Re: [Randon] Real Food - Ensure, etc.

[John Hughes]

Sports nutrition is a multi-billion dollar business and there are many good products out there.  My main point is that none of them offer a performance advantage over real food.

As Susan points out they are a convenient way to get in more calories without having to chew. However, you pay more for that convenience.

I've used Ensure, Perpeteum, Sustained Energy, Spiz, UltraEnergy (anyone remember that?), Gatorade, Gatorade spiked with maltodextrin, home-made sports drink, etc. I prefer the home-made since I can concoct it to my taste and put in enough electrolytes, which commercial products lack. Here's a simple recipe, which meets the recommendations of the American College of Sports Medicine:

• 1/3 c Orange Juice
• 12 teaspoons sugar (or use honey if you don't like sugar)
• 1/4 teaspoon salt
• water to make 1 quart

I keep a container of frozen OJ in the freezer and scoop some into a bottle. For more calories add more sweetener.

Interestingly, pro team nutritionists are providing real food to riders during stages. The riders can't get enough calories with sports products and want something that tastes real. That's also been my experience on RAAM, 1200s, etc.  More on what pro riders eat and home-made concoctions on my website:

http://www.coach-hughes.com/resources/homemade_cycling_nutrition.html

cheers,
John

On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 10:59 AM, <ran...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

  Today's Topic Summary

Group: http://groups.google.com/group/randon/topics

• Real Food - Ensure, etc [5 Updates]
• Lumotec LYT [5 Updates]
• Iphone [2 Updates]

 Real Food - Ensure, etc

John Hughes <coachjo...@gmail.com> Dec 15 04:55PM -0700  

Doug,
 
We're each an experiment of one. In the video Allen Lim talks about the
different diets that different riders on the same team consume. If Ensure
works for you, that's great!
 
I often recommend to clients that they send a meal replacement drink like
Endure or Boost in their drop bags. A couple of bottles make a quick, if
not gourmet, meal before a sleep break and again instead of breakfast.
 
They can also be used as part of the event nutrition on the bike; however,
one caution. One bottle of Ensure / Boost contains 25% of the Daily Value
of magnesium. Too much magnesium causes diarrhea. I know of one
randonneur who, on the advice of his gastroenterologist, took Immodium
prophylacticaly. I'm not recommending anyone do that—just a caution.
 
Although I prefer steel-cut rolled oats and a fresh espresso when possible,
on an event I've been known to have an Ensure and a Frappuccino:-)
 
Cheers,
John
 
 
--
Cheers,
John Hughes
www.coach-hughes.com
PO Box 18028
Boulder, CO 80308-1028


 

sekhem313 <sekh...@yahoo.com> Dec 15 06:46PM -0800  

Hi Doug and John and all Rando Friends!
I agree that real food is good but the 'sandwich an hour' strategy seems to present real problems on a 40 hr ride.  Supplementing (not substituting!) liquid calories seems to be helpful especially in the dregs of that last 200K.
 
I've been experimenting with a whole variety of options - commercial/home made, health food/junkie etc etc (who doesn't want to stuff a Guiness in the jersey pocket ? :).  My current  obsession  is coconut milk (with a big shout out for the  chocolate mint variety!).  I found the energy delivery exceeds the other
commercial products that I've tried (I get variable results w/ products like Endure, poor results from Hammer products, soymilk, etc).  Coconut milk is packed with  medium-chain fatty acids (MCFAs) that are rapidly digestible and are assimilated (almost) as rapidly as carbohydrates.  MCFAs are given to critically ill patients exactly because its directly metabolized as energy and is not converted and stored in muscle as lipid..
 
I'm hoping that there's a nutritionist out there who can answer the $10 question-
the fats in coconut have been traditionally lumped together w/ palm fats  as being bad for the body because they are technically saturated fats.  Coconut milk also contains a large amount of lauric acid which is associated w/ unhealthy serum lipid profiles.  So is there any reason NOT to move to the tropics and live off of coconuts?
 
