I will stop responding to Snit, DFS, flatfish
Chris
I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
one anymore for obvious reasons:
Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
were posted I assume he does this regularly.
Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
not meaningful too.
DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
about Bugs from 2004.
I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
Who is with me?
Chris Ahlstrom
> Maybe we could try it all together:
>
> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>
> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
> Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
> not meaningful too.
> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
> about Bugs from 2004.
The latter two can get very very nasty, as well.
> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>
> Who is with me?
Preachin' to the choir, man.
Even in the kill file they keep trying to reach out to me.
--
I'm So Miserable Without You It's Almost Like Having You Here
-- Song title by Stephen Bishop.
She Got the Gold Mine, I Got the Shaft
-- Song title by Jerry Reed.
When My Love Comes Back from the Ladies' Room Will I Be Too Old to Care?
-- Song title by Lewis Grizzard.
I Don't Know Whether to Kill Myself or Go Bowling
-- Unattributed song title.
Drop Kick Me, Jesus, Through the Goal Posts of Life
-- Unattributed song title.
Chris
> Preachin' to the choir, man.
>
> Even in the kill file they keep trying to reach out to me.
But I mean not virtually everyone but literally everyone should stop. :)
Let's see if they keep posting when they only respond to each other.
Snit
3/5/11 1:16 PM:
> Maybe we could try it all together:
>
> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>
> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
"advocates" out.
> Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
> not meaningful too.
> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
> about Bugs from 2004.
>
> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>
> Who is with me?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
flatfish+++
You get your butt kicked so now you run away and hide?
Must be something to do with the name "Chris" because every single one
of the "Chris's" in COLA is a chicken shit.
Make sure you reply 3rd party so we can see exactly how much you are
"ignoring" us.
That's what Chris Ahlstrom, chrisv, HPT, Shearman, Poaster and the other
Linux vermin do.
You should fit in nicely!
Snit
3/5/11 1:43 PM:
Why would you stop responding to someone who merely made the two following
points:
1) Ubuntu has inconsistent copy and paste behavior. This is clearly a
problem. It can, I believe, be solved with a clipboard manager, but that
does not mean the weakness does not exist.
2) There are two "models" of clipboard behavior:
- Keep the clipboard on app close
- Lose the clipboard on app close
I noted how the first option offers more choice for the user... and it has
since been noted there may be cases the second option offers better
security.
Really: there is no reason anyone who is not insecure in their support of
OSS should find these things so offensive or scary they have to run and
hide.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
owl
> Chris stated in post iku7a0$skm$1...@inf2.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de on
> 3/5/11 1:43 PM:
> > Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 15:40:03 -0500 schrieb Chris Ahlstrom:
> >
> >> Preachin' to the choir, man.
> >>
> >> Even in the kill file they keep trying to reach out to me.
> >
> > But I mean not virtually everyone but literally everyone should stop. :)
> >
> > Let's see if they keep posting when they only respond to each other.
> Why would you stop responding to someone who merely made the two following
> points:
<snip>
> Really: there is no reason anyone who is not insecure in their support of
> OSS should find these things so offensive or scary they have to run and
> hide.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assburgers#Characteristics
<quote>
Abnormalities include verbosity, abrupt transitions, literal
interpretations and miscomprehension of nuance, use of metaphor meaningful
only to the speaker,
...
Speech may convey a sense of incoherence; the conversational style often
includes monologues about topics that bore the listener, fails to provide
context for comments, or fails to suppress internal thoughts. Individuals
with AS may fail to monitor whether the listener is interested or engaged
in the conversation. The speaker's conclusion or point may never be made,
and attempts by the listener to elaborate on the speech's content or
logic, or to shift to related topics, are often unsuccessful.
...
The atypical antipsychotic medications risperidone and olanzapine have
been shown to reduce the associated symptoms of AS;[2] risperidone can
reduce repetitive and self-injurious behaviors, aggressive outbursts
and impulsivity, and improve stereotypical patterns of behavior and
social relatedness. The selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs)
fluoxetine, fluvoxamine and sertraline have been effective in treating
restricted and repetitive interests and behaviors.
</quote>
Snit
Man, I support better usability *and* choice.
Yeah, better rip me apart!
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
7
Only the trolls sniggering away at the thought of it.
Best leave the drama out and focus on what you want others
to hear from you. Trolls adhere to a nasty training regime
that focuses on personal attacks and general trolling, screaming
and shouting to get attention with their sock puppets.
owl
> Man, I support better usability *and* choice.
> Yeah, better rip me apart!
Nice that you can admit that you got ripped apart. That indicates
progress. You should celebrate appropriately.
7
> Chris stated in post iku5mo$skm$1...@inf2.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de on
> 3/5/11 1:16 PM:
>
>> Maybe we could try it all together:
>>
>> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
>> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>>
>> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
>> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
>
> I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
> "advocates" out.
Eeek! You still haven't proven you know what a clipboard manager is.
Chris
> I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
> "advocates" out.
It's not.
It was acknowledged several times that Ubuntu / Gnome should not do what
they do.
It was acknowledged several times that a clipboard manager would be the
better solution and by the way solves the inconsistency issue.
You don't answer to that.
Instead you answer to virtually every single post that has not said that
yet with your copypasta.
Chris
> Make sure you reply 3rd party so we can see exactly how much you are
> "ignoring" us.
I won't.
Do you insist?
flatfish+++
Only if you insist on acting like an ass hole.
Like Chris Ahlstrom for example.
Of course you can always take the path which is creating a new nym that
appears out of nowhere......
Snit
> Snit wrote:
>
>> Chris stated in post iku5mo$skm$1...@inf2.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de on
>> 3/5/11 1:16 PM:
>>
>>> Maybe we could try it all together:
>>>
>>> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
>>> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>>>
>>> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
>>> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
>>
>> I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
>> "advocates" out.
>
>
> Eeek! You still haven't proven you know what a clipboard manager is.
I support the idea of better usability and choice. Better start insinuating
I do not know what clipboard managers are!
LOL!
Really: is that the best you can do?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
3/5/11 2:43 PM:
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 13:54:46 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>> I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
>> "advocates" out.
>
> It's not.
Sure it is. I am being called names, lied about, etc. All because I
acknowledge a problem with Ubuntu and understand and support the idea of
having more choice for users.
> It was acknowledged several times that Ubuntu / Gnome should not do what
> they do.
Good. Then what is the issue?
> It was acknowledged several times that a clipboard manager would be the
> better solution and by the way solves the inconsistency issue.
And I have noted that I agree - though the claim has been made that the
clipboard manager might not solve everythng.
> You don't answer to that.
Sure I do. Over and over and over. Then I get accused of repeating myself.
Here, look up how many times I have talked about this:
-----
1) Ubuntu has inconsistent copy and paste behavior. This is
clearly a problem. It can, I believe, be solved with a
clipboard manager, but that does not mean the weakness does
not exist.
-----
Please note I do not even speak about how a clipboard manager might not
solve it completely - which has been claimed by others. I have not tested
that and did not focus on it.
> Instead you answer to virtually every single post that has not said that
> yet with your copypasta.
You have two complaints:
1) I did not note what I noted in the text I have been pasting.
2) I have been pasting the same thing.
If I keep repeating the same thing you complain about that, but if I do not
you insist I never said it. And the actual issue is left behind.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
flatfish+++
You are replying to 7.
Each day when he wakes up he has to be taught how to breath again.
Chris
>>> Make sure you reply 3rd party so we can see exactly how much you are
>>> "ignoring" us.
>> I won't.
>> Do you insist?
> Only if you insist on acting like an ass hole. Like Chris Ahlstrom for
> example.
Wait, you insist to me answering to you third-party if I insist on acting
like an asshole?
