Terrible experience of using TSVN 1.7.0, now downgrade to 1.6.16.
Neveroldmilk
not even use the repo-browser to view my files on SVN server----the
repo-window just crash when I connect to visual svn server?! I am not
accusing of the developer for TSVN 1.7.0, but I just beg you
developers do some more serious tests before the release.
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Stefan Küng
> When I upgrade my TSVN to 1.7.0, everything seems to be wrong. I could
> not even use the repo-browser to view my files on SVN server----the
> repo-window just crash when I connect to visual svn server?! I am not
> accusing of the developer for TSVN 1.7.0, but I just beg you
> developers do some more serious tests before the release.
Hundreds of users were using nightly builds, beta and RC versions
without any problems.
So many users also means testing in multiple different environments, OS
versions, server versions, protocols, ...
What tests do you suggest we should do?
Stefan
--
___
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\ \_/_\_/> The coolest Interface to (Sub)Version Control
/_/ \_\ http://tortoisesvn.net
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spongman
>
> Stefan
Alternatively:
"Oh, sorry you're having problem. Please post more information on the
errors you were seeing so we can fix any bugs in the code or
misconfiguration of your environment."
*rolls eyes*
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Stefan Küng
>> What tests do you suggest we should do?
>>
>> Stefan
>
> Alternatively:
> "Oh, sorry you're having problem. Please post more information on the
> errors you were seeing so we can fix any bugs in the code or
> misconfiguration of your environment."
>
> *rolls eyes*
Then that information should have been posted instead of ranting about
the quality of our work.
With me it's like this: if you start the conversation nice, I'll be nice
too. If you don't, I don't see any reason to be nice in my answers.
Stefan
--
___
oo // \\ "De Chelonian Mobile"
(_,\/ \_/ \ TortoiseSVN
\ \_/_\_/> The coolest Interface to (Sub)Version Control
/_/ \_\ http://tortoisesvn.net
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spongman
> the quality of our work.
I think you might want to read his post again.
Actually, let's just do that right now:
> > When I upgrade my TSVN to 1.7.0, everything seems to be wrong.
is that a rant about the quality of your work?
from where i'm sitting it looks like he's just reporting what he's
seeing.
> > I could not even use the repo-browser to view my files on SVN server
> > ----the repo-window just crash when I connect to visual svn server?!
not a rant there either, just giving more details of the problem he's
seeing.
> > I am not accusing of the developer for TSVN 1.7.0,
he even explicitly states that he's not accusing you of anything
> > but I just beg you developers do some more serious tests before the release.
and here he, quite cordially, suggests a solution to preventing these
kinds of errors in the future.
he may well be mistaken, the problem's probably due to a mis-
configuration on his machine or server. but still, his point is valid
- more QA can never hurt.
> With me it's like this: if you start the conversation nice, I'll be nice
> too. If you don't, I don't see any reason to be nice in my answers.
You might want to get that looked at by a licensed professional.
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Andy Levy
>> > but I just beg you developers do some more serious tests before the release.
>
> and here he, quite cordially, suggests a solution to preventing these
> kinds of errors in the future.
>
> he may well be mistaken, the problem's probably due to a mis-
> configuration on his machine or server. but still, his point is valid
> - more QA can never hurt.
What QA do you suggest? Are you going to pay for a half-dozen
full-time testers to hammer on each build? Nightlies are available.
People are invited to participate. Bugs, when reported, *are*
resolved, very quickly (when they can be - if they're in the SVN
libraries, that goes to different developers). If "Neveroldmilk" has
an edge case that none of the people who experimented with the
nightlies had, then there's no way for anyone to know a bug exists,
and if it's not known, it can't be fixed.
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spongman
> What QA do you suggest? Are you going to pay for a half-dozen
> full-time testers to hammer on each build?
not at all.
in as much, it would seem to me that Neveroldmilk is doing you a favor
here - providing QA for free.
one could view that as an opportunity to engage, thank and assist a
customer and potentially improve the quality of the product.
or not.
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Andy Levy
> On Oct 14, 12:35 pm, Andy Levy <andy.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> What QA do you suggest? Are you going to pay for a half-dozen
>> full-time testers to hammer on each build?
>
> not at all.
>
> in as much, it would seem to me that Neveroldmilk is doing you a favor
> here - providing QA for free.
>
> one could view that as an opportunity to engage, thank and assist a
> customer and potentially improve the quality of the product.
Neveroldmilk has failed to provide any information which could be used
to track down an issue beyond "it's broke, fix it, you guys don't test
very well."
