A wholesale assault on US science

[John Clark]

More than 1900 members of the US National Academies of Sciences have signed an open letter to the American people saying that the Trump administration has conducted “a wholesale assault on US science”. You can read it in the link below, I doubt if any of the members of the Trump cult will read it but if they do I hope they ask themselves, will destroying science in this country really Make America Great Again? 

To the American people

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

w23

[Cosmin Visan]

Awww... so saaad. Autistic nerds are left without their religion. :((((((((

[spudb...@aol.com]

My criticism of the Dems is we have gives tens of trillions over the decades with little return on investment, considering the cash spent. Secondly, as I hold, scientists who let their Ideology Eclipse theiir Intellect, are of no use to the rest of  the species. Gentlemen, if you get furious over little with us nornies, then yes, you have misread the room. But of course, you don't care. Basdic research is the essence of science, but the lead time toi usefulness is problematic. Tell us why we should fund you John? Where's the ROI? 

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[Quentin Anciaux]

Knowledge

All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. (Roy Batty/Rutger Hauer)

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[John Clark]

On Fri, Apr 18, 2025 at 12:42 PM 'spudb...@aol.com' via Everything List <everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Basdic research is the essence of science, but the lead time toi usefulness is problematic.

We've been investigating cancer for a long time but we still haven't found a cure, so are you advising that we give up?  Are you advising that the US should meekly let China take the lead in AI without a fight? And by the way, doesn't it bother you that you and Trump are on the same side of this issue as a creature like Cosmin? 

> Where's the ROI?

I am absolutely certain that you're looking straight at one of those returns on investment at this very instant!

 John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

tfr

 

[Cosmin Visan]

String theory was pseudoscience from the very beginning, with no testable prediction whatsoever, yet for 50 years they threw money at those socially challenged "physicists".

[spudb...@aol.com]

Low ROI. For cancer my B in law was an oncologist. So I have a rough idea on that specifality. For me, I would be funding billions specifically like big pharrma does, but for organ printing got obvious reasons. Say a kidney hasn't metatticized yet. Rip  it out and replace, before chemo is necessary. Also organ printing would indeed have a very high ROI as well. Pure science hasn't existed since Penzias and Wilson. Lets have projects and actually get these achieved. 

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[spudb...@aol.com]

When scientists lie, the decide to lie not by outright deception, but by the art of exaggeration. String theory may work out, but I am not the boss here. Whatever the Universe does as non-biological mind, The Non-Biological Mind, The Boltzmann Brain network, seems ok. 

Try this on for size as but one example. 

Vazza & Feletti 2020. If you haven't already dicussed this, you will likely in Barcelona. 

Italian scientists discovered: The universe and the human brain are highly similar. Are we in someone's dream? - iNEWS

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[Russell Standish]

On Fri, Apr 18, 2025 at 04:42:17PM +0000, 'spudb...@aol.com' via Everything List wrote:
> My criticism of the Dems is we have gives tens of trillions over the decades
> with little return on investment, considering the cash spent. Secondly, as I
> hold, scientists who let their Ideology Eclipse theiir Intellect, are of no use
> to the rest of the species. Gentlemen, if you get furious over little with us
> nornies, then yes, you have misread the room. But of course, you don't care.
> Basdic research is the essence of science, but the lead time toi usefulness is
> problematic. Tell us why we should fund you John? Where's the ROI?
>

There is a well-known anecdote about Michael Faraday, who exhibited an
early form of an electric motor in 1821, and was asked what was the use
of his electromagnetism. His response was "what is the use of a
baby?".

The question should not be whether society invests in scientific
research - it should be, and at a few percent of GDP, is modest,
affordable and it has historically had extremely high ROI given
long-enough time. The question should be who decides which scientific
programmes get the money. I can see problems with all the usual
choices: the scientists themselves, nameless bureaucrats, the
broligarchs, or politicians like Trump.

Cheers

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----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dr Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile)
Principal, High Performance Coders hpc...@hpcoders.com.au
http://www.hpcoders.com.au
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[Cosmin Visan]

The current religion decides. If the "research" is about matter, all the money. If the research is about consciousness, 0 money.

[spudb...@aol.com]

Oh, Professor, I have zero opposition to us the taxpayer spending trillions on R&D for both basic research and technology. I do note with deep concern that trillions over the years has been wasted. Unfocused discovery of wonder is terrfifc, but human need supercedes unrelated stuff in my opinion. How much is enough, and when does x cross y for a return on investment? I am not a young man and have been waiting 45 years for fusion, either magnetic or inertial confinement, eh? Space travel will benefit, but again 20 years? 

What seems more likely in a few yers is pervoskite solar, possibly deep georthermal (maybe), and we could've developed fail-safe fission, and JC's MSR reactors. Medicine? That's the Cash Cow for R&D and seems underfunded, and uncoordinated. I'd have used US Congresswoman Nancy Pelosi's method of income engancement for All US citizens, by giving US taxpayers the right to donate 1% of their taxes to stocks that have R&D behind them, say medicines? Again, ROI. Just an idea...

Ciao! 

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[spudb...@aol.com]

Can't we do consciousness studies with neurobiology? A;so, there's neen some interesting articles lately that seem to be evidential concerning panpsychism, via computer science, and astrophysics, specifically. Lots of videos too, many of them doubtful. 

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[Russell Standish]

On Sun, Apr 20, 2025 at 01:24:08PM +0000, 'spudb...@aol.com' via Everything List wrote:
> Oh, Professor, I have zero opposition to us the taxpayer spending trillions on
> R&D for both basic research and technology. I do note with deep concern that
> trillions over the years has been wasted. Unfocused discovery of wonder is
> terrfifc, but human need supercedes unrelated stuff in my opinion. How much is
> enough, and when does x cross y for a return on investment? I am not a young
> man and have been waiting 45 years for fusion, either magnetic or inertial
> confinement, eh? Space travel will benefit, but again 20 years?
>
> What seems more likely in a few yers is pervoskite solar, possibly deep
> georthermal (maybe), and we could've developed fail-safe fission, and JC's MSR
> reactors. Medicine? That's the Cash Cow for R&D and seems underfunded, and
> uncoordinated. I'd have used US Congresswoman Nancy Pelosi's method of income
> engancement for All US citizens, by giving US taxpayers the right to donate 1%
> of their taxes to stocks that have R&D behind them, say medicines? Again, ROI.
> Just an idea...

You mean everyday citizens decide where the money's spent? This would
have a different bias to the above, vulnerable to social media
amplified influence. Probably not too dissimilar to politicians
deciding, just with somewhat less formal lobbying methods.

I seem to recall distributing funds by random lottery might be the
least worst option of them all. At very least, scientists/academics
would not need to be spending all their time writing non-productive
research grants that they have to do now.

>
> Ciao!

[Cosmin Visan]

All these funds problems will disappear if people would become scientists for the right reasons. Instead, they become because in their autistic minds they think they will impress girls. Trololol.

[spudb...@aol.com]

Interesting proposal. Based on the "corruption" of US Congressman doing stock trading, I do hold with treating the US taxpayer, as the same. Allowing us to invest in Sci R&D. Permitting us all to gain profits. Start with 1% of Taxes to gain ROI, Professor. In Aus, you folk could invest in say solar tech, with a quicker ROI say than Fusion? Or do QC Neural Net investments verus LLM's. Medical of course for the biggest slice of cheese for us rats in the rat-race. 

Consider? 

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