Winter Riding Pants

[Michael Hechmer]

It's Indian Summer here in northern NE, but the temperature is poised to drop and I am thinking about winter riding pants.  The RBW MUSA pants look very light weight. I see a nice looking pair of wool blend at makersandriders.com.  I have tights and country ski pants but would like something I could walk into a restaurant for lunch with friends.  Would like to hear from the experience of other cold weather riders.

Michael

[Garth]

Of course what's "cold" is relative to each person , that said, I love Outdoor Research Equinox Pants .   They are also a lightweight supple brushed nylon, but instead of relying on velcro externally, they have hidden drawcords around the the inside of the ankle . I wear them mostly as knickers by just pulling them up below the knees, or I can wear them as regular pants of course , though I need some sort of straps to keep them absolutely clear of the rings.  I much prefer the pants of my choice and using anything to strap them as opposed to a certain pair with velcro straps, which to me always looks weird .

The main thing though, is these are regular looking outdoor/travel pants .  

[Ron Mc]

my vote is still the MUSA pants with merino wool base layer, but of course, cold here is 40s.  

[Deacon Patrick]

I wear MUSA knickers and the black merino wool not-so-tights from Rivendell. I may have put two pair tights on when riding at -20˚F. Bleow the knee I wear calf warmers and socks and gators as needed. The nylon MUSA knickers/pants are very repelling of wind, which is where most of the cold comes from on the bike. It doesn't take much of an insulate layer to retain the heat with a wind shell over it. Also highly breathable.

With abandon,

Patrick

[Tony DeFilippo]

I'm with Ron, I rode down to about 20deg regularly in musa pants and Patagonia silk weight long underwear... I added rain pants if it was wet or windy. I'm not planning on changing that up this year.

Those who riding pants on the op's link are nice looking though!

[Jim Bronson]

-20F???  I don't there's any bike pants that could get me out riding in those sorts of temperatures.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Ron Mc]

also with Deac, most of the time I will go with knickers, knicker base layer and Falke knee socks.  With big wind, I'll go with the long pants, full -length base layer and thicker crew socks.  What's very typical here is starting the morning in the low 40s and pushing low 70s by afternoon.  With that expectation I use my rando bag for storage and may pop in a public restroom to swap layers.  I always carry shorty socks in case the knee socks become too warm.  

[Tony DeFilippo]

20 deg F, not -20 deg F... below 20 I'm not riding to work usually. 

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this topic, visit https://groups.google.com/d/topic/rbw-owners-bunch/D7BasfFodNw/unsubscribe.
To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.

[WETH]

I commute 8 miles each way wearing MUSA pants over wool briefs and MUSA shorts down to about 26 degrees before I need to add some light weight tights underneath.

[Andrew Marchant-Shapiro]

I used to commute to -10F.  Jeans with rainpants, wool sweater with shell. Leather mittens.  Wool sox inside breadbags inside regular cycling shoes.  Balaclava and sometimes goggles under the helmet.  I'd start out warm, get cool in the feet, warm up in the feet and have moderately cold hands by the time I got to work 8 miles later.  Mittens were a big improvement on gloves, but limited the kind of bike I could ride, obv.  At the time I had a Trek 620 with MTB bars and an AW hub with a trigger shifter.

[Deacon Patrick]

You're way smarter than me, Jim.

With abandon,
Patrick

[Patrick Moore]

I've got several pairs of knickers which between them take care of all cool-to-cold weather riding.  2 pairs of Nashbar 2/3 pants made from good, tight nylon fabric are good with socks (or in my case, just ordered, Nashbar leg warmers) down to 40F or even lower. Then I have 2 pairs of knickers home made from wool dress pants with the material cut from the leg used to line the front from waist to cuffs. These, over tights, are good down to the teens, which is as cold as I care to ride.

Knickers are a great option because you can mix and match layers easily.

And then I have tights in two different thicknesses; and also a pair of MUSA riding pants, first version. And finally, I have a pair of Rick's hemp knickers which are good when the temperatures are between 50 and 60 F. I fact, I have too many leg options, but I can live with that.

*************

Next question: what about your ears and neck? Faux Peruvian caps with earflaps from Target are great if odd looking; Swobo and other cycling specific caps of wool with lesser earflaps are good down to 40F or so, but the flaps ride up and expose the ear tips. Balaklavas are a hassle, IMO and I use them only for long rides in very cold weather.

