Re: Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster than Forecast?
Exxon Liars & Thieves
> Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster than Forecast?
>
> http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/529498/
>
> http://www.ucar.edu/news/releases/2007/seaice.shtml
>
> http://www.cosis.net/abstracts/EGU2007/01362/EGU2007-J-01362.pdf?PHPS...
People that pay attention to the data already knew this. People in
academia who play video games with models are the ones surprised.
john fernbach
website, for people who are too lazy to check out the hyperlinks.
Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
QUOTE:
" The study indicates that, because of the disparity between the
computer models and actual observations, the shrinking of summertime
ice is about 30 years ahead of the climate model projections. "
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
News Release
UCAR Communications
Arctic Ice Retreating More Quickly Than Computer Models Project
April 30, 2007
BOULDER-Arctic sea ice is melting at a significantly faster rate than
projected by even the most advanced computer models, a new study
concludes. The research, by scientists at the National Center for
Atmospheric Research (NCAR) and the University of Colorado's National
Snow and Ice Data Center (NSIDC), shows that the Arctic's ice cover is
retreating more rapidly than estimated by any of the 18 computer
models used by the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) in
preparing its 2007 assessments.
The study, "Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster Than Forecast?" will appear
tomorrow in the online edition of Geophysical Research Letters. It was
led by Julienne Stroeve of the NSIDC and funded by the National
Science Foundation, which is NCAR's principal sponsor, and by NASA.
"While the ice is disappearing faster than the computer models
indicate, both observations and the models point in the same
direction: the Arctic is losing ice at an increasingly rapid pace and
the impact of greenhouse gases is growing," says NCAR scientist Marika
Holland, one of the study's co-authors.
The authors compared model simulations of past climate with
observations by satellites and other instruments. They found that, on
average, the models simulated a loss in September ice cover of 2.5
percent per decade from 1953 to 2006. The fastest rate of September
retreat in any individual model was 5.4 percent per decade. (September
marks the yearly minimum of sea ice in the Arctic.)
But newly available data sets, blending early aircraft and ship
reports with more recent satellite measurements that are considered
more reliable than the earlier records, show that the September ice
actually declined at a rate of about 7.8 percent per decade during the
1953-2006 period.
"This suggests that current model projections may in fact provide a
conservative estimate of future Arctic change, and that the summer
Arctic sea ice may disappear considerably earlier than IPCC
projections," says Stroeve.
Thirty years ahead of schedule
The study indicates that, because of the disparity between the
computer models and actual observations, the shrinking of summertime
ice is about 30 years ahead of the climate model projections. As a
result, the Arctic could be seasonally free of sea ice earlier than
the IPCC- projected timeframe of any time from 2050 to well beyond
2100.
The authors speculate that the computer models may fail to capture the
full impact of increased carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases in
the atmosphere. Whereas the models indicate that about half of the ice
loss from 1979 to 2006 was due to increased greenhouse gases, and the
other half due to natural variations in the climate system, the new
study indicates that greenhouse gases may be playing a significantly
greater role.
There are a number of factors that may lead to the low rates of
simulated sea ice loss. Several models overestimate the thickness of
the present-day sea ice and the models may also fail to fully capture
changes in atmospheric and oceanic circulation that transport heat to
polar regions.
March ice
Although the loss of ice for March is far less dramatic than the
September loss, the models underestimate it by a wide margin as well.
The study concludes that the actual rate of sea ice loss in March,
which averaged about 1.8 percent per decade in the 1953 -2006 period,
was three times larger than the mean from the computer models. March
is typically the month when Arctic sea ice is at its most extensive.
The Arctic is especially sensitive to climate change partly because
regions of sea ice, which reflect sunlight back into space and provide
a cooling impact, are disappearing. In contrast, darker areas of open
water, which are expanding, absorb sunlight and increase temperatures.
This feedback loop has played a role in the increasingly rapid loss of
ice in recent years, which accelerated to 9.1 percent per decade from
1979 to 2006 according to satellite observations.
Walt Meier, Ted Scambos, and Mark Serreze, all at NSIDC, also co-
authored the study.
Exxon Liars & Thieves
john fernbach wrote:
> I think it's okay to download this and print it out from the NCAR
> website, for people who are too lazy to check out the hyperlinks.
>
> Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
> fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
The guy killed himself -- he doesn't feel fine or anything. His
girlfriend drank his blood as O remember.
Don't say you haven't seen this:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.environment/search?group=sci.environment&q=IOKE_into_Arctic.html&qt_g=Search+this+group
http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=Ice_Mystery_Solved.html+Fernbach&start=0&filter=0
Data trumps theory. Data trumps models.
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_4/Arctic_Ice_Melt.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_4/Mystery_Solved/Ice_Mystery_Solved.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_4/Bebinca/Bebinca_01.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_4/Bebinca/ioke_bebinca_compare.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_4/Bebinca_to_Alaska/Bebinca_to_Alaska2.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_4/Bebinca_into_Alaska//Bebinca_into_Alaska2.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_5/IOKE_into_Arctic.html
http://h2-pv.us/Temp_5/Shanshan_Tornadoes.html
Roger Coppock
[ . . . ]
> Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
> fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
It was REM, I believe. I, however, definitely do
NOT feel fine about it. In fact, as long as were
using phrases fro popular culture, "I'm as mad
as hell, and I'm not going to take this anymore."
http://www.americanrhetoric.com/MovieSpeeches/moviespeechnetwork2.html
IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD AS WE KNOW IT (AND I FEEL FINE)
That's great it starts with an earthquake
Birds and snakes and aeroplanes
Lenny Bruce is not afraid
Eye of a hurricane listen to yourself churn
World serves its own needs dummy serve your own needs
Speed it up a notch speed grunt nose street burn
The ladder starts to clatter with dinner fight down height
Wire in a fire room represent the southern gangs
In a government for hire and a combat site
Lefty wasn't coming in a hurry
With the furies breathing down your neck
Team by team reporters grapple trunk tethered crop
Look at that low plane fine then
Uh oh overflow population cornered
But it'll do save yourself serve yourself
World serves its own needs listen to your heartbeat
Tell me that the reds are in the reverend in the right right?
You patriotic patriotic slam fight right might feeling pretty psyched
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it
It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine
Six o'clock TV hour don't get caught foreign tower
Slash and burn return listen to yourself churn lock him in uniform
And book-burning blood-letting every motive escalate
Automotive incinerate light a candle light a votive
Step down step down watching heel crush crush
Uh oh this means no fear cavalier renegade steer clear
A tournament a tournament a tournament of lies
Offer me solutions offer me alternatives and I decline
It's the end of the world as we know it
(It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it
(It's time I had some time alone)
It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine
The other night I drifted nice continental drift to find
Mount Saint Edelite Leonard Bernstein
Leonid Brezhnev Lenny Bruce and Lester Bangs
Birthday party cheesecake jellybeans boom
You symbiotic patriotic slam foot neck right right
Ken
"john fernbach" <fernba...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1177984013.0...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>I think it's okay to download this and print it out from the NCAR
> website, for people who are too lazy to check out the hyperlinks.
>
> Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
> fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
"It's the End of the World as We Know It (and I Feel Fine)" by R.E.M.
It's the only understandable line in the whole song.
Bawana
> "john fernbach" <fernbach1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1177984013.0...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>
> >I think it's okay to download this and print it out from the NCAR
> > website, for people who are too lazy to check out the hyperlinks.
>
> > Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
> > fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
>
> "It's the End of the World as We Know It (and I Feel Fine)" by R.E.M.
> It's the only understandable line in the whole song.
Ol'kornholer should stick to show tunes.
hanson
news:9UwZh.132$bD...@newsfe02.lga...
>>> Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster than Forecast?
>>> http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/529498/
>>> http://www.ucar.edu/news/releases/2007/seaice.shtml
>>> http://www.cosis.net/abstracts/EGU2007/01362/EGU2007-J-01362.pdf?PHPS...
>>
>> People that pay attention to the data already knew this. People in
>> academia who play video games with models are the ones surprised.
>
> It's not just seasonal sea ice extent either, it's all the indicators.
> Sea level rise, from 1.8 mm/year up to 3.2 mm/year.
> Temperature, weather, almost daily reports.
>
[hanson]
... well, if you would not be so hysterical and watch every daily
report, instead of only almost, then you would be able to adjust
and adapt instead of whining. Build or buy a bigger HVAC gismo.
Problem solved. EOS
>
[Thomas Elifritz]
> Flora and fauna, disappearing, moving.
> Here it comes, folks, get ready.
> Welcome to the Eocene!
> Get A Free Orbiter Space Flight Simulator :
> http://orbit.medphys.ucl.ac.uk/orbit.html
>
[hanson]
So, what is your simulator good for in the Eocene?
Build or buy a bigger HVAC gismo and you'll be ready.
Thanks for the laughs Thomas. Here're the basics of
the game you are crying about:
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.environment/msg/70ed6372eccc32ba
ahaha... ahahahanson
Sylvia Else
Where did those who don't play video games with models get their
forecasts from? You can't get a forecast from just the data - you need a
model.
Sylvia.
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
Feb 13 10:13 AM US/Eastern
Study: Glacier melting can be variable
Feb 13 10:13 AM US/Eastern
BOULDER, Colo., Feb. 13 (UPI) -- A U.S. study suggests two of
Greenland's largest glaciers are melting at variable rates and not at
an increasing trend.
The study, led by Ian Howat, a researcher with the University of
Colorado's National Snow and Ice Data Center and the University of
Washington's Applied Physics Laboratory, shows the glaciers shrank
dramatically and dumped twice as much ice into the sea during a period of
less than a year between 2004 and 2005.
But then, fewer than two years later, they returned to near their
previous rates of discharge.
Howat says such variability during such a short time underlines the
problem in assuming glacial melting and sea level rise will necessarily
occur at a steady upward trajectory.
"Our main point is that the behavior of these glaciers can change a
lot from year to year, so we can't assume to know the future behavior
from short records of recent changes," he said. "Future warming may lead to
rapid pulses of retreat and increased discharge rather than a long, steady
drawdown."
The research is online in the journal Science Express.
Exxon Liars and Crooks
You need a broad and deep understanding. Then the data makes
trajectories which you can anticipate through the points in time.
Science makes predictions all the time without constructing computer
models. I predict water will boil at 100 degrees C at standard test
conditions (STP). I don't need a model for that, at least not a
computer model. Mental models are totally satisfactory for a great
deal of science without constructing any computer models.
Despite your astonishment, there are only a very few forces involved
in climate. They are so large and massive that they swamp out the
minor forces.
Weather predictions are involved in truly miniscule local predictions
of weather: what are the chances it will rain two days from now so I
can plan on golf game or maybe not? The facts of local weather are
huge by local standards: a tornado can give you a really bad day, but
statistically we are in a climate regime of 1200 to 1300 tornadoes a
year in the US, and the data tells me that without needing a computer
model. The fact that 2004 recorded 1800 tornadoes is a heads up that
something is changing and I need to be paying attention to that. 568
tornadoes in May 2003 is a heads up that I need to pay attention.
Models don't have that fine a degree of detail, and are neither
necessary nor useful in paying attention to the data on that level of
detail.
People trying to figure out climate by being super excellent on
predicting local weather are approaching from the wrong direction. You
don't need to model how many blue cars cross the bridge every day to
predict climate, although there may be some bizarre connection between
blue car numbers and the chance of tornadoes that might show up in
some models. Blue cars are not integral to climate, even if
statistically they relate somehow to local weather patterns, it's just
one of life's many coincidences or synchronisities.
Climate is big enough that it shows on Earth Disc satellite pictures,
of which we have decades taken every 30 minutes 24 hours per day.
Here's an example:
http://groups.google.com/groups/search?q=IOKE_into_Arctic.html&start=0&filter=0
Results 1 - 58 of 58 for IOKE_into_Arctic. html
No less than 58 times were people reminded this data existed, placed
online by personal effort of assembling a selection from more than
80,000 images to compose 55,000,000 bytes of graphical display data
for your edification.
Predictions were made based on nothing more than the data that you
can't pour over 100 nuclear bombs worth of heat energy into the Arctic
in August and not get a reaction that would last through February.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/msg/b59c967ad5e444ea
===== quote ====
I personally made predictions months in advance of events that the
thermal-kinetic energy stored in the Bearing Sea will ring the North
American Continent like a bell through at least February 2007 pushing
frigid air off the top of the world with expansion energy. You hear
voices in your head.
