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OT Henry IV Descents for Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax (b. 1926)
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Brad Verity
Apr 3, 2014, 4:09:40 PM4/3/14
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Richard Trappes-Lomax of Allsprings House and his wife Hon. Alice Fitzherbert (descended from Charles II) had eight sons, of whom five married. The Edward III descents for two of the Trappes-Lomax wives - Dorothy Herbert & Diana Silvertop - have already been posted. Another two of the wives - Gertrude Maisie Stockwell (1913-1994) & Patricia Margaret Taylor (1924-1995) - do not have any apparent Edw III or Edw I descents.
The remaining wife, Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins, was born 8 August 1926 in Kensington, London, and is the only Trappes-Lomax spouse still with us, living in Norwich, Norfolk. She married 25 November 1952 in Norfolk, Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (born 22 March 1913 at Allsprings House, Great Harwood, Lancashire; died 9 July 1982 in Norfolk), and has two sons, two daughters, and five grandchildren.
Alison Trappes-Lomax is the daughter of George Algernon Perkins of Bure House, Lammas, Norfolk, born 18 March 1896 in Shropshire, and died 1980 at Bure House. He married 10 September 1924 at Norwich, Norfolk, Marjory Emily Morse (born 19 January 1900 at Edinburgh, Scotland; died 1992 at Bure House).
The Perkins family (Alison's brother John Perkins is the current head of the family and still resides at Bure House) is covered in an article in Burke's Landed Gentry 18th Edition Volume 1 (1965), pp. 561-562. There are a couple errors in the account, which need correction before moving on to Alison's royal lines.
The BLG account states that Alison's father George Algernon Perkins succeeded his grandfather at Chipstead Place, Kent, before selling it in 1915. This is not quite correct. Chipstead Place was purchased in 1829 by Alison's great-great-great-grandfather Frederick Perkins (1780-1860). Frederick's father had become a partner in the Southwark brewery which came to be called Barclay Perkins. In the 19th century, it was considered one of the wonders of London, certainly the largest brewery in England, producing 423,000 barrels in the year 1867:
http://barclayperkins.blogspot.ca/2013/08/the-brewery-of-barclay-perkins-and-co.html
Chipstead Place was inherited by Frederick's eldest surviving son George Perkins (1805-1879), Alison's great-great-grandfather. George Perkins's only son (Alison's great-grandfather), George Perkins of Twickenham (1843-1876), died three years before his father. So when George Perkins died in 1879, he willed Chipstead Place to George Frederick Perkins (1867-1895), the elder son of his deceased son George (not the younger son, as the BLG article incorrectly has it). At George Frederick's death in 1895, Chipstead Place was then either inherited by Alison's grandfather Algernon Edward Perkins (1869-1926), the younger brother of George Frederick, or was left in trust to Alison's father George Algernon Perkins, who was only age 19 in 1915, the year BLG says Chipstead Place was sold.
All of Alison's royal lines come through her paternal grandmother Meriel Gundrede Leighton. First up are the two from Henry IV, with links to the most recent individual in Leo's database for each.
Henry IV had a son
A1) Humphrey of Lancaster, 1st Duke of Gloucester (1390-1447) m. 2) Eleanor Cobham (c.1400-1452), and had
A2) Antigone of Lancaster, illegit. (b. c.1420) m. 1) Henry Gray, 2nd Count of Tancarville (1420-1450, descended from Edward I), and had
A3) Elizabeth Gray (c.1439-aft.1495) m. Sir Roger Kynaston of Hordley (d. 1495), and had a son A4 & a dau B4 (see below)
A4) Humphrey Kynaston of Morton (c.1470-1535) m. Elspeth ferch Maredudd Hywel, and had
A5) Roger Kynaston of Marton (d. 1589) m. Gwen ferch Mardeudd (d. 1615), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00326603&tree=LEO
A6) Humphrey Kynaston of Marton m. Jane Lloyd, and had
A7) Roger Kynaston of Cefn y Carneddau m. Anne Eyton, and had
A8) Lettice Kynaston (b. 1618) m. William Maurice of Cefn-y-braich (1620-1680)*, and had
A9) Anne Maurice (1649-1727) m. David Williams of Glanalaw (d. 1699), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00387914&tree=LEO
A10) Elizabeth Williams m. John Bold of Beaumaris (d. 1719)**, and had
A11) Margaret Bold (d. 1800) m. Hugh Owen of Penrhos (see B13 below), and had
A12) Margaret Owen (1742-1816) m. Sir John Thomas Stanley, 6th Baronet of Alderley Hall (1736-1807, descended from Edward I), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00060790&tree=LEO
A13) Louisa Margaretta Anne Stanley (1768-1842) m. Sir Baldwin Leighton, 6th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1747-1828, descended from Edward III), and had
A14) Sir Baldwin Leighton, 7th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1805-1871) m. Mary Parker (1799-1864), and had
A15) Sir Baldwyn Leighton, 8th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1836-1897) m. Hon. Eleanor Leicester Warren (1841-1914, descended from Edward III), and had
A16) Meriel Gundrede Leighton (1872-1947) m. Algernon Edward Perkins of Whydown Place (1869-1926), and had
A17) George Algernon Perkins of Bure House (1896-1980) m. Marjory Emily Morse (1900-1992), and had
A18) Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 1926) m. Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (1913-1982)
* William Maurice was an antiquarian, and has a bio in ODNB:
http://www.oxforddnb.com/index/18/101018388/
**If John Bold of Beaumaris can be shown to be a descendant of Sir Henry Bold of Bold Hall (d. by 1497) & Dulcia Savage, then he has at least one line of descent from Edward I. Among the Dinham Hall manuscripts at Bangor University is "an account of the descent of John Bold of Beaumaris, father of the 'seven pretty Peggies'":
http://www.archiveswales.org.uk/anw/get_collection.php?inst_id=39&coll_id=10487&expand=
This is likely the only source that provides John Bold's ancestry, as I can find nothing about it online.
B4) Margaret Kynaston m. Sir Richard Hanmer of Hanmer Hall, and had
B5) Sir Thomas Hanmer of Hanmer Hall (d. 1545) m. 1) Jane Brereton, and had
B6) Eleanor Hanmer m. William Hanmer of Fens Hall (d. 1570), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00565098&tree=LEO
B7) Maud Hanmer m. Pirs ap Dafydd Lloyd of Lligwy (d. aft.1603), and had
B8) Sian Lloyd m. William Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. aft. 1622, descended from Edward III), and had
B9) John Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. 1626) m. Ellen Williams (descended from Edward III), and had
B10) Ellen Lewis m. John Wynn of Bodewryd (1617-1669), and had
B11) Edward Wynn of Bodewryd (c.1643-1681) m. Margaret Morgan (d. 1723), and had
B12) Ann Wynn (d. 1748) m. Robert Owen of Penhros (d. 1731, descended from Edward III), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00422101&tree=LEO
B13) Hugh Owen of Penhros (d. 1742) m. Margaret Bold (see A11 above)
I will lay out the remaining Edward III descents for Alison Perkins in the next post.
Cheers, ----Brad
The remaining wife, Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins, was born 8 August 1926 in Kensington, London, and is the only Trappes-Lomax spouse still with us, living in Norwich, Norfolk. She married 25 November 1952 in Norfolk, Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (born 22 March 1913 at Allsprings House, Great Harwood, Lancashire; died 9 July 1982 in Norfolk), and has two sons, two daughters, and five grandchildren.
Alison Trappes-Lomax is the daughter of George Algernon Perkins of Bure House, Lammas, Norfolk, born 18 March 1896 in Shropshire, and died 1980 at Bure House. He married 10 September 1924 at Norwich, Norfolk, Marjory Emily Morse (born 19 January 1900 at Edinburgh, Scotland; died 1992 at Bure House).
The Perkins family (Alison's brother John Perkins is the current head of the family and still resides at Bure House) is covered in an article in Burke's Landed Gentry 18th Edition Volume 1 (1965), pp. 561-562. There are a couple errors in the account, which need correction before moving on to Alison's royal lines.
The BLG account states that Alison's father George Algernon Perkins succeeded his grandfather at Chipstead Place, Kent, before selling it in 1915. This is not quite correct. Chipstead Place was purchased in 1829 by Alison's great-great-great-grandfather Frederick Perkins (1780-1860). Frederick's father had become a partner in the Southwark brewery which came to be called Barclay Perkins. In the 19th century, it was considered one of the wonders of London, certainly the largest brewery in England, producing 423,000 barrels in the year 1867:
http://barclayperkins.blogspot.ca/2013/08/the-brewery-of-barclay-perkins-and-co.html
Chipstead Place was inherited by Frederick's eldest surviving son George Perkins (1805-1879), Alison's great-great-grandfather. George Perkins's only son (Alison's great-grandfather), George Perkins of Twickenham (1843-1876), died three years before his father. So when George Perkins died in 1879, he willed Chipstead Place to George Frederick Perkins (1867-1895), the elder son of his deceased son George (not the younger son, as the BLG article incorrectly has it). At George Frederick's death in 1895, Chipstead Place was then either inherited by Alison's grandfather Algernon Edward Perkins (1869-1926), the younger brother of George Frederick, or was left in trust to Alison's father George Algernon Perkins, who was only age 19 in 1915, the year BLG says Chipstead Place was sold.
All of Alison's royal lines come through her paternal grandmother Meriel Gundrede Leighton. First up are the two from Henry IV, with links to the most recent individual in Leo's database for each.
Henry IV had a son
A1) Humphrey of Lancaster, 1st Duke of Gloucester (1390-1447) m. 2) Eleanor Cobham (c.1400-1452), and had
A2) Antigone of Lancaster, illegit. (b. c.1420) m. 1) Henry Gray, 2nd Count of Tancarville (1420-1450, descended from Edward I), and had
A3) Elizabeth Gray (c.1439-aft.1495) m. Sir Roger Kynaston of Hordley (d. 1495), and had a son A4 & a dau B4 (see below)
A4) Humphrey Kynaston of Morton (c.1470-1535) m. Elspeth ferch Maredudd Hywel, and had
A5) Roger Kynaston of Marton (d. 1589) m. Gwen ferch Mardeudd (d. 1615), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00326603&tree=LEO
A6) Humphrey Kynaston of Marton m. Jane Lloyd, and had
A7) Roger Kynaston of Cefn y Carneddau m. Anne Eyton, and had
A8) Lettice Kynaston (b. 1618) m. William Maurice of Cefn-y-braich (1620-1680)*, and had
A9) Anne Maurice (1649-1727) m. David Williams of Glanalaw (d. 1699), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00387914&tree=LEO
A10) Elizabeth Williams m. John Bold of Beaumaris (d. 1719)**, and had
A11) Margaret Bold (d. 1800) m. Hugh Owen of Penrhos (see B13 below), and had
A12) Margaret Owen (1742-1816) m. Sir John Thomas Stanley, 6th Baronet of Alderley Hall (1736-1807, descended from Edward I), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00060790&tree=LEO
A13) Louisa Margaretta Anne Stanley (1768-1842) m. Sir Baldwin Leighton, 6th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1747-1828, descended from Edward III), and had
A14) Sir Baldwin Leighton, 7th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1805-1871) m. Mary Parker (1799-1864), and had
A15) Sir Baldwyn Leighton, 8th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1836-1897) m. Hon. Eleanor Leicester Warren (1841-1914, descended from Edward III), and had
A16) Meriel Gundrede Leighton (1872-1947) m. Algernon Edward Perkins of Whydown Place (1869-1926), and had
A17) George Algernon Perkins of Bure House (1896-1980) m. Marjory Emily Morse (1900-1992), and had
A18) Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 1926) m. Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (1913-1982)
* William Maurice was an antiquarian, and has a bio in ODNB:
http://www.oxforddnb.com/index/18/101018388/
**If John Bold of Beaumaris can be shown to be a descendant of Sir Henry Bold of Bold Hall (d. by 1497) & Dulcia Savage, then he has at least one line of descent from Edward I. Among the Dinham Hall manuscripts at Bangor University is "an account of the descent of John Bold of Beaumaris, father of the 'seven pretty Peggies'":
http://www.archiveswales.org.uk/anw/get_collection.php?inst_id=39&coll_id=10487&expand=
This is likely the only source that provides John Bold's ancestry, as I can find nothing about it online.
B4) Margaret Kynaston m. Sir Richard Hanmer of Hanmer Hall, and had
B5) Sir Thomas Hanmer of Hanmer Hall (d. 1545) m. 1) Jane Brereton, and had
B6) Eleanor Hanmer m. William Hanmer of Fens Hall (d. 1570), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00565098&tree=LEO
B7) Maud Hanmer m. Pirs ap Dafydd Lloyd of Lligwy (d. aft.1603), and had
B8) Sian Lloyd m. William Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. aft. 1622, descended from Edward III), and had
B9) John Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. 1626) m. Ellen Williams (descended from Edward III), and had
B10) Ellen Lewis m. John Wynn of Bodewryd (1617-1669), and had
B11) Edward Wynn of Bodewryd (c.1643-1681) m. Margaret Morgan (d. 1723), and had
B12) Ann Wynn (d. 1748) m. Robert Owen of Penhros (d. 1731, descended from Edward III), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00422101&tree=LEO
B13) Hugh Owen of Penhros (d. 1742) m. Margaret Bold (see A11 above)
I will lay out the remaining Edward III descents for Alison Perkins in the next post.
Cheers, ----Brad
Brad Verity
Apr 3, 2014, 11:37:39 PM4/3/14
to
On Thursday, April 3, 2014 1:09:40 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> I will lay out the remaining Edward III descents for Alison Perkins in the next post.
George Algernon Perkins (1896-1980), the father of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax, appears in Ruvigny's Plantagenet Roll-Anne of Exeter volume as Number 8563: "1e. George Algernon Perkins, b. 1896" (p. 233).
> I will lay out the remaining Edward III descents for Alison Perkins in the next post.
The 38 separate lines of descent from Edward III (not including the two thru Henry IV, already posted) for Alison are laid out below, with links to the most recent individuals in Leo's database for each.
Because of the length, this post was split in half. The first 19 lines are in Part 1, and the remaining 19 are in Part 2.
