Copper bottles??

[Beth H]

Rivelo (Riv dealer in Portland) is carrying a water bottle made of copper.
It looks gorgeous. Does anyone know anything about the rewards or risks of drinking water from a copper bottle?
It looks an awful lot like the one pictured here: http://www.amazon.com/Travellers-Copper-Bottle-Ayurvedic-Benefits/dp/B00XTQM7FI/ref=pd_bxgy_79_img_2?ie=UTF8&refRID=1HV10VSKRVP66797WN2H
Beth in pdx

[Beth H]

And here's what it looks like over at Rivelo: http://www.rivelopdx.com/shop/copper-water-bottle
Very pretty!
Beth

[Tim Gavin]

Umm, your water may taste like a penny?

Seriously, though, the "benefits" listed on the Amazon product page are hogwash, snake oil, etc.

It is quite classy looking, though!

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[Aaron Young]

I agree. Don't expect any other health benefit than being happy with your Electrified Copper water bottle purchase. Having said that any boost to your mood is a boon to your health. :)

I have a copper bottle from Rivelo and its quickly become my favorite daily drinking vessel. I actually like the slight metallic taste it gives the water, though. 

Electrically yours,

Aaron "zap" Young

The Dalles, OR

[Peter Adler]

Why am I not surprised that a bike retailer in Portland is carrying copper water bottles for large money, and spreading claptrap about unspecified health benefits? Has Portlandia become a documentary?

Copper was one of the first metals used by humans, after gold. Neither of them were used because of any virtues as elements; they were used because they were easy to work: low melting temperatures (easily reached by wood fires) and soft (workable with stone tools). Plus: Shiny!

People have been making cooking vessels out of copper for as long as they've been working copper, but raw copper was rapidly replaced by copper alloys (bronze and brass) and by raw copper pots lined with tin. Although copper is an excellent heat conductor, it is also highly reactive, especially with acids. It puts nasty poisonous stuff into your food.

There are unlined copper food vessels, but they're all for very limited food exposure. The primary ones are copper bowls for whipping cream or egg whites; the chemical reaction between the liquids and the copper gets the whipped cream/egg whites stiffer faster. Unlined copper is also used for high-quality plumbing, because copper is antibacterial. But the water isn't supposed to sit around in the pipes forever.

You need dietary copper. But all the copper you need is in your diet. It is perfectly possible to overdose on ingested copper (especially if the container has developed that decorative green verdigris), in which case the symptoms are quite nasty: Cirrhosis, kidney failure, Alzheimers, low blood pressure, brain necrosis. As a counter to the Ayurvedic claim (shhhhhyeah, right), let's note that there's a condition called "Indian childhood cirrhosis" (i.e., cirrhosis in kids who aren't old enough to have bashed their livers in with alcohol); this condition has been linked to boiling milk in unlined copper cookware. Call me a Western medicine bigot; but if Indian moms have been cooking milk in copper pots for centuries, watching their kids get sick, and not putting two and two together, then it's hard to appreciate the diagnostic rigor of of Ayurvedic medical practice.

I am a big fan of copper decorative items. Wilier Triestina's copper chromovelato is a stunning color. I've got copper bike tchotchkes of all sorts, including a plated copper travel mug that makes it onto the bike fairly often, and the copper version of the Crane Karen bell (actually copper-plated aluminum: more expensive and cheesier-sounding than the brass bell. If anyone's got the solid copper bell Jitensha used to stock and they're willing to sell it, let me know). I have actively fantasized about copper-anodizing a set of centerpull brakes to mount on my dark green Raleigh, for the City of Lost Children look. But aesthetics shouldn't be a suicide attempt; I wouldn't use copper in ways that endager my safety or impair my health. I wouldn't carry my water in unlined copper, just as I wouldn't have brakes made out of solid copper. No matter how pretty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper#Folk_medicine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copper_toxicity

Peter "saw a couple of chicas in downtown Oakland yesterday with Mason jar beer mugs, and nearly crashed as I rolled my eyes" Adler

Berkeley, CA/USA

On Friday, November 13, 2015 at 12:23:41 PM UTC-8, Beth H wrote:

[Bill Lindsay]

I'd still happily drink a moscow mule (or three) out of a copper cup:

http://www.copper.org/consumers/arts/2007/august/Moscow_Mule.html

[Steve Palincsar]

I'm sure you'll find gold water bottles are even better.   As for "unspecified health benefits," does anything make less sense than the reasoning behind homeopathy?  And yet, look how popular it is.

