Freedom of Information

[Tom Kunich]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UHvwWWcjYw

I have been saying this for how long? How long have people like the 5 haters on this group been denying the truth of it?

[Jeff Liebermann]

Amazing. Dr Campbell simply removed from the sample those who died
and had one or more underlying conditions, leaving only those who
lacked underlying conditions and therefore had certainly died from
COVID-19. Of course, the number of COVID-19 deaths counted were
drastically lower because the elderly have the most underlying
conditions and the elderly were the one's who are dying of COVID-19.
He could have done as well by simply removing everyone over 55 who had
died. Incidentally, this is called "cherry picking" where one selects
for a sample only those who would produced the politically correct
result.



--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[Tom Kunich]

On Monday, February 21, 2022 at 12:39:06 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 07:37:25 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UHvwWWcjYw
> >
> >I have been saying this for how long? How long have people like the 5 haters on this group been denying the truth of it?
> Amazing. Dr Campbell simply removed from the sample those who died
> and had one or more underlying conditions, leaving only those who
> lacked underlying conditions and therefore had certainly died from
> COVID-19. Of course, the number of COVID-19 deaths counted were
> drastically lower because the elderly have the most underlying
> conditions and the elderly were the one's who are dying of COVID-19.
> He could have done as well by simply removing everyone over 55 who had
> died. Incidentally, this is called "cherry picking" where one selects
> for a sample only those who would produced the politically correct
> result.

Inform us all - a person that is over the normal average age of death BY AN AVERAGE OF 5.5 YEARS and has between one and eight comorbidities dies. They test him with PCR and say he tests positive for covid-19. So you, with your already demonstrated vast medical knowledge, think they were killed by covid-19? Firstly, the PCR test is NOT nor ever has been an appropriate test so a positive has absolutely NO meaning. Even the CDC has admitted that after I had been arguing that for a year!

Your mental prowess is really impressive since you are perfectly willing to contradict a pandemic specialist. Where did you get all of that vast medical knowledge?

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Tommy, your mental prowess seems to be severely lacking. Not a shock to us. Comorbidity merely means you have other things wrong with you. I have a comorbidity. But I am still healthy and my comorbidity should not kill me anytime soon. However, my comorbidity does make me more susceptible to catching Covid. Even though I am vaccinated and have my booster shot. But if I am very unfortunate and die of Covid, the doctors would likely say I died of Covid with a comorbidity. I still died of Covid. My comorbidity did not kill me, it just made it easier for Covid to infect me and kill me. Seems somewhat simple to me to understand. But I am not you, thankfully.

Comorbidities might be similar to seatbelts or bicycle helmets. You can live just fine with a comorbidity. Just like you can drive without a seatbelt or ride a bicycle without a helmet. No problems at all. BUT, if you do get in a wreck with the car or bike, the lack of a seatbelt or helmet makes it more likely you will die and/or suffer severe injury. But in either case, the crash (COVID) will be listed as the cause of death/injury. Even though your lack of seatbelt or helmet (COMORBIDITY) greatly contributed to your chance of dying or injury. Just like people without comorbidities are able to not get infected better or suffer only minor Covid problems if they do develop the virus. The comorbidity amplifies the risk.

[Tom Kunich]

Well, that was probably too snotty. Just consider, I SHOWED where the CDC is measuring covid-19 deaths only with pneumonia deaths. This means that since they cannot accurately measure covid-19 with any test, that they are including the worlds most common form of death of senior citizens with covid-19.

Every year, between 5,000 and 12,000 people die of influenza. And the "undefined" respiratory deaths were only 7,127. Since you CANNOT identify any deaths from pneumonia as a covid-19 test you are facing a case where this covid-19 in all regards, hasn't been as bad as a bad influenza year.

And in any case, it would be killing OLD PEOPLE that are very, very ill and not expected to live out the year.

The vaccines on the other hand, were being forced upon a military composed of men and women at the most healthy point in their lives. The vaccines are killing at the very least 133 times what not having the vaccines would. And because of the reporting standards they started for vaccine problems (VAERS = Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System) probably the majority of adverse reactions are not being reported. Especially if they are not fatal. I explained that VAERS was actually intended to be reported by the individuals effected. But the form is using only very highly medical technical terms that non-medical people couldn't even identify let alone know if they occurred or were present.

Jeff, you have to forgive me for being annoyed by your obsessive belief that Fauci wouldn't fool you. I have seen Fauci's work over the years and he has NEVER ONCE been right about anything. He is the government worker of the year. If you want it done wrong give it to the government.

This morning even the asses at the local FOX station were saying that covid-19 spreads via microdroplets expelled during a cough. This is absolute bullshit. A corona virus is 30 nanometers in diameter and moisture won't stick to it and even if it did, it would dry instantly. Therefore corona viruses as a whole are airborne. They float in clouds around anyone infected that is breathing. You also have to inhale a large enough number of them that they overcome the body's natural defenses. So outdoors they disperse too rapidly to be a danger unless you're in something like a colosseum where the sheer number of people infected can maintain a large volume of viral counts. Even inside if you have circulating air and not to large a group - such as in any supermarket the viral counts can never get high enough to infect people unless they have immune system problems. Omicron is about as contagious as cold virus which is another corona virus. And it is about as dangerous. Colds can and do kill people with severe comorbities so it isn't as if vaccines were EVER necessary. MOST of the actual deaths were from the initial wave of Delta variant. And they were almost entirely people that were extremely sick or with serious health problems such as gross obesity. On the bike trails I started seeing these people walking and then jogging and their health returned to normal.

You don't understand why people make decisions and you are claiming that they are baseless decisions when they aren't. Stop talking about science because you've never worked in it. There are extremely serious decisions you need to make in every project and you can't understand this.

Again let me show you this CDC chart. Notice that they are reporting covid-19 deaths ABOVE the actual reported numbers of deaths.

[Tom Kunich]

Russell either you don't know what comorbity means or you are fooling yourself. Comorbity is something that can and WILL eventually kill you if nothing else does. If you have a stroke your chances of another NEVER return to normal. There are things you can do to reduce those chances such as quitting smoking or using drugs but it NEVER returns to normal. The same with other things such as atrial fibrillation. Those are both ranked as circulatory diseases and EVERY case of covid-19 death under the age of 60 had at least one of these and most over that age have many of them.

Do you suppose there is some sort of difference of dying from a heart condition while infected with influenza or covid-19? Does ANYONE count influenza deaths as grounds for an economic shutdown? I think that an accountant should understand these things without further discussion.

[John B.]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 12:38:59 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 07:37:25 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
><cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9UHvwWWcjYw
>>
>>I have been saying this for how long? How long have people like the 5 haters on this group been denying the truth of it?
>
>Amazing. Dr Campbell simply removed from the sample those who died
>and had one or more underlying conditions, leaving only those who
>lacked underlying conditions and therefore had certainly died from
>COVID-19. Of course, the number of COVID-19 deaths counted were
>drastically lower because the elderly have the most underlying
>conditions and the elderly were the one's who are dying of COVID-19.
>He could have done as well by simply removing everyone over 55 who had
>died. Incidentally, this is called "cherry picking" where one selects
>for a sample only those who would produced the politically correct
>result.

There is another point. The Dr. John Campbell in the video is not a
medical doctor. He is, or was, in fact a teacher in a school for
nurses and has authored several(I believe) books on nursing.

It might be pointed out that"nurses" are not qualified to diagnose
diseases nor to prescribe treatments.

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:01:15 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

But Tommy, your famous "pandemic specialist" is nothing but a chap
who's claim to fame is that he is a teacher of nurses and had/has
written book(s) on nursing. He is not a medical doctor. Only a bed pan
changer, one might say.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

John, one should not say that. At all. I have several nurses in my family. While bed pan changing may have been and was one task they performed, they did many other important tasks too. An electrical engineer may solder a wire during his work. But I would not demean him by saying that is all he does. Or a civil engineer may measure a room or tract of land with a tape measure. But that is not all he does.

But of course the nurses in my family actually knew about medicine from working with and within it all their lives. Unlike Tommy, they did not just make things up or pull them out of their backside. They were professionals with an education and training. Not Tommy.

[Tom Kunich]

Slow Johnny is looking at Wikipedia which among other things says, "In November 2021, Campbell made false claims about the use of the anti-parasitic drug ivermectin as a COVID-19 treatment"

This is the sort of sources that Slow Johnny loves to use.


