Apple Is Being Slandered For What Chemistry Cannot Fix

[Jolly Roger]

From Seeking Alpha:

<https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>

Summary

* Battery technology has not kept up with computer and software
advancements, aka 'Moore's Law'

* Battery life is not the primary driver in consumer purchases, per a
recent study from Accenture.

* Battery life is largely the product of user behavior, and not just the
phone hardware and software design.

* Independent tests show iPhone battery life meets and exceeds Apple's
major competitor products.

* Intel, AMD, and Android all use power saving technology in their
products and Apple is just following suit.

Apple (AAPL) has recently been stung by a so-called scandal in which
Apple has been slowing down the processor on its phones to deal with
aging battery issues. Apple has acknowledged it is addressing the
battery life problem with an update to the phone software. Apple's
choice to actively manage the phone processor (and thereby the
corresponding performance) to reduce the incidence of power failure
shutdowns is very responsible behavior and mirrors similar choices made
by other hardware developers in the tech industry.

In this article, I will show why Apple is responsibly helping its
consumers manage the batteries on their iPhone product. I will show that
this type of power management is normal and that most technology that
consumers use already has battery management technology. And I will show
that the issue around battery performance has little to do with phone
manufacturers, but reflects on the current state of the battery
industry. Therefore, this is not an Apple design flaw, as some authors
have stated. But rather, it is an issue of the battery developments not
keeping up with Moore's law of advancement in hardware and software.

Moore's Law

Moore's law is "the observation that the number of transistors in a
dense integrated circuit doubles approximately every two years", and was
named after Intel (NASDAQ:INTC) co-founder Gordon Moore, who wrote a
paper in 1965 on the doubling of components on an integrated circuit.

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/26/410007-1514313452253769_origin.png>

Image Courtesy of Wikipedia

The computer industry benefited from the increased power that Moore's
law by providing consumers with faster and smaller systems that can now
fit in pocket. This technology is what has made smartphone technology a
reality to the tune of over 2 billion smartphone devices in use, which
according to Statista will continue to increase in the future.

https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-15139639910765061.png

Image courtesy of Statista

Battery Technology

There are limits to what batteries can do mainly because their
development has not followed Moore's law with a doubling of power every
18 to 24 months. Fred Schlachter of the 'Proceedings of the National
Academy of Sciences of the United States' [PNAS] wrote an article a few
years ago about how battery technology has not kept up with the pace of
electronic innovation in an article No Moore's Law for Batteries.

"Sadly, such batteries do not exist. There is no Moore's Law for
batteries."

Technically speaking, batteries cannot be miniaturized in
the same manner that computers are. Fred explains:

"The reason there is a Moore's Law for computer processors is that
electrons are small and they do not take up space on a chip. Chip
performance is limited by the lithography technology used to fabricate
the chips; as lithography improves ever smaller features can be made on
processors. Batteries are not like this. Ions, which transfer charge in
batteries, are large, and they take up space, as do anodes, cathodes,
and electrolytes. A D-cell battery stores more energy than an AA-cell.
Potentials in a battery are dictated by the relevant chemical reactions,
thus limiting eventual battery performance. Significant improvement in
battery capacity can only be made by changing to a different chemistry."

Most smartphones use Lithium Ion [Li-ION] battery technology. Li-ION is
the most advanced, commonly available batteries that are used in
portable electronics like laptops and phones. That is because unlike
Nickel Cadmium [NiCad], they do not develop 'charge memories'. And they
are better for small electronics than Nickel Metal Hydride [NiMH]
because of shorter charge time and higher energy density, both critical
for the uses of portable phones. Li-ION batteries are also more
environmentally safe than the other types. But Li-ION batteries
typically fail faster than NiCad because they wear out in less charge
cycles, which mean consumers get fewer charges before their batteries
will need replacement.

In fact, this has been documented in publications such as USA Today. In
an article Smartphone Battery Myths That Need to Die, technical writer,
Jennifer Jolly debunks the following myth regarding smartphone
batteries:

"The lithium-ion batteries found in most smartphones today are expected
to maintain at least 80% of their original capacity for around 300 to
500 full charge cycles. That's a pretty wide range. For me, a heavy user
and charger, that means I get about one good year before my battery
starts to poop out. For most other people, the average is about two
years it shows significant signs of wear and tear."

The average lifespan of a typical phone battery is about 1 to 2 years.
That is not a long time, but consumers tend to change their phones every
22.7 months anyway.

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/26/410007-1514313668770382_origin.jpg>

This is because technology changes so fast that battery technology,
while limited, has not caused consumers to stop buying smartphones but
instead to change them fairly quickly for the features and benefits that
new models bring. Consulting firm Accenture outlines the reasons
consumers purchase new phones:

"Among all consumers surveyed, the leading driver of purchase intent is
the ability to access the newest and most innovative features and
functions, cited by 51 percent of respondents in this year's survey,
compared with only 41 percent last year. Another reason consumers are
opting to buy new smartphones is inadequate performance of their
existing devices, cited by 45 percent of customers this year - up from
33 percent last year."

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/26/410007-15143137644815097_origin.jpg>

What improvements in battery technology are on the horizon? Several
lithium-based derivatives that hold charges longer are in development
but have the distinct disadvantage of much lower number of charge
cycles. A sodium battery is in development that is good for home power
storage, but not for mobile technology due to lower energy density
(translates to much bigger battery size for same battery life).
Dual-carbon batteries are in development that discharges slower than
Li-ION and holds more charges, but are still a long way from being ready
for market. For right now, Li-ION based batteries are still the best
choice for mobile computing applications.

Smartphone Battery Life is User-Driven

While limitations on portable battery technology are known, consumers
may not understand that they may be the main reason their smartphone
batteries are dying early.

Batteries will run down when more power is consumed, and features such
as brightness or open apps using Wi-Fi will affect battery life. These
can be adjusted by users. According to Tech Advisor:

"Even in 2016, it's tough to go much longer than 24 hours without
charging your smartphone. Better battery technology simply hasn't
arrived yet, which means it's down to software and settings to eke out
the limited power for as long as possible.

Unfortunately, you're never going to get a week's use out of a
smartphone because of those big, bright screens along with Wi-Fi,
Bluetooth, GPS and 3G. However, by following our advice and making a few
changes to your phone's settings (and maybe even changing the way you
use your phone) you should be able to extend its battery life by a good
chunk."

The article makes good points - adjusting settings on the phone can make
a big difference in everyday battery life. First, daily battery life
will depend on how the owner uses the phone. And as Popular Mechanic
points out, the average Lithium Ion battery can only withstand between
500 to 1500 charge cycles.

Further, does it matter how you discharge your batteries? Yes, according
to Popular Mechanics.

"One cycle is just one bout of discharging, but how much energy you
discharge in one go - a measure referred to as depth of discharge [DOD]
- matters bigtime. Lithium-ions really hate a deep depth of discharge.

According to Battery University, a staggeringly exhaustive resource on
the topic, a li-ion that goes through 100 percent DoD (the user runs it
down all the way to zero before recharging) can degrade to 70 percent of
its original capacity in 300-500 cycles. With a DoD of 25 percent, where
the user plugs it in as soon as it gets to 75 percent remain, that same
battery could be charged up to 2,500 times before it starts to seriously
degrade."

Users who do not manage their phone batteries can experience degradation
much more quickly than those who follow best practices on charging them.

iPhone Batteries Are Not Inferior

One of the assumptions a person has to make to accept that Apple has
somehow made a design flaw in its phones is that the batteries are
inferior.

Paulo Santos argues the point over battery life:

"Most Android phones, by luck or design, will not share the problem. This
is so since their batteries were made larger to provide enough battery
life and thus can also sustain peak current for a longer service life."

We have established that the technology itself is limited not only to
Apple but to all battery manufacturers. So the only question left to
answer is whether Apple is skimping on its batteries. Here are two
studies that examine this very question.

There are plenty of formal reviews that show that Apple iPhone batteries
last as long as their Android counterparts, despite having less size.
Here is a quote from one of them (emphasis mine in this excerpt and all
ensuing quotes):

"iPhone X's battery is a smidgen bigger than the 2,691mAh cell that's in
the iPhone 8 Plus, but it's still way smaller than the ones in its
Android peers. To compare the specs, you'd think iPhone X is at a
serious disadvantage here:

* iPhone X: 2,716mAh
* Note 8: 3,300mAh
* V30: 3,300mAh
* Pixel 2 XL: 3,520mAh

But numbers don't tell the whole story. Case in point: The iPhone 8 Plus
has a smaller battery than the iPhone 7 Plus (2,691mAh versus 2,900mAh),
but there's no noticeable dip in longevity."

To bring in some historical evidence, here is an article in 2015 rating
the best battery life for smartphones, and Apple models beat their
comparable Android models in battery life despite the size differences.

"* Galaxy S6: 14.4 hours
* LG G4: 11 hours
* HTC One M9: 8.5 hours
* iPhone 6: 17.5 hours
* iPhone 6 Plus: 23 hours "

From the same link in 2015, we see this was not the case in objective,
independent testing.

"Over the five hours, here's how their stamina dribbled down:"

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-151396101756034.jpg>

Notice how the two iPhone models are on top.

"The three clear winners here are the iPhone 6, the Samsung Galaxy S6 and
the iPhone 6 Plus, which was a way ahead."

Well, that debunks the myth that iPhone batteries are historically poor.
Let's look into a more recent study by Phonearena.

"We have spent a few days with the $1,000 phone and we have run our
battery test to get the numbers. But first, here is how the iPhone X
battery size compares to other iPhones and Samsung Galaxy phones'
batteries:"

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-151396303131401.png>

The battery sizes are different, but how did the tests come out?

"In our experience, the iPhone X battery will last users even through
those longer days, but you will still need to recharge your phone every
night."

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-15139631212707033.png>

All iPhone models were rated as 'excellent' on the test, as noted above.

