French poll on anti-Americanism
Earl Evleth
The Journal du Dimanche published todya the following poll
"With regard to the Iraqi war which of the following
would best describe your feeling"
1) You like Americans but are favorable to entering
into Iraq ------------------------------------------------ 6%
2) You like Americans but are not favorable to entering
into Iraq --------------------------------------------- 70%
3) You don`t like Americans and are not favorable to
entering Iraq ---------------------------------------------- 15%
4) You don`t like Americans but are favorable to entering
Iraq ---------------------------------------------------------2%
5) No opinion ---------------------------------------------------7%
***
Comment: I have remarked before that it is part of French
culture to be able to disagree with somebody and like them.
My experience of 40 years has been that anti-Americanism is not
a major problem in France. There is no, for instance,
equivalent to www.fuckfrance.com on the web that I have found.
Another study, somewhat more complete:
(http://perso.club-internet.fr/hwelty/France/Intercultural2.html)
The attitude of the French toward the USA (according to a comprehensive
study by the French-American Foundation in May 2000 analyzed by SOFRES/ Le
Monde Jan.6, 2002, partly translated below) :
There are fewer anti-Americans than pro-Americans in France but they are
more politically active (on the left) and vocal than the pro-Americans.
(this is illustrated by another recent poll also sponsored by the
French-American Foundation).
Globally the French feel a relative sympathy (41%) toward America even if
the most largely felt feeling is no strong feeling (49% feel neither
sympathy nor antipathy) and only 9% antipathy. Objective allies of the USA,
the French do not perceive globalization as an instrument of American power
but more as a phenomenon which benefits developed countries over the
interests of the poorest countries. They admit the efficiency of the USA in
modern economy but think that France performs better on issues like social
protection, education or integration of immigrants. The survey leads to a
typology of attitudes, based on three questions : sympathy toward America,
considering America primarily as a partner or an adversary and judging its
influence (excessive, insufficient or raising no problem) in each of the
following domains : TV programs, movies, new technologies, music, economic
ideas, language, advertising, food, clothes. Four categories emerge from
this typology, with two of them very structured : the anti-Americans and the
pros, and two varying between indifference and distant sympathy.
* Real anti-Americans represent 10% of the population. They consider
themselves hostile to the Americans, considering them more as adversaries
than partners and judging their influence excessive in culture, lifestyle,
economy and international relations. For them, the USA can be summarized in
four words : violence, inequalities, racism and imperialism. Liberty and
dynamism of the country are never mentioned. They see in US international
policy only a way to impose its will on the rest of the world and do not
credit it the will to maintain peace in the world or help the development of
democracy in emerging countries. While criticizing the US power, this
hostile group also criticizes the weaknesses of the American system. They
think that in the USA, education, integration of immigrants, policies
against unemployment, safety and the fight against criminality, public
transport and social protection do not work as well as in France. They
acknowledge US superiority only for new technologies and universities. To
hierarchize the criticisms of this group against the USA, one must note the
importance of the cultural field (read about "exception culturelle"). The
negative influence of the USA on TV programs, movies, language and music is
particularly stressed. It is clear that the threat to national identity is a
key factor of anti-Americanism, more than economic or military competition,
for which this group is resigned to seeing France playing a secondary role.
Contrary to what people think about the alleged anti-Americanism of the
upper and intellectual class, this structured group of opponents to the USA
is primarily composed of lower middle class and clerks, i.e. the part of the
middle class more reluctant to economic and social change. This group
represents only 25% of the French society but 40% of the group the most
hostile to the USA. Upper and upper middle class are not over-represented in
this group, working class and retirees are largely under-represented. It is
clear that this group has a strong interest in political matters, more than
the rest of the French population. Voters on the left are a majority (more
than 50% of the group vs. 20% for the right and 30% for people expressing no
political preference). The strength of the anti-Americans resides more in
their level of politization and their capacity to express publicly their
views than in their number.