A number of posts have dealt with harsh winter conditions in the
Northern Hemisphere recently. Apparently some people never learned
basic physics in the absolutely free education system we offer up to
the 12th grade.
Very arctic conditions were warned earlier this year. The
preconditions
were set up and observed and measured. The results of the predictions
are now coming true.
For instance these links were posted:
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_5/IOKE_into_Arctic.html
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_4/Arctic_Ice_Melt.html
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_4/Mystery_Solved/Ice_Mystery_Solved.html
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_4/Bebinca/Bebinca_01.html
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_4/Bebinca/ioke_bebinca_compare.html
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_4/Bebinca_to_Alaska/Bebinca_to_Alaska2.html
http://ecosyn.us/Temp_4/Bebinca_into_Alaska//Bebinca_into_Alaska2.html
===== end quote ====
You see, prediction based on data, no model used, made December 2,
2006, of events yet to come, and actually a repeat of predictions made
months earlier as stated in that archived message.
I didn't need the number of blue cars crossing the bridge, nor would
that level of irrelevant detail have improved the prediction one iota.
No model that has blue cars in it would have done as good, let alone
better.
You have to understand the system first and go down down down to fine
grain details. You can't ever build a useful mental model starting
from the parts and working outward and upwards, because climate is
synergetic and non-linear. The behavior of the whole can never be
equal to the sum of the parts. There are emergent properties
completely unanticipatible working bottom upwards.
Meteorology precedes climatology: Red sky in the morning, sailors take
warning; red sky at night, sailors delight. Models are built for dual
meteorology as well as climatology. Computer models are good for
predicting the 5-day cone of hurricanes, but better for predicting the
3-day cone and even better for prediction of the 24-hour forecast.
Super models evolved to try to improve the weather forecasts, against
which they strain against limits of processors and speed.
Weather is so swamped with details that the whole is completely lost.
An aerial bomber dropped 100 atomic bombs as strong as the Hiroshima
or Nagasaki bombs in the arctic and nobody had it on their radar.
While it was a Hurricane it passed through assorted weather stations
jurisdiction, but once it was no longer a navigation hazard it was off
everybody's screens. 100 A-Bombs of energy was dropped and nobody
remembered the 1st Law of Thermodynamics: energy is never created nor
destroyed. 100 A-Bombs were lost off all the models on Earth who
couldn't tell you in advance that North America would "Ring Like A
Bell" through February, and as we see through April as well, since the
taxday Nor'easter came out of this too.
Bonzo
news:4636c1c6$0$31811$a82e...@reader.athenanews.com...
ADDENDUM:
The rising of the oceans due to the melting of the polar caps -- the single
biggest fear from global warming -- isn't continuing. The only large potential
source of ocean water is Antarctica and the only way to determine if Antarctica
is thinning is through the use of satellites. Duncan Wingham, Professor of
Climate Physics at University College London and Principal Scientist of the
European Space Agency, has unrefuted data that Antarctica, on the whole, is
actually thickening, and will "lower global sea levels by 0.08 mm" per year.
The oceans are thus not about to swallow up the low-lying islands and deltas of
the southern hemisphere, as so many fear. Unlike the several-kilometre-thick ice
in the Antarctic, the Arctic has ice only a few metres thick. Even if the
alarming predictions for ice loss there are correct --and Wingham doubts it --
an Arctic ice melt cannot trump a thickening Antarctic.
If the low-lying countries of the southern hemisphere don't experience economic
losses from the ocean's rise, the logic of economic ruin changes. The northern
hemisphere, Tol has found, would generally gain economically from a warming,
while the south would lose. But without losses in the south, global warming
might well bring net economic gains in both hemispheres.
http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/news/archives/story.html?id=216ca730-10f0-461
4-9692-fc37d99cbac3
Regards
Bonzo
"...and I think future generations are not going to blame us for anything except
for being silly, for letting a few tenths of a degree panic us"
Dr. Richard Lindzen, Professor of Meteorology MIT and Member of the National
Academy of Sciences
"What most commentators-and many scientists-seem to miss is that the only thing
we can say with certainly about climate is that it changes" Dr. Richard Lindzen,
Professor of Meteorology MIT and Member of the National Academy of Sciences
[most of the current alarm over climate change is based on] "inherently
untrustworthy climate models, similar to those that cannot accurately forecast
the weather a week from now." Dr. Richard Lindzen, Professor of Meteorology MIT
and Member of the National Academy of Sciences
Bonzo
news:1177997059.4...@n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 30, 9:21 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
> > Exxon Liars & Thieves wrote:
> > > On Apr 30, 6:10 pm, kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
> > >> Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster than Forecast?
LOWER SEA LEVELS TO COME
Sylvia Else
> On Apr 30, 9:21 pm, Sylvia Else <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote:
>> Exxon Liars & Thieves wrote:
>>
>>> On Apr 30, 6:10 pm, kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
>>>> Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster than Forecast?
>>>> http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/529498/
>>>> http://www.ucar.edu/news/releases/2007/seaice.shtml
>>>> http://www.cosis.net/abstracts/EGU2007/01362/EGU2007-J-01362.pdf?PHPS...
>>> People that pay attention to the data already knew this. People in
>>> academia who play video games with models are the ones surprised.
>> Where did those who don't play video games with models get their
>> forecasts from? You can't get a forecast from just the data - you need a
>> model.
>>
>> Sylvia.
>
> You need a broad and deep understanding.
You mean a model.
> Then the data makes
> trajectories which you can anticipate through the points in time.
Yes, by applying the data to the model.
> Science makes predictions all the time without constructing computer
> models. I predict water will boil at 100 degrees C at standard test
> conditions (STP). I don't need a model for that, at least not a
> computer model. Mental models are totally satisfactory for a great
> deal of science without constructing any computer models.
That's certainly true in some situations. Have you demonstrated that it
is true for climate forecasting?
Sylvia.
Saddam's Noose, Exxon's Neck
Werner Von Braun said "The Human Brain is the most powerful computer
in the universe, and the only one that can be made by unskilled
labor".
I've demonstrated that I can select out of 80,000 satellite images
which I collected in 2006 and pick exactly the right bunch to
effectively communicate a very complex set of interacting forces
coalescing at crucial nexus in a transmission of knowledge which
contains the number of data bytes required to make 550 books the size
of a James Michner novel. Not only can no computer on Earth do that,
all the computers on Earth combined can't do that. You, on your part,
with access to broadband modem can download in less than a day the
data mass equal to 550 James Michner novels and extract meaningful
knowledge which will fundamentally and permanently change your
paradigm on what kinds of data has meaningful contents enabling
accurate predictions months in advance of catastrophic weather events
which killed scores and damaged millions. I posted warnings far enough
in advance that people could batten down the hatches. Your video games
gave you warnings a few days in advance at most.
The system doesn't even know what data is meaningful, and had data
deletion policies which are out of sync with necessities. 24-hour
archives, 21 day archives, 30 day archives were found to be simply
insufficient.
During the Bebinca event the night crew satellite operators failed to
even keep the zoom functions on target, and the most unique event in
the history of satellite weather records was largely missed. You
probably haven't ever even heard of Bebinca, that it had the largest
hot spot ever photographed by infrared cameras aimed at Earth -- the
hot spot was 306 miles in diameter, large enough to drop Hurricane
IOKE into the hot spot completely, 74,000 square miles in size.
Lack of attention meant that six or so days later Cordova, Alaska, was
utterly unprepared for 24 inches of rain in 36 hours time, and the
Alaska pipeline was disabled for a time on both ends by weather
related to this event. 74,000 square miles and nobody paying any
attention to something that burned laser bright on the IR instruments.
No forecast warnings given, Alaskans were stranded when the only
highway in the south to Valdez was washed away.
What you have is a hodge-podge of pieces of evidence that I was
fortunate to save for your later inspection, not because I was
expecting THAT, but because I was expecting something strange and
happened to be looking when something strange showed up. Your video
games can't do that. They are incapable of expecting something novel
-- there's no way to program curiousity into them.
We have gone out of the green zone into the red zone. We are into
territory that no humans have ever been into before, and we have no
guarantees that we will live long enough to ever get back to the green
zone. Killer violent weather was common enough even back in the good
old days, and we have super-charged the weather since then. We have
been poking a violent beast with sharp sticks.
Meaningful data collection to me is to observe and record how many
people lost electric power since January 1, 2007 due to violent
weather. My count is 2,300,000 customer days of inconvenient power
outages during the worst weather of the year. Those 2.3 million is
meters, representing 3 people per, almost 7 million people lost power
for a day or longer. I don't even count those who lost it for just a
few hours.
Video game models don't record that and get meaning out of it. They
have no human misery index.
Sylvia Else
<snipped irrelevant stuff about weather forecasting>
I'll take that as a "no".
Sylvia.
Ignore the Exxon Crackpot Brigade
Climate cannot be forecast when the human race is powerful enough to
change climate but powerless to change it's behaviors. Nobody can
accurately predict climate while people can't control their zippers
leading to population increase, nor control their passions for big
cars. We can't predict why they will vote for people like Bush a
SECOND TIME after seeing the first time.
We can't predict why you are a dumb blond. Does peroxide drain brain
cells?
Computers are useless to predict these things.
Peter Muehlbauer
"Sylvia Else" <syl...@not.at.this.address> wrote
This is a well known troll.
Please do not feed him.
Just simply ignore him or (better) killfile him.
Thanks
Ignore the Exxon Crackpot Brigade
Wolfowitz's girlfriend also shagged Gordon Brown
image for Wolfowitz's girlfriend also shagged Gordon Brown
Rizla is a hooker whose job entailed fellating foreign finance
ministers into upping Iraq war budgets
Washington DC - (Ass Mess): UK Chancellor of the Exchequer Gordon
Brown's frequent trips to the International Bank for Deconstruction
and Embezzlement - a.k.a. the World Bank - may have been more for
pleasure than purely business according to private investigators'
reports into Paul Wolfowitz's lovelife which found that the two men
were both shagging the same woman currently mired in controversy over
salary earnings way above her remit as an IMF hooker.
The World Bank CEO has been accused of ensuring his girlfriend Shaha
Rilza - a scion of the eponymous cigarette paper manufacturing company
- was systematically promoted into high-flyer salaried jobs after
initially being hired as a manicurist in the World Bank's laundry
division.
Part of her duties entailed customer liaison which in Washington-speak
meant fellating foreign finance ministers into making favorable
budgetary adjustments to fund the Iraq war.
Wolfowitz was so pleased with the results that he got Rizla a top-paid
sinecure at the State Department where her legendary oral skills were
soon recognised and utilised across the diplomatic spectrum.
This weekend Gordon Brown met with President Bush in Washington in a
desperate bid to shore up the mess which threatens to hit the
international headlines ahead of Monday's Senate Committee
interrogation of witless US Attorney General Alberto Gonzales.
What his wife Sarah will say when the UK tabloids get hold of the pics
of her husband being pleasured in a Washington sauna by the sultry
Rizla is anybody's guess.
Sylvia Else
Predict a reason? What does that mean?
Never mind.
Sylvia.
Gonzales Architect of Bush Torture Rooms
http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s2i18111
May Day Is VECO Day
Written by queen mudder
Story written: 30 April 2007
Rated 5 out of 5Rated 5 out of 5Rated 5 out of 5Rated 5 out of 5Rated
5 out of 5
Email this story Print this story
image for May Day Is VECO Day
May Day is Bush's VECO day
Washington DC - (Ass Mess): President George Bush says he will rescue
the VECO Corrupt Bastards Club catastrophe tomorrow, but wants to work
with Democrats to find a compromise on getting Attorney General
Alberto Gonzales off the hook for Justice Department cover-ups about
big oil graft and kickbacks.
Bush has vowed to work with Democrats on the next step to craft a
compromise that will allow Gonzales to stay in office while the
Alaskan Bastards are indicted and subjected to Due Process.
"I made my position very clear," Bush said today, "but the Congress
chose to ignore it, so I will make sure that VECO isn't what finally
brings down this fine wartime Administration during the country's
greatest ever need for graft and corruption concealment by the
lawyers," Bush said in a press conference in the White House Rose
Garden on Monday.
"That's not to say that I'm not interested in their opinions - I am.
Anybody who knows me knows my total dedication to graft and corruption
in a bi-partisan atmosphere of mutual distrust.
"I look forward to working with members of both parties to get VECO
and my Attorney General off the hook without setting artificial
timetables and micromanaging the headlines while the Feds do their
work up in Alaska.