The main negative on iPhone batteries from this testing was the longer
recharge times. However, all would easily charge in about three hours or
less, with only about an hour difference between the best Android model
and the worst iPhone model.

<https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-15139632345460842.png>

So, what I have just established is that battery size by itself does not
matter. What matters is that the battery is matched to the phone
hardware it is supporting. Historically, iPhone battery performance has
been fine when tested. And recently, that point seems to hold up quite
well.

Portable Power Management Technology is Ubiquitous

There are few remaining questions we need to answer to show that Apple
has not designed flaws into its iPhone product with regard to battery
management.

What Apple has done is provide software that allows its iPhone users who
want to keep their phones to manage their batteries by slowing down the
processor during times of lower power and to keep the phones from
turning off spontaneously. Contrary to what many have said about this
story, what Apple is doing is not abnormal at all.

There are two computer chip manufacturers that you may have heard of,
Intel and Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (AMD), that have built advanced
power management technology into their chipset designs.

Intel proudly markets its power management technology by providing a
separate online marketing page for it.

In its power management whitepaper, Intel makes a very important point
about power management technology for devices such as laptops that rely
on a battery, which smartphones do.

"If Intel didn't continue to create new technologies to balance that
performance with incredible efficiency, notebook computers would not be
nearly as easy to carry around nor would you be able to work most of the
day on the battery."

Not only does power management technology, such as the one that Apple
has developed for its iPhones, allow more efficient use of available
power, but it has environmental advantages, as Intel points out.

"This provides a consumer with the best possible battery life for a
mobile platform as well as an unequaled Energy Star * rating for desktop
systems."

While not a desktop, smartphones still rely on electricity to charge and
this has an impact on the environment. Efficient use of battery power
during the day will substantially reduce the amount of overall energy
consumed by smartphones.

What about AMD? Well, it has its own power management whitepaper.

"Those with experience implementing microprocessors know the importance
of proper power management. Whether for simple applications processors
or high-end server processors, the ability to down-clock, clock-gate,
power-off, or in some manner disable unused or underused hardware blocks
is crucial in limiting power consumption.

Better power management benefits range from energy savings within the
data center to improved battery life in mobile devices."

The Android OS, powering many phones that make up Apple's main
competitors, also use power management technology. Android.com explains
the reasons for use of power management in its OS.

"Battery life is a perennial user concern. To extend battery life,
Android continually adds new features and optimizations to help the
platform optimize the off-charger behavior of applications and devices."

Apple Made the Right Decision

What Apple is doing is the right thing:

"Our goal is to deliver the best experience for customers, which includes
overall performance and prolonging the life of their devices.
Lithium-ion batteries become less capable of supplying peak current
demands when in cold conditions, have a low battery charge or as they
age over time, which can result in the device unexpectedly shutting down
to protect its electronic components.

Last year we released a feature for iPhone 6, iPhone 6s and iPhone SE to
smooth out the instantaneous peaks only when needed to prevent the
device from unexpectedly shutting down during these conditions. We've
now extended that feature to iPhone 7 with iOS 11.2, and plan to add
support for other products in the future."

I believe the company is being irresponsibly maligned for actively
addressing what is a known issue for battery technology and shows no
evidence that this is a design flaw specific to Apple iPhones. As such,
I see no lasting effects that will hurt Apple or the company's stock. As
the hysteria dies down regarding the recent claims made about Apple
throttling, investors will see that no disadvantage exists to owning the
stock as it pertains to Apple product quality. In fact, I believe that
Apple users will stay loyal to their products despite the slanderous
stories working their way around the Internet.

<https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

[nospam]

In article <faq1gm...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger
<jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> From Seeking Alpha:

...

> * Intel, AMD, and Android all use power saving technology in their
> products and Apple is just following suit.

this is the key.

apple gets criticized when everyone else does the same or worse.

<https://android.gadgethacks.com/news/nexus-6p-battery-randomly-dying-it
s-not-just-you-0175625/>
The most common speculation floating around right now is that the
Nexus 6P's battery is severely degrading after only a year of usage.
It's possible that once the device reaches a certain age, its battery
capacity drops off a cliff, and the phone is simply not capable of
holding a significant amount of charge anymore.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 17:42:46 GMT:

> Apple (AAPL) has recently been stung by a so-called scandal in which
> Apple has been slowing down the processor on its phones to deal with
> aging battery issues

You missed the following facts...

"Apple (AAPL) has recently been stung by a so-called scandal in which

Apple has been [*secretly*, *permanently*, & *drastically*] slowing
down the processor on its phones to deal with [premature chemical]
aging battery issues [so that they wouldn't have to replace the
defective batteries under warranty]."

While all manufacturers have defective batteries (witness the Samsung
exploding-battery fiasco), no other manufacturer on the planet has been
caught secretly screwing its customers like Apple did.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 17:42:46 GMT:
>
>> Apple (AAPL) has recently been stung by a so-called scandal in which
>> Apple has been slowing down the processor on its phones to deal with
>> aging battery issues
>

> You missed the following opinions...

Opinions don't matter.

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 12:47:08 -0500:

> apple gets criticized when everyone else does the same or worse.

You can't name a single other mobile phone manufacturer who has been
accused of *secretly*, *permanently*, and *drastically* cutting down the
CPU speeds (to less than half the original speeds) just so that they
wouldn't need to honor warranty claims.

"Apple acknowledges that it miscommunicated what was happening
with its power management features that were included in software
updates since at least a year ago. Apple has been blamed for not
being more transparent about the sneaky maneuver."
<http://mashable.com/2017/12/28/apple-apology-iphone-performance-battery-throttling/#F9hKxhGyOPqQ>

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:23:15 GMT:

> Opinions don't matter.

*Only true Apple Apologists repeatedly deny what Apple already admitted!*

Verbatim quote:
"Apple is facing a criminal lawsuit in France after *confirming*
it has been deliberately slowing down older iPhones to offset
problems with its lithium battery."
<https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2017/12/28/Apple-apologizes-lowers-iPhone-battery-replacement-price/6451514486710/>

[Alan Browne]

On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
> From Seeking Alpha:
>
> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>

<s>

It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.

For Apple to have to put out:
https://www.apple.com/iphone-battery-and-performance/
is a fiasco.

A simple explanation that a battery change at some point in the life
cycle to restore performance would have been clear enough.

--
“When it is all said and done, there are approximately 94 million
full-time workers in private industry paying taxes to support 102
million non-workers and 21 million government workers.
In what world does this represent a strong job market?”
.Jim Quinn

[nospam]

In article <p28lkm$15i8$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, harry newton

<ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> You can't name a single other mobile phone manufacturer

i did, and several of them.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:23:15 GMT:
>
>> Opinions don't matter.
>

> *Only true Apple-hating Trolls have a problem here

Indeed. The rest of us with functioning brain cells appreciate what
Apple does to increase the runtime of our devices. : )

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>
>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
><s>
>
> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.

Nonsense. Apple announced the feature in the iOS 10.2.1 release notes.
That's good enough for rational people who understand the engineering
challenges. You trolls are desperate to make a mountain out of a mole
hill. Three months from now this will all be forgotten, and Apple will
be unscathed. If that upsets you, look inward.

[Jolly Roger]

He always ignores what doesn't fit his troll narrative. ; )

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 13:29:31 -0500:

> i did, and several of them.

C'mon nospam. Only iOS gullibles are dumb enough to believe your red
herrings.

What you found were situations in the field where batteries degraded, which
we all know, is always a potential with any defective device.

I read both of your references and neither of them showed any indication
that the manufacturer *secretly*, *permanently*, and *drastically*
throttled CPU speeds (to less than half the original speeds) just to mask
the fact they had an overwhelmingly huge set of defective batteries.

Only Apple felt the need to *secretly* implement a *drastic* slowdown
without telling their customers - and - when caught - they belatedly
apologized for not communicating that they did it deceptively.
<https://www.apple.com/iphone-battery-and-performance/>

*Only a true Apple Apologist could deny facts that Apple already admitted.*

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:32:47 GMT:

> He always ignores what doesn't fit his troll narrative. ; )

Heh heh ... what's really funny with you Jolly Roger, is that you're a
typical iOS user mentality, so you consider any facts, trolls.

In fact, if you search for the combination of "troll" and "Jolly Roger" in
the iOS newsgroups, your name comes up on top on *both* newsgroups!
http://tinyurlcom/misc-phone-mobile-iphone
http://tinyurl.com/comp-mobile-ipad

What you Apple Apologists hate, are facts.
"It's still amazing to think that a seeming conspiracy theory
was true: On Dec. 20, Apple admitted it'd been secretly slowing
down iPhones as their batteries aged ... Now, just over a week later,
Apple has issued a formal apology to its customers"
<https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-sorry-iphone-battery-slowdown-ios-update-official/>

*Only true Apple Apologists continually deny what Apple already admits!*

[nospam]

In article <p28mlc$1790$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, harry newton

<ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> In fact, if you search for the combination of "troll" and "Jolly Roger" in
> the iOS newsgroups, your name comes up on top on *both* newsgroups!

only because he's calling *you* a troll.

and if you didn't change names so often, *you'd* be on top.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:30:05 GMT:

> Indeed. The rest of us with functioning brain cells appreciate what
> Apple does to increase the runtime of our devices. : )

*Only true Apple Apologists continually deny what Apple already admits!*

1. The Genius Bar was never told about the drastic CPU slowdown.
2. The Genisu Bar was never supplied with CPU-testing software either.
3. Shhhhhhh. That's because the drastic slowdown was a secret.

So what did they do when people complained of their phones being slow.
(Remember, the CPU is permanently slowed to less than half the original!)

Q: Did the Genius Bar correctly tell the customer to buy a new battery?
Q: Or, did they tell them to buy a new phone.

Pick one.

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 13:44:22 -0500:

> only because he's calling *you* a troll.

