively enable those features, via
a new internal process and settings menu dubbed Flags, allowing them to
isolate the impact of each individual addition on the system."

"When the company's iOS 13 was released alongside the iPhone 11 in
September, iPhone owners and app developers were confronted with a litany
of software glitches. Apps crashed or launched slowly. Cellular signal was
inconsistent. There were user interface errors in apps like Messages,
system-wide search issues and problems loading emails. Some new features,
such as sharing file folders over iCloud and streaming music to multiple
sets of AirPods, were either delayed or are still missing. This amounted to
one of the most troubled and unpolished operating system updates in Apple's
history."

"The new strategy is already being applied to the development of iOS 14,
codenamed 'Azul' internally, ahead of its debut next year. Apple has also
considered delaying some iOS 14 features until 2021 - in an update called
'Azul +1' internally that will likely become known as iOS 15 externally -
to give the company more time to focus on performance."

NOTE: The facts show Apple has _never_ tested iOS sufficiently, which
Google proved beyond any shadow of any doubt, which means, for _years_,
Apple has been touting imaginary privacy & security that never existed.

--
The fact remains, despite Apple Marketing genius to spin the buggy iOS
releases into reputed "changes" and Apple owner gullibility; it's a lot
easier to advertise quality, than it is to deliver it, where the proof is
that Apple has _never_ sufficiently tested its iOS releases (preferring to
release frequently, instead of to release quality), where the customers,
strangely enough, _feel_ safe, from the mere fact of the frequent diarrhea
of releases.

[Arlen Holder]

Yet again, just moments ago, Apple apologists parroted marketing bullshit
in claiming that somehow, the number 13 in a release imparts "magical"
purely imaginary capabilities on an iPhone over Android.
o All new iPhones might be forced to have a removable battery (Android too)
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/0zzVpdtAa_k/LQNjNauZCwAJ>

Here's my factual response to that post proving apologists are gullible:
On Fri, 28 Feb 2020 19:10:15 -0500, nospam wrote:

> actually, apple *extended* its lige by fixing the sudden shutdown
> problem due to older batteries, resulting in people keeping their phone
> for a much longer period of time than they otherwise would have.

Hi nospam,

Save your bullshit for the gullible users on the Apple ngs, nospam.
o Your credibility on facts, nospam, is worse than a coin toss result.

Remember that "for a buck" claim you made which you couldn't support?
o Name a single iOS app functionality that you can get for a buck, that isn't already on Android, for free
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/aUyeuaPI9pc/r9gtLFjXAwAJ>

Bear in mind I was the one who first posted the news of the throttling:
o Report says Apple 'Powerd' code secretly slows your iOS device down to trick you into buying a new device
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/GdEtzzrc9F0/z57KTsmWAQAJ>

The CPU speeds halved was found in devices only about a year old, nospam.
o *Where Apple admitted _intentionally_ secretly shortening iPhone life.*

Simple question of logic, sense, and reason (i.e., not marketing bullshit):
o *How does purposefully secretly shortening iPhone life help the environment?*

> also, ios updates support phones as much as 6 years old.

What game are you trying to play with _that_ line of questioning, nospam?
o The iOS version is utterly _meaningless_ in terms of app functionality.

o Is there any software functionality in the new iPhone 11 that isn't already in an average 5-year old Android phone?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/1D2Sgdlz1-I/6KRWyuETBAAJ>

Remember, my Samsung Galaxy S3 has more app functionality than _any_ iPhone
ever sold, which proves the "iOS update" is utterly meaningless except as a
Marketing gimmick that all you apologists fall for since you all fall for
the mere _illusion_ of functionality.
o What functionality you do on iOS you wish you could do on Android?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/poG62SEefqk/6_b0ero7BAAJ>

> android is lucky to get 3 years of updates, so that's at least two
> android phones, probably three, in the 6 years of ios support.

You apologists nospam, always prove to simply parrot MARKETING bullshit.

For example, even you must know iOS is utterly primitive in functionality!
o Is it a sad fact that iOS is primitive in homescreen management functionality compared to the modern homescreen management functionality of Android?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/uQKprR8Pjl8/K_C6i47ADwAJ>

What you apologists do incessantly is parrot Apple Marketing bullshit!
o The iOS version does not provide any more functionality than Android

Here's what you need to know about parroting Apple Marketing bullshit:
o When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because of the "frequency" of release...
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/voFbGKpUoBo/Bfejm_I9EAAJ>
--
Apple users tend to be gullible in that they believe marketing bullshit.

