Alt.Religion.Wicca Frequently Asked Questions Version 2 (FAQ)
ba...@dmcom.net
Last-modified: 10 January 2009
URL: http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
Hear ye the words of the Star Goddess; she in the dust of whose feet are
the hosts of heaven, and whose body encircles the universe:
"I who am the beauty of the green earth, and the white moon among the
stars, and the mystery of the waters, call unto thy soul: Arise, and
come unto me. For I am the soul of nature, who gives life to the
universe. From Me all things proceed, and unto Me all things must
return; and before My face, beloved of gods and of men, let thine
innermost divine self be enfolded in the rapture of the infinite. Let My
worship be within the heart that rejoices; for behold, all acts of love
and pleasure are My rituals. And therefore let there be beauty and
strength, power and compassion, honor and humility, mirth and reverence
within you. And thou who thinkest to seek Me, know that thy seeking and
yearning shall avail thee not unless thou knowest the Mystery: that if
that which thou seekest thou findest not within thee, thou wilt never
find it without. For behold, I have been with thee from the beginning;
and I am that which is attained at the end of desire."
- From Doreen Valiente's "Charge of the Goddess"
This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ) is designed as an
introduction to Wicca and to this news group as well as a reference for
those investigating the religion of Wicca for the first time.
ARW FAQ was first composed in March 1995 as a composite of three drafts
by different authors: Lleu (wiz...@bga.com), fir...@computel.com and
Ra...@teleport.com. Thanks to Lorax (tyagi nagasiva), Ounce, Karen,
Janice Barlow, Anthony Thompson, Daniel Cohen, Balachandra, Bruce Jones
and C.M. Joserlin ("Raven") for their helpful and thoughtful comments at
various stages of this project. Their views have enriched it greatly.
Version Two is an updated version of the ARW FAQ, supported by many
posters of the group.
1 Introductions
1.1 What is this group for?
1.2 What is Wicca and how is it related to Paganism?
1.3 Why are there posts that have nothing to do with Wicca?
1.4 Which posts provide the best information about Wicca?
2 Basic Orientation
2.1 What are some common, basic beliefs in Wicca?
2.2 What god/desse/s do Wiccans worship?
2.3 What tools and rituals do you use?
2.4 Is there a set liturgy or liturgical calendar?
2.5 What is basic Wiccan theology?
2.6 What are Wiccan ethics, the "Wiccan Rede" and "three-fold law?"
3 Wiccan Beliefs and Practices
3.1 Can I be a Christian/ Jew/ Muslim/ Buddhist/ Taoist/ Astrologer/
Druid/ Shaman/ omnivore/ whatever and a Wiccan?
3.2 What are "dedication" and "initiation" in Wicca? 3.3 Do all Wiccans
practice magic/k?
3.4 Is Wicca the same thing as witchcraft?
3.5 What were "the Burning Times?"
3.6 What are the origins of Wicca?
3.7 What are the major traditions in Wicca?
3.8 What is the "Book of Shadows?" Where do I get one?
3.9 What is a coven and how do I join one?
3.10 How do I witness about Jesus Christ to a Wiccan?
3.11 How do I learn more about Wicca?
4 Resources
4.1 Introductory books on Wicca
4.2 Other Internet Newsgroups
4.3 Wiccan Organizations
4.3 Wiccan Periodicals
4.4 Respected authors
4.5 Other Internet Resources
4.6 Can I get spells here?
5 Copyright and Distribution Notice
1 Introductions
1.1) What is this group for?
Established in December 1994, alt.religion.wicca is Usenet news
group for the discussion of Wicca, also known by some as Wicce, Goddess
Worship, the Old Religion, Witchcraft (with a capital "W") or simply
"the Craft."
1.2) What is Wicca and how is it related to Paganism?
"Wicca" is the name of a contemporary Neo-Pagan religion, largely
promulgated and popularized by the efforts of a retired British civil
servant named Gerald Gardner. In the last few decades, Wicca has spread
in part due to its popularity among feminists and others seeking a more
woman-positive, earth-based religion. Like most Neo-Pagan
spirituality's, Wicca worships the sacred as immanent in nature, drawing
much of its inspiration from the non-Christian and pre-Christian
religions of Europe. "Neo-Pagan" simply means "new pagan" (derived
from the Latin _paganus_, "country-dweller") and hearkens back to times
before the spread of today's major monotheistic (one god) religions.
A good general rule is that most Wiccans are Neo-Pagans but not all
Pagans are Wiccans. Please consult alt.pagan or the alt.pagan FAQ
(archived at http://http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/altpag.txt) for more
general
information on Neo-Paganism.
1.3 Why are there posts that have nothing to do with Wicca?
ARW is an unmoderated group where some have come to consider a
home. We are a family of sorts and all families have their squabbles. No
one censors any thing that is posted here. People post what they feel
like posting and how they desire to post. Another similarity to families
is that you cannot pick your relatives and here we cannot pick whom
posts. Friends and foes have been made over the years at this group and
at times it shows very much.
1.4 Which posts provide the best information about Wicca?
Due to the unmoderated status of the group not all posts have the
same value or merit. Just because it is posted often does not make it
good advice or information. There are some posters who do not understand
Wicca, some who have no personal experience of Wicca, and some who
deliberately seek to present a very negative view of Wicca. Any advice
which is given, even if in a format which appears authoritative, should
be treated with caution. The reader is encouraged to treat all postings
(including this FAQ) with resevation until exploring the posted
information and the poster's history.
2 Basic Orientation
2.1 What are some common, basic beliefs in Wicca?
In addition to its positive view of nature, many find Wicca more
welcoming of women than other religions, with an emphasis on personal
experience and a tolerance of other paths. As a whole, Wiccans value
balance with a respect for diverse complexity, seeing sexuality and
embodiment as essentially positive, spiritual gifts. There is a sense
of personal connection to the divine life source, which is open to
contact through "psychic power," mysticism or "natural magic."
2.2 What god(desse)s do Wiccans worship?
Although some Wiccans focus on particular gods from particular
world mythologies, Wiccans may worship many god(desse)s by many
different names. Most worship some form of the Great Goddess and Her
consort, The Horned God. Such duo-theistic forces are often conceived
as embodying complementary polarities, not in opposition. In some
traditions worship of the Goddess is emphasized, although in others the
Goddess and God are seen as complementary co-equals. The Goddess and
God may be seen as associated with certain things (such as the Goddess
with the earth or moon, God with sun and wildlife, etc.), but there are
no hard and fast rules. Some traditions worship the Goddess alone while
others see Divinity as essentially beyond human understanding, with
"Goddess" and "God" simply a convenient shorthand.
2.3 What tools and rituals do you use?
Some ritual items are common to almost every Wiccan tradition, such
as the athame (ritual knife) and chalice (ritual cup). Others may be
used by some traditions but not others: bells, brooms, candles,
cauldrons, cords, drums, incense, jewelry, special plates, pentacles,
scourges, statues, swords, staves and wands. The meaning of these
items, their use and manufacture will differ among traditions and
individuals. Usually a Wiccan ritual will involve some sort of creation
of sacred space (casting a circle), invocation of divine power, sharing
of dance/song/food or wine and a thankful farewell and ceremonial
closing. Rituals may be held at Wiccan "sabbats" or "esbats"
(see below) or to mark life transitions such as births, coming of-age,
marriages/handfastings, housewarmings, healings, deaths or other rites
of passage.
2.4 Is there a set liturgy or liturgical calendar?
Most Wiccans mark eight holiday "sabbats" in the "wheel of the
year," falling on the solstices, equinoxes and the four "cross-quarter
days" on or about the first of February, May, August and November. The
names of the sabbats may differ between traditions, and many Wiccans
also mark "esbats," rituals for worship in accordance with a given moon
phase (such as the night of the full moon). Although there is no one
source for all Wiccan liturgy, many liturgical items such as the methods
for casting the circle, the "Charge of the Goddess," certain myths and
formulaic expressions are common to many traditions. Some common
formulaic expressions include "hail and welcome/farewell," "blessed be"
(sometimes abbreviated on the net as B*B) and the closing "Merry meet
and merry part, and merry meet again." There is no one bible or book of
common prayer for all Wiccans, however, and great value is placed on
creativity, poetry and the artful integration of different myths and
ritual elements.