"There's a lot of Democrats that understand that I need to get the
money to the presidential election fun raisers as soon as possible.
I'm optimistic that we can get something done in a positive way," Bush
said.
Pat Flannery
kT wrote:
> Arctic Sea Ice Decline: Faster than Forecast?
And, of course, nothing gets the point across like a little Landsat
interactive view over the past three decades:
http://www.everybodysweather.com/Static_Media/Polar_Ice_Cap_Melter/index.htm
"Well...Superman, I was always a bit fond of the Fortress Of Solitude
myself, but it might be a good time to look into diving gear or huge
pontoons."
Meanwhile, in Metropolis:
"Miss Tessmacher, consider the possibilities! Thousands of miles of
beach-front property north of the Arctic Circle itself!"
"Lex, thousands of miles of cold, barren, beach-front property..."
"Well....heh-heh.... a little added CO2 could change all that."
"ARE WE GOING TO ADD GREENHOUSE GASES TO THE ATMOSPHERE, MR. LUTHOR?!"
"I wouldn't count that out as a possibility, Otis...I wouldn't count
that out as a possibility at all." ;-)
Pat
Jeff Findley
"john fernbach" <fernba...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1177984013.0...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
> fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
Was Google broken when you posted this? With a decent search engine, it
would have taken you about 30 seconds to find out that it was R.E.M. who
wrote this song.
Jeff
--
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a
little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor
safety"
- B. Franklin, Bartlett's Familiar Quotations (1919)
Jeff Findley
"Bonzo" <boo...@optusnt.com.au> wrote in message
news:4636...@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
Antarctica isn't melting faster
http://www.antarctica.ac.uk/About_Antarctica/FAQs/faq_02.html
Antarctica is melting faster
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4228411.stm
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0922-02.htm
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/02/AR2006030201712.html
A quick search does not indicate that there is a consensus on this topic.
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
"Jeff Findley" <jeff.f...@ugs.nojunk.com> wrote in message
news:921d6$46374d59$927a2cda$82...@FUSE.NET...
There once was a consensus that the Earth was heading for a Cooling
Disaster.
And since Consensuses are nto science, we know the Global Warming Consensus
is doomed to blow up all over the k00ks faces too.
The cooling world
Newsweek Magazine
There are ominous signs that the Earth's weather patterns have begun to
change dramatically and that these changes may portend a drastic decline in
food production -- with serious political implications for just about every
nation on Earth. The drop in food output could begin quite soon, perhaps
only 10 years from now.
The regions destined to feel its impact are the great wheat-producing
lands of Canada and the U.S.S.R. in the North, along with a number of
marginally self-sufficient tropical areas -- parts ofIndia,Pakistan,
Bangladesh, Indochina and Indonesia -- where the growing season is dependent
upon the rains brought by the monsoon.
The evidence in support of these predictions has now begun to accumulate
so massively that meteorologists are hard-pressed to keep up with it. In
England, farmers have seen their growing season decline by about two weeks
since 1950, with a resultant overall loss in grain production estimated at
up to 100,000 tons annually. During the same time, the average temperature
around the equator has risen by a fraction of a degree -- a fraction that in
some areas can mean drought and desolation. Last April, in the most
devastating outbreak of tornadoes ever recorded, 148 twisters killed more
than 300 people and caused half a billion dollars' worth of damage in 13
U.S. states.
To scientists, these seemingly disparate incidents represent the advance
signs of fundamental changes in the world's weather. Meteorologists disagree
about the cause and extent of the trend, as well as over its specific impact
on local weather conditions. But they are almost unanimous in the view that
the trend will reduce agricultural productivity for the rest of the century.
If the climatic change is as profound as some of the pessimists fear, the
resulting famines could be catastrophic. "A major climatic change would
force economic and social adjustments on a worldwide scale," warns a recent
report by the National Academy of Sciences, "because the global patterns of
food production and population that have evolved are implicitly dependent on
the climate of the present century."
A survey completed last year by Dr. Murray Mitchell of the National
Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reveals a drop of half a degree in
average ground temperatures in the Northern Hemisphere between 1945 and
1968. According to George Kukla of Columbia University, satellite photos
indicated a sudden, large increase in Northern Hemisphere snow cover in the
winter of 1971-72. And a study released last month by two NOAA scientists
notes that the amount of sunshine reaching the ground in the continental
U.S. diminished by 1.3% between 1964 and 1972.
To the layman, the relatively small changes in temperature and sunshine
can be highly misleading. Reid Bryson of the University of Wisconsin points
out that the Earth's average temperature during the great Ice Ages was only
about seven degrees lower than during its warmest eras -- and that the
present decline has taken the planet about a sixth of the way toward the Ice
Age average.
Others regard the cooling as a reversion to the "little ice age"
conditions that brought bitter winters to much of Europe and northern
America between 1600 and 1900 -- years when the Thames used to freeze so
solidly that Londoners roasted oxen on the ice and when iceboats sailed the
Hudson River almost as far south as New York City.
Just what causes the onset of major and minor ice ages remains a
mystery. "Our knowledge of the mechanisms of climatic change is at least as
fragmentary as our data," concedes the National Academy of Sciences report.
"Not only are the basic scientific questions largely unanswered, but in many
cases we do not yet know enough to pose the key questions."
Meteorologists think that they can forecast the short-term results of
the return to the norm of the last century. They begin by noting the slight
drop in overall temperature that produces large numbers of pressure centers
in the upper atmosphere. These break up the smooth flow of westerly winds
over temperate areas. The stagnant air produced in this way causes an
increase in extremes of local weather such as droughts, floods, extended dry
spells, long freezes, delayed monsoons and even local temperature
increases -- all of which have a direct impact on food supplies. "The
world's food-producing system," warns Dr. James D. McQuigg of NOAA's Center
for Climatic and Environmental Assessment, "is much more sensitive to the
weather variable than it was even five years ago." Furthermore, the growth
of world population and creation of new national boundaries make it
impossible for starving peoples to migrate from their devastated fields, as
they did during past famines.
Climatologists are pessimistic that political leaders will take any
positive action to compensate for the climatic change, or even to allay its
effects. They concede that some of the more spectacular solutions proposed,
such as melting the Arctic ice cap by covering it with black soot or
diverting arctic rivers, might create problems far greater than those they
solve. But the scientists see few signs that government leaders anywhere are
even prepared to take the simple measures of stockpiling food or of
introducing the variables of climatic uncertainty into economic projections
of future food supplies. The longer the planners delay, the more difficult
will they find it to cope with climatic change once the results become grim
reality.
"The Cooling World": From Newsweek, April 28, 1975. ?1975 Newsweek Inc.
All rights reserved. Reprinted by permission.
john fernbach
> "john fernbach" <fernbach1...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1177984013.0...@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Was it Nirvana who sang, "It's the end of the world, and I feel
> > fine"? Or am I thinking of some other group?
>
> Was Google broken when you posted this? With a decent
search engine, it would have taken you about 30 seconds
to find out that it was R.E.M. who wrote this song.
>
Frankly, Jeff, I didn't care whether it was Nirvana
or R.E.M. or Johnny Cash or Pavarotti or Madonna.
I was a nerd in high school about 2 million years ago, which
is why I've spent a lot of my life worrying about stuff like
global climate change rather than being current on the
latest music. And I feel fine about the choice.
I also think getting the song attribution wrong was one of the best
things I've ever done in this usenet group. For a long time,
I've been posting news items about global warming and
drought, and often no one except Bawana, Ray Lopez
or sometimes Roger Coppock responds.
But I get the R.E.M and Nirvana issue wrong, and -- presto!
- half a dozen people are responding passionately to my posts.
!!!! FAME AT LAST !!!!
But that reminds me -- wasn't this whole message string orginally
about rates of Arctic melting, and not the urgent
R.E.M./Nirvana controversy? :-)
john fernbach
<Exxon.Liars.and.Thie...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote:
Exxon Liars -- I just looked at one of your hyperlinks on the 2006
heat engine "Bebinca."
Wow. Thank you for the information.
And no, I hadn't seen that set of satellite photos or
the accompanying text.
BTW, a picky point of English grammar - the link got the
word "it's" wrong in describing Bebina and what it means.
When we're writing about possession, about "belonging to it,"
the correct spelling is "its." Whenever we write "it's," the
meaning being conveyed is "it is."
But this is me, as a writer, picking fly shit out of the pepper --
focusing on minutiae. The information on "Bebinca" is
important, and ominous. Again, thanks for the scientific scoop.
Peter Muehlbauer
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:I8IZh.25$c6...@newsfe04.lga...
> Jeff Findley wrote:
>
> > Antarctica isn't melting faster
> > http://www.antarctica.ac.uk/About_Antarctica/FAQs/faq_02.html
> >
> > Antarctica is melting faster
> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4228411.stm
> > http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0922-02.htm
> > http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/02/AR2006030201712.html
> >
> > A quick search does not indicate that there is a consensus on this topic.
>
> global warming is responsible.
Dumb boy kT, reying in newspaper hoaxes...
http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/topstory/20020820southseaice.html
Just take a look out of the window of your simulated space shuttle
and you will see.
Peter Muehlbauer
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:svNZh.4909$VE....@newsfe12.lga...
> Peter Muehlbauer wrote:
> > "kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:I8IZh.25$c6...@newsfe04.lga...
> >> Jeff Findley wrote:
> >>
> >>> Antarctica isn't melting faster
> >>> http://www.antarctica.ac.uk/About_Antarctica/FAQs/faq_02.html
> >>>
> >>> Antarctica is melting faster
> >>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4228411.stm
> >>> http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0922-02.htm
> >>> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/03/02/AR2006030201712.html
> >>>
> >>> A quick search does not indicate that there is a consensus on this topic.
> >> There is no lack of consensus that Antarctic *is* melting, and that
> >> global warming is responsible.
> >
> > Dumb boy kT, reying in newspaper hoaxes...
> > http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/topstory/20020820southseaice.html
>
>
> Antarctica itself is losing mass at a very large rate.
>
> http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/311/5768/1754
Dumb, dumb kT.
Antarctica IS SEA ICE, nothing else.
There is no landmass below antarctica... idiot!
Rand Simberg
Muehlbauer" <spam...@frankenexpress.de> made the phosphor on my
monitor glow in such a way as to indicate that:
>> > Dumb boy kT, reying in newspaper hoaxes...
>> > http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/topstory/20020820southseaice.html
>>
>> First of all, that's sea ice. It melts and reforms constantly.
>>
>> Antarctica itself is losing mass at a very large rate.
>>
>> http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/311/5768/1754
>
>Dumb, dumb kT.
>Antarctica IS SEA ICE, nothing else.
>There is no landmass below antarctica... idiot!
While Elifritz is an idiot, and a troll, and a vile human being,
Antarctica is a land mass. It is in fact a continent. Perhaps you're
thinking of the Arctic?
Bush Lost Iraq War
Nancy Pelosi: Alberto Gonzales Must Resign
Published by Staff April 22nd, 2007 in World.
Nancy Pelosi: Alberto Gonzales Must Resign
Speaker Nancy Pelosi released the following statement last afternoon
calling for the resignation of Attorney General Alberto Gonzales:
"The Attorney General is the defender of the Constitution and the
chief law enforcement officer. The people of the United States must
have absolute confidence in the integrity of their Attorney General.
"By his actions and with his testimony yesterday, Attorney General
Alberto Gonzales has lost the trust of the American people. The nation
cannot have a chief law enforcement officer whose candor and judgment
are in serious question.
"The President should restore credibility to the office of the
Attorney General. Alberto Gonzales must resign."
Source: Office of the Speaker of the House
Peter Muehlbauer
"Rand Simberg" <simberg.i...@org.trash> wrote
Sorry, my fault.
His opportunistic attitude drives me crazy.
Maybe I should really killfile him now.
There is no way to show him what reality is.
Bush Lost Iraq War
LaRouche Youth Movement Was Crucial To Impeachment Resolution in
California
April 30 (LPAC)-The California resolution to investigate Dick Cheney's
and George Bush's being "subversive of the Constitution," and raising
the possibility of impeachment was the biggest vote getter (tied with
another resolution) at the California Democratic Party convention,
reported Tim Carpenter of the Progressive Democrats of America, on
April 30.