Edward III had 4 sons A1, BB1, EE1 & JJ1 (see below)
A1) John of Gaunt, 1st Duke of Lancaster (1340-1399) m. three times, and had 2 daus A2 & U2, and 2 sons V2 & W2 (see below)
A2) Lady Joan Beaufort (1377-1440) m. twice, and had 5 daus A3, B3, D3, I3 & J3, and 3 sons K3, N3 & O3 (see below)
A3) Lady Katherine Neville, by 2nd husband (c.1399-1483) m. 2) Sir Thomas Strangways (d. by1443), and had
A4) Joan Strangways (c.1440-1485) m. 1) Sir William Willoughby of Parham (d. 1468), and had
A5) Cecily Willoughby (b. c.1464) m. Edward Sutton, 2nd Lord Dudley (c.1459-1532, descended from Edward I), and had
A6) Joyce Dudley (d. 1586) m. 1) John Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (d. 1532, descended from Edward I), and had
A7) Sir Edward Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (by1525-1593) m. 2) Anne Darrell, and had
A8) Thomas Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (c.1554-1600) m. Elizabeth Gerard (d. 1626), and had
A9) Robert Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (1585-1626) m. Anne Devereux (see P10 below), and had
A10) Edward Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (c.1609-1635) m. 1) Abigail Stephens (1610-1630), and had
A11) Robert Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (1628-1689) m. Gertrude Baldwin (d. 1683, descended from Edward I), and had
A12) Sir Edward Leighton, 1st Baronet of Wattlesborough (1650-1711) m. 1) Dorothy Charlton (see L10 below), and had
A13) Sir Edward Leighton, 2nd Baronet of Wattlesborough (1681-1756) m. 1) Rachel Forester (see B12 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00531891&tree=LEO
A14) Baldwin Leighton of Shrewsbury (1717-1791) m. Anne Smyth (1726-1797), and had
A15) Sir Baldwin Leighton, 6th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1747-1828) m. Louisa Margaretta Anne Stanley (see X17 below), and had
A16) Sir Baldwin Leighton, 7th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1805-1871) m. Mary Parker (1799-1864), and had
A17) Sir Baldwyn Leighton, 8th Baronet of Wattlesborough (1836-1897) m. Hon. Eleanor Leicester Warren (see C17 below), and had
A18) Meriel Gundrede Leighton (1872-1947) m. Algernon Edward Perkins of Whydown Place (1869-1926), and had
A19) George Algernon Perkins of Bure House (1896-1980) m. Marjory Emily Morse (1900-1992), and had
A20) Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 1926) m. Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (1913-1982)
B3) Lady Cecily Neville, by 2nd husband (1415-1495) m. Richard Plantagenet, 3rd Duke of York (see BB3 below), and had
B4) Lady Anne Plantagenet of York (1439-1476) m. 2) Sir Thomas St Leger (by1438-1483), and had
B5) Anne St Leger (1475-1526) m. George Manners, 11th Lord Ros (1470-1513, descended from Edward I), and had
B6) Thomas Manners, 1st Earl of Rutland (c.1497-1543) m. 2) Eleanor Paston (c.1505-1551, descended from Edward I), and had a son B7 & a dau C7 (see below)
B7) Sir John Manners of Haddon Hall (c.1533-1611) m. Dorothy Vernon (see F8 below), and had
B8) Sir George Manners of Haddon Hall (c.1569-1623) m. Grace Pierrepont (d. 1651, descended from Edward I), and had
B9) John Manners, 8th Earl of Rutland (1604-1679) m. Hon. Frances Montagu (1613-1671, descended from Edward I), and had
B10) Lady Margaret Manners (1647-1682) m. James Cecil, 3rd Earl of Salisbury (see E13 below), and had
B11) Lady Mary Cecil (c.1663-1740) m. Sir William Forester of Dothill Park (1655-1718, descended from Edward I), and had
B12) Rachel Forester (c.1690-1721) m. Sir Edward Leighton, 2nd Baronet of Wattlesborough (see A13 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00531892&tree=LEO
C7) Lady Frances Manners (c.1534-1576) m. Henry Neville, 6th Lord Abergavenny (see D8 below), and had
C8) Mary Neville, 7th Baroness Le Despenser (1554-1626) m. Sir Thomas Fane of Badsell (1536-1589), and had
C9) Francis Fane, 1st Earl of Westmorland (1584-1629) m. Mary Mildmay (c.1582-1640), and had
C10) Hon. George Fane of Basildon House (c.1616-1663) m. Dorothy Horsey (see N11 below), and had
C11) Sir Henry Fane of Basildon House (c.1650-1706) m. Elizabeth Southcote (1651-1724), and had
C12) Charles, 1st Viscount Fane (1676-1744) m. Mary Stanhope (1686-1762, descended from Edward I), and had
C13) Hon. Mary Fane (1710-1785) m. Jerome, 2nd Count de Salis-Soglio (1709-1794), and had
C14) Peter, 3rd Count de Salis-Soglio (1738-1807) m. 3) Anna de Salis (1749-1830), and had
C15) Jerome, 4th Count de Salis-Soglio (1771-1836) m. 3) Henrietta Foster (see W16 below), and had
C16) Countess Catharina Barbara de Salis (1814-1869) m. George Fleming Warren, 2nd Baron de Tabley (see G17 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00132292&tree=LEO
C17) Hon. Eleanor Leicester Warren (1841-1914) m. Sir Baldwyn Leighton, 8th Baronet of Wattlesborough (see A17 above)
D3) Lady Eleanor Neville, by 2nd husband (1403-1472) m. 2) Henry Percy, 2nd Earl of Northumberland (see KK4 below), and had 2 sons D4 & G4 and a dau H4 (see below)
D4) Henry Percy, 3rd Earl of Northumberland (1421-1461) m. Eleanor Poynings (1428-1484, descended from Edward I), and had a son D5 & a dau F5 (see below)
D5) Henry Percy, 4th Earl of Northumberland (c.1449-1489) m. Lady Maud Herbert (c.1457-by1487), and had
D6) Lady Eleanor Percy (c.1478-1531) m. Edward Stafford, 3rd Duke of Buckingham (see J6 below), and had 2 daus D7 & E7 (see below)
D7) Lady Mary Stafford (c.1503-by1529) m. George Neville, 5th Lord Abergavenny (see K5 below), and had
D8) Henry Neville, 6th Lord Abergavenny (1520-1587) m. 1) Lady Frances Manners (see C7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00052490&tree=LEO
E7) Lady Elizabeth Stafford (1497-1558) m. Thomas Howard, 3rd Duke of Norfolk (1473-1554, descended from Edward I), and had
E8) Henry Howard, Earl of Surrey (1516-1547) m. Lady Frances Vere (1517-1577, descended from Edward I), and had
E9) Thomas Howard, 4th Duke of Norfolk (1538-1572) m. 2) Margaret Audley (see Q8 below), and had
E10) Thomas Howard, 1st Earl of Suffolk (1561-1626) m. 2) Katherine Knyvett (c.1566-1638, descended from Edward I), and had
E11) Lady Katherine Howard (c.1593-1673) m. William Cecil, 2nd Earl of Salisbury (see M9 below), and had
E12) Charles Cecil, Viscount Cranborne (1619-1660) m. Lady Diana Maxwell (c.1623-1675), and had
E13) James Cecil, 3rd Earl of Salisbury (1646-1683) m. Lady Margaret Manners (see B10 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00082190&tree=LEO
F5) Lady Margaret Percy (b. c.1447) m. Sir William Gascoigne of Gawthorpe Hall (see I6 below), and had
F6) Elizabeth Gascoigne (c.1480-1559) m. Sir George Tailboys of South Kyme (1467-1538, descended from Edward I), and had
F7) Margaret Tailboys m. Sir George Vernon of Haddon Hall (1508-1565, descended from Edward I), and had
F8) Dorothy Vernon (c.1545-1584) m. Sir John Manners of Haddon Hall (see B7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00052462&tree=LEO
G4) Sir Ralph Percy (1425-1464) m. Eleanor Acton (d. aft.1498), and had
G5) Margaret Percy m. Ralph Harbottle of Beamish (1453-1504, descended from Edward I), and had
G6) Sir Guiscard Harbottle of Beamish (1485-1513) m. Jane Willoughby,
and had
G7) Mary Harbottle (1507-1556) m. Sir Edward Fitton of Gawsworth (d.
1548), and had
G8) Sir Edward Fitton of Gawsworth (1527-1579) m. Anne Warburton (1527-1574, descended from Edward I), and had
G9) Margaret Fitton m. Sir Randall Mainwaring of Over Peover (d. 1612, descended from Edward I), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00248904&tree=LEO
G10) Elizabeth Mainwaring (1587-1641) m. Peter Leycester of Tabley Hall (1588-1647, descended from Edward I), and had
G11) Sir Peter Leycester, 1st Baronet of Tabley (1614-1678) m. Hon. Elizabeth Gerard (1620-1679, descended from Edward I), and had
G12) Sir Robert Leicester, 2nd Baronet of Tabley (1643-1684) m. Meriel Watson (c.1644-1707), and had
G13) Sir Francis Leicester, 3rd Baronet of Tabley (1674-1742) m. Frances Wilson (1683-1716), and had
G14) Meriel Leicester (1705-1742) m. 2) Sir John Byrne, 3rd Baronet of Timogue (see H13 below), and had
G15) Sir Peter Byrne [later Leicester], 4th Baronet of Timogue (1732-1770) m. Catherine Fleming (see T13 below), and had
G16) John Fleming Leicester, 1st Baron de Tabley (1762-1827) m. Georgiana Maria Cottin (1794-1859), and had
G17) George Fleming Leicester [later Warren], 2nd Baron de Tabley (1811-1877) m. Countess Catharina Barbara de Salis (see C16 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00132291&tree=LEO
H4) Lady Katherine Percy (1423-1493) m. Edmund Grey, 1st Earl of Kent (see U4 below), and had
H5) George Grey, 2nd Earl of Kent (c.1443-1503) m. 2) Katherine Herbert (c.1468-by1503), and had
H6) Lady Anne Grey (c.1492-1546) m. John, Baron Hussey of Sleaford (1465-1537), and had
H7) Agnes Hussey (c.1515-aft.1572) m. 2) Sir Humphrey Browne of Ridley Hall (d. 1562), and had
H8) Mary Browne m. Thomas Wilford of Hartridge (1542-1615), and had
H9) James Wilford of Newman Hall m. Anne Newman (d. 1632), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00187965&tree=LEO
H10) Dorothy Wilford (d. 1684) m. John Talbot of Salesbury Hall (1608-1677, descended from Edward I), and had
H11) Dorothy Talbot (1650-1692) m. Edward Warren of Poynton Hall (1659-1720, descended from Edward I), and had
H12) Anna Dorothea Warren (1682-1755) m. Sir Daniel Byrne, 2nd Baronet of Timogue (1676-1715, descended from Edward I), and had
H13) Sir John Byrne, 3rd Baronet of Timogue (c.1705-1742) m. Meriel Leicester (see G14 above)
I3) Mary Ferrers, by 1st husband (1394-1458) m. Sir Ralph Neville of Oversley (1395-1458, descended from Edward I), and had
I4) John Neville of Oversley (c.1415-1482) m. Elizabeth Newmarch (b. 1415), and had
I5) Joan Neville (c.1434-bef.1482) m. 1) Sir William Gascoigne of Gawthorpe Hall (c.1428-1463), and had a son 6V6 & a dau 6W6 (see below)
I6) Sir William Gascoigne of Gawthorpe Hall (c.1450-1487) m. Lady Margaret Percy (see F5 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00109415&tree=LEO
J3) Lady Anne Neville, by 2nd husband (c.1408-1480) m. 1) Humphrey Stafford, 1st Duke of Buckingham (see EE3 below), and had
J4) Humphrey Stafford, Earl of Stafford (c.1425-1458) m. Lady Margaret Beaufort (see V4 below), and had
J5) Henry Stafford, 2nd Duke of Buckingham (1455-1483) m. Lady Katherine Woodville (c.1458-1497), and had
J6) Edward Stafford, 3rd Duke of Buckingham (1478-1521) m. Lady Eleanor Percy (see D6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00026565&tree=LEO
K3) Edward Neville, 3rd Lord Abergavenny, by 2nd husband (c.1417-1476) m. twice, and had a son K4 & a dau M4 (see below)
K4) George Neville, 4th Lord Abergavenny, by 1st wife (see DD4 below) (1440-1492) m. 1) Margaret Fenne (c.1444-1485), and had 2 sons K5 & L5 (see below)
K5) George Neville, 5th Lord Abergavenny (1469-1535) m. 2) Lady Mary Stafford (see D7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00037940&tree=LEO
L5) Sir Edward Neville of Addington Park (by1482-1538) m. Eleanor Windsor (d. 1531, descended from Edward I), and had
L6) Katherine Neville m. Clement Throckmorton of Haseley (see 7
below), and had
L7) Katherine Throckmorton (d. 1622) m. 1) Thomas Harby of Adstone (d.
1592), and had
L8) Emma Harby (1592-1622) m. Robert Charlton of Whitton Court (d.
1670), and had
L9) Sir Job Charlton, 1st Baronet of Ludford (c.1614-1697) m. 1)
Dorothy Blunden (1629-1658, descended from Edward I), and had
L10) Dorothy Charlton (1648-1688) m. Sir Edward Leighton, 1st Baronet of Wattlesborough (see A12 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00531911&tree=LEO
M4) Margaret Neville, by 2nd wife (c.1455-1506) m. John Brooke, 7th Lord Cobham (c.1447-1512, descended from Edward I), and had
M5) Thomas Brooke, 8th Lord Cobham (c.1475-1529) m. 1) Dorothy Heydon (c.1477-by1515), and had
M6) George Brooke, 9th Lord Cobham (c.1497-1558) m. Anne Bray (c.1510-1558), and had
M7) William Brooke, 10th Lord Cobham (1527-1597) m. 2) Frances Newton (d. 1592, descended from Edward I), and had
M8) Elizabeth Brooke (1562-1597) m. Robert Cecil, 1st Earl of Salisbury (1563-1612), and had
M9) William Cecil, 2nd Earl of Salisbury (1591-1668) m. Lady Katherine Howard (see E11 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00003570&tree=LEO
N3) George Neville, 1st Lord Latimer, by 2nd husband (c.1411-1469) m. Lady Elizabeth Beauchamp (c.1411-1480, descended from Edward I), and had
N4) Sir Henry Neville (c.1435-1469) m. Joan Bourchier (see GG4 below), and had
N5) Richard Neville, 2nd Lord Latimer (1468-1530) m. 1) Anne Stafford (d. by 1521), and had
N6) Margaret Neville (b. 1495) m. 1) Edward Willoughby of Beauchamp's
Court (c.1494-1517, descended from Edward I), and had
N7) Elizabeth, 3rd Baroness Willoughby of Broke (d. 1562) m. Sir Fulke
Greville of Beauchamp's Court (by1505-1559), and had
N8) Sir Edward Greville of Harold Park (d. 1615) m. Elizabeth Grey (see R8 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00366701&tree=LEO
N9) Elizabeth Greville (d. by 1642) m. Sir Francis Swift of Roydon (c.1592-1652), and had
N10) Fulca/Elizabeth* Swift (1607-1656) m. James Horsey of Hunningham (d. 1630), and had
N11) Dorothy Horsey (1630-1679) m. 2) Hon. George Fane of Basildon House (see C10 above)
*She was christened Fulca Swift. In the wills of her husband and her father she is called Fulca also Elizabeth Horsey, and in her own will she calls herself Elizabeth Horsey.