2.5 What is basic Wiccan theology?
Some myths and associations are common to many Wiccan traditions,
such as the Goddess' giving birth to the Horned God, the theme of their
courtship and His death, the descent of the Goddess into the realm of
death and others. Another theological point held in common by many
Wiccans is the *immanence* of deity/divinity within the natural world,
self and cycle of the seasons. This places value on the earth and this
world, as distinguished from views of transcendent divinity and an
unenchanted creation. Wiccans as a whole are very much "into" cycles:
of life, of the moon and seasons. Cyclical change as an erotic dance of
life, death and rebirth is a popular theme in Wiccan imagery, ritual and
liturgy. (_Thea_ is Greek for "goddess," by the way, so "theology" is
not a typo here, but a way of emphasizing the Goddess.)
Although it may be foolhardy to compare things as complex as
religions, people do. Many Wiccans distinguish themselves from
Satanists, for example, in preferring complementary views of divinity to
adversarial ones. Others may note their own comfort and embrace of
ambiguity and polytheism (many gods). Unlike the Jewish, Christian or
Islamic traditions, there is little emphasis on interpretation of
"scripture" or a revealed text. Although many Wiccans may believe in
some sort of reincarnation, they may distinguish themselves from
Buddhists in seeing life as a journey or adventure without any desire to
"leave the wheel" of return. Like Hindus, Wiccans may pride themselves
on their tolerance for other paths, like Buddhists they may value
personal insight and like Taoists they may seek to align themselves more
perfectly with nature. Some Wiccans may separate themselves from the
"New Age" in their value for both "light" and "dark" aspects of
existence, a do-it-yourself attitude and a distrust of money or
hierarchies of "enlightenment" which seem to place spirituality up for
sale.
2.6 What are Wiccan ethics, the "Wiccan Rede" and "three-fold law?"
Wiccan ethics are seldom codified in a legalistic way, but may be
informed by some common expressions such as the "Wiccan Rede" and the
"three-fold law." According to most versions of the three-fold law,
whatever one does comes back to one thrice-multiplied, in amplified
repercussion. One short, rhymed version of the Wiccan Rede states
"Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill: An it harm none, do what you
will." Often "none" is interpreted to include the doer themself in
analogy to the "golden rule" of other faiths.
There are no universal proscriptions regarding food, sex, burial or
military service and Wiccans, as a rule, discourage proselytization
(attempts to convert others to a different religion).
3 Wiccan Beliefs and Practices
3.1 Can I be a Christian/ Jew/ Muslim/ Buddhist/ Taoist/ Astrologer/
Druid/ Shaman/omnivore/ whatever and a Wiccan?
Since much of Wicca is more worldview and ceremonial practice than
anything else, there is no Wiccan proscription of such things. Most
traditions have no requirement to denounce any other faith and, indeed,
Wiccans often look askance at "one true wayisms" which claim to have a
monopoly on truth, divine revelation or enlightenment. "Christian
Wiccans" probably face the largest skepticism, however, given the
history and ongoing reality of allegedly "Christian" persecution.
Prejudice (fear of job-loss, child-custody challenges, ridicule,
vandalism and even violence) may still keep many Wiccans "in the broom
closet," with concealment and dual observances a traditional Wiccan
defense against persecution. This may make contact with Wiccans
difficult in some areas. Since Wiccan worship is fairly active by it's
nature, non-participating observers are rarely invited to Wiccan
rituals.
3.2 What are "dedication" and "initiation" in Wicca?
These things mean different things in different traditions. Usually
"dedication" ceremonially marks the beginning of Wiccan study, while
"initiation" may mark full membership in a coven/tradition (such as
after "a year and a day") or may indicate elevation in skill or to
special clergy status. Some traditions look on all initiates as
co-equal clergy, while others have grades or "degrees" of initiation,
which may be marked by distinct sacramental ceremonies, duties or
expectations within the tradition.
Some people claim that "only a Witch can make a Witch," whereas
others say that only the Goddess and God or demonstrated skill can make
a witch. Doreen Valiente was initiated by Gardner himself, but she slyly
asks, "who initiated the first witch?" Valiente and others assert that
those who choose to "bootstrap" a coven into existence (by an initial
initiation) or to use self-initiation may do so, citing the Universal
Declaration of Human Rights. Self-dedications are also quite common
among new practitioners and solitary Wiccans ("solitaries").
3.3 Do all Wiccans practice magic/k?
That depends on what one means by magic. The occultist Aleister
Crowley helped re-popularize archaic spellings such as "magick",
terming his "the Science and Art of causing Change to occur in
conformity with Will." Others may think of magic as folk parapsychology
or see the changes wrought as primarily changes in consciousness.
Ceremonialists may distinguish between the "high magick" of ritual
observance and the "low magic" of practical spells (such as for
protection and health). Almost all Wiccans, however, have some sort of
ceremony or psychological practice to better attune themselves with
divinity, encouraging insight and a sense of efficacy. Others may cast
love spells or other curses but no, we don't do it for strangers on the
net and no, we don't confuse this with stage magic.
3.4 Is Wicca the same thing as witchcraft?
The short answer is no. Many cultures have a negative word like
"witchcraft," often viewing it as a malevolent, supernatural tool used
by the weak, old or malicious. Some people use the term "witchcraft" to
cover more general skills, such as counseling, the occult and herbcraft.
Some Wiccans call themselves "Witches," capitalizing it as a gesture of
solidarity with the victims of the Burning Times, but this is a
personal decision. Although many Wiccans today may cast spells and
practice magic/k, these are not considered an integral part of Wicca by
all Wiccans. Wicca is not traditional folk magic and all magic is not
necessarily Wiccan, anymore than all people who pray belong to any
particular religion.
3.5 What were "the Burning Times?"
"The Burning Times" is the term used by many modern Neo-Pagans and
feminists to refer to the great European witch-hunts of the early modern
period, coincident with the time of the reformation and seen by many as
a crucial step in Christianity's crushing of the Pagan religions,
driving these underground. Some authors claim as many as ten million
people were killed in these hunts, while more recent scholarship puts
the number of documented deaths at 20-100 thousands, 80-90% of these
women. Sometimes these numbers are doubled to account for non-judicial
killings and deaths from torture, suicide, and etceteras. Whatever the
numbers, however, victims of these hunts are perceived as martyrs by
Wiccans today, with the lessons of intolerance, misogyny and religious
terror clearly noted.
3.6 What are the origins of Wicca?
This is a matter of some debate within Wiccan circles. Some
Wiccans see their inspiration and traditions as coming directly from the
gods. Certain Wiccan mythology holds that Wicca has come down from the
Stone Age, surviving persecution in secret covens for hundreds of years.
Others say that their Wicca is a long-held family tradition (or "fam
trad"), passed down through villages and grandmothers. Aidan Kelly
argues that modern Wicca was largely pieced together by Gerald Gardner
from Margaret Murray, Charles Leland and other sources, with significant
revisions by Doreen Valiente (and others), beginning in 1939. Whatever
its origins, Wicca today is a vibrant, modern religion, open to change,
creativity and personalization.
3.7 What are the major traditions in Wicca and where do they come from?
Aidan Kelly argues that all of Wicca derives from Gerald Gardner,
with some crucial editing and revision by his initiate Doreen Valiente.
Alex Sanders is widely thought to have acquired a Gardnerian book of
shadows, with which he started his own "Alexandrian" tradition,
initiating Janet and Stewart Farrar. Other well-known traditions
include Raymond Buckland's Seax Wicca, Victor and Cora Anderson's Faery
Wicca and feminist Dianic Wicca, which emphasizes the Goddess as put
forward by such authors as Zsuzsanna Budapest. There are also branches
of Wicca identifying themselves with various ethnicity's and traditions
such as druidism, shamanism and so forth.
3.8 What is the "Book of Shadows?" Where do I get one?
The Book of Shadows (or "BoS") is sort of a customized reference
book for Wiccans, containing useful information such as myths,
liturgical items, one's own writings or records of dreams and magical
workings. According to Gerald Gardner, such a book should be
handcopied from teacher to student but in practice not every Wiccan has
a "book of shadows" and few are exactly alike. Sometimes only initiates
are allowed access to a tradition's book, or it may be called by a
different name, such as "mirror book," "magical diary" or "grimoire."