Since I only speak facts, and, since Jolly Roger calls all facts a troll,
the math should work out perfectly.

Which is the point.

*Jolly Roger calls *all* facts he doesn't like, trolls.*

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:32:47 GMT:
>
>> He always ignores what doesn't fit his troll narrative. ; )
>
> Heh heh ...

Laughing won't change it.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, nospam <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <p28mlc$1790$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, harry newton
><ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
>
>> In fact, if you search for the combination of "troll" and "Jolly Roger" in
>> the iOS newsgroups, your name comes up on top on *both* newsgroups!
>
> only because he's calling *you* a troll.

Yup. All he is doing is making it perfectly clear that every single
instance is me calling him out (and it also shows just how often he
changes his nym to troll).

> and if you didn't change names so often, *you'd* be on top.

Yup.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 13:44:22 -0500:
>
>> only because he's calling *you* a troll.
>
> Since I only speak facts

You only speak opinion. You can't tell the difference between opinion
and fact.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:30:05 GMT:
>
>> Indeed. The rest of us with functioning brain cells appreciate what
>> Apple does to increase the runtime of our devices. : )
>

> *Only true Apple Hating Trolls have a problem with this feature!

Yes, we know.

[harry newton]

He who is Alan Browne said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 13:28:34 -0500:

> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>
> For Apple to have to put out:
> https://www.apple.com/iphone-battery-and-performance/
> is a fiasco.
>
> A simple explanation that a battery change at some point in the life
> cycle to restore performance would have been clear enough.

I have to agree with you and it's clear everyone but the truest of the
Apple Apologists agrees with you.

While I agree it's a PR fiasco, it's worse than that because the lawsuits
rightfully allege *harm* was done to the Apple customer base (which it was
in two main ways).

1. The CPU was secretly, permanently, and drastically slowed down (to less
than half the paid-for speeds).
2. The "fix" was never told to the customer, and in fact, there are many
documented cases where Apple support told the customer the only solution
was to purchase a new phone.

It's a fact that the Apple Support Personnel were not provided tools to
diagnose the slowdown (which, you must remember, Apple *knew* they did),
and that these same support personnel were, as a result, telling people to
replace their phones, and not to replace the battery (which was the real
solution).

This is worse than PR. It's criminal.

The lawsuits will most likely prevail - so Apple will, IMHO, almost
certainly settle as soon as they can do so on the best terms they can
garner (just like Volkswagen did when they got caught secretly *improving*
the performance of their vehicles under test).

[Lewis]

All of them.

--
Strange things are afoot at the Circle K

[Lewis]

In message <H7GdnQJCIpNPR9rH...@giganews.com> Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>
>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
> <s>

> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.

And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.

--
MY MOM IS NOT DATING JERRY SIENFELD Bart chalkboard Ep. AABF06

[nospam]

In article <slrnp4frh3....@snow.local>, Lewis

<g.k...@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> > It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
> > transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>
> And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
> Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
> at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.

worse, samsung makes *highly* misleading statements:

<https://www.phonearena.com/news/Samsung-and-LG-also-confirm-they-do-not-
slow-down-phones-with-older-batteries_id101140>

...We do not reduce CPU performance through software updates over the
lifecycles of the phone.

very clever (and very misleading) wording.

there's no need to do so 'through software updates' because it's always
been that way.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:32:10 GMT:

> Nonsense. Apple announced the feature in the iOS 10.2.1 release notes.
> That's good enough for rational people who understand the engineering
> challenges. You trolls are desperate to make a mountain out of a mole
> hill. Three months from now this will all be forgotten, and Apple will
> be unscathed. If that upsets you, look inward.

Heh heh heh ... what's funny is that even Apple admitted it was a secret
feature, which they said they "miscommunicated" and "let you down".

Only an Apple Apologist can repeatedly deny what Apple already admitted.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:50:29 GMT:

> Yup. All he is doing is making it perfectly clear that every single

> instance is me calling him out ....

Heh heh heh ... you Apple Apologists call any fact you don't like, a troll.

[harry newton]

He who is Lewis said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 19:43:38 -0000 (UTC):

>>> You can't name a single other mobile phone manufacturer
>
>> i did, and several of them.
>
> All of them.

What's so fantastic about you Apple Apologists is that you claim all the
manufacturers *secretly*, *permanently*, and *drastically* cut CPU speeds
in more than half ... and yet ... you can't name a single one.

You Apple Apologists are allergic to facts.

It's sad that you Apple Apologists are allowed to vote.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:51:57 GMT:

>> *Only true Apple Hating Trolls have a problem with this feature!
>
> Yes, we know.

Yet again, Jolly Roger can't come up with a witty response to facts, so,
what does he do? He fabricates a post that never happened, just so he could
*sound* witty (to himself, since nobody else is fooled but he).

He's done this brazen fabrication of posts to respond to so many times,
there's an entire thread on the subject of Jolly Roger's fabrications.

Why does Jolly Roger habitually fabricate quoted content?
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/FJ0ScwZ9sLE/d40Bp9jKDQAJ

[harry newton]

He who is Lewis said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 19:50:59 -0000 (UTC):

> And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
> Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
> at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.

You deny even what Apple already admitted.
Hence, you're a perfect Apple Apologist.

I read every cite you provided, *none* of which back up your claim that
*any* other manufacturer of mobile phones *secretly*, *permanently*, and
*drastically* cut down CPU speeds (to less than half the original speeds),
in order to hide defective batteries that they didn't wish to replace under
warranty.

There are *plenty* of cases of defective batteries (witness the Samsung
exploding battery fiasco for one); but you are blatantly fabricating
imaginary happenings when you state that "Samsung does exactly the same
thing".

What Apple did wrong has nothing to do with the fact they put the wrong
batteries in the phone; what Apple did wrong was *secretly*, *permanently*,
and *drastically* cutting CPU speeds - and they apologized for doing that
(mostly they apologized for the *secret* part).

No other manufacturer has been caught, except Apple, for *secretly*,
*permanently*, and *drastically* cutting CPU speeds to mask their defective
batteries from the customer.

Those are facts.
You call them trolls because they're facts you don't like.

Yet you deny even what Apple already admitted.
Hence, you're a perfect Apple Apologist.

[nospam]

In article <p28su3$1i0s$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, harry newton

<ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> I read every cite you provided, *none* of which back up your claim that
> *any* other manufacturer of mobile phones *secretly*, *permanently*, and
> *drastically* cut down CPU speeds (to less than half the original speeds),
> in order to hide defective batteries that they didn't wish to replace under
> warranty.

samsung.

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 15:02:29 -0500:

> worse, samsung makes *highly* misleading statements:
>
> <https://www.phonearena.com/news/Samsung-and-LG-also-confirm-they-do-not-
> slow-down-phones-with-older-batteries_id101140>
>
> ...We do not reduce CPU performance through software updates over the
> lifecycles of the phone.
>
> very clever (and very misleading) wording.
>
> there's no need to do so 'through software updates' because it's always
> been that way.

That's a nice cite which is an interesting read, surprising coming from an
Apple Apologist like you are (who denies even what Apple admits).

<https://www.phonearena.com/news/Samsung-and-LG-also-confirm-they-do-not-slow-down-phones-with-older-batteries_id101140>
"Two of the biggest Android phone makers - Samsung and LG - have
just confirmed that they do not slow down phones with older
batteries, a tactic that Apple has admitted it uses on some
iPhones with aging batteries to prevent them from unexpected
shutdowns." [29 Dec 2017]

Quote from LG:
"Never have, never will! We care what our customers think."

Quote from Samsung:

"We do not reduce CPU performance through software updates over
the lifecycles of the phone."

Quote from their reference on HTC & Motorola:
"HTC and Motorola have explicitly confirmed that they do not
slow down the processor in their phones when the battery of
the device gets old."

The article concludes:
"Meanwhile, Apple has apologized for slowing down users iPhones
without their knowledge"

So your own cite proves that none of the Android manufacturers *secretly*,
*permanently*, and *drastically* cut CPU cycles (to less than half what was
originally bought).

Only Apple cares so much about their customers to cut phone speeds in half!

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 15:30:44 -0500:

>> I read every cite you provided, *none* of which back up your claim that
>> *any* other manufacturer of mobile phones *secretly*, *permanently*, and
>> *drastically* cut down CPU speeds (to less than half the original speeds),
>> in order to hide defective batteries that they didn't wish to replace under
>> warranty.
>
> samsung.

<https://www.phonearena.com/news/Samsung-and-LG-also-confirm-they-do-not-slow-down-phones-with-older-batteries_id101140>
"Two of the biggest Android phone makers - Samsung and LG - have
just confirmed that they do not slow down phones with older
batteries, a tactic that Apple has admitted it uses on some
iPhones with aging batteries to prevent them from unexpected
shutdowns." [29 Dec 2017]

Quote from LG:
"Never have, never will! We care what our customers think."

Quote from Samsung:
"We do not reduce CPU performance through software updates over
the lifecycles of the phone."

Quote from their reference on HTC & Motorola:
"HTC and Motorola have explicitly confirmed that they do not
slow down the processor in their phones when the battery of
the device gets old."

The article concludes:
"Meanwhile, Apple has apologized for slowing down users iPhones
without their knowledge"

So your own cite proves that none of the Android manufacturers *secretly*,
*permanently*, and *drastically* cut CPU cycles (to less than half what was
originally bought).

Only an Apple Apologist like you can deny what Apple already admitted.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 18:51:57 GMT:
>
>>> *Only true Apple Hating Trolls have a problem with this feature!
>>
>> Yes, we know.
>

> can't come up with a witty response to facts

No facts are present in your lame trolls.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 20:50:44 GMT:

> No facts are present in your lame trolls.

It's a fact that you just fabricated imaginary quoted content from me, and
you don't expect me to object?

And you then call me a "lame troll"?

What planet do you live on?