Happy Holidays everybody!
T
 
________________________________
From: John Hughes <coachjo...@gmail.com>
To: ran...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2011 4:55 PM
Subject: Re: [Randon] Real Food - Ensure, etc

 
Doug,
 
We're each an experiment of one.  In the video Allen Lim talks about the different diets that different
riders on the same team consume. If Ensure works for you, that's great!
 
I often recommend to clients that they send a meal replacement drink like Endure or Boost in their drop bags.  A couple of bottles make a quick, if not gourmet, meal before a sleep break and again instead of breakfast.
 
They can also be used as part of the event nutrition on the bike; however, one caution.  One bottle of Ensure / Boost contains 25% of the Daily Value of magnesium.  Too much magnesium causes diarrhea.  I know of one randonneur who, on the advice of his gastroenterologist, took Immodium prophylacticaly.  I'm not recommending anyone do that—just a caution.
 
Although I prefer steel-cut rolled oats and a fresh espresso when possible, on an event I've been known to have an Ensure and a Frappuccino:-)
 
Cheers,
John
 
 
On Thu, Dec 15, 2011 at 12:14 PM, <ran...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
 
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PO Box 18028
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Randon Nerd <rando...@gmail.com> Dec 15 10:09PM -0500  

I'm not a nutritionist but I've found that a large strawberry shake
from Micky D's or the B. King packs away an "easy" 1000 calories and
for me is less troublesome than carrying (and chugging) 4 Ensures.
 


 

"William D. Volk" <willia...@gmail.com> Dec 15 08:35PM -0800  

I had hyper-lipidity 25 years ago and gave up many foods to get my cholesterol down to the 130's (sans medication).
 
I have found that unrefined coconut oil does not seem to cause problems (in moderation) and I do drink coconut milk on occasion.
 
The bad reputation is for hydrogenated versions of these fats.
 
My two cents.
 
Sent from my iPad
 


 

"Susan Otcenas" <su...@teamestrogen.com> Dec 16 09:47AM -0800  

>>What I find to work best is Ensure Plus and I drank about 25
or so 8 oz bottles of the milk chocolate variety on PBP.

I drank FORTY bottles of latte Perpetuem on PBP. Believe it or not, I
can still stand to be in the same room with it!

In general, I prefer real food on rides, especially at the 200/300
distance. But over that, particularly if it's cold, I find I have a
hard time getting enough calories without feeling like I'm always
chewing. Having calories in my bottles evens out the flow of calories
into my system and generally keeps me from bonking on longer rides.

YMMV,

Susan

***********************************************
Susan Otcenas
Team Estrogen, Inc.
www.TeamEstrogen.com <http://www.teamestrogen.com/>
877-310-4592
***********************************************
Follow our TE fan page on Facebook!
Look for "teamestrogen.com"
***********************************************


 

 Lumotec LYT

andy <sagit...@gmail.com> Dec 15 09:13PM -0800  

I bought a new LYT. It is reasonably bright, but has a funny heart-
shaped dark pattern in the middle of the beam. It is best seen at
0:30-0:40 in my low-quality video: http://youtu.be/VyRnKm5neSY
 
My pattern is worse than the photo on the B&M website: http://goo.gl/xpYB6
 
Is this normal?
 
Thanks,
Andy


 

Brian Ogilvie <bwog...@gmail.com> Dec 16 10:16AM +0100  

Hi Andy,
 
Is this the same Lyt that you asked about last month on Bicycle
Lifestyle (http://tinyurl.com/bv86qp5), or did you replace that one?
 
As I wrote on that list, my Lyt has a similar pattern; I think it's a
result of the lens design that B&M used to get both asymmetrical
distance illumination and near field illumination.
 
If it really bothers you, you could take the light back to the shop
where you bought it and exchange it for another one.
 
Brian
 
 
--
Brian W. Ogilvie <bwog...@gmail.com>
Paris, France
http://www.pobox.com/~ogilvie


 

andy <sagit...@gmail.com> Dec 16 07:59AM -0800  

Hi Brian,
It is the same Lyt. I did not seek an exchange because I bent and
scratched up the mounting bracket pretty bad. I had hoped I would get
accustomed to the pattern in six weeks, but I have not. The dark
voids in the middle are terrible; I lose sight of potholes and trash
in the dark spots.
 