[Arlen Holder]

On Sun, 17 May 2020 21:37:03 -0400, nospam wrote:

> when an exploit is found, a fix can be pushed within a couple of days
> if needed.

The point is that the mere frequency of release isn't what's important.
o And that neither Android nor iOS push updates out to older devices

FACTS

What's interesting is nospam is well aware that _every_ iPhone ever made
currently has outstanding now-known 0-day exploits that Apple adamantly
refuses to fix for its older iPhones.
o Apple adamantly refuses to fix older iPhones despite extremely
serious fixable vulnerabilities
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/REa4Q3SlT6o>

FACTS

In fact, there are so many iOS 0-day exploits *coming in!* that the hackers
have declared they're gonna stop _accepting_ them for review, there are so
many!
o FACTS: "New Apple Security Blow: If You Have An iPhone, Look Away Now"
[citing new 0-day exploits that work with all Iphones & iPads"]
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/exp1iYDs3j0>

FACTS

Note this is an Android newsgroup where I'm not saying Android is better,
but what I am saying is that the mere frequency of update of the iOS
diarrhea isn't, in and of itself, worth anything, which is my point.
o Why zero day Android exploits cost far more than zero day iOS exploits
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/9koS-SuRqgw>

FACTS

Because even Google proved Apple has _never_ even once fully tested iOS.
o Every iPhone ever made is vulnerable" to still unpatched 0-day bugs
(since the October 22nd 2010, iPhone 2G iOS 3.1.3)
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/MiZixhidmOs/ATC1S3s4FQAJ>

Both operating systems suffer from the same safety issues.
o What is the factual truth about PRIVACY differences or similarities
between the Android & iOS mobile phone ecosystems?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/MiZixhidmOs/ATC1S3s4FQAJ>

The point is that the mere frequency of release isn't what's important.
o And that neither Android nor iOS push updates out to older devices
--
Every notice the huge desparity between Samsung & Apple R&D spending?

[nospam]

In article <r9uki6$mse$1...@news.mixmin.net>, Arlen Holder

<arlen...@newmachine.com> wrote:

>
> > when an exploit is found, a fix can be pushed within a couple of days
> > if needed.
>
> The point is that the mere frequency of release isn't what's important.

nobody said it was.

what *is* important is the immediacy.

> o And that neither Android nor iOS push updates out to older devices

false. android updates support devices 2-3 years back whereas apple
typically supports 5 year old devices, occasionally longer.

[Arlen Holder]

On Mon, 18 May 2020 15:13:41 -0400, nospam wrote:

>> The point is that the mere frequency of release isn't what's important.
>
> nobody said it was.

Hi nospam,

I'm going to treat you in this missive as if you are an adult, OK?

What matters is that the release is "sufficiently tested", nospam.
o Not that bugs other people "might" tell you about, are quickly fixed.

Bear in mind, there will always be tension between you and me simply
because I speak only facts rational logic while you simply always take the
position only of Apple MARKETING.

Hence, it's good you agree with the adult reasonable concept that the mere
"frequency" of release, isn't, in and of itself, _any_ determinant of the
quality of that release.

*The only thing that determines quality of release, is quality of release*.

o FACTS: "New Apple Security Blow: If You Have An iPhone, Look Away Now"

<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/exp1iYDs3j0>

> what *is* important is the immediacy.

Again, I applaud you nospam, for exhibiting a rational reasoned opinion.
o Immediacy is important; but testing comes well before immediacy.

The reasonable take is that you should expect all _known_ security
vulnerabilities to be quickly fixed; but you should also expect a modicum
of testing that rational adults would term "sufficient".

And no, MARKETING doesn't get to be the determinant of "sufficient".
o You must be aware that Craig Federighi recently shook up engineering?

*The only thing that determines quality of release, is quality of release*.

>> o And that neither Android nor iOS push updates out to older devices
>
> false. android updates support devices 2-3 years back whereas apple
> typically supports 5 year old devices, occasionally longer.