You fabricate a post from me, adn then you responded to your own brazen
fabrication, posing it as a response to me - and then you have the balls to
call "me" a troll?

And you don't realize that you Apple Apologists do this all the time.

Why do you Apple Apologists feel the need to resort to brazen fabrications?

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 20:50:44 GMT:

> No facts are present in your lame trolls.

It's a fact that you just fabricated imaginary quoted content from me, and
you don't expect me to object?

And you then call me a "lame troll"?

What planet do you live on?

You fabricate a post from me, adn then you responded to your own brazen
fabrication, posing it as a response to me - and then you have the balls to
call "me" a troll?

And you don't realize that you Apple Apologists do this all the time.

Why do you Apple Apologists feel the need to resort to brazen fabrications?

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 20:50:44 GMT:
>
>> No facts are present in your lame trolls.
>
> It's a fact

You have shown you don't know the difference between fact and opinion.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 20:50:44 GMT:
>
>> No facts are present in your lame trolls.
>
> It's a fact

You have a proven inability to distinguish fact from opinion.

[Harold Newton]

On 30 Dec 2017 21:10:33 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

> You have shown you don't know the difference between fact and opinion.

I don't killfile you Jolly Roger, because you are the *perfect* iOS
apologist.

Any fact you don't like ... you rebel against ... usually hurling vitriol
and insults ... which you then accuse the bearer of facts of doing.

You brazenly fabricate iOS functionality that never existed, and you just
today five times fabricated content that never occurred ... just so that
you could respond to it.

You call every fact you don't like, a troll ... and you repeatedly deny
that which Apple already admitted.

I love you Jolly Roger!

*You're the perfect example of an Apple Apologist!*

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, Harold Newton <har...@example.com> wrote:
> On 30 Dec 2017 21:10:33 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> You have shown you don't know the difference between fact and opinion.
>
> I don't killfile you

And I don't care.

> *You're the perfect example of an Apple Apologist!*

You're a sad old man who gets his only kicks in life trolling complete
strangers.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 21:11:09 GMT:

> You have a proven inability to distinguish fact from opinion.

I love you Jolly Roger!

You're the *perfect* example of an Apple Apologist!

Your dislike of facts (you call facts, trolls) - and your brazen
fabrication of iOS functionality that never existed - and your repeated
denial of that which Apple already admitted, coupled with your vitriol when
confronted with valid verified facts ... makes you the canonical example of
an Apple Apologists!

Thank you Jolly Roger for being the example for all Apple Apologists to
look up to.

*Your actions exemplify exactly why Apple related threads are different.*

There's something very wrong with you Apple Apologists ... I can't figure
out why you're the way you are - but you're so simple to figure out that at
least I know what it is that you are.

a. You deny facts (you call them trolls)
b. You fabricate functionality that never existed (why? Only you know why)
c. You even fabricate post content so you can respond to your fabrications

All you Apple Apologists are not normal people - but you're the *simplest*
of the Apple Apologists to understand - which is why I love you JR!

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 21:27:42 GMT:

>> I don't killfile you
>
> And I don't care.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 21:27:42 GMT:
>
>>> I don't killfile you
>>
>> And I don't care.
>
> You're

You're a lame troll.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 21:11:09 GMT:
>
>> You have a proven inability to distinguish fact from opinion.
>

> Your dislike of facts

Your so-called "facts" are nothing but opinions.

[nospam]

In article <p290fn$1np6$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, harry newton

<ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> I love you Jolly Roger!

somehow, i don't think he feels the same about you.

just a guess.

[Jolly Roger]

I'd love to meet the old man face-to-face so I could wipe that smug
smile off his wrinkled face. : )

[Wilf]

On 30/12/2017 5:42 pm, Jolly Roger wrote:

