MSJune,2015/06 Araceae

[M Sawmliana]

Location : Buarpui - W.Bungtlang road
Date : 24/06/2015
Habit : Herb
Habitat : Wild in the forests


With regards,
M.Sawmliana

[M Sawmliana]

This is for Identification

[J.M. Garg]

Forwarding again for Id assistance please.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: 27 June 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: indian...@googlegroups.com

Location : Buarpui - W.Bungtlang road (North East India)

Date : 24/06/2015
Habit : Herb
Habitat : Wild in the forests


With regards,
M.Sawmliana

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

'Creating awareness of Indian Flora & Fauna'
The whole world uses my Image Resource of more than a thousand species & eight thousand images of Birds, Butterflies, Plants etc. (arranged alphabetically & place-wise). You can also use them for free as per Creative Commons license attached with each image.

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Also author of 'A Photoguide to the Birds of Kolkata & Common Birds of India'.

[J.M. Garg]

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: M Swamy <swamy...@gmail.com>
Date: 3 July 2015 at 17:02
Subject: Re: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: "J.M. Garg" <jmg...@gmail.com>

Calla lily    . Could be  a species of   Zantedeschia  ( Zantedeschia aethiopica ?)

[surajit koley]

I am unable to identify it. Please upload details of open spadix as in - https://groups.google.com/d/msg/indiantreepix/sHHRMo8ZpaM/6rIrgQdWVzcJ

Thank you

Regards

surajit koley

a non-botanist member of

efloraofIndia google group

On Fri, Jul 3, 2015 at 12:25 PM, J.M. Garg <jmg...@gmail.com> wrote:

[J.M. Garg]

Forwarding again for Id assistance please.

Some earlier relevant feedback:

Calla lily. Could be a species of Zantedeschia (Zantedeschia aethiopica ?) - from Mahadeswara ji.

I am unable to identify it. Please upload details of open spadix as in - https://groups.google.com/d/msg/indiantreepix/sHHRMo8ZpaM/6rIrgQdWVzcJ Thank you Regards surajit koley

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: 27 June 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: indian...@googlegroups.com

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[Saroj Kumar Kasaju]

Colocasia esculenta ?

Thank you

Saroj Kasaju

[J.M. Garg]

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With regards,
J. M. Garg

To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/indiantreepix/ce3a82f4-3afb-4f96-ba84-d5238277ae03n%40googlegroups.com.

[J.M. Garg]

I think looks different from Colocasia esculenta

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: <indian...@googlegroups.com>

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

[Gurcharan Singh]

Forwarding for ID

Distributed as Araceae member- Buarpui - W.Bungtlang road, Mizoram ?

Group discussion at

MSJune,2015/06 Araceae (google.com)

[Gurcharan Singh]

Forwarding for ID

Distributed as Araceae member- Buarpui - W.Bungtlang road, Mizoram ?

Group discussion at

MSJune,2015/06 Araceae (google.com)

[J.M. Garg]

Hi, Sawmliana ji,

Could you identify it ?

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: <indian...@googlegroups.com>

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

[J.M. Garg]

Thanks, Sawmliana ji

--
With regards,
J. M. Garg

On Sat, 24 Apr, 2021, 4:55 pm M Sawmliana, <msawm...@gmail.com> wrote:

Alocasia acuminata ?

[J.M. Garg]

Inflorescence looks different as per images at IAS

--

With regards,
J.M.Garg

[J.M. Garg]

Forwarding again for Id assistance please.

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: <indian...@googlegroups.com>

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

[J.M. Garg]

Forwarding again for Id assistance please.

Some earlier relevant feedback:

Calla lily. Could be a species of Zantedeschia (Zantedeschia aethiopica ?) - from Mahadeswara ji.

I am unable to identify it. Please upload details of open spadix as in - https://groups.google.com/d/msg/indiantreepix/sHHRMo8ZpaM/6rIrgQdWVzcJ Thank you Regards surajit koley

Colocasia esculenta ? Thank you Saroj Kasaju

I think looks different from Colocasia esculenta- from me

Alocasia acuminata ?- from Sawmliana ji

Inflorescence looks different as per images at IAS- from me

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: <indian...@googlegroups.com>

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

[surajit koley]

I think, it would be Alocasia fallax Schott - http://plantsoftheworldonline.org/taxon/urn:lsid:ipni.org:names:84167-1 and https://www.gbif.org/species/5329901

The species is confined in Sikkim Himalaya and Khasia, as per F-B-I.