But, without the LaRouche Youth Movement, there wouldn't have been a
resolution. It was the LYM presence in the Los Angeles County
Democratic Party that got an impeachment resolution against Cheney
passed earlier this year-and that was brought up to the Resolutions
Committee at the San Diego convention. But, when the State Democratic
Party resolutions committee rejected the question of impeachment, the
LYM and LaRouche PAC went into action-briefing convention delegates
about the Lousiana adopting of a resolution supporting Rep. Dennis
Kucinich's bill of impeachment against Dick Cheney (see letter), and
organizing a delegation to the Resolutions Committee to tell them that
they dare not resist the "stampede" in the population, and at the
convention for impeachment.
It was late Friday night, when the Resolutions Committee rejected the
impeachment resolutions, provoking an angry response that was shaped
and directed by the LYM non-stop organizing activity up through 6 PM
the last night. The news of the Lousiana resolution passing finally
broke the situation wide open, leading to the drafting of a resolution
that ultimately passed the convention.
PDA's Carpenter summarized the resolution in his April 30 release,
writing:
"The resolution refers to Bush and Cheney having acted in a manner
'subversive of the Constitution' by ... (1) using false information to
justify the invasion of Iraq; (2) authorizing 'the torture of
prisoners of war'; (3) 'authorizing wiretaps on U.S. citizens without
obtaining a warrant'; (4) 'disclosing the name of an undercover CIA
operative'; (5) suspending 'the historic Writ of Habeas Corpus by
ordering the indefinite detention of so-called enemy combatants'; (6)
'signing statements used to ignore or circumvent portions of over 750
Congressional statutes.' The resolution ends by calling for 'vigorous
investigation' and 'appropriate remedies and punishment, including
impeachment.'
LPAC will post the California resolution, when it is provided by the
State Democratic Party.
Peter Muehlbauer
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:KzPZh.73$fu...@newsfe02.lga...
Not so fast.
German EPA states:
Umweltbundesamt, Mai 2004
"Antarctica is the coldest part of the earth. Temperatures are so low
that no melting occured until now (excluding antarctic peninsula).
By warming of the oceans a higher absolute humidity of atmosphere
may appear, resulting in precipitation and condensation at this cold trap
so that ice masses will even incline."
You remain an idiot.
Peter Muehlbauer
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:rWPZh.82$fu...@newsfe02.lga...
> A simple retraction usually suffices.
You snipping my answer makes me feel hitting some of your nerves, eh?
Bush Lost Iraq War
Rebuild Projects in Iraq Failing
CCN (Crazy Cal News) - Iraq - The American-financed rebuilding program
federal oversight agency has found that in a sampling of eight
projects that the United States had declared successes, seven were no
longer operating as designed because of plumbing and electrical
failures, lack of proper maintenance, apparent looting and expensive
equipment that lay idle.
President Bush, defending Dick Cheney and Halliburton, said, "It's
because of them lazy American workers. I have a plan that should fix
everything. I'll just ship some a them illegal alien Mexicans from
Texas to Iraq to do all the construction work. That's what we do in
our oil refineries in Texas. They'll have it fixed up in no time! Que
Paso, amigo?"
Doroteo Morales, an illegal Mexican immigrant, when asked what he
thought of the plan, said, "No habla Inglés."
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
kilometers in March to about 18.8 square kilometers in September. The
average thickness of the sea ice is about 1.5 meters and 85 percent of the
ice pack melts each year. This ice is characterized by undulating ridges and
troughs and crevassed areas which have created route-finding problems for
those traveling across these marginal areas of the ice shelf. The pack moves
quickly with the winds--as much as 65 kilometers in a single day--and ships
can easily be caught in some of the thicker, more complex multiyear ice that
is trapped within indentations on the Ross Sea coastline.
http://www.antarcticconnection.com/antarctic/science/glaciology.shtml
Peter Muehlbauer
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:HoQZh.61$gP...@newsfe03.lga...
> > You snipping my answer makes me feel ...
>
> Does this mean I won the debate?
Debates with idiots you are obsolete.
Bush Lost Iraq War
Ann Coulter named new War Czarette. Vows to bring troops home
immediately.
Written by John Andreini
Story written: 16 April 2007
Rated 3 out of 5Rated 3 out of 5Rated 3 out of 5Rated 3 out of 5Rated
3 out of 5
Email this story Print this story
image for Ann Coulter named new War Czarette. Vows to bring troops
home immediately.
Washington, D.C. - The White House announced today that it is naming
conservative pundit Ann Coulter to be the nation's first War Czarette.
The fiery right-wing commentator and author has accepted the
appointment, and responded to questions about her qualifications.
"I'm pro war. Who better to run a war than someone who loves the smell
of napalm in the morning? I am in total agreement with the president
that this war will go on for a long, long time and that there will be
continued death and destruction. I am very excited about that."
The most surprising aspect of Ms. Coulter's remarks was her
announcement that she will order American troops to leave Iraq within
the month.
"One of my very first responsibilities in this new position will be to
order the evacuation of all U.S. military forces and contractors from
Iraq. Of course your first question will by, "Why?" All I can say at
this time is that we need to clean the slate in that troubled country
and start over. Iraq is an open sore upon humanity that needs to be
treated, and we intend to purify that sandy rat hole with few well-
placed gadgets."
An incredulous reporter asked, "Do you mean nuclear bombs?"
Coulter only smiled.
"You didn't mention evacuating the press," remarked another reporter.
"No. I didn't," said Coulter. "Next question..."
When asked if she could effectively lead the military never having
served in uniform, Coulter leveled a revolver at the reporter and shot
him in the forehead. Coulter then thanked the assembled media for
attending and exited.
Bugman
"Bush Lost Iraq War" <Bush.Lost.Iraq.War...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote in
message news:1178063800....@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s2i17413
>
> Ann Coulter named new War Czarette. Vows to bring troops home
> immediately.
Knowing her she would have the planes blown up so she could blame it on the
democrats.
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
Wolfowitz Mass Murder for OIL
Controlling war spending? Not accomplished
Listen to this story
Something's been lost in the debate over emergency Iraq war funding
and troop withdrawal deadlines. The price tag for the war is
approaching $500 billion - about 10 times the advertised price. Steve
Henn reports.
Photo: Protesters aligned with the group Americans United for Change
held a rally this week near the White House to mark the fourth
anniversary of President Bush's "Mission Accomplished" speech. (Win
McNamee, Getty Images)
email this story
TEXT OF STORY
KAI RYSSDAL: Congressional Democrats sent the president their version
of the Iraq war funding bill today. Despite White House promises to
send it right back with a veto attached, which the president did late
this afternoon.
There is some political symbolism in the timing of this whole thing.
Today's the fourth anniversary of the president's "Mission
Accomplished" speech.
Marketplace's Steve Henn reports something's been lost in the debate
over troop withdrawal deadlines. He says the price tag for the war is
approaching $500 billion - just about 10 times the advertised price.
STEVE HENN: Remember Larry Lindsay?
WASHINGTON EMPLOYEE: I knew he was in the Bush administration, but
I can't remember under what department.
Even people who work a few blocks from the White House can't remember.
For the record, Lindsay was President Bush's first economic policy
adviser. He was fired after he said the war in Iraq could cost more
than $100 billion.
At the time, the official White House line was this war would be a
bargain at $50 billion. Today, we've spent nearly 10 times that.
JOSEPH STIGLIZT: Paul Wolfowitz actually said that the war would
pay for itself.
Joseph Stiglizt is a Nobel Prize-winning economist and served as
former President Clinton's economic policy advisor.
STIGLIZT: The number half a trillion dollars is clearly a mind-
boggling number.
So without a war to pay for, what could you do with that kind of
money?
STIGLIZT: For just a little bit more than $500 billion, you could
have fixed the Social Security problem for the next 75 years.
Or you could have doubled foreign aid to developing countries - not
just aid from the U.S., but all development aid, period.
But Robert Hormats, the author of "The Price of Liberty" - a new book
on paying for America's wars - says in comparison to past conflicts,
the war in Iraq is a steal. The Second World War cost more than $5
trillion when you adjust for inflation, and Vietnam cost about $650
billion.
ROBERT HORMATS: We're definitely trying to fight the war on the
cheap. And I think that's one of the things missing in this war - that
Americans have not been asked to make any sacrifices.
Hormats argues the only ones sacrificing are the troops - who in some
cases, despite this war's price tag, still aren't getting what they
need.
In Washington, I'm Steve Henn for Marketplace.
President Bush addressed the nation on Iraq beneath a banner reading
"Mission Accomplished" aboard the nuclear aircraft carrier USS Abraham
Lincoln on May 1, 2003. (Stephen Jaffe, AFP/Getty Images)
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
Bill Ward
Wrong pole, Peter.
Bill Ward
Highly recommended. Killfiling him, Scott Nudds, Lyin Kuntz, and
kangarooistan really improves the S/N ratio. Until someone responds, that
is, hint, hint.
Wolfowitz Mass Murder for OIL
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
February 11, 2007
An experiment that hints we are wrong on climate change
Nigel Calder, former editor of New Scientist, says the orthodoxy must be
challenged
When politicians and journalists declare that the science of global warming
is settled, they show a regrettable ignorance about how science works. We
were treated to another dose of it recently when the experts of the
Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change issued the Summary for
Policymakers that puts the political spin on an unfinished scientific
dossier on climate change due for publication in a few months' time. They
declared that most of the rise in temperatures since the mid-20th century is
very likely due to man-made greenhouse gases.
The small print explains "very likely" as meaning that the experts who made
the judgment felt 90% sure about it. Older readers may recall a press
conference at Harwell in 1958 when Sir John Cockcroft, Britain's top nuclear
physicist, said he was 90% certain that his lads had achieved controlled
nuclear fusion. It turned out that he was wrong. More positively, a 10%
uncertainty in any theory is a wide open breach for any latterday Galileo or
Einstein to storm through with a better idea. That is how science really
works.
Twenty years ago, climate research became politicised in favour of one
particular hypothesis, which redefined the subject as the study of the
effect of greenhouse gases. As a result, the rebellious spirits essential
for innovative and trustworthy science are greeted with impediments to their
research careers. And while the media usually find mavericks at least
entertaining, in this case they often imagine that anyone who doubts the
hypothesis of man-made global warming must be in the pay of the oil
companies. As a result, some key discoveries in climate research go almost
unreported.
Enthusiasm for the global-warming scare also ensures that heatwaves make
headlines, while contrary symptoms, such as this winter's billion-dollar
loss of Californian crops to unusual frost, are relegated to the business
pages. The early arrival of migrant birds in spring provides colourful
evidence for a recent warming of the northern lands. But did anyone tell you
that in east Antarctica the Adélie penguins and Cape petrels are turning up
at their spring nesting sites around nine days later than they did 50 years
ago? While sea-ice has diminished in the Arctic since 1978, it has grown by
8% in the Southern Ocean.
So one awkward question you can ask, when you're forking out those extra
taxes for climate change, is "Why is east Antarctica getting colder?" It
makes no sense at all if carbon dioxide is driving global warming. While you're
at it, you might inquire whether Gordon Brown will give you a refund if it's
confirmed that global warming has stopped. The best measurements of global
air temperatures come from American weather satellites, and they show
wobbles but no overall change since 1999.
That levelling off is just what is expected by the chief rival hypothesis,
which says that the sun drives climate changes more emphatically than
greenhouse gases do. After becoming much more active during the 20th
century, the sun now stands at a high but roughly level state of activity.
Solar physicists warn of possible global cooling, should the sun revert to
the lazier mood it was in during the Little Ice Age 300 years ago.
Climate history and related archeology give solid support to the solar
hypothesis. The 20th-century episode, or Modern Warming, was just the latest
in a long string of similar events produced by a hyperactive sun, of which
the last was the Medieval Warming.
The Chinese population doubled then, while in Europe the Vikings and
cathedral-builders prospered. Fascinating relics of earlier episodes come
from the Swiss Alps, with the rediscovery in 2003 of a long-forgotten pass
used intermittently whenever the world was warm.
What does the Intergovernmental Panel do with such emphatic evidence for an
alternation of warm and cold periods, linked to solar activity and going on
long before human industry was a possible factor? Less than nothing. The
2007 Summary for Policymakers boasts of cutting in half a very small
contribution by the sun to climate change conceded in a 2001 report.
Disdain for the sun goes with a failure by the self-appointed greenhouse
experts to keep up with inconvenient discoveries about how the solar
variations control the climate. The sun's brightness may change too little
to account for the big swings in the climate. But more than 10 years have
passed since Henrik Svensmark in Copenhagen first pointed out a much more
powerful mechanism.