Instead:
https://truthbasedmedia.com/2022/02/14/new-study-confirms-ivermectin-outperforms-other-options/
https://www.thedesertreview.com/news/national/ivermectin-obliterates-97-percent-of-delhi-cases/article_6a3be6b2-c31f-11eb-836d-2722d2325a08.html
https://www.captainsjournal.com/2022/01/19/new-peer-reviewed-study-shows-ivermectin-significantly-reduces-covid-infections-hospitalization-and-mortality-rates/
https://academic.oup.com/qjmed/article/114/11/780/6143037?login=false

Just imagine, it only took 15 Google pages to discover that Ivermectin actually works. 15 pages warning you that Ivermectin was poisonous and would kill you when not only is this one of the safest drugs in the world but it costs less than $10 for a course of treatment vs hundreds of dollars for the vaccines that have shown bpth NOT to prevent covid-19 but to be a clear and present danger themselves.

Slow Johnny strikes again with that truth of his.

[Tom Kunich]

He has a Phd. in health science.
What can you do with a masters in health science?

Pediatrics
Physical Therapy
Neurology
Oncology

Tell us very Slow Johnny Do you even know what oncology or neurology is? What about pediatrics?

[Tom Kunich]

It must be absolute murder for you to think about how much more money I made treating people's illnesses by making machines that actually work than the piddly sum you've worked your entire life for which Biden is about to make into nothing. I figure you have about two years before you too are a homeless drug addict like half of San Francisco under a Democrat Mayor and a Democrat Governor. Gavin Loathsome has been telling everyone that his budget and state debt are balanced even though the state is spending over 16% more than it earns and owes over $538 Billion. Biden has already in less than two years made it nearly impossible for a large segment of the population of California to eat meat. Your kind of world and pretty quick I predict you will be crying for communism like Frank.

[AMuzi]

Having spent a great deal of quality time with a selection
of RNs over the years, I find that inappropriate.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/21/2022 6:40 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> He has a Phd. in health science.
> What can you do with a masters in health science?
>
> Pediatrics
> Physical Therapy
> Neurology
> Oncology

Wait! Is Tom Kunich now saying that education makes a person
knowledgeable, and qualified to speak on matters he's studied?

Glory be!

Now will Tom convince those without diplomas and degrees to quiet down
and listen to huge numbers of highly educated and trained specialists?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Kunich]

He has a PhD Frank, and he has actually studied his subject. What do you have? If you were a real engineer you would have obtained a job as a real engineer. So tell me all about how some worthless amateur like yourself pretends to be educated?

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 15:32:49 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>https://truthbasedmedia.com/2022/02/14/new-study-confirms-ivermectin-outperforms-other-options/
No sources of data or conclusions provided.

>https://www.thedesertreview.com/news/national/ivermectin-obliterates-97-percent-of-delhi-cases/article_6a3be6b2-c31f-11eb-836d-2722d2325a08.html
"Dubious sources cited by supporters of use of ivermectin for
Covid-19"
<https://www.sgh.com.sg/news/covid19/dubious-sources-cited-by-supporters-of-use-of-ivermectin-for-covid-19>
See comments about Dr Mercola.

>https://www.captainsjournal.com/2022/01/19/new-peer-reviewed-study-shows-ivermectin-significantly-reduces-covid-infections-hospitalization-and-mortality-rates/
From the original report at:
<https://www.cureus.com/articles/82162-ivermectin-prophylaxis-used-for-covid-19-a-citywide-prospective-observational-study-of-223128-subjects-using-propensity-score-matching>
"Being a prospective observational study that allowed subjects to
self-select between treatment vs. non-treatment instead of relying on
randomization, important confounders may have been differentially
present, which could otherwise explain the differences observed."

Self-selection of treatment has the same problem as the VAERS
database. There's no control group and no double-blind treatment.
However, the report is rather complicated and detailed. It's also
preliminary and has not been peer reviewed. Not sure, as I may have
missed something.

>https://academic.oup.com/qjmed/article/114/11/780/6143037?login=false
Better, but only involving 62 mild cases of Covid-19. Otherwise, the
report does show that ivermectin reduces the time it takes to reduce
the viral load using a PCR test.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/21/2022 7:15 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Monday, February 21, 2022 at 3:58:09 PM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 2/21/2022 6:40 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>>>
>>> He has a Phd. in health science.
>>> What can you do with a masters in health science?
>>>
>>> Pediatrics
>>> Physical Therapy
>>> Neurology
>>> Oncology
>> Wait! Is Tom Kunich now saying that education makes a person
>> knowledgeable, and qualified to speak on matters he's studied?
>>
>> Glory be!
>>
>> Now will Tom convince those without diplomas and degrees to quiet down
>> and listen to huge numbers of highly educated and trained specialists?
>
> He has a PhD Frank, and he has actually studied his subject. What do you have?

:-) I have even more than a high school diploma! Aren't you jealous?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 13:01:15 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

"Fact Check-Why those with comorbidities are still counted as COVID-19
deaths"
<https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-comorbidities-coviddeaths/fact-check-why-those-with-comorbidities-are-still-counted-as-covid-19-deaths-idUSL1N2TU22X>
"Currently, based on the death certificate data we have received, for
91% of death certificates with COVID-19 reported, COVID-19 is clearly
the underlying cause. In 9% of cases, it was a reported as a
significant factor contributing to death,"...

VERDICT
"Missing context. The 6% figure used by users online to calculate
COVID-19-only deaths originates from a 2020 database and represents
the percentage of death certificates with COVID-19 listed as the only
cause mentioned. This extrapolation is misleading, however, and
doesn’t take into account that conditions listed in a death
certificate may be caused by the virus itself. While a comorbidity may
cause someone to be at higher risk of COVID-19, the comorbidity is not
necessarily the cause of death."

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

Tommy, tommy, tommy, tommy, tommy...
I have told you many times to use credible sources for your facts. Not lunatic right wing Qanon nut wbsites. And yet you continue to glean your education from them.

For fun I went over to the "truthbasedmedia" website. Here are some of the article titles on the page:
"Dr. Vladimir Zelenko Tells Pastor David Scarlett: Covid “Vaccines” Are Changing People Into Transhumans"
"Guilt by Redaction: Ludicrous FOIA Release by NIH Shows Wuhan Virus Complicity MUCH BIGGER Than Most Realize"
Wuhan virus? Isn't that the mockery Trump used?
"An Easy and Effective Shield to Protect From Covid-19"
So this website believes Covid is real otherwise they would not have an article about shielding from the virus.
"Let There Be Lasers: Israel to Surround Borders With ‘Biblical Pillar of Fire’"
"The Nazis Weren’t Defeated… They Went Underground and Now Run CANADA and the WORLD, Pushing Eugenics and Depopulation Agendas"
So the Nazis run Canada and the world? OK.
"National Geographic Has Become Too Woke to Be Taken Seriously"
National Geographic? I still remember them from the 1970s and Marlin Perkins on TV. Great show.
"Pastor Greg Locke Defends Deliverance Ministry After Chasing Suspected Witches From Church"
Witches? I guess that was popular back in the 1600s. Salem witch trials.

Concerning your second link from "thedesertreview". Its an Imperial Valley newspaper. Not sure if paper or just online. I assume you know where Imperial Valley in California is. I do not. But the author of the article is "Justus R. Hope, MD". A pseudonym. He has written other articles and is associated with "Front Line COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance". Which sounds awfully similar to "America’s Frontline Doctors (AFLD)". Time has a story on them. Not a favorable story.
https://time.com/6092368/americas-frontline-doctors-covid-19-misinformation/
"Similar stories have flooded anti-vaccine forums and messaging apps in recent weeks as some customers and donors raise doubts about AFLD. The group describes itself as a “non-partisan” group of medical professionals. But it originated as a right-wing political organization, and since its founding has consistently spread medical misinformation. Its name implies the group consists of physicians on the frontlines of the pandemic, but it’s not clear how many of its members have spent any time treating patients with COVID-19."
"Over the past three months, a TIME investigation found, hundreds of AFLD customers and donors have accused the group of touting a service promising prescriptions for ivermectin, which medical authorities say should not be taken to treat or prevent COVID-19, and failing to deliver after a fee had been paid."

So I am going to write off your second link as fraudulent too.

As for your third link from "captainsjournal". Here is a list of the articles in the Recent Articles category.
Testing For Home Defense Ammunition For Carbines
Ottawa Police Kidnapping Protesters
DoJ On Missouri’s Second Amendment Preservation Act
Freedom Convoy Update #2
Tyranny In Canada
Alabama House committee approves permitless pistol carry bill
Freedom Convoy Update
Law Enforcement Shenanigans And Illegalities Against The Freedom Convoy
Wyoming Bill To Block State Enforcement Of Gun Control Laws Filed

Tommy, do you think a website like that is credible? I don't. They seem to be focused on some things pretty strongly.