There are many "books of shadows" available in print and on-line
(leading to the "disk of shadows" or even "directories of shadows"
several megabytes large). If you'd like to copy from these sources for
your personal use, you may assemble your own book, but please observe
copyright laws in your newfound enthusiasm.
3.9 What is a coven and how do I join one?
The coven is the basic, cellular "congregation" for some Wiccans,
but is often very formal, selective and closed, aiming for an ideal of
"perfect love and perfect trust" among members. Most Wiccans begin in
less formal ways such as attending festivals, public rituals, classes or
more open groups (often called "circles"). Many Wiccans probably begin
and continue practice as "solitaries," whether before, after or while a
member of a coven. Solitary practice is a valid "tradition" in the
Craft, but some good places to find other Wiccans are on the net, at
public Pagan events or through occult, political or "new age"
bookstores.
3.10 How do I witness about Jesus Christ to a Wiccan?
First of all, please don't do it here. Alt.religion.wicca
is explicitly for discussions on Wicca and Wiccan practice: evangelical
posters are not welcome. Those posting and reading here are adults,
many of whom are or have been Christians, have read a bible, heard of
Jesus and considered their beliefs as seriously as you have yours. The
more you know about Wicca, however, the more intelligent you will seem
and you are certainly welcome here as long as you remain on-topic.
Reading this FAQ is a good first step, and in general it is a good idea
to "lurk" and read for a while before posting to ANY newsgroup. Please
keep in mind, however, Wicca's distrust of proselytization and its
conscious lack of an evangelical tradition. Posts which claim we are
all going to hell or blather about TRUE POWER!!! [IN ALL-CAPS!!!] are
particularly inappropriate, and may be answered with e-mail complaints
to you and/or your service provider.
3.11 How do I learn more about Wicca?
Sticking around and reading this group is one way, as are books and
local contacts. Below is a list of initial resources, beginning with
the books most frequently recommended, two historical books and a few
well-respected authors. At least a few of these should be available
through your local library, and most are easily ordered through any
local bookstore. All contain bibliographies and pointers towards other
material.
4 Resources
4.1 Introductory books on Wicca
Margot ADLER, _Drawing Down the Moon: Witches, Druids,
Goddess-Worshippers and Other Pagans in America Today_ (Boston: Beacon
Press, 1979).
Second, 1986 edition, ISBN 0-8070-3253-0.
Newest Arkana ISBN 0-14-019536-X.
STARHAWK, _The Spiral Dance: A Rebirth of the Ancient Religion of
the Great Goddess_ (San Franciscso: Harper & Row, 1979).
Second, 1989 edition, ISBN 0-06-250816-4.
Scott CUNNINGHAM, _Wicca: A Guide for the Solitary Practitioner_
(St Paul, MN: Llewellyn, 1992). ISBN 0-87542-118-0.
Stewart FARRAR, _What Witches Do: A Modern Coven Revealed_ 1983
(Custer WA: Phoenix, 1989) ISBN 0-919345-17-4.
Silver RAVENWOLF, _To Ride a Silver Broomstick: New Generation
Witchcraft_ (St Paul, MN: Llewellyn, 1993). ISBN 0-87542-791-X.
Aidan A. KELLY, _Crafting the Art of Magic: A History of Modern
Witchcraft, 1939-1964_ (St Paul, MN: Llewellyn, 1991).
ISBN 0-87542-370-1.
Ronald HUTTON, The Pagan Religions of the Ancient British Isles:
Their Nature and Legacy_ (Oxford: Blackwell, 1991).
Paperback ISBN 0-631-18946-7.
Other authors who are generally well thought of include Amber K.,
Zsuzsanna Budapest, Janet and Stewart Farrar, Gerald Gardner, Jade and
Doreen Valiente.
4.2 Other Usenet Newsgroups that may be of interest
news:alt.pagan news:soc.religion.paganism
news:alt.religion.shamanism news:alt.magick
news:alt.religion.druid news:soc.religion.shamanism
news:alt.mythology news:alt.religion.asatru
news:talk.religion.misc news:alt.divination
news:alt.magick.tyagi news:talk.religion.newage
news:alt.tarot news:alt.satanism
news:alt.pagan.magick news:alt.religion.wicca.moderated
4.3 Wiccan/Neo-Pagan Umbrella Organizations
Covenant of the Goddess, PO Box 1226, Berkeley CA 94704, United
States. http://www.caw.org/
Universal Federation of Pagans, PO Box 6006, Athens GA 30604, USA.
New Wiccan Church (Gard/Alex), PO Box 162046, Sacramento CA 95816,
USA.
Witches Against Religious Discrimination, PO Box 5967, Providence RI
02903.
Alliance for Magical & Earth Religions, PO Box 16551, Clayton MO
63105, USA
Military WARD, PO Box 2610, McKinleyville CA 95521-2610, United
States.
The Pagan Federation (British, address same as for _Pagan Dawn_,
below). http://www.paganfed.demon.co.uk/
Circle Network (address same as _Circle Network News_, below_).
http://www.circlesanctuary.org/
4.4 Established Wiccan/Neo-Pagan Periodicals
Green Egg, PO Box 1542, Ukiah CA 95482-1542, United States.
Circle Network News, PO Box 219, Mt Horeb WI 53572, United States.
Enchante, 30 Charlton St #6F, New York NY 10014-4295, United States.
Pagan Dawn (formerly The Wiccan), BM Box 7097, London WC1N 3XX, U.K.
Beltane Papers, 1333 Lincoln St #240, Bellingham WA 98226, United
States.
4.5 Other Internet Resources
Other resource lists are posted to this group from time to time,
including lists of FTP sites, WWW URLs, offers of materials and
reference files. Among those we found particularly useful in writing
this FAQ (and explicitly tried *not* to duplicate or replace here) are
the US Army "Chaplain's Manual" entry on Wicca and the alt.pagan news
group FAQ. Both are recommended for those with further interest in Wicca
and Neo-Paganism,
Witchvox at http://www.witchvox.com/ is one of the most common referred
to resource for pagan contacts and learning more about Wicca and/or
Witchcraft.
4.6 Can I get spells here?
It is possible that you will get help with spells, but unlikely.
Wicca teaches that one should not seek to harm others, thus spells to
curse or cause another to fall in love, bindings are not posted here.
As Wicca embraces that there is not one path belief varies on the giving
of even healing spells. If the person does not know if such a spell is
being cast for their benefit, some believe it is wrong.
5 Copyright and Distribution Notice
Doreen Valiente retains copyrights to all her copyrighted
material, but the rest of this FAQ is in the public domain as a service
and gift of the God and Goddess. We ask all who distribute it to keep
it intact and attribute it when quoted or reproduced elsewhere.
This FAQ Version 2 is posted to alt.religion.wicca once each full
moon, and to other forums as seems appropriate. It is also available on
the World Wide Web at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
Requests for corrections and/or updates can be posted to the group or
emailed to the maintainer of this FAQ.
"Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill: An it harm none, do as you will"
--
news:alt.pagan FAQ at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/altpag.txt
news:alt.religion.wicca FAQ at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
Want a new group FAQs http://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/ncreate.html
Evergreen
> Posting-Frequency: monthly (full moon)
> Last-modified: 10 January 2009
> URL:http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
>
> Hear ye the words of the Star Goddess; she in the dust of whose feet are
> the hosts of heaven, and whose body encircles the universe:
>
> "I who am the beauty of the green earth, and the white moon among the
> stars, and the mystery of the waters, call unto thy soul: Arise, and
> come unto me. For I am the soul of nature, who gives life to the
> universe. From Me all things proceed, and unto Me all things must
> return; and before My face, beloved of gods and of men, let thine
> innermost divine self be enfolded in the rapture of the infinite. Let My
> worship be within the heart that rejoices; for behold, all acts of love
> and pleasure are My rituals. And therefore let there be beauty and
> strength, power and compassion, honor and humility, mirth and reverence
> within you. And thou who thinkest to seek Me, know that thy seeking and
> yearning shall avail thee not unless thou knowest the Mystery: that if
> that which thou seekest thou findest not within thee, thou wilt never
> find it without. For behold, I have been with thee from the beginning;
> and I am that which is attained at the end of desire."