What's _different_ about you, nospam, from the other apologists, is you
know the facts which is proved by the fact you dance around the facts using
"clever" qualifying words such as are used when others are dancing...
o I didn't "inhale"...
o I didn't have sexual "relations"...
o Throttling of the iPhone X isn't "as" necessary...
etc.

Where your 'dancing' word this time is:
o Apple "typically" supports...

What is disappointing about you, nospam, is you attempt to sway adults who
are not aware of those keywords (e.g., when Apple told Congress throttling
wasn't "as" necessary, in the iPhone X - and yet - it was!).

Here, you use the word "typically", which indicates you're aware of facts:
" there is *currently no commitment to patch previous versions of iOS*
to protect older iPhones.
<https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2020/05/10/apple-iphone-exploit-vulnerability-ios-13-mail-problem-update-iphone-11-pro-max-u-iphone-xs-max-xr-upgrade/>

In summary, you're a _different_ kind of apologist, nospam.

o *Type I apologist*: You are in a class of your own, nospam.
Essentially, you _always_ take Apple MARKETING's position.
And yet, you use clever qualifying words which indicate you
clearly _know_ the actual facts.
Like when you claimed that the wifi software 'can' be written, even
as it didn't exist, or like when you claimed that throttling was
different from 'throttling software' existing. And yet, at
other times, you flatly refute the facts, e.g., when you claimed
that the iPhone X didn't have throttling software (yet it did).

o *Type II apologist*: These don't always take Apple MARKETING's position,
but they're are simply ignorant of facts, e.g., Steve Scharf
who famously claimed that the Qualcomm royalties went down simply
because that's what he wanted to think (the facts showed otherwise),
or when he repeatedly makes claims about overall costs, without ever
including the actual costs (e.g., CA sales taxes, which you never
get back), or when he incessantly claims iPhone CPUs are 'faster' and
yet, he completely ignores they're soon to be throttled to half speed.

o *Type III apologist*: These are odd & strange Dunning-Kruger'esque
people who literally own absolutely no adult cognition whatsoever,
e.g., Alan Baker, Jolly Roger, Lewis, Savageduck, BK, Chris,
Joerg Lorenz, Your Name, et al.
No adult conversation is ever going to be possible with these
apologists so their only value is they prove the points for me.

As for you, nospam, this post of yours shows you _can_ think like an adult,
and that you are able to insert the clever qualifying words that most
people gloss over (a la, "I didn't have sexual _relations_ with that
woman").

I've pretty much figured you out nospam, as you're quite consistent.
o As am I.

If I simply assume you work for Apple MARKETING (figuratively speaking),
you _always_ take on that role to flatly refute any and all facts that are
detrimental to Apple Marketing's message.

With that understanding, I can predict almost everything you will ever
claim, since you never seem to own an independent thought process that
strays from Apple MARKETING dogma.

You can also easily predict that I will provide facts whenever you make
claims that are not based on the facts (which is most of the time).

And that I will clearly understand that it isn't the frequency of release
that matters, nor, as you seem to claim, the "immediacy" of the repair,
but, in the "sufficiency" of the actual testing.

What matters is that the release is "sufficiently tested", nospam.
o Not that bugs other people "might" tell you about, are quickly fixed.
--
There will always be tension between you and me simply because I speak only
facts rational logic while you simply always take the position only of
Apple MARKETING.

[Arlen Holder]

On Mon, 18 May 2020 16:19:42 +0200, Joerg Lorenz wrote:

> Am 18.05.20 um 15:12 schrieb sms:
>> The length of time that major updates are rolled out to iPhones is far
>> longer than for Android models. With Android flagships you may get two
>> major OS updates, on the mid-range models, one update, on the low-end
>> models, zero updates. On the iPhone you'll get about five major OS
>> updates before they stop support.
>
> That is why Android devices with similar performance characteristics
> like an iPhone are very expensive devices measured against their useful
> life (=support time).

See also:
o When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because

of the "frequency" of release...

<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/WzRDeuHmQoc>

As an example, from just this week, Apple refuses to update older phones
for a huge hole (yet again, Apple clearly didn't test sufficiently):

o Apple adamantly refuses to fix older iPhones

<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/REa4Q3SlT6o>

05/12 Update: Apple will deliver a fix in iOS 13.5, but there is

*currently no commitment to patch previous versions of iOS*

to protect older iPhones. Needless to say, I will keep this post
updated with further developments on both sides. As it stands,
further developments appear inevitable."
<https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2020/05/10/apple-iphone-exploit-vulnerability-ios-13-mail-problem-update-iphone-11-pro-max-u-iphone-xs-max-xr-upgrade/>
--
Bringing TRUTH to Apple newsgroups via consistent application of fact.

