Coldest Ride on a Rivendell Ever?

[Mark Reimer]

Over the holidays I got a hair-brained idea to try a really long, cold ride. 165km door-to-door from my apartment to my parents cabin for Christmas. I'd bring my 4-season tent and a new (to me) -30 sleeping bag along and try sleeping out on the frozen lake. I'd done it before in a quinzee, but was eager to try a tent.

The temperature was hovering around -12C for most of the week, so I felt really good about it. Then the day before, everything changed. 

Temperature: -30C, and -40C with the windchill. That's the point where celcius and farenheit meet! The ride would be nearly entirely across the open prairies, so it would be windy. And cold. Very cold. It was too late to back out though, I had told too many people I was going to do it no matter what!

Here's the Atlantis kitted up for the rid

I had a North Face 4-season winter tent in one pannier. A North Face -30C sleeping bag in the other. Carradice bag had spare/dry mitts, hat, down jacket, etc. Front bag had camera, food and a pile of chemical hand/toe warmers. 

Here's a photo a family member took of me while I was about 45km into the ride. She had just asked me if I was having fun. 

And a few more from the ride. 

In the end I only made it halfway there. 85km later my toes had finally frozen solid, and the sun was starting to get pretty low. I was riding with my dad, who's face had begun to blister and turn white from frostbite. We were out for 5 hours. Later in the week, I was in the emergency room for a minor cut and met two people who had turned their hands completely black from exposure on that day, after being outside less than 10 minutes each. I felt pretty good about my 5 hours.

When I arrived at the cabin, the warmth of the fire and blankets was too much to overcome. I spent the night warm and toasty, which I do not regret at all.

I'm going to attempt a much shorter overnight in a few weeks though, so I can test out the winter camping gear. 

Get out there!

[Deacon Patrick]

Awesome, Mark! You've got me beat, both in distance and temp. Wow! I've done those temps winter camping, but not by bike. Tip of me tammie to you! You definitely made the right call to shorten the ride. At those temps and winds, anything you do without losing a digit (or worse) is a roaring success. Feet are definitely the trickiest. For that level of cold, I'd suggest Empire or Steger Mukluks. They don't work for me because we don't get that kind of cold but for a few days at a time, and the days are gennarally too warm for them (they rot out if it's too warm). But for zero and below, they are brilliant! I had -30˚F (or colder, the thermometer bottomed out) and had warm feet just sitting around in them. But my attempt to use Stegers only survived 30 days (14 of use) due to the rotting issue with freeze/thaw. Steger in the end made it right. For overnights, you need multiple liners so they can dry out, as well as a good rotation of socks. We can talk more off group if you have further questions.

With abandon,

Patrick

[Mark Reimer]

Very cool, thanks Patrick! I'll definitely check them out. I was using 45NTH Wolvhammer boots with an SPD clip, which up until that ride have kept my toasty warm on every ride I've ever used them on, including comparable temperatures. But about 2 hours into the ride I started getting cold. 3 hours in and I was uncomfortable. Shortly after I lost all feeling in my toes, which was the driving force in the decision to stop riding. Another 4-5 hours out there would have meant nasty damage for sure. For extreme cold, flat pedals and non-clip boots seem to be a must if you're out for a long time. 

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/OVVdAWWdqVc/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Deacon Patrick]

That's the way it goes with inadequate footwear. And lets face it, at those temps nearly everything is inadequate. But do not ever let your fingers or toes get to the point you think they are warm again, despite conditions being the same. That's the very edge of frostbite.

I've wanted a face mask that covers my nose. I'm fine when climbing, but in a headwind or on the downhills, flesh will freeze off very fast.

With abandon,

Patrick

[Mark Reimer]

I just started using a long merino wool 'tube' which I'm really liking. It's very thin, but long enough that I can either run it  single, double, or triple layered just by folding it back on itself. It lets breath pass through pretty nicely and dries very quickly. 

I also have this for extreme cold, which is made by Seirus Neofleece. It's designed to keep the mask off your face around your mouth, which helps with condensation. It also goes up and hooks around your ears, so there is extra warmth there as well.

[Deacon Patrick]

That looks great! I nose breathe, and anything that get in front of my nostrils drives me batty (not hard to do). Like you, I use merino wool Buffs.

With abandon,

Patrick

[hsmitham]

All I can say is you guy's are nuts!

Well I'll add this, Mark a really compelling story and adventure...though I have to say I'll pay the high real estate prices out here in the land of 20C

~Hugh shivering at 7C Smitham

  Los Angeles, CA 

[cyclotourist]

Mark, those pictures are fantastic, thanks for them and the write up!

