A Beginners Question
Frank103
been holding back because I live in an area that gets mediocre reception on
my Sony reciever's FM tuner from stations 20 miles away; so I'm really
paranoid about buying a portable shortwave radio. My homeowners association
doesn't permit outside antennas. Here are several questions:
1. Can someone recommend a portable shortwave radio for under $200US that
works well.?
2. Can I attach an indoor antenna to improve reception? What brand of
antenna?
3. I've tried several indoor antennas from Radio Shack to improve my FM
reception and none did anything. Can someone recommend a really powerful FM
indoor antenna?
Thanks in advance.
Frank
craigm
> I would like to buy a portable shortwave radio with a whip antenna but
> I've been holding back because I live in an area that gets mediocre
> reception on my Sony reciever's FM tuner from stations 20 miles away; so
> I'm really paranoid about buying a portable shortwave radio. My homeowners
> association doesn't permit outside antennas. Here are several questions:
>
> 1. Can someone recommend a portable shortwave radio for under $200US that
> works well.?
Sony 7600GR. Try,
http://www.jr.com/JRProductPage.process?Product=1627439
> 2. Can I attach an indoor antenna to improve reception? What brand of
> antenna?
Yes, for shortwave a 10-20 foot piece of wire can be used. You do not need
to spend a lot of money to get started. If noise is an issue, google
for 'shielded loop antenna'. You can also buy more expensive antennas. Try,
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant.html
> 3. I've tried several indoor antennas from Radio Shack to improve my FM
> reception and none did anything. Can someone recommend a really powerful
> FM indoor antenna?
>
I doubt anyone really can recommend one that works. However, if the stations
of interest are all in the same direction, you could consider mounting a 5
element yagi antenna for FM in your attic. (If your roof is metal this
probably won't work.) Google for 'fm yagi antenna'.
> Thanks in advance.
> Frank
garya...@aol.com
You didn't tell us what model Sony receiver you are using, and what
type of antenna it has. That can make a big difference in what I
would recommend. Without knowing what you already have, you might
consider the CCRadio-SW, or the equivalent under another brand name.
I have it and have found the FM sensitivity to be outstanding. It
actually gets outstanding reception of stations that come in poorly on
the CCRadio and other radios I have. It is also excellent on MW and
SW. If an analog tuner is okay with you, I don't believe you will be
able to top the CCRadio-SW.
Dale Parfitt
> Yes, for shortwave a 10-20 foot piece of wire can be used. You do not need
> to spend a lot of money to get started. If noise is an issue, google
> for 'shielded loop antenna'. You can also buy more expensive antennas.
> Try,
> http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant.html
>
Why would a shielded loop receive less noise than, say, a classic wire turn
loop?
Dale W4OP
craigm
Dale,
I made no shielded loop vs. unshielded loop comparisons. My intent was to
give the beginner the idea that there are different types of antennas, and
by suggesting google, allow the OP to do some research on his own.
That being said, building a shielded loop implies the OP has shielded wire
which can also be used for the connection between the radio and the
antenna. This is probably better then building an unshielded loop out of
speaker wire and using the same wire to connect the antenna to the radio.
Again, I gave the OP the opportunity to do some research.
On the other hand, I used a shielded loop in a previous home as a random
wire antenna was not an option.
craigm
Frank103
antenna that came with the receiver. It's probably about 10 years old by
now and still sounds good. It picks up about half of the FM stations that
are available in my area - Las Vegas. Here's what I don't understand. There
are 2 stations. 88.9 and 89.7. Both are NPR with HD. The first one is news
and the second one is classical music. I can get the news station fine. But
what I really want is the music station which is nothing but static. Being
in a county with 2 million people one would think that there would be more
than one classical music station but there is only one and all I get from it
is static. A Radio Shack amplified antenna was not help at all.
Frank
<garya...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:b3d05ab8-1aef-410b...@e23g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
Telamon
"Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
Shielded loops are less sensitive to local inductive E fields.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
Dale Parfitt
"Telamon" <telamon_s...@pacbell.net.is.invalid> wrote in message
news:telamon_spamshield-2...@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com...