> Of course you can always take the path which is creating a new nym that
> appears out of nowhere......
Why should I?
Snit
Many of the "advocates" are "ripping me apart" in there minds - by lying
about me and my views. Remember, my views here are pretty simple:
1) Ubuntu has inconsistent copy and paste behavior. This is clearly a
problem. It can, I believe, be solved with a clipboard manager, but that
does not mean the weakness does not exist.
You responded to this point by claiming, incorrectly, that I did not
recognize the role of a clipboard manager in this.
2) There are two "models" of clipboard behavior:
- Keep the clipboard on app close
- Lose the clipboard on app close
I noted how the first option offers more choice for the user... and it has
since been noted there may be cases the second option offers better
security.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
owl
Did you properly close the source application between every one of the
four hundred times you have copy/close/paste'd that?
Chris
> Best leave the drama out and focus on what you want others to hear from
> you. Trolls adhere to a nasty training regime that focuses on personal
> attacks and general trolling, screaming and shouting to get attention
> with their sock puppets.
I am also asking you. You sometimes copypaste a your messages as answers
to them. In my opinion this doesn't make much sense. I suggest nothing
but silence. These threads only grow so fast because people answer them.
Focussing is not easy. They suck you in and your realize you keep posting
and postng and waste your time when actually you have made your point
hours ago.
Snit
3/5/11 2:58 PM:
He is a special case.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
Your sarcasm is weak. So you know, though, I use a clipboard manager so I
can grab my recent copied items - even if I have closed the program I used
to copy.
I really do not understand why you and other "advocates" would be so worked
up over this. Why the big deal? Why the lies and name calling and other
BS? It is not like I am being anti-Linux or anti-OSS or making any personal
attacks.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
3/5/11 3:02 PM:
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 21:46:07 +0000 schrieb 7:
>
>> Best leave the drama out and focus on what you want others to hear from
>> you. Trolls adhere to a nasty training regime that focuses on personal
>> attacks and general trolling, screaming and shouting to get attention
>> with their sock puppets.
>
> I am also asking you. You sometimes copypaste a your messages as answers
> to them. In my opinion this doesn't make much sense. I suggest nothing
> but silence. These threads only grow so fast because people answer them.
It is true: if I did not respond to those who are trolling me then they
would likely stop.
I admit, though, it is interesting to me to see how many lies and insults
people will post when faced with minor usability issues and signs that the
defaults on Linux do not offer as many choices as other options. It amazes
me how insecure many of the "advocates" are - to clearly take such things so
personally and be so heavily offended by it.
An interesting exercise in psychology.
> Focussing is not easy. They suck you in and your realize you keep posting
> and postng and waste your time when actually you have made your point
> hours ago.
Yes, I made my points long ago and they have not changed. Now it is just an
exercise in seeing how "advocates" react to non-offensive facts.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris
>>> I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
>>> "advocates" out.
>> It's not.
> Sure it is. I am being called names, lied about, etc. All because I
> acknowledge a problem with Ubuntu and understand and support the idea of
> having more choice for users.
Do you want to say that this is everything you said?
>> It was acknowledged several times that Ubuntu / Gnome should not do
>> what they do.
> Good. Then what is the issue?
That's what I'm asking you. The thread is growing and growing and no
information is added.
>> It was acknowledged several times that a clipboard manager would be the
>> better solution and by the way solves the inconsistency issue.
> And I have noted that I agree - though the claim has been made that the
> clipboard manager might not solve everythng.
Of course it doesn't solve everything. It won't make me lunch.
>> You don't answer to that.
> Sure I do. Over and over and over. Then I get accused of repeating
> myself. Here, look up how many times I have talked about this:
> -----
> 1) Ubuntu has inconsistent copy and paste behavior. This is clearly
> a problem. It can, I believe, be solved with a clipboard manager,
> but that does not mean the weakness does not exist.
> -----
So what exactly is this "weakness"?
We now all know the default behaviour in the X clipboard.
Ubuntu / Gnome didn't like it.
They started to change applications so they have a persistent clipboard.
They are not done with all applications yet (will they ever?).
So if you don't like that it doesn't work in _all_ applications you need
to install a clipboard manager.
Clipboard managers were written _for the purpose_ of getting the
behaviour you want.
> Please note I do not even speak about how a clipboard manager might not
> solve it completely - which has been claimed by others. I have not
> tested that and did not focus on it.
So who are "others", what did they claim and how might it not solve it
completely and why don't you speak about it since this would be a
_trivial_ solution to your "problem"?
>> Instead you answer to virtually every single post that has not said
>> that yet with your copypasta.
> You have two complaints:
> 1) I did not note what I noted in the text I have been pasting.
Maybe I didn't see that you wrote that a clipboardmanager may solve it in
these posts. I'm sorry then, in my memory you didn't.
But that doesn't change the fact that the solution is _trivial_ and you
even don't want to have a look.
Look, it doesn't work that way: You install a system and magicaly it
perfect meets your likes. There is no perfect default setting for
everyone. You need to do a little configuration on any Operating System
(as long as it is not forcing a look and feel on you).
Why do you so strongly refuse to apply _trivial_ configuration?
> 2) I
> have been pasting the same thing.
Redundancy? Why?
> If I keep repeating the same thing you complain about that,
Surprising, isn't it?
> but if I do
> not you insist I never said it.
Did I really do that? Only when you posted close in time to me and I
didn't read your post yet.
Or when the thread already has grown so big that nobody can keep in mind
what everybode said. Copypaste makes it worse because nobody is going to
read the same thing 10+ times.
> And the actual issue is left behind.
Which was: The behaviour you complain about is only there because
Ubuntu / Gnome felt that the default behaviour is not what they want and
then changed the applications you complain about.
They did it on _purpose_.
owl
> owl stated in post no9ahsdf...@rooftop.invalid on 3/5/11 3:05 PM:
> >
> > Did you properly close the source application between every one of the
> > four hundred times you have copy/close/paste'd that?
> Your sarcasm is weak. So you know, though, I use a clipboard manager so I
> can grab my recent copied items - even if I have closed the program I used
> to copy.
Wait, you mean that without the clipboard manager you would not have
access to this text? Did it get lost when you closed that app?
> I really do not understand why you and other "advocates" would be so worked
> up over this. Why the big deal? Why the lies and name calling and other
> BS? It is not like I am being anti-Linux or anti-OSS or making any personal
> attacks.
You have interacted with me often enough to know that I never initiate
personal attacks. I generally respond in kind. It is you who usually
fall off the civility wagon first, with your ironically condescending
canned responses that do nothing for your argument and generally shine
a spotlight on the desperation that you are so fearful of projecting.
RonB
You're letting Snit troll you again. The best way to ignore him, and the
others, is to killfile them. And, yes, I've been responding to them via
proxy (as one of the trolls mentioned) and I'll try to stop from doing
that. But it does make it much, much easier to ignore them if I simply
don't see their crap. Even if I killfile them, I still see their inanity
in others' responses.
So killfiling them not only saves you time and aggravation -- it saves me,
and everyone who has them killfiled them, time and aggravation. It's not
like they're trying to present an honest argument anyhow.
--
RonB
Registered Linux User #498581
CentOS 5.5 or VectorLinux Deluxe 6.0
voodoo
they do have a talent for turning this place into a glorious hate-fest.
Big Steel
> Maybe we could try it all together:
>
> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>
> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
> not meaningful too.
> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
> about Bugs from 2004.
>
> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>
> Who is with me?
You idiot.....
What's with this loon?
Does he need help and must make a post to take a piss?
flatfish+++
> they do have a talent for turning this place into a glorious hate-fest.
That's what you Linux vermin do.
This group isn't about Linux advocacy.
It's about Microsoft hate.
flatfish+++
Maybe Chris Ahlstrom will offer to wipe his pee pee.
