>On Mon, 17 Jun 2019 16:08:07 -0700 (PDT), Bud <
sirs...@fast.net> wrote:
>
>>On Monday, June 17, 2019 at 9:12:19 AM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>> On Mon, 3 Jun 2019 15:57:31 -0700 (PDT), Bud <
sirs...@fast.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Monday, June 3, 2019 at 1:20:48 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 31 May 2019 11:10:22 -0700 (PDT), Bud <
sirs...@fast.net>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Friday, May 31, 2019 at 1:55:58 PM UTC-4, Ben Holmes wrote:
>>>>>>> On Fri, 31 May 2019 09:54:24 -0700 (PDT), David Healy
>>>>>>> <
healyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Friday, May 31, 2019 at 8:26:59 AM UTC-7, Mark Ulrik wrote:
>>>>>>>>> onsdag den 29. maj 2019 kl. 20.30.20 UTC+2 skrev Ben Holmes:
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 29 May 2019 10:55:38 -0700 (PDT), David Healy
>>>>>>>>>> <
healyd...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>On Wednesday, May 29, 2019 at 10:24:25 AM UTC-7, Mark Ulrik wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> onsdag den 29. maj 2019 kl. 17.18.10 UTC+2 skrev Ben Holmes:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Taken from the censored forum:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 28 May 2019 20:01:30 -0400, Edward Bauer <
eb...@md.metrocast.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>On Sunday, May 26, 2019 at 1:38:03 PM UTC-4, BOZ wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
https://historical.ha.com/itm/autographs/u.s.-presidents/lee-harvey-oswald-marine-corps-rifle-score-book/a/692-35179.s
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>If you want to open doors to solving the JFK assassination (and some in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>this newsgroup don’t), read and understand every page of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Oswald’s Marine Corps Score Book.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>All marksmen know the indispensable requirement to always zero your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>firearm (adjust the windage and elevation screws), especially if it had
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>been disassembled as Oswald’s had been. Lee was trained in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>USMC to zero often. A study of his Score Book shows that he re-zeroed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>before 25?30% of his slow fire shots and in at least five
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>instances even re-zeroed during rapid fire.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>His first shot missed JFK because it was used to zero the scope. It was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>aimed at the south curb of Main Street and caused the fresh bullet gouge
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>seen by Walthers, Sweatt, Tague and others. It took Oswald exactly 9.5
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>seconds to zero, operate the bolt, aim and fire.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is another moron who clearly knows nothing about the case.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Mannlicher Carcano did not have any way to adjust zero.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's windage & elevation were FIXED.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> This moron makes the same mistake that the Warren Commission did...
>>>>>>>>>>>>> presuming that Oswald used the scope. But no real Marine Corps
>>>>>>>>>>>>> trained shooter would be stupid enough to try to use the scope (and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the wrong *sized* scope at that!) to shoot a moving target at that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> range. Try this argument in any rifle forum and stand back for the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> laughter that's coming your way.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> What these morons never do is actually *get* their hands on a 4x18
>>>>>>>>>>>>> scope, and try to make shots at a moving target. Indeed, far better
>>>>>>>>>>>>> experts that Oswald EVER was ... completely failed to hit the target
>>>>>>>>>>>>> as Oswald is claimed to have done.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> How unusual. Ben seems to be implying that Oswald's shooting feat
>>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't quite as difficult as many of his fellow conspiracy believers
>>>>>>>>>>>> would like to think.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Speaking of morons, here's another one. He reads: "Indeed, far better
>>>>>>>>>> experts that Oswald EVER was ... completely failed to hit the target
>>>>>>>>>> as Oswald is claimed to have done." and thinks that I'm "implying"
>>>>>>>>>> that the alleged feat isn't quite as difficult.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> That takes a true moron to read into what I said the precise opposite
>>>>>>>>>> of what I stated.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Wow. Look at Ben dishonestly trying to squirm his way out of this. The WC concluded that the scope was a "substantial aid to rapid, accurate firing." Ben, however, disputes this, arguing that even experts "completely failed to hit the target" when they used the scope. He thinks that under the circumstances a Marine Corps trained shooter like Oswald would have used the iron sights, and that the WC therefore (inadvertently) made the shooting feat more difficult than it probably was.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mark Lane pointed this out... and believers have been lying about it
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ever since.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> And CB darling Mark Lane pointed out that the WC inadvertently
>>>>>>>>>>>> exaggerated the difficulty of the shots?!? I must be dreaming. This
>>>>>>>>>>>> can't be happening.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Again, only a true moron can take what I wrote, and end up thinking I
>>>>>>>>>> said the precise opposite.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> According to Ben, Mark Lane agreed with him that the WC (inadvertently) exaggerated the difficulty of the shots by assuming that Oswald used the scope.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> You'll notice in this moron's last paragraph that he does what all
>>>>>>>>>>>>> believers do, he supplies speculation as if it were fact.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> And that fact tells the tale...