>
> - From Doreen Valiente's "Charge of the Goddess"
Now there's some genuine woo-woo if I've ever heard it.
> This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
So what we are dealing with here is a fundamental dishonesty on the
part of the author. You've been warned.
But more importantly, all the information here is useless to anyone
with
a desire to learn about real magick. It's a bunch of superstitious
nonsense
copied from books and websites whose authors all have one thing in
common:
They can't do any magick.
What they can do is play the role of a witch or warlock on stage or in
the movies, but that's it.
Don't believe me? Ask our resident charlatan, who hides behind the
name
"ren", to demonstrate his magickal abilities. He can talk the talk but
he
can't walk the walk.
So if Halloween all year 'round is your thing, if you want to play
dress up
witch with a bunch of other clueless pretenders, read on.
Sid
Sidney Lambe
Wiccan Priest and Apprentice Magician
http://tinyurl.com/7vs9zb
usenet4444 (at) gmail (dot) com
> is designed as an
> introduction to Wicca and to this news group as well as a reference for
> those investigating the religion of Wicca for the first time.
>
> ARW FAQ was first composed in March 1995 as a composite of three drafts
> by different authors: Lleu (wiz...@bga.com), fire...@computel.com and
> R...@teleport.com. Thanks to Lorax (tyagi nagasiva), Ounce, Karen,
> (archived athttp://http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/altpag.txt) for more
> Circle Network (address same as _Circle Network News_, below_).http://www.circlesanctuary.org/
>
> 4.4 Established Wiccan/Neo-Pagan Periodicals
>
> Green Egg, PO Box 1542, Ukiah CA 95482-1542, United States.
> Circle Network News, PO Box 219, Mt Horeb WI 53572, United States.
> Enchante, 30 Charlton St #6F, New York NY 10014-4295, United States.
> Pagan Dawn (formerly The Wiccan), BM Box 7097, London WC1N 3XX, U.K.
> Beltane Papers, 1333 Lincoln St #240, Bellingham WA 98226, United
> States.
>
> 4.5 Other Internet Resources
>
> Other resource lists are posted to this group from time to time,
> including lists of FTP sites, WWW URLs, offers of materials and
> reference files. Among those we found particularly useful in writing
> this FAQ (and explicitly tried *not* to duplicate or replace here) are
> the US Army "Chaplain's Manual" entry on Wicca and the alt.pagan news
> group FAQ. Both are recommended for those with further interest in Wicca
> and Neo-Paganism,
>
> Witchvox athttp://www.witchvox.com/is one of the most common referred
> to resource for pagan contacts and learning more about Wicca and/or
> Witchcraft.
>
> 4.6 Can I get spells here?
>
> It is possible that you will get help with spells, but unlikely.
> Wicca teaches that one should not seek to harm others, thus spells to
> curse or cause another to fall in love, bindings are not posted here.
> As Wicca embraces that there is not one path belief varies on the giving
> of even healing spells. If the person does not know if such a spell is
> being cast for their benefit, some believe it is wrong.
>
> 5 Copyright and Distribution Notice
>
> Doreen Valiente retains copyrights to all her copyrighted
> material, but the rest of this FAQ is in the public domain as a service
> and gift of the God and Goddess. We ask all who distribute it to keep
> it intact and attribute it when quoted or reproduced elsewhere.
>
> This FAQ Version 2 is posted to alt.religion.wicca once each full
> moon, and to other forums as seems appropriate. It is also available on
> the World Wide Web athttp://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
> Requests for corrections and/or updates can be posted to the group or
> emailed to the maintainer of this FAQ.
>
> "Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill: An it harm none, do as you will"
> --
> news:alt.pagan FAQ athttp://members.dmcom.net/~bard/altpag.txt
> news:alt.religion.wicca FAQ athttp://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
zayton
"Evergreen" <usene...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:6621247c-bc8a-4f9a...@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>> This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
>
> Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
You haven't been around long enough.
Contrary to your assumptions,
the world did not begin at your birth; nor did ARW begin at your arrrival
here.
Evergreen
> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:6621247c-bc8a-4f9a...@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> >> This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
>
> > Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
>
> You haven't been around long enough.
Since mid-September. Long enough for someone to edit the FAQ
in order to make it an honest work that reflects reality.
But alas, I have seen no signs here that any of the regulars (which
includes
you posting under a variety of aliases) has any interest in honesty or
truth.
You all just love your delusions.
That's why you can't do any magick.
[delete]
Sid
--
zayton
> On Apr 8, 12:17 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:6621247c-bc8a-4f9a...@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>> >> This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
>>
>> > Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
>>
>> You haven't been around long enough.
>
> Since mid-September. Long enough for someone to edit the FAQ
> in order to make it an honest work that reflects reality.
So what new questions have which have been asked since september have you
submitted to the keeper of the faq with a request that they be considered
for inclusion in the faq?
Evergreen
> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:b5944142-a215-49d9...@v19g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Apr 8, 12:17 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
> >> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >>news:6621247c-bc8a-4f9a...@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>
> >> >> This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
>
> >> > Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
>
> >> You haven't been around long enough.
>
> > Since mid-September. Long enough for someone to edit the FAQ
> > in order to make it an honest work that reflects reality.
>
> So what new questions have which have been asked since september have you
> submitted to the keeper of the faq with a request that they be considered
> for inclusion in the faq?
Why would I submit anything to a dishonest fool who copies worthless
information
off he web and posts it on this group under the fallacious subject of
"FAQ"?
The whole problem with Wicca is that it's based on useless theatrical
woo-woo like the garbage in that 'FAQ'. That's why why there aren't
any
real witches (people who can do real magick) in the entire psuedo-
religion.
Noinden
> usenet4444 (at) gmail (dot) com- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
You are calling the owner of the FAQ dishonest??? Bwhaaa
zayton
> On Apr 9, 11:21 am, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:b5944142-a215-49d9...@v19g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> > On Apr 8, 12:17 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>> >> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> >>news:6621247c-bc8a-4f9a...@c9g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> >> >> This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
>>
>> >> > Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
>>
>> >> You haven't been around long enough.
>>
>> > Since mid-September. Long enough for someone to edit the FAQ
>> > in order to make it an honest work that reflects reality.
>>
>> So what new questions have which have been asked since september have you
>> submitted to the keeper of the faq with a request that they be considered
>> for inclusion in the faq?
>
> Why would I submit anything to a dishonest fool who copies worthless
> information
> off he web and posts it on this group under the fallacious subject of
> "FAQ"?
>
Idiot.
Baird posts answers agreed upon over the years by a majority of regular
posters to ARW to questions which were often asked over those same years.
Nothing is his FAQ is simply "copied off the web" as you claim.
You didn't hear the questions asked because you wandered in and started
revealing yourself to be a total ass only a few months ago.
ba...@dmcom.net
wrote:
>
>You are calling the owner of the FAQ dishonest??? Bwhaaa
The FAQ belongs to many, not me at all, what I do do is try to maintain
it.. There was never even any attempt to copyright it by any that
contributed to it.
As for people considing me dishonest, that clearly is posible. Belief is
error.
--
news:alt.pagan FAQ at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/altpag.txt
news:alt.religion.wicca FAQ at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
ba...@dmcom.net
wrote:
>Idiot.
>
>Baird posts answers agreed upon over the years by a majority of regular
>posters to ARW to questions which were often asked over those same years.
>
>Nothing is his FAQ is simply "copied off the web" as you claim.
>
>You didn't hear the questions asked because you wandered in and started
>revealing yourself to be a total ass only a few months ago.
Er r, Baird is not me, though we do see each other in usenet and email
from time to time. The FAQ does cite the main contributots long before I
took over posting the FAQ (After Rain disappeared). There has been held
open dicussions about posible revisions that I have made, the one I have
had a hard time about including is dealing with the Warlock issue. I
have notes, just have not have the time to put that together for a
presentation to the community.
In part this was because of net access, but also because the different
interpertations are hard to merge in a single paragraph.
As for net access, I should in a week reapear as bard (not Baird ) from
a different ISP. The host site for the FAQs will of course need to be
changed as well. There might be a serrling period, however the timing
should permat me to post the FAQ on or about the next full moon.