Snit
3/5/11 3:22 PM:
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 14:58:56 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>>>> I noted an issue with copy and paste on Ubuntu. This is freaking some
>>>> "advocates" out.
>>> It's not.
>> Sure it is. I am being called names, lied about, etc. All because I
>> acknowledge a problem with Ubuntu and understand and support the idea of
>> having more choice for users.
>
> Do you want to say that this is everything you said?
It clearly has been my main points.
>>> It was acknowledged several times that Ubuntu / Gnome should not do
>>> what they do.
>> Good. Then what is the issue?
>
> That's what I'm asking you. The thread is growing and growing and no
> information is added.
Right: people are lying about me and my views and I am letting it be known
what my views actually are. For some strange reason it interests me to see
how many lies people will tell, simply because I am noting two simple and
non-offensive facts:
* Ubuntu has a flaw in the way copy and paste is handled.
* Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard offers more
choice than not allowing them to do so.
More details, of course, have been provided repeatedly.
>>> It was acknowledged several times that a clipboard manager would be the
>>> better solution and by the way solves the inconsistency issue.
>> And I have noted that I agree - though the claim has been made that the
>> clipboard manager might not solve everythng.
>
> Of course it doesn't solve everything. It won't make me lunch.
>
>>> You don't answer to that.
>> Sure I do. Over and over and over. Then I get accused of repeating
>> myself. Here, look up how many times I have talked about this:
>> -----
>> 1) Ubuntu has inconsistent copy and paste behavior. This is clearly
>> a problem. It can, I believe, be solved with a clipboard manager,
>> but that does not mean the weakness does not exist.
>> -----
>
> So what exactly is this "weakness"?
See: above you say no new info is added, but here you admit you do not know
what the info is. Here is my video showing the inconsistency:
<http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>
That explains it quite well.
Below you go off topic, acting as if I was looking for a solution to the
problem on my installation - but being that I have never suggested that I
was looking for help on it and I made it clear I know about clipboard
managers, that is not really relevant.
Again: I am not asking for help dealing with the weakness of Ubuntu - I was
merely noting it. Thank you, however, for offering to assist in case I
needed it.
You denied I had posted about clipboard managers - though I had.
Repeatedly.
> Or when the thread already has grown so big that nobody can keep in mind
> what everybode said. Copypaste makes it worse because nobody is going to
> read the same thing 10+ times.
>
>> And the actual issue is left behind.
>
> Which was: The behaviour you complain about is only there because
> Ubuntu / Gnome felt that the default behaviour is not what they want and
> then changed the applications you complain about.
> They did it on _purpose_.
<http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/UbuntuCP.mov>
Please support that they have the bug with copy and paste on purpose.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
I have merely been repeating non-offensive views. You went a bit off the
deep end with your copy/close/paste comments, hence why you never responded
when I noted how many other things are often done between copying and
pasting.
You have also been struggling for some time to make a point - but I am happy
to humor you.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
PM:
I noted:
* Ubuntu has a flaw in the way copy and paste is handled.
* Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
Facts such as these, RonB claims, aggravate him. Yes: he is aggravated by
the reality of OSS... so he hides from those who speak the truth.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
3/5/11 3:44 PM:
What amazes me is how hateful and angry many of the "advocates" get when
someone points out simple things about OSS, in this case:
* Ubuntu has a flaw in the way copy and paste is handled.
* Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
I mean, really, it is just bizarre how worked up over it they get. RonB
says it "aggravates" him to even see such comments.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
flatfish+++
Just look at them frothing in the Dragon Speech thread....
Hell even us Windows users like Zeke and me aren't that positive on the
usefulness for most people.
The Linux loons came crawling out of the woodpile with their usual sour
grapes.
It's truly amazing how bitter and nasty they are.
William Poaster
> Maybe we could try it all together:
>
> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>
> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
> Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
> not meaningful too.
> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
> about Bugs from 2004.
>
> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>
> Who is with me?
+1
--
Linux, the choice of a GNU generation.
"Microsoft has vast resources, literally billions of dollars in cash, or liquid assets reserves.
Microsoft is an incredibly successful empire built on the premise of market dominance with low-quality goods."
-- Former White House adviser Richard A. Clarke --
Big Steel
> In response to, Chris who on 5/3/2011 20:16 shattered the silence with:
>
>> Maybe we could try it all together:
>>
>> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
>> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>>
>> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
>> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
>> Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
>> not meaningful too.
>> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
>> about Bugs from 2004.
>>
>> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>>
>> Who is with me?
>
> +1
>
that can't do anything on his own, a total joke.
flatfish+++
> In response to, Chris who on 5/3/2011 20:16 shattered the silence with:
>
>> Maybe we could try it all together:
>>
>> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
>> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>>
>> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
>> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
>> Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
>> not meaningful too.
>> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues and 2% of his time
>> about Bugs from 2004.
>>
>> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>>
>> Who is with me?
>
> +1
William Poaster is going to love this thread because it will give him
endless opportunities to talk about his fantastic filter system.
I can see him charging up his batteries now!
Chris
$Annoyed_Answer
Chris
> You're letting Snit troll you again.
But I am limiting it to this thread now. :)
Snit
3/5/11 4:24 PM:
Yes, it is.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris
> * Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard offers
> more choice than not allowing them to do so.
YOU HAVE THE CHOICE TO INSTALL A CLIPBOARD MANAGER!
You don't complain that you don't have EVERY choice in the default
installation, do you?
>> So what exactly is this "weakness"?
> See: above you say no new info is added, but here you admit you do not
> know what the info is.
Rhetorical question, ever heard?
> Below you go off topic, acting as if I was looking for a solution to the
> problem on my installation - but being that I have never suggested that
> I was looking for help on it and I made it clear I know about clipboard
> managers, that is not really relevant.
Then I will use one of your favorite words:
If you don't like the default behaviour in Ubuntu you should chose to
install a clipboard manager.
Who has ever said that the default configuration would fit everyone's
liking?
> You denied I had posted about clipboard managers - though I had.
> Repeatedly.
Maybe I was a bit in rage. Sorry.
> Please support that they have the bug with copy and paste on purpose.
But after reading this statement OVER AND OVER again I think it is
understandable.
Let me put it that way: They put up a new "guideline" how applications
should behave BUT NOT EVERY SINGLE APPLICATION IN THE WORLD DOES IT YET.
Chris
flatfish+++
> I think this thread does a good job being a QED.
So you claimed to kill file people but yet you leave a thread "open"
where we all get the "privilege" of having you reply to us.
Yea.
That makes sense :(
It's one step lower than Liarmutt who replies 3rd party.
owl
> owl stated in post poasef...@rooftop.invalid on 3/5/11 3:33 PM:
> > Snit <use...@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> >> owl stated in post no9ahsdf...@rooftop.invalid on 3/5/11 3:05 PM:
> >
> >>>
> >>> Did you properly close the source application between every one of the
> >>> four hundred times you have copy/close/paste'd that?
> >
> >> Your sarcasm is weak. So you know, though, I use a clipboard manager so I
> >> can grab my recent copied items - even if I have closed the program I used
> >> to copy.
> >
> > Wait, you mean that without the clipboard manager you would not have
> > access to this text? Did it get lost when you closed that app?
> >
*crickets*
> >> I really do not understand why you and other "advocates" would be so worked
> >> up over this. Why the big deal? Why the lies and name calling and other
> >> BS? It is not like I am being anti-Linux or anti-OSS or making any personal
> >> attacks.
> >
> > You have interacted with me often enough to know that I never initiate
> > personal attacks. I generally respond in kind. It is you who usually
> > fall off the civility wagon first, with your ironically condescending
> > canned responses that do nothing for your argument and generally shine
> > a spotlight on the desperation that you are so fearful of projecting.
