DMX DIN mounted 230V LED dimming

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Michael

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Oct 11, 2015, 5:15:40 AM10/11/15
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Hello,

I'm still debating with my self about getting the DMX extension, or just using other dimming solutions.
I have been searching for a DIN mounted 230V LED dimmer, as an alternative to the Loxone dimmer.
For some uses it would be nice just to mount the 230V dimmer in the DIN enclosure, like the Loxone dimmer. I have been searching for a DMX alternative, but haven't found anything that seemed like a good buy.

So if you can recommend something, I would be grateful.

Sincerely
Michael

Duncan

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Oct 11, 2015, 2:49:16 PM10/11/15
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there is a nice 3 channel din mount dmx 230v dimmer for around $40-45
it is rated for 1A, which is around 200-230w, and is trailing edge so plays nicely with led bulbs

http://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-dmx-dimmer-triac.html?spm=2114.01020208.0.333.4fWVIH&initiative_id=SB_20151011104730&site=glo&groupsort=1&SortType=price_asc&shipCountry=uk&SearchText=dmx+dimmer+triac

http://www.starwell.cc/index.asp is the manufacturer.

ive installed about 12 since i cant get njd 12 channel dmx dimmers any more

Michael

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Oct 11, 2015, 3:35:23 PM10/11/15
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Hi Duncan,

That's not bad at all, it was exactly something like this I was looking for.
It says static power is lower than 3W, US that idling power?
Have you tried putting a power meter on it with all lamps of? 3W seems a bit high for standby power, I would have thought it would be below 1W. Power is expansive in Denmark (about 0.33 USD/kWh)

Sincerely
Michael

Duncan

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Oct 14, 2015, 2:08:03 PM10/14/15
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it says less than 3w, but i havnt measured it, sorry
duncan

Duncan

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Oct 16, 2015, 7:07:49 AM10/16/15
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2.6w measured yesterday

TomM

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Oct 16, 2015, 7:59:17 AM10/16/15
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Michael,

If you're still wondering whether to buy the DMX extension or not - just do it.  I can confirm the reliability and flexibility of DMX makes it a really robust solution and the cost of dimmers is pretty low.  Don't forget you can also use dimmers and relays to control things like extractor fans, heating valves, electric underfloor heating, electronic locks - we even have mirror demisting pads connected to DMX so the mirror isn't all misty when we get out of the shower!

Loxone + DMX + 1-wire is pretty much all you need to get 90% of your house automated. the rest is probably just IP gateways.

On Friday, October 16, 2015 at 12:07:49 PM UTC+1, Duncan wrote:
2.6w measured yesterday

Michael

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Oct 18, 2015, 9:27:07 AM10/18/15
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Hi Duncan,

Thanks for measuring it!
I have a follow up question, if you power cycle the dimmer, will it remember it's settings?
Like the DMX channel it is set to reading?

If they work fine with being powered totally down and up, this might be a scheme to save some of those expensive kWh :)
I could eg. use the 3ch dimming for outdoor lighting, and then just switch the dimming module off when all of the outdoor light is off anyways.

Sincerely
Michael

Duncan

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Oct 18, 2015, 3:51:51 PM10/18/15
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yes it keeps its settings with the power off - it only has the dmx channel to set.

Adrian

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Oct 18, 2015, 3:58:45 PM10/18/15
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@Duncan

Are there any disadvantages to this 3 channel DMX module in comparison of the Loxone Dimmer module?

The cost difference is huge when dimming a lot of lights. I'm only afraid of the lifetime of the chinese module in comparison of the loxone module. 

 What do you think about reliability? How long are you using it?

Duncan

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Oct 19, 2015, 7:58:47 AM10/19/15
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i cant vouch for how long they will last, but ive just bought a few spares just in case as they are so cheap

the only real disadvantage is they arent via a retail chain from Europe so little comeback if they dont work, but ive had no failures from around 15 so far after about 6 months, and they have managed to dim down even a single gu10 led without problems.

duncan

Andrew B

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Nov 12, 2015, 10:59:32 AM11/12/15
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I have embarked on a 24vdc LED lighting solution that uses DMX.  I have 2 x 32 channel DMX boards and a 1500W power supply that will drive all lighting in the house.  The 24v LED bulbs are a bit harder to find, but they exist (for marine and RV applications, mostly) and should be more robust than high voltage AC units since the on-board circuitry has to do a lot less and generates far less heat doing it.