--
news:alt.pagan FAQ at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/altpag.txt
news:alt.religion.wicca FAQ at http://members.dmcom.net/~bard/arwfaq2.txt
Evergreen
So someone who thinks that an "FAQ" full of useless, theatrical woo-
woo
is valuable also thinks that I am a "total ass".
That makes perfect sense to me.
People should note that this fool and his associates here have been
trying to drive me from this group since I arrived by posting endless
juvenile abuse like the above.
Obviously, they have no magickal abilities at all.
And obviously they are too stupid to note the simple fact that the
textual diarrhea of stupid losers doesn't have any effect on me at
all.
I obviously cannot be driven away by cowardly losers hiding behind
fake names and the internet running their punk mouths.
Noinden
> On Thu, 9 Apr 2009 13:03:16 -0700 (PDT), Noinden <noin...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> >You are calling the owner of the FAQ dishonest??? Bwhaaa
>
> The FAQ belongs to many, not me at all, what I do do is try to maintain
> it.. There was never even any attempt to copyright it by any that
> contributed to it.
>
> As for people considing me dishonest, that clearly is posible. Belief is
> error.
>
> --
> Want a new group FAQshttp://web.presby.edu/~nnqadmin/nnq/ncreate.html
Baird you maintain it, thus to me you own it, untill you pass it own
the next sucker...ummmm person who maintains it.
In my ten years posting here, you have never been dishonest.
Noon-Air
Which makes you appear pretty ignorant to the rest of us. Too bad really....
you have been trolling on here for awhile, and you still can't take the
hint. You must be another politician wannabe.
Have a nice life.
Noinden
Why would we drive you away? The Resident cats are having fun with
you ;)
zayton
Since I said nothing the value of the FAQ,
only that your description of it
as something copied off the web
showed that you had no idea what you were talking about,
then yes,
as you have just illustrated yet again,
you are a total ass.
responding to your own delusions rather than what was posted.
Evergreen
> On Apr 10, 12:45 am, Evergreen <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote:
An FAQ for a newsgroup is supposed to contain questions that are
frequently asked on that newsgroup. Duh. This one doesn't. I have
been here since mid-September and never seen one of those
questions asked here.
Furthermore, the information that this deceitful document presents is
superstitious, theatrical woo-woo that is good for nothing but playing
the role of a witch in movie or stage production or writing fantasy
novels.
A person could memorize and master everything referred to in that
deceitful and ignorant document and still be unable to do any magick
at all.
Evergreen
I said that it was copied from books or off the web, and it was.
If not by the maintainer of the fake FAQ, then by the people
he obtained it from.
There's no place else that information of this kind can be acquired,
fool.
I won't say it's useless. If a person wanted to play the role of a
witch in
a movie or stage production, or write fantasy novels it could come in
handy.
But it isn't useful to anyone who wants to learn real magick.
[delete off-topic ramblings]
Noinden
Noinden
How has Baird lied?
How is the doccument deceitful?
Post proof or retract. If you say you are not beholden too (your
typical "you can not make me" then your attacks on ren calling you a
dangerous stalker are thus null and void.)
Slan leat
Gareth Thomas
Evergreen
> Ok Sid to use your standards.
>
> How has Baird lied?
He calls the document an "FAQ" for this group. I've been here since
mid-September and never seen one of those questions asked here.
> How is the doccument deceitful?
As stated above, plus the fact that it is full of superstitious and
ignorant
woo-woo that isn't useful for anything but playing the role of a witch
in a movie or a stage production, or for writing fantasy novels.
The entire psuedo-religion of Wicca is the artificial creation of
shoddy
amateur scholars. It's a mish-mash of snippets of history, legend, and
myth woven together with liberal doses of pure fiction.
http://www.bcholmes.org/wicca/gardner.html
You could master and memorize everything referred to in that document
and still not be able do any magick.
That's why you and ren and your other allies here can't make me go
away.
Because all you can do is run your anus mouths. You can't do any
magick
at all.
[delete]
zayton
> On Apr 10, 9:42 am, Noinden <noin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Apr 10, 12:45 am, Evergreen <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote:
> [delete off-topic blather]
>
> An FAQ for a newsgroup is supposed to contain questions that are
> frequently asked on that newsgroup.
Yes.
That is precicely what this one consists of..
> Duh. This one doesn't.
Duh, Yes idiot, it does.
I have
> been here since mid-September and never seen one of those
> questions asked here.
Precicely.
You have only been here since September.
The FAQ has been evolving for at least 10 years.
>
> Furthermore, the information that this deceitful document presents is
> superstitious, theatrical woo-woo that is good for nothing but playing
> the role of a witch in movie or stage production or writing fantasy
> novels.
>
> A person could memorize and master everything referred to in that
> deceitful and ignorant document and still be unable to do any magick
> at all.
As you acknowledge above,
the FAQ responds to frequently asked questions.
It doesn't claim to teach anyone to "do any magick at alll".
Did you actually forget your own definition of a FAQ.
Idiot.
Evergreen
> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Perfect. Note that this is the kind of loser who takes the garbage in
that non-FAQ seriously.
The nasty little superstitious bigot gets real upset when someone
criticizes it.
Noinden
> On Apr 10, 12:33 pm, Noinden <noin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Ok Sid to use your standards.
>
> > How has Baird lied?
>
> He calls the document an "FAQ" for this group. I've been here since
> mid-September and never seen one of those questions asked here.
I have been here since 1997 or so, they have been asked all the time.
> > How is the doccument deceitful?
>
> As stated above, plus the fact that it is full of superstitious and
> ignorant
> woo-woo that isn't useful for anything but playing the role of a witch
> in a movie or a stage production, or for writing fantasy novels.
> The entire psuedo-religion of Wicca is the artificial creation of
> shoddy
> amateur scholars. It's a mish-mash of snippets of history, legend, and
> myth woven together with liberal doses of pure fiction.
>
> http://www.bcholmes.org/wicca/gardner.html
Like the theory of evolution, and GUI OS things evolve. Thus quoting
Gardner is like being a bottom feeding creationsit saying Darwin got
it wrong. Almost now one beleives Darwin got it right. Similarly
almost no one is Gardnerian if they are wiccan.
You still did not prove a thing.
Evergreen
Because Wicca is built on such a pathetic foundation, the only changes
have been to add more useless, theatrical woo-woo to its websites and
books, and to become grossly commercial.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/browse_thread/thread/ccad2f364d8fbfad
The people who picked up after Gardner, like Gardner, couldn't do any
magick
at all.
> You still did not prove a thing.
The proof is right here on thiis newsgroup. What you have is a bunch
of losers
discussing useless, ficticious woo-woo as if it was somehow real.
And, obviously, none of you can do any magick at all.
If you could, you wouldn't have to resort to all this juvenile
trolling in your pathetic attempts to drive me away.
zayton
No.
Because your criticism and your attempted defense of it were delusional.
The FAQ was not copied off the web.
The FAQ does not claim to teach "how to do magick."
The FAQ answers "Frequently Asked Questions",
which you hve not heard
because you have only been here since September.
And I didn't get upset.
I just pointed out that you are an Idiot.
A fact which you continue to illustrate
with your every post.
Idiot.
Evergreen
All of that garbage information comes from books and the web.
Or from people who got it from books and the web.
There is no other source for garbage information of that sort.
Other than the idiots who authored it.
> The FAQ does not claim to teach "how to do magick."
Considering that magick is what Wicca is obviously about , that's
hardly surprising. It doesn't claim to be about witches either.
Have you always been this stupid, or did you hit your head or
something?
> The FAQ answers "Frequently Asked Questions",
> which you hve not heard
> because you have only been here since September.
Then it should say: questions that used to be asked on
this newsgroup.
If they ever were. I've seen no evidence to substantiate
this claim.
So I gather that you've been a 'neo-pagan' for years.
And you still can't do any magick but have to resort to
childish trolling like this.
Doesn't surprise me a bit.
> And I didn't get upset.
> I just pointed out that you are an Idiot.
> A fact which you continue to illustrate
> with your every post.
>
> Idiot.
Well. You've been trying to drive this "idiot" off this newsgroup for
months and failed.
So you've been defeated by an idiot.