> I have merely been repeating non-offensive views. You went a bit off the
> deep end with your copy/close/paste comments, hence why you never responded
> when I noted how many other things are often done between copying and
> pasting.
You continue to do your retarded copy/close/paste, with your 8-button
Rainman Mouse that doesn't even have an onboard cache, and the rest of
the world will carry on with the standard, works-as-expected copy/paste
procedure it has used for eons.
Snit
3/5/11 5:19 PM:
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 16:13:47 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>> * Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard offers
>> more choice than not allowing them to do so.
>
> YOU HAVE THE CHOICE TO INSTALL A CLIPBOARD MANAGER!
You are clearly getting angry (even yelling). Maybe you think your comment
is relevant to my point - or even think someone is disagreeing? Maybe you
can explain yourself.
Remember: the point is simple:
* Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
This is certainly not contrary to the idea that users can modify the
behavior to get more choices!
> You don't complain that you don't have EVERY choice in the default
> installation, do you?
>
>>> So what exactly is this "weakness"?
>> See: above you say no new info is added, but here you admit you do not
>> know what the info is.
>
> Rhetorical question, ever heard?
>
>> Below you go off topic, acting as if I was looking for a solution to the
>> problem on my installation - but being that I have never suggested that
>> I was looking for help on it and I made it clear I know about clipboard
>> managers, that is not really relevant.
>
> Then I will use one of your favorite words:
> If you don't like the default behaviour in Ubuntu you should chose to
> install a clipboard manager.
> Who has ever said that the default configuration would fit everyone's
> liking?
>
>> You denied I had posted about clipboard managers - though I had.
>> Repeatedly.
>
> Maybe I was a bit in rage. Sorry.
As I have noted, people in COLA get upset (even enraged) over the most
simple and non-offensive things, in this case merely noting that allowing
users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard offers more choice than
not allowing them to do so. Have you considered seeking assistance with
your anger management strategies?
>> Please support that they have the bug with copy and paste on purpose.
>
> But after reading this statement OVER AND OVER again I think it is
> understandable.
> Let me put it that way: They put up a new "guideline" how applications
> should behave BUT NOT EVERY SINGLE APPLICATION IN THE WORLD DOES IT YET.
And I noted that... which really upset some in COLA. Odd, eh? It is not
like I was making a big deal out of it... I merely noted what you agree is
the problem.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris
> So you claimed to kill file people
I don't think so.
> but yet you leave a thread "open"
> where we all get the "privilege" of having you reply to us.
I don't force you to use it. :)
But somehow it is working, isn't it?
Snit
3/5/11 5:21 PM:
> I think this thread does a good job being a QED.
I noted:
* Ubuntu does not have consistent behavior in its copying and pasting.
* Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
And you claimed this enraged you. RonB claimed it "aggravated" him. Other
advocates clearly share your weaknesses here. It is rather amazing, really,
and observing it is one of the things that keeps COLA interesting for me - I
am sincerely interested in understanding such poor emotional reactions.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
voodoo
> flatfish+++ stated in post d2kbq2ts361a$.10rv8jrk...@40tude.net on
> 3/5/11 4:24 PM:
>> It's truly amazing how bitter and nasty they are.
>
> Yes, it is.
yoo hoo, snit.
do you have One Shot One Kill kill-filed, or do you enjoy his posts?
how about Big Steel and the various forms of Clog_-_wog?
Snit
...
>>> Wait, you mean that without the clipboard manager you would not have
>>> access to this text? Did it get lost when you closed that app?
>>>
>
> *crickets*
Sorry, I thought you were being silly - I did not realize you really did not
know how copy and paste works.
Assuming just one clipboard, when you copy one thing, then copy another, the
original thing is lost (from the clipboard). So, yes, as I copied other
things I would have lost the original one.
No offense: it had not occurred to me that people in COLA would not
understand how copy and paste work.
...
>> I have merely been repeating non-offensive views. You went a bit off the
>> deep end with your copy/close/paste comments, hence why you never responded
>> when I noted how many other things are often done between copying and
>> pasting.
>
> You continue to do your retarded copy/close/paste, with your 8-button
> Rainman Mouse that doesn't even have an onboard cache, and the rest of
> the world will carry on with the standard, works-as-expected copy/paste
> procedure it has used for eons.
You are clearly quite confused. Remember, you are the one who talked about
copy/close/paste as the name of some common procedure. I was talking about
copy and paste - and have noted you can do *many* things between those two
events (even paste).
At least now I understand your frustration, you sincerely do not know how
copy and paste works. My apologies for not recognizing that earlier.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
3/5/11 5:40 PM:
There are many posts I ignore... I certainly do not approve of the name
calling, etc. on either "side".
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
flatfish+++
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 19:33:17 -0500 schrieb flatfish+++:
>
>> So you claimed to kill file people
>
> I don't think so.
Stop responding = effectively the same thing.
>> but yet you leave a thread "open"
>> where we all get the "privilege" of having you reply to us.
>
> I don't force you to use it. :)
>
> But somehow it is working, isn't it?
It's not working because we don't have people kill filed.
We respond first party and to everyone who posts.
IOW we are not afraid.
We don't hide.
We leave that to the Linux advocates.
It seems to be their method of choice.
Bury their head in the sand and pretend all the problems with Linux
don't exist.
voodoo
> IOW we are not afraid.
> We don't hide.
>
> We leave that to the Linux advocates. It seems to be their method of
> choice. Bury their head in the sand and pretend all the problems with
> Linux don't exist.
instead we should all bury our heads in the sand and pretend that
problems with ms-windows do not exist. yes, that will work out much
better for all of us.
flatfish+++
Tell it to a Microsoft group.
This group is a Linux advocacy group.
Although most will admit there is very little Linux advocacy happening
here.
DFS
>
> I will not respond to Snit, flatfish and DFS in any threads except this
> one anymore for obvious reasons:
>
> Snit is now going on to copypaste discussion style. From the quotes that
> were posted I assume he does this regularly.
> Flatfish doesn't seem to have much meaningful to say. So my answers are
> not meaningful too.
> DFS seems to talk 98% of his time about non-issues
Well of course they're non-issue for you. You're not one of the
brainless sheeple that has latched onto Ubuntu.
> and 2% of his time about Bugs from 2004.
Lie.
> I think most do it anyway but I want to ask the remaining people:
>
> Who is with me?
I'm with you. I'll only respond to you in this thread.
Chris
> I noted:
Do I have to correct you?
You _merely_ noted.
Chris
> You are clearly getting angry (even yelling). Maybe you think your
> comment is relevant to my point - or even think someone is disagreeing?
> Maybe you can explain yourself.
So why do you keep bringing up a non-issue and pretending it is an issue?
> Remember: the point is simple:
> * Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
> offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
> This is certainly not contrary to the idea that users can modify the
> behavior to get more choices!
So the whole thread doesn't make any sense. Yes.
> As I have noted, people in COLA get upset (even enraged) over the most
> simple and non-offensive things, in this case merely noting
Yes, you noted it.
And then you noted it.
And then you went on with noting it.
And then you merely noted it.
And after that you merely noted it.
Oh and then you merely noted it.
> It is
> not like I was making a big deal out of it... I merely noted
Just lol.
Please tell me you really are just trolling. Please.
Chris
> > and 2% of his time about Bugs from 2004.
>
> Lie.
Was I remembering it wrong? Is it from 2005?
Snit
3/5/11 6:39 PM:
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 17:37:59 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>> You are clearly getting angry (even yelling). Maybe you think your
>> comment is relevant to my point - or even think someone is disagreeing?
>> Maybe you can explain yourself.
>
> So why do you keep bringing up a non-issue and pretending it is an issue?