As for your third link, it appears to be a legitimate website of a legitimate medical group. Yeah. Its a study about using Ivermectin to treat patients with Covid. It seems to say there is a benefit with patients infected with Covid. It is a very small sample though. 62 patients being treated for Covid in the hospital. Some quotes from the article:
"Collectively, these results demonstrate a likely beneficial treatment effect of Ivermectin, to reduce the duration of illness, elicit faster recovery and diminution of qualitative indices of SARS-CoV-2 viral load compared to the usual treatment."
AND
"Further study of Ivermectin 12 mg in the pre-exposure prophylaxis and prevention of community transmission of SARS-CoV-2, such as spoke-and-wheel or targeted hotspots treatment, is now warranted, especially as an interim measure in countries that cannot immediately roll out vaccination programs. We cannot conclude in this study that Ivermectin has a place in prophylaxis, but this warrants investigation."

The study you cite concludes that ivermectin seemed to make recovery from Covid quicker. A few days quicker to healthy. OK. Notice they seem to still be regarding VACCINES as the ultimate goal. But are also saying using ivermectin as a vaccine substitute is a possibility. Based on their tiny tiny tiny study of 62 people over six months. And I will also point out they explicitly say they excluded severe patients, those with a ventilator and in ICU. The seriously ill patients they did not want in this test of ivermectin. They only wanted to test ivermectin on not too sick Covid patients who recovered. Hmm? You do know that Covid morbidity is fairly small. Fractions of 1%. Covid does not kill everyone. Just a few. But when hundreds of millions or billions have it, then the total deaths do add up.

[sms]

On 2/21/2022 5:00 PM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:

<snip>

> Tommy, tommy, tommy, tommy, tommy...
> I have told you many times to use credible sources for your facts. Not lunatic right wing Qanon nut wbsites. And yet you continue to glean your education from them.

There are no non-lunatic, non-right-wing Qanon nut web sites that he can
use, so you're asking for the impossible.

[Andre Jute]

Nonsense, Jeff. It's an approved way of determining how many excess deaths there were. Actuarial statistics, a branch of demographics dealing with life expectancy, works by exclusions to define a subset either positively or negatively (or in these days of inclusion and vicarious -- more often simply vacuous -- guilt at excluding fuckwits like the ones you're running with) inclusively or exclusively. There are scores of medical thinkers doing it and you catch glimpses of them because it takes balls of steel to speak out when junior-school dimbos like your friends, and Scharfie, in a class of vicious spite by himself, want to lock up people for speaking the truth because the Chinese Pandemic is such a handy tool for the Donkey Party to engineer the theft of elections and to draw a veil of smoke over the Biden Administration's failures. -- AJ?
>

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

On Monday, February 21, 2022 at 7:06:31 PM UTC-6, sms wrote:
> On 2/21/2022 5:00 PM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> <snip>
> > Tommy, tommy, tommy, tommy, tommy...

> > I have told you many times to use credible sources for your facts. Not lunatic right wing Qanon nut websites. And yet you continue to glean your education from them.

> There are no non-lunatic, non-right-wing Qanon nut web sites that he can
> use, so you're asking for the impossible.

OK. And I did get very confused in my reply and associate Tommy with education. Sorry about that drastic mistake.

[John B.]

Yes, I was of course being sarcastic, but I do maintain that a nurse
is not a doctor and is thus is not qualified to diagnose nor proscribe
treatment.

In the U.S. anyway, there are two levels of Nursing qualification, I
believe. "Registered Nurse" and "Practical Nurse" with different
qualifications, I believe. Or perhaps different levels of training.

>
>But of course the nurses in my family actually knew about medicine from working with and within it all their lives. Unlike Tommy, they did not just make things up or pull them out of their backside. They were professionals with an education and training. Not Tommy.

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 15:32:49 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

Nope Tommy, the difference between you and I is that I prefer the
truth while you prefer any irrational statement that will support your
delusions.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 15:40:53 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

And yet again the indomitable Tommy falls flat on his arse.... right
out in front of everybody.

https://www.excelsior.edu/article/health-sciences-degree/
"students who earn degrees in health sciences go on to pursue clinical
jobs like dental hygienist, physical therapy assistant, surgical
technician, EKG technologist, veterinary technician, or radiation
therapist, or may pursue non-clinical jobs like medical and health
services manager, claims reviewer, health education specialist, or
community health specialist."

But tell us Tommy, how is it possible for anyone with even a bit of
intelligence to get it wrong... Every Time?
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Mon, 21 Feb 2022 15:52:37 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

Yes Sir! All that money and lives in a $50,000 house, in a slum, and
whines about the cost of groceries.

By Gorry! I'm glad I'm not "rich" like Tommy.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

Yes, I was being unduly sarcastic but I do maintain that Nurses are
not qualified to either diagnose nor proscribe treatment.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

Your argument is silly. I worked with a bloke, several of them, that
had PhD's and none of them claimed to be sufficiently well educated to
diagnose or treat sick people.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Tom Kunich]

This group is inhabited by people that are simply so far to the left that they can't even see their own errors. They don't even know that Biden signaled Russia to go right ahead and invade because he had no intentions of doing anything. We'll see how well that goes. In the meantime. Biden is running military actions in Syria and the Slime Stream Media isn't reporting it do to these people it doesn't exist.

[Tom Kunich]

Imagine you talking about my house being in a slum when I have been offered $880,000 for it while you are living in Thailand which is one huge slum outside of the business district.

[Tom Kunich]

What education have you had John? If must have been very great considering you parked aircraft with a tow truck and made sure that the real technicians filled out the paperwork. Impress me some more

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/22/2022 11:24 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
> What education have you had John?

:-) Another day of unintentional irony from the guy without even a high
school diploma!

But congratulations on the GED certificate, Tom. At least you've got
that, right?

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Tom Kunich]

Why does it slip your mind that I discovered that I did graduate? And that I have an additional education in navigation from a high ranked college in Marin county? Or that I have a two year degree from Chabot College in Hayward? Is that because that is the only way you can infer that I didn't attain heights in my career that you couldn't even dream of? That you're so penniless that you have to make claims on other people's money as all communists do?

Well, if you have money problems now just wait for Biden to really destroy you with his uncontrolled inflation. How long before you're living out of your car and eating dog food?

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/22/2022 11:56 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 8:45:53 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 2/22/2022 11:24 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>>>
>>> What education have you had John?
>> :-) Another day of unintentional irony from the guy without even a high
>> school diploma!
>>
>> But congratulations on the GED certificate, Tom. At least you've got
>> that, right?
>
> Why does it slip your mind that I discovered that I did graduate?

Tom, people don't "discover" that they graduated high school. That's not
how that works. And a high school diploma disqualifies you from getting
a GED, which you've claimed you have.

> And that I have an additional education in navigation from a high ranked college in Marin county?

I do remember you bragging about that. As I recall, Jeff was unable to
find the existence of such a thing. But feel free to give us
documentation, for a change from storytelling and bragging!

> Or that I have a two year degree from Chabot College in Hayward?

Hmm. I think this may be new information, although I don't take notes on
your copious flights of fancy. What I recall about you and "college" is
your tale of attending part of a term and walking out because the
socialist instructors obviously didn't know as much as you did. But hey,
feel free to give us documentation! (Is that two year degree on your
resume? I don't remember.)

> Is that because that is the only way you can infer that I didn't attain heights in my career that you couldn't even dream of?

I never dreamed of having a long, long string of temporary jobs with
most lasting less than two years, so you've got me there! The places I
worked seemed to want to keep me. Even the big firm I used for a "back
to industry" sabbatical tried to talk me in returning to them for
engineering consulting work in the summers.

> That you're so penniless that you have to make claims on other people's money as all communists do?

Dude, I'm far, far from penniless. I could buy every bike in your
ever-churning stable on a moment's notice. I could buy your house, too,
but I wouldn't want to live in that hellhole.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[sms]

On 2/22/2022 1:21 AM, John B. wrote:

<snip>

> Yes, I was being unduly sarcastic but I do maintain that Nurses are
> not qualified to either diagnose nor proscribe treatment.

Depends on the type of nurse.

In the U.S., an LVN or LPN (Licensed Vocational Nurse/Licensed Practical
Nurse) is probably not qualified to diagnose. An experienced RN is
probably qualified, but legally can't diagnose or proscribe treatment. A
NP (Nurse practitioner) is both qualified and allowed to diagnose and
proscribe treatment, and depending on the state, is allowed to write
prescriptions.

In the U.S., it used to be that to become an RN you needed only a two
year Associate Degree. Now a four year Bachelor's degree is the minimum.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:20:02 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Biden is running military actions in Syria and the Slime Stream Media isn't reporting it do to these people it doesn't exist.