> From Seeking Alpha:
>
> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>

> Summary
>
> * Battery technology has not kept up with computer and software
> advancements, aka 'Moore's Law'
>
> * Battery life is not the primary driver in consumer purchases, per a
> recent study from Accenture.
>
> * Battery life is largely the product of user behavior, and not just the
> phone hardware and software design.
>
> * Independent tests show iPhone battery life meets and exceeds Apple's
> major competitor products.
>
> * Intel, AMD, and Android all use power saving technology in their
> products and Apple is just following suit.
>
> Apple (AAPL) has recently been stung by a so-called scandal in which
> Apple has been slowing down the processor on its phones to deal with
> aging battery issues. Apple has acknowledged it is addressing the
> battery life problem with an update to the phone software. Apple's
> choice to actively manage the phone processor (and thereby the
> corresponding performance) to reduce the incidence of power failure
> shutdowns is very responsible behavior and mirrors similar choices made
> by other hardware developers in the tech industry.
>
> In this article, I will show why Apple is responsibly helping its
> consumers manage the batteries on their iPhone product. I will show that
> this type of power management is normal and that most technology that
> consumers use already has battery management technology. And I will show
> that the issue around battery performance has little to do with phone
> manufacturers, but reflects on the current state of the battery
> industry. Therefore, this is not an Apple design flaw, as some authors
> have stated. But rather, it is an issue of the battery developments not
> keeping up with Moore's law of advancement in hardware and software.
>
> Moore's Law
>
> Moore's law is "the observation that the number of transistors in a
> dense integrated circuit doubles approximately every two years", and was
> named after Intel (NASDAQ:INTC) co-founder Gordon Moore, who wrote a
> paper in 1965 on the doubling of components on an integrated circuit.
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/26/410007-1514313452253769_origin.png>
>
> Image Courtesy of Wikipedia
>
> The computer industry benefited from the increased power that Moore's
> law by providing consumers with faster and smaller systems that can now
> fit in pocket. This technology is what has made smartphone technology a
> reality to the tune of over 2 billion smartphone devices in use, which
> according to Statista will continue to increase in the future.
>
> https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-15139639910765061.png
>
> Image courtesy of Statista
>
> Battery Technology
>
> There are limits to what batteries can do mainly because their
> development has not followed Moore's law with a doubling of power every
> 18 to 24 months. Fred Schlachter of the 'Proceedings of the National
> Academy of Sciences of the United States' [PNAS] wrote an article a few
> years ago about how battery technology has not kept up with the pace of
> electronic innovation in an article No Moore's Law for Batteries.
>
> "Sadly, such batteries do not exist. There is no Moore's Law for
> batteries."
>
> Technically speaking, batteries cannot be miniaturized in
> the same manner that computers are. Fred explains:
>
> "The reason there is a Moore's Law for computer processors is that
> electrons are small and they do not take up space on a chip. Chip
> performance is limited by the lithography technology used to fabricate
> the chips; as lithography improves ever smaller features can be made on
> processors. Batteries are not like this. Ions, which transfer charge in
> batteries, are large, and they take up space, as do anodes, cathodes,
> and electrolytes. A D-cell battery stores more energy than an AA-cell.
> Potentials in a battery are dictated by the relevant chemical reactions,
> thus limiting eventual battery performance. Significant improvement in
> battery capacity can only be made by changing to a different chemistry."
>
> Most smartphones use Lithium Ion [Li-ION] battery technology. Li-ION is
> the most advanced, commonly available batteries that are used in
> portable electronics like laptops and phones. That is because unlike
> Nickel Cadmium [NiCad], they do not develop 'charge memories'. And they
> are better for small electronics than Nickel Metal Hydride [NiMH]
> because of shorter charge time and higher energy density, both critical
> for the uses of portable phones. Li-ION batteries are also more
> environmentally safe than the other types. But Li-ION batteries
> typically fail faster than NiCad because they wear out in less charge
> cycles, which mean consumers get fewer charges before their batteries
> will need replacement.
>
> In fact, this has been documented in publications such as USA Today. In
> an article Smartphone Battery Myths That Need to Die, technical writer,
> Jennifer Jolly debunks the following myth regarding smartphone
> batteries:
>
> "The lithium-ion batteries found in most smartphones today are expected
> to maintain at least 80% of their original capacity for around 300 to
> 500 full charge cycles. That's a pretty wide range. For me, a heavy user
> and charger, that means I get about one good year before my battery
> starts to poop out. For most other people, the average is about two
> years it shows significant signs of wear and tear."
>
> The average lifespan of a typical phone battery is about 1 to 2 years.
> That is not a long time, but consumers tend to change their phones every
> 22.7 months anyway.
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/26/410007-1514313668770382_origin.jpg>
>
> This is because technology changes so fast that battery technology,
> while limited, has not caused consumers to stop buying smartphones but
> instead to change them fairly quickly for the features and benefits that
> new models bring. Consulting firm Accenture outlines the reasons
> consumers purchase new phones:
>
> "Among all consumers surveyed, the leading driver of purchase intent is
> the ability to access the newest and most innovative features and
> functions, cited by 51 percent of respondents in this year's survey,
> compared with only 41 percent last year. Another reason consumers are
> opting to buy new smartphones is inadequate performance of their
> existing devices, cited by 45 percent of customers this year - up from
> 33 percent last year."
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/26/410007-15143137644815097_origin.jpg>
>
> What improvements in battery technology are on the horizon? Several
> lithium-based derivatives that hold charges longer are in development
> but have the distinct disadvantage of much lower number of charge
> cycles. A sodium battery is in development that is good for home power
> storage, but not for mobile technology due to lower energy density
> (translates to much bigger battery size for same battery life).
> Dual-carbon batteries are in development that discharges slower than
> Li-ION and holds more charges, but are still a long way from being ready
> for market. For right now, Li-ION based batteries are still the best
> choice for mobile computing applications.
>
> Smartphone Battery Life is User-Driven
>
> While limitations on portable battery technology are known, consumers
> may not understand that they may be the main reason their smartphone
> batteries are dying early.
>
> Batteries will run down when more power is consumed, and features such
> as brightness or open apps using Wi-Fi will affect battery life. These
> can be adjusted by users. According to Tech Advisor:
>
> "Even in 2016, it's tough to go much longer than 24 hours without
> charging your smartphone. Better battery technology simply hasn't
> arrived yet, which means it's down to software and settings to eke out
> the limited power for as long as possible.
>
> Unfortunately, you're never going to get a week's use out of a
> smartphone because of those big, bright screens along with Wi-Fi,
> Bluetooth, GPS and 3G. However, by following our advice and making a few
> changes to your phone's settings (and maybe even changing the way you
> use your phone) you should be able to extend its battery life by a good
> chunk."
>
> The article makes good points - adjusting settings on the phone can make
> a big difference in everyday battery life. First, daily battery life
> will depend on how the owner uses the phone. And as Popular Mechanic
> points out, the average Lithium Ion battery can only withstand between
> 500 to 1500 charge cycles.
>
> Further, does it matter how you discharge your batteries? Yes, according
> to Popular Mechanics.
>
> "One cycle is just one bout of discharging, but how much energy you
> discharge in one go - a measure referred to as depth of discharge [DOD]
> - matters bigtime. Lithium-ions really hate a deep depth of discharge.
>
> According to Battery University, a staggeringly exhaustive resource on
> the topic, a li-ion that goes through 100 percent DoD (the user runs it
> down all the way to zero before recharging) can degrade to 70 percent of
> its original capacity in 300-500 cycles. With a DoD of 25 percent, where
> the user plugs it in as soon as it gets to 75 percent remain, that same
> battery could be charged up to 2,500 times before it starts to seriously
> degrade."
>
> Users who do not manage their phone batteries can experience degradation
> much more quickly than those who follow best practices on charging them.
>
> iPhone Batteries Are Not Inferior
>
> One of the assumptions a person has to make to accept that Apple has
> somehow made a design flaw in its phones is that the batteries are
> inferior.
>
> Paulo Santos argues the point over battery life:
>
> "Most Android phones, by luck or design, will not share the problem. This
> is so since their batteries were made larger to provide enough battery
> life and thus can also sustain peak current for a longer service life."
>
> We have established that the technology itself is limited not only to
> Apple but to all battery manufacturers. So the only question left to
> answer is whether Apple is skimping on its batteries. Here are two
> studies that examine this very question.
>
> There are plenty of formal reviews that show that Apple iPhone batteries
> last as long as their Android counterparts, despite having less size.
> Here is a quote from one of them (emphasis mine in this excerpt and all
> ensuing quotes):
>
> "iPhone X's battery is a smidgen bigger than the 2,691mAh cell that's in
> the iPhone 8 Plus, but it's still way smaller than the ones in its
> Android peers. To compare the specs, you'd think iPhone X is at a
> serious disadvantage here:
>
> * iPhone X: 2,716mAh
> * Note 8: 3,300mAh
> * V30: 3,300mAh
> * Pixel 2 XL: 3,520mAh
>
> But numbers don't tell the whole story. Case in point: The iPhone 8 Plus
> has a smaller battery than the iPhone 7 Plus (2,691mAh versus 2,900mAh),
> but there's no noticeable dip in longevity."
>
> To bring in some historical evidence, here is an article in 2015 rating
> the best battery life for smartphones, and Apple models beat their
> comparable Android models in battery life despite the size differences.
>
> "* Galaxy S6: 14.4 hours
> * LG G4: 11 hours
> * HTC One M9: 8.5 hours
> * iPhone 6: 17.5 hours
> * iPhone 6 Plus: 23 hours "
>
> From the same link in 2015, we see this was not the case in objective,
> independent testing.
>
> "Over the five hours, here's how their stamina dribbled down:"
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-151396101756034.jpg>
>
> Notice how the two iPhone models are on top.
>
> "The three clear winners here are the iPhone 6, the Samsung Galaxy S6 and
> the iPhone 6 Plus, which was a way ahead."
>
> Well, that debunks the myth that iPhone batteries are historically poor.
> Let's look into a more recent study by Phonearena.
>
> "We have spent a few days with the $1,000 phone and we have run our
> battery test to get the numbers. But first, here is how the iPhone X
> battery size compares to other iPhones and Samsung Galaxy phones'
> batteries:"
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-151396303131401.png>
>
> The battery sizes are different, but how did the tests come out?
>
> "In our experience, the iPhone X battery will last users even through
> those longer days, but you will still need to recharge your phone every
> night."
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-15139631212707033.png>
>
> All iPhone models were rated as 'excellent' on the test, as noted above.
>
> The main negative on iPhone batteries from this testing was the longer
> recharge times. However, all would easily charge in about three hours or
> less, with only about an hour difference between the best Android model
> and the worst iPhone model.
>
> <https://static.seekingalpha.com/uploads/2017/12/22/410007-15139632345460842.png>
>
> So, what I have just established is that battery size by itself does not
> matter. What matters is that the battery is matched to the phone
> hardware it is supporting. Historically, iPhone battery performance has
> been fine when tested. And recently, that point seems to hold up quite
> well.
>
> Portable Power Management Technology is Ubiquitous
>
> There are few remaining questions we need to answer to show that Apple
> has not designed flaws into its iPhone product with regard to battery
> management.
>
> What Apple has done is provide software that allows its iPhone users who
> want to keep their phones to manage their batteries by slowing down the
> processor during times of lower power and to keep the phones from
> turning off spontaneously. Contrary to what many have said about this
> story, what Apple is doing is not abnormal at all.
>
> There are two computer chip manufacturers that you may have heard of,
> Intel and Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. (AMD), that have built advanced
> power management technology into their chipset designs.
>
> Intel proudly markets its power management technology by providing a
> separate online marketing page for it.
>
> In its power management whitepaper, Intel makes a very important point
> about power management technology for devices such as laptops that rely
> on a battery, which smartphones do.
>
> "If Intel didn't continue to create new technologies to balance that
> performance with incredible efficiency, notebook computers would not be
> nearly as easy to carry around nor would you be able to work most of the
> day on the battery."
>
> Not only does power management technology, such as the one that Apple
> has developed for its iPhones, allow more efficient use of available
> power, but it has environmental advantages, as Intel points out.
>
> "This provides a consumer with the best possible battery life for a
> mobile platform as well as an unequaled Energy Star * rating for desktop
> systems."
>
> While not a desktop, smartphones still rely on electricity to charge and
> this has an impact on the environment. Efficient use of battery power
> during the day will substantially reduce the amount of overall energy
> consumed by smartphones.
>
> What about AMD? Well, it has its own power management whitepaper.
>
> "Those with experience implementing microprocessors know the importance
> of proper power management. Whether for simple applications processors
> or high-end server processors, the ability to down-clock, clock-gate,
> power-off, or in some manner disable unused or underused hardware blocks
> is crucial in limiting power consumption.
>
> Better power management benefits range from energy savings within the
> data center to improved battery life in mobile devices."
>
> The Android OS, powering many phones that make up Apple's main
> competitors, also use power management technology. Android.com explains
> the reasons for use of power management in its OS.
>
> "Battery life is a perennial user concern. To extend battery life,
> Android continually adds new features and optimizations to help the
> platform optimize the off-charger behavior of applications and devices."
>
> Apple Made the Right Decision
>
> What Apple is doing is the right thing:
>
> "Our goal is to deliver the best experience for customers, which includes
> overall performance and prolonging the life of their devices.
> Lithium-ion batteries become less capable of supplying peak current
> demands when in cold conditions, have a low battery charge or as they
> age over time, which can result in the device unexpectedly shutting down
> to protect its electronic components.
>
> Last year we released a feature for iPhone 6, iPhone 6s and iPhone SE to
> smooth out the instantaneous peaks only when needed to prevent the
> device from unexpectedly shutting down during these conditions. We've
> now extended that feature to iPhone 7 with iOS 11.2, and plan to add
> support for other products in the future."
>
> I believe the company is being irresponsibly maligned for actively
> addressing what is a known issue for battery technology and shows no
> evidence that this is a design flaw specific to Apple iPhones. As such,
> I see no lasting effects that will hurt Apple or the company's stock. As
> the hysteria dies down regarding the recent claims made about Apple
> throttling, investors will see that no disadvantage exists to owning the
> stock as it pertains to Apple product quality. In fact, I believe that
> Apple users will stay loyal to their products despite the slanderous
> stories working their way around the Internet.
>
> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>

This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
with my camera. Sure, it would add some space to have a removable
battery, but it would certainly help in other ways.

Wilf

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Sat, 30 Dec 2017 16:52:20 -0500:

>> I love you Jolly Roger!
>
> somehow, i don't think he feels the same about you.
>
> just a guess.

:)

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 21:54:27 GMT:

> I'd love to meet the old man face-to-face so I could wipe that smug
> smile off his wrinkled face. : )

You should treat your elders with more respect!

:)

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

You've earned no respect, entitled old fool. One day you'll fuck with
the wrong person and learn your lesson the hard way.

>:)

...and they'll wipe that shit-eating smile right off your old farty
trollish face.

[nospam]

In article <p291vv$1pv2$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf

<wi...@replyto.newsgroup> wrote:

> This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
> battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
> with my camera.

you can, and it even includes tools:
<https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits>

many other options, including:
<https://www.amazon.com/Iphone-replacement-battery-Quality-Lithium/dp/B0
74NY7Y5B/>

and if you already have tools, you can save a few bucks:
<https://www.amazon.com/Replacement-Battery-iPhone-4-7-Inch/dp/B01BJWXET
Q/>

if you prefer not to open up the phone yourself, then there are plenty
of repair shops will do it for you, or apple itself.

complete non-issue.

oh, and some cameras have internal batteries, as do many android phones
and plenty of other products.