* Pro-Americans : America has many more supporters than opponents in
France. More than a quarter of the population expresses total sympathy for
the USA, a country they consider as a partner with no excessive influence on
our daily life. More remarkably, pro-Americanism goes along with a real
confidence in Europe existing with the USA. A majority of the supporters
think that in twenty years, Europe will be more powerful than the USA. This
opinion leads them to believe in the capacity of France, and more largely
Europe, to resist foreign influences. The group adds to that gratitude
toward the allies of World War II (the group is composed of older people).
Pro-Americans are clearly politically to the right (in the group 45% right,
33% left, 22% with no political preferences) and their interest in political
matters is similar to that of the average French population's.
* Between the pro and the anti-Americans is the majority of the
population. For two thirds of the population, the attitude toward the USA
ranges from " sympathetic rivalry " (15%) to " pragmatic indifference "
(50%). They can be critical on certain points but are never hostile. America
does not interest them much and is a distant continent. It is on them that
anti-Americans, politically active but not very numerous, can have an
influence in the years to come ; for the pro-Americans, less active
politically and more reluctant to express publicly their views, it is hard
to fight, in spite of their much larger number.
Richard J
I wish they had asked how many were prejudged against President Bush. I
think that would have been much more revealing.
Teflon
ikke
"Earl Evleth" <evl...@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message
news:BA7EBAD6.1074B%evl...@wanadoo.fr...
>
>
>
> The Journal du Dimanche published todya the following poll
>
> "With regard to the Iraqi war which of the following
> would best describe your feeling"
>
> 1) You like Americans but are favorable to entering
> into Iraq ------------------------------------------------ 6%
>
> 2) You like Americans but are not favorable to entering
> into Iraq --------------------------------------------- 70%
>
> 3) You don`t like Americans and are not favorable to
> entering Iraq ---------------------------------------------- 15%
>
> 4) You don`t like Americans but are favorable to entering
> Iraq ---------------------------------------------------------2%
>
> 5) No opinion ---------------------------------------------------7%
>
>
> ***
>
> Comment: I have remarked before that it is part of French
> culture to be able to disagree with somebody and like them.
> My experience of 40 years has been that anti-Americanism is not
> a major problem in France. There is no, for instance,
> equivalent to www.fuckfrance.com on the web that I have found.
>
>
(snip)
Indeed...some Memphis radio station presenter participated in a discussion
on BBC radio earlier today. He was proudly announcing his "Bash a Peugeot
for Peace" event. An invitation for patriotic Americans to come and vent
their anger on a.French car, "using US-made baseball bats". Of course, WW2
and boycots of French wine and mineral water featured heavily in his
diatribe.
The BBC presenter and the other guest, a foreign affairs correspondent for
Le Figaro, were nigh on speechless. I imagine that a good many listening
Americans can only have cringed.
The Brits are certainly not above this kind of thing, as The Sun so
pathetically illustrated ("illustrated" being the operative word) last week.
It's just tragic that so many otherwise quite reasonable people should have
such a simplistic black/white view of events, and should be so eager to jump
on this bandwagon.
An American friend of mine tells me his parents were expressing dismay at
the French "betrayal" of America. Either Americans are being fed a different
story, or this explosion of hatred is simply the top coming off the vat of
resentment of the French that's been accumulating and stewing for decades.
*Truly* tragic.
Cheers
John
Earl Evleth
wrote on 23/02/03 20:04:
>
> I wish they had asked how many were prejudged against President Bush. I
> think that would have been much more revealing.
This is not known but I think I already speculated here (certainly on
another NG) that Bush is very unpopular because of an accumulation of
factors.
1) the feeling from the beginning that he is neither intelligent
nor knowledgeable.
2) the administration came into power saying it was going to go it
alone, unilateralism was in.
3) Rumsfeld backed the negative atmosphere with his declarations,
very toxic.
As for being "prejudiced" I would say that yes he has been
judged.
The term Bush's war is used here and their is not specific blaming
"the Americans" on an individual basis. The French tend to separate
the nation and state from the people in this case.
Ě will keep my eyes open for a more clevery designed polls.