I thought there was enough math/data out there that no one any longer
believed this.
From the W8JI page- http://www.w8ji.com/magnetic_receiving_loops.htm
"Folklore claims a small "shielded" loop antenna behaves like a sieve,
sorting "good magnetic signals" from "bad electrical noise".
Nothing is further from the truth! At relatively small distances a small
magnetic loop is more sensitive to electric fields than a small electric
field probe.
W4OP
garya...@aol.com
> Gary, the Sony receiver is model GX700 ES and the antenna is the standard FM
> antenna that came with the receiver. It's probably about 10 years old by
> now and still sounds good. It picks up about half of the FM stations that
> are available in my area - Las Vegas. Here's what I don't understand. There
> are 2 stations. 88.9 and 89.7. Both are NPR with HD. The first one is news
> and the second one is classical music. I can get the news station fine. But
> what I really want is the music station which is nothing but static. Being
> in a county with 2 million people one would think that there would be more
> than one classical music station but there is only one and all I get from it
> is static. A Radio Shack amplified antenna was not help at all.
>
The antenna that came with your Sony is just a piece of wire which
Sony states to use as a temporary antenna. The CCRadio-SW would be
your best bet to try and get the station you want. You can only try
and see if you get what you want. But there is never any guarantee
when it comes to reception.
RHF
> Dale Parfitt wrote:
>
> >> Yes, for shortwave a 10-20 foot piece of wire can be used. You do not
> >> need to spend a lot of money to get started. If noise is an issue, google
> >> for 'shielded loop antenna'. You can also buy more expensive antennas.
> >> Try,
> >>http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant.html
>
> > Why would a shielded loop receive less noise than, say, a classic wire
> > turn loop?
>
> > Dale W4OP
>
> Dale,
>
> I made no shielded loop vs. unshielded loop comparisons. My intent was to
> give the beginner the idea that there are different types of antennas, and
> by suggesting google, allow the OP to do some research on his own.
>
> That being said, building a shielded loop implies the OP has shielded wire
> which can also be used for the connection between the radio and the
> antenna.
- This is probably better then building an unshielded loop
- out of speaker wire and using the same wire to connect
- the antenna to the radio.
>
> Again, I gave the OP the opportunity to do some research.
>
> On the other hand, I used a shielded loop in a previous
> home as a random wire antenna was not an option.
>
> craigm
Craig M.,
Actually Loop {Balance} Antenna make from Speaker-Wire and
using the same Speaker-Wire {Balanced} as a feed-in-line
is a fairly simple and practical Loop Antenna set-up.
Just like a "Split" Speaker-Wire Dipole Antenna using the
same Speaker-Wire {Balanced} as a feed-in-line is a
fairly simple and practical Dipole Antenna set-up.
Both can be very low cost and effective Shortwave Listening
(SWL) Antennas not requiring a Ground to give relatively
Good Signal Levels and Low Noise.
RadioShack - Recoton (SW-1850) 50Feet 18 AWG Speaker Wire
http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2428008
iane ~ RHF
.
RHF
> antenna that came with the receiver. It's probably about 10 years old by
> now and still sounds good. It picks up about half of the FM stations that
> are available in my area - Las Vegas. Here's what I don't understand. There
> are 2 stations. 88.9 and 89.7. Both are NPR with HD. The first one is news
> and the second one is classical music. I can get the news station fine. But
> what I really want is the music station which is nothing but static. Being
> in a county with 2 million people one would think that there would be more
> than one classical music station but there is only one and all I get from it
> is static. A Radio Shack amplified antenna was not help at all.
>
> - Show quoted text -
Frank 103,
A Beginners Question - FM Radio Reception and FM Antennas
The SR-100 Silver Ribbon Tunable FM Antenna by Magnum Dynalab
http://www.magnumdynalab.com/fmantennas-sr100.htm
Designed to be used In-Doors and You can 'Adjust-It' and
'Rotate-It' for the best Reception of the specific FM Radio
Station that you are trying to hear.