Neck: a good clan Stuart wool scarf cut into quarters and hemmed tuck neatly into jersey collars. Fleece neck gaiters work too, but are bulky. Wool neck gaiters irritate my neck

On Fri, Oct 17, 2014 at 8:46 AM, Ron Mc <bulld...@gmail.com> wrote:

also with Deac, most of the time I will go with knickers, knicker base layer and Falke knee socks.  With big wind, I'll go with the long pants, full -length base layer and thicker crew socks.  What's very typical here is starting the morning in the low 40s and pushing low 70s by afternoon.  With that expectation I use my rando bag for storage and may pop in a public restroom to swap layers.  I always carry shorty socks in case the knee socks become too warm.  

--

Resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, and letters that get interviews.

By-the-hour resume and LinkedIn coaching.

Other professional writing services.

http://www.resumespecialties.com/

www.linkedin.com/in/patrickmooreresumespec/

Patrick Moore

Alburquerque, Nouvelle Mexique,  Vereinigte Staaten

*************************************

   "Where you come from is gone, where you thought you were going to never was there, and where you are is no good unless you can get away from it. Where is there a place for you to be? No place.

"Nothing outside you can give you any place," he said. "You needn't to look at the sky because it's not going to open up and show no place behind it. You needn't to search for any hole in the ground to look through into somewhere else. You can't go neither forwards nor backwards into your daddy's time nor your children's if you have them. In yourself right now is all the place you've got. If there was any Fall, look there, if there was any Redemption, look there, and if you expect any Judgment, look there, because they all three will have to be in your time and your body and where in your time and your body can they be?

 "Where in your time and your body has Jesus redeemed you?" he cried. "Show me where because I don't see the place. If there was a place where Jesus had redeemed you that would be the place for you to be, but which of you can find it?”     -- Flannery O'Connor, Wise Blood  

[Patrick Moore]

Andy: what sorts of socks? Thick ones? If so, how did you get these into a pair of shoes that fit in the summer?

I've heard that keeping your torso warm (where all the essential organs are) will prevent warming blood from being skinted to your extremities. Not sure if this agrees with my experience, though.

On Fri, Oct 17, 2014 at 9:06 AM, Andrew Marchant-Shapiro <marchan...@gmail.com> wrote:

I used to commute to -10F.  Jeans with rainpants, wool sweater with shell. Leather mittens.  Wool sox inside breadbags inside regular cycling shoes.  Balaclava and sometimes goggles under the helmet.  I'd start out warm, get cool in the feet, warm up in the feet and have moderately cold hands by the time I got to work 8 miles later.  Mittens were a big improvement on gloves, but limited the kind of bike I could ride, obv.  At the time I had a Trek 620 with MTB bars and an AW hub with a trigger shifter.

[iamkeith]

I do a lot of winter riding in Wyoming these days, but on a snow bike.  I found some fantastic pants by Patagonia called "guide pants."  Looks like they've changed a slight bit since I got mine a couple of years ago, but this is close.  Without looking through the entire website, there might be some similar but equally good options, too:  http://www.patagonia.com/us/product/mens-alpine-guide-pants?p=83950-0&pcc=1128

These are great all the way into the really low, sub-zero temperatures.  Wind and moisture resistant, but not too hot for riding.  They have elastic at the bottom that keeps them out of your chain.  They're incredibly comfortable, stretchy, non-binding, non-chafing material.  They're kind of expensive, but not for what they are and for how well made they are.   The only problem is that, like my MUSA knickers and Pants in warmer, transitional weather, I pretty much choose to live in them all the time - not just when I'm riding - so I'm afraid I'm going to wear them out.   BEST ACTIVE WINTER PANTS I'VE EVER OWNED.

On Friday, October 17, 2014 7:28:07 AM UTC-6, Michael Hechmer wrote:

[Andrew Marchant-Shapiro]

Patrick:

I don't recall the name right now...I'm wearing through my last few pair.  Ah.  DeFeet Blaze, IIRC.  Not especially high, but thick in the right places.  Perfect for me, and they likely fit because since I have size 13B (very narrow) feet, even size 13 cycling shoes tend to be a moderately loose fit.

[Patrick Moore]

Thanks; good reviews from the quick google I just did. In fact, I may have a pair of these myself, as I came into a stash of very lightly used DeFeet and Icebreaker socks sold on one list or another. I gather that their warmth comes from their tight weave as much as from their bulk.

[Patrick Moore]

Speaking of winter riding pants, I have a NOS pair of very thick wool army pants from some European country that have been sitting in my extras bin for 10 years or so. Never worn by me. ~34 waist and ~32 inseam, but I can check.

Make offer. Shipping from 87120. Photos coming.

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.

To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.

To post to this group, send email to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Ron Mc]

I don't think Deac puts on shoes until 10 below

[ascpgh]

I picked up a pair of Mammut soft shell pants off the sale rack at REI last year. They are made of a Schoeller fabric that is inherently water resistant and look remarkably normal with jean-style pockets, belt loops and snap/zip front. No provision to snug the cuff for riding, but my velcro reflector band makes that a moot issue. Not too hot once indoors either. These soft shell pants are the ticket for opening up the temperature range for this next level gear after MUSA pants are deemed too thin.  Despite the very normal looking pants, I draw more stares for coming in from the cold, off a bicycle, than for any clothing I'm wearing. 

