Polling what's the best 650b touring tire?

[hsmitham]

Hey RBW riders, curious what you all think is the best  650b & 700c tire for touring? Is it even possible to have a plush ride with decent flat resistance?

Hugh

Sunland, Ca

[Manuel Acosta]

I don't know about 700c but for 650b by far my favorite tire. Good for anything. Great at nothing. are

Schwalbe Marathon wire GreenGuard 

Lovely tire. Find it just good enough to do anything. From long road rides to rutty dirt trails. Granted they seem a tad heavy and the tread isn't ideal for loose, gravely stuff. But I feel that every tire can be good for anything. Lots of the "feel" of the bike is based on your own riding abilities. The beauty of this tire is that you don't have to over think about what your riding on. Just go.

My 2 cents

[Michael Hechmer]

I run Marathon Racers on my touring tandem and have been very pleased with them.  Much of our riding is dirt roads and these tires offer great comfort and have not flatted in the first 800 miles, even with 400+ lbs. of load.  On my single touring bike I commuted for a number of years, over a great deal of bad roads and urban debris on Avocet 38c Cross tires.  These gave good comfort, and relatively low rolling resistance and I never had a single flat.  The sidewalls are starting to look somewhat worn now.

Michael 

[Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery]

Marathon Supreme in 700C. I also like Big Apple and Mondial. In 650B, there aren't many chooses, but the Marathon is probably the best of them, in terms of durability. There's no reason you can't tour on Hetres, though, or any other tire. After all, "touring" is just riding your bike.

[Steve Palincsar]

On Tue, 2013-01-29 at 19:56 -0800, hsmitham wrote:
> Is it even possible to have a plush ride with decent flat resistance?

Absolutely. The Hetre is about as plush as it gets, and it has
excellent flat resistance, in my experience. (Note, however, I have
zero experience with goatheads and similar.)

[Matthew J]

When I was riding 650B I had good luck with Hetres, even better with the Soma. 

 

The 700 Grand Bois Cypres I am riding now are avoiding flats on combination road, paved, and limestone trails.  These probably are not the right choice if you will be riding places with larger stones.  Also I've never ridden out west, but it sounds as though goat head thorns would overwhelm the Grand Bois.

[C.J. Filip]

Been riding on the Col de la Vie (38mm) this winter. Cheap, plush,
lightish. No flats yet. Have a set of Hetres standing by but they
won't fit under the 50mm hammered Honjos my bike is currently
outfitted with.

[ted]

In my experience, only tires with thick rubber thwart goat heads. So if you dont want to ride very stout tires, you just try not to ride over goat heads.

[franklyn]

I have toured with Panaracer CdlV and Soma B-line, and they are pretty good. I think Soma's 650b Xpress advertises to have good puncture resistance, and is relatively light.

Franklyn

[Bruce Herbitter]

Rivendell Maxy Fastys have had an excellent combination of lightweight, pace and flat resistance. The current pair I have is still good after 2,900 flat free miles.

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[Jan Heine]

Touring, I don't think I've had more than one or two flats. This is
over decades of occasional tours, and tens of thousands of miles. On
backroads, there tends to be very little debris, and wider tires get
fewer flats anyhow. So I choose the most supple, comfortable and fun
tires I can find. Puncture protection is only a minor consideration.

Punctures seem to occur mostly during organized events that use the
shoulders of busy highways. I avoid those, not just because I get
flats, but also because I don't enjoy riding there. Some riders seem
to get more punctures on urban streets, but as long as you stay out of
the gutter, the road surface also tends to be relatively clean.

Overall, once you go to really wide tires, you will find that you get
almost zero punctures. I have ridden more than 12,000 miles on Grand
Bois Hetres, most of them in the city and suburbs, yet I've had only
two punctures. Both occurred when the tires were very worn. One was a
very sharp flint, the other a huge steel wire from an exploded truck
tire.

Disclosure: Our sister company, Compass Bicycles Ltd., sells Grand
Bois tires.