O3) Richard Neville, Earl of Salisbury (c.1398-1460) m. Alice Montagu
(1406-1462, descended from Edward I), and had 2 daus O4 & Q4, and 2 sons S4 & T4 (see below)
O4) Lady Alice Neville (c.1434-aft.1503) m. Henry Fitzhugh, 6th Lord
Fitzhugh (1429-1472), and had
O5) Elizabeth Fitzhugh (1462-bef.1407) m. 2) Nicholas, 1st Baron Vaux
of Harrowden (c.1460-1523, descended from Edward I), and had
O6) Katherine Vaux (b. c.1490) m. Sir George Throckmorton of Coughton
(by1489-1552), and had 2 sons O7 & P7 (see below)
O7) Clement Throckmorton of Haseley (by1515-1573) m. Katherine Neville
(see B6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00113858&tree=LEO
P7) Sir Robert Throckmorton of Coughton (by1513-1581) m. 1) Muriel Berkeley (c.1511-by1542, descended from Edward I), and had
P8) Mary Throckmorton (c.1536-1603) m. Edward Arden of Park Hall (1533-1583), and had
P9) Katherine Arden (c.1556-1627) m. Sir Edward Devereux, 1st Baronet of Castle Bromwich (see CC7 below), and had
P10) Anne Devereux (c.1585-1621) m. Robert Leighton of Wattlesborough Castle (see A9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00350140&tree=LEO
Q4) Lady Katherine Neville (c.1442-1504) m. 1)
Q5) Cecily Bonville (1460-1529) m. 1) Thomas Grey, 1st Marquess of Dorset (c.1456-1501, descended from Edward I), and had
Q6) Thomas Grey, 2nd Marquess of Dorset (1477-1530) m. 2) Margaret Wotton (d. 1541), and had a dau Q7 & a son R7 (see below)
Q7) Lady Elizabeth Grey (c.1520-1564) m. 1) Thomas, 1st Baron Audley of Walden (1488-1544), and had
Q8) Margaret Audley (1540-1564) m. Thomas Howard, 4th Duke of Norfolk (see E9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007937&tree=LEO
R7) Lord John Grey of Pirgo (c.1524-1564) m. Mary Browne (see S7 below), and had
R8) Elizabeth Grey (c.1554-1619) m. 2) Sir Edward Greville of Harold Park (see N8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00366702&tree=LEO
S4) John Neville, Marquess Montagu (c.1431-1471) m. Isabel Ingaldesthorpe (1441-1476, descended from Edward I), and had
S5) Lady Lucy Neville (1468-1534) m. 2) Sir Anthony Browne of Calais (1443-1506, descended from Edward I), and had
S6) Sir Anthony Browne of Cowdray Park (c.1500-1548) m. 1) Alice Gage (d. 1540), and had
S7) Mary Browne (c.1530-1617) m. 1) Lord John Grey of Pirgo (see R7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00123377&tree=LEO
[Continued in Part 2 of 2]
Brad Verity
Apr 3, 2014, 11:40:02 PM4/3/14
to
On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:37:39 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> [Continued in Part 2 of 2]
T4) Richard Neville, Earl of Warwick 'The Kingmaker' (1428-1471) = a
> [Continued in Part 2 of 2]
mistress, and had
T5) Margaret Neville, illegit. (c.1455-1498) m. 1) Richard Huddleston of Blennerhasset (c.1440-1485), and had
T6) Joan Huddleston (c.1485-c.1538) m. Hugh Fleming of
Rydal Hall (d. 1557), and had
T7) Anthony Fleming, Heir of Rydal Hall m. Elizabeth Hutton, and had
T8) William Fleming of Rydal Hall (1535-1598) m. 2) Agnes Bindloss
(1564-1631), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00186178&tree=LEO
T9) Daniel Fleming of Skirwith Hall (d. 1621) m. Isabel Braithwaite (d. 1639), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00263637&tree=LEO
T10) William Fleming of Rydal Hall (c.1609-1653) m. Alice Kirkby (c.1608-1681, descended from Edward I), and had
T11) Sir Daniel Fleming of Rydal Hall (1633-1701) m. Barbara Fletcher (see LL13 below), and had
T12) Sir William Fleming, 1st Baronet of Rydal (1656-1736) m. Dorothy Rowlandson (1701-1757), and had
T13) Catherine Fleming (1732-1786) m. Sir Peter Leicester, 4th Baronet of Timogue (see G15 above)
U2) Lady Elizabeth of Lancaster, by 1st wife (1364-1425) m. 2) John Holland, 1st Duke of Exeter (c.1358-1400, descended from Edward I), and had
U3) Lady Constance Holland (1386-1437) m. 2) Sir John Grey of Badmondisfield Hall (c.1385-1439, descended from Edward I), and had
U4) Edmund Grey, 1st Earl of Kent (1416-1490) m. Lady Katherinre Percy (see H4 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00059129&tree=LEO
V2) John Beaufort, 1st Earl of Somerset, by 3rd wife (1373-1410) m. Lady Margaret Holland (1383-1439, descended from Edward I), and had
V3) Edmund Beaufort, 2nd Duke of Somerset (1406-1455) m. Lady Eleanor Beauchamp (1408-1467, descended from Edward I), and had
V4) Lady Margaret Beaufort (c.1437-1474) m. 1) Humphrey, Earl of Stafford (see J4 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00026562&tree=LEO
W2) Cardinal Henry Beaufort, by 3rd wife (1375-1447) = unknown mistress, and had
W3) Jane Beaufort, illegit. (c.1402-1479) m. Sir Edward Stradling of St Donats Castle (c.1389-1453), and had
W4) Sir Henry Stradling of St Donats Castle (c.1423-1476) m. Elizabeth ap Thomas, and had
W5) Thomas Stradling of St Donats Castle (c.1454-1480) m. Jennet Matthew (d. 1485), and had
W6) Siân Stradling (b. c.1480) m. Sir William Griffith of Penrhyn (c.1480-1531, descended from Edward I), and had a son W7 & 2 daus X7 & Z7 (see below)
W7) Sir Edward Griffith of Port Penrhyn (1511-1540) m. Jane Puleston, and had
W8) Ellen Griffith (d. 1573) m. Sir Nicholas Bagnall of Newry Castle (c.1510-1591), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00547626&tree=LEO [as dau of Sir Edward Griffith]
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00205316&tree=LEO [as mother of Frances Bagnall]
W9) Frances Bagnall m. Oliver Plunkett, 4th Baron Louth (d. 1607, descended from Edward I), and had
W10) Matthew Plunkett, 5th Baron Louth (d. 1629) m. Mary Fitzwilliam (d. by 1661, descended from Edward I), and had
W11) Hon. Elizabeth Plunkett m. Nicholas Gernon of Miltoun, and had
W12) Margaret Gernon m. William Fortescue of Newrath (see HH11 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00526815&tree=LEO
W13) Elizabeth Fortescue (c.1685-1762) m. John Foster of Dunleer (1665-1747), and had
W14) Anthony Foster of Collon House (1705-1779) m. 1) Elizabeth Burgh (1708-1744, descended from Edward I), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00597855&tree=LEO
W15) Rt Rev. William Foster, Bishop of Clogher (1744-1797) m. Catherina Letitia Leslie (see II15 below), and had
W16) Henrietta Foster (1785-1856) m. Jerome, 4th Count de Salis-Soglio (see C15 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00191895&tree=LEO
X7) Agnes Griffith (b. c.1508) m. Hugh Lewis, Heir of Presaddfed, and had
X8) John Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (c.1530-c.1573) m. Ellen ferch Huw (d. aft.1598), and had a son X9 & a dau Y9 (see below)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00630847&tree=LEO
X9) William Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. aft.1616) m. Ellen Morris, and had
X10) William Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. aft.1622) m. Sian Lloyd (descended from Henry IV), and had
X11) John Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (d. 1626) m. Ellen Williams (see Y10 below), and had
X12) Ellen Lewis m. John Wynn of Bodewryd (1617-1669), and had
X13) Edward Wynn of Bodewryd (c.1643-1681) m. Margaret Morgan (d. 1723), and had
X14) Ann Wynn (d. 1748) m. Robert Owen of Penhros (see AA13 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00422101&tree=LEO
X15) Hugh Owen of Penhros (d. 1742) m. Margaret Bold (descended from Henry IV), and had
X16) Margaret Owen (1742-1816) m. Sir John Thomas Stanley, 6th Baronet of Alderley Hall (1736-1807, descended from Edward I), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00060790&tree=LEO
X17) Louisa Margaretta Anne Stanley (1768-1842) m. Sir Baldwin Leighton, 6th Baronet of Wattlesborough (see A15 above)
Y9) Anne Lewis (d. aft.1625) m. 2) Rev. Arthur Williams of Meillionydd (see Z8 below), and had
Y10) Ellen Williams m. John Lewis of Chwaen-wen Uchaf (see X11 above)
Z7) Dorothy Griffith (c.1515-c.1585) m. 1) William Williams, Heir of Cochwillan Old Hall (c.1512-1557) ,and had a son Z8 & a dau AA8 (see below)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00249262&tree=LEO
Z8) Rev. Arthur Williams of Meillionydd (c.1540-1621) m. Anne Lewis (see Y9 above)
AA8) Jane Williams m. William Coytmore of Coetmore Hall, and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00249264&tree=LEO
AA9) Elin Coytmore (d. 1628) m. Richard ap Rowland Wynn of Penhesgyn Issa (d. 1606), and had
AA10) Rowland Wynn of Penhesgyn Issa m. Elsbeth Meyrick (descended from Edward I), and had
AA11) Margred Wynn (c.1607-1681) m. 1) Thomas Owen of Penhros, and had
AA12) John Owen of Penhros (c.1628-1712) m. Margaret Williams (d. 1720), and had
AA13) Robert Owen of Penhros (d. 1731) m. Ann Wynn (see X14 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00422100&tree=LEO
BB1) Edmund of Langley, 1st Duke of York (1341-1403) m. 1) Isabel of Castile (1355-1392), and had a son BB2 & a dau DD2 (see below)
BB2) Richard Plantagenet, 3rd Earl of Cambridge (1385-1415) m. 1) Lady Anne Mortimer (see JJ4 below), and had a son BB3 & a dau CC3 (see below)
BB3) Richard Plantagenet, 3rd Duke of York (1411-1460) m. Lady Cecily Neville (see B3 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00001703&tree=LEO
CC3) Lady Isabel Plantagenet (1409-1484) m. 2) Henry Bourchier, 1st Earl of Essex (see FF3 below), and had
CC4) William, Lord Bourchier (c.1428-1477) m. 2) Lady Anne Woodville (c.1448-1489), and had
CC5) Cecily Bourchier (c.1473-by1493) m. John Devereux, 2nd Lord Ferrers of Chartley (1464-1501, descended from Edward I), and had
CC6) Walter Devereux, 1st Viscount Hereford (c.1491-1558) m. 2) Margaret Garneys (d. 1599), and had
CC7) Sir Edward Devereux, 1st Baronet of Castle Bromwich (c.1550-1622) m. Katherine Arden (see P9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00194798&tree=LEO
DD2) Lady Constance Plantagenet (c.1375-1416) m. Thomas Despenser, Earl of Gloucester (1373-1400, descended from Edward I), and had
DD3) Lady Isabel Despenser (1400-1439) m. 1) Richard Beauchamp, Earl of Worcester (1397-1422, descended from Edward I), and had
DD4) Lady Elizabeth Beauchamp (1415-1448) m. Edward Neville, 3rd Lord Abergavenny (see K3 above), and had a son (see K4 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00037943&tree=LEO
EE1) Thomas of Woodstock, 1st Duke of Gloucester (1355-1397) m. Lady Eleanor de Bohun (1366-1399, descended from Edward I), and had
EE2) Anne Plantagenet, Countess of Buckingham (1383-1438) m. three times, and had 4 sons EE3, FF3, GG3 & HH3 (see below)
EE3) Humphrey Stafford, 1st Duke of Buckingham, by 2nd husband (1402-1480) m. Lady Anne Neville (see J3 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00026559&tree=LEO
FF3) Henry Bourchier, 1st Earl of Essex, by 3rd husband (1404-1483) m. Lady Isabel Plantagenet (see CC3 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00108530&tree=LEO
GG3) John Bourchier, 1st Lord Berners, by 3rd husband (c.1411-1474) m. Margery Berners (1409-1475), and had
GG4) Joan Bourchier (c.1448-1470) m. Sir Henry Neville, Heir of Latimer (see N4 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00057785&tree=LEO
HH3) William Bourchier, 9th Lord FitzWarin, by 3rd husband (c.1409-1469) m. Thomasine Hankford (1423-1453), and had
HH4) Fulk Bourchier, 10th Lord FitzWarin (1445-1479) m. Elizabeth Dinham (c.1450-1516), and had
HH5) John Bourchier, 1st Earl of Bath (1470-1539) m. 1) Cecily Daubeney (b. c.1477), and had
HH6) Lady Elizabeth Bourchier (d. 1548) m. Edward Chichester of Hounditon (c.1496-1522), and had
HH7) Sir John Chichester of Raleigh (c.1520-1568) m. Gertrude Courtenay (1521-1566, descended from Edward I), and had
HH8) Susannah Chichester m. John Fortescue of Buckland Filleigh (c.1551-1604), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00325795&tree=LEO [as dau of Sir John Chichester]
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00526809&tree=LEO [as mother of Sir Faithful Fortescue]
HH9) Sir Faithful Fortescue of Dromiskin Castle (1586-1666) m. 1) Hon. Anne Moore (c.1592-1634), and had a son HH10 & a dau II10 (see below)
HH10) Sir Thomas Fortescue of Dromiskin Castle (1620-1710) m. 1) Sydney Kingsmill (descended from Edward I), and had
HH11) William Fortescue of Newrath (c.1647-1734) m. Margaret Gernon (see W12 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00526814&tree=LEO
II10) Letitia Fortescue (d. 1684) m. Sir Thomas Meredith of Drogheda (c.1595-1676), and had
II11) Charles Meredith of Newtown (by1639-1710) m. 2) Judith Savage (d. 1738), and had
II12) Thomas Meredith of Newtown (by1682-1732) m. Catherine Baldwin, and had
II13) Very Rev. Charles Meredith, dean of Ardfert (c.1707-1747) m. Letitia Vesey (d. 1756, descended from Edward I), and had
II14) Catherine Meredith m. Rev Dr. Henry Leslie of Ballibay House (1719-1803), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00597861&tree=LEO
II15) Catherina Letitia Leslie (d. 1814) m. Rt Rev. William Foster, Bishop of Clogher (see W15 above)
JJ1) Lionel of Antwerp, Duke of Clarence (1338-1368) m. 1) Elizabeth Burgh (1332-1363, descended from Edward I), and had
JJ2) Philippa of Clarence (1355-1377) m. Edmund Mortimer, 3rd Earl of
March (1352-1381), and had a son JJ3 & a dau KK3 (see below)
JJ3) Roger Mortimer, 4th Earl of March (1374-1398) m. Alianore Holland (1370-1405, descended from Edward I), and had
JJ4) Lady Anne Mortimer (1388-1411) m. Richard of York, 3rd Earl of Cambridge (see BB2 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00001700&tree=LEO
KK3) Lady Elizabeth Mortimer (1371-1417) m. 1) Sir Henry 'Hotspur' Percy
(1364-1403), and had a son KK4, & a dau LL4 (see below)
KK4) Henry Percy, 2nd Earl of Northumberland (1394-1455) m. Lady Eleanor Neville (see D3 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00015423&tree=LEO
LL4) Elizabeth Percy (c.1395-1437) m. 1) John, 7th Lord Clifford (1388-1422, descended from Edward I), and had
LL5) Thomas, 8th Lord Clifford (1414-1455) m. Joan Dacre (c.1417-c.1452, descended from Edward I), and had
LL6) John, 9th Lord Clifford (1435-1461) m. Margaret Bromflete (c.1436-1493), and had
LL7) Henry, 10th Lord Clifford (1454-1523) m. 1) Anne St John (d. 1508), and had
LL8) Anne Clifford (c.1496-bef.1546) m. 1) Robert Clifton of Clifton (d. 1517), and had
LL9) Dorothy Clifton (b. 1517) m. Christopher Pickering of Cleasby (d. by 1567, descended from Edward I), and had
LL10) Winifred Pickering (d. 1589) m. Henry Crackenthorpe of Newbiggin Hall (d. 1593), and had
LL11) Barbara Crackenthorpe (b. 1582) m. Sir Richard Fletcher of Hutton le Forest (d. 1637), and had
LL12) Sir Henry Fletcher, 1st Baronet of Hutton le Forest (c.1605-1645) m. Katherine Dalston (1606-1676), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00569546&tree=LEO
LL13) Barbara Fletcher (1634-1675) m. Sir Daniel Fleming of Rydal Hall (see T11 above)
Cheers, ------Brad
jhigg...@yahoo.com
Apr 4, 2014, 8:21:02 PM4/4/14
to
On Thursday, April 3, 2014 1:09:40 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
>
> **If John Bold of Beaumaris can be shown to be a descendant of Sir Henry Bold of Bold Hall (d. by 1497) & Dulcia Savage, then he has at least one line of descent from Edward I. Among the Dinham Hall manuscripts at Bangor University is "an account of the descent of John Bold of Beaumaris, father of the 'seven pretty Peggies'":
>
> http://www.archiveswales.org.uk/anw/get_collection.php?inst_id=39&coll_id=10487&expand=
>
> This is likely the only source that provides John Bold's ancestry, as I can find nothing about it online.