This is one of those "Why do you keep beating your wife" statements - you
are implying incorrect assumptions in your question.
>> Remember: the point is simple:
>> * Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
>> offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
>> This is certainly not contrary to the idea that users can modify the
>> behavior to get more choices!
>
> So the whole thread doesn't make any sense. Yes.
I can accept that, to you, my point does not make sense... when you learn a
bit more about copy and paste you might want to re-read it and see if you
understand better.
>> As I have noted, people in COLA get upset (even enraged) over the most
>> simple and non-offensive things, in this case merely noting
>
> Yes, you noted it.
> And then you noted it.
> And then you went on with noting it.
> And then you merely noted it.
> And after that you merely noted it.
> Oh and then you merely noted it.
I noted it. People responded. And I responded to them.
This is how conversations work.
>> It is
>> not like I was making a big deal out of it... I merely noted
>
> Just lol.
>
> Please tell me you really are just trolling. Please.
I am responding to those who are.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
3/5/11 6:33 PM:
Not sure what point you are trying to make.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
flatfish+++
Seems to be common with the Chris nym.
Very much like clue less voodoo.
Chris
>>> I noted:
>> Do I have to correct you?
>> You _merely_ noted.
> Not sure what point you are trying to make.
Give anyone the complete thread to read and then ask them if you _merely_
noted it.
By the way I didn't say I wouldn't _read_ your posts. Thus it is not "KF".
voodoo
> On 06 Mar 2011 01:28:02 GMT, voodoo wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2011 19:57:27 -0500, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>
>>
>>> IOW we are not afraid.
>>> We don't hide.
>>>
>>> We leave that to the Linux advocates. It seems to be their method of
>>> choice. Bury their head in the sand and pretend all the problems with
>>> Linux don't exist.
>>
>> instead we should all bury our heads in the sand and pretend that
>> problems with ms-windows do not exist. yes, that will work out much
>> better for all of us.
>
> Tell it to a Microsoft group.
but the windows advocacy group is _dead_. nobody is advocating windows
over there. you and your friends are doing that over here.
> This group is a Linux advocacy group.
>
> Although most will admit there is very little Linux advocacy happening
> here.
that is right. there should be more advocacy as practiced by these two.
someone named "Big Steel" and the followup by some dude with the label
"flatfish+++"
http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/ddec1f06872b21d6
Big Steel: "I'll tell what went wrong. The application as a whole is
slop."
flatfish+++: "Typical Linux SLOP WARE programming."
now there is advocacy of linux that everyone can admire.
Snit
3/5/11 7:22 PM:
I did not say you said you would KF me, but others have made that claim.
Not sure what your point is about my "merely" noting it. I noted it and
then responded to people who, frankly, were acting quite irrationally.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
flatfish+++
> On Sat, 05 Mar 2011 20:31:30 -0500, flatfish+++ wrote:
>
>> On 06 Mar 2011 01:28:02 GMT, voodoo wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2011 19:57:27 -0500, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> IOW we are not afraid.
>>>> We don't hide.
>>>>
>>>> We leave that to the Linux advocates. It seems to be their method of
>>>> choice. Bury their head in the sand and pretend all the problems with
>>>> Linux don't exist.
>>>
>>> instead we should all bury our heads in the sand and pretend that
>>> problems with ms-windows do not exist. yes, that will work out much
>>> better for all of us.
>>
>> Tell it to a Microsoft group.
>
> but the windows advocacy group is _dead_. nobody is advocating windows
> over there. you and your friends are doing that over here.
That's because unlike Linux they don't have to.
People are willing to shell out for Windows rather than settle for Linux
for free.
>> This group is a Linux advocacy group.
>>
>> Although most will admit there is very little Linux advocacy happening
>> here.
>
> that is right. there should be more advocacy as practiced by these two.
> someone named "Big Steel" and the followup by some dude with the label
> "flatfish+++"
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/ddec1f06872b21d6
>
> Big Steel: "I'll tell what went wrong. The application as a whole is
> slop."
>
> flatfish+++: "Typical Linux SLOP WARE programming."
>
> now there is advocacy of linux that everyone can admire.
Hey, Linux is mostly slop ware.
Prove me wrong.
Good luck.
You can start with how come the help systems are either non-existent or
miserable.
Chris
> You can start with how come the help systems are either non-existent or
> miserable.
man
Chris
> I think this thread does a good job being a QED.
Looks good to me so far:
http://ompldr.org/vN29tbw
:)
TomB
But of course you do approve of your own name calling and bullshit
assumptions, don't you?
Face it, Snit: you're nothing but a troll, desperate to call people
'wrong'. That seems to be your only purpose in here.
--
We should start referring to processes which run in the background by
their correct technical name... paenguins.
~ Kevin M. Bealer
TomB
>> $Provocative_Statement
>
> $Annoyed_Answer
$Stampede
;-)
--
Military justice is to justice what military music is to music.
~ Groucho Marx
TomB
>
> I admit, though, it is interesting to me to see how many lies and insults
> people will post when faced with minor usability issues and signs that the
> defaults on Linux do not offer as many choices as other options.
It has nothing to do with whatever issues are noted in GNU/Linux. It's
your annoying know-it-all attitude combined with the huge amounts of
repetition and your desperate need for attention that gets on 'our'
nerves. You're a troll, simple as that. You 'fish for replies'.
--
Age is not a particularly interesting subject. Anyone can get old.
All you have to do is live long enough.
~ Groucho Marx
Chris
> I mean, really, it is just bizarre how worked up over it they get. RonB
> says it "aggravates" him to even see such comments.
Do you really not recognize that you and your discussion style are the
problem and not the things you _merely_ note?
TomB
> 3/5/11 3:22 PM:
>
>> We now all know the default behaviour in the X clipboard.
>> Ubuntu / Gnome didn't like it.
>> They started to change applications so they have a persistent clipboard.
>> They are not done with all applications yet (will they ever?).
>>
>> So if you don't like that it doesn't work in _all_ applications you need
>> to install a clipboard manager.
>>
>> Clipboard managers were written _for the purpose_ of getting the
>> behaviour you want.
>
> <nothing>
>
The gist of your reply, the only thing really relevant and to the
point, and Snit ignores it. Why? It doesn't fit his trolling agenda.
Very good breakdown, by the way. What you say is exactly how it is.
But it will never happen that every single application available for
GNU/Linux will adapt the behaviour set by Gnome. The KDE team for
example has no desire at all to overrule the default X behaviour, and
instead uses the sensible solution of relying on a clipboard manager
(Klipper) by default. I wish Gnome would do the same, instead of
trying to fix a non-problem.
But - as I have noted many times before in these discussion - the
choice in F/OSS and GNU/Linux works both ways - from the user point of
view as well as from the developer point of view. And these interests
can conflict at times, resulting in 'issues' such as the behaviour
under discussion. It is a property of the environment. You either
embrace it or reject it. And with this being said, all future nagging
about 'issues' coming from this inherent property of the environment is
made unneccesary. This is known, and accepted as one of the
consequences of the utter freedom provided by the environment. Either
deal with it, or go away.
--
I'm not a bad guy! I work hard, and I love my kids. So why should
I spend half my Sunday hearing about how I'm going to Hell?
~ Homer J. Simpson
TomB
>
Actually, that accurately describes yourself.
--
Chuck Norris doesn't read books. He stares them down until he gets the
information he wants.
Peter Köhlmann
>
> You can start with how come the help systems are either non-existent or
> miserable.
In contrast to windows help?
Which is non-existant to shitty beyond belief?
--
The chief cause of problems is solutions
Big Steel
> flatfish+++ wrote:
>
>>
>> You can start with how come the help systems are either non-existent or
>> miserable.
>
> In contrast to windows help?