[Arlen Holder]

UPDATE:

For the permanent Usenet record to preserve...
o The TYPE I apologist, nospam, again made the spurious claim (see below).

o Tested: Is a $400 iPhone SE really faster than the most powerful Android phone, the $1,400 Galaxy S20
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/md8UpARikj4>

For reference, see this post from the Type I apologist, just moments ago:
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.mobile.android/md8UpARikj4/VwqXFCz1AwAJ>
--

When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because of the

mere "frequency" of release... they're simply parroting mindless MARKETING
mantra, particularly given iOS exploits are so numerous as for there to be
a glut such that some hackers aren't even accepting zero-day iOS exploits.

[Alan Baker]

On 2020-05-22 5:15 p.m., Arlen Holder wrote:
> UPDATE:
>
> For the permanent Usenet record to preserve...
> o The TYPE I apologist, nospam, again made the spurious claim (see below).
>
> o Tested: Is a $400 iPhone SE really faster than the most powerful Android phone, the $1,400 Galaxy S20
> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/md8UpARikj4>

Your source said:

'The $399 iPhone SE clearly beats the $1,399 Galaxy S20 Ultra overall.'

Happy to clear that up for everyone.

:-)

[Alan Baker]

Got nothing, hey?

:-)

[Arlen Holder]

On Thu, 4 Jul 2019 07:21:42 -0000 (UTC), Arlen G. Holder wrote:

> My 2-year old LG Stylo 3 Plus is at Android 7.0, "Android security patch
> level", February 1, 2019, Kernel version 3.18.31.

That was a year ago where they were updating my $130 LG Stylo 3 Plus far
too frequently for my tastes (I try to leave iOS on the OS it was born
with).

But if I had thought the LG Stylo 3 Plus (T-Mobile) updated too
frequently...

This constant Android update is even worse with my $100 Moto G(7)!
o <https://i.postimg.cc/pTMh6H1w/update02.jpg>

They repeatedly keep updating my Motorola phone every couple of months!
o <https://i.postimg.cc/Qtg9Ly2H/update03.jpg>

[Arlen Holder]

Another example the speciousness of the apologists' argument that the mere
number that Apple arbitrarily assigns to an iOS release is, somehow, in and
of itself, of paramount importance...(to them)... even though it's just a
number.

It's meaningless otherwise. It's just a bunch of digits.
What matters is the range of os versions that apps work on.

Not the particular set of random version digits arbitrarily assigned to the
OS itself.

For example, it's widely reported that the new Covid tracking surveillance
apps work on Android versions from 6 up to 11.

I don't know offhand, where I simply ask iOS users what iOS versions does
those same covid tracking apps work on?

What's the range of iOS versions those covid tracking apps work on?

[Arlen Holder]

On Sat, 26 Sep 2020 11:10:33 GMT, Dee wrote:

> Those both are Android OS updates (whether just security patch or
> full OS upgrades), so I would say the first one to your LG Stylo 3
> Plus came to you from LG (who got it from Google and then tweaked
> it), and the second one to your Moto G7 came to you from Motorola
> (who got it from Google and then tweaked it).

Hi Dee,
Regarding this thought-provoking question thread on frequency of updates:
o When we talk of Android updates, what kinds of updates are we talking about?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/WaKaaPHM_Qs>

I apologize if I ask a basic question, where I get that they're Android OS
updates of some sort (e.g., a minor subversion of the major version).

But _who_ gave them to me?
o Didn't the carrier give them to me?

That is, is _this_ the sequence for those minor OS updates?
1. Google created it and gave it to LG
2. LG did something with it, and then gave it to the carrier
3. The carrier (in this case, T-Mobile) pushed it to me

Is _that_ the sequence for those myriad minor OS updates?

> You said you "recently got" the Android 10 upgrade on your Android 9
> Moto G7. How recently? In your screenshot the security patch says
> August 1, 2020. Yet Android 10 was released in September, 2019. So
> Motorola took at least 11 months to tweak the code before they
> released it to you.