Duncan

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Nov 13, 2015, 11:16:41 AM11/13/15
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this is the typical problem though - you have saved money on loxone dimmers but in exchange have to source difficult to find and expensive 24v lights, high power 24v supplies etc - how many current 24v light models are available that can deliver the range of angles, brightness, white cct and cri that you can get from 240v dimmable bulbs?

i picked up some branded gu10 bulbs this week with smooth dimming, 25deg, 40deg cct of 2700k, 3000k or 4000k with cri >90 for £9 each to try, along with some others at cri95 - the rate of change in this particular area of retrofit leds is spectacular. If you buy expensive specialist bulbs or integrated downlighters, its very expensive to upgrade whilst the technology continues to advance so quickly and you are stuck with an inventory of adequate but not ideal lighting as things move ahead around you.

Andrew Brownsword

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Nov 13, 2015, 11:40:43 AM11/13/15
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Yeah, finding them took work... but thanks to the Internet it is doable.  I kept my search requirements as simple as possible and now I have the three types I decided I needed (downlights, A19 E26 bulbs, and MR16s), at competitive prices.  And a single power supply that handles the whole house, and is cheap enough that having a spare on hand is easily feasible.  I'm not suggesting this is for everyone, but it is possible and has some advantages.  The rated lifetimes of these luminaries means they ought to last a very long time indeed.  The CRIs of the most important ones are >92.

Cheers,
   Andrew
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Torsten

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Nov 13, 2015, 11:49:14 AM11/13/15
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Hi Duncan,

very interesting posts, thanks for that.  As a test for my home automation (Loxone), I've bought the DMX triac dimmer you mentioned.  It works perfect for dimming a normal light bulbs.  However, when I tried to dim the following cheap led (12W), it didn't dim as desired.  Flickering and no dimming below 50%.


What could be the reason?  Just because I tried to dim only one 12W led, or are these leds not compatible with this DMX triac dimmer?  What (cheap) led spots do you typically use?

Thanks a lot!

Radek Dohnal

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Nov 14, 2015, 1:48:12 AM11/14/15
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Andrew, please can you send us a link, where (or what type) of PS and led lights you bought?
Im planning to do similar solution like you,but I find only 500W PS.

Duncan

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Nov 14, 2015, 5:29:36 AM11/14/15
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Finding dimmable LEDs that work nicely can be a nightmare. I've certainly bought lots of samples that have ended up in the bin. It's one of the reasons that I've chosen to use gu10 bulbs and standard fittings - you can keep your fittings and just change bulbs as the technology improves and if you are buying from aliexpress you are bringing in light weight bulbs not heavy fittings.
The Dmx triac dimmer seems to work nicely with most gu10 240v bulbs that I have, but after a lot of trial and error I'm sticking to a single aliexpress make/supplier and a couple of uk sourced makes that I know work with both the triac dimmer and the njd 12 channel dimmer pack (which is leading edge but seems to work well with these bulbs anyway)

Andrew Brownsword

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Nov 14, 2015, 10:30:51 AM11/14/15
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I was recommended to use a MeanWell power supply, and I selected the SPV-1500-24 for my application. The larger devices have a constant fan, so plan for a space where that won't be an issue.

For lights I'm primarily using downlights from Lauren Illumination (24v, ~92 CRI) and corn bulbs from 12vMonster (12-24v or 24-36v, the LumenCache certified ones seem to perform well). The MR16s I'm not entirely happy with so far -- working through some buzzing sound issues by employing capacitors -- so I wouldn't suggest my source until I've resolved that. Also, I only have a couple of months on my test units, so it's not a very long term test.

There were a couple of other types of bulbs I tried that didn't perform very well -- uneven dimming ramps, buzzing, and even cross channel effects in one case (although I suspect the latter was a ground loop type issue I have since fixed). I also haven't yet installed the whole house, so haven't verified that problems won't show up when doing that. I'm optimistic though that the issues that do, if any will be resolvable.