Unfortunately, neither the F-B-I nor the internet provides me details on flower/spadix.

As per F-B-I, vol-6, page 527, the species should be near A. decipiens & A. fornicata.

Thank you.

Best regards,

Surajit Koley

[J.M. Garg]

I am not convinced about it being Alocasia fallax as per GBIF specimens or Alocasia decipiens as per GBIF. 

What I see here is shining leaves with clear tertiary veins and contrasting colours of both sides of the leave, as can be seen in GBIF specimens of Alocasia fornicata at one, two, three, four, five, six. It also have distribution in the area as per POWO.

However, I am not sure. 

Pl. confirm or otherwise. 

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: <indian...@googlegroups.com>

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

[surajit koley]

Please send me the flower to examine physically.

Thank you.

Best regards,

Surajit Koley

[surajit koley]

Dear Sawmliana ji,

I know I am asking for too much! Please understand that I am no expert on Alocasia or Colocasia, I am here too to learn something about plant-world. However, I do know what a flower of A. fornicata look like. And I believe that identification based on leaf morphology can mislead, specially in case of Alocasia or Colocasia.

I have doubt if your plant can be Alocasia fornicata - flowers are not like the ones I see here.- (a) floral chamber and spathe appear to be narrower and more elongated in your species, (b) spadix is different.

I do not know if the above characters can be regional variation.

I attach here description of Alocasia fornicata from the booh, "Botany of Bihar and Orissa".

Also attached an edited picture for your perusal, along with other pictures (one immature flower and the other mature) of Alocasia fornicata flower that I recorded.

And KEY is there in a private mail for certain spp of Alocasia.

Thank you.

Best regards,

Surajit Koley

[surajit koley]

I would like to add one more point - I never came across any such phrase that "shiny leaf means Alocasia."

Thank you.

Best regards,

Surajit Koley

[J.M. Garg]

I think it may be some Remusatia species as per comparative images herein, mostly Remusatia hookeriana Schott as per details and images herein and as per Flora of China keys, FoC illustrations- one, two, three and GBIF specimens - one, two, three, four

--

With regards,
J.M.Garg

[surajit koley]

I am not acquainted with this genus, Sir ji.

Yet, I do not think it can be Remusatia hookeriana -(1) as per Fl.Br.Ind., spathe max 2.5 inch, / 7 cm max.- FoC) (2) spadix max. 11+7+9 = 27 mm = 1 inch approx (check FoC).

The spadix in this thread looks much longer, though actual size can only be verified by Sawmliana ji.

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[J.M. Garg]

Thanks, Surajit ji.
To me relative size of spathe, ovule and leaves appears to be OK. Actually close up images (making them look appear large) has confused us, into thinking this to be an Alocasia.

--
With regards,
J. M. Garg

To view this discussion on the web, visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/indiantreepix/CAMV_mc2eEygEWpjmCV4a7dq8YC%2BMFe%3DPN%2B%2BOZtesnqQquoiLew%40mail.gmail.com.

[surajit koley]

Yes, Sir ji, photographic illusions are quite possible.

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[surajit koley]

Sir ji, is there any possibility of Steudnera colocasioides ? Please check the spadix at - http://www.aroidpictures.fr/GENERA/STEUDNERA/steudcolocasioides.html

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[J.M. Garg]

I do not think so.

--
With regards,
J. M. Garg

[surajit koley]

Is it flower or the leaves?

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[surajit koley]

Ok Sir ji in this case you are correct -

It is not Alocasia - since its flower does not carry an appendix

It is not Steudnera - spathe is differentiated into two zones, and spadix indicates a constricted sterile zone above the floral chamber

Now, I will check, later, if it can be Colocasia - colocasia can have reduced or no appendix. Thereafter I will go to Remusatia.