He saw from compilations of weather satellite data that cloudiness varies
according to how many atomic particles are coming in from exploded stars.
More cosmic rays, more clouds. The sun's magnetic field bats away many of
the cosmic rays, and its intensification during the 20th century meant fewer
cosmic rays, fewer clouds, and a warmer world. On the other hand the Little
Ice Age was chilly because the lazy sun let in more cosmic rays, leaving the
world cloudier and gloomier.
The only trouble with Svensmark's idea - apart from its being politically
incorrect - was that meteorologists denied that cosmic rays could be
involved in cloud formation. After long delays in scraping together the
funds for an experiment, Svensmark and his small team at the Danish National
Space Center hit the jackpot in the summer of 2005.
In a box of air in the basement, they were able to show that electrons set
free by cosmic rays coming through the ceiling stitched together droplets of
sulphuric acid and water. These are the building blocks for cloud
condensation. But journal after journal declined to publish their report;
the discovery finally appeared in the Proceedings of the Royal Society late
last year.
Thanks to having written The Manic Sun, a book about Svensmark's initial
discovery published in 1997, I have been privileged to be on the inside
track for reporting his struggles and successes since then. The outcome is a
second book, The Chilling Stars, co-authored by the two of us and published
next week by Icon books. We are not exaggerating, we believe, when we
subtitle it "A new theory of climate change".
Where does all that leave the impact of greenhouse gases? Their effects are
likely to be a good deal less than advertised, but nobody can really say
until the implications of the new theory of climate change are more fully
worked out.
The reappraisal starts with Antarctica, where those contradictory
temperature trends are directly predicted by Svensmark's scenario, because
the snow there is whiter than the cloud-tops. Meanwhile humility in face of
Nature's marvels seems more appropriate than arrogant assertions that we can
forecast and even control a climate ruled by the sun and the stars.
The Chilling Stars is published by Icon. It is available for £9.89 including
postage from The Sunday Times Books First on 0870 165 8585
Crooked Corporations Backing Crooked Politicians
A Federal Court Ruled, the Tobacco Mafia was a Racketeering Operation
for over 50 years. This followed one of the longest most complex
litigations in American history. Full due process of law is
undisputable. This point is not open for debate. The court ruling
ended the debate.
The racketeers hired a great body of corrupt individuals to commit
frauds. The evidence was displayed in court. It passed due process of
law. There is no debate about the names of people hired and the acts
they committed to defraud the American Public. This point is not open
for debate. The court has ruled.
Among the persons engaged in unlawful criminal fraud, some names are
better known than others and some individuals had longer criminal
careers than others. A great body of evidence, a google of evidence
40,000,000 pages worth, was ordered to be made available online by
order of the court. This evidence passed due process of law. This
point is not debatable.
It is a mandatory duty of Americans to uphold the laws. Concealing
crimes and aiding the commission of crimes is a violation of law in
all 50 states. This point is not debatable.
When a person receives notice that a crime of fraud is in process they
have a mandatory duty to investigate the facts as anyone of ordinary
intelligence would do under similar circumstances. This is the law
over the 50 states, common law inherited from British Common Law
before there ever was a United States. This point is not debatable.
Bonzo has been previously notified and received notice that acts of
crime, acts of fraud, were in process, and has a record kept in
google.com groups archives of notification in groups he participates
in and in threads where he has been active and in messages where he
has responded, and in messages where he has partly quoted the
notification. This is not a debatable point.
Links to evidence have been presented to John Fermback upon which the
law placed a madatory duty on Bonzo that he investigate as a
reasonable person or ordinary intelligence would investigate the
facts. Google.com preserves archived copies of this presentation of
links, and many sites around the world hold temporary but long
longevity duplicates of these archives. This point is not debatable.
When a clear scientific consensus exists, as it did on tobacco
mortality links, or global warming mortality links, those with a
profit motive to benefit from confusing the consensus in the minds of
the less educated have only one choice. They must create doubt. This
strategy and the documented evidence that it was used by racketeer
employers of science fraudsters was placed in the notice of Bonzo.
There are archives that he received this notice. This point is not
debatable.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.global-warming/search?q=%22Doubt+is+our+product%22+Fernbach&start=0&filter=0
There is no dispute that Fred Seitz was employed by RJ Reynolds
Tobacco Company over a period of at least 16 years of record or that
he received a salary of no less than $660,000 during that time. Public
records online by court order show his employment contracts and salary
negotiations. The court has adjudicated that a criminal fraud science
deception was being practiced before, during and after the employment
of Fred Seitz as science advisor. This point is not debatable.
There is no dispute that Fred Seitz became a science advisor of The
A.S.S. Coalition created by Philip Morris Tobacco Company for the
purpose of racketeering and committing science frauds. He appears on
letterhead of the science advisory board of this corrupt oganization.
Records are online by Federal Court order. This is not a debatable
point.
There is no argument about the fact that Fred Seitz was on the
founding Board of SEPP, headed by partner Fred Singer, and he appears
continuously on the record of that board even to the latest filing of
IRS form 990 available to public inspection on the internet. This
point is not debatable.
There is no argument about the fact that Fred Singer was on the
founding Board of SEPP, which organization he founded while housed in
Moonie Office space while Singer was a member of the Board of
Directors of that same Moonie Organization, the Washington Institute
for Values in Public Policy. There are records from the racketeers
which demonstrate that Fred Singer masterminded four science fraud
operations in support of the needs of his racketeer financial
contributors in 1993 and 1994, partly while housed in those offices.
This point is not debatable.
There are records from the racketeers files linking Patrick J.
Michaels to SEPP, Singer, Seitz and The A.S.S. Coalition during this
period. This point is not debatable.
There are a plentitude of documents that the public relations firm of
APCO ASSociates was created by long-time lawyers employed by Philip
Morris Tobacco Company, and that APCO ASSociates willfully,
premeditately with full knowledge engaged in science frauds in
creating The A.S.S. Coalition, including utilizing the services of a
compliant stable of crooks with prior proven history of frauds
benefiting the racketeers. There are public records online by Federal
Court order. This point is not debatable.
APCO ASSociates and employee of APCO, Tom Harris, created a fraud
event:
Wednesday, November 13, 2002 at 9:00 AM
National Press Club Dining Room
150 Wellington Street, Ottawa
In this event Fred Singer, Fred Seitz, Patrick Michaels and APCO
ASSociates were gathered together again long after The A.S.S.
Coalition had supposedly disbanded. By 2002 the racketeering corrupt
history of these career criminals was public knowledge posted on
internet websites by Federal Court order. This point is not debatable.
Blowhard Bill Gray was a participant in this event now known to be
sponsored by coal powered utilities and mining interests in Canada.
This point is not debatable.
Blowhard Bill Gray owes the public a full and complete disclosure of
all the circumstances and events how he came to be involved in an
organized crime event involving career criminals of known disrepute.
Until such time as a complete and satisfactory explanation is
provided, Blowhard Bill Gray is himself in disrepute as a Known
ASSociate of Organized Crime Science Fraudsters. This point is not
debatable.
Since DOUBT is the product, and delay of public restrictions is the
goal, to aid anfd abet a fraud is the same as to instigate it. Bonzo
is involved in deceit and deception to deny or conceal the career
criminal ASSociates of Blowhard Bill Gray. Gray has not and cannot
produce any science which causes doubts of the accumulated scientific
knowledge we collectively call "Global Warming Theory". He makes press
releases without support data, and he has a consistant track record of
continuing ASSociation with career criminals.
Giving him coverage is to violate the law of mandatory duty to
investigate as a reasonable person with ordinary intelligence would
investigate once notice of his organized crime ASSociations if given
to you. His goal is to create a FALSE appearance of a scientific
debate without producing the peer-reviewed science required of a
debate. Until such a time as Bill Gray has produced peer-reviewed
evidence his opinions are worthless, even less than worthless if they
are fraudulant. This point is not debatable.
http://www.climatesearch.com/newsDetail.cfm?nwsId=54
Tom Harris, Associate <===== Tom Harris, Organized Crime Fraudster
APCO Worldwide (Canada) <==== Created TASSC Organized Crime Fraud
Ring
phone 613/288-0382
fax 613/565-1937
email tcha...@apcoworldwide.com
web http://www.apcoworldwide.com
Climate Specialists speaking at the news conference:
1 - Dr. Tim Patterson
2 - Dr. Fred Singer <==== TASSC Corrupt Scientist
3 - Dr. Tim Ball
4 - Dr. Madhav L. Khandekar
5 - Dr. Pat Michaels <==== TASSC Corrupt Scientist
6 - Professor Fred Michel
Energy Engineering Specialists:
1 - Dr. J. Terry Rogers
2 - Dr. Howard C. Hayden
Not attending news conference but available for phone & email
interviews:
Dr. Roger Pocklington
Dr. Sallie Baliunas
Dr. Willie Soon
Dr. John Christy
Dr. Chris Essex
Dr. Roger Peilke
Dr. William M. Gray <==== Known Associate of Organized Crime
Figures.
Dr. Fred Seitz <==== TASSC Corrupt Scientist
Dr. George Taylor
Dr. Sherwood Idso
Dr. David Wojick, P.E.
Art Robinson of OISM
Dr. Herb I. H. Saravanamuttoo
Dr. Robert Balling
Dr. Ross McKitrick
Dr. Philip Stott
Fred J. McCall
:
:"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:svNZh.4909$VE....@newsfe12.lga...
Uh, you might want to look into that again before you start calling
even a lunatic "idiot"...
--
"Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the
truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong."
-- Thomas Jefferson
Fred J. McCall
:
:"By his actions and with his testimony yesterday, Attorney General
:Alberto Gonzales has lost the trust of the American people.
Oddly, I don't recall Speaker Pelosi asking my opinion before she
presumed to speak for "the American people".
--
"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the
soul with evil."
-- Socrates
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
"Crooked Corporations Backing Crooked Politicians"
<Crooke...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote in message
news:1178076602.9...@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Bonzo Exposed.
>
> A Federal Court Ruled, the Tobacco Mafia was a Racketeering Operation
> for over 50 years.
The topic was the Global warming BS being rammed down our throats, not
peoples smoking cigarettes.
Crooked Corporations, Political Crooks
farm.com> wrote:
> "Crooked Corporations Backing Crooked Politicians"<Crooked.Co...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote in message
>
> news:1178076602.9...@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...> Bonzo Exposed.
>
> > A Federal Court Ruled, the Tobacco Mafia was a Racketeering Operation
> > for over 50 years.
>
> ===========================
> The topic was the Global warming BS being rammed down our throats, not
> peoples smoking cigarettes.
Same people telling lies as "SKEPTICS" now on Global Warming worked
for the Racketeers as "SKEPTICS" for hire telling lies for Tobacco
mafia.
The denial industry -- TASSC, EXXON & Serial Killer Tobacco Lies
http://environment.guardian.co.uk/climatechange/story/0,,1875762,00.html
For years, a network of fake citizens' groups and bogus scientific
bodies has been claiming that science of global warming is
inconclusive. They set back action on climate change by a decade. But
who funded them? Exxon's involvement is well known, but not the
strange role of Big Tobacco. In the first of three extracts from his
new book, George Monbiot tells a bizarre and shocking new story
ExxonMobil is the world's most profitable corporation. Its sales now
amount to more than $1bn a day. It makes most of this money from oil,
and has more to lose than any other company from efforts to tackle
climate change. To safeguard its profits, ExxonMobil needs to sow
doubt about whether serious action needs to be taken on climate
change. But there are difficulties: it must confront a scientific
consensus as strong as that which maintains that smoking causes lung
cancer or that HIV causes Aids. So what's its strategy?
Article continues
The website Exxonsecrets.org, using data found in the company's
official documents, lists 124 organisations that have taken money from
the company or work closely with those that have. These organisations
take a consistent line on climate change: that the science is
contradictory, the scientists are split, environmentalists are
charlatans, liars or lunatics, and if governments took action to
prevent global warming, they would be endangering the global economy
for no good reason. The findings these organisations dislike are
labelled "junk science". The findings they welcome are labelled "sound
science".
Among the organisations that have been funded by Exxon are such well-
known websites and lobby groups as TechCentralStation, the Cato
Institute and the Heritage Foundation. Some of those on the list have
names that make them look like grassroots citizens' organisations or
academic bodies: the Centre for the Study of Carbon Dioxide and Global
Change, for example. One or two of them, such as the Congress of
Racial Equality, are citizens' organisations or academic bodies, but
the line they take on climate change is very much like that of the
other sponsored groups. While all these groups are based in America,
their publications are read and cited, and their staff are interviewed
and quoted, all over the world.