Guess what that makes you.
zayton
> On Apr 11, 3:51 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:22a63980-b714-43f8...@q33g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Apr 10, 3:22 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>> >> "Evergreen" <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Which, even if it were true, is NOT what you said.
>
> There is no other source for garbage information of that sort.
>
> Other than the idiots who authored it.
True of your posts.
>
>> The FAQ does not claim to teach "how to do magick."
>
> Considering that magick is what Wicca is obviously about , that's
> hardly surprising. It doesn't claim to be about witches either.
If that were what Wicca is all about
then it would be surprising.
You really don't do logic do you?
>
> Have you always been this stupid, or did you hit your head or
> something?
I could be stupid and still know you are an idiot.
>
>> The FAQ answers "Frequently Asked Questions",
>> which you hve not heard
>> because you have only been here since September.
>
> Then it should say: questions that used to be asked on
> this newsgroup.
>
> If they ever were. I've seen no evidence to substantiate
> this claim.
That's because you jumped in and began making an ass of yourself as soon as
you arrived.
>
> So I gather that you've been a 'neo-pagan' for years.
> And you still can't do any magick but have to resort to
> childish trolling like this.
>
> Doesn't surprise me a bit.
um....
Your powers of deduction are astonishing.
(That's ironic, by the way)
>
>> And I didn't get upset.
>> I just pointed out that you are an Idiot.
>> A fact which you continue to illustrate
>> with your every post.
>>
>> Idiot.
>
> Well. You've been trying to drive this "idiot" off this newsgroup for
> months and failed.
I have?
News to me.
>
> So you've been defeated by an idiot.
Hmmm.
Bored, yes;
Defeated, not so far.
Unless, of course, you count the fact
that you do a better job of proving you are an idiot
than I could ever aspire to.
>
> Guess what that makes you.
>
The guy who keeps reminding you that you are an idiot?
(One of them, anyway)
Hope
I have asked some of these questions to people off-site since coming
here in December. If sid could actually do "remote viewing," as he
claims, looks like he would know that not everything happens on his
computer screen.
Evergreen
Here you have a perfect example of the kind of loser who takes the
garbage in that non-FAQ seriously.
Is she casting powerful spells to do me harm? No, because the
theatrical
woo-woo she wants people to believe is magick is a joke.
So the poor thing is reduced to trolling, which is something that can
be done by any rotten child with their mommy's computer.
This is the kind of supporter that Ren attracts.
Hope
yourself look like a total asshat, you exceed my expectations yet
again.
I have never claimed to cast spells.
I have never claimed to want anyone to believe any particular thing
about magic, nor have I stated what I believe about it.
I have never claimed to be a supporter of Ren.
Your perseveration is really getting out of hand. You need
professional help with your compulsive lying. It's getting
really...well, quite frankly, it's boring.
zayton
"Hope" <hollera...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:6fb11146-fc0d-4941...@r31g2000vbp.googlegroups.com...
I have asked some of these questions to people off-site since coming
here in December. If sid could actually do "remote viewing," as he
claims, looks like he would know that not everything happens on his
computer screen.
*****
Which begs the question:
"If a tree falls in the forest,
and Sid soesn't hear it,
is Sid still an idiot?"
sarchasm
> "Hope" <hollera...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I have asked some of these questions to people off-site since coming
> here in December. If sid could actually do "remote viewing," as he
> claims, looks like he would know that not everything happens on his
> computer screen.
>
> *****
> Which begs the question:
> "If a tree falls in the forest,
> and Sid soesn't hear it,
> is Sid still an idiot?"
If the tree fell on Sidiot, he 'wood' be likely to compulsively deny it.
Evergreen
> "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
> > "Hope" <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I have asked some of these questions to people off-site since coming
> > here in December. If sid could actually do "remote viewing," as he
> > claims, looks like he would know that not everything happens on his
> > computer screen.
>
> > *****
> > Which begs the question:
> > "If a tree falls in the forest,
> > and Sid soesn't hear it,
> > is Sid still an idiot?"
>
> If the tree fell on Sidiot, he 'wood' be likely to compulsively deny it.
Oh my. "Sarchasm's" mommy is letting him play with her computer again.
zayton
<snip>
, looks like he would know that not everything happens on his
>> > computer screen.
>>
>> > *****
>> > Which begs the question:
>> > "If a tree falls in the forest,
>> > and Sid soesn't hear it,
>> > is Sid still an idiot?"
>>
>> If the tree fell on Sidiot, he 'wood' be likely to compulsively deny it.
>
> Oh my. "Sarchasm's" mommy is letting him play with her computer again.
You've already used that half-assed retort today.
Your half-wit must only be running at quarter capacity.
sarchasm
> "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>> > "Hope" <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I have asked some of these questions to people off-site since coming
>> > here in December. If sid could actually do "remote viewing," as he
>> > claims, looks like he would know that not everything happens on his
>> > computer screen.
>>
>> > *****
>> > Which begs the question:
>> > "If a tree falls in the forest,
>> > and Sid soesn't hear it,
>> > is Sid still an idiot?"
>>
>> If the tree fell on Sidiot, he 'wood' be likely to compulsively deny it.
>
> Oh my.
>
Jump higher, frog.
Noon-Air
"sarchasm" <sar....@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:grro7k$kq6$1...@news.motzarella.org...
And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
Looks like it spilled over to alt.pagan......and now I will have to find
another place.
<sigh> Whats a muther to do.....
Ren
> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>
> Looks like it spilled over to alt.pagan......and now I will have to find
> another place.
>
> <sigh> Whats a muther to do.....
Don't give up and don't worry about things you have no control over.
Alt.Religion.Wicca and Alt.Pagan are both un-moderated newsgroups.
If you are frustrated with this, I suggest going to a moderated Pagan
and Wiccan newsgroup.
Be well, Noon-Air.
Steve
"Ren" <ren...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bf8b2e42-d57e-49d1...@l16g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
Be well, Noon-Air.
--------------------
Ren,
Thanx for the kind reply,
I have found a moderated group that is good.
Its not the frustration, its just that folks refuse to killfile an obvious
troll, whos only purpose in life is to get folks riled up.....and having to
wade through all the junk to see if there is something of substance, or if
its just "My wand is bigger than yours".
I will stop by from time to time to see if there has been any change....
Be well my friend.
--
Steve @ Noon-Air Heating & A/C
"Stop calling me for freebies Satan,
I'll fix your air conditioner when you pay me, Cheapskate!"
Evergreen
The fact is that ren and his tiny group of supporters won't killfile
me
because they know that what I have to say about our psuedo-religion
is accurate.
And what I have to say about our resident charlatan, ren, is accurate.
If I was simply the idiot troll they claim that I am, then they would
killfile
me and that would be the end of me here.
Frankly, I believe that most, if not all, of ren's tiny group of
supporters
are his own sockpuppets. I just can't conceive of there being a human
being with enough intelligence to run a computer who can't see
that ren is a pathetic and cheap con artist. A charlatan. And a
patholgical
liar.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/dd5189f03c3b1b34p
It's been 12 days since he accused me of being a "dangerous stalker"
and
he has yet to produce once scrap of evidence to support this
accusation.
Read here about ren the dangerous sorcerer <snicker>:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/bddb8c59f894a2a5
Ren is the perfect example of your typical 'neo-pagan' pseudo-
magician.
He dresses up like a magician and talks like a magician but he can't
do
any magick.
That will be your fate if you take the garbage in the the non-FAQ
seriously,
my friends.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/f43a1ad12ba7482d
No, it iisn't a real FAQ. I've been here since September and never
seen anyone
ask even one of those questions.
Why would people ask questions about ficticiious nonsense?
Hope
>
> The fact is that ren and his tiny group of supporters won't killfile
> me
> because they know that what I have to say about our psuedo-religion
> is accurate.
*LMAO* Wrong again, oh egocentric one. It's because there's nothing
good on TV.
>
> And what I have to say about our resident charlatan, ren, is accurate.
"Our"??? Oh brother. You really have lost touch with reality. Now
you speak as though you belong here and have friends here who agree
with you concerning your obsession with Ren. I am embarrassed for
you, sid. Really.
>
> If I was simply the idiot troll they claim that I am, then they would
> killfile
> me and that would be the end of me here.
>
Oh, you are the sidiot we claim you are--probably even bigger. Alas,
right now you are the closest thing to entertainment we have here.