My mistake. It was more recent. Let me look it up for you.
1. I bought the $100 Moto G7 on Black Friday 2019 from Google
2. It came with Android 9 at that time in late November 2019
3. Someone (the carrier?) pushed Android 10

See details here, dated July 3, 2020:
o Those on Android 10... is it worth upgrading from 9 to 10?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/X65cMyzAn-g>

In that thread, I quoted a bunch of cites explaining that update:
o Motorola finally starts rolling out Android 10 for the Moto G7 & Moto G7 Power
<https://www.androidcentral.com/motorola-finally-starts-rolling-out-android-10-moto-g7-and-moto-g7-power>
o Motorola timidly starts updating the Moto G7 and G7 Power to Android 10
<https://www.phonearena.com/news/motorola-moto-g7-g7-power-android-10-updates_id124496>
o *Which Motorola phones will get upgraded to Android 10?*
<https://www.trustedreviews.com/news/when-will-motorola-phones-get-upgraded-to-android-10-3941399>
etc.

Personally, given I keep my iPads as close to the iOS they were born with,
I think they push updates to Android too frequently for my personal taste:
o Are they updating your Android device too frequently lately? May 12, 2020
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/a_62P0R-O6M>
Where I had posted these images in May:
o 01Feb2020 update <https://i.postimg.cc/vHTvLyt5/update01.jpg>
o 04Apr2020 update <https://i.postimg.cc/1zG053y1/update02.jpg> on May12

By way of summary, I'm thoroughly confused because they update my phone so
frequently I can't easily keep track of who is updating what from where.

1. What is it that is updated? (e.g., the OS, a patch, an app, a framework)
2. Who gives it to us? (e.g., Google, the carrier, or the developer)
3. How do they give it to us? (pull from somewhere or push to our phone)
4. Where does it sit? (e.g., an app repository or pushed to our device)
--
See also:
o What "Android security patch level" is your Android phone currently at?
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/WKsE8UROGOA>
Which contains these screenshots of my Moto G7 updates:
o 06Jun2020 update <https://i.postimg.cc/pTMh6H1w/update02.jpg>
o 01Aug2020 update <https://i.postimg.cc/Qtg9Ly2H/update03.jpg>

[Arlen Holder]

Yet again, Google proved, beyond doubt, iOS isn't ever _tested_ properly!
o <https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2020/12/an-ios-zero-click-radio-proximity.html>
NOTE: At least read the last paragraph if you can't read the entire proof.

By now I'm sure you all heard about new flaws in iOS where Google asked:
o "Is it really that easy to fully & completely compromise iOS?

The answer was "yes", where it seems there's a ton of untested code from
1985 in "core iOS", where, it seems, a LENGTH call was _never checked_.

What?
o A buffer overflow?

Really?
o On something as _obvious_ as a LENGTH check no less?

Can you believe it was _that_ easy?
o One bug. And the entire iPhone is yours.

It's zero click.
o And wormable.

All because of a single bug in iOS
o Which Google clearly said, tons more almost certainly must exist.

All that is covered in gory detail in this thread already:
o Yet again (it never ends) hackers exploit iOS insecurities with zero-day remote access to the entire device over Wi-Fi, with no user interaction required at all
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/7Mc1sX9XISA>

Where the point of this post is to impart this separate reference
o Which applies to both Android and to iOS security with respect to hackers

o Inside the secretive industry that helps government hackers get around encryption
<https://www.vice.com/en/article/8xdayg/iphone-zero-days-inside-azimuth-security>
--
Apple users just want to "feel" secure - which MARKETING gladly feeds them.
(That's why Apple's iOS has _never_ even once been sufficiently tested.)
(Project Zero proved that many times, and Apple engineers confirmed it.)

[Arlen Holder]

BTW, I just installed & ran (in about an hour) a test app using the latest
Android Studio as described in this step-by-step tutorial I just posted:
o *Tutorial Installing Android Studio 4.1.1 on Windows 10* (AMD CPU)
<https://groups.google.com/g/comp.mobile.android/c/g3ymz5CPsIk>

Here is a screenshot of a test app, running on my Moto G7 (Android 10):
o <https://i.postimg.cc/1tvysJY1/as01.jpg> hello world

Note that Android Studio says that even the ancient API 16 runs on 99.8% of
Android devices (i.e., Jelly BGean, Android 4.1) even though we're up to
Android 11 at this point (my $100 65GB/4GB/400GB Moto G7 is Android 10).