Earl
Rev. Don Kool
Earl Evleth wrote:
>
>
> The Journal du Dimanche published todya the following poll
>
> "With regard to the Iraqi war which of the following
> would best describe your feeling"
>
> 1) You like Americans but are favorable to entering
> into Iraq ------------------------------------------------ 6%
>
> 2) You like Americans but are not favorable to entering
> into Iraq --------------------------------------------- 70%
>
> 3) You don`t like Americans and are not favorable to
> entering Iraq ---------------------------------------------- 15%
>
> 4) You don`t like Americans but are favorable to entering
> Iraq ---------------------------------------------------------2%
>
> 5) You bathe weekly----------------------------------------------0%
Figures.
Hope this helps,
Don
--
*************************** Q: How many frenchmen does it take
* Rev. Don McDonald, SCNA * to defend Paris?
* Baltimore, MD * A: No one knows, it's never been tried.
***************************
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/oldno7/TheFrench.mpg
Reluctant Yamaha YZF-R1 Owner
Rev. Don Kool
Earl Evleth wrote:
> Richard J at ric...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>I wish they had asked how many were prejudged against President Bush. I
>>think that would have been much more revealing.
> This is not known but I think I already speculated here (certainly on
> another NG) that Bush is very unpopular because of an accumulation of
> factors.
>
> 1) the feeling from the beginning that he will never cowtow to Old europe.
Nothing wrong with that, Earl.
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: French poll on anti-Americanism
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 20:08:38 +0000
>
>le Sun, 23 Feb 2003 19:50:49 -0000, dans l'article
><%D96a.2310$Ax1....@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>, ikke <ik...@who.net> a dit
>...
>
>{ snip sickening tale of dumbfuck Yank racism }
>
>> An American friend of mine tells me his parents were expressing dismay at
>> the French "betrayal" of America. Either Americans are being fed a
>different
>> story, or this explosion of hatred is simply the top coming off the vat of
>> resentment of the French that's been accumulating and stewing for decades.
>
>Considering the sorry state of the 'American [sic] education [sic]' system,
>it's hardly surprising that it produces such classless idiots. As the URL
>that I posted recently demonstrates ...
>
>url:http://www.nytimes.com/2003/02/18/opinion/18KRUG.html
>
> 'Surveys show that a majority of Americans think that some or all of
> the Sept. 11 hijackers were Iraqi'
>
>ROTFLMAO !!!
>
> 'while many believe that Saddam Hussein was involved in Sept. 11, a
> claim even the Bush administration has never made.'
>
>*guffaw!!*
>
>We have seen several posters (Jigsaw, Scooter-Boy [1], Crappy, and FW's new
>'special friend' Zod the Clod) on news:alt.activism.death-penalty who
>genuinely seem to believe that the United States liberated Europe single-
>handedly. As this URL shows, this is the not the case ...
>
>url:http://www.ww2n.com/archives/art-20010426.shtml
>
> 'Germany was not defeated by the western Allies. It was defeated by
> Stalin's Soviet Union. The western Allies, and Normandy, played a
> strictly supporting role in the great European war'
>
> Figures speak for themselves. Stalin's Red Army destroyed 507 German
> divisions and 100 divisions of Nazi allied states. Soviet forces downed
> 77,000 German warplanes, knocked out 107,000 heavy guns and 48,000
> German tanks.
>
> Seventy-five percent of the 10 million German casualties in World War
> Two, (7.5 million men), were inflicted by the Red Army on the Eastern
> Front. The USSR, in turn, lost at least 20 million casualties. Russian
> historians now say the real figure could be closer to 30 million'
>
>This won't stop Scooter-Boy [1] and his illiterate, mouth-breathing cohorts
>from posting revisionist propaganda. But at least the educated world knows
>the truth.