Why use US news sources? It's not like the US has a monopoly on
international news. If you want news about Syria, try using a source
in the middle-east:

Quatar:
<https://www.aljazeera.com/where/syria/>

Saudi Arabia:
<https://www.arabnews.com/search/site/Syria>

Israel:
<https://www.haaretz.com/search-results?q=syria>

Syria:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_media_in_Syria#Online>

Plenty more:
<https://www.world-newspapers.com/countries/middle-east/syria>

[AMuzi]

On 2/22/2022 12:43 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:20:02 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Biden is running military actions in Syria and the Slime Stream Media isn't reporting it do to these people it doesn't exist.
>
> Why use US news sources? It's not like the US has a monopoly on
> international news. If you want news about Syria, try using a source
> in the middle-east:
>
> Quatar:
> <https://www.aljazeera.com/where/syria/>
>
> Saudi Arabia:
> <https://www.arabnews.com/search/site/Syria>
>
> Israel:
> <https://www.haaretz.com/search-results?q=syria>
>
> Syria:
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_media_in_Syria#Online>
>
> Plenty more:
> <https://www.world-newspapers.com/countries/middle-east/syria>
>
>
>

+1

Also RFI (France) and RAI (Italy) plus a host of excellent
British papers.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 10:11:43 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

>On 2/22/2022 1:21 AM, John B. wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>> Yes, I was being unduly sarcastic but I do maintain that Nurses are
>> not qualified to either diagnose nor proscribe treatment.

>Depends on the type of nurse.
>
>In the U.S., an LVN or LPN (Licensed Vocational Nurse/Licensed Practical
>Nurse) is probably not qualified to diagnose. An experienced RN is
>probably qualified, but legally can't diagnose or proscribe treatment. A
>NP (Nurse practitioner) is both qualified and allowed to diagnose and
>proscribe treatment, and depending on the state, is allowed to write
>prescriptions.

Diagnosis is not a problem. We now have online web sites and AI
algorithms that can diagnose many common ailments. For example:
<https://symptoms.webmd.com>
<https://www.mayoclinic.org/symptom-checker/select-symptom/itt-20009075>
More:
<https://openmd.com/directory/symptoms>

Treatment is a different story. The medical establishment has a very
effective monopoly on drugs and procedures, which is probably a good
thing from the safety standpoint. There are databases of commonly
prescribed drugs and treatments, but those are not easily
understandable or accessible to the GUM (great unwashed masses). The
Star Trek Tricorder is a probably a decade in the future. An open
source medication replicator, maybe 20 years.

[sms]

On 2/22/2022 10:56 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

<snip>

> Diagnosis is not a problem. We now have online web sites and AI
> algorithms that can diagnose many common ailments. For example:
> <https://symptoms.webmd.com>
> <https://www.mayoclinic.org/symptom-checker/select-symptom/itt-20009075>
> More:
> <https://openmd.com/directory/symptoms>

Print your diploma out and take it with you the next time you go to the
doctor: <https://i.imgur.com/YFs6RHz.png>.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:13:04 -0500, Frank Krygowski
<frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>On 2/22/2022 11:56 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> And that I have an additional education in navigation from a high ranked college in Marin county?
>
>I do remember you bragging about that. As I recall, Jeff was unable to
>find the existence of such a thing. But feel free to give us
>documentation, for a change from storytelling and bragging!

I need to find the original thread, but as I recall, I couldn't find
any school that offered a degree in navigation:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=degree+in+navigation>
There are bachelors degrees in Navigation Technology, Maritime
Sciences, Nautical Sciences, etc but those are mostly 4 year college
degrees. I'm not sure, but I think the 2 year degrees are all
"certificates" and not "degrees". Degrees usually require a
substantial number of general education courses. There are schools
that offer navigation certifications, but those are not colleges.

Reminder: Tom claimed to have a lifetime membership in the Aeolian
Yacht Club. Too bad they don't offer lifetime memberships. I suspect
this might be where "education in navigation" (previously a "degree in
navigation") originated.

>> Or that I have a two year degree from Chabot College in Hayward?
>
>Hmm. I think this may be new information,

Yep. That's new. Google groups search shows no mention of Tom
posting anything about Chabot College prior to today 02/22/2022:
<https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/search?q=Chabot%20author%3ATom%20author%3AKunich>
No mention of Chabot College on his LinkedIn resume. Ah, I foundit:
<https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/c/_Y1MbXuzvNo/m/o6omSxsfAgAJ>
Education
general education - Degree in navigation
Tality requested I get a BA so that they could promote me to
department manager
Chabot College - Hayward, CA

Tom. Which "area of study" did you take? See bottom of web page for
the list:
<http://www.chabotcollege.edu>

>although I don't take notes on
>your copious flights of fancy.

I take some notes. I was thinking of producing a web page itemizing
Tom's lies, amazing facts, and unanswered questions. I haven't done
this because I suspect Tom might enjoy the attention and I'm currently
a bit busy.

>What I recall about you and "college" is
>your tale of attending part of a term and walking out because the
>socialist instructors obviously didn't know as much as you did.

Something like that. I don't recall exactly what Tom claimed and am
too busy/lazy to search for the exact claim.

[Tom Kunich]

When I discovered that diploma I published all of the information about it. If Jeff couldn't find it he was a liar plain and simple.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 11:51:00 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

Thanks. I like that. I'll print a few copies on my color laser
printer. Maybe I'll have a T-shirt made. I probably would do that if
any of my various doctors had a sense of humor. I discovered that the
hard way after having triple bypass surgery. I arrived for a follow
up visit with a long cloth zipper taped to my chest over the incision.
My cardiologist was not amused.

[AMuzi]

I'm as critical as anyone of our recently diminished Medical
Billing Industry (formerly medical services). That said,
diagnosis is a refined art requiring both great skill and
deep knowledge, ideally after thousands of iterations. MDs
who are good are very good (although that group is
retiring/quitting at dramatic rates). The news is filled
with idiots who (wrongly) self-diagnose from web pages.
Something to keep in mind- seek an informed opinion besides
your own.

[Ralph Barone]

That’s great. Where did you get it from?

[Tom Kunich]

Plainly your Alzheimer's is advancing rapidly. I said that after I got all of the preliminaries out of the way I audited a physics class at UC Berkeley and that after almost the entire hour of the class the instructor hadn't uttered one single word of physics but had recited socialist propaganda. So I told him off and walked out.

You and Frank simply exaggerate or simply falsify my statements in the hope that I will let you get away with it. Frank's claim that you were unable to find that school of navigation in Marin is an example of that. At the time I published all of the data about it. So if you couldn't find it you're simply a liar. Since I had a degree I assume that the only place that could have issued that was https://www.edumaritime.net/california/california-maritime-academy-vallejo

The only thing I can remember about it is that I was the only one that could use the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore and take a noon latitude. The last voyage, the boat had a GPS so that I could verify my measurements. Since I was the navigator I was also a watch captain and took the night watch. Watches were 4 hours on and 4 hours off.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:04:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>When I discovered that diploma I published all of the information about it. If Jeff couldn't find it he was a liar plain and simple.

If you claim to have a diploma, you are responsible for providing the
necissary "information", not me. I can't seem to find anything
related to you having a diploma using Google Groups search. I went
through the articles you posted with the word "diploma" and found
nothing relevent:
<https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/search?q=diploma%20author%3Atom%20author%3Akunich>
If Google can't find it, it doesn't exist.

Of course, absense of proof is not proof of absense, so it's possible
I missed something important. However, your inability to recall,
find, or produce the diploma "information" is very suspicious and
suggests that you might not have "published" anything. Finding your
own postings using Google Groups search is admittedly difficult, but
not impossible. Try it. You might find something and prove me wrong.

Incidentally, even if I was a liar, there's nothing to stop you from
also being a liar.

[sms]

<https://imgflip.com/memetemplate/308032443/Internet-Doctor-of-Medicine>

My nephew and his wife are both physicians. It drives my niece crazy
when someone thinks that their Google Search trumps her medical degree.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:42:11 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

Tell me about the courses you took at Chabot College.

>I said that after I got all of the preliminaries out of the way I audited a physics class at UC Berkeley

Amazing. In order to audit a class at any university, you must first
be admitted to the university as a student. That means you have to
produced a high skool graduation diploma or degree. Auditing classes
are the same as being a regular student, except that you do not
receive a grade or credit for the class, and your transcript would
show an "AU" or something similar to prove that you had taken the
class.

>and that after almost the entire hour of the class the instructor
>hadn't uttered one single word of physics but had recited socialist
>propaganda. So I told him off and walked out.

Nobody else walked out? Just you? Did you try again with another
physics instructor? Did you complain to the administration? Did you
ask for a tuition refund?

>You and Frank simply exaggerate or simply falsify my statements
>in the hope that I will let you get away with it.

Get away with what? Just how am I suppose to falsify your statements
when everything I use are your statements as saved by Google Groups?
Are you suggesting that Frank and I are impersonating you?

>Frank's claim that you were unable to find that school of navigation
>in Marin is an example of that. At the time I published all of the
>data about it. So if you couldn't find it you're simply a liar.

You just don't seem to understand how logic works. If you can't prove
your own claim, then don't expect someone else to do it for you.