Note these facts that iOS users can only cry for:
o Almost any Android APK works on almost any Android phone on the planet
--
This is built-in app portability iOS users can only cry for their lack of.

[Arlen Holder]

Yet another utterly brilliant MARKETING move was when Apple
convinced consumers
that the mere _frequency_ of release, meant "safety"!

o When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because of the "frequency" of release...
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/voFbGKpUoBo>
o What is it about the sheer frequency of iOS releases that makes Apple users feel safe?
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/uxj50hk6nxI/m/BAYk_7CDBwAJ>

This post, just today, shows that fallacy to be a fact.

See also:
o When apologists claim iOS is "safer" than Android simply because of the "frequency" of release...
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/voFbGKpUoBo>

o Yet again, it's becoming more & more obvious Apple has never sufficiently tested iOS for bugs in the real world
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/zKgwg21GfpM>

o Yet again, Apple introduces NEW HUGE SECURITY holes with the latest software release (it never ends)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/JXHO9DtMPb4/>

On Tue, 15 Dec 2020 20:39:11 -0600, Ant wrote:

> Hmm, didn't v9.3.x have severe problems beside the GPS issue?

Hi Ant,

FACTS:
o Apple has _never_ even once ever released a _tested_ iOS release!

You're not an apologist, where the only people on the entire planet who aren't aware of the many "serious problems" in _every_ iOS release...
o Are the apologists themselves

Everyone else owns adult cognitive skills
o To wit...

o Apple iOS 9.3 Has A Serious New Problem
<https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/03/28/apple-ios-9-3-safari-link-problem/>
"it turned out iOS 9.3 was bricking a number of older devices,
something Apple (to its credit) quickly admitted. But now real anger is
building among users of iPhones and iPads of all ages after web browsing
in Safari became largely unusable following the upgrade."

o Apple iOS 9.3 Update: New Fix For Serious Problems
<https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/03/30/apple-ios-9-3-safari-links-fix/>
"Temporarily pulled last week after causing problems with older iPhones
and iPads, Apple has also confirmed it is tied to a bug which impacts
web surfing and promised to provide a fix soon (presumably in the shape
of iOS 9.3.1)."

o Apple Admits To Serious iOS 9.3.1 Problem
<https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2016/04/06/apple-ios-9-3-1-security-problem/>
"Despite claims this generation of iOS would focus on optimisation as
opposed to major features, each major iOS 9 release, 9.1, 9.2 and 9.3,
has suffered from significant problems."

FACT: Apple has never sufficiently tested core iOS code (proved by Google)
ASSESSMENT: It doesn't matter because consumers only believe MARKETING

See also:
o Why zero day Android exploits cost far more than zero day iOS exploits (because iOS is far easier to hack)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/9koS-SuRqgw>

o Yet again (it never ends) hackers exploit iOS insecurities with zero-day remote access to the entire device over Wi-Fi, with no user interaction required at all
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/7Mc1sX9XISA>

o iOS 14.x is on track to be as untested as was the infamously buggy iOS 13.x release (proof, yet again, Apple never tests anything sufficiently)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/gN-vVJANnzQ>

o As always, Apple (yet again) failed to find their own iOS 14 actively exploited security holes (Apple concentrates R&D on emoji's instead)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/LYDOl3iy3yQ>

o Yet again, Apple proves they never even once sufficiently tested iOS 14 in the real world
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/x6lH31w87-Y>

o Every Apple operating system, MacOS, iOS, iPadOS, watchOS, and tvOS were seriously vulnerable (and Apple wasn't who found it, yet again - it never ends)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/SPzqnW7L65w>

o iOS 14 leak shows rumored "Enable Voice Call Recording" option which proves, yet again, it's not the hardware that severely limits iOS app functionality - it's Apple
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/VOhhulLyQXY>

o Lack of testing (yet again) where iPhone 11 Users Complain of Display With Odd Green Tint
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/WxYEIqN5AuI>

o Direct Quote: "Every iPhone ever made is vulnerable" to still unpatched 0-day bugs (since the October 22nd 2010, iPhone 2G iOS 3.1.3)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/0LP1nVGKG58>

