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Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors (only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
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arlen michael holder
Nov 16, 2018, 2:30:23 PM11/16/18
to
Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors?
(the question is only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
move causes tremendously different things to happen, so I added a second
monitor just so that I could start:stop:backup:repeat play video tutorials
in one monitor and then try to reproduce those actions in another monitor.
<https://comp.mobile.android.narkive.com/0dR8Lodl/report-my-first-hello-world-using-android-studio-freeware-on-windows-worked-just-fine-in-about-an#post18>
That works fine, but now I use dual monitors for everything.
Hence the issue of windows popping up comes to the fore.
For example, sometimes I doubleclick on a taskbar icon and the result pops
up in monitorleft, while other times it pops up in monitorright.
Where it pops up seems to simply be the last place it was put, where it
seems that, for efficiency, a set of "guidelines" should be in place for
efficiency (i.e., one should never have to search is a maxim I employ).
Often, when there are a lot of windows, I find myself glancing left and
right to *find* where that window popped up.
If you have dual monitors, you'll know what I mean (if you don't have dual
monitors, you'll have lots of solutions because you won't understand the
problem - where those with the most solutions least understand the issues).
*What's a good philosophy for which windows go where?*
For example:
o My taskbar is only on the left monitor, so everything opens from left.
o I have browsers opening at left because you generally read left to right.
o I have file systems opening on the right because mice are to the right.
But what else do you do, philosophically, to streamline the use of dual
monitors?
(the question is only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
move causes tremendously different things to happen, so I added a second
monitor just so that I could start:stop:backup:repeat play video tutorials
in one monitor and then try to reproduce those actions in another monitor.
<https://comp.mobile.android.narkive.com/0dR8Lodl/report-my-first-hello-world-using-android-studio-freeware-on-windows-worked-just-fine-in-about-an#post18>
That works fine, but now I use dual monitors for everything.
Hence the issue of windows popping up comes to the fore.
For example, sometimes I doubleclick on a taskbar icon and the result pops
up in monitorleft, while other times it pops up in monitorright.
Where it pops up seems to simply be the last place it was put, where it
seems that, for efficiency, a set of "guidelines" should be in place for
efficiency (i.e., one should never have to search is a maxim I employ).
Often, when there are a lot of windows, I find myself glancing left and
right to *find* where that window popped up.
If you have dual monitors, you'll know what I mean (if you don't have dual
monitors, you'll have lots of solutions because you won't understand the
problem - where those with the most solutions least understand the issues).
*What's a good philosophy for which windows go where?*
For example:
o My taskbar is only on the left monitor, so everything opens from left.
o I have browsers opening at left because you generally read left to right.
o I have file systems opening on the right because mice are to the right.
But what else do you do, philosophically, to streamline the use of dual
monitors?
Bob_S
Nov 16, 2018, 11:57:54 PM11/16/18
to
So because a person with only one monitor in your mind has no knowledge of
what two monitors look like?
You are not as bright as you say you are....
I have 3 monitors but I'll be damned if I'd take the time to tell you a
solution after the way you talk down to others.
You sir - a first class ass.
Bob S.
what two monitors look like?
You are not as bright as you say you are....
I have 3 monitors but I'll be damned if I'd take the time to tell you a
solution after the way you talk down to others.
You sir - a first class ass.
Bob S.
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Nov 17, 2018, 4:33:42 AM11/17/18
to
In message <pso74g$eg6$1...@dont-email.me>, Bob_S <go...@phoenix.com>
writes:
bright.
appear to have done, as this is the first I've seen of this thread in
the 'group _I_ am reading it in), without quoting anything or saying to
whom you are replying, I think readers can make their own minds as to
who is an ass, of whatever class.
>
>Bob S.
John G.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
did you hear about the guy who was frozen to absolute zero? He was 0K ...
- Jason in alt.windows7.general (and three other 'groups), 2018-5-1
writes:
>So because a person with only one monitor in your mind has no knowledge
>of what two monitors look like?
I sincerely hope no-one has a monitor in my mind.
>of what two monitors look like?
>
>You are not as bright as you say you are....
Whatever I may think, I'm usually quite careful not to _say_ that I'm
>You are not as bright as you say you are....
bright.
>
>I have 3 monitors but I'll be damned if I'd take the time to tell you a
>solution after the way you talk down to others.
I haven't done that.
>I have 3 monitors but I'll be damned if I'd take the time to tell you a
>solution after the way you talk down to others.
>
>You sir - a first class ass.
By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
>You sir - a first class ass.
appear to have done, as this is the first I've seen of this thread in
the 'group _I_ am reading it in), without quoting anything or saying to
whom you are replying, I think readers can make their own minds as to
who is an ass, of whatever class.
>
>Bob S.
John G.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
did you hear about the guy who was frozen to absolute zero? He was 0K ...
- Jason in alt.windows7.general (and three other 'groups), 2018-5-1
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Nov 17, 2018, 4:55:41 AM11/17/18
to
In message <psn5sc$2h3$1...@news.mixmin.net>, arlen michael holder
[]
place it was put is a _cause_ of searching; it depends on whether you
remember where it was when you minimised/closed it, or not. (Neither
viewpoint is _wrong_; they're just different.) I suspect this applies
whether you have one monitor or many.
you, but won't for many (on the third one, for example, not everyone's
pointing device is on the right - and even if it is, the attachment of
[only?] "file systems" to the pointing device isn't obvious, to me
anyway).
usage-specific - that we won't come up with anything of wide usefulness.
But I might be wrong there. I suspect we might get _some_ people who
think their way/answer is the best one, though.
rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities. - Ayn Rand, quoted by Deb
Shinder 2012-3-30
<arlen_mich...@example.com> writes:
>Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors?
>(the question is only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
>
>I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
(What's an IDE - is it another "word" for user interface?)
>Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors?
>(the question is only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
>
>I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
[]
>That works fine, but now I use dual monitors for everything.
>Hence the issue of windows popping up comes to the fore.
>
>For example, sometimes I doubleclick on a taskbar icon and the result pops
>up in monitorleft, while other times it pops up in monitorright.
>
>Where it pops up seems to simply be the last place it was put, where it
>seems that, for efficiency, a set of "guidelines" should be in place for
>efficiency (i.e., one should never have to search is a maxim I employ).
Some people might consider a window popping up in _other_ than the last
>Hence the issue of windows popping up comes to the fore.
>
>For example, sometimes I doubleclick on a taskbar icon and the result pops
>up in monitorleft, while other times it pops up in monitorright.
>
>Where it pops up seems to simply be the last place it was put, where it
>seems that, for efficiency, a set of "guidelines" should be in place for
>efficiency (i.e., one should never have to search is a maxim I employ).
place it was put is a _cause_ of searching; it depends on whether you
remember where it was when you minimised/closed it, or not. (Neither
viewpoint is _wrong_; they're just different.) I suspect this applies
whether you have one monitor or many.
>
>Often, when there are a lot of windows, I find myself glancing left and
>right to *find* where that window popped up.
>
>If you have dual monitors, you'll know what I mean (if you don't have dual
>monitors, you'll have lots of solutions because you won't understand the
>problem - where those with the most solutions least understand the issues).
>
>*What's a good philosophy for which windows go where?*
>
>For example:
>o My taskbar is only on the left monitor, so everything opens from left.
>o I have browsers opening at left because you generally read left to right.
>o I have file systems opening on the right because mice are to the right.
Those "so/because/because" may seem logical ("a good philosophy") for
>Often, when there are a lot of windows, I find myself glancing left and
>right to *find* where that window popped up.
>
>If you have dual monitors, you'll know what I mean (if you don't have dual
>monitors, you'll have lots of solutions because you won't understand the
>problem - where those with the most solutions least understand the issues).