>
>
>
> Cheers, ----Brad
>
> **If John Bold of Beaumaris can be shown to be a descendant of Sir Henry Bold of Bold Hall (d. by 1497) & Dulcia Savage, then he has at least one line of descent from Edward I. Among the Dinham Hall manuscripts at Bangor University is "an account of the descent of John Bold of Beaumaris, father of the 'seven pretty Peggies'":
>
> http://www.archiveswales.org.uk/anw/get_collection.php?inst_id=39&coll_id=10487&expand=
>
> This is likely the only source that provides John Bold's ancestry, as I can find nothing about it online.
>
>
>
Although it's possible that John Bold of Meaumarais is descended from Sir Henry Bold of Bold (d. ca. 1496), I think it's unlikely - because there's another Bold family which is more likely, but definitely not confirmed, to be ancestral to John Bold.
J. E. Griffiths, on p. 159 of his "Pedigrees of Anglesey and Carnarvonshire Families" (1914) pr4sents a pedigree of a Bold family of Carnarvonshire which he does in fact trace back to Sir Richard Bold of Bold and his wife Margaret Butler of Bewsey. Sir Richard Bold here is known from other pedigrees to be son of Sir Henry Bold and his wife Dulcia (or Alice) Savage - much discussed in this group. The Carnarvonshire family is said to descend from Sir Robert Bold, a son of Sir Richard Bold and Margaret Butler. But a detailed Bold pedigree in vol. 5 of Croston's edition of Baines' History of Lancashire does not give a son Robert to this couple. This omission, along with other points of confusion in the early generations of the Griffiths Bold pedigree, causes me to doubt the stated connection of Bold of Carnarvonshire to Bold of Bold.
Anyway, regardless of the validity of this connection, Griffiths was unable to connect John Bold of Beaumarais to the Bolds of Carnarvonshire. He gives a pedigree on the same page showing the descendants of John Bold, buts adds a footnote as follows:
"I have been unable to make a satisfactory connection between these Bolds [i.e., John Bold of Beaumarais and descendants] and the Bolds of of Carnarvon and Tre'rddol, but there is no doubt they are of the same family."
The phrase "no doubt" may be a bit strong, but it does seem likely that John Bold of Beaumarais is more immediately connected to this Bold family rather than Bold of Bold. The document you describe from Bangor University might well shed some light on this. (BTW the document's description slightly misidentifies John Bold - he was the father of ONE OF "the seven pretty Peggies")
IIRC the possible Edward I descent of the descendants of Sir Henry Bold of Bold comes from his wife Dulcia (or Alice) Savage - and the descent depends on which John Savage was her father: John Savage who married Elinor Brereton, or his son John who married Katherine Stanley (who brings the Edward I descent). I know this parentage has been discussed many times in this group, but I don't recall that a conclusion was reached. Am I missing something?
John Higgins
Brad Verity
Apr 5, 2014, 11:22:40 AM4/5/14
to
On Friday, April 4, 2014 5:21:02 PM UTC-7, jhigg...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Although it's possible that John Bold of Meaumarais is descended from Sir Henry Bold of Bold (d. ca. 1496), I think it's unlikely - because there's another Bold family which is more likely, but definitely not confirmed, to be ancestral to John Bold.
Thank you very much for looking into this further, John.
> Although it's possible that John Bold of Meaumarais is descended from Sir Henry Bold of Bold (d. ca. 1496), I think it's unlikely - because there's another Bold family which is more likely, but definitely not confirmed, to be ancestral to John Bold.
> J. E. Griffiths, on p. 159 of his "Pedigrees of Anglesey and Carnarvonshire Families" (1914) pr4sents a pedigree of a Bold family of Carnarvonshire which he does in fact trace back to Sir Richard Bold of Bold and his wife Margaret Butler of Bewsey. Sir Richard Bold here is known from other pedigrees to be son of Sir Henry Bold and his wife Dulcia (or Alice) Savage - much discussed in this group.
>The Carnarvonshire family is said to descend from Sir Robert Bold, a son of Sir Richard Bold and Margaret Butler. But a detailed Bold pedigree in vol. 5 of Croston's edition of Baines' History of Lancashire does not give a son Robert to this couple. This omission, along with other points of confusion in the early generations of the Griffiths Bold pedigree, causes me to doubt the stated connection of Bold of Carnarvonshire to Bold of Bold.
> Anyway, regardless of the validity of this connection, Griffiths was unable to connect John Bold of Beaumarais to the Bolds of Carnarvonshire. He gives a pedigree on the same page showing the descendants of John Bold, buts adds a footnote as follows:
> "I have been unable to make a satisfactory connection between these Bolds [i.e., John Bold of Beaumarais and descendants] and the Bolds of of Carnarvon and Tre'rddol, but there is no doubt they are of the same family."
> The phrase "no doubt" may be a bit strong, but it does seem likely that John Bold of Beaumarais is more immediately connected to this Bold family rather than Bold of Bold. The document you describe from Bangor University might well shed some light on this. (BTW the document's description slightly misidentifies John Bold - he was the father of ONE OF "the seven pretty Peggies")
> IIRC the possible Edward I descent of the descendants of Sir Henry Bold of Bold comes from his wife Dulcia (or Alice) Savage - and the descent depends on which John Savage was her father: John Savage who married Elinor Brereton, or his son John who married Katherine Stanley (who brings the Edward I descent). I know this parentage has been discussed many times in this group, but I don't recall that a conclusion was reached. Am I missing something?
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/soc.genealogy.medieval/IdbjvoXpemI/PuGa3rRUy4YJ
In it, Dulcia is described as daughter of John Savage, esquire. In 1464, this would have to have been Sir John Savage (c.1423-1495), husband of Katherine Stanley, who was not knighted until the 1470s. Also, his father Sir John Stanley, husband of Eleanor Brereton, had died in July 1463, and the marriage settlement doesn't describe Dulcia's father as a knight or as deceased. So it can be said now with a good degree of certainty that Dulcia Savage, wife of Sir Henry Bold, was the daughter of Sir John Savage and Katherine Stanley (descended from Edward I).
If we estimate Dulcia to have been about twenty in 1464 at her marriage settlement, then she was born around the year 1445. But she may have been a few years younger, as her son and heir Sir Richard Bold wasn't born until 1472, so perhaps she was born closer to 1450. At any rate, Dulcia Savage was definitely one of the elder daughters, if not the eldest, of her parents. Her sister Margaret Savage had borne three children to first husband John Honford by his death in 1478, so was likely the sister closest in age to Dulcia. Also near them in age was their sister Ellen Savage, who married Sir Peter Legh of Lyme in 1467, three years after Dulcia's marriage settlement. I don't have enough dates for the other sisters to estimate birthdates for them, except for Katherine Savage, who did not marry Thomas Legh of Adlington until 1479, so was likely several years younger than Dulcia, Margaret and Ellen.
Thanks & Cheers, -----Brad
jhigg...@yahoo.com
Apr 5, 2014, 1:18:27 PM4/5/14
to
On Saturday, April 5, 2014 8:22:40 AM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
>
> Is the Bold pedigree from Baines' History of Lancashire available for view online? I'd love to see it. I agree that the omission of a son Sir Robert Bold from the Lancashire pedigree, makes the descent of the Carnarvonshire Bolds from the Lancashire family problematic.
>
>
> Thanks & Cheers, -----Brad
>
> Is the Bold pedigree from Baines' History of Lancashire available for view online? I'd love to see it. I agree that the omission of a son Sir Robert Bold from the Lancashire pedigree, makes the descent of the Carnarvonshire Bolds from the Lancashire family problematic.
>
>
Volume 5 of Croston's edition of Baines' History of Lancaster is available on Google Books but not at the Internet Archive AFAIK (although volumes 1 and 3 are there). I'll email you a copy of the Bold pedigree from Croston, as well as the Bold pedigree from the Griffith work.
al...@mindspring.com
Apr 5, 2014, 4:01:39 PM4/5/14
to
Brad you may want to look at VCH Lancashire, Vol. III, (1907), p 402-409 as well for more on Bold of Bold.
Doug Smith
Doug Smith
al...@mindspring.com
Apr 5, 2014, 4:24:29 PM4/5/14
to
You can see some of the pedigree that includes Richard Bold (of of Plâs-y-Bowld, Caergwrle, Yr Hôb, Flintshire, Wales) married to Margery Butler at https://histfam.familysearch.org//familygroup.php?familyID=F7160&tree=Welsh. They have combined from several Welsh sources and made notes.
Just giving rough dates this Richard appears to occur about 100 years or so earlier than the Richard Bold who married Margaret Boteler. There also appears to be a daughter Maud alleged to have married Richard Sherborne in both the Welsh and the Bold of Bold lines. There appears to be a lot of confusion here.
Doug Smith
Just giving rough dates this Richard appears to occur about 100 years or so earlier than the Richard Bold who married Margaret Boteler. There also appears to be a daughter Maud alleged to have married Richard Sherborne in both the Welsh and the Bold of Bold lines. There appears to be a lot of confusion here.
Doug Smith
Brad Verity
Apr 5, 2014, 6:27:01 PM4/5/14
to
On Saturday, April 5, 2014 1:24:29 PM UTC-7, al...@mindspring.com wrote:
> You can see some of the pedigree that includes Richard Bold (of of Plâs-y-Bowld, Caergwrle, Yr Hôb, Flintshire, Wales) married to Margery Butler at https://histfam.familysearch.org//familygroup.php?familyID=F7160&tree=Welsh. They have combined from several Welsh sources and made notes.
> Just giving rough dates this Richard appears to occur about 100 years or so earlier than the Richard Bold who married Margaret Boteler. There also appears to be a daughter Maud alleged to have married Richard Sherborne in both the Welsh and the Bold of Bold lines. There appears to be a lot of confusion here.
Thanks, Doug. John Higgins sent me off list the Bold of Bold Hall pedigree from Baines's 'History of Lancashire' and the Griffith's Bold pedigree from 'Pedigrees of Anglesey and Carnarvonshire Families'.
> You can see some of the pedigree that includes Richard Bold (of of Plâs-y-Bowld, Caergwrle, Yr Hôb, Flintshire, Wales) married to Margery Butler at https://histfam.familysearch.org//familygroup.php?familyID=F7160&tree=Welsh. They have combined from several Welsh sources and made notes.
> Just giving rough dates this Richard appears to occur about 100 years or so earlier than the Richard Bold who married Margaret Boteler. There also appears to be a daughter Maud alleged to have married Richard Sherborne in both the Welsh and the Bold of Bold lines. There appears to be a lot of confusion here.
Griffith begins his pedigree with Sir Richard Bold & Margery Boteler, and accurately gives them a daughter Maud Bold, wife of Sir Richard Sherborn of Stonyhurst Hall, in addition to a son Sir Robert Bold, grandfather of Sir Harri Bold, constable of Conway Castle, 1461-68. But Sir Richard Bold, husband of Margery Boteler, was born in 1472 and died in 1528, and his daughter Maud died in 1588, per the HOP bio of her husband Sir Richard Sherborn, here:
http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1509-1558/member/sherborn-sir-richard-1522-94
It is obvious (once you put in the dates for Maud Bold Sherborn, which Griffith did not) that she could not be the great-aunt of a Sir Harry Bold who was constable of Conway Castle 1461-68.
It seems Griffith confused two Richard Bolds with wives named Margery. The one he wanted, the one whom these Bolds of Carnarvon descend from, whom he said was living circa 1300-50, was the earlier Richard Bold married to Margery Mobberley, whom Baines, in his pedigree of Bold of Bold Hall, has living in 1337. Baines has a Robert Bold of Farnley Hall as a younger brother, not a younger son, of this Richard Bold, but it definitely seems that it was in the 14th-century, not the 15th or early 16th-century, that these Bolds of Carnarvon branched off from the Lancashire Bolds of Bold Hall.
There may be more to find out about Sir Harry Bold of Conway Castle in the Patent Rolls from the reign of Edward IV. But as he doesn't descend from Edward I, he falls outside the scope of my research.
Cheers, ----Brad
Brad Verity
Apr 6, 2014, 1:23:03 PM4/6/14
to
On Thursday, April 3, 2014 8:37:39 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> C9) Francis Fane, 1st Earl of Westmorland (1584-1629) m. Mary Mildmay (c.1582-1640), and had
> C10) Hon. George Fane of Basildon House (c.1616-1663) m. Dorothy Horsey (see N11 below), and had
> C11) Sir Henry Fane of Basildon House (c.1650-1706) m. Elizabeth Southcote (1651-1724), and had
> C12) Charles, 1st Viscount Fane (1676-1744) m. Mary Stanhope (1686-1762, descended from Edward I), and had
Many thanks to Leo for pointing out a discrepancy to the above in Ruvigny, which I had meant to comment on in the original post and forgot.
> C9) Francis Fane, 1st Earl of Westmorland (1584-1629) m. Mary Mildmay (c.1582-1640), and had
> C10) Hon. George Fane of Basildon House (c.1616-1663) m. Dorothy Horsey (see N11 below), and had
> C11) Sir Henry Fane of Basildon House (c.1650-1706) m. Elizabeth Southcote (1651-1724), and had
> C12) Charles, 1st Viscount Fane (1676-1744) m. Mary Stanhope (1686-1762, descended from Edward I), and had
In the Anne of Exeter volume in his Plantagenet Roll series, in Table XXV (p. 28), Ruvigny has "Sir Henry Fane, K.B., P.C., M.P. d. 1706" (Generation C11 above), as the second son of "Hon. Sir Francis Fane, K.B. = Elizabeth, Lady Darcy, nee West". Hon. Sir Francis Fane, in Table XXIV on the preceding page, is shown to be the second son of Francis Fane, 1st Earl of Westmorland (Generation C9 above).