o iPhone: a zero-day vulnerability allows spying on your personal data
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/m_Ljx53NmaU>

o A critical iPhone and iPad bug that lurked for 8 years may be under active attack
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/P5b1Ujau6iU>

o New vulnerabilities (described as numerous) have been detected in Apple┬ Image I/O
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/RrXonVt7_y0>

o Yet again, it's becoming more & more obvious Apple has never sufficiently tested iOS for bugs in the real world
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/zKgwg21GfpM>

o Yet again, Apple introduces NEW HUGE SECURITY holes with the latest software release (it never ends)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/JXHO9DtMPb4>

o Apple (yet again, preferring schedule over security) asked people to keep secret since August a huge security vulnerability that allowed an attacker to remotely render any nearby iPhone or iPad unusabl
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/InIiL0092n8>

o Yet again, 17 malware apps on the Apple App Store using well-known techniques, still easily evade Apple's lack of testing
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/uinhbsMG14M>

o Apple is (yet again claiming it's) changing the way it develops software internally following iOS 13┬ buggy debut
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/Q-EfcyXrOrs>

o Even more proof (if needed) Apple doesn't test iOS sufficiently: Another location Privacy Bug found in iOS 13.0
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/Lk77IXcf4T0>

o Yet more proof (if any was needed) Apple (again) ships bugs TWICE on iOS
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/rjO9yG7CfwU>

o Apple is officially upset Google exposed the imaginary security Apple widely promotes (blaming Google for the iOS diarrhea)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/1HfjUt0wwFA>

o Yet another Astoundingly Huge Massive Indiscriminate iPhone Hack Has Been Going Strong for Two Years! (it never ends)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/rRzsRZin3c4>

o Yet again... proof Apple never tests their products sufficiently in the real world (Google finds another half dozen SERIOUS zero-interaction zero-day Apple vulterabilities)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/nbxvoDgiGT4>

o Apple App Store Security Bypassed By Government iOS Surveillance Malware
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/bC1CDU1pGNM>

o Every indication is that the new line of astronomically-priced Apple iPhones are just as flawed as the iPhone 6 to 7 to 8 to X are
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/1RiqBADD-vE>

o Yet more proof Apple doesn't test software sufficiently (this time not only from Facebook but also from Expedia, Hollister and Hotels.com)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/8HfdPOQVNVk>

o Yet another non-root password-stealing bug on Apple (Apple _never_ tests sufficiently - and doesn't even KNOW what this bug is yet!)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/ocCnzVh3BxQ>

o Yet again, Apple forgot to test iOS 11.2.6 in the real world (significant problems reported)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/AlkmHCTSUXg>

o Apple just now BLOCKED Live Photos in FaceTime for all _current_ iOS & macOS users!
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/fQ3Kb96gedA>

o Is Apple seriously suggesting that millions of unsuspecting customers - now become - beta testers - just so that their phones will work!
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/xrovVjnWUo4>

o Lockscreen exploit easilfy found only hours after iOS 12.1 released (yet again, Apple never tests anything in the real world)
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/N-hQKPDI4a0>

o Forbes reports from 75% to 83% of tested new model iPhones exhibit a new design flaw
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/jbCZ20q_VVQ>

o 9to5 Mac reports iPhone XS & iPhone XS Max has serious battery problems, already...
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/oWW0imXI4zE>
--
One bug.... and the entire untested core iOS house of cards falls down.
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/c/7Mc1sX9XISA>

Google asked "Was it really that easy?", to which the answer was "Yes".
HINT: iOS code dates to 1985 and Google proved it has never been tested.

[Arlen Holder]

On Thu, 17 Dec 2020 17:32:46 -0000 (UTC), Arlen Holder wrote:

> 1. So you're tracked at the App Store (by your iCloud account presumably)
> 2. And you're tracked on your device (by your Advertiser ID)

BTW, given Apple users always seem to only know what MARKETING fed them
o That is, Apple owners don't have a clue about the reality of Android

By way of huge contrast with (free) apps (unjailbroken/unrooted):
a. Android free apps are not locked to a user
(so a single APK can work on a billion phones, unlike iOS apps)

b. Most versions of Android do NOT have an Advertiser ID
(if you don't set up a Google Account it simply does not exist)

c. On Android, _not_ setting a Google Account works just fine
(unlike iOS, where not setting an iCloud account cripples the device)

d. There are _plenty_ of apps which either allow you to set the privacy
on a feature-by-feature basis on Android, or which report what tracking
activities are going on by the app itself on your Android device.