I posted a pic to the winter thread, but here's another one of today's outing: https://www.flickr.com/photos/cyclotourist/16046526337/

I have no frame of reference for what you did!!!

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.

To post to this group, send email to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

Cheers,
David

Member, Supreme Council of Cyberspace

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

[Eric Norris]

I’m in SoCal today (alas, with no bike) and it is indeed unnaturally warm here. I had to run the AC in my rental car yesterday!

--Eric N
campyo...@me.com
www.CampyOnly.com
Twitter: @CampyOnlyGuy
Blog: http://CampyOnlyGuy.blogspot.com 

[Eric Platt]

I salute you for riding in such cold.  Have ridden in the teens to about -20F.  As it was 30+ years ago, didn't have the correct gear for it.  Don't think I could get myself out when it gets in the -30 to -40 range.  Wow.  

The only foot covering that I know of that could maybe, just maybe handle that would be Sorrel boots with a couple of layers of socks inside.  Even then, I wouldn't want to ride far.

Eric Platt

St. Paul, MN

[Deacon Patrick]

I haven't had it get cold enough since I got my Sorel's to know for sure (only got down to -10˚F I think), but I find them more constricting (less wide) and far less flexible than a mukluk, both of which contribute greatly to warmth. Plus, they do not ventilate well, which the mukluks do. So warmer all round to go mukluk over Sorel, if you aren't caught in the freeze/thaw cycle. Grin.

With abandon,

Patrick

[dougP]

That's definitely pushing the envelope.  Good on ya for pulling the plug when you did.  This makes my silly little photo of snow in SoCal look pretty wimpy.  The only commonality on the two rides is we both were on Atlantis.  Heck, I didn't even wear full fingered gloves (dumb mistake on my part; lack of experience). 

dougP

On Thursday, January 8, 2015 at 7:37:46 AM UTC-8, Mark Reimer wrote:

[Evan]

Mark,

Dang! You are one tough rider. 

So, did the water in your stainless bottle freeze after ten minutes or did you add a liberal dose of vodka as antifreeze?

Evan E.

SF, CA

[Bill Lindsay]

and here's me, thinking that the FatLantis can't get any more butch.....and there he goes, getting more butch. 

On Thursday, January 8, 2015 at 7:37:46 AM UTC-8, Mark Reimer wrote:

[Marc Irwin]

Helmets off to you!  You are the personification of Rule #9. The lowest I've gotten is last year.  I rode my Hunq in -35F windchill, but just a few miles to have lunch and back.  The scary part was realizing I could not feel the difference between that and more temperate +10-15F.  It only takes a few minutes of exposure. 

Marc

[Bill Lindsay]

I would have given him a Rule #5 to go with that Rule #9.  

[Bob E]

Thanks for the great report and photos, Mark! Your post inspired me to "get out there" and go for a ride in the freshly fallen snow here in New Jersey this afternoon. I was mostly warm and toasty bundled up in several layers of wool, but my toes were uncomfortably cold after only an hour in the 22 degree (above zero, not below) weather; I can't imagine being out in -40 temps! I'd like to know how you dressed for your adventure.

By the way, there was a good post a few weeks ago in Lovely Bicycle! regarding the effect humidity has on how cold one feels:

http://lovelybike.blogspot.com/2014/12/winters-chill-brings-warmer-cold.html

Bob E.

On Thursday, January 8, 2015 at 10:37:46 AM UTC-5, Mark Reimer wrote

Get out there!

[Deacon Patrick]

Way to get out, Bob! Cool ride. Grin.

Sounds like you may have been warmer with fewer socks. If you put on extra socks over what you usually wear, you may have constricted blood flow and thus made you foot much colder. At 22˚F I'd just be in a medium wool sock and a mesh shoe.

As for humidity, as the temp drops it holds less moisture, so it is easy to have high relative humidity and little actual effect or moisture. So at extreme cold we have 99% humidity and flakes forming in thin air and no clouds as the moisture squeezes out.

With abandon,

Patrick

[Bob E]

On Saturday, January 10, 2015 at 7:14:18 PM UTC-5, Deacon Patrick wrote:

Way to get out, Bob! Cool ride. Grin.

Sounds like you may have been warmer with fewer socks. If you put on extra socks over what you usually wear, you may have constricted blood flow and thus made you foot much colder. At 22˚F I'd just be in a medium wool sock and a mesh shoe.