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[surajit koley]

Sir ji, I fail to connect it with any Alocasia (no appendix in flower) / Colocasia / Steudnera, "Flora of China '' has to offer.

I fail to connect it to any Remusatia as well, - the exposed part of the spadix is significantly longer than the hidden part in spathe tube.

If this is the same plant as in the other thread - https://groups.google.com/g/indiantreepix/c/e5eE6YgOC_c/m/3SiL9s7uDfIJ - which I think it is - then I am afraid we have to think outside Remusatia hookeriana.

Thank you

Regards

surajit

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[surajit koley]

This is Colocasia mannii Hook.f.

"A herb ..... stolon absent ------ upper surface of leaf blade glossy green ....... spadix 9-11 cm., .... female zone 3-3.8 cm., sterile zone 3cm., male zone 3-4.2 cm., synandria ivory ...."

So, is the other thread, spathe limb and male + strile + synandria decayed showing only fruiting chamber since that was photographed in September - https://groups.google.com/g/indiantreepix/c/e5eE6YgOC_c

Don't ask me where did I otain the data from - obviously I copied from somewhere!!!

Don't redirect me to Indiabiodiversity site.

surajit koley

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

[J.M. Garg]

Thanks, Surajit ji.

Hope you are right as per GBIF- specimens one and two.

Description from FBI from IBIS Flora is as below:

Hook. f. ; leaves oblong-ovate base sagittate lobes very obtuse sinus broad acute, spathe narrowly oblong cymbiform, spadix half as long as the spathe sub-acute, appendage 0.

UPPER ASSAM ; at Makum, Mann.

Leaves 8-12 by 4-7 in., nerves 6-7 pairs, not stout, basal lobes 4 in. ; petiole 1-3 ft. Peduncle rather slender. Spathe 6-7 in., tube 1 in. Spadix 1.1/2-4 in. ; male infl. 1 in. intermediate space 1/2 in. ; male 1.1/4-1.1/2, tip rounded. Anthers stellately crenate. Ovaries globose, stigma a discoid area.

--

With regards,
J.M.Garg

[J.M. Garg]

Thanks a lot, Rajib ji, for validation.    

Thanks a lot, Surajit ji, for resolving this id with your great efforts. 

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Rajib Gogoi 
Date: Fri, 21 May 2021 at 14:47
Subject: Re: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: J.M. Garg <jmg...@gmail.com>, M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>

Colocasia mannii

Rajib Gogoi

On Friday, 21 May, 2021, 2:44:13 pm IST, J.M. Garg <jmg...@gmail.com> wrote:

May I request you to pl. confirm this as Colocasia mannii Hook.f. or otherwise as per your publication: Taxonomic identity and Lectotypification of Colocasia mannii (Araceae), a Little Known Species from Northeast India

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: M Sawmliana <msawm...@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2015 at 13:25
Subject: [efloraofindia:226503] MSJune,2015/06 Araceae
To: <indian...@googlegroups.com>

Location : Buarpui - W.Bungtlang road
Date : 24/06/2015
Habit : Herb
Habitat : Wild in the forests


With regards,
M.Sawmliana

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

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With regards,
J.M.Garg

[surajit koley]

Forwarding again for Id confirmation or otherwise please.

Some earlier relevant feedback:

Sir ji, is there any possibility of Steudnera colocasioides ? Please check the spadix at - http://www.aroidpictures.fr/GENERA/STEUDNERA/steudcolocasioides.html            Surajit

I do not think so. -- With regards, J. M. Garg

Is it flower or the leaves? life is short

A response was expected before my next reply mail, more than 12 hrs. later

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know

On Wed, 19 May 2021 at 22:26, surajit koley <surajitno...@gmail.com> wrote:

[surajit koley]

Sawmliana ji,

I am happy that your species id has been resolved. Please do not bother to send me any flower. I remember your difficulties.

I expect, in the coming days, you will offer us more and more uncommon or lesser-known species from your region. Please record as much detail of your plants as you can.

Thank you

Best regards

surajit koley

life is short

time is running out

don't try to know everything

utilize what you already know