Co Pilot

[Sean Crosby]

How do I co-pilot 3 controllers at the same time (regular controller, quad stick, and adaptive Microsoft controller)?

[Fred Davison]

A device like a Console Tuner Titan 2 or a CronusMax Zen could combine the quadstick with one of the other controllers, then you can co-pilot the third controller on the platform.

The T2, with the bluetooth module, could combine them all into one controller output for the host.

What host platform?  PC or XBox?

On Mon, Jan 31, 2022 at 10:30 AM Sean Crosby <futureme...@gmail.com> wrote:

How do I co-pilot 3 controllers at the same time (regular controller, quad stick, and adaptive Microsoft controller)?

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[Sean Crosby]

That would be awesome! The host is Xbox One S

[Sean Crosby]

Silly question: can I just simply plug the QS into the Microsoft adaptive controller?! 

[Fred Davison]

If you are only going to do a couple buttons with it, and one joystick.

http://quadstick.s3.amazonaws.com/documents/user_manual/um/xbox_adaptive_controller.htm

It is not very flexible, plus you will need a power supply for the XAC.

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[D S]

HI Fred.

You said: "A device like a Console Tuner Titan 2 or a CronusMax Zen could combine the quadstick with one of the other controllers, then you can co-pilot the third controller on the platform."

Could you elaborate a bit more on the Cronus Zen option? Due to the global shortage of Titan Two's I've acquired a Cronus Zen and have had no joy with getting two controllers to work together like co-pilot into a PC. Forget the QS, this is even just using regular DS4 and XBOX controllers. I'd love to know how you achieved this. My end goal would be to use the Quadstick and Xbox Adaptive Controller as one combined device.

[Fred Davison]

You will need to ask CronusMax in their forum.    The T2 automatically passed controller data through from all controllers.  You have to run a script if you need to block or change the mapping of one of the controllers. 

The Zen appears to only pass data from one controller unless it is running a script, but I don't know how to write that script.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/quadstick/3aa89b6d-f606-4b2e-9598-be0c8bdd104an%40googlegroups.com.

[Fred Davison]

I've been trying to find a solution using the Zen to allow dual controllers and I just can't find it.

In fact I've found statements of just the opposite, that only one controller can be used.   That was a year ago.  Maybe that has changed.  

Next, I tried using the XBox Accessories app, which can perform the copilot function for PC games, but it does not accept the output of the Zen as an XBox 1 controller, regardless of the Zen output protocol settings.   Games will work with their XBox 360 or PC settings, but the app won't.

The only thing I got to work with the XBox Accessories app copilot function was a Wingman XB for the Quadstick and an XAC or true XBox One controller.   While many PC games will work with the X-Input emulation of the Zen, or QMP 4, the XBox Accessories app is apparently looking specifically for XBox One controllers, not just X-Input compatible.

[Simpson]

Thanks for your help Fred. 

I came across this post on their forum:

Could using the QS as a keyboard combined with the XAC work? I’d test myself but I currently don’t have access to my devices. 

[Fred Davison]

With three USB-A ports on there, it is a shame it can't do that.

I had a crazy idea, and I think it works:  Use the Zen to convert the XAC into something the Quadstick can read on the USB-A port.   The Quadstick can use the inputs from a Dualshock 4 controller and the Zen can emulate one....

So I clicked on Enable PS4 Speciality (For PS5 Console) and set the Emulator Output Protocol to Playstation 4/5, then plugged an XBox controller into one of the ports on the front of the Zen and voila!  It worked.  

XAC -> Zen -> QS-USB-A -> QS -> PC -> QMP 4 -> virtual XBox controller for PC games....  ??  PROFIT!

Sample config:  USB Host DS4 tester

Next, run QMP 4 and enable the virtual XBox controller emulation....

I also had the PROG port on the side connected to the PC for some extra power for the Zen/XAC part and for monitoring it with ZenStudio.

This could be useful for a lot of random controllers that people might want to use.