By funding a large number of organisations, Exxon helps to create the
impression that doubt about climate change is widespread. For those
who do not understand that scientific findings cannot be trusted if
they have not appeared in peer-reviewed journals, the names of these
institutes help to suggest that serious researchers are challenging
the consensus.
This is not to claim that all the science these groups champion is
bogus. On the whole, they use selection, not invention. They will find
one contradictory study - such as the discovery of tropospheric
cooling, which, in a garbled form, has been used by Peter Hitchens in
the Mail on Sunday - and promote it relentlessly. They will continue
to do so long after it has been disproved by further work. So, for
example, John Christy, the author of the troposphere paper, admitted
in August 2005 that his figures were incorrect, yet his initial
findings are still being circulated and championed by many of these
groups, as a quick internet search will show you.
But they do not stop there. The chairman of a group called the Science
and Environmental Policy Project is Frederick Seitz. Seitz is a
physicist who in the 1960s was president of the US National Academy of
Sciences. In 1998, he wrote a document, known as the Oregon Petition,
which has been cited by almost every journalist who claims that
climate change is a myth.
The document reads as follows: "We urge the United States government
to reject the global warming agreement that was written in Kyoto,
Japan, in December 1997, and any other similar proposals. The proposed
limits on greenhouse gases would harm the environment, hinder the
advance of science and technology, and damage the health and welfare
of mankind. There is no convincing scientific evidence that human
release of carbon dioxide, methane, or other greenhouse gases is
causing or will, in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating
of the Earth's atmosphere and disruption of the Earth's climate.
Moreover, there is substantial scientific evidence that increases in
atmospheric carbon dioxide produce many beneficial effects upon the
natural plant and animal environments of the Earth."
Anyone with a degree was entitled to sign it. It was attached to a
letter written by Seitz, entitled Research Review of Global Warming
Evidence. The lead author of the "review" that followed Seitz's letter
is a Christian fundamentalist called Arthur B Robinson. He is not a
professional climate scientist. It was co-published by Robinson's
organisation - the Oregon Institute of Science and Medicine - and an
outfit called the George C Marshall Institute, which has received
$630,000 from ExxonMobil since 1998. The other authors were Robinson's
22-year-old son and two employees of the George C Marshall Institute.
The chairman of the George C Marshall Institute was Frederick Seitz.
The paper maintained that: "We are living in an increasingly lush
environment of plants and animals as a result of the carbon dioxide
increase. Our children will enjoy an Earth with far more plant and
animal life than that with which we now are blessed. This is a
wonderful and unexpected gift from the Industrial Revolution."
It was printed in the font and format of the Proceedings of the
National Academy of Sciences: the journal of the organisation of which
Seitz - as he had just reminded his correspondents - was once
president.
Soon after the petition was published, the National Academy of
Sciences released this statement: "The NAS Council would like to make
it clear that this petition has nothing to do with the National
Academy of Sciences and that the manuscript was not published in the
Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences or in any other peer-
reviewed journal. The petition does not reflect the conclusions of
expert reports of the Academy."
But it was too late. Seitz, the Oregon Institute and the George C
Marshall Institute had already circulated tens of thousands of copies,
and the petition had established a major presence on the internet.
Some 17,000 graduates signed it, the majority of whom had no
background in climate science. It has been repeatedly cited - by
global-warming sceptics such as David Bellamy, Melanie Phillips and
others - as a petition by climate scientists. It is promoted by the
Exxon-sponsored sites as evidence that there is no scientific
consensus on climate change.
All this is now well known to climate scientists and
environmentalists. But what I have discovered while researching this
issue is that the corporate funding of lobby groups denying that
manmade climate change is taking place was initiated not by Exxon, or
by any other firm directly involved in the fossil fuel industry. It
was started by the tobacco company Philip Morris.
In December 1992, the US Environmental Protection Agency published a
500-page report called Respiratory Health Effects of Passive Smoking.
It found that "the widespread exposure to environmental tobacco smoke
(ETS) in the United States presents a serious and substantial public
health impact. In adults: ETS is a human lung carcinogen, responsible
for approximately 3,000 lung cancer deaths annually in US non-smokers.
In children: ETS exposure is causally associated with an increased
risk of lower respiratory tract infections such as bronchitis and
pneumonia. This report estimates that 150,000 to 300,000 cases
annually in infants and young children up to 18 months of age are
attributable to ETS."
Had it not been for the settlement of a major class action against the
tobacco companies in the US, we would never have been able to see what
happened next. But in 1998 they were forced to publish their internal
documents and post them on the internet.
Within two months of its publication, Philip Morris, the world's
biggest tobacco firm, had devised a strategy for dealing with the
passive-smoking report. In February 1993 Ellen Merlo, its senior vice-
president of corporate affairs, sent a letter to William I Campbell,
Philip Morris's chief executive officer and president, explaining her
intentions: "Our overriding objective is to discredit the EPA
report ... Concurrently, it is our objective to prevent states and
cities, as well as businesses, from passive-smoking bans."
To this end, she had hired a public relations company called APCO. She
had attached the advice it had given her. APCO warned that: "No matter
how strong the arguments, industry spokespeople are, in and of
themselves, not always credible or appropriate messengers."
So the fight against a ban on passive smoking had to be associated
with other people and other issues. Philip Morris, APCO said, needed
to create the impression of a "grassroots" movement - one that had
been formed spontaneously by concerned citizens to fight
"overregulation". It should portray the danger of tobacco smoke as
just one "unfounded fear" among others, such as concerns about
pesticides and cellphones. APCO proposed to set up "a national
coalition intended to educate the media, public officials and the
public about the dangers of 'junk science'. Coalition will address
credibility of government's scientific studies, risk-assessment
techniques and misuse of tax dollars ... Upon formation of Coalition,
key leaders will begin media outreach, eg editorial board tours,
opinion articles, and brief elected officials in selected states."
APCO would found the coalition, write its mission statements, and
"prepare and place opinion articles in key markets". For this it
required $150,000 for its own fees and $75,000 for the coalition's
costs.
By May 1993, as another memo from APCO to Philip Morris shows, the
fake citizens' group had a name: the Advancement of Sound Science
Coalition. It was important, further letters stated, "to ensure that
TASSC has a diverse group of contributors"; to "link the tobacco issue
with other more 'politically correct' products"; and to associate
scientific studies that cast smoking in a bad light with "broader
questions about government research and regulations" - such as "global
warming", "nuclear waste disposal" and "biotechnology". APCO would
engage in the "intensive recruitment of high-profile representatives
from business and industry, scientists, public officials, and other
individuals interested in promoting the use of sound science".
By September 1993, APCO had produced a "Plan for the Public Launching
of TASSC". The media launch would not take place in "Washington, DC or
the top media markets of the country. Rather, we suggest creating a
series of aggressive, decentralised launches in several targeted local
and regional markets across the country. This approach ... avoids
cynical reporters from major media: less reviewing/challenging of
TASSC messages."
The media coverage, the public relations company hoped, would enable
TASSC to "establish an image of a national grassroots coalition". In
case the media asked hostile questions, APCO circulated a sheet of
answers, drafted by Philip Morris. The first question was:
"Isn't it true that Philip Morris created TASSC to act as a front
group for it?
"A: No, not at all. As a large corporation, PM belongs to many
national, regional, and state business, public policy, and legislative
organisations. PM has contributed to TASSC, as we have with various
groups and corporations across the country."
There are clear similarities between the language used and the
approaches adopted by Philip Morris and by the organisations funded by
Exxon. The two lobbies use the same terms, which appear to have been
invented by Philip Morris's consultants. "Junk science" meant peer-
reviewed studies showing that smoking was linked to cancer and other
diseases. "Sound science" meant studies sponsored by the tobacco
industry suggesting that the link was inconclusive. Both lobbies
recognised that their best chance of avoiding regulation was to
challenge the scientific consensus. As a memo from the tobacco company
Brown and Williamson noted, "Doubt is our product since it is the best
means of competing with the 'body of fact' that exists in the mind of
the general public. It is also the means of establishing a
controversy." Both industries also sought to distance themselves from
their own campaigns, creating the impression that they were
spontaneous movements of professionals or ordinary citizens: the
"grassroots".
But the connection goes further than that. TASSC, the "coalition"
created by Philip Morris, was the first and most important of the
corporate-funded organisations denying that climate change is taking
place. It has done more damage to the campaign to halt it than any
other body.
TASSC did as its founders at APCO suggested, and sought funding from
other sources. Between 2000 and 2002 it received $30,000 from Exxon.
The website it has financed - JunkScience.com - has been the main
entrepot for almost every kind of climate-change denial that has found
its way into the mainstream press. It equates environmentalists with
Nazis, communists and terrorists. It flings at us the accusations that
could justifably be levelled against itself: the website claims, for
example, that it is campaigning against "faulty scientific data and
analysis used to advance special and, often, hidden agendas". I have
lost count of the number of correspondents who, while questioning
manmade global warming, have pointed me there.
The man who runs it is called Steve Milloy. In 1992, he started
working for APCO - Philip Morris's consultants. While there, he set up
the JunkScience site. In March 1997, the documents show, he was
appointed TASSC's executive director. By 1998, as he explained in a
memo to TASSC board members, his JunkScience website was was being
funded by TASSC. Both he and the "coalition" continued to receive
money from Philip Morris. An internal document dated February 1998
reveals that TASSC took $200,000 from the tobacco company in 1997.
Philip Morris's 2001 budget document records a payment to Steven
Milloy of $90,000. Altria, Philip Morris's parent company, admits that
Milloy was under contract to the tobacco firm until at least the end
of 2005.
He has done well. You can find his name attached to letters and
articles seeking to discredit passive-smoking studies all over the
internet and in the academic databases. He has even managed to reach
the British Medical Journal: I found a letter from him there which
claimed that the studies it had reported "do not bear out the
hypothesis that maternal smoking/ passive smoking increases cancer
risk among infants". TASSC paid him $126,000 in 2004 for 15 hours'
work a week. Two other organisations are registered at his address:
the Free Enterprise Education Institute and the Free Enterprise Action
Institute. They have received $10,000 and $50,000 respectively from
Exxon. The secretary of the Free Enterprise Action Institute is Thomas
Borelli. Borelli was the Philip Morris executive who oversaw the
payments to TASSC.
Milloy also writes a weekly Junk Science column for the Fox News
website. Without declaring his interests, he has used this column to
pour scorn on studies documenting the medical effects of second-hand
tobacco smoke and showing that climate change is taking place. Even
after Fox News was told about the money he had been receiving from
Philip Morris and Exxon, it continued to employ him, without informing
its readers about his interests.
TASSC's headed notepaper names an advisory board of eight people.
Three of them are listed by Exxonsecrets.org as working for
organisations taking money from Exxon. One of them is Frederick Seitz,
the man who wrote the Oregon Petition, and who chairs the Science and
Environmental Policy Project. In 1979, Seitz became a permanent
consultant to the tobacco company RJ Reynolds. He worked for the firm
until at least 1987, for an annual fee of $65,000. He was in charge of
deciding which medical research projects the company should fund, and
handed out millions of dollars a year to American universities. The
purpose of this funding, a memo from the chairman of RJ Reynolds
shows, was to "refute the criticisms against cigarettes". An undated
note in the Philip Morris archive shows that it was planning a "Seitz
symposium" with the help of TASSC, in which Frederick Seitz would
speak to "40-60 regulators".
The president of Seitz's Science and Environmental Policy Project is a
maverick environmental scientist called S Fred Singer. He has spent
the past few years refuting evidence for manmade climate change. It
was he, for example, who published the misleading claim that most of
the world's glaciers are advancing, which landed David Bellamy in so
much trouble when he repeated it last year. He also had connections
with the tobacco industry. In March 1993, APCO sent a memo to Ellen
Merlo, the vice-president of Philip Morris, who had just commissioned
it to fight the Environmental Protection Agency: "As you know, we have
been working with Dr Fred Singer and Dr Dwight Lee, who have authored
articles on junk science and indoor air quality (IAQ)
respectively ..."
Singer's article, entitled Junk Science at the EPA, claimed that "the
latest 'crisis' - environmental tobacco smoke - has been widely
criticised as the most shocking distortion of scientific evidence
yet". He alleged that the Environmental Protection Agency had had to
"rig the numbers" in its report on passive smoking. This was the
report that Philip Morris and APCO had set out to discredit a month
before Singer wrote his article.