>
>
>[1] url:http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/scooter-boy.jpg
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
>Path:
>lobby!ngtf-m01.news.aol.com!ngpeer.news.aol.com!feed1.newsreader.com!news
reader.com!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.ne
t!newsfeed.fjserv.net!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!feed.news.nacam
ar.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berl
>in.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: French poll on anti-Americanism
>Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2003 20:08:38 +0000
>Lines: 62
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
>Message-ID: <5bmni-...@zeouane.org>
>References: <BA7EBAD6.1074B%evl...@wanadoo.fr>
><%D96a.2310$Ax1....@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.fr (212.198.68.117)
>X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1046031119 54556662 212.198.68.117 (16 [91468])
>X-Orig-Path: not-for-mail
>X-OS: BSD UNIX
>X-No-Archive: true
>Mail-Copies-To: never
>X-Obsessive-Litany: http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>X-Scooter-Boy's-Moped:
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/drewls_wifes_scooter.jpg
>X-Scooter-Boy: http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/scooter-boy.jpg
>X-Chats: http://www.zeouane.org/chats/
>X-PGP: http://www.zeouane.org/pgp/pubring.pkr
>X-PGP-Fingerprint: 3F1F C838 88D5 2659 B00A 6DF6 6883 FB9C E34A AC93
>User-Agent: tin/1.5.14-20020926 ("Soil") (UNIX) (FreeBSD/4.5-RELEASE (i386))
>
>
Dolly Coughlan Jr, the legend continues!
As Desi lies, the archive grows!
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>Considering the sorry state of the 'American [sic] education [sic]' system,
>it's hardly surprising that it produces such classless idiots.
desi posted --"it's a pity that you seem to have tarred me with the 'anti- American'
brush, for I'm certainly not." See
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=pu7e5v4agibnjc07hblct1qeg6ikshqslc%404ax.com
That's my boy, desi.... Always good for a laugh.
<rest of drivel clipped>
PV
--
>Ayatollah desi
Another choice comment from desi, that I will be reminding him of --
"I would rather see the extinction of the human race, than allow one innocent to
be put to death by the state." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=87wvtkfeg2.fsf%40lievre.coughlan.fr
Dolly Coughlan Jr
<pasdespa...@zeouane.org> writes:
>Subject: Re: French poll on anti-Americanism
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 20:40:51 +0000
>
>le Mon, 24 Feb 2003 20:25:15 GMT, dans l'article
><kivk5v8j7ngqopac5...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor
><abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>>>Considering the sorry state of the 'American [sic] education [sic]' system,
>>>it's hardly surprising that it produces such classless idiots.
>
>> desi posted --"it's a pity that you seem to have tarred me with the 'anti-
>American'
>> brush, for I'm certainly not." See
>>
>url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=pu7e5v4agibnjc07hblct1qeg6ikshqs
lc%404ax.com
>
>Ha, ha, ha ... it seems that with each slavish response to me, FW confirms
>his 'English as a Foreign Language' status. Here's a tip, little FW: the
>'such' in the above statement, limits it to the person being discussed.
>
> 'France's education system produces brilliant philosophers such as
> Sartre ...'
>
>FW interprets this as 'all Frenchmen are Sartre'. Ho, ho, ho ...
>
> 'The intifida has resulted in deaths such as those of the Palestinian
...'
>
>FW interprets this as 'every Palestinian dies because of the intifida'.
>Much as he'd like them to, this is just more of his now famous illiteracy.
>
>LMAO !!!!!
>
>--
>Desmond Coughlan |desmond @ zeouane . org
>http://www.zeouane.org/
>http://www.zeouane.org/peinedemort/obsessive_litany.html
>__ __ _ __ ____________ ____ _
>\ \ / /_ _ _ __ ___ __ _| |__ __ _ \ \ / /__ / ___| | _ \/ |
> \ V / _` | '_ ` _ \ / _` | '_ \ / _` | \ V / / /| |_ _____| |_) | |
> | | (_| | | | | | | (_| | | | | (_| | | | / /_| _|_____| _ <| |
> |_|\__,_|_| |_| |_|\__,_|_| |_|\__,_| |_| /____|_| |_| \_\_|
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------- Headers --------------------
>
>Path:
>lobby!ngtf-m01.news.aol.com!ngpeer.news.aol.com!newsfeed1.bredband.com!br
edband!news.tele.dk!news.tele.dk!small.news.tele.dk!fu-berlin.de!uni-berli
n.de!e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.FR!not-for-mail
>From: Desmond Coughlan <pasdespa...@zeouane.org>
>Newsgroups: alt.activism.death-penalty
>Subject: Re: French poll on anti-Americanism
>Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 20:40:51 +0000
>Lines: 34
>Sender: Desmond Coughlan <des...@lievre.voute.net>
>Message-ID: <jjcqi-...@zeouane.org>
>References: <BA7EBAD6.1074B%evl...@wanadoo.fr>
><%D96a.2310$Ax1....@news-binary.blueyonder.co.uk>
><5bmni-...@zeouane.org> <kivk5v8j7ngqopac5...@4ax.com>
>NNTP-Posting-Host: e117.dhcp212-198-68.noos.fr (212.198.68.117)
>X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 1046119689 55213538 212.198.68.117 (16 [91468])
A Planet Visitor
wrote:
>le Mon, 24 Feb 2003 20:25:15 GMT, dans l'article <kivk5v8j7ngqopac5...@4ax.com>, A Planet Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> a dit ...