Everyone has a bit of sadist in them. We are indulging ours.
Besides, you know you would be devastated if we were all to killfile
you and Ren were to completely and finally reject you. You might do
something desperate. We don't want that on our consciences.
sarchasm
>
> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>
There are certain aspects of killfiling which make them less effective than
other methods.
>
> Looks like it spilled over to alt.pagan......and now I will have to find
> another place.
>
> <sigh> Whats a muther to do.....
It's interesting to note that the sidiot troll would be rapidly banned from
any moderated group wherein he were to troll, (such as
alt.religion.wicca.moderated).
sarchasm
>
> The fact is that ren and his tiny group of supporters
>
That is not a fact, it's sidiot trolling with a strawman of his own device.
>
> won't killfile me
>
As opposed to sidiot pretending to killfile others and then posting flames
to them?
>
> because they know that what I have to say about our psuedo-religion
> is accurate.
>
"Our"? If sidiot's "religion" is flame-trolling and lying, he still does
not speak for anyone else - much as he wishes he did.
Evergreen
Obviously, don't like me, "sarchasm". When are you going to do
something
about me besides sit on your fat butt and run your anus mouth?
Any rotten child with their mommy's computer can do what you are
doing.
And if they happenned to be as stupid as you are, they would keep at
it
for months on end and never notice that their textual turds hadn't had
any
adverse effect on me at all.
I look forward to the day your testicles descend into your scrotum and
you become an actual threat to me. Then I will crush you.
People should note that "sarchasm" here is one Ren's supporters. All
of
Ren's tiny group of supporters are losers like this creep.
sarchasm
>
> Obviously, don't like me, "sarchasm".
>
What's not to like about sidiot?
>
> When are you going to do something
> about me besides sit on your fat butt and run your anus mouth?
>
Pointing out sidiot's lack of credibility, his hypocrisy and his penchant
for doing what he accuses others of doing has been sufficient.
>
> I look forward to the day your testicles descend into your scrotum and
> you become an actual threat to me.
>
Why the position of someone's testicles would be a threat to sidiot can only
be due to his own lack, (even if sidiot is female).
>
> Then I will crush you.
>
Sidiot already has a crush on ren, given all the woo-wooing.
Evergreen
> "Sidiot" <usenet4...@gmail.com> threatened impotently:
You've been going on like this since September, and I'm still here,
posting
whatever I feel like and accomplishing my primary goal, which is
protecting
gullible youngsters from being victimized by our resident charlatan,
Ren.
So I was going to ask you what you do when you aren't insulting people
who don't care what you think and that you can't influence.
Then I realized that you don't do anything else. This is your life.
That's pretty sad.
Do carry on. You are doing a marvelous job of making this newsgroup
a shithole.
And the amazing thing is that Ren actually encourages you.
sarchasm
>
> and accomplishing my primary goal, which is protecting
> gullible youngsters from being victimized
>
There is no evidence to support such a claim. The sidiot may as well claim
to be protecting lefthanded wombats from eating porkrinds.
>
> So I was going to ask you what you do when you aren't
>
When not challenging the bullshit claims of trolling flamers like sidiot, I
do otehr things.
>.
> Then I realized that
>
This redundant trolling is the bulk of what sidiot does here.
>
> That's pretty sad.
>
Indeed.
>
> You are doing a marvelous job of making this newsgroup a shithole.
>
Sidiot is now claiming that others cause him to flame-troll on arw to turn
it into the shithole he desires, (so that newcomers will join his mailing
list). Sidiot remains a transparent moron.
Noinden
SNIP rants of a Troll.
Why do you think we are trying to drive you away? You are the best
advertisement for Wicca and Neopaganism with "Do the opposite of what
Sid says".
Ah-knee
I thought that was why Sid was brought here. For the numbers and so a
certain few could counter his posts and teach "their" way. Nobody
reads or replies to teaching posts any other way, because nobody here
needs to be taught basics. As for lurkers and newbies? They are long
gone. Too many sites with sparkly and animated pictures on them.
Evergreen
> I thought that was why Sid was brought here. For the numbers and so a
> certain few could counter his posts and teach "their" way. Nobody
> reads or replies to teaching posts any other way, because nobody here
> needs to be taught basics. As for lurkers and newbies? They are long
> gone. Too many sites with sparkly and animated pictures on them.
You certainly do need to be taught the basics.
The supersititious, theatrical woo-woo that you think is 'magick'
couldn't
make water wet.
You only think you are magicians because you are surrounded by people
who agree to pretend that you are a real magician if you will pretend
that
they are real maticians. I call this the Neo-Pagan Pact.
In the 'neo-pagan' world of psuedo-magick, it's Halloween all year
'round.
You dress up like you think real magicians (by whatever name) dress
and
you talk like you think real magicians talk, but you are as magickally
adept
(or maybe less so) than the typical child begging for candy in a
witch's
costume on October 31.
That non-FAQ, with its answers to questions that I have never seen
asked
on this group in the months I have been here, is full of information
that will
teach a person to do one thing: Play the role of a magician in a movie
or
stage production or to write fantasy novels.
Steve
> "Noon-Air" <Noon...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
>> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>>
>
> There are certain aspects of killfiling which make them less effective
> than other methods.
True... but if folks didn't rise to the bait, he would get bored and go play
outside.
>> Looks like it spilled over to alt.pagan......and now I will have to find
>> another place.
>>
>> <sigh> Whats a muther to do.....
>
> It's interesting to note that the sidiot troll would be rapidly banned
> from any moderated group wherein he were to troll, (such as
> alt.religion.wicca.moderated).
His reputation precedes him. BTW... did you notice that when he gets shot
down in flames, he gets real abusive and vulgar?? Oh well....
sarchasm
> "sarchasm" <sar....@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "Noon-Air" <Noon...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
>>> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>>>
>>
>> There are certain aspects of killfiling which make them less effective
>> than other methods.
>
>
> True... but if folks didn't rise to the bait, he would get bored and go
> play outside.
>
Possibly but, not probably. The sidiot troll has demonstrated, (by posting
to that effect), that he'll troll whether responded to or not.
>
>>> Looks like it spilled over to alt.pagan......and now I will have to find
>>> another place.
>>>
>>> <sigh> Whats a muther to do.....
>>
>> It's interesting to note that the sidiot troll would be rapidly banned
>> from any moderated group wherein he were to troll, (such as
>> alt.religion.wicca.moderated).
>
>
> His reputation precedes him. BTW... did you notice that when he gets shot
> down in flames, he gets real abusive and vulgar?? Oh well....
>
Yes, he also dodges direct challenges to his weak assertions because his
positions are too flimsy to withstand inquiry.
Noon-Air
> "Steve" <jste...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> "sarchasm" <sar....@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> "Noon-Air" <Noon...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
>>>> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>>>>
>>>
>>> There are certain aspects of killfiling which make them less effective
>>> than other methods.
>>
>>
>> True... but if folks didn't rise to the bait, he would get bored and go
>> play outside.
>>
>
> Possibly but, not probably. The sidiot troll has demonstrated, (by
> posting to that effect), that he'll troll whether responded to or not.
> positions are too flimsy to withstand inquiry.
>
If he gets no responses to his trolling, then he has once again failed.
Evergreen
> "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:gs14cd$3ai$1...@news.motzarella.org...
>
>
>
> > "Steve" <jstev...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >> "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>> "Noon-Air" <Noon-...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> >>>> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single thread
> >>>> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>
> >>> There are certain aspects of killfiling which make them less effective
> >>> than other methods.
>
> >> True... but if folks didn't rise to the bait, he would get bored and go
> >> play outside.
>
> > Possibly but, not probably. The sidiot troll has demonstrated, (by
> > posting to that effect), that he'll troll whether responded to or not.
> > Yes, he also dodges direct challenges to his weak assertions because his
> > positions are too flimsy to withstand inquiry.
>
> If he gets no responses to his trolling, then he has once again failed.
Oh golly. I am just so devasted. A couple of fat-assed, dickless
losers
hiding in a room somewhere and running their anus mouths all day long
on the internet because they don't have lives, don't like me.
Isn't that just too bad?
Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
He has to do that because usually no one else will talk to the poor
feeb, for obvious reasons.