Thanks, Patrick. I was wearing only one pair of socks, but it was a pretty tight fit in the uninsulated leather boots I was wearing, so you're right -- my feet probably were a little too constricted. I'll take your advice, but I just don't think I'm ready for mesh shoes just yet in these temps! Maybe some insulated boots, like Sorels.

I appreciate your input. And speaking of inspiration, you've certainly inspired me to get out more in the winter months -- aside from skiing, I used to pretty much hibernate in winter, but after reading about your exploits, I picked up my first pair of snowshoes (MSR) last year. Winter is fun!

Regards,

Bob

[Deacon Patrick]

Awesome!

I feel like a bit of a charlatan as I haven't been able to get much (and we've had some amazing weather I've had to watch through the window) -- so I get to experience things vicariously through you all. So I am selfishly glad my prior stupidity has inspired you. Grin.

With abandon,

Patrick

[Mark Reimer]

Bob,

In terms of what I wore for -40, here's my standard 'really cold' getup:

Feet: Really thick wool socks, made by Wigwam and supposedly rated to -40. I only wear one pair of thick socks, as stuffing extra socks into the boots removes valuable air space which is essential for insulating. I sometimes throw a chemical toe-warmer in there as well.

Shoes: 45NTH Wolvhammer boots

Legs: Sugoi winter leggings. These are traditional cycling leggings with a chamois. I wear them primarily because they are insulated and have a full wind-proof front which goes up to just below my chest. Over that, I had a pair of wool long underwear. Over those, I wore some MEC Roubaix winter cycling tights. Then last, a pair of knickers to keep the goofy tights-look somewhat at bay, as well as add one final windproof layer over the family jewels.

Upper: First a thin synthetic base layer. This should be replaced soon with merino as it smells, hah! Then a cycling jersey, used only so I can make use of the tri-pockets in the back, which I use to keep food and water warm next to my body. Then a Cima Coppi long sleeve merino wool jersey. Last, a fitted Pearl Izumi soft shell jacket with windproof front and vented back.

Hands: Massive MEC winter gloves with a removable insulated liner, plus chemical hand warmers.

Neck: Merino wool neck/face cover

Head: thin headband, then fitted synthetic MEC hat. If it's REAALLY cold and windy, I'll add ski goggles. 

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/OVVdAWWdqVc/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.

[Bob E]

Mark,

 

Thanks for the breakdown of your kit; it's good to know what works at those conditions. I don't think I'll ever experience that kind of cold (at least not on a bike), but it's a good reference point that I can adjust accordingly for the temperatures I see.

 

This is how I dressed for 22 F:

 

Upper: Smartwool baselayer, EWR heavy wool cycling jersey, Ibex wool vest, Ibex wool jacket,

Lower: Synthetic long johns, REI front-insulated cycling pants.

Head: Pearl Izumi balaclava, Walz wool winter cycling cap

Hands: Winter cycling gloves

Feet: Wool knee-high skiing socks, leather ankle-high boots

 

Cheers!

 

Bob

[Ted Shwartz]

My coldest day happened on my regular commute. It normally takes 45 minutes. That day it took 1 1/2 hours. When I finally got to work I looked up the weather and found out it was 3 below (Fahrenheit) with a 25 mph headwind.

It took a while for my water bottle to thaw, and my brain engage.

The rest was ok, just cooked from the upwind ride. My normal cold weather equipment is a layered approach, and thin wool socks, thick wool socks, and a goretex oversock with Shimano sandles. The feet are well insulated, not constricted, and don't have booty/shoe/cleat holes

Ted Shwartz

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

I don't usually pay attention to stated windchill temps (tailwinds feel warmer), but back when I had an Atlantis (prior to global warming), I commuted on it everyday during Minneapolis winter for several years. I definitely rode a number of days where the actual temperature was in the minus-teens (F). I recall after a prolonged cold snap that 0F was plenty comfortable, and that 10F felt balmy. My cheap Shimano rear hub disengaged when it dipped below minus-10F, but my Phil hub worked even at the coldest temps. Nowadays, I don't leave home till late morning, so I seldom ride in extreme cold temps.

Jim

[Mark Reimer]

Ahh yes, cold freewheels. My Phil Wood hub constantly skipped anywhere below 0C until I degreased the pawls and replaced the lube with a very thin layer of tri-flow. Now it always works, thankfully. 

[Geoffrey]

I have the fasterkatt shoes, I wish I could find teh wolvhammer boots in my size, on the shelf, everyone seems sold out of size 13.