Find 815 ARG - Oceanic Billboards
tdciago
In Tustin, CA - "Discover the mysteries of Berlin." (Picture of
Berlin
Cathedral & statue of "Battle with the Lion")
http://bp1.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R3yOY6PcwhI/AAAAAAAAP9I/9M6aOyJ11gA/s1600-h/oceanic-tustin-hires-1.jpg
In Ames, Iowa - "Lose yourself in London." (Big Ben shows 8:15)
http://bp2.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R30q_6PcwuI/AAAAAAAAP-w/fKfY_weMmIw/s1600-h/IMG_9215.JPG
In New York City - "Lose yourself in London." (Big Ben shows 8:15)
http://bp2.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R32Bu6PcxAI/AAAAAAAAQBA/hvqtT8XkFWc/s1600-h/billny.jpg
In Los Angeles - "The adventure begins here." (Picture of Sydney,
Australia)
http://bp2.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R32H-6PcxBI/AAAAAAAAQBI/ctg0XlodOjU/s1600-h/oceanic-LA.jpg
In Knoxville, TN - (Slogan not confirmed yet. Picture shows L.A.)
http://bp1.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R32BuqPcw_I/AAAAAAAAQA4/vgxW0FtigWQ/s1600-h/Lost-Knoxville1.jpg
Each billboard displays the slogan "Oceanic Airlines: Your ultimate
destination," which seems, IMO, to imply the afterlife.
SPECULATION:
It looks like this ARG will conclude (2 hours before the season 4
premiere) with the discovery of the 815 wreckage and bodies in the
Sunda Trench. The shocker will likely be the date of the discovery,
probably sometime in 2006 or early 2007. That will lead to the
revelation that time on the island moves more slowly than time in the
outside world, since Naomi and Cooper already knew about the
wreckage. It will also pose the dilemma of how the Losties can be
alive on an island in the Pacific, and simultaneously dead at the
bottom of the Indian Ocean.
I wonder if the flight path from Sydney to L.A. (6 hours out) is a
mirror image of the flight path from Sydney to the wreckage location
in the Sunda Trench.
http://bp1.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R3vjUKPcwTI/AAAAAAAAP7Y/6T1ep_hLJyI/s1600-h/2142670087_8f475dcaff.jpg
tdciago
> In Knoxville, TN - (Slogan not confirmed yet. �Picture shows L.A.)http://bp1.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/R32BuqPcw_I/AAAAAAAAQA4/vgxW0Ftig...
It reads: "Find your way back to LA."
Joseph Donovan
>
> SPECULATION:
> It looks like this ARG will conclude (2 hours before the season 4
> premiere) with the discovery of the 815 wreckage and bodies in the
> Sunda Trench. The shocker will likely be the date of the discovery,
> probably sometime in 2006 or early 2007. That will lead to the
> revelation that time on the island moves more slowly than time in the
> outside world, since Naomi and Cooper already knew about the
> wreckage. It will also pose the dilemma of how the Losties can be
> alive on an island in the Pacific, and simultaneously dead at the
> bottom of the Indian Ocean.
>
> I wonder if the flight path from Sydney to L.A. (6 hours out) is a
> mirror image of the flight path from Sydney to the wreckage location
> in the Sunda Trench.
Local Time Dilation? Do you suppose that Sam will get his job back from a
grateful Oceanic, once he promises not to do anymore illicit hacking?
J Donovan
tdciago
> Local Time Dilation? �Do you suppose that Sam will get his job back from a
> grateful Oceanic, once he promises not to do anymore illicit hacking?
I don't know. How grateful will Oceanic be to hear that their plane
and 324 dead bodies were found at the bottom of the Indian Ocean,
completely off course from the flight plan?
:)
There is now a full recap of the billboards found so far, at
http://find815.blogspot.com/2008/01/oceanic-air-billboards-recap.html
. The one in Portland reads: "A new life awaits you in Seoul."
Oddly, the one in Sydney simply reads: "Fly to L.A."
So you start your adventure from Down Under (hell?) and find your way
back to the City of Angels (heaven?), and there is a new life awaiting
you in your Seoul (soul).
tenworld
> On Jan 4, 3:03�am, "Joseph Donovan" <bayne...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
>
> > Local Time Dilation? �Do you suppose that Sam will get his job back from a
> > grateful Oceanic, once he promises not to do anymore illicit hacking?
>
> I don't know. How grateful will Oceanic be to hear that their plane
> and 324 dead bodies were found at the bottom of the Indian Ocean,
> completely off course from the flight plan?
> :)
>
> . The one in Portland reads: "A new life awaits you in Seoul."
> Oddly, the one in Sydney simply reads: "Fly to L.A."
>
> So you start your adventure from Down Under (hell?) and find your way
> back to the City of Angels (heaven?), and there is a new life awaiting
> you in your Seoul (soul).
to find your Ames(aim) in life after living through the school of hard
knocks(Knoxville)?
tdciago
> alive on an island in the Pacific, and simultaneously dead at the
> bottom of the Indian Ocean.
Talk about having an evil twin! Can a dead Lostie coincide with its
live Lostie counterpart? Can one be superimposed on the other?