>Since I had a degree I assume that the only place that could have
>issued that was
>https://www.edumaritime.net/california/california-maritime-academy-vallejo

Interesting that you wrote "had a degree" in past tense. Did you
loose your degree somehow? Can't get a replacement?

Looking through the list undergraduate majors, I don't see anything
mentioned about offering only a degree in navigation. Which major did
you take and what does it say on your degree?

>The only thing I can remember about it is that I was the only one
>that could use the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore
>and take a noon latitude.

More amazing facts that demonstrate you've never used a sextant. You
cannot measure distance with a sextant. All it does is measure the
elevation angle above the horizon. You can obtain the latitude with a
noon sight. How does one measure distance with a sextant?

>The last voyage, the boat had a GPS so that I could verify my
>measurements.

You don't really need a GPS to verify your measurements. A nautical
chart will do as well.

>Since I was the navigator I was also a watch captain and took the
>night watch. Watches were 4 hours on and 4 hours off.

I've never heard of a night watch or a watch captain. The traditional
watch names are:
- First Watch (2000hrs through to midnight)
- Middle Watch (000hrs to 0400hrs)
- Morning Watch (0400hrs to 0800hrs)
- Forenoon Watch (0800hrs to 1200hrs)
- Afternoon Watch (1200hrs to 1600hrs)
- First Dog Watch (1600hrs to 1800hrs)
- Last Dog Watch 1800hrs to 2000hrs)
The names do vary depending on service and type of vessel. You got
the 4 hr sea watches correct.

[ 45 minutes wasted ]

[Tom Kunich]

Who are you kidding Jeff? You never went through all those postings in a million years. At the time I discovered that Diploma I gave all of the information about it. I have no further responsibility to tell you anything. You don't like that? Tough shit.

[Tom Kunich]

Why didn't you tell us what experience you've had at sea? You might want to list the number of years you were a seaman so that everyone can understand what sort of knowledge you have. We'll be waiting for that.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 13:44:18 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:42:11 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
><cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>>The only thing I can remember about it is that I was the only one
>>that could use the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore
>>and take a noon latitude.
>
>More amazing facts that demonstrate you've never used a sextant. You
>cannot measure distance with a sextant. All it does is measure the
>elevation angle above the horizon. You can obtain the latitude with a
>noon sight. How does one measure distance with a sextant?

Oops. I just realized that it is possible to measure distance off
short with a sextant. It's not commonly used in that manner, but it
is possible. Tom, can you explain how it's done? If you can't, I'll
explain (later).

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 14:01:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 1:13:15 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:04:20 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
>> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >When I discovered that diploma I published all of the information about it. If Jeff couldn't find it he was a liar plain and simple.
>> If you claim to have a diploma, you are responsible for providing the
>> necissary "information", not me. I can't seem to find anything
>> related to you having a diploma using Google Groups search. I went
>> through the articles you posted with the word "diploma" and found
>> nothing relevent:
>> <https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/search?q=diploma%20author%3Atom%20author%3Akunich>
>> If Google can't find it, it doesn't exist.
>>
>> Of course, absense of proof is not proof of absense, so it's possible
>> I missed something important. However, your inability to recall,
>> find, or produce the diploma "information" is very suspicious and
>> suggests that you might not have "published" anything. Finding your
>> own postings using Google Groups search is admittedly difficult, but
>> not impossible. Try it. You might find something and prove me wrong.
>>
>> Incidentally, even if I was a liar, there's nothing to stop you from
>> also being a liar.

>Who are you kidding Jeff? You never went through all those postings in a million years.

There were a total of 27 postings, 13 of which you wrote. It took me
a while, nothing close to a million years.

>At the time I discovered that Diploma I gave all of the information
>about it.

So, now you want to hide that information? If you disclosed it once,
why are you so afraid to disclose it again? Perhaps the "information"
doesn't exist?

>I have no further responsibility to tell you anything.

That's true. I can't make you do anything. However, that doesn't
stop me from pointing out your lies (and some probable lies).

>You don't like that? Tough shit.

If you're experiencing a "touch shit" problem, may I recommend a stool
softener such as polyethylene glycol 3350. I think you'll like it:
<https://medlineplus.gov/druginfo/meds/a603032.html>
For my qualifications to give medical advice, see:
<https://i.imgur.com/YFs6RHz.png>

Incidentally, you might enjoy reading this:
"Why Dems Will Even Gain House, Senate Seats"
<https://www.laprogressive.com/dems-gain-seats/>

[Frank Krygowski]

Tom, you're making even less sense than usual. If you have a diploma,
produce the evidence now. There are ways of doing that.

Pretending you "remember" having a diploma is not one of those ways,
especially given your "memory."

--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:22:41 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

Really? And how do you know that? You have visited Thailand? You can
speak Thai?
But I assume you mean places like:

https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.Fqobzbq4jC_CjpC9unQ9bwHaE8%26pid%3DApi&f=
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.aDPs8FkImUtExSZYkQFMFgHaDk%26pid%3DApi&f=1
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.5TeDlPCgwgbhTUwqF0HJugHaD4%26pid%3DApi&f=1
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.4cZJsUrCi9iRKmRWVls8DwHaE7%26pid%3DApi&f=1

You really are a stupid little fellow, aren't you.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:24:37 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

What education? Well, I have a high school diploma so 1 for me and 0
for you. Then I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering (aeronautical)
so 2 for me and 0 for you. And finally I completed an apprenticeship
in Machine Shop Practice (as my certificate says) so 3 for me and
strike out for you.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 11:13:11 AM UTC-6, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 2/22/2022 11:56 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 8:45:53 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> >> On 2/22/2022 11:24 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> >>>
> >>> What education have you had John?
> >> :-) Another day of unintentional irony from the guy without even a high
> >> school diploma!
> >>
> >> But congratulations on the GED certificate, Tom. At least you've got
> >> that, right?
> >
> > Why does it slip your mind that I discovered that I did graduate?
> Tom, people don't "discover" that they graduated high school. That's not
> how that works. And a high school diploma disqualifies you from getting
> a GED, which you've claimed you have.
> > And that I have an additional education in navigation from a high ranked college in Marin county?
> I do remember you bragging about that. As I recall, Jeff was unable to
> find the existence of such a thing. But feel free to give us
> documentation, for a change from storytelling and bragging!

I can believe that. After all Tommy has bragged numerous times about being a member of the Yacht Club. I am not a member of a Yacht Club. So I suspect the Yacht Club offered an afternoon class, seminar, on navigation one Saturday afternoon. And Tommy showed up to mock the instructor about all he did not know and Tommy did know. So Tommy now claims to have an education in navigation. Makes perfect sense to me. After all, I did take a class at Northwestern in Evanston one summer long ago. On how to sail a 420 class two man sail boat. We sailed on Lake Michigan. But I do not belong to a Yacht Club or claim I know how to sail. Other than what I learned that summer.

[John B.]

But did he, really?

For some years Tommy bragged about his failure to graduate from high
school and then you, Frank, mentioned the GED and suddenly Tommy
claimed that "Oh Yes! I had one of them too!
--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

??????? Back in the 1950s when my Mom became an RN, she took a 4 year degree. And in the 1970s my Uncle took a 4 year degree to become an RN. My niece a couple years ago became an RN with a 4 year degree. So I don't know about this claim you could become an RN with only a 2 year degree. Not since the 1950s anyway.

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 08:56:04 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 8:45:53 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 2/22/2022 11:24 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> >
>> > What education have you had John?
>> :-) Another day of unintentional irony from the guy without even a high
>> school diploma!
>>
>> But congratulations on the GED certificate, Tom. At least you've got
>> that, right?
>

>Why does it slip your mind that I discovered that I did graduate?

Well, yes, we did hear you say that you "graduated" but then you lied
on your resume... the very first entry.... so, one might assume,
you've probably lied all your life.

--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:03:46 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:13:04 -0500, Frank Krygowski
><frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>>On 2/22/2022 11:56 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>>> And that I have an additional education in navigation from a high ranked college in Marin county?
>>
>>I do remember you bragging about that. As I recall, Jeff was unable to
>>find the existence of such a thing. But feel free to give us
>>documentation, for a change from storytelling and bragging!
>
>I need to find the original thread, but as I recall, I couldn't find
>any school that offered a degree in navigation:
><https://www.google.com/search?q=degree+in+navigation>
>There are bachelors degrees in Navigation Technology, Maritime
>Sciences, Nautical Sciences, etc but those are mostly 4 year college
>degrees. I'm not sure, but I think the 2 year degrees are all
>"certificates" and not "degrees". Degrees usually require a
>substantial number of general education courses. There are schools
>that offer navigation certifications, but those are not colleges.
>

I may be out dated but back when I lived on a boat a professional had
a license from the Coast Guard (I think it was) and that was all that
was required. I'm going from memory here but I'm reasonably sure that
there was no "Navigator" certificate issued. Why should there be? As
the normal Captain's license includes testing the ability to navigate.