Cheers,
Andrew



> On Nov 13, 2015, at 10:48 PM, Radek Dohnal <dohna...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Andrew, please can you send us a link, where (or what type) of PS and led lights you bought?
> Im planning to do similar solution like you,but I find only 500W PS.
>
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Torsten

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Nov 14, 2015, 12:39:34 PM11/14/15
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Great info.  Could you tell me who your single aliexpress make/supplier is?  Looking forward to give it a try with these lights...

Tx

Duncan

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Nov 14, 2015, 4:21:44 PM11/14/15
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blaze lighting - http://www.aliexpress.com/store/905586

dimmable 7w gu10 in 3000k which are excellent for kitchens and utilities , and if you ask nicely they will make you some 2700k which i prefer for dining, corridors, bedrooms etc
http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Top-Selling-SAA-CE-Dimmable-GU10-led-7W-COB-LED-Spotlight-bulbs-Replace-70W-halogen-lamp/905586_32330786826.html
the ones with the smooth alu shell and diffuser are the best, their others not so good - i tried the driverless samsung chipset ones and was disappointed.

they are incredibly bright, nice white colours and dim well. they do 60deg, 38deg and i think 25 degree if you ask

they also do an 8w 10deg which i havnt tried yet

Simon Still

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Nov 23, 2015, 5:56:18 AM11/23/15
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Is there really any good reason to mess around with unknown Chinese LED bulbs?  There are a lot of them that are just plain dangerous - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08W2VIwBkhI - is the first that comes up but I've seen lots of others.  Even a lot of the stuff that's being imported sale in UK shops is distinctly iffy - http://luxreview.com/article/2015/02/cheap-leds-buyer-beware 

The cost of *known* quality, safe, bulbs that actually have a warranty that's worth something is higher than the chinese rubbish but given the life of the bulbs (that reputable bulbs might actually achieve) the upfront costs really are not that bad, especially if you're buying a load of binnable bulbs to find the ones that are any good (and you have to at least budget for import duty and VAT on your Chinese imports). 

TomM

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Nov 24, 2015, 5:22:42 PM11/24/15
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Its a fair point.  I happily buy a lot of niche electronics which ultimately come directly from China and I have to say i'm generally OK with the quality and construction techniques.  I think i've said in other posts before, if you buy any gadget from China or anywhere else that is a non-household name brand then I would recommend you have a good poke around in it before using it in a production environment.  In my experience with the 130 LED GU10s in my house which were about £3 each (i.e. cheap) only 1 has blown and that happened almost immediately so clearly some issue there from the start.  The rest have performed faultlessly, my only issue is the dimming curves of them, but I think that's where the compromise is made.

Ultimately, my cheap chinese GU10s are infinitely safer than the bodged 12v downlighters that the previous owner of this house installed (and the rest of his bodging shite).

Duncan

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Nov 27, 2015, 12:38:28 PM11/27/15
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it comes down to individual choice and some product research - does a costo chinese (Feit) dimmable gu 10 currently at £3 each qualify as cheap chinese junk?

its cheap, made in china, and mostly unheard of, but actually its an excellent retrofit size, 400 lumens, 36 degree, dims nicely, has a good 2.7k colour and is far brighter and a good match light-wise to a 50w gu10
i installed about 50 of these in a domestic property with wall mounted leading edge dimmers as an energy saving project and have to say they are very impressive for the money

i could have bought a philips light with a very similar spec, similar brightness, equally acceptable light quality etc but at £9 each

the philips claim a cri of 90, but i dont think there is a significant enough difference to justify the 3x price particularly in corridors in bedrooms - in those areas requiring task lighting such as kitchens, study etc, i will specify a cri 95 9w 500lumen 3000k chinese gu10 that i have sampled, which is extremely impressive, and a lot better value than a SORAA £30 gu10

Simon Still

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Nov 28, 2015, 12:07:32 PM11/28/15
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Sure - I've just a become  bit more cautious about eBay/Alibaba direct imports for lighting.  Some of it's good but some of it is dangerous junk and for the limited number I'm buying it's not worth the time and money to find the good stuff.  If it's being sold in a shop in the UK it's likely to be fine safety wise but quality still varies.     