I am really curious why no one else is complaining about this. On one
hand, both you and Peter White said it was to be expected. On the
other hand, my pattern looks nothing like the photo posted by Peter.
And Jan Heine gave a pleasant review
http://janheine.wordpress.com/2011/12/09/new-led-taillight-solutions/
 
Design point or defective unit? Unknown. Right now I do not
recommend the Lyt to anyone.
 
Andy


 

Brian Ogilvie <bwog...@gmail.com> Dec 16 05:30PM +0100  

Hi Andy,
 
It does sound like your light is defective, then. It's hard to judge
based on the video, since cameras often adjust their sensitivity to
match the available light, but it looks like the near field lighting
on yours is a lot brighter than it should be; on mine, most of the
light ends up getting thrown into the far field, and the dark spots
aren't that big--they're similar to the gap between the near-field and
far-field lighting on my Cyo R.
 
I wonder if the LED isn't positioned properly? If it's in the wrong
place, the lens might not be focusing the light properly. I once
dropped a blinky down a five-story stairwell (by accident!). It still
worked after I gathered the pieces and assembled them, but many of the
LEDs had been knocked out of place and were no longer properly aligned
with the lens. Those ones were a lot dimmer than the other ones.
Something similar might be the case with yours. If you bought it at an
LBS that values your business, you might be able to return it anyway.
(They could always swap the brackets if yours is too scratched to
return to B&M.)
 
I'm curious to see if anyone else on Randon-L uses the Lyt and what they think.
 
Brian
 
 
--
Brian W. Ogilvie <bwog...@gmail.com>
Paris, France
http://www.pobox.com/~ogilvie


 

Jan Heine <hei...@earthlink.net> Dec 16 08:31AM -0800  

Brian,
 
Looking at your beam pattern and the one on the B&M site (they have
two up, and I am talking about the one on the left side as a little
thumbnail here http://www.bumm.de/produkte/dynamo-scheinwerfer/lumotec-lyt.html),
the beam patterns are the same. So the limitation is inherent in the
light.
 
Everybody has different sensitivities to dark spots. Some riders are
really bothered by the dark spot immediately in front of the light
that you get with the IQ Cyo and Edelux, but most randonneurs scan the
road much further ahead anyhow.
 
When the Lyt was evaluated for Bicycle Quarterly, it was compared to
other similarly priced LED lights (like the Spanninga and the Planet
Bike), as well as older halogen ligths (like the E6). The Lyt was in a
different class, much better. However, if you want the ultimate in
illumination, I recommend the IQ Cyo, or even better, the Edelux.
 
Jan Heine
Compass Bicycles Ltd.
http://www.compasscycle.com
 
Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/
 


 

 Iphone

"William D. Volk" <willia...@gmail.com> Dec 15 11:48AM -0800  

Kind of,
 
Motion-X GPS will let you upload a route and will show you where you are on it. It can also cache maps, so it will work when there's no cell signal ... like on Kitchen Creek road out here in San Diego County.
 
William D. Volk
 
On Dec 15, 2011, at 8:25 AM, sehtzek wrote:
 


 

Ian Boehm <bohe...@melbpc.org.au> Dec 16 08:40AM +1100  

On 16/12/2011 3:25 AM, sehtzek wrote:
> by turn directions?
 
> I'm trying to decide if I need to spend another chunk of change on a
> Garmin 800 or if I can accomplish the same thing with my Iphone.
 
G'day Scott
 
Following is the text of my recent post to the Audax Oz list. It's not
been edited for local references but some it might be of use to you and
others on this list. Have fun. Oh and Garmin makes an iphone dongle for
receiving ANT+ signals. The photo that I saw most definitely shows that
it doesn't have a iphone socket so that it can't be charged on the move.
Have fun.
 