> Sure, it would add some space to have a removable
> battery, but it would certainly help in other ways.

and much worse in others, including having a lower reliability, shorter
run time and a thicker phone.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2017-12-30, nospam <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <p291vv$1pv2$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf
><wi...@replyto.newsgroup> wrote:
>
>> This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
>> battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
>> with my camera.
>
> you can, and it even includes tools:
><https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits>
>
> many other options, including:
><https://www.amazon.com/Iphone-replacement-battery-Quality-Lithium/dp/B0
> 74NY7Y5B/>
>
> and if you already have tools, you can save a few bucks:
><https://www.amazon.com/Replacement-Battery-iPhone-4-7-Inch/dp/B01BJWXET
> Q/>
>
> if you prefer not to open up the phone yourself, then there are plenty
> of repair shops will do it for you, or apple itself.
>
> complete non-issue.

I've replaced batteries in many an iOS device. It's not a huge
inconvenience and can be done in a matter of minutes in most cases.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 30 Dec 2017 22:22:37 GMT:

> I've replaced batteries in many an iOS device. It's not a huge
> inconvenience and can be done in a matter of minutes in most cases.

Apple just publicly stated the $36 batteries are available now.
<https://www.macrumors.com/2017/12/30/apple-29-usd-iphone-battery-replacements-now-avail/>

The $29+6.95 fee applies to the United States, with prices varying in other
countries based on exchange rates.

[Wilf]

On 30/12/2017 10:15 pm, nospam wrote:

> In article <p291vv$1pv2$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf
> <wi...@replyto.newsgroup> wrote:
>
>> This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
>> battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
>> with my camera.
>
> you can, and it even includes tools:
> <https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits>

I'm really talking about regular battery-swaps in and out, say when mine
runs low on a given day.

>
> many other options, including:
> <https://www.amazon.com/Iphone-replacement-battery-Quality-Lithium/dp/B0
> 74NY7Y5B/>
>
> and if you already have tools, you can save a few bucks:
> <https://www.amazon.com/Replacement-Battery-iPhone-4-7-Inch/dp/B01BJWXET
> Q/>
>
> if you prefer not to open up the phone yourself, then there are plenty
> of repair shops will do it for you, or apple itself.
>
> complete non-issue.

Not a non-issue, as I could otherwise carry a spare, charged battery
with me at all times to swap in when the incumbent one ran out of charge
on a given day.

>
> oh, and some cameras have internal batteries, as do many android phones
> and plenty of other products.

Of course they do - I'm not trying to slight Apple for this, you know.

>
>> Sure, it would add some space to have a removable
>> battery, but it would certainly help in other ways.
>
> and much worse in others, including having a lower reliability, shorter
> run time and a thicker phone.
>

Of course, but maybe some of us would willingly pay that price for the
extra convenience.


Wilf

[nospam]

In article <p29cj5$9kb$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf <wi...@replyto.newsgroup>

wrote:

> >> This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
> >> battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
> >> with my camera.
> >
> > you can, and it even includes tools:
> > <https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits>
>
> I'm really talking about regular battery-swaps in and out, say when mine
> runs low on a given day.

there's no need to swap an iphone battery during the day since it will
normally last 2-3 days on a single charge in typical use.

it really only needs to last 1 day, because it will be charged at night.

> >
> > complete non-issue.
>
> Not a non-issue, as I could otherwise carry a spare, charged battery
> with me at all times to swap in when the incumbent one ran out of charge
> on a given day.

it's definitely a non-issue.

you are assuming iphones have whatever shitty battery life your current
phone has.

as mentioned above, you're unlikely to need a spare battery in normal
use, but in the unlikely event you do, there are numerous phone cases
with built-in batteries (for android or apple) as well as portable usb
batteries which can power or charge anything that uses usb for power,
which are a *lot* of devices. some of the larger external usb batteries
can even charge a laptop, or a phone *many* times over.

[Wilf]

On 31/12/2017 1:10 am, nospam wrote:

> In article <p29cj5$9kb$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf <wi...@replyto.newsgroup>
> wrote:
>
>>>> This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
>>>> battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
>>>> with my camera.
>>>
>>> you can, and it even includes tools:
>>> <https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits>
>>
>> I'm really talking about regular battery-swaps in and out, say when mine
>> runs low on a given day.
>
> there's no need to swap an iphone battery during the day since it will
> normally last 2-3 days on a single charge in typical use.
>
> it really only needs to last 1 day, because it will be charged at night.
>
>>>
>>> complete non-issue.
>>
>> Not a non-issue, as I could otherwise carry a spare, charged battery
>> with me at all times to swap in when the incumbent one ran out of charge
>> on a given day.
>
> it's definitely a non-issue.
>
> you are assuming iphones have whatever shitty battery life your current
> phone has.

It's a non-issue for you and I respect that ... you're lucky. It's not
a non-issue for me, and you do not seem to respect that fact. My
"shitty battery life" is part of an iPhone 6s - I feel you are being
defensive and hoping I must have some other brand of phone but Apple. I
love Apple phones, actually, and can't imagine having any other brand,
but I am alert, alive and un-deluded enough to recognise when there are
problems; I am not an Apple Groupie!

>
> as mentioned above, you're unlikely to need a spare battery in normal
> use, but in the unlikely event you do, there are numerous phone cases
> with built-in batteries (for android or apple) as well as portable usb
> batteries which can power or charge anything that uses usb for power,
> which are a *lot* of devices. some of the larger external usb batteries
> can even charge a laptop, or a phone *many* times over.
>

My iPhone 6s, when new, could hardly get through one day, so please do
not assume you can speak for everyone's experience. I now use a charger
case, but that makes my phone so much heavier than it should be.

Wilf

[harry newton]

Jolly Roger, the village idiot, has proved yet again, he's an utter moron.

Slander: "oral" defamation
<https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/slander>

Advice for the iOS village idiot, Jolly Roger:
Look up the difference between "slander" and "libel".

[nospam]

In article <p29eql$bvb$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf <wi...@replyto.newsgroup>
wrote:

> >>
> >> Not a non-issue, as I could otherwise carry a spare, charged battery
> >> with me at all times to swap in when the incumbent one ran out of charge
> >> on a given day.
> >
> > it's definitely a non-issue.
> >
> > you are assuming iphones have whatever shitty battery life your current
> > phone has.
>
> It's a non-issue for you and I respect that ... you're lucky. It's not
> a non-issue for me, and you do not seem to respect that fact. My
> "shitty battery life" is part of an iPhone 6s

a 6s does not have shitty battery life.

i have a 6s and it lasts well over 1 day in typical use, usually more
than 2 days.

>
> My iPhone 6s, when new, could hardly get through one day, so please do
> not assume you can speak for everyone's experience. I now use a charger
> case, but that makes my phone so much heavier than it should be.

then you may have a defective battery. that's not normal.

take it to an apple store and have them check it.

[Jolly Roger]

harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> Jolly Roger, the village idiot, has proved yet again, he's an utter moron.

Troll, troll, troll your boat...

[Lewis]

In message <301220172010092937%nos...@nospam.invalid> nospam <nos...@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> In article <p29cj5$9kb$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf <wi...@replyto.newsgroup>
> wrote:

>> >> This all would not matter terribly much if I could purchase a spare
>> >> battery and swap it out with the original ... at will ... like I can do
>> >> with my camera.
>> >
>> > you can, and it even includes tools:
>> > <https://www.ifixit.com/Kits/iPhone-Battery-Kits>
>>
>> I'm really talking about regular battery-swaps in and out, say when mine
>> runs low on a given day.

> there's no need to swap an iphone battery during the day since it will
> normally last 2-3 days on a single charge in typical use.

Oh come on. My phone has no trouble getting through a day, but it cannot
get through two days, much less three.

> it really only needs to last 1 day, because it will be charged at night.

Yep. And if it's a real issue, a "lipstick" battery can give you 4 hours
more life easily. The iPhone 6/6S/7 can all take the Apple Battery case,
and that will give you two days of battery life.

--
'Are you Death?' IT'S THE SCYTHE, ISN'T IT? PEOPLE ALWAYS NOTICE THE
SCYTHE.

[Leonard Blaisdell]

In article <p29eql$bvb$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, Wilf <wi...@replyto.newsgroup>
wrote:

> My iPhone 6s, when new, could hardly get through one day, so please do
> not assume you can speak for everyone's experience. I now use a charger
> case, but that makes my phone so much heavier than it should be.

So get the $29 fresh battery from Apple. Easy peasy. It will be just
like a brand new iPhone 6s in a world that has moved on to an 8 or X
with more powerful abilities. See, that's how they get ya!

leo

[harry newton]

He who is Leonard Blaisdell said on Sun, 31 Dec 2017 21:53:41 -0800:

> So get the $29 fresh battery from Apple. Easy peasy. It will be just
> like a brand new iPhone 6s in a world that has moved on to an 8 or X
> with more powerful abilities. See, that's how they get ya!

The main problem is that you have to replace the battery once a year or so
(whenever the iOS decides to throttle the CPU again to less than half the
claimed speeds).

So you can buy the $40 battery (includes shipping & tax) this year, but
then next year you're back to buying the $95 battery (includes shipping &
tax), and again the year after that.

So for your typical six-year life of a smartphone (mine is going strong
from circa 2012 for example), you have to buy five new batteries just to
keep the CPU at the claimed speeds - which will cost you $40 + $95 + $95 +
$95 + $95 = $420.

If you don't buy Apple iPhones, you don't have to do any of that (and you
save your $420) because this *permanent* & *drastic* no-longer-secret CPU
throttling only occurs on Apple iPhones.

For example, you can buy eight (8) LG Stylo 3 Plus $130 phones from Costco
for the price of one (1) hardware-equivalent iPhone 7 Plus at Costco (with
the batteries taken into account in that math).

Your choice:
8 hardware-equivalent Android phones for 1 iPhone

[nospam]

In article <p2cj72$k7f$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, harry newton

<ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> For example, you can buy eight (8) LG Stylo 3 Plus $130 phones from Costco
> for the price of one (1) hardware-equivalent iPhone 7 Plus at Costco (with
> the batteries taken into account in that math).

you really are that stupid.