>
>*What's a good philosophy for which windows go where?*
>
>For example:
>o My taskbar is only on the left monitor, so everything opens from left.
>o I have browsers opening at left because you generally read left to right.
>o I have file systems opening on the right because mice are to the right.
you, but won't for many (on the third one, for example, not everyone's
pointing device is on the right - and even if it is, the attachment of
[only?] "file systems" to the pointing device isn't obvious, to me
anyway).
>
>But what else do you do, philosophically, to streamline the use of dual
>monitors?
A good question, though I suspect answers will be so personal - or
>But what else do you do, philosophically, to streamline the use of dual
>monitors?
usage-specific - that we won't come up with anything of wide usefulness.
But I might be wrong there. I suspect we might get _some_ people who
think their way/answer is the best one, though.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities. - Ayn Rand, quoted by Deb
Shinder 2012-3-30
Paul
Nov 17, 2018, 5:17:42 AM11/17/18
to
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>
> By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
> appear to have done
He didn't add newsgroups. All three messages are to:
>
> By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
> appear to have done
alt.windows7.general
microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
You could easily have found the original post.
By using the MIDs in the References on the header
of the Bob_S message.
http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI=%3Cpsn5sc%242h3%241%40news.mixmin.net%3E
Paul
R.Wieser
Nov 17, 2018, 7:13:02 AM11/17/18
to
Paul,
That url you posted to find newsgroup messages back using the reference,
http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI= ....
is that available to any random dude (myself included :-) ) ? (asking
because of a persons name in the domain name).
Sometimes I've got the need to do such a search, but throwing it into Google
mostly hasn't given me what I was after ...
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
That url you posted to find newsgroup messages back using the reference,
http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI= ....
is that available to any random dude (myself included :-) ) ? (asking
because of a persons name in the domain name).
Sometimes I've got the need to do such a search, but throwing it into Google
mostly hasn't given me what I was after ...
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Nov 17, 2018, 7:35:57 AM11/17/18
to
In message <psops3$4lh$1...@dont-email.me>, Paul <nos...@needed.invalid>
writes:
You are correct. I know why I didn't see the original. My fault.
The rest of my comments stand though (-:
Anthony Hopkins, RT 2016/10/22-28
writes:
The rest of my comments stand though (-:
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
If you're playing a killer monster, be very quiet. -
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
Anthony Hopkins, RT 2016/10/22-28
R.Wieser
Nov 17, 2018, 8:03:41 AM11/17/18
to
John,
>>>So because a person with only one monitor in your mind has no knowledge
>>>of what two monitors look like?
...
Its about persons who have only a single monitor (implanted) in(to) Arlens
mind. Which I do not quite understand, because why would anyone want or
need to put more than one into such a brain ? :-)
Also, while I suspect there shrinks would actually benefit from being able
to do so, I'm quite certain that most of us here would not enjoy it in the
least. :-p
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
>>>So because a person with only one monitor in your mind has no knowledge
>>>of what two monitors look like?
>>I sincerely hope no-one has a monitor in my mind.
...
> The rest of my comments stand though (-:
I think you read that one the wrong way around :
Its about persons who have only a single monitor (implanted) in(to) Arlens
mind. Which I do not quite understand, because why would anyone want or
need to put more than one into such a brain ? :-)
Also, while I suspect there shrinks would actually benefit from being able
to do so, I'm quite certain that most of us here would not enjoy it in the
least. :-p
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Mayayana
Nov 17, 2018, 8:49:03 AM11/17/18
to
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" <G6JP...@255soft.uk> wrote
| >I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
|
| (What's an IDE - is it another "word" for user interface?)
Integrated development environment. Like Visual
Studio. Generally used to refer to programming tools
where you can get at anything you need through a
single UI.
A code editor will usually have things like debugging,
but an IDE will provide access to work as a "project",
allowing you to deal with all files, resources, compiler,
docs, etc through the single program window. IDE is a
somewhat stuffy term, but we can be thankful that
Microsoft don't call it a Next Gen Solutionizing Modern
Software Solution for Enterprise Services. Then we'd
have to say NGSMSSES and people would probably
fight over how to pronounce it. Is it "nagsmisses"
or "nig some esses"? [Hint: Losers say nig some esses.]
If I understand correctly, Arlen is talking about
making Android phone apps with a tool that Microsoft
provides, and despite trying to exert military
discipline over the IDE, it isn't listening to him.
Which of course has nothing whatever to do with
Win7 or XP. I doubt the MS code editor will run on
the latter.
| >I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
|
| (What's an IDE - is it another "word" for user interface?)
Studio. Generally used to refer to programming tools
where you can get at anything you need through a
single UI.
A code editor will usually have things like debugging,
but an IDE will provide access to work as a "project",
allowing you to deal with all files, resources, compiler,
docs, etc through the single program window. IDE is a
somewhat stuffy term, but we can be thankful that
Microsoft don't call it a Next Gen Solutionizing Modern
Software Solution for Enterprise Services. Then we'd
have to say NGSMSSES and people would probably
fight over how to pronounce it. Is it "nagsmisses"
or "nig some esses"? [Hint: Losers say nig some esses.]
If I understand correctly, Arlen is talking about
making Android phone apps with a tool that Microsoft
provides, and despite trying to exert military
discipline over the IDE, it isn't listening to him.
Which of course has nothing whatever to do with
Win7 or XP. I doubt the MS code editor will run on
the latter.
Frank Slootweg
Nov 17, 2018, 9:10:48 AM11/17/18
to
software) which does not have the capability to show the 'parent' of the
article you're currently looking at.
'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE/WM/WLM/TB, etc. can do that by
just 'opening' the thread in the threads pane and see in which
branch/subthread the current post is and look 'up' the thread to see the
parent.
In my CUI newsreader (tin) it's even simpler. I just press 'u' - for
up the thread - to see the parent, 'u' again to see the grandparent,
etc..
So John may want to have a look if Turnpike does (not) have this
essential functionality.
Char Jackson
Nov 17, 2018, 9:16:36 AM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 12:35:27 +0000, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
<G6JP...@255soft.uk> wrote:
>In message <psops3$4lh$1...@dont-email.me>, Paul <nos...@needed.invalid>
>writes:
>>J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>
>>> By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
>>>appear to have done
>>
>>He didn't add newsgroups. All three messages are to:
>>
>> alt.windows7.general
>> microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
>>
>>You could easily have found the original post.
>>By using the MIDs in the References on the header
>>of the Bob_S message.
>>
>>http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI=%3Cpsn5sc%242h
>>3%241%40news.mixmin.net%3E
>>
>> Paul
>You are correct. I know why I didn't see the original. My fault.
>
>The rest of my comments stand though (-:
With all due respect, I thought your entire post completely missed the
<G6JP...@255soft.uk> wrote:
>In message <psops3$4lh$1...@dont-email.me>, Paul <nos...@needed.invalid>
>writes:
>>J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>
>>> By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
>>>appear to have done
>>
>>He didn't add newsgroups. All three messages are to:
>>
>> alt.windows7.general
>> microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
>>
>>You could easily have found the original post.
>>By using the MIDs in the References on the header
>>of the Bob_S message.
>>
>>http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI=%3Cpsn5sc%242h
>>3%241%40news.mixmin.net%3E
>>
>> Paul
>You are correct. I know why I didn't see the original. My fault.
>
>The rest of my comments stand though (-:
mark, which is extremely unusual for you. Bob_S was right on, IMHO,
although he might have quoted something to help folks understand to whom
he was responding. (the troll, arlen, obviously)
--
Char Jackson
R.Wieser
Nov 17, 2018, 10:19:12 AM11/17/18
to
Frank,
> 'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE
Yes, even back in OE5 you could switch between a sorted on
date/name/subject/etc list and a thread tree.