I have no evidence that Fred Singer or his organisation have taken
money from Philip Morris. But many of the other bodies that have been
sponsored by Exxon and have sought to repudiate climate change were
also funded by the tobacco company. Among them are some of the world's
best-known "thinktanks": the Competitive Enterprise Institute, the
Cato Institute, the Heritage Foundation, the Hudson Institute, the
Frontiers of Freedom Institute, the Reason Foundation and the
Independent Institute, as well as George Mason University's Law and
Economics Centre. I can't help wondering whether there is any aspect
of conservative thought in the United States that has not been formed
and funded by the corporations.
Until I came across this material, I believed that the accusations,
the insults and the taunts such people had slung at us
environmentalists were personal: that they really did hate us, and had
found someone who would pay to help them express those feelings. Now I
realise that they have simply transferred their skills.
While they have been most effective in the United States, the impacts
of the climate-change deniers sponsored by Exxon and Philip Morris
have been felt all over the world. I have seen their arguments
endlessly repeated in Australia, Canada, India, Russia and the UK. By
dominating the media debate on climate change during seven or eight
critical years in which urgent international talks should have been
taking place, by constantly seeding doubt about the science just as it
should have been most persuasive, they have justified the money their
sponsors have spent on them many times over. It is fair to say that
the professional denial industry has delayed effective global action
on climate change by years, just as it helped to delay action against
the tobacco companies.
· This is an edited extract from Heat, by George Monbiot, published by
Allen Lane. To order a copy for £16.99 with free UK p&p (rrp £17.99),
go to Guardian.co.uk/bookshop or call 0870 836 0875.
Gregg Cattanach
You haven't kill-filed this goof (Exxon-Turds.info) yet? alt-g.w. becomes
almost readable when you remove this idiot.
--
Gregg C.
beav
<fmc...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>Bush Lost Iraq War <Bush.Lost.Iraq.War.-.@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote:
>
>:
>:"By his actions and with his testimony yesterday, Attorney General
>:Alberto Gonzales has lost the trust of the American people.
>
>Oddly, I don't recall Speaker Pelosi asking my opinion before she
>presumed to speak for "the American people".
cripes.
candor and judgement?
her candor and judgement in going to syria are lousy too. her self
proclaimed "deal" that israel was ready to negotiate is laughable too.
she's a joke.
a sick, sick joke.
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
"Crooked Corporations, Political Crooks"
<Crooked.Co...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote in message
news:1178078950.0...@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
On May 1, 8:51 pm, "Al Queda Gore" <Al Queda @ Gore family Tobbacco
farm.com> wrote:
> "Crooked Corporations Backing Crooked
> Politicians"<Crooked.Co...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote in message
>
> news:1178076602.9...@y5g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...> Bonzo
> Exposed.
>
> > A Federal Court Ruled, the Tobacco Mafia was a Racketeering Operation
> > for over 50 years.
>
> ===========================
> The topic was the Global warming BS being rammed down our throats, not
> peoples smoking cigarettes.
Same people telling lies as "SKEPTICS" now on Global Warming worked
for the Racketeers as "SKEPTICS" for hire telling lies for Tobacco
mafia.
======================
You mean like Al Gore and the Millions$$$$ he made selling Tobbacco on his
Tennessee farm?
Queda @gorefamilytobbaccofarm.com Al Queda Gore
"Gregg Cattanach" <rl31...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:Zo0_h.20656$Um6....@newssvr12.news.prodigy.net...
Good idea. I just did. thanks.
The Great Global Warming Swnidle
Feb 13 10:13 AM US/Eastern
Study: Glacier melting can be variable
Feb 13 10:13 AM US/Eastern
BOULDER, Colo., Feb. 13 (UPI) -- A U.S. study suggests two of
Greenland's largest glaciers are melting at variable rates and not at
an increasing trend.
The study, led by Ian Howat, a researcher with the University of
Colorado's National Snow and Ice Data Center and the University of
Washington's Applied Physics Laboratory, shows the glaciers shrank
dramatically and dumped twice as much ice into the sea during a period of
less than a year between 2004 and 2005.
But then, fewer than two years later, they returned to near their
previous rates of discharge.
Howat says such variability during such a short time underlines the
problem in assuming glacial melting and sea level rise will necessarily
occur at a steady upward trajectory.
"Our main point is that the behavior of these glaciers can change a
lot from year to year, so we can't assume to know the future behavior
from short records of recent changes," he said. "Future warming may lead to
rapid pulses of retreat and increased discharge rather than a long, steady
drawdown."
The research is online in the journal Science Express.
Gregg Cattanach
> The Great Global Warming Swnidle wrote:
>
>> Howat says such variability during such a short time
>> underlines the problem in assuming glacial melting and sea level
>> rise will necessarily occur at a steady upward trajectory.
>
> upwards trajectory. You realize, of course, that all you are doing
> here is helping people understand the severity of the global warming
> problem.
> You do understand that, right?
Reading comprenension school. The problem is the assumption that the
melting and rise will be steady AND upward.
--
Gregg C.
Fred J. McCall
<Crooked.Co...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote:
:
:Same people telling lies as "SKEPTICS" now on Global Warming worked
:for the Racketeers as "SKEPTICS" for hire telling lies for Tobacco
:mafia.
:
Loony toon.
<plonk>
Lloyd
farm.com> wrote:
> The Sunday Times
>
> February 11, 2007
>
> An experiment that hints we are wrong on climate change
> Nigel Calder, former editor of New Scientist, says the orthodoxy must be
> challenged
> When politicians and journalists declare that the science of global warming
> is settled, they show a regrettable ignorance about how science works. We
> were treated to another dose of it recently when the experts of the
> Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change issued the Summary for
> Policymakers that puts the political spin on an unfinished scientific
> dossier on climate change due for publication in a few months' time. They
> declared that most of the rise in temperatures since the mid-20th century is
> very likely due to man-made greenhouse gases.
>
> The small print explains "very likely" as meaning that the experts who made
> the judgment felt 90% sure about it.
90% is quite good for not being able to do controlled experiments.
> Older readers may recall a press
> conference at Harwell in 1958 when Sir John Cockcroft, Britain's top nuclear
> physicist, said he was 90% certain that his lads had achieved controlled
> nuclear fusion.
Not the same as analyzing all the published research by hundreds of
scientists.
>It turned out that he was wrong. More positively, a 10%
> uncertainty in any theory is a wide open breach for any latterday Galileo or
> Einstein to storm through with a better idea. That is how science really
> works.
>
> Twenty years ago, climate research became politicised in favour of one
You are lying.
> particular hypothesis, which redefined the subject as the study of the
> effect of greenhouse gases. As a result, the rebellious spirits essential
> for innovative and trustworthy science are greeted with impediments to their
> research careers. And while the media usually find mavericks at least
> entertaining, in this case they often imagine that anyone who doubts the
> hypothesis of man-made global warming must be in the pay of the oil
> companies. As a result, some key discoveries in climate research go almost
> unreported.
>
You are lying.
> Enthusiasm for the global-warming scare also ensures that heatwaves make
> headlines, while contrary symptoms, such as this winter's billion-dollar
> loss of Californian crops to unusual frost, are relegated to the business
> pages. The early arrival of migrant birds in spring provides colourful
> evidence for a recent warming of the northern lands. But did anyone tell you
> that in east Antarctica the Adélie penguins and Cape petrels are turning up
> at their spring nesting sites around nine days later than they did 50 years
> ago? While sea-ice has diminished in the Arctic since 1978, it has grown by
> 8% in the Southern Ocean.
>
> So one awkward question you can ask, when you're forking out those extra
> taxes for climate change, is "Why is east Antarctica getting colder?" It
> makes no sense at all if carbon dioxide is driving global warming.
It does it you bother to read a little.
>While you're
> at it, you might inquire whether Gordon Brown will give you a refund if it's
> confirmed that global warming has stopped. The best measurements of global
> air temperatures come from American weather satellites, and they show
> wobbles but no overall change since 1999.
>
You are lying.
> That levelling off is just what is expected by the chief rival hypothesis,
> which says that the sun drives climate changes more emphatically than
> greenhouse gases do. After becoming much more active during the 20th
> century, the sun now stands at a high but roughly level state of activity.
The sun hasn't increased output in the past 15 years but the earth is
warming.
> Solar physicists warn of possible global cooling, should the sun revert to
> the lazier mood it was in during the Little Ice Age 300 years ago.
>
Sure, and really cooling if a supervolcano erupts. So?
> Climate history and related archeology give solid support to the solar
> hypothesis.
You are lying.
>The 20th-century episode, or Modern Warming, was just the latest
> in a long string of similar events produced by a hyperactive sun, of which
> the last was the Medieval Warming.
>
> The Chinese population doubled then, while in Europe the Vikings and
> cathedral-builders prospered. Fascinating relics of earlier episodes come
> from the Swiss Alps, with the rediscovery in 2003 of a long-forgotten pass
> used intermittently whenever the world was warm.
>
> What does the Intergovernmental Panel do with such emphatic evidence for an
> alternation of warm and cold periods, linked to solar activity and going on
> long before human industry was a possible factor?
The same they do for "evidence" for the earth being flat.
>Less than nothing. The
> 2007 Summary for Policymakers boasts of cutting in half a very small
> contribution by the sun to climate change conceded in a 2001 report.
>
> Disdain for the sun goes with a failure by the self-appointed greenhouse
> experts to keep up with inconvenient discoveries about how the solar
> variations control the climate. The sun's brightness may change too little
> to account for the big swings in the climate. But more than 10 years have
> passed since Henrik Svensmark in Copenhagen first pointed out a much more
> powerful mechanism.
>
> He saw from compilations of weather satellite data that cloudiness varies
> according to how many atomic particles are coming in from exploded stars.
> More cosmic rays, more clouds. The sun's magnetic field bats away many of
> the cosmic rays, and its intensification during the 20th century meant fewer
> cosmic rays, fewer clouds, and a warmer world. On the other hand the Little
> Ice Age was chilly because the lazy sun let in more cosmic rays, leaving the
> world cloudier and gloomier.
>
> The only trouble with Svensmark's idea - apart from its being politically
> incorrect - was that meteorologists denied that cosmic rays could be
> involved in cloud formation.
Actually it's because his hypothesis has been disproven.
>After long delays in scraping together the
> funds for an experiment, Svensmark and his small team at the Danish National
> Space Center hit the jackpot in the summer of 2005.
>
> In a box of air in the basement, they were able to show that electrons set
> free by cosmic rays coming through the ceiling stitched together droplets of
> sulphuric acid and water. These are the building blocks for cloud
> condensation. But journal after journal declined to publish their report;
> the discovery finally appeared in the Proceedings of the Royal Society late
> last year.
>
> Thanks to having written The Manic Sun, a book about Svensmark's initial
> discovery published in 1997, I have been privileged to be on the inside
> track for reporting his struggles and successes since then.
Yeah, sure.
>The outcome is a
> second book, The Chilling Stars, co-authored by the two of us and published
> next week by Icon books. We are not exaggerating, we believe, when we
> subtitle it "A new theory of climate change".
>
And that's what passes for scientific publishing these days?
Lloyd
> Bush Lost Iraq War <Bush.Lost.Iraq.War...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote:
>
> :
> :"By his actions and with his testimony yesterday, Attorney General
> :Alberto Gonzales has lost the trust of the American people.
>
> Oddly, I don't recall Speaker Pelosi asking my opinion before she
> presumed to speak for "the American people".
>
Don't recall Bush asking mine before going to war.
Terrorist Democrat defeated @whitehouse.gov Bush Vetoes Terrorist Democrats Aid to Al Queda
"kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote in message
news:g53_h.34$yp1...@newsfe04.lga...
> The Great Global Warming Swnidle wrote:
>
>> problem in assuming glacial melting and sea level rise will necessarily
>> occur at a steady upward trajectory.
>
> upwards trajectory.
You mean like all those Glaciers that once covered NY State and canada , but
melted and left us great vistas of Finger Lakes and the Great lakes due
to SUV's 100,000 years ago ?
Fred J. McCall
:On May 1, 11:35 pm, Fred J. McCall <fmcc...@earthlink.net> wrote:
:> Bush Lost Iraq War <Bush.Lost.Iraq.War...@Exxon-Turds.info> wrote:
:>
:> :
:> :"By his actions and with his testimony yesterday, Attorney General
:> :Alberto Gonzales has lost the trust of the American people.