Check-Out the "FM Antennas FAQs" by Magnum Dynalab
http://www.magnumdynalab.com/fmantennas-sr100.htm
C Crane FM Reflect Antenna by C. Crane Co.
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/mwant/0143.html
* This is a "Passive' FM Antenna that can be mounted
On-the-Wall; or Hidden-behind-Draps; or Under-the-Carpet.
Terk "FM Pro" {FM-50} FM Antenna
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/mwant/3825.html
* This is an Active {Amplified} FM Antenna that can be
mounted In-Doors; In-the-Attic; or Out-Side Under-the-Eaves.
READ - Improving FM Radio Reception : The Better Antennas To Use
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.audio.tech/msg/aa420981a553930b
READ - Serious 'portable' FM Radios for DXing the FM Band
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/38a23d4d7ab0ba14
READ - Follow-Up - Two Key 'Features' In Any Portable
FM Radio That Are Worth Considering For DXing The FM
Band Are :
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/a3edc1e05ab1e40a
f m magic - iane ~ RHF {pomkia}
.
Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antennas Group => http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf
GoTo => http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
The SWL Antenna Discussion Group => http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf
Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna HELP => http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf
Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna NEWS => http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf
Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antenna INFO => http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf
* * * All Are Welcome : Including ELMERS and 'Want-to-be-Elmers'
plus plain old "Mister-Know-It-Alls"; and even those Newbees with
"I Know This Is A Really Dumb Question - But _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ "
.
Shortwave Radio Listener QSL Reports News & Info Group
http://groups.google.com/group/shortwave-listener-qsl-reports
Read & Post Your Shortwave Listener (SWL) Reception Reports
SWL-QSL-REPORTS => http://tinyurl.com/3awlyr
.
The Shortwave Listener's Blessing :
SWL BLESSING => http://tinyurl.com/s2bjm
May You Never Tire of Listening to the Radio and Always
have Strong Signals and Noise Free Reception ~ RHF {ibid}
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/message/9233
.
Tous Sont Bienvenus ! - - - Groupe par Radio
d'auditeur d'onde courte pour des Antennes de SWL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
.
Alle Sind Willkommen ! - - - Shortwave Radiozuhörer
Gruppe für SWL Antennen
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
.
Tutti Sono Benvenuti ! - - - Gruppo Radiofonico
dell'ascoltatore di onda corta per le Antenne di SWL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
.
Todos São Bem-vindos ! - - - Grupo de Rádio
do ouvinte do Shortwave para Antenas de SWL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
.
¡Todos Son Agradables! - - - Grupo de Radio del oyente
de la onda corta para las Antenas de SWL
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
.
= = = = Plain Old American-English Translation = = = =
All are Welcome - - - To Join the Shortwave Listeners
(SWL) Antenna Group on YAHOO !
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
.
|
|
|
/ \
.......!.......
pli...@telkomsa.net
have no trouble at all getting far distant stations. My other
portables and my stereo won't receive them at all.
You got good advice for a CC Radio SW, and there is also the cheaper
Kaito KA2100, all of which are the same as the Redsun RP2100. A superb
performer on FM.
See: http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/portable/2100.html
Universal also do a range of FM antenna's, but I don't have any
experience with those. Have a look at:
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/mwant.html
You need to see that the connectors on these devices match the FM
radio you have in mind.
Good reception
John Plimmer, Montagu, Western Cape Province, South Africa
South 33 d 47 m 32 s, East 20 d 07 m 32 s
RX Icom IC-756 PRO III with MW mods
Drake SW8 & ERGO software
Sony 7600D, GE SRIII, Redsun RP2100
BW XCR 30, Sangean 803A.
Antenna's RF Systems DX 1 Pro Mk II, Datong AD-270
Kiwa MW Loop, PAORDT Roelof mini-whip
http://www.dxing.info/about/dxers/plimmer.dx
RHF
> Frank I live in a marginal FM area and since I have a Redsun RP2100 I
> have no trouble at all getting far distant stations. My other
> portables and my stereo won't receive them at all.