Simon Still

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Dec 6, 2015, 2:01:16 PM12/6/15
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Duncan

Catching up on these DMX dimmers - do you now have them in regular use?  I've just installed my first of a few.  

The first channel is running 3x 5W Sylvania LED bulbs.  They didn't like being faded (behaved strangely on start up and shut down) but now have it set to step change the dimming and at 65% and 100% they're running fine.

The second channel is dimming an uplighter with a 130W halogen bulb in it - that seems to have a very noticable flicker which is rather annoying.  Is this faulty, the nature of the dimmer or something that a Loxone setting can address?

Simon

Bartel Eerdekens

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May 10, 2017, 4:05:29 AM5/10/17
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Hi Simon,


After a few years, what is your experience now with these? Did one break? Were they reliable?
Do you have them still in use?


Thanks!

Op zondag 6 december 2015 20:01:16 UTC+1 schreef Simon Still:

Duncan

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May 10, 2017, 7:22:18 AM5/10/17
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i have one project running a small number with no failures for around 6 months, and a larger project running 33 of these dimmer blocks for around 2 years - there have been about 10 failures early on, but none for the last year.

Andrew B

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May 10, 2017, 8:53:03 AM5/10/17
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I am using 3 of these units connected in parallel using their load sharing & redundancy features:  


That gives me maximum output of 1800W, which is 50% more than I need at peak (all lights on full).  They have variable speed fans and are silent in my attic until most of the house is very bright (which means I won't be asleep anyhow!).  I've measured and tested and sure enough, they share the load nicely... and when one drops out the other two continue handling the load.  I even had a wiring glitch at one point and one carried the house with most lights on, which must have exceeded its rated capacity for a few minutes.... worked without trouble although the fan was sounding like a jet engine.

Andrew B

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May 10, 2017, 8:54:10 AM5/10/17
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Oh, and one other note.... I put a bank of capacitors across the PSU to smooth out the weird power signal to a large number of PWM lights.  That helped a lot reduce vibration, buzzing and various other effects.

Robbie

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May 11, 2017, 11:36:48 AM5/11/17
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On Wednesday, May 10, 2017 at 9:05:29 AM UTC+1, Bartel Eerdekens wrote:
After a few years, what is your experience now with these? Did one break? Were they reliable?
Do you have them still in use?


Thanks!

Op zondag 6 december 2015 20:01:16 UTC+1 schreef Simon Still:
Duncan

Catching up on these DMX dimmers - do you now have them in regular use?  I've just installed my first of a few.  

The first channel is running 3x 5W Sylvania LED bulbs.  They didn't like being faded (behaved strangely on start up and shut down) but now have it set to step change the dimming and at 65% and 100% they're running fine.

The second channel is dimming an uplighter with a 130W halogen bulb in it - that seems to have a very noticable flicker which is rather annoying.  Is this faulty, the nature of the dimmer or something that a Loxone setting can address?

Simon

Bartel,

I'm also using the cheap Chinese 3 Channel din DMX dimmer modules that Duncan recommended.

I've had five operating since April 2015, mainly driving between two and seven LED GU10 lamps on each channel, and a few remaining tungsten lamps (front room chandelier & linear filament picture lamps).

The only issue I had was one channel dying when one of the six chandelier 28W lamps blew (but I am quite heavily loading that channel). Luckily I purchased ten in total, so I just swapped it out for another.

Regarding LED lamps flickering: Our electricians fitted "Save Light" dimmable 7W LED GU10 lamps, but these would only dim to around half brightness (44% on the Loxone app) then go out, with occasional flashes if the Loxone was set to anything from 10-43%. I tried many alternative GU10 lamps until I found these Philips 4W Dim Tone lamps that will smoothly dim down to 1% on the Loxone app, with no flicker at all. I can highly recommend them (& I give more detail in the review I left). I've also since found that the 4.5W versions also dim just as perfectly on these din DMX modules.