Andy Cheatham

Pittsburgh

[Shawn Granton]

When it gets cold and wet enough in the Pacific NW (say like next month), I pull out the old military wool surplus pants. The pair I've owned for about 7 years came from the local army surplus for like $10, probably (East) German origin. Good thick wool that is great for cold and wet. I had them hemmed and made into knickers. After all those years I've finally worn them out, so found another pair for about the same price and am going to convert to knickers as well!

I've seen several European winter wool knickers at the surplus and online, but unfortunately I've never found any in my size. But they are out there, and rarely more than $40.

yours,

Shawn

http://urbanadventureleague.wordpress.com/ 
http://groups.google.com/group/urban-adventure-league-portland 
http://societyofthreespeeds.wordpress.com/ 

http://www.flickr.com/photos/urbanadventureleaguepdx/  

http://bikesspottedpdx.tumblr.com/ 
Un-electronic mail goes here: P O Box 14185, Portland OR 97293-0185

[Jim Bronson]

I was responding to Deacon Patrick who did mention negative 20 Fahrenheit.

> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an

> email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--
Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

[Chris Chen]

two words: COVER EVERYTHING

"I want the kind of six pack you can't drink." -- Micah

[Eric Daume]

Several years ago, I ordered a custom made jacket and pants from Foxwear. Basically a one man shop in Idaho that makes sports clothing, so definitely MUSA. But the prices were very reasonable, it was maybe $220 shipped for the jacket, pants and a hat. I really like the stuff, especially the pants: they're made from some lined, windproof Gore Tex type fabric, and they seem good by themselves between the lower 50s and maybe upper 20s. Since I'm tall and thin, it was nice to get something that fit: long enough (finally!), slightly baggy, not tight like, er, tights, but a bit trimmer than sweatpants. Normal enough I can wear them into a store and not feel like a freak.

Eric Daume
Dublin, OH

On Fri, Oct 17, 2014 at 9:28 AM, Michael Hechmer <mhec...@gmail.com> wrote:

It's Indian Summer here in northern NE, but the temperature is poised to drop and I am thinking about winter riding pants.  The RBW MUSA pants look very light weight. I see a nice looking pair of wool blend at makersandriders.com.  I have tights and country ski pants but would like something I could walk into a restaurant for lunch with friends.  Would like to hear from the experience of other cold weather riders.

Michael

--

[Kevin M]

IMHO the answer is Swrve midweight pants. They are not quite soft-shell, have 4-way stretch, are breathable and water resistant, look normal(!), and are tailored for riding. They come in hipster skinny and kinda skinny. They also make soft-shell pants but I prefer layering underneath the mid weight stuff. I'll wear my wool non-tights underneath them below 40, and amfib tights underneath below 25 or so. 

These pants are just super comfortable. Definitely the best peace of kit i have picked up this year. 

Kevin 

Bring on that Arctic Vortex, I'm ready. 

Chicago, IL

[Michael Hechmer]

This looks like what I had in mind, but their website says pretty much the same thing about every item and the photos are too small to see clearly.  Gotta think about it.

Hi of 45 for tomorrow, so it looks like indian summer is over.

Michael

[Deacon Patrick]

High of 45 IS indian summer. Grin.

With abandon,

Patrick

[cyclotourist]

When it drops below 60F, I stay inside! 

Brrrrrrr....

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bun...@googlegroups.com.
To post to this group, send email to rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com.
Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

--

Cheers,
David

Member, Supreme Council of Cyberspace

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

[Patrick Moore]

Oh, you lose too much riding time! I'm no Deacon Patrick, but I'm good on a sunny, not too windy day, down to the upper teens in dry NM winter. 60F is just perfect riding weather -- wool really comes into its own when the temp drops below 65F.

[cyclotourist]

I think it only gets into the 50s for three or four days of the year, so nope, not missing too much... :-)

[Shawn Granton]

On Sat, Oct 18, 2014 at 6:58 PM, cyclotourist <cyclot...@gmail.com> wrote:

I think it only gets into the 50s for three or four days of the year, so nope, not missing too much... 

Would that be defined as a Polar Vortex then?

;-) 

[Steve Palincsar]

On 10/18/2014 09:58 PM, cyclotourist wrote:

I think it only gets into the 50s for three or four days of the year, so nope, not missing too much... :-)

Where are you located?  Hawaii?

[Patrick Moore]

Et in arcadia ego ....