> You got good advice for a CC Radio SW, and there is also the cheaper
> Kaito KA2100, all of which are the same as the Redsun RP2100. A superb
> performer on FM.
> See:http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/portable/2100.html
>
> Universal also do a range of FM antenna's, but I don't have any
> experience with those. Have a look at:http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/mwant.html
> You need to see that the connectors on these devices match the FM
> radio you have in mind.
>
> Good reception
>
> John Plimmer, Montagu, Western Cape Province, South Africa
> South 33 d 47 m 32 s, East 20 d 07 m 32 s
> RX Icom IC-756 PRO III with MW mods
> Drake SW8 & ERGO software
> Sony 7600D, GE SRIII, Redsun RP2100
> BW XCR 30, Sangean 803A.
> Antenna's RF Systems DX 1 Pro Mk II, Datong AD-270
>
> On Dec 5, 1:36 am, "Frank103" <frank...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I would like to buy a portable shortwave radio with a whip antenna but I've
> > been holding back because I live in an area that gets mediocre reception on
> > my Sony reciever's FM tuner from stations 20 miles away; so I'm really
> > paranoid about buying a portable shortwave radio. My homeowners association
> > doesn't permit outside antennas. Here are several questions:
>
> > 1. Can someone recommend a portable shortwave radio for under $200US that
> > works well.?
> > 2. Can I attach an indoor antenna to improve reception? What brand of
> > antenna?
> > 3. I've tried several indoor antennas from Radio Shack to improve my FM
> > reception and none did anything. Can someone recommend a really powerful FM
> > indoor antenna?
>
> > Thanks in advance.
>
> - Show quoted text -
HeartLandAmerica.Com has the "Silicon Scientific" Multi-Band
Digital AM/FM Shortwave Radio RP2000 'On-Sale-For' $49
http://www.hlaimages2.com/prod_images/500/75498.jpg
http://www.heartlandamerica.com/browse/item.asp?product=digital-shortwave-radio&PIN=54168
IMHO - This 'appears-to-be' a Redsun RP2100 Radio that
has been Re-Branded with the "Silicon Scientific" Name.
~ RHF
.
Telamon
"Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
> "Telamon" <telamon_s...@pacbell.net.is.invalid> wrote in message
> news:telamon_spamshield-2...@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com...
> > In article <KCy5j.2781$md.534@trnddc06>,
> > "Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >
> >> >
> >> > Yes, for shortwave a 10-20 foot piece of wire can be used. You
> >> > do not need to spend a lot of money to get started. If noise is
> >> > an issue, google for 'shielded loop antenna'. You can also buy
> >> > more expensive antennas. Try,
> >> > http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant.html
> >> >
> >>
> >> Why would a shielded loop receive less noise than, say, a classic
> >> wire turn loop?
> >>
> >
> > Shielded loops are less sensitive to local inductive E fields.
> >
>
> I thought there was enough math/data out there that no one any longer
> believed this.
>
> From the W8JI page- http://www.w8ji.com/magnetic_receiving_loops.htm
> "Folklore claims a small "shielded" loop antenna behaves like a
> sieve, sorting "good magnetic signals" from "bad electrical noise".
> Nothing is further from the truth! At relatively small distances a
> small magnetic loop is more sensitive to electric fields than a small
> electric field probe.
>
I would not be quoting some ham零 web site as an authority on
electromagnetic theory or folklore.
There is a lot of bad information on the net. The areas of electronics
and electromagnetism are easy to misunderstand. Part of the problem is
that it is also easy to leave questions more open ended than intended
and so the answers tend to be ambiguous.
So now, I'll be more specific. Maybe it will help.
Small loops that have a shield that is split half way around are only
sensitive to magnetic fields. The split half way around ensures the E
field is canceled for far field and it works pretty well for near
inductive fields. I have used this type of probe along with small E
field probes in EMI and RFI work so I know they operate as they were
designed or I would not have been able to solve problems.