Skarsol

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May 11, 2017, 6:11:59 PM5/11/17
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Do be aware that these aren't Class 2 and so will face more stringent wiring requirements if you have to pass any sort of code inspection (if you're in the US).

Andrew B

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May 11, 2017, 8:05:49 PM5/11/17
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Yes, any PSU >100W is not Class 2 and therefore must (essentially) following mains wiring rules.  In my setup I am using AWG14 (or thicker), and am heavily fused.

Bartel Eerdekens

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May 12, 2017, 3:53:07 AM5/12/17
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Thx for the updates everyone! Definitely will order a few, knowing this now! (As those original Loxone dimmers are way too expensive!)

Op donderdag 11 mei 2017 17:36:48 UTC+2 schreef Robbie:

Duncan

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May 12, 2017, 7:37:13 AM5/12/17
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another dimmer option is to use the Theben 8 channel knx dimmer - it takes up the space of 2 of the chinese dimmers but has 8 channels instead of 6

it can dim 200w per channel of led lighting and has programmable curves including leading and trailing edge,and its really easy to link into your loxone project

but it costs around £50 per channel in europe - still expensive but 1/2 the cost of loxone dimmers and far more compact.

https://www.theben.de/en/Products/Home-and-Building-control/KNX/Actuators/DM-8-2-T-KNX

Simon Still

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May 16, 2017, 11:44:30 AM5/16/17
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On Wednesday, 10 May 2017 09:05:29 UTC+1, Bartel Eerdekens wrote:
After a few years, what is your experience now with these? Did one break? Were they reliable?
Do you have them still in use?

I only ended up fitting a single one which has been in daily use since November 15.  The halogen  uplighter which was flickering was changed for an uplighter with a single Sylvania GU10 bulb so the dimmer now runs 

c1- 3x 5w bulbs 
c2 - 1x 5w
c3 - 2 x 5w (set as a switch - on or off)>

On the single 5w bulb circuit, which i use dimmed, i get some flashing or changes in brightness.  I think it is that the load is too small.   
With the 3 bulb circuit this doesn’t happen

Yesterday I came home after a few days away and the dimmer seemed to have failed.  It still felt warm to the touch (so it was getting power and the circuits were doing something) but the display was blank.  

I replaced it with my spare today and found that the single bulb had failed.  Lacking any other dimmable GU10 Leds i've put a halogen GU10 in the fitting for now.  Which of course flickers (as did the old 130w halogen uplighter).

Regretting using even one of these.  They really seem pretty much useless - high failure rate.  Problematic with low (LED) loads.  Flicker with Halogen.

is there a straight replacement that's high quality?  anything other than the same DIN format would be a real pain now given where it's installed. 

Clegger

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May 17, 2017, 4:29:29 AM5/17/17
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Regretting using even one of these.  They really seem pretty much useless - high failure rate.  Problematic with low (LED) loads.  Flicker with Halogen.

is there a straight replacement that's high quality?  anything other than the same DIN format would be a real pain now given where it's installed. 

I'd like to know this too.    

We installed 10 of these dimmers about 18 months ago, mostly driving Photonstar LED downlights via decent quality drivers.  Of the 10, 3 failed within a year. Of those, 2 took their time going out - they had problems after we had a power cut, and would do things like randomly turn on and off at high speed.  In the end they all died.  Some of our proposed lighting circuits weren't in operation at the time, so I was able to re-jig things so we still had light.

I recently ordered another 5, and replaced the 3 that had failed.  Within 2 weeks, one of the replacements had failed :-/

I also find their low-power dimming a little unpredictable.  We seem to have random fluctuations in brightness at anything below about 50%, but only in some rooms.  I'm also disappointed at how bright the rooms are on minimum brightness, but that could well be a function of the drivers and LEDs used too.  

For me, these dimmers are a false economy.  If I were doing this again, I'd stump up the extra funds for a better solution. 

Clegger

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May 17, 2017, 5:00:34 AM5/17/17
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On Wednesday, May 17, 2017 at 9:29:29 AM UTC+1, Clegger wrote:
 
Regretting using even one of these.  They really seem pretty much useless - high failure rate.  Problematic with low (LED) loads.  Flicker with Halogen.

is there a straight replacement that's high quality?  anything other than the same DIN format would be a real pain now given where it's installed. 