> Which is non-existant to shitty beyond belief?
total bullshit....
7
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 21:46:07 +0000 schrieb 7:
>
>> Best leave the drama out and focus on what you want others to hear from
>> you. Trolls adhere to a nasty training regime that focuses on personal
>> attacks and general trolling, screaming and shouting to get attention
>> with their sock puppets.
>
> I am also asking you. You sometimes copypaste a your messages as answers
> to them. In my opinion this doesn't make much sense. I suggest nothing
> but silence. These threads only grow so fast because people answer them.
A copy paste reply for a variant of a troll makes the trolls go mad.
All their efforts gone to dust.
Troll's can't afford copy paste, they get kill filed for being a troll.
> Focussing is not easy. They suck you in and your realize you keep posting
> and postng and waste your time when actually you have made your point
> hours ago.
Snit
1:38 AM:
Does not help with the GUI at all.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
> On 2011-03-06, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>> voodoo stated in post 4d72d7f2$0$32754$c3e8da3$40d4...@news.astraweb.com on
>> 3/5/11 5:40 PM:
>>
>>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2011 17:18:47 -0700, Snit wrote:
>>>
>>>> flatfish+++ stated in post d2kbq2ts361a$.10rv8jrk...@40tude.net on
>>>> 3/5/11 4:24 PM:
>>>
>>>
>>>>> It's truly amazing how bitter and nasty they are.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, it is.
>>>
>>> yoo hoo, snit.
>>>
>>> do you have One Shot One Kill kill-filed, or do you enjoy his posts?
>>> how about Big Steel and the various forms of Clog_-_wog?
>>
>> There are many posts I ignore... I certainly do not approve of the name
>> calling, etc. on either "side".
>
> But of course you do approve of your own name calling and bullshit
> assumptions, don't you?
>
> Face it, Snit: you're nothing but a troll, desperate to call people
> 'wrong'. That seems to be your only purpose in here.
I noted a couple of facts:
* Ubuntu has inconsistencies in how it handles copy and paste.
* Lacking the choice to quit an app before pasting reduces
choices compared with having that choice.
The first one was proved and you admitted you agree. The second is true by
definition. And yet you call me names, insist I am just looking to call
people wrong, etc. Seriously, when people cannot admit to such simple facts,
they *are* wrong. It is not like those are debatable points. These things
are black and white.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
> On 2011-03-05, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>>
>> I admit, though, it is interesting to me to see how many lies and insults
>> people will post when faced with minor usability issues and signs that the
>> defaults on Linux do not offer as many choices as other options.
>
> It has nothing to do with whatever issues are noted in GNU/Linux.
Sure it does. It is about that and *nothing* else. Remember, this whole
"incidence" is based on my noting to things which are obviously correct:
* Ubuntu has inconsistencies in how it handles copy and paste.
* Lacking the choice to quit an app before pasting reduces
choices compared with having that choice.
But because I do not blindly support the status quo, and instead support
recognition of issues and an increase in choice, you and others have made a
very big deal out of what is, really, not that big of an issue.
You are insecure in your support of OSS, and you tie too much of your self
worth to an OS.
> It's
> your annoying know-it-all attitude combined with the huge amounts of
> repetition and your desperate need for attention that gets on 'our'
> nerves. You're a troll, simple as that. You 'fish for replies'.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
2:19 AM:
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 16:18:04 -0700 schrieb Snit:
I do not respond in kind... the "advocates" call me names and make up stores
about me and clearly try to get me as upset as they are... they want me to
sink to their level. It is upsetting to them when I do not (or, at least,
rarely do).
The real issue is I pointed out things about OSS which do not support the
status quo.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris Ahlstrom
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 15:40:03 -0500 schrieb Chris Ahlstrom:
>
>> Preachin' to the choir, man.
>>
>> Even in the kill file they keep trying to reach out to me.
>
> But I mean not virtually everyone but literally everyone should stop. :)
>
> Let's see if they keep posting when they only respond to each other.
If that's all that happens, then I'll never have to read the
drivel posted by these sick fsckers.
--
- long f_ffree; /* free file nodes in fs */
+ long f_ffree; /* freie Dateiknoten im Dateisystem */
-- Seen in a translation
Snit
> On 2011-03-05, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>> Chris stated in post ikud2e$skm$2...@inf2.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de on
>> 3/5/11 3:22 PM:
>>
>>> We now all know the default behaviour in the X clipboard.
>>> Ubuntu / Gnome didn't like it.
>>> They started to change applications so they have a persistent clipboard.
>>> They are not done with all applications yet (will they ever?).
>>>
>>> So if you don't like that it doesn't work in _all_ applications you need
>>> to install a clipboard manager.
>>>
>>> Clipboard managers were written _for the purpose_ of getting the
>>> behaviour you want.
>>
>> <nothing>
>>
>
> The gist of your reply,
Was this... but you snipped it and ran from it:
-----
Right: people are lying about me and my views and I am letting it
be known what my views actually are. For some strange reason it
interests me to see how many lies people will tell, simply because
I am noting two simple and non-offensive facts:
* Ubuntu has a flaw in the way copy and paste is handled.
* Allowing users to quit a program and not lose the clipboard
offers more choice than not allowing them to do so.
More details, of course, have been provided repeatedly.
-----
> the only thing really relevant and to the
> point, and Snit ignores it. Why? It doesn't fit his trolling agenda.
Again: I am noting *facts*. His comment does not alter those *facts*.
This does not fit your blind support of the status quo, so you call me names
and make up stories about me. And then repeat things which are not in
question. It is irrational of you.
> Very good breakdown, by the way. What you say is exactly how it is.
> But it will never happen that every single application available for
> GNU/Linux will adapt the behaviour set by Gnome. The KDE team for
> example has no desire at all to overrule the default X behaviour, and
> instead uses the sensible solution of relying on a clipboard manager
> (Klipper) by default. I wish Gnome would do the same, instead of
> trying to fix a non-problem.
You have already admitted that the problem I note in Ubuntu exists - and you
imply it above.
> But - as I have noted many times before in these discussion - the
> choice in F/OSS and GNU/Linux works both ways - from the user point of
> view as well as from the developer point of view. And these interests
> can conflict at times, resulting in 'issues' such as the behaviour
> under discussion.
Right: and the fact that the system is not user-focused is a weakness for
the user. Obviously.
> It is a property of the environment. You either embrace it or reject it.
I embrace it ... but do not blindly accept the status quo. I acknowledge
the areas where it is weak.
Slightly off topic, but a good example of my support of Linux: just
yesterday a friend of mind from out of state and I were talking and he told
me his notebook computer (running windows) was hosed - viruses. He is
fairly knowledgeable but cannot fix it. And he has data he would like to
save (though nothing he *must* save... still, he does not want to lose pics
and the like).
He will be sending the computer to me - I will do what I can to save his
data and then will be putting Ubuntu (or maybe Mint) on it for him - and
then send it back. For his computing needs, mostly web surfing and other
fairly basic tasks, Linux will likely serve him better than Windows and I
suggested he use it and will even install it for him.
This is advocacy. I did not lie to him about Linux. I did not deny its
weaknesses (we even talked about them some). We also talked about its
benefits (almost no risk of malware, the repositories, etc.) He is now
excited to make the switch.
> And with this being said, all future nagging about 'issues' coming from this
> inherent property of the environment is made unneccesary. This is known, and
> accepted as one of the consequences of the utter freedom provided by the
> environment. Either deal with it, or go away.
Remember, I have been very clear that the problem I noted is not a show
stopper - but you are trying to push the idea that if someone talks about
and recognizes such weaknesses it *should* be seen as a show stopper... they
should "go away". I encourage people to use Linux - warts and all - if it
will serve them better. You push people away and tell them not to use it.