Ruvigny is in error here. He made Sir Henry Fane's father the wrong son of the 1st Earl of Westmorland. For it was not Hon. Sir Francis Fane, but his younger brother, Hon. George Fane (Generation C10 above) who was in reality the father of Sir Henry Fane. Ruvigny also has George Fane in his Table XXIV, married to Dorothy Horsey, and with a "?" as to whether they had any issue. They did - they had a son Sir Henry Fane, and a daughter who died unmarried.
Sir Henry Fane has a bio in HOP, here:
http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1660-1690/member/fane-sir-henry-1650-1706
And his father Hon. George Fane has a bio in HOP, here:
http://www.historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1660-1690/member/fane-%28vane%29-hon-george-1616-63
Cheers, -----Brad
jhigg...@yahoo.com
Apr 6, 2014, 7:06:48 PM4/6/14
to
On Saturday, April 5, 2014 8:22:40 AM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
corbyguy
Apr 8, 2014, 4:24:09 PM4/8/14
to
wrote in message
news:67ceb44f-268f-4aaf...@googlegroups.com...
the Bold family of Bold by chance were ancestral of the Bold family that
lived in Fazakerley in the early 1800's? I wonder if there is a connection.
I have a Thomas Bold born early 1800's supposedly in Fazakerley who married
an Elizabeth Howard. I have not been able to find the baptism for Thomas as
i believe that he was Roman Catholic and the registers haven't survived
preceding this time period.
Jamie
jhigg...@yahoo.com
Apr 8, 2014, 6:31:59 PM4/8/14
to
Peter Bold of Bold, an MP who died in 1762 was the last male-line representative of the family. He died leaving 6 daughters as co-heirs - no sons. The four generations before him in the male line each appear to have had only a single surviving son, so there are no junior lines to follow that might lead to your Thomas.
Aside from pedigree mentioned above, there is a good discussion of the family of Bold of Bold and particularly the descent of the estate in VCH Lancashire 3:403-406, available at the Internet Archive and also here:
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/source.aspx?pubid=289&page=2
jhigg...@yahoo.com
Apr 8, 2014, 7:02:35 PM4/8/14
to
Expanding upon Brad's lengthy list, I can provide two additional Edward III descents for Alison Trappes-Lomax - both through her mother Marjory Emily Morse, for whom no such descents had previously been noted.
John Beaufort, 1st Earl of Somerset [V2 in Bard's part 2 post] and his wife Margaret Holand had a daughter MM3
MM3. Joan Beaufort (d. 15.VII.1445); m. (1) James I, K. of Scotland (before 1.VIII.1394-21.II.1437)
MM4. James II, K. of Scotland (16.X.1430-3.VIII.1460); m. 2.VII.1449 Marie of Geldern
MM5. Mary Stewart (b. 1451, d. V.1488); m. (2) before IV.1474 (his 2nd) James Hamilton, 1st Lord Hamilton (d. 16.XI.1479)
MM6. Elizabeth Hamilton (d. after IV.1531); m. contract 9.IV.1494 (his 2nd) Matthew Stuart, 11th Earl of Lennox (d. 9.IX.1513)
MM7. Margaret Stewart; m. (1) before 13.II.1508/9 (his 2nd of 3) (div. before 25.X.1515) John Fleming, 2nd Lord Fleming (d. 1.XI.1524)
MM8. Margaret Fleming; m. ca. 24.XI.1529 (his 1st of 3) Patrick Murray of Falahill, Laird of Philiphaugh (d. 1577)
MM9. Katherine Murray (b. after 1529, d. after 22.V.1594); m. 1552 (his 2nd) James Somerville, 3rd of Cambusnethan (b. ca. 1520, d. 1594)
MM10. Nicholas/Nicola Somerville; m. contract 13.IV.1582 Walter Stewart, 1st Lord Blantyre (d. 8.III.1617)
MM11. William Stewart, 2nd Lord Blantyre (d. 29.XI.1638); m. Helen Scott of Ardross [see NN12 below]
MM12. Margaret Stewart (d. 1662); m. contract XII.1644/I.1645 (his 1st) John Swinton, 23rd of that Ilk (d. 1679)
MM13. John Swinton, 25th of that Ilk (d. 1723); m. (1) Sarah Welch of London
MM14. Frances Swinton; m. Rev. Henry Veitch, minister of Swinton, Berwickshire
MM15. John Veitch; m. Elizabeth Gardiner [or Gardener]
MM16. Hugh Veitch of Stewartfield; m. Mary Robertson of Prenderguest (b. 4.X.1786, d. 11.X.1870)
MM17. Rachel Mackerras Veitch (b. 29.II.1820, d. 21.III.1879); m. 20.VIII.1839 John Haig of Cameron Bridge ***
MM18. William Henry Haig of Cameron Bridge (b. 3.II.1842, d. 5.VII.1884); m. 6.VI.1871 Emily Martha Newman (d. 17.III.1929)
MM19. Annabel Marjory Haig (d. 30.VII.1955); m. 14.IX.1898 Arthur Francis Morse (b. 10.IV.1872, d. 4.V.1959)
MM20. Marjory Emily Morse (b. 21.I.1900); m. 10.IX.1924 George Algernon Perkins of Bure House, Lamas, Norfolk
MM21. Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 8.VIII.1926); m. 25.XI.1952 Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax
*** The youngest child of the couple at MM17 was Field-Marshall Sir Douglas Haig, 1st Earl Haig - the controversial British commander in WWI.
NN10. Helen Somerville of Cambusnethan; m. 1577 Sir John Skene of Curriehill (d. 1617)
NN11. Jean Skene of Curriehill; m. (his 3rd) Sir William Scott of Ardross (d. 1628 aged 82)
NN12. Helen Scott of Ardross; m. William Stewart, 2nd Lord Blantyre [see MM11 above]
The family of Haig mentioned above is covered extensively (under Haig of Bemersyde and associated families) in Burke's Landed Gentry. Tracing that family back would suggest that there's an additional Edward III descent here, but there's a problem with the line.
The supposed line is as follows:
OO3. [same as MM3] Joan Beaufort (d. 15.VII.1445); m. (2) before 21.IX.1439 James Stewart, "the Black Knight of Lorn"
OO4. James Stewart, 1st Earl of Buchan (d. 1497-1500); (unm.) Margaret Murray
OO5. Elizabeth Stewart; m. (1) 1507 Mungo Home of Ersiltoun (d. 1513)
OO6. Isobel Home; m. William Haig, 13th of Bemersyde (d. 9.IX.1513, battle of Flodden)
OO7. Robert Haig, 14th of Bemersyde; m. Barbara Spottiswoode
OO8. Andrew Haig, 15th of Bemersyde (d. 1583); m. [3 times]
OO9. Robert Haig, 16th of Bemersyde (d. 1602); m. ca. 1565 Margaret Kerr of Faldonsyde
OO10. James Haig, 17th of Bemersyde; m. Elizabeth McDougal of Stodrig
OO11. Robert Haig of St. Ninians, Stirlingshire (d. VI.1664); m. Elspeth Abercromby
OO12. John Haig of Orchard Farm; m. (1) 1.III.1660 Isobel Ramsay of Alloa
OO13. George Haig of Newbigging (b. 27.VIII.1662); m. 22.III.1684 Janet Anderson of Alloa
OO14. James Haig of Alloa (b. 30.III.1691); m. 7.VIII.1718 Mary Mackenzie of Alloa
OO15. John Haig of The Gartlands, Clackmannanshire (b. 9.IX.1720, d. 24.VIII.1773); m. 11.II.1751 Margaret Stein of Kennetpan
OO16. William Haig of Seggie, Fifeshire (b. 7.III.1771, d. 1847); m. 13.X.1794 Janet Stein of Kennetpan
OO17. John Haig of Cameron Bridge, Fifeshire (b. 24.X.1802, d. 20.III.1878); m. 20.VIII.1839 Rachel Mackerras Veitch of Stewartfield [see MM17 above}
The problem in the line is at OO6 - Isobel Home. Although SP and various Burke's publications indicate that Isobel is the daughter of Mungo Home of Ersiltoun and Elizabeth Stewart, Brad Verity has pointed out (in an offline exchange of posts) that this is chronologically impossible. If Isobel is indeed of this particular Home family, she is probably the sister, rather than the daughter, of Mungo Home - and thus loses the Edward III descent.
John Beaufort, 1st Earl of Somerset [V2 in Bard's part 2 post] and his wife Margaret Holand had a daughter MM3
MM3. Joan Beaufort (d. 15.VII.1445); m. (1) James I, K. of Scotland (before 1.VIII.1394-21.II.1437)
MM4. James II, K. of Scotland (16.X.1430-3.VIII.1460); m. 2.VII.1449 Marie of Geldern
MM5. Mary Stewart (b. 1451, d. V.1488); m. (2) before IV.1474 (his 2nd) James Hamilton, 1st Lord Hamilton (d. 16.XI.1479)
MM6. Elizabeth Hamilton (d. after IV.1531); m. contract 9.IV.1494 (his 2nd) Matthew Stuart, 11th Earl of Lennox (d. 9.IX.1513)
MM7. Margaret Stewart; m. (1) before 13.II.1508/9 (his 2nd of 3) (div. before 25.X.1515) John Fleming, 2nd Lord Fleming (d. 1.XI.1524)
MM8. Margaret Fleming; m. ca. 24.XI.1529 (his 1st of 3) Patrick Murray of Falahill, Laird of Philiphaugh (d. 1577)
MM9. Katherine Murray (b. after 1529, d. after 22.V.1594); m. 1552 (his 2nd) James Somerville, 3rd of Cambusnethan (b. ca. 1520, d. 1594)
MM10. Nicholas/Nicola Somerville; m. contract 13.IV.1582 Walter Stewart, 1st Lord Blantyre (d. 8.III.1617)
MM11. William Stewart, 2nd Lord Blantyre (d. 29.XI.1638); m. Helen Scott of Ardross [see NN12 below]
MM12. Margaret Stewart (d. 1662); m. contract XII.1644/I.1645 (his 1st) John Swinton, 23rd of that Ilk (d. 1679)
MM13. John Swinton, 25th of that Ilk (d. 1723); m. (1) Sarah Welch of London
MM14. Frances Swinton; m. Rev. Henry Veitch, minister of Swinton, Berwickshire
MM15. John Veitch; m. Elizabeth Gardiner [or Gardener]
MM16. Hugh Veitch of Stewartfield; m. Mary Robertson of Prenderguest (b. 4.X.1786, d. 11.X.1870)
MM17. Rachel Mackerras Veitch (b. 29.II.1820, d. 21.III.1879); m. 20.VIII.1839 John Haig of Cameron Bridge ***
MM18. William Henry Haig of Cameron Bridge (b. 3.II.1842, d. 5.VII.1884); m. 6.VI.1871 Emily Martha Newman (d. 17.III.1929)
MM19. Annabel Marjory Haig (d. 30.VII.1955); m. 14.IX.1898 Arthur Francis Morse (b. 10.IV.1872, d. 4.V.1959)
MM20. Marjory Emily Morse (b. 21.I.1900); m. 10.IX.1924 George Algernon Perkins of Bure House, Lamas, Norfolk
MM21. Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 8.VIII.1926); m. 25.XI.1952 Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax
*** The youngest child of the couple at MM17 was Field-Marshall Sir Douglas Haig, 1st Earl Haig - the controversial British commander in WWI.
NN10. Helen Somerville of Cambusnethan; m. 1577 Sir John Skene of Curriehill (d. 1617)
NN11. Jean Skene of Curriehill; m. (his 3rd) Sir William Scott of Ardross (d. 1628 aged 82)
NN12. Helen Scott of Ardross; m. William Stewart, 2nd Lord Blantyre [see MM11 above]
The family of Haig mentioned above is covered extensively (under Haig of Bemersyde and associated families) in Burke's Landed Gentry. Tracing that family back would suggest that there's an additional Edward III descent here, but there's a problem with the line.
The supposed line is as follows:
OO3. [same as MM3] Joan Beaufort (d. 15.VII.1445); m. (2) before 21.IX.1439 James Stewart, "the Black Knight of Lorn"
OO4. James Stewart, 1st Earl of Buchan (d. 1497-1500); (unm.) Margaret Murray
OO5. Elizabeth Stewart; m. (1) 1507 Mungo Home of Ersiltoun (d. 1513)
OO6. Isobel Home; m. William Haig, 13th of Bemersyde (d. 9.IX.1513, battle of Flodden)
OO7. Robert Haig, 14th of Bemersyde; m. Barbara Spottiswoode
OO8. Andrew Haig, 15th of Bemersyde (d. 1583); m. [3 times]
OO9. Robert Haig, 16th of Bemersyde (d. 1602); m. ca. 1565 Margaret Kerr of Faldonsyde
OO10. James Haig, 17th of Bemersyde; m. Elizabeth McDougal of Stodrig
OO11. Robert Haig of St. Ninians, Stirlingshire (d. VI.1664); m. Elspeth Abercromby
OO12. John Haig of Orchard Farm; m. (1) 1.III.1660 Isobel Ramsay of Alloa
OO13. George Haig of Newbigging (b. 27.VIII.1662); m. 22.III.1684 Janet Anderson of Alloa
OO14. James Haig of Alloa (b. 30.III.1691); m. 7.VIII.1718 Mary Mackenzie of Alloa
OO15. John Haig of The Gartlands, Clackmannanshire (b. 9.IX.1720, d. 24.VIII.1773); m. 11.II.1751 Margaret Stein of Kennetpan
OO16. William Haig of Seggie, Fifeshire (b. 7.III.1771, d. 1847); m. 13.X.1794 Janet Stein of Kennetpan
OO17. John Haig of Cameron Bridge, Fifeshire (b. 24.X.1802, d. 20.III.1878); m. 20.VIII.1839 Rachel Mackerras Veitch of Stewartfield [see MM17 above}
The problem in the line is at OO6 - Isobel Home. Although SP and various Burke's publications indicate that Isobel is the daughter of Mungo Home of Ersiltoun and Elizabeth Stewart, Brad Verity has pointed out (in an offline exchange of posts) that this is chronologically impossible. If Isobel is indeed of this particular Home family, she is probably the sister, rather than the daughter, of Mungo Home - and thus loses the Edward III descent.
PDel...@aol.com
Apr 9, 2014, 3:52:13 AM4/9/14
to jhigg...@yahoo.com, gen-me...@rootsweb.com
I just wonder if Noel Coward can boast a similar ancestry? His mother was a
Veitch (v MM16), of a palpably more advantaged background than his father.
PG
In a message dated 09/04/2014 00:13:04 GMT Daylight Time,
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Veitch (v MM16), of a palpably more advantaged background than his father.
PG
In a message dated 09/04/2014 00:13:04 GMT Daylight Time,
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jhigg...@yahoo.com
Apr 10, 2014, 12:57:36 PM4/10/14
to
Brad Verity
Apr 20, 2014, 5:01:35 PM4/20/14
to
On Tuesday, April 8, 2014 4:02:35 PM UTC-7, jhigg...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Expanding upon Brad's lengthy list, I can provide two additional Edward III descents for Alison Trappes-Lomax - both through her mother Marjory Emily Morse, for whom no such descents had previously been noted.