But that always needs to be done by toolbar -> "view" -> "currrent view" ->
"group messages by conversation" (I've never seen (an addition for) a simple
(switch between list and tree) button for it). It also drops any message
focus it might have had, leaving it upto the user to find it back again.
Which is no fun in a long thread that has several/many subthreads.
... Which is also the reason why I seldom switch from one to the other.
Its often easier to switch to "sort by subject" (from the defailt "sort by
date") and than looking up a bit.
Also, your "go to parent" probably breaks when you have certain posters
blocked - and which probably is why John didn't see the parent message in
the first place.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
> 'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE
date/name/subject/etc list and a thread tree.
But that always needs to be done by toolbar -> "view" -> "currrent view" ->
"group messages by conversation" (I've never seen (an addition for) a simple
(switch between list and tree) button for it). It also drops any message
focus it might have had, leaving it upto the user to find it back again.
Which is no fun in a long thread that has several/many subthreads.
... Which is also the reason why I seldom switch from one to the other.
Its often easier to switch to "sort by subject" (from the defailt "sort by
date") and than looking up a bit.
Also, your "go to parent" probably breaks when you have certain posters
blocked - and which probably is why John didn't see the parent message in
the first place.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Paul
Nov 17, 2018, 10:49:01 AM11/17/18
to
But it is useful, in cases where you want to generate
a web page for someone, so they can see source material
without having to fumble around with other stuff.
http://al.howardknight.net/
It's better than Google, because it includes alt.windows7.general.
It's worse than Google, because long messages get truncated.
Howard had to add the truncation feature, after movie
pirates decided to try to fill it with movie uploads
and then use it as their bitch. So Howard retaliated
by ruining the archive, and truncating *any* long
message, not just ones with obvious movie payloads.
Which is a smart move on Howards part, as the movie
pirates can't game the system if all long posts are
ruined. So if a post is really long, you can't
read all of it on the resulting web page.
Paul
Paul
Nov 17, 2018, 10:53:03 AM11/17/18
to
Frank Slootweg wrote:
> Paul <nos...@needed.invalid> wrote:
>> J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>
>>> By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
>>> appear to have done
>> He didn't add newsgroups. All three messages are to:
>>
>> alt.windows7.general
>> microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
>>
>> You could easily have found the original post.
>> By using the MIDs in the References on the header
>> of the Bob_S message.
>>
>> http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI=%3Cpsn5sc%242h3%241%40news.mixmin.net%3E
>
> Why go to all that trouble?
When a message hasn't yet shown up on a server
> Paul <nos...@needed.invalid> wrote:
>> J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
>>
>>> By posting a post like this one (especially adding newsgroups as you
>>> appear to have done
>> He didn't add newsgroups. All three messages are to:
>>
>> alt.windows7.general
>> microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
>>
>> You could easily have found the original post.
>> By using the MIDs in the References on the header
>> of the Bob_S message.
>>
>> http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?STYPE=msgid&A=0&MSGI=%3Cpsn5sc%242h3%241%40news.mixmin.net%3E
>
> Why go to all that trouble?
for some reason, Howard is my backup system. If
I need someone to see a message *right now*,
I generate a reference using Howard.
That's why I used it. In case John couldn't
see the message where he is sitting.
Right now, some messages are coming into E-S
about 12 hours late. And it almost looks like
the spool is corrupted right now. That's why
I'm reading and posting via AIOE for the time
being.
Paul
Paul
Nov 17, 2018, 10:57:57 AM11/17/18
to
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
> In message <psn5sc$2h3$1...@news.mixmin.net>, arlen michael holder
> <arlen_mich...@example.com> writes:
>> Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors?
>> (the question is only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
>>
>> I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
>
> (What's an IDE - is it another "word" for user interface?)
A neat thing about an IDE, is you can run a program you just
> <arlen_mich...@example.com> writes:
>> Philosophically, how do you "organize" two monitors?
>> (the question is only applicable to those of you with dual monitors)
>>
>> I'm a noob at Windows/Android where the IDE is so complex that one false
>
> (What's an IDE - is it another "word" for user interface?)
wrote, attach a debugger, and when you hit a breakpoint, the
text editor in the IDE "jumps" to the line of code where the
program is currently stopped.
This is an aid to debugging, saving developer time opening
files manually.
A number of features are "Integrated" together, to improve
workflow efficiency.
Doing things like Syntax Coloring in the text editor,
makes your glaring errors stand out better :-) Compared
to writing C in Notepad (which is what I use when
making 60 line programs for MinGW).
Paul
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 11:36:56 AM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 09:54:10 +0000, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
> A good question, though I suspect answers will be so personal - or
> usage-specific - that we won't come up with anything of wide usefulness.
> But I might be wrong there. I suspect we might get _some_ people who
> think their way/answer is the best one, though.
Hi J.P. Gilliver,
> A good question, though I suspect answers will be so personal - or
> usage-specific - that we won't come up with anything of wide usefulness.
> But I might be wrong there. I suspect we might get _some_ people who
> think their way/answer is the best one, though.
Instantly, dual monitors require an organizational philosophy adjustment.
(If people aren't organized, they likely won't even _notice_ a difference.)
You may know that I'm one of the most well organized people on this planet
for how my computer is set up, e.g., I _never_ need to search for anything,
and everything has a shortcut *on the taskbar*, where my philosophy is that
the taskbar is the *one and only* place to _start_ "things".
And yet, if there's one thing that _changes_ (tremendously) the _instant_
you add a second monitor ... it's ... well ... it's ... it's the taskbar!
Dammit! :)
I'm going to explain the problem below, but I don't have the solution yet
... (as the solution is what I'm asking about)...
Also, I'm not going to respond to the trolls (i.e., not to Bob S, Rudy
Wieser, and Char Jackson, who prove each time they post that all they _can_
do, is troll - mainly because they also prove to be utterly clueless in
technical knowledge, and yet, they feel a strangely desperate childish need
to post "something", even as that incessant moronic drivel Bob S, Rudy, and
Char post, simply proves they can only add negative value to any thread).
I think you understood the question, where, I've been using a single
monitor for, oh, as long as anyone, but when two monitors popped up,
*instantly*, things were different. Very different.
In an organizational sense.
If you don't have two monitors, you might not realize the task bar, for
example, acts differently in each monitor. There's nothing you can do about
it, because I tried, and it just acts differently. So I turned it off in
one monitor. That changes things instantly also, since now the main
"action" is always at the left (assuming a task bar at the left).
I just remembered, in typing that, that most people put the task bar
wherever Microsoft put it, which is, of course, on the bottom. From a
philosophical viewpoint, I think that's the *worst* place (other than at
the top) for a permanent taskbar, since up:down real estate is almost
always far more precious than side-to-side real estate in typically-sized
monitors.
Bear in my _all_ my equipment is handmedowns, from the computer (which was
salvage) to the main monitor (which was salvage) to the second monitor
(which was given to me by a friend when he found out that I was having
trouble with the IDE in dual monitors running video tutorials).
If a person has never been a noob to a complex IDE, who is using tutorials
to figure out complex tasks, then they may very well not comprehend that
the problem set is overwhelmingly different. Instantly so!
There's a thread on that very topic, just before this thread:
Subject: two mice, one for each monitor hooked to one desktop?
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2018 14:57:17 -0500
Message-ID: <pskj2u$ks9$1...@dont-email.me>
<http://www.pcbanter.net/showthread.php?t=1106395>
The problem is hard to describe because it's like driving a rental car,
where everything you used to do, is now in a different place.
For example,
o The mouse is still in the same old place (to the right, for me)
o The main monitor is to my front, in the usual place (for me)
o The second monitor is to the left.
o That taskbar drove me nuts though
If someone hasn't actually tried to have the same taskbar in both monitors,
they will never realize, I think, how different it instantly is, from a
single monitor. I finally gave up on trying to control that taskbar where I
rarely give up on technical things, but I just could not get the taskbar to
do the same thing in both monitors.
