dialing in seams and edges

[Amsterdamman]

Hi All,
Finally my Ormerod1 is working fairly consistently and with few failures. Now I'm trying to get the prints better, esp since I want to print my Ormerod2 parts! Attached is a photo of three 1cm3 blocks I made last night. Left is #1 and middle is #9 made with KISSlicer far right is from Slic3r. Since lots of users seem to still use Slic3r I also made one with Slic3r just to see the difference, and it is a better final shape, but the print was twice as long as well and I prefer the paths and interface method KISSlicer uses. The final product is key, so I would give up and use Slic3r if it is the only method that works. 

I was trying different fields between test #1 and #9 but found the last MISC tab had the most effect on the print seam. Seam hiding didn't help, so I lowered the Oversampling resolution from 0.125 to 0.05 and dropped the crowning threshold from 1 to 0.5 but It still isn't quite as good as Slic3r though... Attached are screenshots of my KISSLicer fields. 

Also the base of the piece flares slightly compared to Slic3r. Any suggestions for fields to play with or other methods to improve the KISSlicer results?
Thanks all for any help your willing to offer!!
Kimon ~ The Amsterdamman

[funBart]

(edited the text a little)

Hi, I tried various slicers including Slic3r, Simplify3D, Makerware, Cura, Craftware and at the end they are all capable to deliver beautiful prints. So it's never a slicer flaw with either of them and all comes down by tweaking the settings. 

Those cubes are all not very nice, how big are they, 1cm3? Personally, according those results, I would say you have another problem than a slicer problem, probably with the mechanics of the printer (backlash, loose belts, loose drive gear, wrong set firmware as additional destringing, wrong set acceleration settings?

A nice place for common problems is this site:

http://reprap.org/wiki/Print_Troubleshooting_Pictorial_Guide

For a straight object like this, I can't imagine the oversample resolution has anything to do with it, as it's just a resolution to slice with, mostly effecting complex curved objects to it's ouput resolution. Any value between 0.05 and 2 should work here. The crowning threshold won't do anything with the walls of this object either. It fills in small gaps in the infill, top layer and very small walls (1 extrusion wide walls for example).

The only thing I could find in your settings compared to mine are:

- The trigger for destring is 100, so there is no destringing probably will happen at the test cube: maybe start with min jump and trigger both on 5mm

- the values of Prime and suck are pretty high, are you using a Bowden extruder?

-on the style tab: I shouldn't use wipe for this kind of objects, better turn it off for now.

- the layer time is high (10s) that's very long, resulting in a slow print maybe and therefor transferring to much heat to the printed object keeping it soft.

- are you sure there is no additional destring set in the firmware

- Although I don't think it's wrong, is the filament diameter measured with a caliper?

- As now that behaviour occurs on a corner: maybe set Jitter to 360 degrees on the style tab and see what's happening than. The seam can causing that blobs maybe as well: after Jitter set, you can try to play with the seam feature.

The latest Beta of Kisslicer has more tweaks for the Seam, you can try it later when these settings are playing better with your printer.

https://groups.google.com/d/msg/kisslicer-refugee-camp/UBI5gPxyc0o/qNe3GjLEkjIJ

Hopes this helped, maybe others have some ideas as well.

Bart

[Amsterdamman]

I updated to KISSlicer 1.4.5.10 and had MUCH better results! Attached are screenshots of my current settings. I changed the triggers etc. as suggested but left wipe on as the only place I see it in the g-code is on layer increment. Attached is a photo of the test 1 cm cubes. Left is 1st test with old KISSlicer, middle is Slic3r and right is new 1.4 KISSlicer. The seam is much improved and I think better than Slic3r now. 

The seam angle acts slightly strange. It did not move the seam to a different side, but with the seam angle straight down SEEMED to have a positive impact. Not sure about it though. I'll make a test...

My only complaint in the first three layers are slightly too large and create a mild flare at the base. Any idea which setting may correct this? I also attached the simple .stll for the 1cm3 cube.

Thanks for input! Really helped a great deal!

Kimon ~ The Amsterdamman

(added .stl) 

and yes - it is a Bowden extruder machine 

[Amsterdamman]

I think the seam angle was the main issue!! 

attached photo: changed seam angle to default top right corner and the seam is very bad again!