I initially posted the Henry IV and Edward III descents for Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax through her paternal grandmother, Meriel Gundrede Leighton. Alison's paternal grandfather Algernon Edward Perkins does not have Edward III lines in his ancestry.
John Higgins then added that there were Edward III lines behind Alison's maternal grandmother Annabel Marjory Haig. Though the two lines which he initially posted turn out not to be applicable to Alison, one other line (and probably another) for Annabel Haig does go back to Edward III, with these lines also being in the ancestry of Sir Noel Coward.
It turns out there are also many Edward III lines behind Alison's maternal grandfather Arthur Francis Morse, the husband of Annabel Haig. Arthur Francis Morse of The Mead, Coltishall, Norfolk, was born 10 April 1872 at Aylsham, Norfolk, and died 4 May 1959 at The Mead. He married 14 September 1898, Annabel Marjorie Haig (born 30 July 1873 at Cameron Bridge House, Markinch, Fifeshire, Scotland; died 30 July 1955 at The Mead).
First up are Arthur Morse's twelve lines of descent from James IV of Scotland, with links to the most recent individuals in Leo's database for each.
James IV of Scotland had, by three different mistresses, three daughters A1, F1 & H1 (see below):
A1) Lady Janet Stewart, illegit. (c.1508-by1563) m. Malcolm, 3rd Lord Fleming (c.1494-1547), and had a son A2 & 3 daus B2, D2 & E2 (see below)
A2) James, 4th Lord Fleming (1535-1558) m. Lady Barbara Hamilton (see F3 below), and had
A3) Jean Fleming (1554-1609) m. 1) John, 1st Lord Maitland of Thirlestane (1543-1595), and had
A4) John Maitland, 1st Earl of Lauderdale (1594-1645) m. Lady Isabel Seton (1594-1638, descended from James I), and had
A5) Charles Maitland, 3rd Earl of Lauderdale (1620-1691) m. Elizabeth Lauder, and had
A6) John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale (c.1655-1710) m. Lady Margaret Cunningham (c.1662-1742, descended from James II), and had
A7) Charles Maitland, 6th Earl of Lauderdale (1688-1744) m. Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (see C8 below), and had
A8) Hon. Frederick Lewis Maitland of Rankeillor Park (1730-1786) m. Margaret Dick (see B11 below), and had
A9) Mary Turner Maitland (1768-1851) m. Henry Scrymgeour-Wedderburn of Wedderburn (1755-1841, descended from Edward III), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162762&tree=LEO
A10) Matilda Scrymgeour (1803-1864) m. Robert Matthew Isacke of North Foreland Lodge (1803-1896), and had
A11) Mary Harriet Isacke (1832-1925) m. Charles Morse of Aylsham (1820-1883), and had
A12) Arthur Francis Morse of The Mead (1872-1959) m. Annabel Marjory Haig (1873-1955, descended from Edward III), and had
A13) Marjory Emily Morse (1900-1992) m. George Algernon Perkins of Bure House (1896-1980, descended from Henry IV), and had
A14) Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 1926) m. Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (1913-1982, descended from Charles II)
B2) Agnes Fleming (c.1537-1597) m. William, 6th Lord Livingston (d. 1592, descended from James I), and had a dau B3 & a son C3 (see below)
B3) Jane Livingston (d. 1621) m. Alexander, 4th Lord Elphinstone (see J3 below), and had
B4) Agnes Elphinstone (1579-1617) m. John Gordon, 13th Earl of Sutherland (see H4 below), and had
B5) Lady Elizabeth Gordon (c.1601-aft.1654) m. James Crichton, 6th Laird of Frendraught (d. 1667, descended from James I), and had
B6) James Crichton, 1st Viscount Frendraught (c.1620-by1665) m. 1) Lady Janet Leslie (c.1620-1640), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00557027&tree=LEO
B7) Hon. Janet Crichton (b. 1640) m. Sir James Makgill of Rankeillor (c.1635-1699, descended from Edward III), and had
B8) David Makgill of Rankeillor (c.1667-1717) m. Janet Craig, and had
B9) Isabel Makgill (c.1705-1787) m. Rev. William Dick of Cupar (c.1669-1736), and had
B10) James Dick of Colluthie (1726-1777) m. Margaret Bisset (see E9 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162765&tree=LEO
B11) Margaret Dick (c.1748-1825) m. Hon. Frederick Lewis Maitland of Rankeillor Park (see A8 above)
C3) Alexander Livingstone, 1st Earl of Linlithgow (c.1555-1621) m. Lady Eleanor Hay (c.1566-1627, descended from James II), and had
C4) Lady Anna Livingstone (d. 1632) m. Alexander Montgomerie, 6th Earl of Eglinton (see K4 below), and had
C5) Hugh Montgomerie, 7th Earl of Eglinton (1613-1669) m. 1) Lady Anne Hamilton (see G5 below), and had
C6) Lady Anne Montgomerie (1632-1687) m. 2) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (see D6 below), and had
C7) James Ogilvy, 1st Earl of Seafield (1663-1730) m. Anne Dunbar (1672-1708), and had
C8) Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (1692-1778) m. Charles Maitland, 6th Earl of Lauderdale (see A7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007129&tree=LEO
D2) Margaret Fleming (c.1529-by1587) m. 3) John Stewart, 4th Earl of Atholl (d. 1579, descended from Edward III), and had
D3) Lady Janet Stewart (d. 1593) m. Sir Duncan Campbell, 1st Baronet of Glenorchy (1551-1631, descended from Edward III), and had
D4) Anne Campbell m. Sir Patrick Ogilvy of Inchmartine (d. 1651, descended from Edward III), and had
D5) Patrick Ogilvy, 2nd Earl of Findlater (d. 1659) m. Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (descended from James II), and had
D6) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (d. 1711) m. 1) Lady Anne Montgomerie (see C6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00116699&tree=LEO
E2) Joan Fleming (b. c.1532) m. 3) David Crawford, 5th Laird of Carse (d. 1595), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00117134&tree=LEO
E3) Margaret Crawford (b. c.1570) m. Sir Patrick Maxwell, 5th Laird of Newark Castle (c.1565-1625), and had
E4) George Maxwell, Heir of Newark Castle (c.1590-bef.1625) m. Helen Maxwell of Tealing, and had
E5) Sir Patrick Maxwell, 6th Laird of Newark Castle (c.1617-1678) m. Marion Campbell (see L5 below), and had
E6) Janet Maxwell m. John Murray of Balnabroich, and had
E7) Christian Murray m. Alexander Stewart of Balnabroich (see I8 below), and had
E8) Margaret Stewart m. Thomas Bisset of Glenalbert (d. 1774), and had
E9) Margaret Bisset m. 1) James Dick of Colluthie (see B10 above)
F1) Lady Katherine Stewart, illegit. (c.1494-aft.1554) m. James Douglas, 3rd Earl of Morton (d. 1550, descended from James I), and had
F2) Lady Margaret Douglas (c.1516-aft.1579) m. James Hamilton, Duke of Châtelherault (c.1519-1575, descended from James II), and had a dau F3 & a son G3 (see below)
F3) Lady Barbara Hamilton (b. c.1533) m. 2) James, 4th Lord Fleming (see A2 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00006087&tree=LEO
G3) John, 1st Marquess of Hamilton (c.1540-1604) m. Margaret Lyon (c.1545-1625, descended from James II), and had
G4) James, 2nd Marquess of Hamilton (1589-1625) m. Lady Anne Cunningham (d. 1647, descended from James II), and had
G5) Lady Anne Hamilton (c.1612-1632) m. Hugh Montgomerie, 7th Earl of Eglinton (see C5 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00060662&tree=LEO
H1) Lady Margaret Stewart, illegit. (b. 1497) m. twice, and had a lover, and had a son H2, and 4 daus I2, J2, K2 & L2 (see below)
H2) George Gordon, 4th Earl of Huntly, by 1st husband (1513-1562) m. Lady Elizabeth Keith (b. c.1515, descended from James I), and had
H3) Lady Jean Gordon (c.1546-1629) m. 2) Alexander Gordon, 12th Earl of Sutherland (1552-1594, descended from James II), and had
H4) John Gordon, 13th Earl of Sutherland (1576-1615) m. Agnes Elphinstone (see B4 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00053811&tree=LEO
I2) Margaret Stewart, illegit. by lover (c.1520-c.1540) m. David, 2nd Lord Drummond (d. 1571), and had
I3) Sybil Drummond (b. c.1538) m. Sir Gilbert Ogilvy of Powrie (d. 1601), and had
I4) John Ogilvy of Powrie (c.1560-1609) m. Elizabeth Scrymgeour (c.1566-1613), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00595742&tree=LEO
I5) Margaret Ogilvy m. Duncan Campbell, 4th Laird of Glenlyon (d. 1640), and had
I6) Margaret Campbell m. 1) Robert Stewart, 3rd Laird of Ballechin (descended from James II), and had
I7) Patrick Stewart, 5th Laird of Ballechin (b. c.1630) m. Elizabeth Lindsay (descended from Edward III), and had
I8) Alexander Stewart of Balnabroich (d. 1741) m. 1) Christian Murray (see E7 above)
J2) Margaret Drummond, by 2nd husband (d. 1590) m. Robert, 3rd Lord Elphinstone (1530-1602), and had
J3) Alexander, 4th Lord Elphinstone (1552-1638) m. Jane Livingston (see B3 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00046192&tree=LEO
K2) Agnes Drummond, by 2nd husband (d. 1589) m. 2) Hugh Montgomerie, 3rd Earl of Eglinton (c.1531-1585, descended from James I), and had
K3) Lady Margaret Montgomerie (d. 1624) m. Robert Seton, 1st Earl of Winton (c.1552-1603, descended from James I), and had
K4) Alexander Seton [later Montgomerie], 6th Earl of Eglinton (1588-1661) m. Lady Anna Livingstone (see C4 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043429&tree=LEO
L2) Isabel Drummond, by 2nd husband m. Sir Matthew Campbell of Loudoun (d. 1593, descended from James II), and had
L3) Margaret Campbell m. Thomas, 6th Lord Boyd (c.1547-1611), and had
L4) Isabel Boyd (c.1572-aft.1641) m. 2) Sir Dugald Campbell, 1st Baronet of Auchenbreck (c.1570-1641), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00514046&tree=LEO
L5) Marion Campbell m. Sir Patrick Maxwell, 6th Laird of Newark Castle (see E5 above)
The next post will lay out the lines of descent from James II of Scotland for Arthur Morse, grandfather of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax.
Cheers, -----Brad
Brad Verity
Apr 20, 2014, 9:20:27 PM4/20/14
to
On Sunday, April 20, 2014 2:01:35 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> The next post will lay out the lines of descent from James II of Scotland for Arthur Morse, grandfather of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax.
I had meant to point out in my previous post that Mary Harriet Isacke, the mother of Arthur Morse, is an unbroken, direct female-to-female descendant of Lady Margaret Stewart, the illegitimate daughter of James IV of Scotland by his mistress Margaret Drummond.
> The next post will lay out the lines of descent from James II of Scotland for Arthur Morse, grandfather of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax.
Below are the twelve lines of descent from James II of Scotland (not including those thru James IV, already posted) for Arthur Morse, with links to the most recent individuals in Leo's database for each.