>
>>>Considering the sorry state of the 'American [sic] education [sic]' system,
>>>it's hardly surprising that it produces such classless idiots.
>
>> desi posted --"it's a pity that you seem to have tarred me with the 'anti- American'
>> brush, for I'm certainly not." See
>> url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=pu7e5v4agibnjc07hblct1qeg6ikshqslc%404ax.com
>
>Ha, ha, ha ... it seems that with each slavish response to me, FW confirms
>his 'English as a Foreign Language' status. Here's a tip, little FW: the
>'such' in the above statement, limits it to the person being discussed.
>
> 'France's education system produces brilliant philosophers such as
> Sartre ...'
>
>FW interprets this as 'all Frenchmen are Sartre'. Ho, ho, ho ...
>
> 'The intifida has resulted in deaths such as those of the Palestinian ...'
>
>FW interprets this as 'every Palestinian dies because of the intifida'.
>Much as he'd like them to, this is just more of his now famous illiteracy.
>
>LMAO !!!!!
Actually, there is NO DOUBT of your anti-American posts. And your
hypocritical denial only serves to PROVE you are a LIAR -- You wrote
"it's a pity that you seem to have tarred me with the 'anti- American' brush, for I'm
certainly not." See
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=pu7e5v4agibnjc07hblct1qeg6ikshqslc%404ax.com
These are the PROOFS of your anti-American leanings. And only represent
a small portion of posts which show those leanings --
Mr D confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "Desmond's tenor is usually fairly
anti-American and stereotyped when it comes to all things American." See -
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=jonathan-589598.14351921022003%40newsroom.utas.edu.au
Incubus confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "I have to confess that you anti
american bigotry is begenning to piss me off." See
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=Ti8u9.291%24OM6.20576%40newsfep1-gui.server.ntli.net
John Rennie confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "Blind anti-American
prejudice can lead you up some strange alleys, Desmond." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=_9xp9.1502%24345.70338%40newsfep2-win.server.ntli.net
John Rennie again confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "Still as wildly
anti-American as ever, still seizing on any nonsensical ploy to promote that view."
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020117212018.12097.00002164%40mb-fs.aol.com
GeneralZod confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "And Desi is too much of a
class-A chicken shit to come here and spout his anti-American venom in a public
place." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=9Qng9.11521%246e2.2616850566%40newssvr30.news.prodigy.com
Jigsaw confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "Recently, our resident
Anti-American sage" See
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020722185456.19336.00000127%40mb-mp.aol.com
And I have certainly noted many of your anti-American comments.
Richard left this group temporarily because of your anti-American comments.
And this is just the quickest of a search for comments on your anti-Americanism.
1) "...Americans don't even know how to spell the word, let alone comprehend
the concept" See --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn984mij.8t.desmond%40gateway.voute.net
2) "one can hardly be surprised if all Americans are as stupid as you."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn917fca.3m3.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
3) "One can infer from this that either Americans are stupid, or sadistic bastards."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020723212934.02191.00000601%40mb-mq.aol.com
4) "Unfortunately, this sort of thinking is at present way beyond the
reasoning power of 99 % of Americans."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=c%2Bka0dA9qOeyEwhf%40maudit.demon.co.uk
5) "Only to idiotic redneck Americans..."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=RdX3t1AqeyvyEwrD%40maudit.demon.co.uk
6) "'spag /spAIG/ adj. & n. sl. "spastic", "stupid person", used to refer to
Americans..." See --
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021120212944.28561.00001819%40mb-mv.aol.com
7) "typical dumbfuck American's ignorance" See--
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20021030212918.28561.00000610%40mb-mv.aol.com
8) "idiotic buffoons that are Americans," See -
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20020908212925.09987.00000590%40mb-fp.aol.com
9) Mark posted -- "Frankly, if a way could be found to select only knowledgeable and
rational individuals to make the decisions, both the criminal justice system and the
political system would be in far, FAR better shape! You replied --
"Yes, but American juries would be composed entirely of foreigners, Mark ..." See
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn90i6nq.4lg.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
10) If you're 'American by birth' (which no one believes you are), then all I can say
is that you're a damning indictment of the American (sic) education (sic) system. Are
they all as illiterate as you ?