My 1st guess would be the center or pivot point of the angle is on the active print edge vs the center of the object. 

So the angle affects the seam and not the placement. The seam is always on the same corner regardless of seam angle. 

angle straight down or to the left seemed to work ok, down was best. Straight up made a slightly poor seam.

My fast fix: switch the default seam angle position to straight down. 

The older KISSlicer 1.1.0.14 version may have the same issue. 

[funBart]

Pasted some in:

On Sunday, 14 September 2014 11:42:06 UTC+2, Amsterdamman wrote:

I updated to KISSlicer 1.4.5.10 and had MUCH better results! Attached are screenshots of my current settings. I changed the triggers etc. as suggested but left wipe on as the only place I see it in the g-code is on layer increment. Attached is a photo of the test 1 cm cubes. Left is 1st test with old KISSlicer, middle is Slic3r and right is new 1.4 KISSlicer. The seam is much improved and I think better than Slic3r now. 

The seam angle acts slightly strange. It did not move the seam to a different side, but with the seam angle straight down SEEMED to have a positive impact. Not sure about it though. I'll make a test...

That's strange. I just tested it with the 1cm3 cube, but with jitter to 0, the seam mas on places where you should expect, In your setting (straight down) the seam was in the middle of the straight wall, instead at the corner as with you. 

You understood that Jitter was adding a more random placing of the seam each layer? So when set to 360 it moves around the whole cube, no mather what angle you have set. 

My only complaint in the first three layers are slightly too large and create a mild flare at the base. Any idea which setting may correct this? I also attached the simple .stll for the 1cm3 cube.

I think you have to much material pushed to the build plate the first layers, so actually pushing it outwards because it has no place to go. To solve that:

• callibrate the start height of the buildplate, normnally the size of a 80grams paper sheet just fitting between nozzle and build plate.
•  Maybe you have set on the Printer//hardware tab bed roughness to high: that's causing an extra amount/flow of material the first layer. Normally you can leave it to 0, I have set it to 0.05. Same for Z offset: normally you can leave it at 0. That value only translates the Z value of the complete Gcode.
  

Thanks for input! Really helped a great deal!

Kimon ~ The Amsterdamman

(added .stl) 

and yes - it is a Bowden extruder machine 

One thing noticed:  your speed settings are on a very wide spread: As the travel speed is way to high compared to that, surely resulting in overshooting and a bad print. I assume you have the acceleration settings set ok at the firmware, but I suggest you tweak the travel speed to 100mm/s or less.

RotterdammanBart

[Amsterdamman]

yes, strange your results were so different than mine with seam angle. I had the same issue for awhile with older KISSlicer as well and dealt with many small faults making herringbone gears (a 98% perfect rebuild and reprint just finished! tiny issues on the seam line still, but very minor) 

Jitter: yes I was using 0 degree normally, tried to use 360 in desperation. I get a slightly thick spot at each seam using jitter. Maybe this indicated a issue with my ends?

agree the first layer was causing base flare issues, I didn't change any setting directly, but as the machine and slicer dialed in the layer has worked much better. Great bed stick and the slight pattern of the base layer shows on the shiny face.

firmware set to absolute E - seems to be the only one that works! file ext g, none mark path start/stop.

I dropped x,y travel speed to 100. Should I lower the XY accel from 1500? These were all set to the default values.

Thanks again for help, the prints are 100x better now!

Kimon ~ The Amsterdamman

[Bart]

The XY acceleration does nothing actually: it's only used to tweak the printtime calculated by Kisslicer matching the actual printtime.

About the seam, that's just trying to tweak the Depth and Gap setting. At lower heights (0.1-0.15mm) I don't see much difference, but on 0.3mm it's more obvious. Mostly I leave them both at 1.

Bart

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[EnerJel EU]

I read your post about using the path screen to see the seam, very helpful! Using that I saw a 0.1 depth made the best seam on the path screen and also prints a near perfect seam for me!

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[Amsterdamman]

I read your post about using the path screen to see the seam, very helpful! Using that I saw a 0.1 depth made the best seam on the path screen and also prints a near perfect seam for me!