[Simpson]

Wow, amazing. That does open up some options doesn’t it. Given that you’re the one who would know and have the power to do so, could the QS firmware be modified to enable the XAC to plug into that back of the QS natively (ie so this can be done without the Zen)?

[Fred Davison]

I've tried.  I didn't have any luck with it.  Sony and Microsoft ignore most of the rules around "Human Interface Devices" (HID) for USB.  They do all kinds of proprietary stuff.

[Simpson]

Ah bummer. Ok will give this a try and let you known what luck I have. 

[Simpson]

Hi Fred, 

Just trying to test this, but I'm having trouble with QMP 4 - I can't seem to get Windows to see the Quadstick as an XBOX controller via ticking the box in QMP 4:

My settings in Steam have everything disabled except XBOX Configuration Support, but the system still detects it as Quadstick:

I have tried different DS3 emulation settings with no improvement.

Are you to suggest anything I've overlooked?

Thanks

David

[Fred Davison]

The quadstick must be in emulation mode 0, 2, or 4.  QMP will not work with other emulation modes.  The emulation mode cannot change AFTER QMP starts.  If it changes, nothing will work.  QMP will need to be restarted.

Send in a debugging report with QMP:

1. Plug the Quadstick into the PC
2. Start QMP
3. Wait 20 seconds
4. Perform the operation that is giving you trouble.
5. Click in the Transcript pane at the bottom of the window.
   
6. Press F1 key
7. Answer prompt to send in the debugging report
8. EXIT QMP.  Ignore any error message.
   
9. Send me an email so I know to go look for the report.

[Simpson]

Ok I solved this one by going back to x360ce ... after opening the program for the first time it gave me an error message saying that there was something that needed to be installed for the emulator to work. I installed that and x360ce worked, then when I came back to QMP 4 it now works. So whatever was installed by x360ce seems to be necessary to get XBOX emulation through QMP 4 working.

Onto the next problem - I can't seem to get any input from anything plugged into the back of the Quadstick. I've tried the Zen with both a XAC and standard XBOX controller (and confirmed in Zen Studio that it is outputting something), and also tried a DS4 controller straight into the Quadstick and can't get it to pass through these controls. Any suggestions?

Cheers

David

[Fred Davison]

Good.

QMP uses the same low-level driver as X360CE.  ViGEmBus must be installed first.   This is explained in the post for QMP 4.

There would have been a message in the QMP transcript about it.  "ViGEmBus driver not found".

Now, both the Quadstick and the XBox controllers will be detected.  Most modern games will ignore the Quadstick.  Some games will try to use both controllers.  If the game cannot be configured to ignore the Quadstick's controller, it be necessary to run HIDHide and configure it to only allow QMP to see the Quadstick controller.  Of course, if the game responds to the Quadstick itself, you can probably just use that and skip running QMP.

[Simpson]

Hi Fred,

This is all up and running pretty well now, thanks for your help.

It made me wonder if you could use a Brooks Super Converter (XBOX -> PS4 https://www.brookaccessory.com/detail/07484504/) instead of the Cronus Zen. I tried it briefly with no luck ... would you expect this to work?

[Fred Davison]

Work for what?  What is connected to what?

The Brook Super Converter series has been replaced by the Wingman series.  The Wingman XE is Brook's current PS4 console adapter.  It adapts just about any controller (including the quadstick) to the PS4 and some PS4 games on the PS5. 

It is not compatible with PS Remote Play, only the consoles.

The BSC XBox One to PS4 Super converter is not compatible with the quadstick.

[Simpson]

Work for what? What is connected to what?

- I was referring to the connection chain you described earlier in this thread. Could a Brooks converter be used instead of a Zen to translate XAC input into the Quadstick USB-A port? If it works it would be cheaper and less configuration/ hassle 

[Fred Davison]

See this thread:  https://groups.google.com/g/quadstick/c/0tbH9Il0z90/m/HP10SFB6AAAJ

The Wingman XE can be used to adapt many controllers to the USB-A port for use by the Quadstick, including the XAC.

[Simpson]

Ah great. Looks like I’ll be getting a Wingman XE then !