Jan Heine
Editor
Bicycle Quarterly
www.bikequarterly.com

Follow our blog at http://www.janheine.wordpress.com

[hsmitham]

I want to thank all of you for your contributions to my poll. The questions genesis was posed by my Brother who with me plans to do a tour in late spring down the California coast. I thought hey I know a resource of fellows with lots of knowledge. 

@ Jim Thill as it seems in my limited experience you have a straight forward logic really helpful and humorous, as in why didn't I think of that. @ Jan also in my limited experience your ability to clear misapprehension with precise logical investigation is a great resource thank you. 

Jan I have two rides on my Hetres and find such a plush ride with good puncture resistance hard to wrap my head around, don't get me wrong I believe you. Now I have to conduct my own data acquisition, oh the fun.

I could not be happier to have discovered this group. Cheers-

Hugh

Sunland, Ca

[Nanga Parbat]

I have been extremely happy with the Schwalbe Big Ben. They come in 700c and 650, roll fast, work better than expected off road, provide a plush ride and no flats.

My new favorite tire.

Cheers,

Scott

[Johan Larsson]

On my previous bike with 32 mm Continental Contact tires with a puncture protection layer I got maybe 1-2 punctures every year. Upon weekly inspection I used to pry out many small pieces of glass from the tires, that the puncture protection had stopped. Using 25 mm racing tires was impossible for commuting and everyday use on my roads - 10 punctures on the 14 days I tried having them... all 10 punctures because of glass.

On my current bike with 42 mm Hetres I have had two punctures in three years, and I'm on my second back tire with the front tire soon having to be replaced too. And one puncture was because of a glass shard that tore a hole big enough I could put my finger through. I glued it from the inside with rubber cement and a patch made from a tubular tire, and used it a full year more, until it was completely worn out. I weigh 210 lbs so I have to run them at fairly high pressure (~4 bar/60 psi in the back) compared to what the lightweights can run them at, which makes it even more impressive. I absolutely love these Hetre tires - fast, silent, comfortable, grippy and in practice - for me, so far - puncture proof. I just wish they were available in a true 50 mm 559 mm/26" version...


Johan Larsson,
Sweden

[Garth]

  
700x38 Vittoria Rando Hypers, called Voyager Hyper now :) 

[Michael Hechmer]

My experience matches Jan's.  Since retiring 4 hearts ago and ending my 30 miles  of round trip commute into Burlington, Vt, the number of flats I have to deal with has plummeted.  Two or three a year.  I ride PariMoto's, Grand Bois Cerf, and Marathon Racers  (26 x1.6) over country roads, - dirt, chip and seal, & pavement seven months of the year without worry.

Michael

[Patrick Moore]

I'm very late to this party, but:

Jan wrote: "wider tires get fewer flats anyhow."

Not my experience at all, at least not in goathead country! I've noticed this consistently over 20+ years of Albuquerque riding, adjusting for mileage differences between bikes shod with different tires, and raised my puzzled query as to why onlist before. My 22s consistently get fewer, or at least no more, flats on the same paved routes than my 32s; certainly than the Parigi Roubaix 29s before Stan's. And note that the narrow tires in question are very light and delicate ones --  =<200 gram Turbos., GPs, Pro Races, etc.

Why would narrower tires get fewer flats, as i my experience? Ryan Watson says they fit between the penetrants more easily, but he may have just been kidding. Why would wider ones get fewer flats, for that matter?

[Steve Palincsar]

I'd be tempted to call damage by goathead an "Act of God" were it not for the fact that goatheads belong to the Devil.



As for why Jan thinks wider tires get fewer flats, it's that the lower pressure lets a tire deform around the foreign object rather than driving it into the tire. 

[Patrick Moore]

On Friday's ride I did the usual pump 'n' sprint home as the Stan's had dried during its statutory 3 month effective period. When I got home I added 2 oz more to each tire; then made the mistake of pulling a particularly nasty one -- a true Beelzebub -- from the rear. The hole squired the entire 2 oz onto the garage floor before it was sealed (added 2 oz more). 