**********
Early this year I bought an iphone linked to Telstra 3G. Thought was
given to using its GPS capabilities on rides so the Cyclemeter app was
bought and installed and the B&M Ewerk plus battery was installed on the
recumbent to keep the ifone battery topped up. Battery life isn't
wonderful when not much is happening and would be less so when
processing the GPS data. The batphone is parked under the lid of the
rack bag where it has a very good view of the sky. This solution is only
suitable for good weather as most mobile phone offerings are far from
water resistant.
 
The app does a fine job of keeping track of where I am in 3 dimensions
though I'm not confident of the accuracy of GPS derived altitude.
Cyclemeter generates a .gpx file which can be processed by, say,
ridewithgps.com
 
As an example my plot of this year's Flat 400 is at:
http://ridewithgps.com/trips/249050
 
Cyclemeter is happy to plot other activities like runs, walks, car trips
etc.
 
A minor annoyance of the system is that Cyclemeter files have to be sent
by email. Dunno if this is Apple being precious or a limitation of the
app. I reckon having email come to ones batphone is a bit onanistic so a
send-only webmail account had to be set up.
 
AFAIK Cyclemeter is available for other allegedly-smart phone platforms
and there are other apps that provide similar functionality but I've not
tried them.
 
The ifone GPS feature has other uses. There can be times when one is not
10,000 basis points confident that one is not geographically embarrassed
and a quick spot check is necessary. Telstra 3G has provided me with my
location on a Google Map every time I've tried in rural Vic and SA.
Other carriers may not be able to offer such a boast. Of course a
porpoise built GPS jigger will do the same from its internal map.
 
Heart rate, speed and cadence can be ported to the ifone and other
platforms with a dongle that will receive ANT+ signals and, of course,
suitable ANT+ sensors. Wahoo is one. I haven't checked these systems
closely but the dongle would need to have a female socket at the other
end so the battery could be kept alive on an Audax length ride.
 
This system works well in Oz where 3G data feeds are cheap. OS data
feeds are fiendishly expensive so a bike GPS is the only realistic option.
 
Notwithstanding the above I'm moving to a Garmin 800 device soon. Some
of its attractions are:
 
Water resistance
Charge on the go
Entertainment value on the handlebars
Native use of ANT+
 
Others can rabbit on about their Garmins.
 
Hope this helps.
 
*********
 
 
 
 
Cheers
__o
_`\<,
...(*)/(*)
 
Ian Boehm


 

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PO Box 18028
Boulder, CO 80308-1028

[Susan Otcenas]

In winter I make a homemade "rando cocoa mocha" to put in the thermoses that fit in my bottle cages.   Maltodextrin, unsweetened cocoa, coconut crystals, endurolytes powder, cinnamon, a little salt, all mixed with hot coffee.  Tasty, nutritious, inexpensive and easy to make. 

 

I carry a little screw top jar of all the powders mixed together and use convenience store-bought coffee to top up the thermoses at the controls.  Works like a charm and keeps me warm on cold winter rides.

 

Susan

 

***********************************************

Susan Otcenas

Team Estrogen, Inc.

www.TeamEstrogen.com

877-310-4592

***********************************************

Follow our TE fan page on Facebook!

Look for "teamestrogen.com"

***********************************************

 

 

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From: ran...@googlegroups.com [mailto:ran...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of John Hughes
Sent: Friday, December 16, 2011 10:55 AM
To: ran...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [Randon] Real Food - Ensure, etc.

[Jenny]

Ensure comes in a powdered version. When travelling (and
internationally), you can pack the canister in your luggage so that
you don't have to scramble to find/buy it in an unfamiliar or remote
locale. For the rides, I make individual baggies of the powder, each
one holding an hour's worth of nourishment--reconstitute it with water
at rest stops (shake it vigorously). Its' not as smooth as the canned,
but does the trick. When I make up the baggies, I like to add finely
ground espresso powder to the chocolate powder to take the edge of the
sweetness and perk me up. I also do something similar with CIB
(Carnation Instant Breakfast) and powdered hot chocolate mix.