I'd like to know this too.    


Having heard that the power supplies are the weak point with these, I was also considering how feasible it would be to bypass the power supplies and provide them with DC from an external supply.  Too much on at the moment to look further into this...

Simon Still

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May 17, 2017, 5:12:45 AM5/17/17
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On Wednesday, 17 May 2017 09:29:29 UTC+1, Clegger wrote: 
 mostly driving Photonstar LED downlights via decent quality drivers.  

Hmm.  This seems a really odd decision to have made - they're not cheap lights and you they supply drivers that are designed to dim. 
 
Of the 10, In the end they all died.  

 
I also find their low-power dimming a little unpredictable.  We seem to have random fluctuations in brightness at anything below about 50%, but only in some rooms.  I'm also disappointed at how bright the rooms are on minimum brightness, but that could well be a function of the drivers and LEDs used too.  

I'm using 1-10v analogue dimming from Loxone to dim all my Photonstar LED fittings.  It was a bit of a tight balance between the number of analogue outputs from Loxone and the number of circuits I wanted/needed in the house but it worked out.  The analogue dimmers needed to be set to stepped 10/20/30% brightness rather than 1-100 dimming and *mostly* dim down to 10% reliably - I rejected a few drivers that were unreliable below 20% and PhotonStar replaced those under warranty.  
 

For me, these dimmers are a false economy.  If I were doing this again, I'd stump up the extra funds for a better solution. 

Absolutely.  I've just ordered another spare but I'm now in a position where I've paid for 3 of them /£100/£30 a circuit after 18 months which is no longer low cost.   

Simon Still

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May 17, 2017, 5:33:35 AM5/17/17
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On Wednesday, 17 May 2017 10:00:34 UTC+1, Clegger wrote:
Having heard that the power supplies are the weak point with these, I was also considering how feasible it would be to bypass the power supplies and provide them with DC from an external supply.  Too much on at the moment to look further into this...

Where did you pick that up from? 
I'll open up my duff one and see what it looks like inside.  

I think they're actually just poor.  I can understand them being a bit flaky with LEDs but the fact that both of mine seem to put a noticable flicker into a halogen makes me thing they're just crap.

I don't understand Duncan's enthusiasm for them 

Duncan

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May 17, 2017, 2:56:04 PM5/17/17
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its not so much enthusiasm as pragmastic due to the lack of dmx alternative (at 240v anyway)

my lighting strategy was always to use gu10 fittings with retrofit dimmable bulbs to be able to take advantage of led improvements over time, without having to replace a load of inbuilt led/mains units, and to be able to change K, CRI and beam angle easily once the house had been lived in for a while

given that i have every light in and out of the house dimmable (including external wall lights, drive lights etc) as part of the lighting scheme, then loxone dimmers were not a viable option when it comes to 96 channels of mains dimming (that would be £10k for dimmers), and 24v downlights where too few options to choose and too expensive to replace as leds get better over time. lots of channels with few bulbs per channel was and is always going to be a challenge for mains dimmable bulbs where they work much better with a higher load.

the njd dmx dimmers are rather nicely made but leading edge, and made lots of leds buzz, hence left with the cheap chinese 3 channel stuff.
i bought quite a few different led gu10 bulbs to try for compatability before i started with the njd and then dmx dimemrs, and apart from a few failures the chinese stuff has been good value for money in terms of delivering mood lighting at a whole house level for very little expense.

i have replaced some with the theben 8 channel dimmer, partly just as an experiment in knx and to see if they were better - answer is the single unit is £500 for 8 channels and has been reliable so far, but thats a trial of 1 so hardly conclusive, and the dimming performance is not far different from the cheap chinese stuff except goes slightly dimmer before they start to flicker, but not worth paying £50 per channel compared to £10

it was probably me saying that the internal dc power supply was weak - all mine that have failed have lost the internal psu. at the cost i paid, i havnt bothered trying to externally power them or fix them, just throw away and replace. i think ive replaced 6 of my 32 units in nearly 2 years, but mostly in the first 6 months.


jackal077

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May 17, 2017, 7:37:04 PM5/17/17
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Hi Duncan,
What led bulbs are you using? Im using philips and sylvania or megaman. I can check the exact model tomorrow and can dim them with the Theben dimmer to really low setting like 2- 3% without any flicker.