[Patrick Moore]

That's Arcadia, CA, of course.

[cyclotourist]

I kid, I kid... but really, I have the opposite problem: I can't ride in the summer as the temps are 100F+ and somewhat humid. I have to time my rides so I can be done before it hits 90F!!!!!! SoCal is the opposite of most of the country in SO many ways... :-)

[Dan A]

I second the vote for Foxwear. Lou makes great stuff with custom sizing at very reasonable prices.

Dan Abelson

[Ron Mc]

sorry, no time to tarry gotta go is 62 degrees and dry this morning with a projected high of 76.  

[jimD]

I concur.

-JimD (in sunny Santa Clara, Ca.)  😊

[Andrew Marchant-Shapiro]

I dissent.  I've never lived anywhere one could do that and ride either side of July.

[lungimsam]

I love my MUSA long pants (Gray with blue edition).

But I wish they had a special winter version of MUSA long pants with a windstopper material from the waistband down to below the knees.

[Ron Mc]

Mark, try searching 3/4-length merino wool base layer.  

[Tonester]

REI Acme pants, but my "winter" is pretty mild in California.

[Mojo]

I give this answer to this question every year.

 The best winter active pant is from XC Sporthill, their cross country ski pant. Period, no debate. :-)

http://www.sporthill.com/products2011.php?ProductGroup=2100

I use these for riding, xc-skiing, and hiking into the 20s. They last for many years (decades? I'm on my second pair since 1996), stand up to saddle wear well. Wash easy and dry quick.

They have a new (to me) pant with 'wind panels' in the front

http://www.sporthill.com/products2011.php?ProductGroup=2850

For temperatures ~5-20F I add some synthetic fishnet knickers underneath by Brynje of Norway. 

http://www.nordiclifeuk.co.uk/index.php/brynje-home?gclid=CLKrpo6OvsECFcKHaQodO18A-Q

For temperatures at or below zeroF, I add a nylon shall pant that has zippers up the side of the legs.

On top I use a similar system (Brynje fishnet under Sporthill 3SP under a nylon zip shell for the coldest skis/rides). 

Or I use a Sporthill 3 SP top under a Ibex Breakaway jacket for windy cold.

 http://shop.ibex.com/Wool-Clothing/Mens-Vests-Jackets/Breakaway-II-Jacket

I use wool socks, hats and balaclava. 

Gloves go from thin to thick to mittens. I have a pair of ski over-mitts that fit nicely over my gloves and ski pole straps. 

Boots get over-boots around 10F. Thicker socks are counter-productive and colder.

MUSA pants don't even cut autumn temperatures. Thin, slick nylon doesn't trap warmth and feels unpleasant against the skin. And my hairy legs build up static in them; yuck. 

[Kieran J]

Hey Mojo - these look great. I always like seeing MD-Tall sizes! And I like the tapered leg and slim cuff.

Do you have both versions of the pants? Is one "heavier/thicker" than the other?

KJ

[Joe Broach]

​

On Tue, Oct 21, 2014 at 9:14 AM, 'Mojo' via RBW Owners Bunch <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

[...]

MUSA pants don't even cut autumn temperatures. Thin, slick nylon doesn't trap warmth and feels unpleasant against the skin. And my hairy legs build up static in them; yuck. 

​Good tips Mojo. Sporthill has a nice size range, too. Rachel wore a tiny pair all winter commuting back in Montana. Your MUSA description sounds like the original pants. They were/are amazing hot weather "sun pants" for me. Also some of the best wet wading fishing pants I've used as long as the brush isn't too prickly. I'm still nursing along my old pair years later. The newer MUSAs I've tried were lots thicker, stiffer, and warmer.

best,

joe broach

portland, or​

--

[Mojo]

Hi Kieran,

I have only the tradiitonal Sporthill XC pant and love love them. They breathe very well and block much but not all wind. They are warm when wet. I am leery of clothes that "block" the wind. If I want wind block, I add a wind shell on top.

Thanks for bringing up the Long sizing. I am 6ft with an 89 PBH so use pants with a 33-34 inseam. With the XC Sporthill pant, the Large Long size fits me well.

Joe in western Colorado Ramey

[Mojo]

Yes Joe, you are right. I bought the originals. I didn't know there was an updated version. 

[Jim Bronson]

When it drops below 60F, I start whining, but I ride anyway.

[Deacon Patrick]

Mojo,

I have the updated MUSA knickers and they are great down to about 20˚F before they need wool tights under them. I've hairy legs also and have never had a problem with static or them feeling strange against my skin. But I'm an odd ball. Grin.

With abandon,

Patrick

[Mojo]

Thanks Patrick and Joe. Obviously I need to stay up-to-date with the fashion trends at Rivendell!