[Alan Browne]

On 2017-12-30 13:32, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2017-12-30, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:

>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>
>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>

>> <s>
>>
>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>
> Nonsense. Apple announced the feature in the iOS 10.2.1 release notes.
> That's good enough for rational people who understand the engineering
> challenges.

Which is what slim percentage of Apple iPhone users? 3%? Maybe.

It's a PR fiasco which is why a) Apple have posted their "apology"
online and 2) are offering the battery change at a serious discount.

There's no word smithing out of this - and it's almost hilarious
watching you try.

--
“When it is all said and done, there are approximately 94 million
full-time workers in private industry paying taxes to support 102
million non-workers and 21 million government workers.
In what world does this represent a strong job market?”
.Jim Quinn

[Alan Browne]

On 2017-12-30 14:50, Lewis wrote:

> In message <H7GdnQJCIpNPR9rH...@giganews.com> Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>
>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>> <s>
>
>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>

> And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
> Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
> at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.

My issue is not with what they did as a technical solution but the
opaque description of it and the lack of a suggestion such as: "At some
point you may wish to replace your battery to restore full performance."

That would be transparent, informative and helpful.

They missed a great opportunity to avoid all this egg over their face.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2017-12-30 13:32, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2017-12-30, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>>
>>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>>> <s>
>>>
>>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>>
>> Nonsense. Apple announced the feature in the iOS 10.2.1 release notes.
>> That's good enough for rational people who understand the engineering
>> challenges.
>
> Which is what slim percentage of Apple iPhone users?

The misguided feelings of people who don't bother to read or understand
the issues aren't very valuable to me. Trolls, on the other hand, place
high value on bullshit.

> It's a PR fiasco

One manufactured by trolls and clueless idiots, sure.

> There's no word smithing out of this - and it's almost hilarious
> watching you try.

No word Smithing is happening. Reasonable people just aren't going along
with your trolls. Cry harder.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2017-12-30 14:50, Lewis wrote:
>> In message <H7GdnQJCIpNPR9rH...@giganews.com> Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>>
>>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>>> <s>
>>
>>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>>
>> And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
>> Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
>> at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.
>
> My issue is not with what they did as a technical solution but the
> opaque description of it

Quick, point to the non-opaque statements by other phone makers.

Tick tock...

[JF Mezei]

On 2018-01-01 14:29, Jolly Roger wrote:

> One manufactured by trolls and clueless idiots, sure.

Apple responded top this issue and will take actions such as lowered
battery prices and updated software. Apple wouldn't have done that for
stories started by trolls and clueless idiots.

It is YOU who are trolling by refusing to admit this is an issue.


Just because trolls exagerate the issue to troll leevls does not negate
the existence of the issue.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-01, JF Mezei <jfmezei...@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 2018-01-01 14:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
>
>> One manufactured by trolls and clueless idiots, sure.
>

> Apple responded to this issue and will take actions such as lowered

> battery prices and updated software. Apple wouldn't have done that for
> stories started by trolls and clueless idiots.

Sure they would. It's what happened.

> It is YOU who are trolling

Coming from the resident Apple FUDster, that means nothing at all.

> Just because trolls exagerate the issue

Means they will be ignored as the ignorant trolls they are.

Bye, Felicia.

[Alan Browne]

On 2018-01-01 14:29, Jolly Roger wrote:

> On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>> On 2017-12-30 13:32, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>> On 2017-12-30, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>>>> <s>
>>>>
>>>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>>>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>>>
>>> Nonsense. Apple announced the feature in the iOS 10.2.1 release notes.
>>> That's good enough for rational people who understand the engineering
>>> challenges.
>>
>> Which is what slim percentage of Apple iPhone users?
>
> The misguided feelings of people who don't bother to read or understand
> the issues aren't very valuable to me. Trolls, on the other hand, place
> high value on bullshit.

You're placing a high value on defending the indefensible....

>
>> It's a PR fiasco
>
> One manufactured by trolls and clueless idiots, sure.
>
>> There's no word smithing out of this - and it's almost hilarious
>> watching you try.
>
> No word Smithing is happening. Reasonable people just aren't going along
> with your trolls. Cry harder.

You're so cute when you're defending apple when they have their knickers
about their ankles...

[Alan Browne]

On 2018-01-01 14:30, Jolly Roger wrote:
> On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>> On 2017-12-30 14:50, Lewis wrote:
>>> In message <H7GdnQJCIpNPR9rH...@giganews.com> Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>>>> <s>
>>>
>>>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>>>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>>>
>>> And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
>>> Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
>>> at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.
>>
>> My issue is not with what they did as a technical solution but the
>> opaque description of it
>
> Quick, point to the non-opaque statements by other phone makers.

Wow. High school debating team tactics - deflect to the other phone
makers. Who gives a shit about the others.

[harry newton]

He who is Alan Browne said on Mon, 1 Jan 2018 15:20:20 -0500:

> Wow. High school debating team tactics - deflect to the other phone
> makers. Who gives a shit about the others.

This classic deflection is what I call the "cookie jar" argument by the
Apple Apologists.

Even Apple did it in their idiotic message about "batteries".

The deflection argument relies on people being inherently stupid.
Hence, they feel it works because they're not used to non-stupid people.

As you know, it's the classic Apple Apologists' tactic which goes like
this:

Mom: "Billy - is your hand in the cookie jar?"
Billy: No. (Pulls hand out of cookie jar.)
Mom: Is that chocolate on your face?
Billy: No. (Wipes face.)
Mom: Why did you eat those cookies?
Billy: I didn't eat the cookies! (Shakes crumbs off of clothing.)
Mom: Why are cookie crumbs all over you?
Billy: But Susan across the street hits her dog!
Mom: What does that have to do with you getting caught eating the cookies?
Billy: But Sammy next door threw a rock at the window!
(this goes on forever)

Why are the Apple Apologists not like normal people?
Answer: I don't know why - but they're not normal.

They exhibit absolutely no comprehension of logical fact.

[harry newton]

He who is nospam said on Mon, 01 Jan 2018 02:16:56 -0500:

>> For example, you can buy eight (8) LG Stylo 3 Plus $130 phones from Costco
>> for the price of one (1) hardware-equivalent iPhone 7 Plus at Costco (with
>> the batteries taken into account in that math).
>
> you really are that stupid.

We realize that you always find the *worst* price-to-performance
comparisons but you can't deny the facts in this one where the $130 LG
Stylo 3 Plus has hardware features that you can't hope to find in *any* of
the latest iOS devices ... such as
- 8 cores
- 2 TeraByte expansion
- Removable battery
- Courageous headphone jack
- FM radio
etc.

The hardware comparison between the $130 Stylo 3 Plus phablet is "about the
same" as the $670 iPhone 7 in that the main advantage the phone has is more
CPU speed for half as many cores but remember, that CPU speed will likely
be halved by iOS in just one or two years of use.

The only other hardware advantage the five-times-more-expensive iPhone has
is 3GB of RAM versus 2GB on the five-times-cheaper LG phone.

The rest of the specs (e.g., display size, pixels, type, etc.) and camera
specs and GSM specs and internal storage specs, and sensor specs, etc., are
almost exactly the same.

We already proved this in another thread.
Phablet stocking stuffers: iPhone 7 versus LG Stylo 3 Plus
price/performance hardware comparison
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/HDI8moW_4Pw%5B1-25%5D>

You Apple Apologists hate facts.

[harry newton]

He who is Alan Browne said on Mon, 1 Jan 2018 15:18:54 -0500:

> You're placing a high value on defending the indefensible....

A decade or more ago, I actually thought the Apple Apologists were perhaps
intelligent, but just misguided.

I've learned since then that they're not normal people.

Why do they incessantly fabricate imaginary functionality?
Who knows why.

The Apple Apologists are not like normal adults.

They even deny what Apple already admitted.

What normal person does that?

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 1 Jan 2018 20:01:51 GMT:

> Means they will be ignored as the ignorant trolls they are.

Any fact Jolly Roger doesn't like - he calls a troll.

Jolly Roger vehemently denies what Apple already admitted!

Why?
Who the hell knows why.

*But that's how an Apple Apologists' mind works!*

[harry newton]

He who is JF Mezei said on Mon, 1 Jan 2018 14:59:54 -0500:

> It is YOU who are trolling by refusing to admit this is an issue.

The Apple Apologists, which Jolly Roger clearly is, all seem to still
vehemently deny what Apple already admitted!

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2018-01-01 14:29, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>> On 2017-12-30 13:32, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>> On 2017-12-30, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>>>>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>>>>
>>>> Nonsense. Apple announced the feature in the iOS 10.2.1 release
>>>> notes. That's good enough for rational people who understand the
>>>> engineering challenges.
>>>
>>> Which is what slim percentage of Apple iPhone users?
>>
>> The misguided feelings of people who don't bother to read or
>> understand the issues aren't very valuable to me. Trolls, on the
>> other hand, place high value on bullshit.
>
> You're placing a high value on defending the indefensible....

The fact that you're acting like extending the runtime of devices with
failing batteries is some sort of "indefensible" offense says all we
need to know about your motives.

Meanwhile Apple continues to gain the loyalty of those of us who are
intelligent and level-headed enough to understand the engineering issues
involved and how what Apple does helps improve the user experience while
raking in the majority of the profits. And there's not one little thing
the haters can do about it except cry harder. Boo fuckin' hoo.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
> On 2018-01-01 14:30, Jolly Roger wrote:
>> On 2018-01-01, Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>> On 2017-12-30 14:50, Lewis wrote:
>>>> In message <H7GdnQJCIpNPR9rH...@giganews.com> Alan Browne <bitb...@blackhole.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 2017-12-30 12:42, Jolly Roger wrote:
>>>>>> From Seeking Alpha:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://seekingalpha.com/article/4134069-apple-slandered-chemistry-fix>
>>>>> <s>
>>>>
>>>>> It's not about the technicalities - it's about Apple's lack of
>>>>> transparency resulting in a PR fiasco.
>>>>
>>>> And yet none of the phone manufactures have behaved any differently,
>>>> Samsung does *exactly* the same thing. I don't see The Internet frothing
>>>> at Samsung for routinely dropping performance 50-80%.
>>>
>>> My issue is not with what they did as a technical solution but the
>>> opaque description of it
>>
>> Quick, point to the non-opaque statements by other phone makers.
>
> Wow.