You and other "advocates" have made a *huge deal* out of what is, really, a
rather small weakness (but a weakness nonetheless).
Who is the real Linux advocate: me who gets people who know little of Linux
to try it - or folks like you who tell them to "go away"?
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
> On 2011-03-05, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>>
>> Many of the "advocates" are "ripping me apart" in there minds
>
> Actually, that accurately describes yourself.
Please, before you post try to think if you have something to say of value.
It will make your posts more interesting.
Thanks!
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris Ahlstrom
> On 2011-03-05, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>>
>> Many of the "advocates" are "ripping me apart" in there minds
>
> Actually, that accurately describes yourself.
Actually, many of the advocates are sick to death of Snit's never-ending
puerile blather about trivialities. The occasional reasonable conversations
are too few and far between. At least he doesn't seem to use "turd",
"suck", and "vermin" much.
--
A year spent in artificial intelligence is enough to make one believe in God.
Chris Ahlstrom
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 17:37:59 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
> <who cares? it's trolling>
>
> Please tell me you really are just trolling. Please.
So much for your plea.
--
To use violence is to already be defeated.
-- Chinese proverb
Chris Ahlstrom
> Am Sat, 05 Mar 2011 22:02:34 -0500 schrieb flatfish+++:
And so the trolling continues.
There is no good general help system on Linux or on Windows. By that I mean
they both have good help infrastructures (man, info, html on Linux, chm on
Windows), but the level of help differs widely between applications.
One often has to rely on Google or MSDN for adequate help.
One interesting note is how often you can find complete, free books on GNU
software, because the texinfo format is designed to be comverted to a number
of printed (as well as online) formats. And you can buy hardbound copies of
manual from GNU Press, a nice way of donating to the cause.
--
_-^--^=-_
_.-^^ -~_
_-- --_
< >)
| |
\._ _./
```--. . , ; .--'''
| | |
.-=|| | |=-.
`-=#$%&%$#=-'
| ; :|
_____.,-#%&$@%#&#~,._____
Snit
3/6/11 7:01 AM:
> TomB wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> On 2011-03-05, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>>>
>>> Many of the "advocates" are "ripping me apart" in there minds
>>
>> Actually, that accurately describes yourself.
>
> Actually, many of the advocates are sick to death of Snit's never-ending
> puerile blather about trivialities.
If the problem I noted is so trivial to the "advocates", then why are they
making such a big deal out of it?
I am the one who was clear it was not a show stopper.
> The occasional reasonable conversations
> are too few and far between. At least he doesn't seem to use "turd",
> "suck", and "vermin" much.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris
> But because I do not blindly support the status quo, and instead support
> recognition of issues and an increase in choice
And as we repeat: You don't need to increase choice. You already have the
choice to install a clipboard manager.
> , you and others have
> made a very big deal out of what is, really, not that big of an issue.
So let's do a survey who has caused it to be a big issue?
> You are insecure in your support of OSS,
Yes, just make things up that others may find insulting. Keep doing it,
no problem.
Maybe we should do it too.
You are insecure in your support of Windows/Mac OS whatever therefore you
need to install Open Source software for the sole purpose of looking for
things with what you can confirm your belief that it is inferior.
TomB
Consider the advice returned.
--
I wanna, I wanna, I wanna, I wanna, I wanna really
really really wanna zigazig ha.
~ The Spice Girls
Snit
7:33 AM:
> Am Sun, 06 Mar 2011 06:40:22 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>> But because I do not blindly support the status quo, and instead support
>> recognition of issues and an increase in choice
>
> And as we repeat: You don't need to increase choice. You already have the
> choice to install a clipboard manager.
I understand your desire to change the topic, but I will ask you to focus on
it.
If you have two options: one that has more choices than the other, which do
you think should be the *default* for an OS - the option that offers users
more choice or the option that reduces choice?
I think it makes more sense to have, by default, the option that offers more
choice.
Choice is good.
>> , you and others have
>> made a very big deal out of what is, really, not that big of an issue.
>
> So let's do a survey who has caused it to be a big issue?
A survey? What? Gee: we have a herd of advocates who walk almost in
lock-step to support the status quo and lash out at those who do not. Gee,
who will they claim is the cause of their little freakout here? Hmmmm...
Really: a "survey" - you think a survey will get the "advocates" to give up
their desire to lie about those who are honest about Linux. Pleeeeease.
That is not going to happen.
>> You are insecure in your support of OSS,
>
> Yes, just make things up that others may find insulting. Keep doing it,
> no problem.
> Maybe we should do it too.
It is simply a fact that I noted a weakness of Linux (and noted it was not a
show stopper) and a number of Linux "advocates" freaked out over it. If you
have a better explanation of their irrational behavior I would love to hear
it.
> You are insecure in your support of Windows/Mac OS whatever therefore you
> need to install Open Source software for the sole purpose of looking for
> things with what you can confirm your belief that it is inferior.
Huh? As I posted earlier to day, just yesterday I worked with someone to
convert them to Linux (either Ubuntu or Mint, I have not decided what to
install yet). So your claim is clearly irrational - it does not fit the
facts.
My claims fit the facts. Perfectly. And no logical alternate explanation
has been offered.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Snit
> On 2011-03-06, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>> TomB stated in post 201103061...@usenet.drumscum.be on 3/6/11 2:41 AM:
>>
>>> On 2011-03-05, the following emerged from the brain of Snit:
>>>>
>>>> Many of the "advocates" are "ripping me apart" in there minds
>>>
>>> Actually, that accurately describes yourself.
>>
>> Please, before you post try to think if you have something to say of value.
>> It will make your posts more interesting.
>
> Consider the advice returned.
Sigh: you are just in a mood these days. Really: why are you and other
"advocates" so worked up over my lack of blind support for the status quo?
Keep in mind, I have not said a thing about OSS not being of value - and
even noted how I got a friend to agree to switch to Linux just yesterday.
While I am honest about Linux and advocate it, you and your "advocate"
friends lash out at those who speak honestly about the pros and cons of
Linux.
I wish the "advocates" would advocate Linux more and lash out at people who
speak honestly about Linux less. Granted: I do enjoy watching you and other
"advocates" act as you do - it is an interesting example of group-think and
irrationality - but I would prefer if you could instead actually advocate
Linux.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
TomB
> Am Sun, 06 Mar 2011 06:40:22 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>> But because I do not blindly support the status quo, and instead
>> support recognition of issues and an increase in choice
>
> And as we repeat: You don't need to increase choice. You already
> have the choice to install a clipboard manager.
He doesn't *want* to understand that. It would take away his trolling
ammo.
>> , you and others have made a very big deal out of what is, really,
>> not that big of an issue.
>
> So let's do a survey who has caused it to be a big issue?
Snit of course. He brought up this 'issue' so many times I lost count.
And the reason why he brought it up this time (to prove that the
'advocates' were wrong to say that the non-persistent clipboard is
behaviour to be expected) was not justified at all.
>> You are insecure in your support of OSS,
>
> Yes, just make things up that others may find insulting. Keep doing
> it, no problem.
Typical trolling.
And in saying that, he simply lies.
> Maybe we should do it too.
>
> You are insecure in your support of Windows/Mac OS whatever
> therefore you need to install Open Source software for the sole
> purpose of looking for things with what you can confirm your belief
> that it is inferior.
Yup, that must be it. Say Snit, why are you so insecure in your
support of OSX?
--
I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought,
but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones.
~ Albert Einstein
Snit
> On 2011-03-06, the following emerged from the brain of Chris:
>> Am Sun, 06 Mar 2011 06:40:22 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>>
>>> But because I do not blindly support the status quo, and instead
>>> support recognition of issues and an increase in choice
>>
>> And as we repeat: You don't need to increase choice. You already
>> have the choice to install a clipboard manager.