*Especially since my philosophy is that EVERYHTHING starts at the taskbar!*
While someone with one HUGE monitor may "claim" that it's the same thing as
two smaller monitors, it's just not. And it's *instantly* different.
Instantly, dual monitors require an organizational philosophy adjustment.
R.Wieser
Nov 17, 2018, 11:39:34 AM11/17/18
to
Paul,
> It doesn't "give threading for free", that site.
I was not assuming, or looking for anything like it. I just wondered if it
was maybe set up for some intimi, but leaked out somehow. I have little to
no wish to abuse such a situation.
But it caused me to consider a second thing: Do you have any idea about its
retention ? I'm asking, because its normally parents of already old
messages (often from necro-bumping GoogleGroups posters, but sometimes also
techical posts which lack context) that I sometimes want/need to take a peek
at.
> So Howard retaliated by ruining the archive, and truncating *any* long
> message, not just ones with obvious movie payloads.
> Which is a smart move on Howards part, as the movie pirates can't game the
> system if all long posts are ruined.
Both agreed. But I take it it was either that, or apart from auto-weedeing
the obvious ones, still needing to keep adding filters to weed out those
"gamers" ...Something which I think he tried first (but had to admit it
would take way to much time).
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
> It doesn't "give threading for free", that site.
was maybe set up for some intimi, but leaked out somehow. I have little to
no wish to abuse such a situation.
But it caused me to consider a second thing: Do you have any idea about its
retention ? I'm asking, because its normally parents of already old
messages (often from necro-bumping GoogleGroups posters, but sometimes also
techical posts which lack context) that I sometimes want/need to take a peek
at.
> So Howard retaliated by ruining the archive, and truncating *any* long
> message, not just ones with obvious movie payloads.
> Which is a smart move on Howards part, as the movie pirates can't game the
> system if all long posts are ruined.
the obvious ones, still needing to keep adding filters to weed out those
"gamers" ...Something which I think he tried first (but had to admit it
would take way to much time).
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
joe
Nov 17, 2018, 12:13:26 PM11/17/18
to
same time you could get a PC with intel processor. You can solve the
problem in hours, not days or weeks with the approaches you take.
Since you spend money on numerous phones and other electronic devices to
give away, getting the proper hardware to do what you are doing should
be easy.
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 12:24:20 PM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 10:57:58 -0500, Paul wrote:
> A neat thing about an IDE, is you can run a program you just
> wrote, attach a debugger, and when you hit a breakpoint, the
> text editor in the IDE "jumps" to the line of code where the
> program is currently stopped.
This (very detailed) post is only for J.P. Gilliver whom I respect, so I
> A neat thing about an IDE, is you can run a program you just
> wrote, attach a debugger, and when you hit a breakpoint, the
> text editor in the IDE "jumps" to the line of code where the
> program is currently stopped.
will explain, in detail, how IDEs are (vastly) _different_, in terms of
what a noob needs in monitor real-estate setup.
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5901351androidstudio55.jpg>
Bear in mind I'm a complete noob to this particular IDE, so the problem
*instantly* gets _different_ in that this isn't just punching buttons in
something relatively simple like, oh, say, "The GIMP", or "Photoshop", or
"ShotCut" (all of which pale in comparison to the complexity of this IDE).
Paul is correct (as alway, where, to help others who don't know how
freaking complex IDEs can be, here is a sample screenshot of the IDE that
I'm currently using.
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9210567androidstudio05.jpg>
The goal of this particular IDE, is to write Android apps on Windows:
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5881250androidstudio73.jpg>
Where the IDE is used to design & test Android apps on Windows computers:
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5614359androidstudio42.jpg>
It has many "panes", from coding panes, to error panes, to CAD panes, to
widget panes, to variable panes, to setting panes, to execution panes,
etc., all the while it interfaces to external devices and emulated devices.
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=7301488androidstudio29.jpg>
It's very extensible, where you can add an entire new level of complexity,
such as adding the entire suite of Microsoft Visual Studio Android
emulators, as I did, which brings in yet another GUI into the equation:
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9766951androidstudio33.jpg>
When you're doing all that, even WITHOUT the video tutorials, your screen
is filled to the brim with necessary windows, which is shown here.
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=8515596androidstudio46.jpg>
At the same time you're dealing with all that, you're _also_ dealing with
the Windows file system file explorer.
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1054744androidstudio50.jpg>
Where you're constantly creating & deleting & editing & moving files.
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5602322androidstudio51.jpg>
And all that assumes everything is already WORKING just dandy!
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5790092androidstudio56.jpg>
Which, almost always is not the case, at least for a noob like I am, so
you're constantly debugging something in Windows!
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=2597741androidstudio62.jpg>
After all that, then add a start-and-stop video tutorial to _that_ mess,
and you see that the need for screen real estate is paramount!
<http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=7987464androidstudio74.jpg>
To a noob, there is no freaking way they will get _anything_ done without
following a step-by-step tutorial. And, for a noob, the problem with almost
all (if not all) tutorials are numerous, where I can just summarize by
saying there are no good tutorials out there that I can find (yet) for this
particular IDE. (I'm not the only one looking where others have said the
same thing.)
Mostly the tutorials aren't so great because they're usually _old_ (like
they're on version 1 of the tools while the current tool is version 3), so
all the button presses are different.
Lots of the non-video tutorials don't show WHERE the icons are that they
hit, which is compounded by the fact that the icons are in different places
given the inevitable version mismatch (and setup mismatches).
For a noob, literally, you need more real estate than the typical 17-inch
monitor. If you have a HUGE monitor, then this question doesn't apply.
*But if you have only two small'ish monitors, the question applies.*
In summary, for J.P. Gilliver, an "IDE" is a complete environment (much
like, I guess, Microsoft Office is), where, for a noob, who is new to both
coding, and to emulation and to writing Android apps, the amount of "real
estate" you need on your monitor is *instantly* greater than doing simpler
things.
If you already have a *huge* monitor, the problem is vastly less.
If you have a *tiny* monitor, like I have, the problem compounds.
When you add a second 17" monitor, like I did, "things change".
Since I'm all about organization (if you have to resort to a search, you've
already lost the battle), all I'm asking is that people who have dealt with
these monitor changes for years to give me organizational advice.
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 12:25:44 PM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 10:49:01 -0500, Paul wrote:
> http://al.howardknight.net/
Thanks Paul,
This is offtopic, but to further help Rudy, and maybe to help others, Paul
is 100% correct on everything he wrote, as usual, where Paul's answer is
specific to the message id.
The summary below is not specific to the message id, but to keywords,
where I _created_ all the tinyurls below (some very many years ago).
I hope Rudy appreciates the effort since I'm always about helping everyone
with every post... :)
o In addition to Usenet Article Lookup by Message-ID engine:
<http://al.howardknight.net/>
AFAIK... there are only these:
o Google groups archive for WinXP:
<http://tinyurl.com/windowsxp-general>
<http://tinyurl.com/microsoft-public-windowsxp-gen> (30-char limit)
o N-archive for both WinXP & Win7:
<http://microsoft.public.windows.xp.general.narkive.com>
<http://alt.windows7.general.narkive.com>
o PCBanter archive for Windows 7
<http://tinyurl.com/ alt-windows7-general>
If anyone knows of _others_, now is a good time to edify us all!
--
Off-topic aside: I wish to thank JP Gilliver, where I appreciate that you
explained to "Bob S" that the question is perfectly valid. I will respond
more fully in later posts if others are like Bob S, who don't yet realize
that dual monitors instantly bring up organizational issues which didn't
exist prior (e.g., like dual taskbars).