James II of Scotland married, plus had a mistress, and had 2 daus A1 & J1, and 2 sons 1 & 1 (see below):
A1) Princess Mary Stewart of Scotland (1451-1488) m. 2) James, 1st Lord Hamilton (c.1415-1479), and had a son A2 & a dau G2 (see below)
A2) James Hamilton, 1st Earl of Arran (c.1475-1529) m. twice, plus had mistresses, and had 2 sons A3 & C3, and a dau E3 (see below)
A3) James Hamilton, Duke of Châtelherault (c.1519-1575) m. Lady Margaret Douglas (c.1516-aft.1579, descended from James IV), and had a dau A4 & a son B4 (see below)
A4) Lady Barbara Hamilton (b. c.1533) m. 2) James, 4th Lord Fleming (1535-1558, descended from James IV), and had
A5) Jean Fleming (1554-1609) m. 1) John, 1st Lord Maitland of Thirlestane (1543-1595), and had
A6) John Maitland, 1st Earl of Lauderdale (1594-1645) m. Lady Isabel Seton (1594-1638, descended from James I), and had
A7) Charles Maitland, 3rd Earl of Lauderdale (1620-1691) m. Elizabeth Lauder, and had
A8) John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale (c.1655-1710) m. Lady Margaret Cunningham (see D8 below), and had
A9) Charles Maitland, 6th Earl of Lauderdale (1688-1744) m. Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (see B9 below), and had
A10) Hon. Frederick Lewis Maitland of Rankeillor Park (1730-1786) m. Margaret Dick (see H13 below), and had
A11) Mary Turner Maitland (1768-1851) m. Henry Scrymgeour-Wedderburn of Wedderburn (1755-1841, descended from Edward III), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162762&tree=LEO
A12) Matilda Scrymgeour (1803-1864) m. Robert Matthew Isacke of North Foreland Lodge (1803-1896), and had
A13) Mary Harriet Isacke (1832-1925) m. Charles Morse of Aylsham (1820-1883), and had
A14) Arthur Francis Morse of The Mead (1872-1959) m. Annabel Marjory Haig (1873-1955, descended from Edward III), and had
A15) Marjory Emily Morse (1900-1992) m. George Algernon Perkins of Bure House (1896-1980, descended from Henry IV), and had
A16) Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 1926) m. Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (1913-1982, descended from Charles II)
B4) John, 1st Marquess of Hamilton (c.1540-1604) m. Margaret Lyon (c.1545-1625, descended from James I), and had
B5) James, 2nd Marquess of Hamilton (1589-1625) m. Lady Anne Cunningham (see E6 below), and had
B6) Lady Anne Hamilton (c.1612-1632) m. Hugh Montgomerie, 7th Earl of Eglinton (see G8 below), and had
B7) Lady Anne Montgomerie (1632-1687) m. 2) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (see C7 below), and had
B8) James Ogilvy, 1st Earl of Seafield (1663-1730) m. Anne Dunbar (1672-1708), and had
B9) Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (1692-1778) m. Charles Maitland, 6th Earl of Lauderdale (see A9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007129&tree=LEO
C3) Sir James Hamilton of Finnart, illegit. (c.1495-1540) m. Margaret Livingston, and had
C4) Grizel Hamilton (d. by 1573) m. Andrew Leslie, 5th Earl of Rothes (c.1530-1611), and had
C5) Lady Elizabeth Leslie m. James Ogilvy, 1st Earl of Findlater (d. 1652), and had two daus C6 & D6 (see below)
C6) Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy m. Patrick Ogilvy, 2nd Earl of Findlater (d. 1659, descended from James IV), and had
C7) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (d. 1711) m. 1) Lady Anne Montgomerie (see B7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00116699&tree=LEO
D6) Lady Anne Ogilvy (d. 1661) m. William Cunningham, 8th Earl of Glencairn (see F7 below), and had
D7) Alexander Cunningham, 9th Earl of Glencairn (c.1640-1670) m. Nicolas Stewart, and had
D8) Lady Margaret Cunningham (c.1662-1742) m. John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale (see A8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007127&tree=LEO
E3) Joan Hamilton, illegit. m. Alexander Cunningham, 4th Earl of Glencairn (c.1510-1574), and had
E4) William Cunningham, 5th Earl of Glencairn (d. 1580) m. Janet Gordon (d. 1596), and had
E5) James Cunningham, 6th Earl of Glencairn (d. 1630) m. Margaret Campbell (d. 1610, descended from Edward III), and had a dau E6 & a son F6 (see below)
E6) Lady Anne Cunningham (d. 1647) m. James, 2nd Marquess of Hamilton (see B5 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00082387&tree=LEO
F6) William Cunningham, 7th Earl of Glencairn (d. 1631) m. Lady Janet Kerr (see J5 below), and had
F7) William Cunningham, 8th Earl of Glencairn (c.1610-1664) m. Lady Anne Ogilvy (see D6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007121&tree=LEO
G2) Elizabeth Hamilton (b. c.1477) m. Matthew Stewart, 2nd Earl of Lennox (by1463-1513), and had a son G3 & a dau I3 (see below)
G3) John Stewart, 3rd Earl of Lennox (c.1495-1526) m. Lady Elizabeth Stewart (descended from Edward III), and had
G4) Lady Helen Stewart (d. 1564) m. twice, and had a dau G5 & a son H5 (see below)
G5) Lady Jean Hay, by 1st husband (1540-1570) m. Andrew Hay, 8th Earl of Erroll (c.1535-1585, descended from James I), and had
G6) Lady Eleanor Hay (c.1566-1627) m. Alexander Livingstone, 1st Earl of Linlithgow (c.1555-1621, descended from James IV), and had
G7) Lady Anna Livingstone (d. 1632) m. Alexander Montgomerie, 6th Earl of Eglinton (see below), and had
G8) Hugh Montgomerie, 7th Earl of Eglinton (1613-1669) m. 1) Lady Anne Hamilton (see B6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00060661&tree=LEO
H5) Alexander Gordon, 12th Earl of Sutherland, by 2nd husband (1552-1594) m. Lady Jean Gordon (c.1546-1629, descended from James IV), and had
H6) John Gordon, 13th Earl of Sutherland (1576-1615) m. Agnes Elphinstone (1579-1617, descended from James IV), and had
H7) Lady Elizabeth Gordon (c.1601-aft.1654) m. James Crichton, 6th Laird of Frendraught (d. 1667, descended from James I), and had
H8) James Crichton, 1st Viscount Frendraught (c.1620-by1665) m. 1) Lady Janet Leslie (c.1620-1640), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00557027&tree=LEO
H9) Hon. Janet Crichton (b. 1640) m. Sir James Makgill of Rankeillor (c.1635-1699, descended from Edward III), and had
H10) David Makgill of Rankeillor (c.1667-1717) m. Janet Craig, and had
H11) Isabel Makgill (c.1705-1787) m. Rev. William Dick of Cupar (c.1669-1736), and had
H12) James Dick of Colluthie (1726-1777) m. Margaret Bisset (see I11 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162765&tree=LEO
H13) Margaret Dick (c.1748-1825) m. Hon. Frederick Lewis Maitland of Rankeillor Park (see A10 above)
I3) Lady Elizabeth Stewart m. Sir Hugh Campbell of Loudoun (1502-1561), and had
I4) Sir Matthew Campbell of Loudoun (d. 1593) m. Isabel Drummond (descended from James IV), and had
I5) Margaret Campbell m. Thomas, 6th Lord Boyd (c.1547-1611), and had
I6) Isabel Boyd (c.1572-aft.1641) m. 2) Sir Dugald Campbell, 1st Baronet of Auchenbreck (c.1570-1641), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00514046&tree=LEO
I7) Marion Campbell m. Sir Patrick Maxwell, 6th Laird of Newark Castle (c.1617-1678, descended from James IV), and had
I8) Janet Maxwell m. John Murray of Balnabroich, and had
I9) Christian Murray m. Alexander Stewart of Balnabroich (see K9 below), and had
I10) Margaret Stewart m. Thomas Bisset of Glenalbert (d. 1774), and had
I11) Margaret Bisset m. 1) James Dick of Colluthie (see H12 above)
J1) Princess Margaret Stewart of Scotland (1459-c.1485) = William, 3rd Lord Crichton (d. by 1493), and had
J2) Margaret Crichton, illegit. (c.1485-aft.1545) m. 3) George Leslie, 4th Earl of Rothes (c.1490-1558), and had
J3) Lady Helen Leslie (d. 1594) m. 2) Mark Kerr of Newbattle Abbey (1517-1584), and had
J4) Mark Kerr, 1st Earl of Lothian (by1559-1609) m. Margaret Maxwell (d. 1617), and had
J5) Lady Janet Kerr m. William Cunningham, 7th Earl of Glencairn (see F6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007120&tree=LEO
K1) Alexander Stewart, 1st Duke of Albany (c.1454-1485) m. 1) Lady Catherine Sinclair, and had
K2) Alexander Stewart, Bishop of Moray (c.1472-1537) = Lady Margaret Stewart (b. 1497, illegit. day of James IV), and had
K3) Margaret Stewart, illegit. (c.1520-c.1540) m. David, 2nd Lord Drummond (d. 1571), and had
K4) Sybil Drummond (b. c.1538) m. Sir Gilbert Ogilvy of Powrie (d. 1601), and had
K5) John Ogilvy of Powrie (c.1560-1609) m. Elizabeth Scrymgeour (c.1566-1613), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00595742&tree=LEO
K6) Margaret Ogilvy m. Duncan Campbell, 4th Laird of Glenlyon (d. 1640), and had
K7) Margaret Campbell m. 1) Robert Stewart, 3rd Laird of Ballechin (see L4 below), and had
K8) Patrick Stewart, 5th Laird of Ballechin (b. c.1630) m. Elizabeth Lindsay (descended from Edward III), and had
K9) Alexander Stewart of Balnabroich (d. 1741) m. 1) Christian Murray (see I9 above)
L1) Sir John Stewart, 1st Laird of Sticks, illegit. (d. 1523) m. Muriel Sutherland (d. 1510), and had
L2) Patrick Stewart, 1st Laird of Ballechin (b. c.1495) m. Elizabeth Buttar (d. 1590), and had
L3) Sir James Stewart, 2nd Laird of Ballechin (d. 1627) m. 1) Maria Crichton, and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00320971&tree=LEO
L4) Robert Stewart, 3rd Laird of Ballechin m. Margaret Campbell (see K7 above)
The final post will cover the remaining James I & Edward III lines for Arthur Morse, grandfather of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax.
Cheers, ----Brad
Brad Verity
Apr 21, 2014, 7:47:59 PM4/21/14
to
On Sunday, April 20, 2014 6:20:27 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> The final post will cover the remaining James I & Edward III lines for Arthur Morse, grandfather of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax.
Below are the remaining 37 lines of descent for Arthur Morse, from Edward III of England (includes those from James I of Scotland), not counting the descents from James IV and James II, already posted. Links to the most recent individuals in Leo's database for each line are also given.
> The final post will cover the remaining James I & Edward III lines for Arthur Morse, grandfather of Alison Perkins Trappes-Lomax.
Edward III had a son A1:
A1) John of Gaunt, 1st Duke of Lancaster (1340-1399) m. 3) Katherine Roet (c.1350-1403), and had
A2) John Beaufort, 1st Earl of Somerset (1373-1410) m. Lady Margaret Holland (1383-1439, descended from Edward I), and had
A3) Lady Joan Beaufort, Queen of Scotland (c.1403-1445) m. twice, and had 2 sons A4 & FF4, and 2 daus S4 & V4 (see below)
A4) John Stewart, 1st Earl of Atholl, by 2nd husband (c.1440-1512) m. twice, and had a son O5, and 4 daus A5, H5, K5 & L5 (see below)
A5) Lady Elizabeth Stewart, by 1st wife (c.1465-by1500) m. Andrew, 2nd Lord Gray (c.1449-1514), and had 2 daus A6 & C6, and a son F6 (see below)
A6) Isabel Gray (c.1484-by1554) m. 1) Sir James Scrymgeour of Dudhope (d. 1504), and had
A7) James Scrymgeour of Dudhope (c.1500-1546) m. (div.) Mariot Stewart, and had
A8) Elizabeth Scrymgeour (c.1518-1554) m. James Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (d. by 1542), and had
A9) John Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (c.1535-1580) m. Agnes Bruce (d. 1590), and had
A10) John Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (d. 1629) m. Marion Fotheringham (see D9 below), and had a son A11 & a dau B11 (see below)
A11) John Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (c.1600-1656) m. Jean Makgill, and had
A12) John Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (c.1625-1698) m. Magdalene Wedderburn (see B13 below), and had
A13) Alexander Scrymgeour of St Andrews (1669-aft.1730) m. Janet Falconer, and had
A14) David Scrymgeour of Birkhill Castle (c.1700-1772) m. Katharine Wedderburn (1715-1796), and had
A15) Henry Scrymgeour-Wedderburn of Wedderburn (1755-1841) m. Mary Turner Maitland (see C17 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162761&tree=LEO
A16) Matilda Scrymgeour (1803-1864) m. Robert Matthew Isacke of North Foreland Lodge (1803-1896), and had
A17) Mary Harriet Isacke (1832-1925) m. Charles Morse of Aylsham (1820-1883), and had
A18) Arthur Francis Morse of The Mead (1872-1959) m. Annabel Marjory Haig (1873-1955, descended from Edward III), and had
A19) Marjory Emily Morse (1900-1992) m. George Algernon Perkins of Bure House (1896-1980, descended from Henry IV), and had
A20) Alison Marjorie Gundrede Perkins (b. 1926) m. Stephen Richard Trappes-Lomax (1913-1982, descended from Charles II)
B11) Magdalen Scrymgeour (c.1595-by1629) m. Alexander Wedderburn, 2nd Laird of Kingennie (1583-1637), and had
B12) Alexander Wedderburn, 3rd Laird of Kingennie (1615-1683) m. 1) Elizabeth Ramsay (c.1620-1643), and had
B13) Magdalene Wedderburn (c.1640-by1682) m. John Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (see A12 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162772&tree=LEO
C6) Janet Gray (c.1489-1539) m. four times, and had 2 daus C7 & D7 (see below)
C7) Margaret Keith, by 3rd husband (c.1518-by1563) m. William Keith, 3rd Earl Marischal (see AA7 below), and had
C8) Lady Joan Keith m. Sir James Crichton, 4th Laird of Frendraught (see U9 below), and had
C9) James Crichton, 5th Laird of Frendraught (d. 1619) m. Janet Gordon (see GG8 below), and had
C10) James Crichton, 6th Laird of Frendraught (d. 1667) m. Lady Elizabeth Gordon (see K10 below), and had
C11) James Crichton, 1st Viscount Frendraught (c.1620-by1665) m. 1) Lady Janet Leslie (c.1620-1640), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00557027&tree=LEO
C12) Hon. Janet Crichton (b. 1640) m. Sir James Makgill of Rankeillor (see E11 below), and had
C13) David Makgill of Rankeillor (c.1667-1717) m. Janet Craig, and had
C14) Isabel Makgill (c.1705-1787) m. Rev. William Dick of Cupar (c.1669-1736), and had
C15) James Dick of Colluthie (1726-1777) m. Margaret Bisset (see G14 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162765&tree=LEO
C16) Margaret Dick (c.1748-1825) m. Hon. Frederick Lewis Maitland of Rankeillor Park (see F15 below), and had
C17) Mary Turner Maitland (1768-1851) m. Henry Scrymgeour-Wedderburn of Wedderburn (see A15 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162762&tree=LEO
D7) Alison Charteris, by 1st husband (d. aft.1592) m. 1) Thomas Fotheringham, 7th Laird of Powrie (d. 1547), and had 2 sons D8 & E8 (see below)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00346599&tree=LEO
D8) Rev. James Fotheringham of Inverarity (d. aft.1612) m. Margaret Lindsay (see P7 below), and had
D9) Marion Fotheringham (b. c.1568) m. John Scrymgeour of Kirktoun (see A10 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00163100&tree=LEO
E8) Thomas Fotheringham, 8th Laird of Powrie (c.1533-1595) m. Helen Lindsay (see Q7 below), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00058141&tree=LEO
E9) Isabel Fotheringham m. William Ruthven of Freeland (d. 1608), and had
E10) Elizabeth Ruthven m. Sir David Makgill of Rankeillor (b. c.1600), and had
E11) Sir James Makgill of Rankeillor (c.1635-1699) m. Hon. Janet Crichton (see C12 above)
F6) Gilbert Gray of Buttergask (d. bed.1541) m. Egidia Mercer, and had
F7) Patrick, 4th Lord Gray (c.1520-1584) m. Marion Ogilvy (c.1520-aft.1569), and had 2 daus F8 & G8 (see below)
F8) Marjorie Gray (d. 1592) m. 2) Patrick Ogilvy of Inchmartine (d. 1623), and had
F9) Patrick Ogilvy, Heir of Inchmartine (d. 1592) m. Margaret Haliburton (d. 1638), and had
F10) Sir Patrick Ogilvy of Inchmartine (d. 1651) m. Anne Campbell (see H8 below), and had