:>
:> Oddly, I don't recall Speaker Pelosi asking my opinion before she
:> presumed to speak for "the American people".
:>
:
:Don't recall Bush asking mine before going to war.
And do you recall him proclaiming that the American people wanted that
invasion?
I thought not...
Terrorist Democrat defeated @whitehouse.gov Bush Vetoes Terrorist Democrats Aid to Al Queda
> Bush Vetoes Terrorist Democrats Aid to Al Queda wrote:
>
>>> The Great Global Warming Swnidle wrote:
>>>
>>>> Howat says such variability during such a short time underlines
>>>> the
>>>> problem in assuming glacial melting and sea level rise will necessarily
>>>> occur at a steady upward trajectory.
>>> In other words, the melting will be variable, occurring at an unsteady
>>> upwards trajectory.
>> ====================
>>
>> You mean like all those Glaciers that once covered NY State and canada ,
>> but melted and left us great vistas of Finger Lakes and the Great lakes
>> due to SUV's 100,000 years ago ?
>
>
> Love the new sock puppet, keep up the good work!
>
>===================
Ah the melted glacirs from 100000 yeasr ago stump the Global Warming koolaid
drinkers everytime.
Bush Lost Iraq War
Jajati Karan
CNN-IBN
Posted Wednesday, May 02, 2007 at 14:19
Updated Wednesday, May 02, 2007 at 14:32
Email Email Print Print
COOLING TIPS: Children take bath in a pond to escape the heat wave.
COOLING TIPS: Children take bath in a pond to escape the heat wave.
Other stories in the section
* Britain records hottest July since 1911
* Bush vetoes Iraq war-funding bill
* Brown to be PM in few weeks: Blair
* Mix of clashes, rallies on May Day
* Al qaeda leader in Iraq killed
Bhubaneshwar: The heat wave in Orissa has claimed the lives of 36
people though official figures put the toll at six. With temperature
rising over 43 degrees Celsius particularly in western part of the
state, there is no respite in sight for the people of Orissa.
For 44-year-old Birendra Mahasuara, a priest at the Kedar Gouri temple
in Bhubaneswar, an early morning bath in the temple pond is a daily
ritual. But with temperatures crossing 43 degrees Celsius, it is not a
ritual any more but a compulsion.
"I am a priest; I cannot afford AC in my house. So by bathing at least
four times in a day I try to keep my body cool," says Birendra
Mahasuara.
The state government has already initiated some measures to combat the
heat like changing the working hours for labourers and school timing
for children.
Even the Meteorological department in Bhubaneswar says the heat wave
will not abate soon.
"There is some sea breeze in coastal Orissa but that does not reach
western Orissa due to North westerly hot winds flowing there. So it's
becoming very hot out there," Director of Meteorological department
(Bhubaneswar) SC Sahoo says.
So far in Orissa the highest temperature has been 50.1 degree Celsius
recorded at Titlagarh in 2003. The people in Orissa have already
experienced such extreme weather in the past and that is why they have
also learnt the art of beating the heat.
Roger Coppock
<Another Terrorist Democrat defeated @White House.gov> wrote:
[ . . . ]
> Ah the melted glacirs from 100000 yeasr ago stump the Global Warming koolaid
> drinkers everytime.
If all the ice melted 100,000 years ago,
how do we now have 800,000-year ice cores?
Gonzales Architect of Bush Torture Rooms
wrote:
> "kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:svNZh.4909$VE....@newsfe12.lga...
>
>
>
> > Peter Muehlbauer wrote:
> > > "kT" <cos...@lifeform.org> schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:I8IZh.25$c6...@newsfe04.lga...
> > >> Jeff Findley wrote:
>
> > >>> Antarctica isn't melting faster
> > >>>http://www.antarctica.ac.uk/About_Antarctica/FAQs/faq_02.html
>
> > >>> Antarctica is melting faster
> > >>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4228411.stm
> > >>>http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0922-02.htm
>
> > >>> A quick search does not indicate that there is a consensus on this topic.
> > >> global warming is responsible.
>
> > > Dumb boy kT, reying in newspaper hoaxes...
> > >http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/topstory/20020820southseaice.html
>
> > First of all, that's sea ice. It melts and reforms constantly.
>
> > Antarctica itself is losing mass at a very large rate.
>
> >http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/311/5768/1754
>
> Dumb, dumb kT.
> Antarctica IS SEA ICE, nothing else.
> There is no landmass below antarctica... idiot!
The denial industry -- TASSC, EXXON & Serial Killer Tobacco Lies
Bonzo
news:1178152207.5...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
Simple.
Either the 800,000 is another of your "plucked out of thin air" figures or not
all the ice melted 100,000 years ago.
Regards
Bonzo
"...and I think future generations are not going to blame us for anything except
for being silly, for letting a few tenths of a degree panic us"
Dr. Richard Lindzen, Professor of Meteorology MIT and Member of the National
Academy of Sciences
"What most commentators-and many scientists-seem to miss is that the only thing
we can say with certainly about climate is that it changes" Dr. Richard Lindzen,
Professor of Meteorology MIT and Member of the National Academy of Sciences
[most of the current alarm over climate change is based on] "inherently
untrustworthy climate models, similar to those that cannot accurately forecast
the weather a week from now." Dr. Richard Lindzen, Professor of Meteorology MIT
and Member of the National Academy of Sciences
Exxon Crooks and Liars
Jajati Karan
http://www.ibnlive.com/news/india/05_2007/heat-wave-in-orissa-36-dead-39594.html
Eric Swanson
>
>"Roger Coppock" <rcop...@adnc.com> wrote in message
>news:1178152207.5...@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
>> On May 2, 12:56 pm, "Bush Vetoes Terrorist Democrats Aid to Al Queda"
>> <Another Terrorist Democrat defeated @White House.gov> wrote:
>> [ . . . ]
>> > Ah the melted glacirs from 100000 yeasr ago stump the Global
Warming koolaid
>> > drinkers everytime.
>>
>> If all the ice melted 100,000 years ago,
>> how do we now have 800,000-year ice cores?
>
>
>Simple.
>Either the 800,000 is another of your "plucked out of thin air" figures
or not
>all the ice melted 100,000 years ago.
The lower elevation ice in the NH melted during the Eemian, as did much
of the ice over Greenland. However, the Antarctic ice has been around
for much longer. The EPICA core is dated back 800,000 years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_core
http://www.esf.org/epica
--
Eric Swanson --- E-mail address: e_swanson(at)skybest.com :-)
--------------------------------------------------------------
john fernbach
>
> Dumb, dumb kT.
> Antarctica IS SEA ICE, nothing else.
> There is no landmass below antarctica... idiot!- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
HUH?/
john fernbach
wrote:
>
> > While Elifritz is an idiot, and a troll, and a vile human being,
> > Antarctica is a land mass. It is in fact a continent. Perhaps you're
> > thinking of the Arctic?
>
> Sorry, my fault.
> His opportunistic attitude drives me crazy.
> Maybe I should really killfile him now.
> There is no way to show him what reality is.- Hide quoted text -
>
But the "reality" is that Antarctica does have land mass, no?-
john fernbach
>
> Does this mean I won the debate?
>
Looks like it. >
john fernbach
farm.com> wrote:
> Annually the ice pack grows from an average minimum of 2.9 million square
> kilometers in March to about 18.8 square kilometers in September. The
> average thickness of the sea ice is about 1.5 meters and 85 percent of the
> ice pack melts each year. This ice is characterized by undulating ridges and
> troughs and crevassed areas which have created route-finding problems for
> those traveling across these marginal areas of the ice shelf. The pack moves
> quickly with the winds--as much as 65 kilometers in a single day--and ships
> can easily be caught in some of the thicker, more complex multiyear ice that
> is trapped within indentations on the Ross Sea coastline.http://www.antarcticconnection.com/antarctic/science/glaciology.shtml
Question -- the 85 percent of the ice pack that melts each year ... is
that 85 percent of the SEA ice that melts?
Or 85 percent of the total ice pack covering Antarctica?
john fernbach
farm.com> wrote:
>
But did anyone tell you
> that in east Antarctica the Adélie penguins and Cape petrels are turning up
> at their spring nesting sites around nine days later than they did 50 years
> ago? While sea-ice has diminished in the Arctic since 1978, it has grown by
> 8% in the Southern Ocean.
>
> So one awkward question you can ask, when you're forking out those extra
> taxes for climate change, is "Why is east Antarctica getting colder?" It
> makes no sense at all if carbon dioxide is driving global warming.
I believe that Robert Henson of the US-based National Center on
Atmospheric Research (NCAR) addresses Antarctic cooling in his new
book "The Rough Guide to Climate Change." See also A. Barrie Pittock
of the Commonwealth Scientic and Industrial Research Organisation
(CSIRO) in his new book "Climate Change."
If I remember right, what Henson and Pittock both say on this subject
is that greenhouse-driven global warming, or global climate change (if
you will) has led to faster circumpolar winds in the Antarctic. The
net effect is to isolate the climate of Antarctic more, to
increasingly cut off the climate of the continental interior from the
climate of the surrounding southern oceans. This may well cause parts
of Antarctica to become colder, Henson and Pittock suggest in their
books, even though the global climate as a whole is growing warmer.
BTW -- Let's suppose that Henson and Pittock are wrong, and let's
assume as a hypothetical that the fact of Antarctic cooling did really
cut against the mainstream IPCC view about recent changes in global
temperatures being driven by increases in greenhouse emissions.
Well -- wouldn't this same Antarctic cooling also provide evidence
against the notion that cyclical fluctuations in sunlight intensity
are to blame for higher temperatures since the 1980s?
I mean, sure-- the eastern Antarctic cooling can be enlisted as
evidence against the idea of general climate change, by one group of
GW denialists. "Eastern Antarctica is getting cooler, so who cares
what Al Gore is saying about ice melting in the Arctic?" one group of
skeptics can say.
What what these same skeptics can't say -- at least not without
blushing -- is that Antarctic cooling is also evidence for the new
theory, much cited by some GW denialists, that the earth on the whole
actually has been getting somewhat warmer, but that sunspot cycles or
"cosmic dust" or changes in the sun's intensity are to blame.
Peter Muehlbauer
"john fernbach" <fernba...@yahoo.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:1178394142....@n76g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On May 1, 7:50 pm, kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
>
> >
> > Does this mean I won the debate?
> >
> Looks like it. >
Debate? Which debate?
I dont't like to "debate" with people giving others names instead of
contribute some facts. There are no fundamentals for communication.
Further on I dont't "debate" with people residing at the bottom of
my killfile.
Point.
Souls Black as Coal
john fernbach
wrote:
> "john fernbach" <fernbach1...@yahoo.com> schrieb im Newsbeitragnews:1178394142....@n76g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On May 1, 7:50 pm, kT <cos...@lifeform.org> wrote:
>
> > > Does this mean I won the debate?
>
> > Looks like it. >
>
> Debate? Which debate?
> I dont't like to "debate" with people giving others names instead of
> contribute some facts. There are no fundamentals for communication.
> Further on I dont't "debate" with people residing at the bottom of
> my killfile.
> Point.
did I somehow get the screen names mixed up? g
Peter Muehlbauer
"john fernbach" <fernba...@yahoo.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:1178408882....@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
John, as I wrote in reply to this, I made a typo.
Look here
Message-ID: <f18g29$7vn$1...@news1.nefonline.de>
That might have happened of fatigue, if you look at the time of posting.
This kT-baby either didn't read it, or he knowingly ignored it.
He now wants to flog a dead horse, but that's not my problem
if he wants to make a fool of himself.
Gonna Bust Up Exxon's Crime Ring
wrote:
> Debate? Which debate?
> I dont't like to "debate" with people giving others names instead of
> contribute some facts.
Who gives a shit what a brownshirt thug from the Josef Goebbels School
of Propaganda likes or dislikes?
What I like is Prescott Bush sold Thyssen's coal to Auschwitz through
September 1942, almost a year after Pearl Harbor, that Prescott's
fraternity brothers from Skull & Bones moved into the Army and
targetted Dresden for saturation bombing, and that you, a neo-nazi
Kraut work for the 4th Reich whose figurehead leader is George W,
grandson of Prescott. These are people with genes that make a fortune
off murder than stick the shiv between the ribs of their business
partners in crime, and you think they won't do that to you because you
prostitute your ass for them.
That's what I like, but who gives a shit?
Peter Muehlbauer Helped Kill 36 Human Beings with Global Warming