> http://al.howardknight.net/
Thanks Paul,
This is offtopic, but to further help Rudy, and maybe to help others, Paul
is 100% correct on everything he wrote, as usual, where Paul's answer is
specific to the message id.
The summary below is not specific to the message id, but to keywords,
where I _created_ all the tinyurls below (some very many years ago).
I hope Rudy appreciates the effort since I'm always about helping everyone
with every post... :)
o In addition to Usenet Article Lookup by Message-ID engine:
<http://al.howardknight.net/>
AFAIK... there are only these:
o Google groups archive for WinXP:
<http://tinyurl.com/windowsxp-general>
<http://tinyurl.com/microsoft-public-windowsxp-gen> (30-char limit)
o N-archive for both WinXP & Win7:
<http://microsoft.public.windows.xp.general.narkive.com>
<http://alt.windows7.general.narkive.com>
o PCBanter archive for Windows 7
<http://tinyurl.com/ alt-windows7-general>
If anyone knows of _others_, now is a good time to edify us all!
--
Off-topic aside: I wish to thank JP Gilliver, where I appreciate that you
explained to "Bob S" that the question is perfectly valid. I will respond
more fully in later posts if others are like Bob S, who don't yet realize
that dual monitors instantly bring up organizational issues which didn't
exist prior (e.g., like dual taskbars).
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 12:56:40 PM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 11:13:21 -0600, joe wrote:
> If you are unhappy using two monitors, get yourself a 4k monitor. At the
> same time you could get a PC with intel processor. You can solve the
> problem in hours, not days or weeks with the approaches you take.
Hi Joe,
> If you are unhappy using two monitors, get yourself a 4k monitor. At the
> same time you could get a PC with intel processor. You can solve the
> problem in hours, not days or weeks with the approaches you take.
You are astute.
We know each other well, "joe" (mostly from the mobile phone ngs), so you
are completely correct that throwing money at the problem solves
everything.
I do not disagree.
I am a person who saves our precious resources. Most people are not.
For example, I compost all my leftovers so as to reduce, literally to zero,
the amount of trash I have to put out at the curb, and I have decades-old
vehicles simply because it's a waste of resources to buy new ones (the
sales tax of about 10% alone on a $50K car is more than repairs, where, as
you may know, "joe", I do all my own repairs, from vehicle alignment, to
mounting, repairing, & balancing my own tires, to brakes & cooling systems,
and where I write detailed tutorials on the net like I did recently for how
to replace a clutch (usually with HUNDREDS of pictures, to help noobs like
me out there).
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.home.repair/qEhph1MmSKs/S_R2Y4gRBwAJ>
Daily, I conserve our precious resources, where, I agree with you, it takes
zero intelligence to just throw money at a problem such as how to organize
dual monitors.
But I'd rather solve the problem using intelligence.
Philosophically, I've solved the search problem using intelligence (where,
I posit that if you have to search for anything on your own computer, then
you already lost the battle).
For me, I made the "taskbar" the single point for "action" on the computer
monitor, where that taskbar contains EVERYTHING anyone would need.
o It contains the Microsoft "Start" stuff
o It contains pinned folders (which then contain the key folders)
o It contains pinned shortcuts
o It contains the cascaded WinXP menu (literally copied over from WinXP)
o It contains a pinned folder of "lesser used" links (aka "Favorites")
o It contains notifications (although I limit them to a minimum)
etc.
The one thing I haven't yet figured out how to do with the taskbar is how
to make it cascade to a menu system of just folders. Apparently the only
way to do that is to use the "actual" folders, which is ridiculous.
So that's the only thing missing in making the taskbar the *start* point
for *everything*.
And yet, with dual monitors, the one thing that changes the most, is the
taskbar!
> Since you spend money on numerous phones and other electronic devices to
> give away, getting the proper hardware to do what you are doing should
> be easy.
a year to friends and family (and they give me stuff too, e.g., I've almost
never had to pay for my iPads simply because I would never waste the money
on them unless I had to, so people give them to me, for free) - but "gifts"
are very different things, "joe".
Gifts are things you give willingly without concern for the cost.
You only are concerned with the joy that it brings the recipient.
Almost always, the recipient gives back a nugget of value, in some respect.
That's why I give so freely on Usenet, for example.
For the joy of giving (and getting back nuggets of wisdom, in return).
--
Hint: I'm a believer in Usenet being a "gift" of nuggest of knowledge!
R.Wieser
Nov 17, 2018, 1:20:32 PM11/17/18
to
Arlen,
>> While someone with one HUGE monitor may "claim" that it's the same thing
>> as
>> two smaller monitors, it's just not. And it's *instantly* different.
>>
>> Instantly, dual monitors require an organizational philosophy adjustment.
It sounds to me *you* are the one creating a problem, instead of solving
one.
To reflect your own words back to you: : If you do not feel the need to have
to go thru a "organizational philosophy adjustment" (whatever that actually
may mean, sounds like bullshit-bingo content to me) you simply connect a big
(as in: wide) screen. Problem solved.
>> Also, I'm not going to respond to the trolls (i.e., not to Bob S, Rudy
>> Wieser, and Char Jackson, who prove each time they post that all they
>> _can_ do, is troll - mainly because they also prove to be utterly
>> clueless in technical knowledge.
Good. That saves me the trouble of deciding if I would like to part with
what I found out about it when I, instead of the bog-standard and utterly
eazy (even on w98se) "stretch desktop to two monitors", tried to put a
different desktop on both of them.
The problem with that was not the software, as MSDN and google offered
enough info to build such a "second desktop" program, but that ...
Oh wait, you are not at all interrested in what I have to say. 'Scuse me.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
>> While someone with one HUGE monitor may "claim" that it's the same thing
>> as
>> two smaller monitors, it's just not. And it's *instantly* different.
>>
>> Instantly, dual monitors require an organizational philosophy adjustment.
one.
To reflect your own words back to you: : If you do not feel the need to have
to go thru a "organizational philosophy adjustment" (whatever that actually
may mean, sounds like bullshit-bingo content to me) you simply connect a big
(as in: wide) screen. Problem solved.
>> Also, I'm not going to respond to the trolls (i.e., not to Bob S, Rudy
>> Wieser, and Char Jackson, who prove each time they post that all they
>> _can_ do, is troll - mainly because they also prove to be utterly
Good. That saves me the trouble of deciding if I would like to part with
what I found out about it when I, instead of the bog-standard and utterly
eazy (even on w98se) "stretch desktop to two monitors", tried to put a
different desktop on both of them.
The problem with that was not the software, as MSDN and google offered
enough info to build such a "second desktop" program, but that ...
Oh wait, you are not at all interrested in what I have to say. 'Scuse me.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 2:19:22 PM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 19:20:24 +0100, R.Wieser wrote:
> Good. That saves me the trouble of deciding if I would like to part with
> what I found out about it
Hi Rudy,
> Good. That saves me the trouble of deciding if I would like to part with
> what I found out about it
Thank you for proposing that you have vast imaginary knowledge.
(but that you won't tell us what it is).
Hehhehheh ... sure Rudy ... sure.... we believe you. Sure.
(I'll bet you're great at playing hide and seek too!)
I only speak facts, where all my facts are cold hard referenced facts.
You generally speak from a vast reservoir of an imaginary belief system.
You and I go way back, where, as you know, and as the other trolls know, I
am merely a "mirror" to you (and to all similar trolls).
o When you act like an adult, I treat you like an adult
o When you act like a child, I treat you like a child
Sometimes, rarely, but sometimes, you _do_ act like an adult.
And you know the fact is clear, that I then _treat_ you like an adult.
The way I show you act like a child is simply to point out EXACTLY what you
write yourself. I don't prove you act like a child, Rudy... you prove it.