F11) Patrick Ogilvy, 2nd Earl of Findlater (d. 1659) m. Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (descended from James II), and had
F12) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (d. 1711) m. 1) Lady Anne Montgomerie (see I10 below), and had
F13) James Ogilvy, 1st Earl of Seafield (1663-1730) m. Anne Dunbar (1672-1708), and had
F14) Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (1692-1778) m. Charles Maitland, 6th Earl of Lauderdale (see J12 below), and had
F15) Hon. Frederick Lewis Maitland of Rankeillor Park (1730-1786) m. Margaret Dick (see C16 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00162763&tree=LEO
G8) Isabel Gray (d. 1589) m. 2) Alexander Falconer, 6th Laird of Haulkerton (c.1545-1595), and had
G9) Sir Alexander Falconer, 7th Laird of Haulkerton (d. by 1646) m. Agnes Carnegie (d. 1634), and had
G10) Margaret Falconer m. Alexander Lindsay of Evelick (1604-1663), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00595634&tree=LEO
G11) Elizabeth Lindsay m. Patrick Stewart, 5th Laird of Ballechin (b. c.1630, descended from James IV), and had
G12) Alexander Stewart of Balnabroich (d. 1741) m. 1) Christian Murray (see KK12 below), and had
G13) Margaret Stewart m. Thomas Bisset of Glenalbert (d. 1774), and had
G14) Margaret Bisset m. 1) James Dick of Colluthie (see C15 above)
H5) Lady Marjory Stewart, by 2nd wife (d. 1524) m. Colin Campbell, 3rd Laird of Glenorchy (c.1468-1523), and had
H6) Colin Campbell, 6th Laird of Glenorchy (1499-1583) m. 2) Katherine Ruthven, and had a son H7 & a dau I7 (see below)
H7) Sir Duncan Campbell, 1st Baronet of Glenorchy (1551-1631) m. 1) Lady Janet Stewart (see R8 below), and had
H8) Anne Campbell m. Sir Patrick Ogilvy of Inchmartine (see F10 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00116696&tree=LEO
I7) Margaret Campbell (d. 1610) m. James Cunningham, 6th Earl of Glencairn (descended from James II), and had a dau I8 & a son J8 (see below)
I8) Lady Anne Cunningham (d. 1647) m. James, 2nd Marquess of Hamilton (see Y9 below), and had
I9) Lady Anne Hamilton (c.1612-1632) m. Hugh Montgomerie, 7th Earl of Eglinton (see L10 below), and had
I10) Lady Anne Montgomerie (1632-1687) m. 2) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (see F12 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00116700&tree=LEO
J8) William Cunningham, 7th Earl of Glencairn (d. 1631) m. Lady Janet Kerr (see below), and had
J9) William Cunningham, 8th Earl of Glencairn (c.1610-1664) m. Lady Anne Ogilvy (d. 1661, descended from James II), and had
J10) Alexander Cunningham, 9th Earl of Glencairn (c.1640-1670) m. Nicolas Stewart, and had
J11) Lady Margaret Cunningham (c.1662-1742) m. John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale (see W12 below), and had
J12) Charles Maitland, 6th Earl of Lauderdale (1688-1744) m. Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy (see F14 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007128&tree=LEO
K5) Lady Joan Stewart, by 1st wife (c.1463-1510) m. Alexander Gordon, 3rd Earl of Huntly (c.1464-1524), and had
K6) John Gordon, Master of Huntly (c.1492-1517) m. Lady Margaret Stewart (b. 1497, illegit. dau of James IV), and had
K7) George Gordon, 4th Earl of Huntly (1513-1562) m. Lady Elizabeth Keith (see BB7 below), and had
K8) Lady Jean Gordon (c.1546-1629) m. 2) Alexander Gordon, 12th Earl of Sutherland (see N7 below), and had
K9) John Gordon, 13th Earl of Sutherland (1576-1615) m. Agnes Elphinstone (see EE9 below), and had
K10) Lady Elizabeth Gordon (c.1601-aft.1654) m. James Crichton, 6th Laird of Frendraught (see C10 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00053821&tree=LEO
L5) Lady Elizabeth Stewart, by 2nd wife, m. three times, and had 2 daus L6 & M6 (see below)
L6) Margaret Robertson, by 1st husband m. George Hay, 7th Earl of Erroll (see S7 below), and had
L7) Andrew Hay, 8th Earl of Erroll (c.1535-1585) m. 1) Lady Jean Hay (see M7 below), and had
L8) Lady Eleanor Hay (c.1566-1627) m. Alexander Livingstone, 1st Earl of Linlithgow (see DD8 below), and had
L9) Lady Anna Livingstone (d. 1632) m. Alexander Montgomerie, 6th Earl of Eglinton (see V10 below), and had
L10) Hugh Montgomerie, 7th Earl of Eglinton (1613-1669) m. 1) Lady Anne Hamilton (see I9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00060661&tree=LEO
M6) Lady Helen Stewart, by 2nd husband (d. 1564) m. twice, and had a dau M7 & a son N7 (see below)
M7) Lady Jean Hay, by 1st husband (see T8 below) (1540-1570) m. Andrew Hay, 8th Earl of Erroll (L7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043441&tree=LEO
N7) Alexander Gordon, 12th Earl of Sutherland, by 2nd husband (see O7 below) (1552-1594) m. Lady Jean Gordon (see K8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00000516&tree=LEO
O5) John Stewart, 2nd Earl of Atholl, by 2nd wife (d. 1521) m. Lady Janet Campbell (d. 1546), and had 2 daus O6 & P6, and a son R6 (see below)
O6) Lady Janet Stewart m. 1) Alexander Gordon, Master of Sutherland (c.1501-1530), and had
O7) John Gordon, 11th Earl of Sutherland (1525-1567) m. 2) Lady Helen Stewart (see M6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00006127&tree=LEO
P6) Lady Ellen Stewart (d. 1577) m. 2) John, 5th Lord Lindsay of the Byres (d. 1563), and had 2 daus P7 & Q7 (see below)
P7) Margaret Lindsay (1528-by1599) m. 2) Rev. James Fotheringham of Inverarity (see D8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00346935&tree=LEO
Q7) Helen Lindsay m. Thomas Fotheringham, 8th Laird of Powrie (see E8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00058141&tree=LEO
R6) John Stewart, 3rd Earl of Atholl (1507-1542) m. 1) Grizel Rattray (d. by 1541), and had
R7) John Stewart, 4th Earl of Atholl (d. 1579) m. Margaret Fleming (see JJ7 below), and had
R8) Lady Janet Stewart (d. 1593) m. Sir Duncan Campbell, 1st Baronet of Glenorchy (see H7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00042754&tree=LEO
S4) Princess Annabella Stewart of Scotland, by 1st husband (b. c.1435) m. 2) George Gordon, 2nd Earl of Huntly (1441-1501), and had
S5) Lady Isabel Gordon (c.1462-by1485) m. William Hay, 3rd Earl of Erroll (c.1452-1507), and had 2 sons S6 & T6 (see below)
S6) Thomas Hay of Logie Almond (c.1480-1513) m. Margaret Logie, and had
S7) George Hay, 7th Earl of Erroll (c.1500-1574) m. 1) Margaret Robertson (see L6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043444&tree=LEO
T6) William Hay, 4th Earl of Erroll (c.1478-1513) m. 1) Christian Lyon (d. 1508), and had a son T7 & a dau U7 (see below)
T7) William Hay, 5th Earl of Erroll (c.1495-1522) m. Elizabeth Ruthven (d. by 1529), and had
T8) William Hay, 6th Earl of Erroll (c.1521-1541) m. Lady Helen Stewart (see M6 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00006387&tree=LEO
U7) Lady Elizabeth Hay m. William Abernethy, 5th Lord Saltoun (see FF6 below), and had
U8) Agnes Abernethy m. William Crichton, 3rd Laird of Frendraught (d. aft.1546), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00325494&tree=LEO
U9) Sir James Crichton, 4th Laird of Frendraught (d. aft.1569) m. Lady Joan Keith (see C8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00086964&tree=LEO
V4) Princess Joan Stewart of Scotland, by 1st husband (c.1428-aft.1486) m. James Douglas, 1st Earl of Morton (c.1438-1493), and had a dau V5 and a son Y5 (see below)
V5) Lady Janet Douglas (c.1464-c.1488) m. Patrick Hepburn, 1st Earl of Bothwell (c.1455-1508), and had
V6) Lady Joan Hepburn (c.1488-1558) m. George, 3rd Lord Seton (d. 1513), and had a son V7 & a dau X7 (see below)
V7) George, 4th Lord Seton (c.1508-1549) m. 1) Elizabeth Hay (d. by 1539), and had
V8) George, 5th Lord Seton (c.1531-1586) m. Isabel Hamilton (c.1534-1604), and had 2 sons V9 & W9 (see below)
V9) Robert Seton, 1st Earl of Winton (c.1552-1603) m. Lady Margaret Montgomerie (see X9 below), and had
V10) Alexander Seton [later Montgomerie], 6th Earl of Eglinton (1588-1661) m. Lady Anna Livingstone (see L9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043429&tree=LEO
W9) Alexander Seton, 1st Earl of Dunfermline (1555-1622) m. 1) Lilias Drummond (c.1578-1601), and had
W10) Lady Isabel Seton (1594-1638) m. John Maitland, 1st Earl of Lauderdale (see Z10 below), and had
W11) Charles Maitland, 3rd Earl of Lauderdale (1620-1691) m. Elizabeth Lauder, and had
W12) John Maitland, 5th Earl of Lauderdale (c.1655-1710) m. Lady Margaret Cunningham (see J11 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00007126&tree=LEO
X7) Marion Seton (c.1512-by1561) m. Hugh Montgomerie, 2nd Earl of Eglinton (c.1510-1546), and had
X8) Hugh Montgomerie, 3rd Earl of Eglinton (c.1531-1585) m. 2) Agnes Drummond (d. 1589, descended from James IV), and had
X9) Lady Margaret Montgomerie (d. 1624) m. Robert Seton, 1st Earl of Winton (see V9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043399&tree=LEO
Y5) John Douglas, 2nd Earl of Morton (by1466-1515) m. Janet Crichton, and had a son Y6 & 2 daus AA6 & DD6 (see below)
Y6) James Douglas, 3rd Earl of Morton (d. 1550) m. Lady Katherine Stewart (c.1494-aft.1554, illegit. day of James IV), and had
Y7) Lady Margaret Douglas (c.1516-aft.1579) m. James Hamilton, Duke of Châtelherault (c.1519-1575, descended from James II), and had a son Y8 & a dau Z8 (see below)
Y8) John, 1st Marquess of Hamilton (c.1540-1604) m. Margaret Lyon (see CC8 below), and had
Y9) James, 2nd Marquess of Hamilton (1589-1625) m. Lady Anne Cunningham (see I8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043738&tree=LEO
Z8) Lady Barbara Hamilton (b. c.1533) m. 2) James, 4th Lord Fleming (see HH7 below), and had
Z9) Jean Fleming (1554-1609) m. 1) John, 1st Lord Maitland of Thirlestane (1543-1595), and had
Z10) John Maitland, 1st Earl of Lauderdale (1594-1645) m. Lady Isabel Seton (see W10 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00115860&tree=LEO
AA6) Lady Elizabeth Douglas m. Robert Keith, Master of Marischal (d. 1524), and a son AA7, and 2 daus BB7 & CC7 (see below)
AA7) William Keith, 3rd Earl Marischal (c.1510-1581) m. Margaret Keith (see C7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00086940&tree=LEO
BB7) Lady Elizabeth Keith (b. c.1515) m. George Gordon, 4th Earl of Huntly (see K7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00006124&tree=LEO
CC7) Lady Janet Keith (c.1524-1559) m. John Lyon, 7th Lord Glamis (1521-by1559), and had
CC8) Margaret Lyon (c.1545-1625) m. 2) John, 1st Marquess of Hamilton (see Y8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043747&tree=LEO
DD6) Lady Agnes Douglas (c.1500-by1549) m. Alexander, 5th Lord Livingston (d. 1553), and had
DD7) William, 6th Lord Livingston (d. 1592) m. Agnes Fleming (see II7 below), and had a son DD8 & a dau EE8 (see below)
DD8) Alexander Livingstone, 1st Earl of Linlithgow (c.1555-1621) m. Lady Eleanor Hay (see L8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043438&tree=LEO
EE8) Jane Livingston (d. 1621) m. Alexander, 4th Lord Elphinstone (1552-1638, descended from James IV), and had
EE9) Agnes Elphinstone (1579-1617) m. John Gordon, 13th Earl of Sutherland (see K9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00053812&tree=LEO
FF4) James Stewart, 1st Earl of Buchan, by 2nd husband (1442-1499) m. and had a mistress, and had two daus FF5 & HH5 (see below)
FF5) Lady Joan(?) Stewart (d. aft.1530) m. Alexander Abernethy, 4th Lord Saltoun (d. 1527), and had a son FF6 & a dau GG6 (see below)
FF6) William Abernethy, 5th Lord Saltoun (d. 1543) m. Lady Elizabeth Hay (see U7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00025693&tree=LEO
GG6) Beatrix Abernethy m. Alexander Forbes, 5th Laird of Pitsligo (d. 1562), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00046209&tree=LEO
GG7) Anne Forbes m. Alexander Gordon, 4th Laird of Lesmoir (c.1540-c.1609), and had
GG8) Janet Gordon m. James Crichton, 5th Laird of Frendraught (see C9 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00566537&tree=LEO
HH5) Agnes Stewart, illegit. (c.1488-1557) = James IV, King of Scotland, and had
HH6) Lady Janet Stewart, illegit. (c.1508-by1563) m. Malcolm, 3rd Lord Fleming (c.1494-1547), and had a son HH7 & 3 daus II7, JJ7 & KK7 (see below)
HH7) James, 4th Lord Fleming (1535-1558) m. Lady Barbara Hamilton (see Z8 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00006086&tree=LEO
II7) Agnes Fleming (c.1537-1597) m. William, 6th Lord Livingston (see DD7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00043454&tree=LEO
JJ7) Margaret Fleming (c.1529-by1587) m. 3) John Stewart, 4th Earl of Atholl (see R7 above)
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00046276&tree=LEO
KK7) Joan Fleming (b. c.1532) m. 3) David Crawford, 5th Laird of Carse (d. 1595), and had
http://www.genealogics.org/getperson.php?personID=I00117134&tree=LEO
KK8) Margaret Crawford (b. c.1570) m. Sir Patrick Maxwell, 5th Laird of Newark Castle (c.1565-1625), and had
KK9) George Maxwell, Heir of Newark Castle (c.1590-bef.1625) m. Helen Maxwell of Tealing, and had
KK10) Sir Patrick Maxwell, 6th Laird of Newark Castle (c.1617-1678) m. Marion Campbell (descended from James IV), and had
KK11) Janet Maxwell m. John Murray of Balnabroich, and had
KK12) Christian Murray m. Alexander Stewart of Balnabroich (see G12 above)
Cheers, ----Brad
Brad Verity
Apr 23, 2014, 10:40:23 AM4/23/14
to
On Sunday, April 20, 2014 6:20:27 PM UTC-7, Brad Verity wrote:
> Below are the twelve lines of descent from James II of Scotland (not including those thru James IV, already posted) for Arthur Morse, with links to the most recent individuals in Leo's database for each.
Many thanks to John Higgins for pointing out the error in Line C below. Arthur Morse actually has 10, not 12, lines of descent from James II of Scotland.
> Below are the twelve lines of descent from James II of Scotland (not including those thru James IV, already posted) for Arthur Morse, with links to the most recent individuals in Leo's database for each.
> C3) Sir James Hamilton of Finnart, illegit. (c.1495-1540) m. Margaret Livingston, and had
> C4) Grizel Hamilton (d. by 1573) m. Andrew Leslie, 5th Earl of Rothes (c.1530-1611), and had
> C5) Lady Elizabeth Leslie m. James Ogilvy, 1st Earl of Findlater (d. 1652), and had two daus C6 & D6 (see below)
But this is a mistake. BP has confused two of the daughters of the 5th Earl, making Isabella Leslie, wife of James, Master of Sinclair, the 5th Earl's daughter by his 3rd wife, and Elizabeth Leslie, wife of the 1st Earl of Findlater, his daughter by his 1st wife, when it should be the other way around, as 'Scots Peerage' correctly shows:
https://archive.org/stream/scotspeeragefoun07pauluoft#page/294/mode/2up
As neither the 5th Earl of Rothes nor his 3rd wife Janet Durie have any James II (or Edward III) descents behind them, their daughter Lady Elizabeth Leslie (Generation C5 above) loses this royal line.
> C6) Lady Elizabeth Ogilvy m. Patrick Ogilvy, 2nd Earl of Findlater (d. 1659, descended from James IV), and had
> C7) James Ogilvy, 3rd Earl of Findlater (d. 1711) m. 1) Lady Anne Montgomerie (see B7 above)
> D6) Lady Anne Ogilvy (d. 1661) m. William Cunningham, 8th Earl of Glencairn (see F7 below), and had
> D7) Alexander Cunningham, 9th Earl of Glencairn (c.1640-1670) m. Nicolas Stewart, and had
Thanks again to John. I've adjusted my database accordingly.
Cheers, -----Brad
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