>
> He doesn't *want* to understand that. It would take away his trolling
> ammo.
I have repeatedly acknowledged and talked about clipboard managers - heck, I
have even talked about my own use of them.
You, dishonestly, are claiming I do not understand that people can install
clipboard managers and are further belittling me.
All because I noted a weakness of default Ubuntu and acknowledged that when
you have two options differentiated by one allowing a choice the first does
not, then the one that offers the added choice offers more choices.
This so upsetting to you that you feel the need to belittle me and lie about
me. This speaks very, very poorly of you.
>>> , you and others have made a very big deal out of what is, really,
>>> not that big of an issue.
>>
>> So let's do a survey who has caused it to be a big issue?
>
> Snit of course. He brought up this 'issue' so many times I lost count.
> And the reason why he brought it up this time (to prove that the
> 'advocates' were wrong to say that the non-persistent clipboard is
> behaviour to be expected) was not justified at all.
On Ubuntu that behavior is not to be expected - or if it is, the
expectations would be quickly ripped apart. As I have proved.
Sad how you know less about Ubuntu than I do (at least in this case), given
that you claim to be an "advocate" and accuse me of being a troll.
>>> You are insecure in your support of OSS,
>>
>> Yes, just make things up that others may find insulting. Keep doing
>> it, no problem.
>
> Typical trolling.
>
> And in saying that, he simply lies.
As I noted: you and others are "insulted" by facts I note about Ubuntu. You
claim I make these facts up, but these facts are obviously true. There is
no reasonable counter to the facts I note. I cannot imagine being so
blindly tied to an OS that I would be insulted by someone speaking honestly
about it. It is intriguing to me to watch you and others get so caught up
over this.
>> Maybe we should do it too.
>>
>> You are insecure in your support of Windows/Mac OS whatever
>> therefore you need to install Open Source software for the sole
>> purpose of looking for things with what you can confirm your belief
>> that it is inferior.
>
> Yup, that must be it. Say Snit, why are you so insecure in your
> support of OSX?
See: you just make things up. I have never done as you do, shown offense at
someone being honest about OS X (or any OS). In fact, I have repeatedly
pointed out areas of weakness with it: its lack of consistency on closing
apps when you close a final window, lack of resize from any edge, lack of
real maximize, etc.
I simply do not display the types of insecurity you and others do -
certainly not over my OS of choice. But I can understand why it is
bothersome to you for me to point out your obvious insecurity and your
desire to try to turn that around. It is a common defense mechanism... not
unexpected at all.
Interesting to watch though.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
Chris Ahlstrom
> Am Sun, 06 Mar 2011 06:40:22 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>
>> You are insecure in your support ...
Troll sign, pure and simple.
> Yes, just make things up that others may find insulting. Keep doing it, no
> problem. Maybe we should do it too.
Back atcha:
> You are insecure in your support of Windows/Mac OS whatever therefore you
> need to install Open Source software for the sole purpose of looking for
> things with what you can confirm your belief that it is inferior.
--
When it comes to broken marriages most husbands will split the blame --
half his wife's fault, and half her mother's.
Snit
3/6/11 8:33 AM:
> Chris wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties:
>
>> Am Sun, 06 Mar 2011 06:40:22 -0700 schrieb Snit:
>>
>>> You are insecure in your support ...
>
> Troll sign, pure and simple.
I am open to other ideas: but here are the facts.
1) I noted a couple of facts, one about a weakness of Ubuntu and another
about how one of two options offers more choice.
2) In reaction, several "advocates" lied about me, about what I know or do
not know, and otherwise lashed out. Some even noted how they were enraged
and agitated by my merely noting these non-offensive facts about OSS.
If you have an alternate explanation that fits the facts as well I would
love to hear it. Sincerely.
>> Yes, just make things up that others may find insulting. Keep doing it, no
>> problem. Maybe we should do it too.
>
> Back atcha:
And that is what that comment is about: there is no other reasonable
explanation for the anger the "advocates" have shown, so they dodge the
issue and accuse me of things for which they have no support. It is an
interesting study.
>> You are insecure in your support of Windows/Mac OS whatever therefore you
>> need to install Open Source software for the sole purpose of looking for
>> things with what you can confirm your belief that it is inferior.
--
[INSERT .SIG HERE]
voodoo
> On 06 Mar 2011 02:38:53 GMT, voodoo wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2011 20:31:30 -0500, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>
>>> On 06 Mar 2011 01:28:02 GMT, voodoo wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 05 Mar 2011 19:57:27 -0500, flatfish+++ wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> IOW we are not afraid.
>>>>> We don't hide.
>>>>>
>>>>> We leave that to the Linux advocates. It seems to be their method of
>>>>> choice. Bury their head in the sand and pretend all the problems
>>>>> with Linux don't exist.
>>>>
>>>> instead we should all bury our heads in the sand and pretend that
>>>> problems with ms-windows do not exist. yes, that will work out much
>>>> better for all of us.
>>>
>>> Tell it to a Microsoft group.
>>
>> but the windows advocacy group is _dead_. nobody is advocating windows
>> over there. you and your friends are doing that over here.
>
> That's because unlike Linux they don't have to.
oh i like that fantasy.
no advocacy == no future
you can see that in the mobile phone market.
> People are willing to shell out for Windows rather than settle for Linux
> for free.
yes. only freaks would not want to expose themselves to a few hundred
thousand viruses. windows is worth every penny. yup.
>>> This group is a Linux advocacy group.
>>>
>>> Although most will admit there is very little Linux advocacy happening
>>> here.
>>
>> that is right. there should be more advocacy as practiced by these two.
>> someone named "Big Steel" and the followup by some dude with the label
>> "flatfish+++"
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.advocacy/msg/
ddec1f06872b21d6
>>
>> Big Steel: "I'll tell what went wrong. The application as a whole is
>> slop."
>>
>> flatfish+++: "Typical Linux SLOP WARE programming."
>>
>> now there is advocacy of linux that everyone can admire.
>
> Hey, Linux is mostly slop ware.
that is because the professional grade malware is written for windows.
linux gets the leavings.
> Prove me wrong.
> Prove me wrong.
> Prove me wrong.
> Prove me wrong.
> Good luck.
>
> You can start with how come the help systems are either non-existent or
> miserable.
what help method in windows will help my friend with the disappearing SD
devices when he plugs in a card with huge files?
i know! he can call the help desk for this:
1) reboot
2) power cycle
3) reinstall
voodoo
you are right big steel, its uselessness is not beyond belief.
TomB
>
>>>>> Many of the "advocates" are "ripping me apart" in there minds
>>>>
>>>> Actually, that accurately describes yourself.
>>>
>>> Please, before you post try to think if you have something to say
>>> of value. It will make your posts more interesting.
>>
>> Consider the advice returned.
>
> Sigh: you are just in a mood these days. Really: why are you and
> other "advocates" so worked up over my lack of blind support for the
> status quo?
Is this 'status quo' thing going to be one of your new mantras? If so,
be aware that I am not supporting any status quo at all. Each and
everytime you claim that I do, you will be telling a lie.
TomB
>>> RonB says it "aggravates" him to even see such comments.
>>
>> Do you really not recognize that you and your discussion style are
>> the problem and not the things you _merely_ note?
>
> I do not respond in kind... the "advocates" call me names and make
That's exactly what *you* do. In this thread alone you have claimed
that
* I call support of choice nonsense I have /blind/ support for some
* 'status quo' (whatever that means)
In the process you have called me unreasonable and have accused me of
being insecure.
And those are things you are doing *all the time*. It's trolling.
Plain and simple.
--
The only "intuitive" interface is the nipple. After that, it's all
learned.
~ Bruce Ediger