One of the most basic ways of acting like a child, Rudy, which is very
common on the net (e.g., Diesel, Nil, Snit, Bob S, etc.) and, which you
_know_ to be a fact (e.g., Bob S did it in this very thread) is...
o A child _claims_ to have imaginary knowledge,
o But that imaginary knowledge _never_ seems to every exist.
The beauty, of course, of imaginary knowledge is that it contains only
"pros" and zero "cons". Frank Slootweg has _tons_ of that imaginary
knowledge, for example, where he can't _prove_ a single word of it:
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/QJlPRhqHeNQ>
To which I had to push and prod him to even respond, given that he claimed
we "ignored" his imaginary knowledge until then.
What I notice about people with wholly imaginary knowledge, which you have
plenty of Rudy, much to your credit, is that, like Diesel did in the
freeware thread,
o You want us to _beg_ for that imaginary knowledge, and, even then,
o You want us to apologize for treating you like a child, and, even then,
o You won't tell us because you want to "make us work" for it.
Don't believe me on this trait of those with wholly imaginary solutions?
Look here in the ringtone thread, which is filled to the brim with your
imaginary knowledge...
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.comp.freeware/TTcHK_FOZpg/GtE8dYWLBAAJ>
--
Many on Usenet have more imaginary knowledge than do actual children!
Frank Slootweg
Nov 17, 2018, 2:32:56 PM11/17/18
to
R.Wieser <add...@not.available> wrote:
> Frank,
>
> > 'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE
>
> Yes, even back in OE5 you could switch between a sorted on
> date/name/subject/etc list and a thread tree.
>
> But that always needs to be done by toolbar -> "view" -> "currrent view" ->
> "group messages by conversation" (I've never seen (an addition for) a simple
> (switch between list and tree) button for it). It also drops any message
> focus it might have had, leaving it upto the user to find it back again.
> Which is no fun in a long thread that has several/many subthreads.
Just F[Y]I:
> Frank,
>
> > 'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE
>
> Yes, even back in OE5 you could switch between a sorted on
> date/name/subject/etc list and a thread tree.
>
> But that always needs to be done by toolbar -> "view" -> "currrent view" ->
> "group messages by conversation" (I've never seen (an addition for) a simple
> (switch between list and tree) button for it). It also drops any message
> focus it might have had, leaving it upto the user to find it back again.
> Which is no fun in a long thread that has several/many subthreads.
Thunderbird has keyboard shortcuts to Expand and Collaps threads
If you use the Message Pane to read articles, you don't lose focus.
But if you read articles in a seperate window (instead of in the Message
Pane), the focus in the 'thread pane' (upper-right pane) indeed does not
follow the progression in the seperate message window.
> ... Which is also the reason why I seldom switch from one to the other.
>
> Its often easier to switch to "sort by subject" (from the defailt "sort by
> date") and than looking up a bit.
> Also, your "go to parent" probably breaks when you have certain posters
> blocked - and which probably is why John didn't see the parent message in
> the first place.
this particular case, because John did post a response to the 'unknown'
poster ('Arlen'), but in general, it might be a concern.
I have no experience with blocking/unblocking in TB and I didn't see a
way while quickly browsing the menus.
FWIW, in my CUI newsreader 'tin', 'go to parent' overrides any
'killing', so the newsreader will show the article, even if it was
'killed' earlier.
Frank Slootweg
Nov 17, 2018, 3:03:20 PM11/17/18
to
arlen michael holder <arlen_mich...@example.com> wrote:
[...]
hours ago!?
If before, your post doesn't make any sense. If after, you're even a
bigger creep than 'normal'.
In any case, that's what you get for insulting people for no reason
whatsoever, they ignore you, partly or completely. Live with it or
change your ways.
FWIW, I'm still up for constructive participation in said thread, if
you manage to act like an adult.
As always, the ball is in your court.
P.S.
> given that he claimed
> we "ignored" his imaginary knowledge until then.
As usual, you're confusing different topics. That I made you work to
re-read inforation I had posted before has nothing to do with said
thread. Two completely different topics, not even remotely related.
[...]
[...]
> The beauty, of course, of imaginary knowledge is that it contains only
> "pros" and zero "cons". Frank Slootweg has _tons_ of that imaginary
> knowledge, for example, where he can't _prove_ a single word of it:
> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/QJlPRhqHeNQ>
> To which I had to push and prod him to even respond, given that he claimed
> we "ignored" his imaginary knowledge until then.
Did you post this before or after I responded in said thread, some 4
> "pros" and zero "cons". Frank Slootweg has _tons_ of that imaginary
> knowledge, for example, where he can't _prove_ a single word of it:
> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/QJlPRhqHeNQ>
> To which I had to push and prod him to even respond, given that he claimed
> we "ignored" his imaginary knowledge until then.
hours ago!?
If before, your post doesn't make any sense. If after, you're even a
bigger creep than 'normal'.
In any case, that's what you get for insulting people for no reason
whatsoever, they ignore you, partly or completely. Live with it or
change your ways.
FWIW, I'm still up for constructive participation in said thread, if
you manage to act like an adult.
As always, the ball is in your court.
P.S.
> given that he claimed
> we "ignored" his imaginary knowledge until then.
re-read inforation I had posted before has nothing to do with said
thread. Two completely different topics, not even remotely related.
[...]
R.Wieser
Nov 17, 2018, 3:42:56 PM11/17/18
to
Frank,
> Just F[Y]I:
>
> Thunderbird has [snip]
You mentioned OE, and that is what I respond(ed) to.
> because John did post a response to the 'unknown'
> poster ('Arlen'), but in general, it might be a concern.
Actually ? No.
He responded to Bob_S, as can make out from the part where John specifically
referred to him not having quoted who he responded to - which would have
been Arlen.
> I have no experience with blocking/unblocking in TB and I didn't
> see a way while quickly browsing the menus.
I'm using OE6 (hence my knowledge about it), and even I only recently came
to know how to do it (though it was simple in retrospect - you just have to
make a rule first).
> FWIW, in my CUI newsreader 'tin', 'go to parent' overrides
> any 'killing', so the newsreader will show the article, even if it
> was 'killed' earlier.
FWI, if you block a sender in OE his posts will not even be stored in the
message database. No overriding possible. It even asks if you want to
delete all the senders past messages too. And yes, I do like the "hide
messages of blocked posters" better - for the reason of being able to keep
track of a full thread tree and/or being able to (temporarily) unblock a
person and thereby being able to read his past messages.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
> Just F[Y]I:
>
> Thunderbird has [snip]
You mentioned OE, and that is what I respond(ed) to.
> because John did post a response to the 'unknown'
> poster ('Arlen'), but in general, it might be a concern.
He responded to Bob_S, as can make out from the part where John specifically
referred to him not having quoted who he responded to - which would have
been Arlen.
> I have no experience with blocking/unblocking in TB and I didn't
> see a way while quickly browsing the menus.
to know how to do it (though it was simple in retrospect - you just have to
make a rule first).
> FWIW, in my CUI newsreader 'tin', 'go to parent' overrides
> any 'killing', so the newsreader will show the article, even if it
> was 'killed' earlier.
message database. No overriding possible. It even asks if you want to
delete all the senders past messages too. And yes, I do like the "hide
messages of blocked posters" better - for the reason of being able to keep
track of a full thread tree and/or being able to (temporarily) unblock a
person and thereby being able to read his past messages.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 4:05:12 PM11/17/18
to
On 17 Nov 2018 20:03:16 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> FWIW, I'm still up for constructive participation in said thread, if
> you manage to act like an adult.
Hi Frank,
> FWIW, I'm still up for constructive participation in said thread, if
> you manage to act like an adult.
I am a mirror.
I am all about "real" solutions.
Too many people post wholly imaginary solutions on Usenet.
I don't use a Usenet reader (I use "vi" to read Usenet) so your link
doesn't work, but I'll install a Usenet reader and try to read it.