Another situation occurs when the shield is not split evenly around the
loop and grounded on one end. Here the outer shield picks up the E
field and the shielded wire picks up the M field and this configuration
will generate about two times the signal the center split shielded loop
will generate.
So it depends on a number of parameters not least of which is physical
size and electrical size for the application.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
Dale Parfitt
> I would not be quoting some ham零 web site as an authority on
> electromagnetic theory or folklore.
You might want to Google Tom W8JI and find out who he is. To describe one of
the U.S.'s brighter engineers and designers as "some ham" is a real
disservice. The fact that he happens to have a ham license is purely a
coincidence. His explaination of how the shielded loop functions is embraced
by the IEEE group on Electromagnetics and Propagation, Roy Lewellen (writer
of EZNEC software) et al.
W4OP
Telamon
"Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
I don't care who Tom and Roy Lewellen are supposed to be. Credentials
don't impress me.
It's likely either they stated something incorrect or you misunderstood
them.
You asked a question and I answered it correctly. If you don't like the
answer go take it up with those two.
And by the way you will be glad to know I'm much more important than the
two of them together and yet I take the time to answer your questions.
I'm such a nice guy despite being the most important person you will
ever deal with.
Oh yeah, and your welcome Dale.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
RHF
> >
>
> > I would not be quoting some ham¹s web site as an authority on
Tom Rauch [W8JI]
http://www.w8ji.com/
http://www.qrz.com/detail/W8JI
Roy Lewallen [W7EL]
http://www.qrz.com/detail/W7EL
EZNEC Antenna Software by W7EL
http://www.eznec.com/
.
Billy Burpelson
> In article <ZRm6j.366$3s1.152@trnddc06>,
> "Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> >
>>> I would not be quoting some ham零 web site as an authority on
>>> electromagnetic theory or folklore.
>> You might want to Google Tom W8JI and find out who he is. To describe
>> one of the U.S.'s brighter engineers and designers as "some ham" is a
>> real disservice. The fact that he happens to have a ham license is
>> purely a coincidence. His explaination of how the shielded loop
>> functions is embraced by the IEEE group on Electromagnetics and
>> Propagation, Roy Lewellen (writer of EZNEC software) et al.
>
> I don't care who Tom and Roy Lewellen are supposed to be. Credentials
> don't impress me.
Uh, it's not just 'credentials' -- it's the actual knowledge they
posses, their actual accomplishments and international acclaim they have
received. Can you say the same? (Being the group buffoon doesn't count).
> And by the way you will be glad to know I'm much more important than the
> two of them together...
Humph! Once again, a legend in your own mind.
If you were as knowledgeable of the industry as you claim to be, you
would be familiar with Tom and Roy. I'm not too familiar with Roy's work
(other than being an EZNEC user) but I have been following Tom's
postings for years and it is very apparent that his little finger is
more knowledgeable than you could ever hope to be... Of course, for
sheer gall, you do take the award.
Telamon
Billy Burpelson <bi...@burpelson.net> wrote:
> Telamon wrote:
> > In article <ZRm6j.366$3s1.152@trnddc06>,
> > "Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
> >
> >> >
> >>> I would not be quoting some ham零 web site as an authority on
> >>> electromagnetic theory or folklore.
> >> You might want to Google Tom W8JI and find out who he is. To describe
> >> one of the U.S.'s brighter engineers and designers as "some ham" is a
> >> real disservice. The fact that he happens to have a ham license is
> >> purely a coincidence. His explaination of how the shielded loop
> >> functions is embraced by the IEEE group on Electromagnetics and
> >> Propagation, Roy Lewellen (writer of EZNEC software) et al.
> >
> > I don't care who Tom and Roy Lewellen are supposed to be. Credentials
> > don't impress me.
>
> Uh, it's not just 'credentials' -- it's the actual knowledge they
> posses, their actual accomplishments and international acclaim they have
> received. Can you say the same? (Being the group buffoon doesn't count).
I have that knowledge. I use that knowledge professionally.
And what credentials do you have besides being an idiot?