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Ben is hardwired to call other people liars and morons, but at
>>>>>>>>>>>> least he is educating his fellow CBs in the process.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Actually, I only call those who lie "liars." That would, of course,
>>>>>>>>>> make *YOU* a liar ... since nothing I said would lead an honest person
>>>>>>>>>> to believe that the alleged shooting was *EASIER* rather than far more
>>>>>>>>>> difficult than the WC led people to believe.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Didn't the WC conclude that Oswald probably used the scope? Do you agree with that, or do you believe that the iron sights under the circumstances would have been the more likely choice of a Marine Corps trained shooter? Would using the iron sights have made the shooting easier or more difficult, in your opinion?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> only WCR/LHO did it all by his lonesome faithful agree it was simple
>>>>>>>> shooting that day.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A moving target reacquisition with the use of a scope at that
>>>>>>>> TSBD-Elm St. distance, after shot 1, is difficult at best and
>>>>>>>> impossible at worst
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Interesting to note that the NRA rated "Masters" who couldn't hit the
>>>>>>> head or neck of the target using the scope WERE FIRING AT STATIONARY
>>>>>>> TARGETS!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I thought shooters were taught to shoot center mass.
>>>>>
>>>>> The shooters were attempting to duplicate "Oswald's" alleged shooting
>>>>> feat.
>>>>
>>>> Show that the shooter were told to try for one head shot and one
>>>> body shot.
>>>
>>>
>>> Show that Oswald was attempting to try to hit JFK in the head, and in
>>> the body.
>>
>> I doubt he was. I think he was trying to make kill shots. Just like those other shooters did.
>>
>>
>>>>> They didn't aim at the target's feet.
>>>>
>>>> Notice Ben cowardice. He doesn`t address my actual query...
>>>
>>>
>>> Notice "Chickenshit's" constant cowardice, he *NEVER* addresses what I
>>> state.
>>
>> You are looking at things incorrectly, and demand I do also. Those shooters duplicated Oswald`s shooting in that they put killing shots on target. Just like Oswald did.
>>
>>>
>>>> "I thought shooters were taught to shoot center mass."
>>>>
>>>> A short search turns up this...
>>>>
>>>>
https://www.quora.com/Are-any-infantry-soldiers-trained-for-head-shots
>>>>
>>>> The third answer down is from a Marine Sergeant. Cops and soldiers
>>>> are generally taught to shoot center mass. Ben knows this, but it
>>>> interferes with his game playing so he disregards it, instead focusing
>>>> on some silly undefined "duplicate" criteria. Oswald didn`t duplicate
>>>> the shooting of the other shooters, either, did he fail?
>>>
>>>
>>> This is what happens when a non-shooting moron tries to teach an
>>> expert marksman about shooting.
>>
>> You might be an expert shooter but you are an idiot when it comes to applying information.
>>
>>> "Center mast" on the targets used would put the shots in the neck.
>>
>> How about the head?
>>
>> There is no reason for the shooters who took part in this shooting test should be trying to make wounds where Oswald made wounds. That is just silly. Doubtful Oswald`s plan was "I`m gonna shoot Kennedy once in the body and once in the head". Likely he was trying to make kill shots. Just like these other shooters accomplished.
>>
>>
>>> "Chickenshit" probably knows this, but is desperate to refute what a
>>> *REAL* expert has to say.
>>>
>>> And my 10th award Expert badge makes me an expert.
>>
>> And these guys were experts. And they put kill shots on target, just like Oswald did. You want to apply some stupid criteria, like matching the wounds Oswald inflicted.
>>
>>>>> Notice that "Chickenshit" ignored the point I made... that the NRA
>>>>> rated "Masters" attempted to duplicate the shooting ...
>>>>
>>>> Support that.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sure... just as soon as you publicly deny it.