At this point, I haven't read it yet, but when I do, I'll respond in that
thread.
Thanks.
Remember always...
o When a Usenet poster acts like an adult, I treat him as an adult
o When a Usenet poster acts like a child, I treat him as a child
It's a very simple formula.
o I never need to prove they act like a child.
o I just point out when they do since _they_ prove they act like children.
Witness the very first post in this thread from Bob S. for an example.
--
Too many Usenet posters live in a world of imaginary solutions; mine are
all real, and they're well documented, unlike the imaginary solutions,
which only have pros, and no cons, because, well, because they only exist
in make believe.
Frank Slootweg
Nov 17, 2018, 4:29:15 PM11/17/18
to
R.Wieser <add...@not.available> wrote:
> Frank,
>
> > Just F[Y]I:
> >
> > Thunderbird has [snip]
>
> You mentioned OE, and that is what I respond(ed) to.
Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have TB, I
> Frank,
>
> > Just F[Y]I:
> >
> > Thunderbird has [snip]
>
> You mentioned OE, and that is what I respond(ed) to.
posted some information about it (TB).
And note the, perhaps too subtle, 'F[Y]I'. I.e. it's not directed
towards (only) you.
> > because John did post a response to the 'unknown'
> > poster ('Arlen'), but in general, it might be a concern.
>
> Actually ? No.
>
> He responded to Bob_S, as can make out from the part where John specifically
> referred to him not having quoted who he responded to - which would have
> been Arlen.
to 'Arlen'. Directly to his OP actually.
Trust me! My newsreader *does* show threads and *does* show parents! :-)
> > I have no experience with blocking/unblocking in TB and I didn't
> > see a way while quickly browsing the menus.
>
> I'm using OE6 (hence my knowledge about it), and even I only recently came
> to know how to do it (though it was simple in retrospect - you just have to
> make a rule first).
OE1, but never used OE/WM/WLM/TB for news, because I have a (for me)
better newsreader.
> > FWIW, in my CUI newsreader 'tin', 'go to parent' overrides
> > any 'killing', so the newsreader will show the article, even if it
> > was 'killed' earlier.
>
> FWI, if you block a sender in OE his posts will not even be stored in the
> message database. No overriding possible. It even asks if you want to
> delete all the senders past messages too. And yes, I do like the "hide
> messages of blocked posters" better - for the reason of being able to keep
> track of a full thread tree and/or being able to (temporarily) unblock a
> person and thereby being able to read his past messages.
Frank Slootweg
Nov 17, 2018, 4:45:28 PM11/17/18
to
arlen michael holder <arlen_mich...@example.com> wrote:
> On 17 Nov 2018 20:03:16 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>
> > FWIW, I'm still up for constructive participation in said thread, if
> > you manage to act like an adult.
>
> Hi Frank,
> I am a mirror.
Nope, you aren't! You're a dishonest, obnoxious, pompous creep.
>
> > FWIW, I'm still up for constructive participation in said thread, if
> > you manage to act like an adult.
>
> Hi Frank,
> I am a mirror.
I've said it before and I'll say it again: *Nobody* is buying your
'justification' for your MO, such as the crap below, which I'm about to
snip.
You've repeatedly been asked to come up with at least *one* poster who
*does* buy your justification. You never delivered. Why is that!?
So cut the crap, refrain from posting your crap justifications and
don't just *say* you act like an adult, but actually *do* act like one.
You've got only *one* chance. Don't blow it.
[Crap deleted.]
arlen michael holder
Nov 17, 2018, 10:41:49 PM11/17/18
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2018 10:53:03 -0500, Paul wrote:
> When a message hasn't yet shown up on a server
> for some reason, Howard is my backup system.
Howard Knight is good.
> When a message hasn't yet shown up on a server
> for some reason, Howard is my backup system.
Google is always fast nowadays (it used to not be that way in the past).
But Google is only good for the newsgroups they archive, e.g.,
http://tinyurl.com/windowsxp-general
The "Narkive" is slow, where it takes a day or two to show up:
http://alt.windows7.general.narkive.com
http://microsoft.public.windowsxp.general.narkive.com
The PC Banter site is even worse than that...
http://tinyurl.com/alt-windows7-general
R.Wieser
Nov 18, 2018, 4:09:10 AM11/18/18
to
Frank,
> Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have
> TB, I posted some information about it (TB).
Yes, and that's exactly the problem.
[quote]
You posted something about TB, *but made it look like it was also applicable
to other newsgroup readers*. Which, reading your current reply, you should
never have done. But I'm stil assuming it was a honest, though maybe a bit
wishfull, mistake.
> Actually? Yes! :-) John posted *several* responses, one was directly
> to 'Arlen'. Directly to his OP actually.
And that has to do with Johns post to Bob_S ... what exactly ?
> Trust me! My newsreader *does* show threads and *does* show parents! :-)
Yes, you already said that in your previous post to me - where I replied
that I like your readers behaviour better (for multiple reasons).
>> FWI, if you block a sender in OE [snip]
>
> Thanks for the info.
You're welcome.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
> Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have
> TB, I posted some information about it (TB).
[quote]
'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE/WM/WLM/TB, etc. can do that by just
'opening' the thread in the threads pane and see in which branch/subthread
the current post is and look 'up' the thread to see the parent.
[/quote]
'opening' the thread in the threads pane and see in which branch/subthread
the current post is and look 'up' the thread to see the parent.
You posted something about TB, *but made it look like it was also applicable
to other newsgroup readers*. Which, reading your current reply, you should
never have done. But I'm stil assuming it was a honest, though maybe a bit
wishfull, mistake.
> Actually? Yes! :-) John posted *several* responses, one was directly
> to 'Arlen'. Directly to his OP actually.
> Trust me! My newsreader *does* show threads and *does* show parents! :-)
that I like your readers behaviour better (for multiple reasons).
>> FWI, if you block a sender in OE [snip]
>
> Thanks for the info.
You're welcome.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
mechanic
Nov 18, 2018, 6:11:08 AM11/18/18
to
On 17 Nov 2018 19:32:52 GMT, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> FWIW, in my CUI newsreader 'tin',
tin on Cygwin on Windows - respect!
> FWIW, in my CUI newsreader 'tin',
J. P. Gilliver (John)
Nov 18, 2018, 7:46:28 AM11/18/18
to
In message <psra7i$17ju$1...@gioia.aioe.org>, R.Wieser
certainly; I _think_ OE too.) It's certainly not _exclusive_ to TB.
(Which you maybe didn't intend to imply anyway, but what you put could
be interpreted that way.)
[rest snipped]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
Veni, Vidi, Vomit (I came, I saw, I was ill) - m...@saslimited.demon.co.uk, 1998
<add...@not.available> writes:
>Frank,
>
>> Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have
>> TB, I posted some information about it (TB).
>
>Yes, and that's exactly the problem.
>
>[quote]
>'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE/WM/WLM/TB, etc. can do that by just
>'opening' the thread in the threads pane and see in which branch/subthread
>the current post is and look 'up' the thread to see the parent.
>[/quote]
>
>You posted something about TB, *but made it look like it was also applicable
>to other newsgroup readers*.
It _is_ applicable to _some_ other newsgroup readers. (Turnpike,
>Frank,
>
>> Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have
>> TB, I posted some information about it (TB).
>
>Yes, and that's exactly the problem.
>
>[quote]
>'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE/WM/WLM/TB, etc. can do that by just
>'opening' the thread in the threads pane and see in which branch/subthread
>the current post is and look 'up' the thread to see the parent.
>[/quote]
>
>You posted something about TB, *but made it look like it was also applicable
>to other newsgroup readers*.
certainly; I _think_ OE too.) It's certainly not _exclusive_ to TB.
(Which you maybe didn't intend to imply anyway, but what you put could
be interpreted that way.)