Jenny

Jenny Hegmann, MS, RD, LDN
Sports Nutritionist
The Cyclist's Food Guide (c) 2012.

[John Hughes]

Ken,

As I've said before, we're each an experiment of one. If separating hydration and calories works for you, that's great!

Whatever goes in your mouth, whether as separate stuff or in combination, mixes in your stomach so from your gut's point of view it generally doesn't matter.

You do need to get enough H20, calories and electrolytes—the delivery mechanism(s) is a matter of personal choice. 

There's an article on my website about my personal experiment during a 400K with commentary by Susan Barr, veteran randonneuse with her PhD in nutrition:

     http://www.coach-hughes.com/resources/nutrition_mantras.html

Now, time for home-made pizza (less cheese and fat) and a Ranger IPA!

Cheers,
John

On Fri, Dec 16, 2011 at 12:27 PM, Ken Luke <kenl...@gmail.com> wrote:

John, what are your thoughts on the separation of hydration and calories? This last year I switched to just water & electrolytes for my bottles and was quite happy with the results. I felt that overall it was easier to keep my hydration level correct w/o trying to stuff too many calories down my gullet; if my stomach started to cramp up I'd lay off the gels for a while and just drink until my body could handle some more food.

For me personally there's also the convenience factor of not having to refill bottles with powder mid-ride. I would invariably get some of the dust on my hands and wind up with a sticky mess for the rest of the ride…

On Dec 16, 2011, at 10:54 AM, John Hughes wrote:

> Sports nutrition is a multi-billion dollar business and there are many good products out there.  My main point is that none of them offer a performance advantage over real food.
>
> As Susan points out they are a convenient way to get in more calories without having to chew. However, you pay more for that convenience.
>
> I've used Ensure, Perpeteum, Sustained Energy, Spiz, UltraEnergy (anyone remember that?), Gatorade, Gatorade spiked with maltodextrin, home-made sports drink, etc. I prefer the home-made since I can concoct it to my taste and put in enough electrolytes, which commercial products lack. Here's a simple recipe, which meets the recommendations of the American College of Sports Medicine:
>       • 1/3 c Orange Juice
>       • 12 teaspoons sugar (or use honey if you don't like sugar)
>       • 1/4 teaspoon salt
>       • water to make 1 quart
> I keep a container of frozen OJ in the freezer and scoop some into a bottle. For more calories add more sweetener.
>
> Interestingly, pro team nutritionists are providing real food to riders during stages. The riders can't get enough calories with sports products and want something that tastes real. That's also been my experience on RAAM, 1200s, etc.  More on what pro riders eat and home-made concoctions on my website:
>
> http://www.coach-hughes.com/resources/homemade_cycling_nutrition.html
>
> cheers,
> John

------------------------------------------------------------
Ken Luke           kenl...@gmail.com

"Complexity is easy; Simplicity is hard."
 -- Edmund Keane
------------------------------------------------------------

[Jim House]

John,

 

Your “I’ve used” list took me back to 1974 and ERG – that lemon lime flavor you would rip the foil pack open and add to the bike bottle of water – the start of it all?

I think ERG stood for Electrolyte Replacement with Glucose.

I loved that stuff and it kept me going long after I would normally cramp out of a race.

 

In the modern age the stuff that works best for me and my stomach is half bottle of Cytomax with a few Endurolytes and a half bottle of water per hour.

 

As for the real food the Planters nut mix or cashews in the single server bags and the small boxes of raisins are what I eat most.

 

The folks from Cliff showed me a trick years ago. 

Before opening a Cliff Bar take a kitchen butter knife and press the dull side down the center of the bar in the bag.

Next turn the bag and press two more times till you now have six chunks of cliff bar inside the bag.

Next with scissors cut the bag end open and fold over top and re seal with a rubber band.

Then in your jersey pocket you can open the cliff bag pull out a mouth size chunk and have at it.

Single mouth size servings made easy on the bike is what it is all about for me.

 

Great conversation.

 

Jim House

Maumee, OH