>>
>> I`ll just assume you are lying.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>> but had
>>>>> tremendous ADVANTAGES... and still couldn't duplicate it.
>>>>
>>>> They duplicated his results, a dead victim. It would be silly to
>>>> think if one of his shots hit Kennedy in the ear the other shooters
>>>> would have to match that.
>>>
>>>
>>> My statement remains unrefuted.
>>
>> And stupid.
>>
>>>
>>>>>>> Hence, it should have been even *easier*...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But they failed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Were they aiming at the head?
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>> Quote them.
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't need to. I know the target.
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> Only Oswald was good enough!!! ROTFLMAO!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> These shooters put kill shots on target, same as Oswald did.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cite for your claim... Dumbass!
>>>>
>>>>
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0144a.htm
>>>>
>>>>
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh17/html/WH_Vol17_0144b.htm
>>>
>>>
>>> You cited the proof that you lied.
>>
>> These targets don`t show kill shots, stupid?
>>
>>> Mark Lane was the first one to
>>> point out that they were unable to hit the head or the neck.
>>
>> So you it is your and Mark Lane`s contention that if one of Oswald`s shots hit Kennedy in the toe, any failure of these shooter to duplicate this shot would somehow mean that Oswald didn`t?
>>
>> They made kill shots.
>>
>>> He was right, and you're a provable liar. Because now we *KNOW* that
>>> you were lying when you were making your "center mast" claims.
>>
>> How so?
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>> (way to many unknowns, way to many limo possible
>>>>>>>> reactions)--in fact, rumors being what they are, one could surmise a
>>>>>>>> TSBD shooter completely missed Kennedy with a rushed shot 2 and hit
>>>>>>>> Connelly. Then it's back to the target-scope reacquisition process
>>>>>>>> AGAIN for the alleged rushed third shot from the alleged TSBD snipers
>>>>>>>> nest. Chaos ensues, If the limo did not stop on Elm St after the
>>>>>>>> alleged 2nd shot I doubt Oswald could of hit even the Elm Street
>>>>>>>> railroad overpass with his alleged 3rd shot.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The scope makes a bad situ worse (time wise/shot wise-especially), if not impossible.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And we know this for a FACT - because the Warren Commission was kind
>>>>>>> enough not to classify the tests conducted showing it to be highly
>>>>>>> improbable at best.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Chickenshit" had nothing to say...
>>>>>
>>>>> The best way to silence "Chickenshit" is to just keep referencing the
>>>>> evidence... Works every time!
>>>>
>>>> I told you, if you don`t put the information out there that
>>>> supports your claim I just assume you are lying.
>>>
>>>
>>> You're lying again, "Chickenshit."
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>As a critic, I suspect Ben has done nothing more than waking you and
>>>>>>>>>>> other WCR faithful *up*.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Actually, what I've ended up doing is forcing these morons to tell
>>>>>>>>>> whoppers about what I've stated.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Because they can't deal with what I *ACTUALLY* say...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>The walls of WCR report/ deceit are crumbling.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Mark Lane is the bearer of bad news for your .john, lone nut tribe.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Indeed, the fact that I've posted hundreds of quotes from him -
>>>>>>>>>> completely UNANSWERED AND UNREFUTED shows that they know they've lost.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I just got through posting Mark Lane's illustration of Chief Warren
>>>>>>>>>> outright lying ... and this moron couldn't refute it.
On Tue, 18 Jun 2019 09:00:37 -0700 (PDT),
chucksch...@gmail.com
wrote:
>On Tuesday, June 18, 2019 at 10:06:36 AM UTC-5, Ben Holmes wrote:
>> On Tue, 18 Jun 2019 01:06:54 -0700 (PDT),
chucksch...@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On Sunday, June 16, 2019 at 2:07:25 PM UTC-5,
borisba...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> "The answer lies in human nature and the desire to find patterns and order
>> >> where there is none." - Idiot Schuyler
>> >
>> >Look like the experts agree with me, Boris Dunning-Kruger.
>>
>> No, you're lying again, Chuckles... here's the proof:
>
> The topic was about conspiracism. The Truther disagrees that
> conspiracism is--in part--a desire from the adherent to find order and
> meaning where there is none.
>
>Try and keep up.
>
>--The Management
Once again, the coward snips the proof that he's a liar.
Understandable, one supposes...
Liars probably hate themselves for the lies they tell.
The topic can be anything at all, and a liar will do what a liar does
best...