I just did a quick search and found no USCG license for "Navigator".

--
Cheers,

John B.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
Fall on the floor in shock and surprise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!





>
> --
> Cheers,
>
> John B.

[sms]

On 2/22/2022 12:03 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

<snip>

> I take some notes. I was thinking of producing a web page itemizing
> Tom's lies, amazing facts, and unanswered questions. I haven't done
> this because I suspect Tom might enjoy the attention and I'm currently
> a bit busy.
>
>> What I recall about you and "college" is
>> your tale of attending part of a term and walking out because the
>> socialist instructors obviously didn't know as much as you did.
>
> Something like that. I don't recall exactly what Tom claimed and am
> too busy/lazy to search for the exact claim.

Not to cast any aspersions on lovely Marin County, but there are not any
"highly ranked colleges" there.

In Vallejo there is the California Maritime Academy, now called CSU
Maritime Academy. Vallejo is in Solano County. They have several courses
in navigation. Perhaps that is what Tom was referring to and just didn't
know what county the school is in.

[John B.]

I believe I've posted about the chap I knew -Special Forces trained
Medic - who described some of the testing that he went through before
he graduated from Medic Training. One was to be presented a list of
the patients complaints and then diagnose the most likely problem.

Something along the line of, A bloke comes in and with a slight fever
and a small cough, his right hip hurts and he had loose bowels
yesterday.

What is the most likely problem and what is the recommended treatment?
--
Cheers,

John B.

[AMuzi]

Try appendicitis, most commonly seen in military age young
men and notoriously difficult to diagnose. Not slighting
Navy Medical Corpsmen but there's a lot more to this.

[John B.]

Well, taking a "noon site" is a pretty elementary thing. I've seen 10
or 12 year old kids that could do that. And using a sextant to measure
distance? Well, if you are claiming that you used only a sextant then
you are lying again. And standing watch? On a commercial vessel there
is no such position as a "Watch Captain" there is only the Captain and
the Mates and normally the Mates stand watches under the supervision
of the Captain.

But, of course, if you want to play navy you can even call yourself an
Admiral, and never leave the Living Room.

And, by the way, I navigated my way from Phuket, Thailand to Perth,
Australia, nearly 3,000 land miles, say 2,600 nautical miles, and back
so obviously I do know a little about navigating a boat.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 14:05:29 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

You go first Tommy and please include copies of your USCG licenses.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 14:24:39 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>

wrote:

>On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 13:44:18 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:42:11 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
>><cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>>The only thing I can remember about it is that I was the only one
>>>that could use the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore
>>>and take a noon latitude.
>>
>>More amazing facts that demonstrate you've never used a sextant. You
>>cannot measure distance with a sextant. All it does is measure the
>>elevation angle above the horizon. You can obtain the latitude with a
>>noon sight. How does one measure distance with a sextant?
>
>Oops. I just realized that it is possible to measure distance off
>short with a sextant. It's not commonly used in that manner, but it
>is possible. Tom, can you explain how it's done? If you can't, I'll
>explain (later).

I asked him in another message but you cannot measure distance with
only a sextant and no other device/thing/etc.. Perhaps a trick
question but certainly true.
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 08:16:58 +0700, John B. <sloc...@gmail.com>

I beg to differ. I initially thought it couldn't be done but upon
further reflection, I realized that it's quite easy. You're correct
that other items are required:
1. Road map or nautical chart of the area.
2. Calculator and scratch pad.
3. Binoculars.
I will admit that it's somewhat of a trick question. However, I can't
think of a hint that wouldn't also disclose the method, so I'll save
that for later.

Tamaya (Jupiter) MS-833 circa 1980.
<http://www.learnbydestroying.com/jeffl/crud/Tamaya_MS-833.jpg>
<https://tamaya-technics.com/en/sextant/>
Today, about $2,000 new or $900 on eBay used.

[John B.]

Nope. The bloke had "had drink taken" the previous evening and the
fall that hurt the hip, headache and loose bowels was the result. The
treatment was two APC pills and "come back tomorrow if you don't feel
better" (:-)
--
Cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 14:38:59 -0600, AMuzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote:
>I'm as critical as anyone of our recently diminished Medical
>Billing Industry (formerly medical services).

Agreed. If your doctors do NOT work for a medical group or HMO, you
might want to ask how much they pay for malpractice insurance:
"How Much Does Malpractice Insurance Cost?"
<https://physiciansthrive.com/malpractice-insurance/costs/>
A few years ago, a doctor friend casually mentioned that the local
hospital had about 250 lawsuits pending, and that his small practice
was paying $70,000/year for essentially protection money. I'm not
sure about the current case load or insurance charges.

>That said,
>diagnosis is a refined art requiring both great skill and
>deep knowledge, ideally after thousands of iterations. MDs
>who are good are very good (although that group is
>retiring/quitting at dramatic rates). The news is filled
>with idiots who (wrongly) self-diagnose from web pages.
>Something to keep in mind- seek an informed opinion besides
>your own.

Good advice that would apply nicely to a majority of people. My view
is somewhere in between the extremes of turning one's life over to the
doctors versus alternative medicine. I'm about half way in between. A
few details:

I order detailed blood tests every 6 months from DirectLabs.com:
<https://www.directlabs.com>
In general, the tests are far more extensive than Medicare will
consider justifiable and somewhat cheaper than the deductible. In the
past 20 years, it has uncovered hints of major problems well before
symptoms appeared.

I research the cost of prescribed drugs and look for alternatives. My
guess(tm) is that I've drastically cut my drug billing at least by
half. Often, the doctor prescribes a pill that is a combination of
two drugs but which costs more than the two ingredients purchased
separately.

I tend to be rather sensitive to many drugs, where the recommended
dose is an overdose for me. The doctors understand the problem, but
are worried about being accused of practicing creative medicine. To
obtain plausible denial, the compromise is that I have to take the
standard dose and report any adverse reactions before the doctor can
reduce the dosage. This has nearly killed me once, and made me rather
ill another time. I now have a tolerable drug titration setup with
which I can optimize the dosage, but don't want to risk it.

For a while, I had a small chemistry lab setup at home. I was trying
to synthesize some of the drugs I was taking. In general, I succeeded
in making the drug, but did not have much control over the potency and
therefore the dosage. After a few mistakes, I decided it was too
risky and purchased the real drugs.

For about 10 years, I had problems with acid reflux. The
gastroenterologist ran tests and recommended a mix of bland diet and
acid blockers. That helped, a little. By coincidence, I had to go
through a series of four kidney surgeries. After each surgery, I
noticed that my acid reflux problem was disappearing. After the last
surgery, it was totally gone. It's been about 2 years and it remains
totally gone. What happened was the surgeons gave me an antibiotic
that effectively killed all the bugs in my stomach and intestinal
tract. Apparently, the bacterial infection that was causing the acid
reflux was also killed, and never came back.

Basically, there are plenty of things that individuals can do for
themselves instead of hiring a doctor to do the work. Obviously, this
kind of do-it-myself medicine is not for everyone. Hopefully, it
won't be outlawed. Also, if my guess(tm) is right, when the internet
fad is over and gone, the replacement will be something like home
medicine, simply because commercial medicine will be too expensive for
anyone to afford.

[John B.]

On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 18:42:03 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>

Read what I said - cannot measure distance with only a sextant and no
other device/thing/etc."

And yes... if you have an accurate chart or you know the height of a
mountain or the distance between to rocks you can calculate distance
with a sextant but they are "other devices, things, etc." (:-)

But having said that many nautical charts were drawn from survey data
perhaps a hundred years, or more, old and weren't accurate down to the
last nth of a whatever. I'm reminded of a good friend who's favorite
anchoring place at an island in the Philippines was, according to his
new GPS, something like a mile onto dry land.

See
https://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2016/06/23/accurate-nautical-charts/
for more information

--
Cheers,

John B.

[AMuzi]

My point was that medical diagnoses can be difficult at
times with high stakes.

[Tom Kunich]

On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 2:24:48 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 13:44:18 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
> wrote:
> >On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:42:11 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
> ><cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>The only thing I can remember about it is that I was the only one
> >>that could use the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore
> >>and take a noon latitude.
> >
> >More amazing facts that demonstrate you've never used a sextant. You
> >cannot measure distance with a sextant. All it does is measure the
> >elevation angle above the horizon. You can obtain the latitude with a
> >noon sight. How does one measure distance with a sextant?
> Oops. I just realized that it is possible to measure distance off
> short with a sextant. It's not commonly used in that manner, but it
> is possible. Tom, can you explain how it's done? If you can't, I'll
> explain (later).

So suddenly you remember what trigonometry is? Amazing. You must have emailed someone that actually has an education.

[Tom Kunich]

I apparently put it in my records storage and I have to intentions of digging through years and years of records for your satisfaction of wasting my time. Where is YOUR diploma? Framed in glass sitting on your wall, the most important thing in your life?