Duncan

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May 18, 2017, 3:57:00 AM5/18/17
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i have the philips 5.4w cri 90 bulbs on the chinese dmx dimmers which dim down to around 30%, and costo feit (costco) 2.7k on the theben (its used in bedroom areas) - the costco dont go that low, perhaps around 15% but that may be the bulb rather than the theben

Simon Still

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May 18, 2017, 7:27:50 AM5/18/17
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On Thursday, 18 May 2017 00:37:04 UTC+1, jackal077 wrote:
Hi Duncan,
What led bulbs are you using? Im using philips and sylvania or megaman. I can check the exact model tomorrow and can dim them with the Theben dimmer to really low setting like 2- 3% without any flicker.

I was using Sylvania RefLED+ Of the 10 I bought I one died within a few weeks and a second went - seemingly at the same time as the dimmer failed (could that be connected?).  Bought from any-lamp.co.uk who are not actually in the UK.  However, they have a 3 year warranty on Phillips and Sylvania and will send out replacements with minimal fuss.

I've just bought a couple of Phillips Master LED's which someone here said dim better to try in my single bulb location.

 

Simon Still

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May 18, 2017, 7:36:45 AM5/18/17
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On Wednesday, 17 May 2017 19:56:04 UTC+1, Duncan wrote:
its not so much enthusiasm as pragmastic due to the lack of dmx alternative (at 240v anyway)

my lighting strategy was always to use gu10 fittings with retrofit dimmable bulbs to be able to take advantage of led improvements over time, without having to replace a load of inbuilt led/mains units, and to be able to change K, CRI and beam angle easily once the house had been lived in for a while

Sure.  Nice to have that flexibility.  I think all the big gains in LEDs have been achieved - power is now low enough that additional savings are really minor.  You can now buy lights that are indistinguishable from Halogen - hard to see why you would now need to replace in their lifetime. 
CRI and colour temperature are no longer a problem but being able to change easily remains an advantage.

I went for 2700k everywhere and I'd probably take 3000 or so for kitchen and bathroom if i was speccing again.  

However, my PhotonStar lights with analogue dimming have been 100% reliable whereas even my expensive, supposedly top quality, Sylvania GU10's have had a 20% failure rate.  



...., then loxone dimmers were not a viable option ....24v downlights where too few options to choose

Annoying that this still all remains an issue another few years down the line.  I'd probably do the same again (1-10v or DMX dimmed constant current lights) but you still end up with a smattering of GU10s where you want pendant lights or other 'non-recessed-downlight' fittings.  


Duncan

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May 18, 2017, 9:08:05 AM5/18/17
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i had some very specific requirements such as some lights with 10-12degree angle, which could only really be achieved with gu10 in an affordable way

led lighting still has a way to go in terms of quality though - even lights with a cri >90 often have a R9 (red colour)  of a negative value compared to a halogen of 100, so skin and reds can look washed out

if you compare to a led such as the soraa with a r9 of around 90, you can see the difference, but currently im not happy to replace more than 200 leds at £25 each. wait a few years and they will be £8-10 per bulb.

njamessimpson

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May 19, 2017, 8:06:17 AM5/19/17
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Duncan - you mentioned a good 95 crib led bulb with DMX 3 channel. What's your source? I'd prefer higher CRI for lounge etc.

Thanks

Duncan

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May 19, 2017, 8:59:33 AM5/19/17
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these have a good cri, but i dont know the r9
https://well-lit.co.uk/browse/fitting/gu10/

for a cri of 95 and r9 of 95 then the soraa vivid 3 is the model to go for at around £25 each

Robbie

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May 22, 2017, 5:36:51 AM5/22/17
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As I mentioned before, I've found the Philips Dim Tone GU10 lamps (4W &