Sid
Noinden
> Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
> He has to do that because usually no one else will talk to the poor
> feeb, for obvious reasons.
Prove it! Because Noon-Air has been around quite a while, so you are
accusing Sarc of something akin to plagiarism by anticipation. Given
the level of your understanding of the occult that is rather
appropriate ;) You stopped learning sometime in the early middle ages.
Evergreen
> On Apr 14, 11:56 am, Evergreen <usenet4...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
> > He has to do that because usually no one else will talk to the poor
> > feeb, for obvious reasons.
>
> Prove it! Because Noon-Air has been around quite a while,
Anyone who even reads sarchasm's articles has been stupid for
quite a while.
> so you are
> accusing Sarc of something akin to plagiarism by anticipation.
What are you going to do about it?
> Given
> the level of your understanding of the occult that is rather
> appropriate ;) You stopped learning sometime in the early middle ages.
So if you know so much about 'the occult', why don't you drive me
away with magick instead of trolling like a stupid loser?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/3e387e7b5cd0627a
Posting woo-woo in the usenet and being a magician are two very
different
things, clown.
Speaking of clowns, noindent takes ren seriously, which is something
that no
mentally competent person does, believe me:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/710dc35380ae361d
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/e71094ef5f99c2fc
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/bddb8c59f894a2a5
Noinden
> usenet4444 (at) gmail (dot) com
Why would I want to drive you away? You are the stupidest Troll we
have had in years ;)
Actually post something with substance, rather than links to your
flawed ideas and we can talk occult. (and I tore several of those
apart months back, you ignored that, because you had no come back).
Simply put. You can not actually hold a real debate here. You result
in ad homenin attacks rather than attacks based in logic, fact, or
reality.
This makes you an automatic loser in the debates here.
sarchasm
>
> A couple of
>
> Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
>
A "couple of" denotes more than one. If "Noon-Air" were a sockpuppet of
another, that would be one poster and not a "couple of" posters. The
conclusion is that sidiot tries these and other diversions because he is
unable to respond to the subject matter. Flaming those who challenge
sidiot's delusions is not pertinent response, nor do vapid insults divert
attention from the fact that sidiot dodges like someone is is fearful that
his position is too weak to defend.
Noinden
> "EverSidiot" <usenet4...@gmail.com> confuses himself again:
http://pictureisunrelated.com/2009/03/30/this-isnt-where-i-parked-my-car/#comments
This position?
sarchasm
>
>http://pictureisunrelated.com/2009/03/30/this-isnt-where-i-parked-my-car/#comments
>
>This position?
>
For sidiot, more like the fetal position from which he is unable to anything
other than crap himself and cry on usenet. Maybe he's colicky or gassy.
Evergreen
> "Noinden" <noin...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > "EverSidiot" <usenet4...@gmail.com> confuses himself again:
>
> > > A couple of
>
> > > Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
>
> > A "couple of" denotes more than one. If "Noon-Air" were a sockpuppet of
> > another, that would be one poster and not a "couple of" posters. The
> > conclusion is that sidiot tries these and other diversions because he is
> > unable to respond to the subject matter. Flaming those who challenge
> > sidiot's delusions is not pertinent response, nor do vapid insults divert
> > attention from the fact that sidiot dodges like someone is is fearful that
> > his position is too weak to defend.
>
>
> >This position?
>
> For sidiot, more like the fetal position from which he is unable to anything
> other than crap himself and cry on usenet. Maybe he's colicky or gassy.
This is one ren's most ardent supporters. Witness the fruits of the
teachings of our resident charlatan. This poor feeb has posted
hundreds
of articles like this in the months I've been here and doesn't have
the
mental capacity to comprehend the obvious fact that they haven't had
any effect on me at all. This is the kind of loser that ren attracts.
Joseph Littleshoes
Evergreen wrote:
> This is the kind of loser that ren attracts.
>
> Sid
>
And that, from Ren's biggest fan here:)
--
JL
sarchasm
"sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "Noinden" <noin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > > "EverSidiot" <usenet4...@gmail.com> confuses himself again:
>>
>> > > A couple of
>>
>> > > Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
>>
>> > A "couple of" denotes more than one. If "Noon-Air" were a sockpuppet of
>> > another, that would be one poster and not a "couple of" posters. The
>> > conclusion is that sidiot tries these and other diversions because he
>> > is
>> > unable to respond to the subject matter. Flaming those who challenge
>> > sidiot's delusions is not pertinent response, nor do vapid insults
>> > divert
>> > attention from the fact that sidiot dodges like someone is is fearful
>> > that
>> > his position is too weak to defend.
>>
>> >http://pictureisunrelated.com/2009/03/30/this-isnt-where-i-parked-my-...
>>
>> >This position?
>>
>> For sidiot, more like the fetal position from which he is unable to
>> anything
>> other than crap himself and cry on usenet. Maybe he's colicky or gassy.
>
>
... Of many dodges by sidiot in which his assertions have been shown to be
as false as his other unsupported claims.
zayton
"Evergreen" <usene...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:2dad0559-e86b-4423...@d19g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 14, 8:53 am, "Noon-Air" <Noon-...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:gs14cd$3ai$1...@news.motzarella.org...
>>
>>
>>
>> > "Steve" <jstev...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> >> "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >>> "Noon-Air" <Noon-...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>> >>>> And I left alt.religion.wicca because of 500 posts in a single
>> >>>> thread
>> >>>> because people refuse to killfile Sid the troll.
>>
>> >>> There are certain aspects of killfiling which make them less
>> >>> effective
>> >>> than other methods.
>>
>> >> True... but if folks didn't rise to the bait, he would get bored and
>> >> go
>> >> play outside.
>>
>> > Possibly but, not probably. The sidiot troll has demonstrated, (by
>> > posting to that effect), that he'll troll whether responded to or not.
>> > Yes, he also dodges direct challenges to his weak assertions because
>> > his
>> > positions are too flimsy to withstand inquiry.
>>
>> If he gets no responses to his trolling, then he has once again failed.
>
> loser
> hiding in a room somewhere and running the anus mouth all day long
> on the internet because me don't have life.
>
> Isn't that just too bad?
>
> feeb, for obvious reasons, Sid
>
Hi, Sidiot.
I eleminated some of your extranious words.
It makes your post much clearer.
No need to thank me.
zayton
> On Apr 14, 6:00 pm, "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> "Noinden" <noin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > "sarchasm" <sar.ch...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > > "EverSidiot" <usenet4...@gmail.com> confuses himself again:
>>
>> > > A couple of
>>
>> > > Note: This is sarchasm talking to one of his own sockpuppets again.
>>
>> > A "couple of" denotes more than one. If "Noon-Air" were a sockpuppet of
>> > another, that would be one poster and not a "couple of" posters. The
>> > conclusion is that sidiot tries these and other diversions because he
>> > is
>> > unable to respond to the subject matter. Flaming those who challenge
>> > sidiot's delusions is not pertinent response, nor do vapid insults
>> > divert
>> > attention from the fact that sidiot dodges like someone is is fearful
>> > that
>> > his position is too weak to defend.
>>
>> >http://pictureisunrelated.com/2009/03/30/this-isnt-where-i-parked-my-...
>>
>> >This position?
>>
>> For sidiot, more like the fetal position from which he is unable to
>> anything
>> other than crap himself and cry on usenet. Maybe he's colicky or gassy.
>
> This is one ren's most ardent supporters.
Note that Sidiot equates thinking _he_ is a jackass with "supporting ren".
Hey, that means that everyone who ever met the Sidiot "supports ren".
Sizzle Flambé
> > This list of Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
>
> Only thing is, I've never seen any of these questions asked on ARW.
> So what we are dealing with here is a fundamental dishonesty on the
> part of the author. You've been warned.
* * * * _ A L L _ F A Q F I L E S A R E L I E S . . .
i f t h e y d i d t h e i r j o b s r i g h t . . . * *
* *
because they'll have answered the questions that _used_ to be
frequently asked, before they get asked _again_.
Another Obvious Observation, courtesy of Sizzle Flambé. Happy to be
of service. No charge. Enjoy the show.
ba...@delhitel.net
wrote:
>I eleminated some of your extranious words.
>It makes your post much clearer.
>No need to thank me.
>
Hi there, test mesage.