> > And by the way you will be glad to know I'm much more important than the
> > two of them together...
>
> Humph! Once again, a legend in your own mind.
This is sarcasm idiot.
> If you were as knowledgeable of the industry as you claim to be, you
> would be familiar with Tom and Roy. I'm not too familiar with Roy's
> work (other than being an EZNEC user) but I have been following Tom's
> postings for years and it is very apparent that his little finger is
> more knowledgeable than you could ever hope to be... Of course, for
> sheer gall, you do take the award.
I'm just not at all floored by someone's supposed importance. Does that
thought make it past your apparently thick scull? Knowledge is not the
provence of some small group of people but is available to anyone that
can think. I know this is over your pretty little head so don't worry
about it.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
Telamon
Billy Burpelson <bi...@burpelson.net> wrote:
Oh, by the way retard if you are so knowledgeable what didn't you answer
the question?
You can't because you are an idiot.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
Frank103
for. Will also try the Terk Pro. Thanks again.
Frank
"Frank103" <fran...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:pwl5j.95$AN1...@newsfe16.lga...
Steve
> >
>
> > I would not be quoting some ham¹s web site as an authority on
W8JI's view, as I understand it, is that small shielded loops are no
less susceptible to local noise in virtue of their shielding, since
the shield, in his view, is part of the antenna. It's probably worth
pointing out that, even if this is true, it is still consistent with
the view that small loops pick up less noise than other types of
antennas in virtue of their directional characteristics. I guess W8JI
would then maintain that a shielded loop would be no less susceptible
to local noise than an unshielded loop, since in this case both
antennas enjoy the benefits of directionality; but he isn't commited
to denying that loops are quieter than, say whips when all things are
considered. Is this correct or am I missing something here?
Dale Parfitt
less susceptible to local noise in virtue of their shielding, since
the shield, in his view, is part of the antenna. It's probably worth
pointing out that, even if this is true, it is still consistent with
the view that small loops pick up less noise than other types of
antennas in virtue of their directional characteristics. I guess W8JI
would then maintain that a shielded loop would be no less susceptible
to local noise than an unshielded loop, since in this case both
antennas enjoy the benefits of directionality; but he isn't commited
to denying that loops are quieter than, say whips when all things are
considered. Is this correct or am I missing something here?
Correct. Here it is from VE7SL perhaps more concisely:
Please note that a 'shielded loop' will not do anything to improve local
noise problems that any other type of loop (such as a multi-turn air core
loop) might do. Don't confuse the 'shielded' nomenclature with 'noise
shielding' as this is not the case. Like any other type of loop, it can be
used to null nearby noise sources or signals or turned to enhance desired
directions.
The shielded loop might more properly be called a 'two-turn' loop or a
'close coupled' loop as this more accurately describes it's behaviour. In
actual operation, it is the shield itself that is the active antenna
element. Signals picked up by the shield are coupled into the inner
conductor, which in turn are coupled back to the receiver via the preamp.
The loop is capable of good nulls on both groundwave and skywave signals.
The more 'balanced' the loop is (gap placed at exact center), the more
balanced the nulls will be.
Telamon
<00d8218f-8b8e-4290...@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com>,
Steve <sdan...@speakeasy.net> wrote:
> On Dec 7, 8:57 pm, "Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > >
> >
> > > I would not be quoting some ham零 web site as an authority on
This is wrong. I already explained why. Go back and read the part of my
post Dale cut out of the thread.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
Telamon
"Dale Parfitt" <par...@verizon.net> wrote:
This is wrong. I already explained why. Go back and read the part of my
post you cut out of the thread. You are being to general in the
description of shielded.
--
Telamon
Ventura, California
Dale Parfitt
>
> This is wrong. I already explained why. Go back and read the part of my
> post Dale cut out of the thread.
>
> --
> Telamon
> Ventura, California
It was not my intent to cut censor your comments Telamon- I was attepmting
to clean up the thread and address Stece's question explicitely.
I respect your comments and we can agree to disagree as gentlemen.
73,
Dale