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spongman
> Neveroldmilk has failed to provide any information which could be used
> to track down an issue beyond "it's broke, fix it, you guys don't test
> very well."
sure, it wasn't the best bug report. but surely it was a whole lot
better than no bug report at all?
his report could be seen as a failure on his part, an attack in need
of defense.
or it could be seen as an opening, a welcome opportunity to gain
potentially valuable insight into the working of your product in an
environment that you have previously not had access to.
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Stefan Küng
> On Oct 14, 1:50 pm, Andy Levy<andy.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Neveroldmilk has failed to provide any information which could be used
>> to track down an issue beyond "it's broke, fix it, you guys don't test
>> very well."
>
> sure, it wasn't the best bug report. but surely it was a whole lot
> better than no bug report at all?
No, not really.
We could have asked further questions, but as he mentioned in the
subject, he already downgraded to 1.6.16. So any further questions would
be useless, because anything we need to ask him to try he can't do
anymore. And that makes the whole report useless. All that's left is
just a rant about the quality of our work.
Stefan
--
___
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(_,\/ \_/ \ TortoiseSVN
\ \_/_\_/> The coolest Interface to (Sub)Version Control
/_/ \_\ http://tortoisesvn.net
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Dale McCoy
> On 14.10.2011 23:10, spongman wrote:
>> On Oct 14, 1:50 pm, Andy Levy<andy.l...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Neveroldmilk has failed to provide any information which could be used
>>> to track down an issue beyond "it's broke, fix it, you guys don't test
>>> very well."
>>
>> sure, it wasn't the best bug report. but surely it was a whole lot
>> better than no bug report at all?
>
> No, not really.
> We could have asked further questions, but as he mentioned in the
> subject, he already downgraded to 1.6.16. So any further questions would
> be useless, because anything we need to ask him to try he can't do
> anymore. And that makes the whole report useless. All that's left is
> just a rant about the quality of our work.
Even worse than being useless, in my opinion, is that it's a waste of
time. And then spongman shows up and apparently feels compelled to
waste yet more time by defending the useless bug report instead of
trying to draw out a better one. (And then I feel compelled to agree
with Stefan, but I'll try to shoehorn in something useful too.)
So, spongman: Imagine that one of your users came to you with the
functionally equivalent bug report: "I can't use your latest version.
It's broken. I'm using the previous version now. You should test
more." What would you do with this bug report? Would you attempt to
fix it? If so, how would you know when you had fixed it? If not,
you're ignoring it, and the report is useless. In the latter case, the
time you spent not-fixing the not-a-bug is time you could have spent
dealing with real bugs. Or having a life.
Dale McCoy
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spongman
>
> To unsubscribe from this discussion, e-mail: [users-unsubscr...@tortoisesvn.tigris.org].
as luck would have it, i happened to suggest something near the top of
this thread:
https://groups.google.com/group/tortoisesvn/msg/c47b9de9f1b8adc5
"Oh, sorry you're having problem. Please post more information on the
errors you were seeing so we can fix any bugs in the code or
misconfiguration of your environment."
at my company, we happen to get mostly useless initial bug reports
from our users - they're creative types mostly, so they're not
accustomed to filing bug reports. we go to great lengths to help them
help us.
and even if we don't get any results in the end, we don't consider it
a waste of time.
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Stefan Küng
> as luck would have it, i happened to suggest something near the top
> of this thread:
>
> https://groups.google.com/group/tortoisesvn/msg/c47b9de9f1b8adc5
>
> "Oh, sorry you're having problem. Please post more information on
> the errors you were seeing so we can fix any bugs in the code or
> misconfiguration of your environment."
And that's exactly what doesn't work. If the user already went back to
the previous version, there's no way for him to provide more information
anymore.
> at my company, we happen to get mostly useless initial bug reports
> from our users - they're creative types mostly, so they're not
> accustomed to filing bug reports. we go to great lengths to help
> them help us.
>
> and even if we don't get any results in the end, we don't consider
> it a waste of time.
the difference between a company and an open source project is that in
the company, you get paid for your time and you still have time for
yourself when you get home. In open source projects, we don't get paid
at all and the time we spend here *is* our own time which is not that
much to begin with.
Stefan
--
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\ \_/_\_/> The coolest Interface to (Sub)Version Control
/_/ \_\ http://tortoisesvn.net
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Neil
Just to bypass all of the hoopla - how did you get back to the previous version? Did you have to use Uninstall programs from the Windows Control Panel? Did you re-download & install 1.6.16?
I think plenty of people are experiencing problems upgrading to 1.7. Why will I never learn to just ignore those "new version" available pop-ups?