New offering from Burke's Peerage online

[Nick Kingsley]

It is now possible to see the nature of the new Burke’s Peerage online offering, although subscription parts of the site are not active yet:

 

http://www.burkespeerage.com/

 

Nick Kingsley

 

[Richard R]

Thanks Nick for keeping us up to date on this. So, if you want an annual subscription to all their records, it'll cost £150 (£80 for the 'Peerage collection' - pretty much what was available before) and £70 for the 'Royal collection').

[colinp]

Is it worth the money to subscribe? Do any of the group use it and if so what do you think? Is it the same as having the books or are the entries updated? If it is updated are the updates more extensive than we report on here or is it apparent that they obtain information from the families?

I wonder if Debrett’s will go the same way. You can’t really beat a proper book!

[Al]

You can't casually flick though website

[G. Willis]

It's been several years since I subscribed to the site (only did so I think twice or three times in order to save copies of as many pedigrees as I could); I wouldn't say it's a very impressive setup, certainly not considering the status 'Burke's Peerage' carries. I recall the vast majority of pedigrees were simply taken from the last volume in which a family appeared; there were many from BLG 1969.

There is now a 'new and revised families' section, which does update a number of peerage and baronetage families (e.g. Marquesses of Anglesey, Cave-Browne-Cave), but to my eye many of these 'new' families are not of any real interesting lineage or note; take the 'new family' of Arnhold Simoes, for example. Searching the surname brings up nothing much except reference to a Christiano Arnhold Simoes, who according to the Armorial Register is 'Earl and Lord of Aboyne'. This is clarified below, where it mentions his 'having acquired the baronial dignity of the Earldom and Lordship of Aboyne' (although 'Earl of Aboyne' is a courtesy title in the family of the Marquesses of Huntly?). He seems to be employed in some kind of financial capacity.

I am not currently subscribed to Burke's so obviously can't check the extent of the pedigrees, but, frankly, I'd be hard pressed to muster interest in the pedigree of a fellow who's just done quite well in business and then bought a baronial title. I for one am not interested in seeing pedigrees- of which there were a great many in Burke's most recently published gentry volumes- headed by the 'noteworthy' individual (I distinctly recall in the Welsh and Yorkshire volumes there were huge numbers of minor local officials and businessmen, not inherently uninteresting necessarily, but to my mind not really fitting in with what I would be looking for from Burke's), giving the scantest details as far back as their grandfather. They may technically be 'gentry' by virtue of the position they have attained, but I can't help but feel a separate volume for this category would be of more use).

There's also a 'featured families' section under 'genealogies', which has details of the sovereign families of Europe as well as some others, which are up-to-date and I should think are representative of the 'new and updated' families pedigrees in format and extent of content.

[colinp]

Thanks for the comment- I don’t think I’ll bother subscribing.

[colinp]

I noticed that the 18th edition of Burke’s Landed Gentry (1965-1972) is now available on the Burke’s website (Pay to view of course)

[colinp]

further discussion here

Nicholas Bacon's family (google.com)

[colinp]

Burke's "Revised Families" online has an entry for William Francis CHARNLEY who does not appear to have a noble or gentry heritage - he was however included in Burke's gentry volume on Wales and the North West

He is a Canadian born solicitor and former Master of the Drapers Company.  He was granted arms by the College of Arms in 1999

He appears to have been included by having being granted the following foreign titles, though it is not stated whether he has received permission from the Crown to use those titles in the UK - are such permissions still granted?:

By Prince David Bagration of Georgia

Duke of Aymer granted by letters patent 29 November 2012 and Marquess of Quarlton, Count of Darsie, Viscount of Turton granted by letters patent 12 May 2015 and appointed Knight Grand Cross in the Order of the Eagle of Georgia and the Seamless Tunic of Our Lord Jesus Christ 29 November 2012, Knight Great Star in the Order of the Crown of Georgia and Senator Grand Badge in the Order of Saint Queen Tamar 20 May 2016

By the Duke of Braganza

 Grà Cruz Honorário da Real Ordem de São Miguel da Ala 29 September 2012, Comendador com Placa 8 December 2012 and Cavaleiro Hereditário da Casa Real Portuguesa de Bragança 14 August 2015

By Archduke Joseph Charles of Austria

Order of Vitéz May 2018

see also The value of nobiliary titles, issued by HRH Prince David Bagration of Mukhrani – Nobiliary law – Adelsrecht – Droit nobiliaire (wordpress.com)

[S. S.]

Colin, such licenses for foreign titles have not been granted for quite some time and won't be in future either. I will leave a link to Francois Velde's excellent site (a true treasure trove of information for the researcher): 

https://www.heraldica.org/topics/britain/foreigntitles.htm#introduction

It contains excellent information on foreign titles and their recognition/licenses granted.

S.S.