I'm thinking I should carry a backup pump, though the Lezyne Alloy Drive (?) is a true yeoman of a pump.

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[Lynne Fitz]

I am partial to the Hutchinson Confriere 650b tire. Granted, a big piece of glass will do one in, but other than that... Many many flat-free miles.

[Anton Tutter]

I believe it's all about tire pressure.  If air is pushing the tire away from the rim with a force of 40 psi, that means that the road surface is pushing back with an equal force of 40 psi.  So an object trying to puncture a wide tire is not pushing against the tread surface with as much force as it would be with a narrower tire at higher pressure.

If someone wearing wide sole shoes stepped on your toe, you'd feel it but it wouldn't hurt much.  If that same person stepped on your toe with the heel of a high heel shoe, I'm willing to bet it'd hurt a whole lot more.

Same idea.

Anton

[Coconutbill]

I'm not sure about the "best" touring tire... I would likely go with a Schwalbe for flat protection... but as far as cheapest, I would say the Conti Tour Rides are just fine.

[Mike Schiller]

Panaracer is coming out with a 650B x 42mm version of the Pasela in 2015.  In both TG and non TG.  Should be a good touring choice at under 500 gms.

~mike

Carlsbad Ca.

[Marc Irwin]

I like the Soma Express at 38mm.  It's the Pasela tread with beefed up sidewalls for city riding.  They've treated me well the past few years.

Marc

[Coconutbill]

I'm pretty happy with the Panaracer Col de la Vie . I haven't taken a caliper to them. no lumps. no problems seating them on my Synergy/Dyad rims.  I haven't tried them under a touring load, though.

[WETH]

If it is not thread hijacking, anyone have experience with both Nifftyswifty and Soma New Xpress 650b tires and willing to share thoughts on how they compare?
Hugh, apologies if this pulls too far away from your original question.
-Erl

[rperks]

FWIW Schwalbe is hitting the 650b market a bit harder soon.  There is a 650b x 62

http://www.schwalbe.com/en/tour-reader/super-moto-x.html

and a couple of others like the Kojak and big ben too

Rob

[hsmitham]

Erl,

No worries. I welcome which ever direction this post goes. 

I've been running the Soma New Express for nearly a year now and I like them. Very few flats and only from those pesky stickers called "Goat heads". I haven't used them really off road nor with a load so can't speak to that variable. As a road/commute tire they fit the bill.

Cheers,

~Hugh

On Saturday, November 8, 2014 5:35:46 PM UTC-8, WETH wrote:

[Lynne Fitz]

my first tires were Nifty Swifties, and the tires just before these were Soma Xpress. I'd say they are about the same in quickness, but the Somas are cushier. About the same for durability. I retired both of them before they were done, and could pull either off the hooks in the garage and remount them. Not touring specifically, just randonneuring.

[Hugh Smitham]

Lynne,

Did you take the Soma Xpress off road? If yes what kind of surface?

-Hugh

On Nov 10, 2014 2:51 PM, "Lynne Fitz" <fitz...@comcast.net> wrote:

my first tires were Nifty Swifties, and the tires just before these were Soma Xpress.  I'd say they are about the same in quickness, but the Somas are cushier.  About the same for durability.  I retired both of them before they were done, and could pull either off the hooks in the garage and remount them.  Not touring specifically, just randonneuring.

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[Michael Hechmer]

What makes for a good touring tire?  And do we want a tire that is optimal for the days we are actually touring or best for our all around needs?  What kind of touring?  Where?

My experience with tires has been that urban environments destroy tires faster than rural ones do. Except maybe in the SW, where goat heads puncture damn near everything. In general, road debris destroys tires way faster than a heavy load does or even rocks, and that debris is usually way more prevalent in urban areas than rural roads,. Bad luck can strike any tire so we always need to be prepared.  Our tandem has Schwalbe Marathon Racers (26x1.6), underneath a fully loaded bike that is well over 400 lbs.  This is a relatively light tire which serves our needs best on a day to day basis but holds up quite well on tour.