[Tom Kunich]

Well, I was making a quarter of a million dollars per year without your oh so valuable diploma. Tell us how much you were making?

[Tom Kunich]

You are not a member of a yacht club and yet you know all about them. You also knew that a 40 meter radio had an antenna 40 meters off of the ground. You also cannot use simple arithmetic nor understand the English language. You are do vastly intelligent I just can ever hope to match that.

[Tom Kunich]

According to Frank, a GED isn't a high school diploma. Also according to Frank, the test given to people entering the service isn't an IQ test and yet they put me working on the bomb/nav system on a B52 and they put you asking a tow truck operator to tow your aircraft over to a parking space. They put you holding a log book for the crew to enter their complaints and for technicians to check off.

And I also said that at my high school reunion I discovered that I did have a high school graduation anyway since I had more than enough credits to graduate when I joined the Air Force 3 months before normal graduation. But you and Frank continue to show your mass jealousy of successful people because you worked very hard to become nothing.

[Tom Kunich]

Scharf's entire world is belittling anyone. He has never recovered from being elected and then allowing the electorate to see him as he really is. Now he couldn't get elected to dog catcher. Imagine being the most hated leftist in a town that is nearly communist in composition.

[Tom Kunich]

So, now we know that Scharf is totally unaware that Vallejo is in Marin County. But he would like you to vote for him.

[Tom Kunich]

I presently am having stress pain in my left lower abdomen and am one of the one out of 8500 to have their guts reversed. So perhaps I am developing appendicitis.

[Tom Kunich]

Why are you continually posting about things you know absolutely nothing about? Do you believe that ships and boats navigate anything more than crudely by navigational chart? You simply must advertise your ignorance with every push of a key don't you?

[Tom Kunich]

Medics are little more than nurses without the education. More than half of the standard treatments in hospitals are performed by nurses. My just retired sister in law ran the entire diabetes treatments for Alameda County. She had other nurses below her that would connect each patient up to the blood treatment machines for the proper period of time.

Idiots like Russell and Slow Johnny think that a nurse is nothing more than a receptionist.

[Frank Krygowski]

You mean you "remember" putting it somewhere. You need to stop trusting
your memory, Tom. Your own posts have confirmed that dozens of times.

> Where is YOUR diploma? Framed in glass sitting on your wall, the most important thing in your life?

All my diplomas (and my wife's, too) are in the file cabinet about six
feet from me, where I keep important papers.

I don't have the diplomas framed on the wall. But I do have two
Professional Engineer licenses framed on the wall.

In a sense, framing diplomas would be redundant anyway. One can't get
the PE without the education, plus sufficient professional experience.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/23/2022 10:19 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
>
>
> Well, I was making a quarter of a million dollars per year without your oh so valuable diploma. Tell us how much you were making?

Is that what you "remember"? :-)



--
- Frank Krygowski

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 07:14:44 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich

<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 2:24:48 PM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 13:44:18 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
>> wrote:
>> >On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 12:42:11 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
>> ><cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >>The only thing I can remember about it is that I was the only one
>> >>that could use the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore
>> >>and take a noon latitude.

>> >More amazing facts that demonstrate you've never used a sextant. You
>> >cannot measure distance with a sextant. All it does is measure the
>> >elevation angle above the horizon. You can obtain the latitude with a
>> >noon sight. How does one measure distance with a sextant?

>> Oops. I just realized that it is possible to measure distance off
>> short with a sextant. It's not commonly used in that manner, but it
>> is possible. Tom, can you explain how it's done? If you can't, I'll
>> explain (later).

>So suddenly you remember what trigonometry is? Amazing. You must have emailed someone that actually has an education.

Actually, I struggled with the trig for about 2 hours last night and
eventually decided that I must be doing something wrong. So, I
cheated and used Google search to find the solution. I found several,
all of which turned out to be quite simple.

So, are you going to explain how to measure the distance off-shore
using sextant? You claimed that "I was the only one that could use
the Captain's Sextant to measure distance off-shore". You claim that
you had a degree in navigation and some experience with the method(s).
Therefore you should be able to explain how it's done. If you feel
uncomfortable with the trig, explain how it's done with a sextant,
nautical chart (map), drafting compass, calculator and ruler. I'll
provide the math and trig if necessary. There are several methods and
variations, some which require little or no math. If you need clues
to refresh your memory, I can provide some. I'll wait until the
weekend for your reply.

Incidentally, "I was the only one that could use the Captain's
Sextant...and take a noon latitude" seems a bit odd because it usually
takes two sailors to do a noon sight. It can be done by one person if
there is a radio receiver available to play the WWV time while
counting the clicks or using a stopwatch to obtain the exact time.
However, it's much better to record a series of sextant measurements
to accurately determine the exact time when the sun is at the highest
point, which requires two sailors. Something like this:
<https://www.usni.org/magazines/naval-history-magazine/2020/june/navigating-sextant>
If you were the only one who knew how to do this, how did you manage
to do it by yourself?

[Jeff Liebermann]

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vallejo,_California>
The first line says:
"Vallejo is a waterfront city in Solano County, California..."
<https://goo.gl/maps/bq4Dbrn83vm33ggE7>

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 07:19:04 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>Well, I was making a quarter of a million dollars per year without your oh so valuable diploma. Tell us how much you were making?

We've been here before. Which company paid you $250,000/year, which
at the time was likely more than what they paid the company president?
Does that include bonuses and stock options?

[sms]

On 2/23/2022 10:02 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

<snip>

> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vallejo,_California>
> The first line says:
> "Vallejo is a waterfront city in Solano County, California..."
> <https://goo.gl/maps/bq4Dbrn83vm33ggE7>

What's so strange is that instead of Tom simply admitting an honest
mistake, of not knowing which county the city of Vallejo, and the CSU
Maritime Academy are located, he decides to double down and lie yet
again. To what end? There's no debate as to which county Vallejo is in.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 07:37:25 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
<cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:

>I presently am having stress pain in my left lower abdomen and am one of the one out of 8500 to have their guts reversed. So perhaps I am developing appendicitis.

<https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/10029-malrotation>
"Malrotation occurs in around one out of every 500 births in the
United States and usually presents within the first year of a baby’s
life, though it may also be asymptomatic. Only around one out of every
6000 infants will develop symptomatic malrotation, with 30% to 60% of
cases diagnosed during the first week of life."

"Left Side Appendicitis with Midgut Malrotation in an Adult"
<https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3889003/>

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 10:13:11 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

I've been pondering the same question. My best guess(tm) is that Tom
is looking for attention. It doesn't matter if his comments are right
or wrong as long as he gets his daily (hourly?) dose of attention from
readers. A correct answer, apology, or admission of error will
usually result in no replies. However, a wrong answer, insult, or
stupid comment, will attract far more attention. So, Tom tends to be
chronically wrong because it works best for his goal of attracting
attention to himself.

[Lou Holtman]

Assume that is the case what would a smart person do?

Lou

[Tom Kunich]

On the Marin peninsula.

[Tom Kunich]

On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 10:17:19 AM UTC-8, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 07:37:25 -0800 (PST), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >I presently am having stress pain in my left lower abdomen and am one of the one out of 8500 to have their guts reversed. So perhaps I am developing appendicitis.
> <https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/10029-malrotation>
> "Malrotation occurs in around one out of every 500 births in the
> United States and usually presents within the first year of a baby’s
> life, though it may also be asymptomatic. Only around one out of every
> 6000 infants will develop symptomatic malrotation, with 30% to 60% of
> cases diagnosed during the first week of life."
>
> "Left Side Appendicitis with Midgut Malrotation in an Adult"
> <https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3889003/>

Is there some reason that your sick mind continues to post here?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Situs_inversus Maybe IF you could read you'd be able to see that is occurs .01% of one in 10,000 people. I suggest you have another visit with your psychologist because you last several posting have been only to attempt to prove me wrong on any point possible. You mind is going and your Alzheimer's is advancing at a rate that you brain will soon become non-functional with the usual shut down of all body processes such as your heart.

[Tom Kunich]

You are quite right Lou. Jeff doesn't ride a bicycle so what is he doing on this group? If he believes that all I'm doing is looking for attention why does his entire world revolve around giving it to me? He is sick and crippled. He was never much in the way of an engineer if what he says is true (which, judging from his other statements, is questionable) and the jealousy emitted from Frank and Jeff makes you wonder why they bother unless it is mental problems. I suppose I shouldn't bother with them but Jeff's idea that the 40 mile distance from Marin City which is the Marin County center to Vallejo, which is only 40 miles is some sort of important point he is making makes it pretty plain what is going on inside of his head.

I shouldn't but I'm really going to have to rub his nose into the fact that I just bought a Colnago C50, a Bontrager wheelset and as soon as I sell one of my other bikes I will buy a Campy groupset to put on it. He, in the meantime will be posting on a bicycles.tech group as if he had some sort of business here.