[rest snipped]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf
Veni, Vidi, Vomit (I came, I saw, I was ill) - m...@saslimited.demon.co.uk, 1998
Frank Slootweg
Nov 18, 2018, 10:18:16 AM11/18/18
to
R.Wieser <add...@not.available> wrote:
> Frank,
>
> > Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have
> > TB, I posted some information about it (TB).
>
> Yes, and that's exactly the problem.
I disagree. Read on.
> Frank,
>
> > Yes, I know, but I also mentioned WM/WLM/TB and since I have
> > TB, I posted some information about it (TB).
>
> Yes, and that's exactly the problem.
> [quote]
> 'Even' simple GUI newsreaders like OE/WM/WLM/TB, etc. can do that by just
> 'opening' the thread in the threads pane and see in which branch/subthread
> the current post is and look 'up' the thread to see the parent.
> [/quote]
>
> You posted something about TB, *but made it look like it was also applicable
> to other newsgroup readers*. Which, reading your current reply, you should
> never have done. But I'm stil assuming it was a honest, though maybe a bit
> wishfull, mistake.
comment, even not after I elaborated on it, is not my problem and I
don't appreciate your insinuations.
That part - the part you quoted - *is* correct and applicable to not
only TB, but to - as I said - applicable to all of OE/WM/WLM/TB. Over
time, I've used OE, WM, WLM and now TB and I know what they can and can
not do.
If you think some of that part is not applicable to OE (or WM/WLM/TB),
then say what you think is not appliable and why.
> > Actually? Yes! :-) John posted *several* responses, one was directly
> > to 'Arlen'. Directly to his OP actually.
>
> And that has to do with Johns post to Bob_S ... what exactly ?
be bothered to reconstruct it after the fact to show that my response
does make sense.
If you want to review it: You implied that John might have Arlen
blocked, causing John not to see Arlen's post to which Bob_S responded
without quoting. But that's unlikely because - as I said - John posted
*another* response directly to 'Arlen', i.e. he apparently had *not*
blocked 'Arlen'.
[...]
AFAIC, these issues are closed. AFAICT, they are misunderstandings
which are the result of too much snipping and misreading context.
Better nluck next time.
R.Wieser
Nov 18, 2018, 10:25:21 AM11/18/18
to
John,
> It _is_ applicable to _some_ other newsgroup readers.
Sigh .... I didn't even contradict that. What I *did* take offence to is
pauls naming of a specific set of readers (and indicating that there where
more alike), and try to make it sound as if switching to the thread-view
tree would be something easy and/or handy for *all* of them.
Yes, its possible using OE. No, you do *not* want to "just" do that to find
a parent post. Too cumbersome. And that I mentioned.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
> It _is_ applicable to _some_ other newsgroup readers.
pauls naming of a specific set of readers (and indicating that there where
more alike), and try to make it sound as if switching to the thread-view
tree would be something easy and/or handy for *all* of them.
Yes, its possible using OE. No, you do *not* want to "just" do that to find
a parent post. Too cumbersome. And that I mentioned.
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Frank Slootweg
Nov 18, 2018, 10:27:40 AM11/18/18
to
UNIX (HP-UX) for many years. After my retirement, I kept using it, now
on Windows. First 'building' (make-ing, compiling, linking,etc.) from
source and later using the Cygwin package. I never looked back! :-)
R.Wieser
Nov 18, 2018, 11:04:56 AM11/18/18
to
Frank,
> Easy does it! No offense, but that you can't parse my "Just F[Y]I:"
> comment, even not after I elaborated on it, is not my problem and I
> don't appreciate your insinuations.
Fuck you.
Your FYI was all about Thunderbird, AGAIN ignoring that you named *by name*
several other readers, including OE. Which I responded about and you have
been forcefully ignoring that response for the last few messages now.
I do not use Thunderbird, and your FYI about it is therefore of absolutily
zero value to me. And yes, that means I didn't even bother to read it.
Furthermore, I did not challenge your knowledge about TB, and as such have
absolutily zero idea why you think you need to drag it in every time.
*Especially not* as a response to me responding to your OE reference. Your
insistance of doing so is nothing more than obnoxious.
You might have made a honest mistake, but as far as I can see it you're
trying your damn best to cover it up by rambling on about something,
anything else. Which is a rather childish behaviour.
Is that non-insinuating enough for you ?
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
> Easy does it! No offense, but that you can't parse my "Just F[Y]I:"
> comment, even not after I elaborated on it, is not my problem and I
> don't appreciate your insinuations.
Your FYI was all about Thunderbird, AGAIN ignoring that you named *by name*
several other readers, including OE. Which I responded about and you have
been forcefully ignoring that response for the last few messages now.
I do not use Thunderbird, and your FYI about it is therefore of absolutily
zero value to me. And yes, that means I didn't even bother to read it.
Furthermore, I did not challenge your knowledge about TB, and as such have
absolutily zero idea why you think you need to drag it in every time.
*Especially not* as a response to me responding to your OE reference. Your
insistance of doing so is nothing more than obnoxious.
You might have made a honest mistake, but as far as I can see it you're
trying your damn best to cover it up by rambling on about something,
anything else. Which is a rather childish behaviour.
Is that non-insinuating enough for you ?
Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Frank Slootweg
Nov 18, 2018, 11:56:38 AM11/18/18
to
R.Wieser <add...@not.available> wrote:
> Frank,
>
> > Easy does it! No offense, but that you can't parse my "Just F[Y]I:"
> > comment, even not after I elaborated on it, is not my problem and I
> > don't appreciate your insinuations.
>
> Fuck you.
Sigh! You STILL don't get it, do you!?
> Frank,
>
> > Easy does it! No offense, but that you can't parse my "Just F[Y]I:"
> > comment, even not after I elaborated on it, is not my problem and I
> > don't appreciate your insinuations.
>
> Fuck you.
> Your FYI was all about Thunderbird,
too subtle, 'F[Y]I'. I.e. it's not directed towards (only) you.".
Now READ that again and at least TRY to comprehend it. Pay special
attention to the brackets and those pesky words "not" and "only". When
you finally grasp what I *really* wrote, instead of what you *think* I
meant, apologize for your mistake and your uncalled for attacks and
insults.
[More of the same misinterpretations/misrepresentations deleted.]
Frank Slootweg
Nov 18, 2018, 12:08:06 PM11/18/18
to
R.Wieser <add...@not.available> wrote:
> John,
>
> > It _is_ applicable to _some_ other newsgroup readers.
>
> Sigh .... I didn't even contradict that. What I *did* take offence to is
> pauls naming of a specific set of readers (and indicating that there where
> more alike), and try to make it sound as if switching to the thread-view
> tree would be something easy and/or handy for *all* of them.
I see! You mix up posters, 'read' what was never written, don't read
> John,
>
> > It _is_ applicable to _some_ other newsgroup readers.
>
> Sigh .... I didn't even contradict that. What I *did* take offence to is
> pauls naming of a specific set of readers (and indicating that there where
> more alike), and try to make it sound as if switching to the thread-view
> tree would be something easy and/or handy for *all* of them.
what was written, misinterpret and misrepresent what was written and
that magically makes all of that your correspondent's fault, instead of
yours!? Makes perfect sense, NOT!
FYI, and yes *this* time its for *your* information and *only* for
your information, switching to the thread-view *is* easy for all of them
- just easIER for TB - and equally handy - or not handy - for all of
them.
> Yes, its possible using OE. No, you do *not* want to "just" do that to find
> a parent post. Too cumbersome. And that I mentioned.
That you find it too cumbersome if fine, but that does in no way
> Yes, its possible using OE. No, you do *not* want to "just" do that to find
> a parent post. Too cumbersome. And that I mentioned.
justify your way over the top attacks.
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