Commuting creates the most difficult environment for tires.  When I commuted I wanted bullet proof, to hell with rolling resistance.  Touring, piece of cake for most tires. 

Michael

[Allingham II, Thomas J]

Which is why some of us change our tires a lot.  Do most of you change tires to suit the characteristics of the ride, at least where the ride is a departure from the circumstance that caused you to select the tire that’s on the bike?  Or do you select the bike among a stable of several that has the best tires for the task?

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[Bruce Gordon]

Since you guys are talking about 650b tires - We have made a 650b version of our Rock n’ Road tires.

They will be in our shop around Christmas time.  Check out our Blog for the progress on the tires.

Did I mention that they will be tubeless compatible, and available in Blackwall or Skinwall.

Regards,

Bruce Gordon

www.bgcycles.com

www.brucegordoncycles.blogspot.com

(707) 762-5601

[Lynne Fitz]

gravel sometimes. or dirt.

[Evan Baird]

Spotted these on a Bilenky tandem at the Philly Expo.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/therubbishbin/15566528697/

[Steve Palincsar]

Yes, but what are they?

[Jim Bronson]

650B tandem shorn with Compass Babyshoe Pass Ultralight??

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Keep the metal side up and the rubber side down!

[Bill Lindsay]

Hugh

It's a $320 experiment, but it would be a really cool experiment.  You could buy a set of Soma Grand Randonneur tires in both the light and fast (green label) version and the stout and rugged (blue label) version.  Ride them both on the road and see if you hate the rugged Blue Label version.  Ride them both on your trails and see if the Blue Labels hold up in the conditions in which your Hetres got sliced.  Let us know how it worked out.  Jan-types would predict the green labels are a lot faster and have few enough flats that it's worth it.  Others might say they both ride fine, and the extra stoutness is worth it. 

Bill

[Steve Palincsar]

On 11/12/2014 10:30 AM, Bill Lindsay wrote:
> Hugh
>
> It's a $320 experiment, but it would be a really cool experiment. You
> could buy a set of Soma Grand Randonneur tires in both the light and
> fast (green label) version and the stout and rugged (blue label)
> version. Ride them both on the road and see if you hate the rugged
> Blue Label version. Ride them both on your trails and see if the Blue
> Labels hold up in the conditions in which your Hetres got sliced. Let
> us know how it worked out. Jan-types would predict the green labels
> are a lot faster and have few enough flats that it's worth it. Others
> might say they both ride fine, and the extra stoutness is worth it.

I'm not sure what happened to that sliced tire could be generalized to
"conditions." I was on a ride with my friend Holly when she got a
similar cut. She'd just ridden over a box cutter laying on the side of
the road, sharp side up. Sliced right through it. Who knows what
caused the cut we saw the photo of? It's not the sort of thing that
ordinary roadside conditions are likely to cause, unless your roadsides
are paved with broken bottles, tin cans with the lid attached, or
discarded box cutters. And you could ride for over 40 years and not
encounter a box cutter like the one Holly rode over.

[Hugh Smitham]

Bill,

Thanks for the suggestion,  I have $320 ear marked for other parts namely accessories for the wife's Betty, my Atlantis & AHH.

By all means I encourage you to take on the experiment as I'm sure a lot of folks would appreciate the data.

The Irony to this thread is at the time I posed the question I only had the 650b AAH, it was doing duty as a fitness, off road and tour bike. Since, I built up my 56 cm 26" Atlantis (Ol' Willy) as my off road tour bike the question is not as urgent though still relevant.

As an experiment I do plan on acquiring the new Soma Cazadero' in 650b, maybe put Homer back in service as a lightweight off road S240 rig?

-Hugh
Los Angeles, CA

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