[Ralph Barone]

+1

[Frank Krygowski]

On 2/23/2022 1:28 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Feb 2022 10:13:11 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> What's so strange is that instead of Tom simply admitting an honest
>> mistake, of not knowing which county the city of Vallejo, and the CSU
>> Maritime Academy are located, he decides to double down and lie yet
>> again. To what end? There's no debate as to which county Vallejo is in.
>
> I've been pondering the same question. My best guess(tm) is that Tom
> is looking for attention. It doesn't matter if his comments are right
> or wrong as long as he gets his daily (hourly?) dose of attention from
> readers. A correct answer, apology, or admission of error will
> usually result in no replies. However, a wrong answer, insult, or
> stupid comment, will attract far more attention. So, Tom tends to be
> chronically wrong because it works best for his goal of attracting
> attention to himself.

I'm no psychologist, but I don't think Tom's behavior is generated by a
simple desire for attention. For one thing, if that were the case he
would be doing what I've suggested: taking his arguments to a much
bigger audience.

I think this article is much closer to Tom's truth:
https://evolutioncounseling.com/combative-attitude-explained/
"It’s hard to empathize with the combative life attitude until we look
below the surface and see it’s a protective mechanism, meant to combat
the anxiety produced from a world perceived as hostile."

Tom has constantly raged against, well, almost everyone. He feels under
threat from immigrants, liberals, communists, Democrats, medical
professionals, black protesters, police and more. Despite his frequent
bragging, he has no feelings of security; so he mounts a continuous
aggressive defense.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

My high school diploma, I have no idea where it is at. I looked for it a few years ago but had no idea even where to begin looking. I'll have to ask my Mom some day if she knows where she put it. But my college diplomas, yes I had them framed and they hang on the wall. I never thought of a high school diploma as being something to be proud of. We are not living in the 1800s when a high school diploma was a big accomplishment. The first boy in the family to achieve that monumental accomplishment!!!!! EVERYONE (except Tommy) has a high school diploma. Big whoop. But only 37.5% of USA has a college degree. Bigger whoop.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 at 9:29:09 AM UTC-6, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 at 4:25:25 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
> > On Tue, 22 Feb 2022 11:45:49 -0500, Frank Krygowski
> > <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> >
> > >On 2/22/2022 11:24 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > >>
> > >> What education have you had John?
> > >
> > >:-) Another day of unintentional irony from the guy without even a high
> > >school diploma!
> > >
> > >But congratulations on the GED certificate, Tom. At least you've got
> > >that, right?
> > But did he, really?
> >
> > For some years Tommy bragged about his failure to graduate from high
> > school and then you, Frank, mentioned the GED and suddenly Tommy
> > claimed that "Oh Yes! I had one of them too!
> According to Frank, a GED isn't a high school diploma.

It isn't Tommy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Educational_Development
"The General Educational Development (GED) tests are a group of four subject tests which, when passed, provide certification that the test taker has United States or Canadian high school-level academic skills. It is an alternative to the US high school diploma, HiSET, and TASC test. The GED Testing Service website currently does not refer to the test as anything but "GED".

The American Council on Education (ACE), in Washington, D.C. (U.S.), which owns the GED trademark, coined the initialism to identify "tests of general equivalency development" that measure proficiency in science, mathematics, social studies, reading, and writing. Passing the GED test gives those who do not complete high school, or who do not meet requirements for high school diploma, the opportunity to earn their high school equivalency credential, also called a high school equivalency development or general equivalency diploma."

Also according to Frank, the test given to people entering the service isn't an IQ test and yet they put me working on the bomb/nav system on a B52 and they put you asking a tow truck operator to tow your aircraft over to a parking space. They put you holding a log book for the crew to enter their complaints and for technicians to check off.
>
> And I also said that at my high school reunion I discovered that I did have a high school graduation anyway since I had more than enough credits to graduate when I joined the Air Force 3 months before normal graduation. But you and Frank continue to show your mass jealousy of successful people because you worked very hard to become nothing.

We know Tommy. You have claimed this many times before. But as Frank pointed out, you CANNOT sit for the GED tests if you have a high school diploma. They check on those things. So do you have a high school diploma or a GED? One or the other Tommy.

[ritzann...@gmail.com]

I doubt that. The treatments part. Not the medics being nurses. Or nurses in training. That makes sense. The military takes volunteers or picks people to be medics. Nurses on the battlefield and front line. Then trains them to perform this task. The military trains everyone for whatever task they assign to the person. My uncle was a medic in the Navy in the 1970s and became a RN nurse with a college degree afterwards. But as for treatments in hospitals, official doctors are involved. Maybe not too involved. Maybe the nurse writes up a report and preliminary diagnosis, and the doctor looks at it and looks at the patient and says OK. But a doctor is always involved. Not a nurse only.

> My just retired sister in law ran the entire diabetes treatments for Alameda County. She had other nurses below her that would connect each patient up to the blood treatment machines for the proper period of time.

Tommy, Tommy, Tommy. Why oh why do you write about things you do not know anything at all about? You have no idea what the diabetes treatment for patients with this disease is. Why write nonsense about it? I know this is one of your trademarks. Just like you wrote about navigation and Jeff and John I believe corrected you on a sextant and how to navigate. But making up stuff on how diabetes is treated? Blood treatment machines are not used to treat diabetes.

Diabetes is an endocrine disease. The endocrine gland called the pancreas does not work. The Islets of Langerhans inside the pancreas create insulin. Insulin is a hormone that binds with sugar in the bloodstream and allows it to be received by the cells in the body. When diabetes is diagnosed, these cells inside the pancreas are not working. Thus allowing sugar to build up in the blood stream. Now when a diabetic is first diagnosed, or whenever they have very poor control of their diabetes, DKA Diabetic Ketoacidosis may develop. A diabetes treatment place/doctor/clinic (as you sister-in-law ran) will receive the first diagnosed patient and put him/her on an IV. This IV will have saline (water to dilute the blood) and insulin in it. Insulin is used to get the sugar out of the blood and into the cells. Water/saline is to dilute the blood and make it less acidic. When first diagnosed and with DKA, the diabetic is literally starving to death because the body cells are not able to get any sugar from the blood. They are starving. The body tries to fix this problem by breaking down fats and this causes acids to go into the blood. I guess breaking down fat causes acid. This can be deadly.

Thus the IV to dilute the blood with saline and the insulin to get the sugar into the cells and cause the body to stop using fat as fake fuel and putting acid into the blood. This initial diagnosis and DKA would be the ONLY time a diabetic is hooked up to a "blood treatment machine" as you stated. But I don't think anyone except you would say an IV is a machine. Diabetics do not use machines that filter the blood like kidney dialysis or chemotherapy.

Again Tommy, stop talking about stuff you are completely clueless of. Now I know that means you would have absolutely nothing on earth to talk about. Because you seem to be clueless on everything under the sun. But don't make up nonsensical lies.

>
> Idiots like Russell and Slow Johnny think that a nurse is nothing more than a receptionist.

No Tommy. I have many nurses in my family. And have met many at clinics and hospitals. I have watched what they do. Receptionist was not one of their duties. HOWEVER, I do wonder if the receptionists at the numerous clinics I have been to do have nurses working the receptionist chair. Maybe the nurses in the clinic rotate between seeing patients and working the receptionist chair. And doing the other administrative tasks in the office. Like scheduling appointments and filling out forms on the computer. Anyone know people who work at a clinic and can answer this?

[sms]

On 2/23/2022 1:07 PM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:

<snip>

> It isn't Tommy.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Educational_Development
> "The General Educational Development (GED) tests are a group of four subject tests which, when passed, provide certification that the test taker has United States or Canadian high school-level academic skills. It is an alternative to the US high school diploma, HiSET, and TASC test. The GED Testing Service website currently does not refer to the test as anything but "GED".

In California it's called a "California High School Equivalency
Certificate."

You can't receive it until age 18 (17 in some instances). Most of the
students in the schools in my area could probably pass that test after
completing middle school, but that's not allowable.

It really should not be labeled as an "alternative" to a high school
diploma.

With a GED you can attend community college then you could transfer to a
four year college to get a bachelor's degree, but you'd be unlikely to
gain admission directly to a four year accredited institution with a
GED. You could also attend a proprietary, unaccredited for-profit
college like "Trump University," even without a high school diploma or GED.

<snip>

> We know Tommy. You have claimed this many times before. But as Frank pointed out, you CANNOT sit for the GED tests if you have a high school diploma. They check on those things. So do you have a high school diploma or a GED? One or the other Tommy.

Frank is correct, but I think that it would not be difficult to sit for
the GED by lying about not having a high school diploma. AFAIK, there is
no national registry of every U.S. resident with a high school diploma.