Yep, just as I thought. You have nothing.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-01, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> He who is Jolly Roger said on 1 Jan 2018 20:01:51 GMT:
>
>> Means they will be ignored as the ignorant trolls they are.
>
> Any fact

Your so-called "facts" are nothing but misguided opinions, old fool.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 1 Jan 2018 23:29:05 GMT:

> Your so-called "facts" are nothing but misguided opinions, old fool.

Apple Apologists like you hate facts.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 1 Jan 2018 23:27:46 GMT:

> Meanwhile Apple continues to gain the loyalty of those of us who are
> intelligent and level-headed enough to understand the engineering issues
> involved and how what Apple does helps improve the user experience while
> raking in the majority of the profits. And there's not one little thing
> the haters can do about it except cry harder. Boo fuckin' hoo.

Oh ... the humor.... Jolly Roger ... you're killing me with your humor!

I can't even drink my coffee ... this was so funny.

Thanks!

:)

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 31 Dec 2017 01:59:10 GMT:

> Troll, troll, troll your boat...

Read this article (WARNING: It contains facts).
<https://www.extremetech.com/mobile/261243-apple-cuts-battery-replacement-costs-wont-stop-throttling-iphone-performance>

I realize you're allergic to facts so I hope you don't break out in hives.

Some verbatim quotes:
"The effective cost of buying an Apple device is significantly higher
than it used to be, at least for people who keep their hardware more
than a year"

"Apple acknowledges that it failed to properly inform users about the
changes made in iOS 10.2.1 and the introduction of this throttling."

"Apple tries to dodge responsibility for its own smartphone designs"
"This is an Apple-only issue."

"Android phones do not perform this kind of throttling".

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-02, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> He who is Jolly Roger said on 1 Jan 2018 23:29:05 GMT:
>
>> Your so-called "facts" are nothing but misguided opinions, old fool.
>
> Apple Apologists

You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-02, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 1 Jan 2018 23:27:46 GMT:
>
>> Meanwhile Apple continues to gain the loyalty of those of us who are
>> intelligent and level-headed enough to understand the engineering issues
>> involved and how what Apple does helps improve the user experience while
>> raking in the majority of the profits. And there's not one little thing
>> the haters can do about it except cry harder. Boo fuckin' hoo.
>
> Oh ... the humor....

It's clear it really eats you up that some folks prefer Apple. You are
consumed with jealousy. Pitiful old man.

[Jolly Roger]

On 2018-01-02, harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:

> He who is Jolly Roger said on 31 Dec 2017 01:59:10 GMT:
>
>> Troll, troll, troll your boat...
>
> Read this

Troll, troll, troll your boat...

> "Android phones do not perform this kind of throttling".

Android phones get throttled too:

"I have heavy duty real time image processing app on android and just
got the Samsung Galaxy S3 (9300).

What I observe is that the device is doing heavy throttling on the cpu
speed."

<https://stackoverflow.com/questions/11883404/how-to-control-cpu-throttling-on-android>

"I've found on the HTC One X that when the screen is off the CPU
throttles back to 384 MHz. This speed is too slow for DSP processing I
am trying to do."

<https://stackoverflow.com/questions/13616660/can-i-control-an-android-phones-cpu-throttling>

[nospam]

In article <fb1tln...@mid.individual.net>, Jolly Roger

<jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:

> >
> > Apple Apologists
>
> You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
> Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.

they don't even qualify for opinions, given that they're demonstrably
false, sometimes dramatically so.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:27:03 GMT:

> It's clear it really eats you up that some folks prefer Apple. You are
> consumed with jealousy. Pitiful old man.

The way you respond to facts you don't like is to attempt to insult the
bearer of truth - which is a key trait of all the Apple Apologists.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:26:15 GMT:

> You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
> Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.

When you incessantly deny what Apple already admitted, that makes you an
Apple Apologist.

When you incessantly fabricate iOS functionality that only exists in your
mind, that makes you an Apple Apologists.

When you claim that Apple informed users adequately when nobody on the
planet but Apple Apologists even dares to make such a patently ridiculous
claim, that makes you an Apple Apologists.

You are an Apple Apologist because you act exactly like an Apple Apologist.

[Jolly Roger]

harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:27:03 GMT:
>
>> It's clear it really eats you up that some folks prefer Apple. You are
>> consumed with jealousy. Pitiful old man.
>
> The way you respond to facts

You haven't posted any facts to respond to.

[Jolly Roger]

harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:26:15 GMT:
>
>> You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
>> Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.
>
> When you

Still no facts, eh?

When you keel over and die these newsgroups will instantly improve.

[harry newton]

He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 22:00:23 GMT:

> When you keel over and die these newsgroups will instantly improve.

Not really.

What you'll notice over the decades is that the Apple Apologists habitually
deny what everyone else knows to be fact (that Apple admitted), the Apple
Apologists incessantly make up fictional functionality (that doesn't
exist), and the Apple Apologists spew patently ridiculous claims (such as
that Apple adequately "informed" people).

You, nospam, Snit, Jamie, and Lewis are all classic Apple Apologists.

The *only* reason Apple threads go nowhere endlessly is that you exist.

What happens is that reasonable people eventually give up because you Apple
Apologists make the most unrealistic and patently ridiculous claims.

That's a fact.

[Jolly Roger]

harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 22:00:23 GMT:
>
>> When you keel over and die these newsgroups will instantly improve.
>
> Not really.

Really.

[Elden]

On Jan 2, 2018, Jolly Roger wrote
(in article <fb2dnm...@mid.individual.net>):

> harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> > He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:26:15 GMT:
> >
> > > You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
> > > Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.
> >
> > When you
>
> Still no facts, eh?
>
> When you keel over and die these newsgroups will instantly improve.

Or when people stop responding to him... would achieve the same result. One
you have control over, the other you don’t.

--
-=Elden=-

[Jolly Roger]

Good luck with that. He changes nyms and other headers regularly to
avoid filters, as anyone who has been here more than a minute knows.

[Elden]

On Jan 12, 2018, Jolly Roger wrote:

> On 2018-01-13, Elden<use...@moondog.org> wrote:
> > On Jan 2, 2018, Jolly Roger wrote
> > (in article <fb2dnm...@mid.individual.net>):
> > > harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
> > > > He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:26:15 GMT:
> > > >
> > > > > You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
> > > > > Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.
> > > >
> > > > When you
> > >
> > > Still no facts, eh?
> > >
> > > When you keel over and die these newsgroups will instantly improve.
> >
> > Or when people stop responding to him... would achieve the same
> > result. One you have control over, the other you don’t.
>
> Good luck with that. He changes nyms and other headers regularly to
> avoid filters, as anyone who has been here more than a minute knows.

Whoosh!

--
-=Elden=-

[Chris]

Jolly Roger <jolly...@pobox.com> wrote:
> On 2018-01-13, Elden <use...@moondog.org> wrote:
>> On Jan 2, 2018, Jolly Roger wrote
>> (in article <fb2dnm...@mid.individual.net>):
>>> harry newton <ha...@at.invalid> wrote:
>>>> He who is Jolly Roger said on 2 Jan 2018 17:26:15 GMT:
>>>>
>>>>> You call anyone who calls you out on your lame trolls an "Apple
>>>>> Apologist". All of your so-called "facts" are opinions.
>>>>
>>>> When you
>>>
>>> Still no facts, eh?
>>>
>>> When you keel over and die these newsgroups will instantly improve.
>>
>> Or when people stop responding to him... would achieve the same
>> result. One you have control over, the other you don’t.
>
> Good luck with that. He changes nyms and other headers regularly to
> avoid filters, as anyone who has been here more than a minute knows.

Then spend the 30 seconds it takes to update your killfile. Job done. End.
Of. Story.

[Harold Newton]

On 2 Jan 2018 17:29:15 GMT, Jolly Roger wrote:

> Android phones get throttled too:

If Apple is so innocent and maligned unfairly for screwing its customers,
why did Apple themselves duplicitously employ the *same* clever distortions
of the truth that Apple Apologists nospam and you employ constantly?

I only speak fact.

Watch this:
Apple's iPhone Explanation is not matching up with the truth:
<https://youtu.be/CcgchEv-dyE>

And read this:

"The feature was not mentioned in the release notes accompanying
the update, but Apple quietly revised the notes to include a
line about "power management" at some point *after* the update
was released."

There are problems with Apple's iPhone battery explanation

<http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-iphone-battery-explanation-might-cost-company-in-court-2018-1>

"Even an Apple user who was paying attention would not have known about
the feature had they downloaded the update"

"There was no mention of the CPU throttling feature or "power management"
included with the release notes that accompanied the software update on
January 23."

"Release notes associated with the software update, quietly revised on
Apple's website [well] *after* the software's release, [only] *now*
mention 'power management during peak workloads.'"

"A screenshot of the release notes from an iPhone, [are] different
from the notes *now* listed on Apple's website."

"Blog posts from 9to5Mac and MacRumors at the time also say that
the release notes ... didn't mention power management."

"[By] February 23...the feature was already on 'over 50% of active
iOS devices'"

"In December, Apple said that it "extended" the CPU-throttling feature
to the iPhone 7, which is a newer model of device than the iPhones
that were experiencing the shutdown issue that Cook was talking
about. However, the release notes for that update did not mention
a power management feature, either."

"Apple kept [this] information from consumers for quite some time,
[Apple] didn't reveal the fact that the rollout of a new operating
system was going to have the effect of dropping back phones."