e. There are so many app search filters on Android for Google Play apps
that it's not funny, and they're persistent, so you don't have to keep
setting them (unlike iOS which doesn't have decent filters, & even when
you can set them, e.g., "free apps", it's not persistent in iOS searches
in my experience).

f. On Android, the APKs can be extracted or auto-archived by a whole bunch
of APK management apps, or natively at the time of installation, at any
time - yes - even years after the APK was installed and yes - even if
the app or version no longer exists on the Google Play store... none of
which is possible on the iOS IPAs which are locked to the iCloud account
and which require Apple software just to save them (and which you can
no longer simply belatedly extract and save off the app as an IPA if
that version of the app, or the app itself, no longer exists in the
App Store).

I realize quite well that most Apple owners are clueless about Android, where you know I ask every iPhone owner I see in lines waiting outside stores or at checkout _why_ they bought an iPhone and I _always_ get back MARKETING bullshit parroted by the shockingly gullible typical Apple owner.

With respect to those three things above, for example, they don't know:
A. Android APKs can't track you at Google Play like iOS apps can be tracked
(because you can get apps anywhere, and even if you did get the APK from
Google Play, the Aurora Store spoofs your Google Play identity and
device (and location, and a bunch of other things if you want it to),
and then it automatically _saves_ the APK, which you can then put on
a billion phones, none of which is even remotely possible to do on iOS).

B. The Advertiser ID simply does not exist on most versions of Android,
so they can't track you by the Advertiser ID which simply doesn't exist.

By way of contrast, the Advertiser ID _always_ exists on iOS; you can't
get rid of it (on both platforms you can reset it manually though).

C. Given I'm always talking about a nonrooted/nonjailbroken device,
on iOS you're stuck with an iCloud account, but on Android,
the phone works just fine without a Google Account. You can have as many
Google Accounts as you want, mind you, but you don't have to set the OS
to any of them (unlike with iOS, where you _must_ set the OS to an
iCloud account).

On iOS, not setting the OS to an iCloud account "can" be easily done,
but it _cripples_ the phone; whereas on Android, the phone works just
fine _without_ a Google Account set up in the operating system settings.

D. On Android, it's not funny the number of settings you have to deny
any given app any given permission. And the tracking is easily shown,
as this one screenshot of my disabled Google Services shows:
<https://i.postimg.cc/9FmRKqnz/stt01.jpg>

Note: The Android phone works just fine with almost every single Google
service disabled (i.e., almost every system or added app with the words
"google" in the name were disabled on my phone, and I only had to turn
back on a couple to get the phone to work just fine without them).

E. When you search for apps on the Google Play Store, you can easily set a
persistent filter to not show any apps from Google, nor to show any
non-free apps, nor to show any apps which use the GSF (Google Services
Framework), nor to show any apps that pop up ads, etc.

You can't do most of that when you search for iOS apps, and whereas you
can search for "free" apps, the damn settings don't seem to be
persistent on my iPads (if you know how to make them persistent, please
let me know as I _never_ need to pay for an app on a mobile device!).

F. When you download an app from the Google Play Store or from the F-Droid
repository, you can check a checkbox to automatically save the APK to
your sdcard. This is so great of a feature that it's shocking that it's
not available on iOS (AFAIK), where on iOS, saving the IPA isn't all
that useful anyway 'cuz it's locked to the iCloud account anyway.

On Android, not only can you automatically save the APK the instant you
installed it, but you can later _extract_ the APK of any app you like,
even system pre-installed apps, to use them on a billion other phones.

That way you can store on your desktop thousands of APKs (one for every
version of the 500 or so apps you install on a typical device), where
you can transfer the entire directory of APKs over Wi-Fi without any
additional Google software (unlike with iOS IPAs).

In summary, what's shocking is that the typical Apple owner is clueless
about the power and flexibility of Android - where it always seems the only thing the typical Apple owner knows is the bullshit that Apple MARKETING (rather cleverly) feeds them.
--
Apple owners have no clue how utterly restricted they are in their prison.