[Jim M.]

On Friday, November 13, 2015 at 2:39:40 PM UTC-8, Bill Lindsay wrote:

I'd still happily drink a moscow mule (or three) out of a copper cup:

That mug is lined so the copper won't leach into the drink. 

Peter beat me to the PSA. I wouldn't put anything acidic in an unlined copper vessel, and I'd be hesitant to drink water that sits for a while in one. Pretty, though.

jim m

wc ca

[John A. Bennett]

Dear Peter, and Anyone Else,

If it wasn't obvious, let me be more plain here: we're not making any health claims about copper bottles. They're just good looking, and work well as a water bottle.

Big Diffy has been drinking out of one for a while now, and I've never seen a more healthy human. 

Cheers,

John at Rivelo in Portland, where not everyone has a beard or a tattoo

On Friday, November 13, 2015 at 2:25:53 PM UTC-8, Peter Adler wrote:

[Aaron Young]

Peter, 

Thanks for sharing the bit about Indian Childhood Cirrhosis.  A little more digging and checking the citations shows that the link between the cirrhosis and the copper vessels isn't so clear.  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9587155  Also, this is a neonatal disease and doesn't fully apply to us adults.  Neonates are more susceptible to many conditions that adults aren't. 

All,

Here's the skinny:

Copper pipes in homes have a lifespan of about 15 or so years.  Corrosion should be minimal during that period if the water flowing through is not too acidic or too hot and the pipes' surface isn't damaged.  

Drinking cold, neutral pH water from a copper bottle like those in question is just as safe as drinking water from your tap.  You can check the pH of your tap water.  If it is less than 6.5 then you should be concerned about corroding the pipes and your water bottle and increasing your intake.  

Even then the risk of blowing out your liver is pretty small.  If one is that concerned about liver health then it would be better to avoid all alcohol intake instead of avoiding a copper water bottle.  

You are probably more likely to get too much copper from taking vitamin supplements than from drinking cool water from these bottles.  

I plan to keep drinking cold water from my solid "Electrified" copper bottle knowing the health risk exists, but is minimal if the bottle is used appropriately.  I'm also going to keep drinking alcohol knowing that the health risks exist, but within reason that life is for living! 

Cheers,

Aaron "zap me a beer" Young

The Dalles, OR

 

--

[Eric Norris]

Straight from RiVelo ... the benefits of copper bottles (not be take too seriously). 

My daughter and I stopped there tonight to pick up a copper bottle. I will drink from it and let the group know if there are any ill effects.

--Eric N

www.CampyOnly.com

CampyOnlyGuy.blogspot.com

Twitter: @CampyOnlyGuy

[Bill Gibson]

It's gorgeous and fun. Recyclable, too. But heavy and um, of low heat capacity. 

Bill Gibson
Tempe, Arizona, USA

[Aaron Young]

Oh, I forgot to mention.  I put a bird on mine.  ;)

[cyclotourist]

Bravo!!!!

Cheers,
David

Member, Supreme Council of Cyberspace

"it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride." - Seth Vidal

[Ron Mc]

I wish I had one of those this morning.  Riding down to meet my friends who have set up their RVs at a KOA on the cross-town greenway trail, and of course have their bikes.  My buddy homebrews (buys Russian River "parts" and homebrews real Pliny), kegs in 5-gal soda cans, and has this portable draft stand.  

It would be cool to draw my Pliny into a my own copper stein that came from my water bottle cage.