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030223212927.16280.00002535%40mb-mo.aol.com
11) Considering the sorry state of the 'American [sic] education [sic]' system,
it's hardly surprising that it produces such classless idiots. See
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=20030223212940.16280.00002546%40mb-mo.aol.com
12) "one can hardly be surprised if all Americans are as stupid as you."
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=slrn917fca.3m3.desmond%40lievre.voute.net
PV
>--
>Ayatollah desi
Another choice comment from desi, that I will be reminding him of --
"I would rather see the extinction of the human race, than allow one innocent to
be put to death by the state." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=87wvtkfeg2.fsf%40lievre.coughlan.fr
To which St. George remarked --
"Desmond, this statement is, quite literally, the most idiotic I have EVER read on
this or indeed any other newsgroup. Congratulations. In one sentence you have
surpassed the wildest dreams of ridiculousness of 'Don' and his cronies." See --
url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=7s9fo4%24da2%241%40nnrp1.deja.com
I could not agree more. But _ridiculousness_ is desi's middle name.
Mr Q. Z. Diablo
Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote:
> Mr D confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "Desmond's tenor is
> usually fairly
> anti-American and stereotyped when it comes to all things American." See
> -
> url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=jonathan-589598.14351921022003%40
> newsroom.utas.edu.au
I find myself dragged into this conflict yet again.
I have not "confirmed" that Desmond is anti-American. I have simply
indicated that I believe he is. Hardly confirmation, let alone "proof".
My opinion and mine only, regardless of whether or not you agree with it.
Mr Q. Z. D.
--
Drinker, systems administrator, wannabe writer, musician and all-round bastard.
"...Base 8 is just like base 10 really... ((o))
If you're missing two fingers." - Tom Lehrer ((O))
A Planet Visitor
<jona...@zeouane.org.remove.this.it.is.bollocks> wrote:
>In article <vqao5vsp98de8d5u9...@4ax.com>, A Planet
>Visitor <abc...@zbqytr.ykq> wrote:
>
>> Mr D confirmed you post anti-American comments -- "Desmond's tenor is
>> usually fairly
>> anti-American and stereotyped when it comes to all things American." See
>> -
>> url:http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=jonathan-589598.14351921022003%40
>> newsroom.utas.edu.au
>
>I find myself dragged into this conflict yet again.
>
>I have not "confirmed" that Desmond is anti-American. I have simply
>indicated that I believe he is. Hardly confirmation, let alone "proof".
>
I never claimed your words PROVED that he is anti-American. They
simply form part of the FOUNDATION that I established to prove he
is anti-American. Just as one part of evidence does not prove guilt.
An accumulation of such evidence might well prove it. I certainly used
words from OTHERS. Had you been the ONLY one to have said
that... or if there were no other comments from desi that substantiated
that view in my opinion, I could certainly not have relied on your comment
as the sole evidence which might PROVE he is anti-American.
>My opinion and mine only, regardless of whether or not you agree with it.
>
Oh... ___I____ AGREE with it. I believe desi might take issue with your
words. Your particular words in that post, form a large part of why I
respect your opinion. Sorry if I USED your opinion to fight my battle,
but I could hardly ignore what you had said.
PV
Schachter Alexander
wanted to replace Nazism with Communism, great difference between being
gassed or shot by a kalashnikov
"Dolly Coughlan Jr" <dollyco...@aol.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:20030223212940...@mb-mo.aol.com...