I think it might be worth another look at a thread I started back in
July of 2007, called "Good Vibrations, Wormholes, and the Casimir
Effect":
http://groups.google.co.bw/group/alt.tv.lost/browse_thread/thread/aff457f0fad1a0ed
Some possibilities to consider:
Alice Universe
"In theoretical physics, an Alice universe is a hypothetical universe
with no global definition of charge. What a Klein bottle is to a
closed two-dimensional surface, an Alice universe is to a closed three-
dimensional volume. The name is a reference to the character in Lewis
Carroll's children's book, Alice Through the Looking-Glass.
An Alice universe can be considered to allow at least two
topologically-distinct routes between any two points (it is doubly
connected), and if one connection (or 'handle') is declared to be a
'conventional' spatial connection, at least one other must be deemed
to be a non-orientable wormhole connection.
Once these two connections are made, we can no longer define whether a
given particle is matter or antimatter. A particle might appear as an
electron when viewed along one route, and as a positron when viewed
along the other. If we define a reference charge as nominally positive
and bring it alongside our 'undefined charge' particle, the two
particles may attract if brought together along one route, and repel
if brought together along another - the Alice universe loses the
ability to distinguish between positive and negative charges, except
locally."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_universe
From the same page, there is a mention of chirality:
"In wormhole theory, a non-orientable wormhole is a wormhole
connection that appears to reverse the chirality of anything passed
through it."
And from http://www.flatrock.org.nz/topics/science/creation_could_be_left_handed.htm
:
Whatever the right hand findeth to do, the left hand carries a watch
on its wrist to show how long it takes to do it.
- Ralph W Sockman
Describing Chirality
Kelvin's Definition
"I call any geometrical figure, or group of points, chiral, and say it
has chirality, if its image in a plane mirror, ideally realised,
cannot be brought to coincide with itself."
This is the celebrated definition stated by Lord Kelvin in 1904, in
his Baltimore Lectures on Molecular Dynamics and the Wave Theory of
Light. This statement is universally accepted as the definition of
chirality. Equivalent statements simply transpose Kelvin's definition
in other contexts, such as symmetry groups.
Chirality is a dichotomous property
The word "chiral" comes from the ancient Greek "cheir" which means
"hand". The definition of chirality is something which has a mirror
image, but cannot be superimposed. These two mirror images are known
as "enantiomers". They are, unsurprisingly, left and right
"handed".
________________________
I have previously theorized that Christian Shephard represents the
mythological figure of Chiron the centaur. The name Chiron also is
derived from the Greek word for "hand," as is the English word
"surgeon."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chiron
thinbluemime
Ok, I am confused and befuddled. I understand a Mobius strip. I have to
have a clear picture, some point of reference in my world, to grasp the
theoretical concepts. I need it relatively simple.
A multi dimensional universe was once explained, by stepping down from a 3
dimensional world we are accustomed to, to a 2 dimensional world, like
stick figures on paper. An object passing thru a 2 dimensional world,
would appear to come from no where, disappear into nowhere and leave a
whole in the 2 dimensional paper world. The passing 3 dimensional object,
through the 2 dimensional world would not be fully seen at one time,
because of the limitation of the people's sight in that 2 dimensional
world.
Like I said, I am not clear on how Dead Jack, and Live Jack could coexist
in the same dimension.
But I want to believe :)
Got any pictures for this visually dependent, conceptionally impaired
Lost Fan?
Johnn...@webtv.net
>
>I wonder if the flight path from Sydney to L.A.
> (6 hours out) is a mirror image of the flight
> path from Sydney to the wreckage location in
> the Sunda Trench.
>
moment they departed Sydney. ...This wouldn't make sense. ..After all,
the weird aspects of the flight started when they entered the island's
airspace -- (such as the losties surviving an unsurvivable jet crash).
I think the jet that crashed near Bali -- if indeed it did crash -- was
a flight "specifically" heading in that N-Westerly direction.
Thus, either Naomi is lying, or outside of the island's bubble is an
entirely different reality. I'm opting for the latter; it would fit in
with what Ms. Hawkings told Desmond. ...Jon
tdciago
> This would imply that the problems in the flight started right from the
> moment they departed Sydney. �...This wouldn't make sense. �..After all,
> the weird aspects of the flight started when they entered the island's
> airspace -- (such as the losties surviving an unsurvivable jet crash).
Yes, it may be that mirror image flight paths, if they indeed exist,
originate from the point at which the "incident" occurred. One path
would continue NE toward L.A., and the other would go NW, toward Bali.
tdciago
> Like I said, I am not clear on how Dead Jack, and Live Jack could coexist �
> in the same dimension.
> But I want to believe :)
>
> Got any pictures for this visually dependent, conceptionally impaired �
> Lost Fan?
I find the whole concept of the Alice Universe extremely confusing,
too. But I can see how the concept of chirality, or handedness, might
work. Dead Jack and Live Jack are chiral mirror images of each other,
like our left and right hands. If you lay one on top of the other,
facing the same direction, they don't match up. They're both Jack,
but not exactly the *same* Jack. But in an Alice Universe, the two
Jacks (matter and antimatter) are indistinguishable from each other.
-------------------------------------------
"When looking at an object (like the girl Alice in Through the Looking
Glass) and its mirror image, you may be unable to distinguish between
the original and its reflection....The two sides of the mirror...are
indistinguishable, or 'symmetric'.
Changes we can make that don't affect our observations of an object
are called symmetries of the object, and they constitute its symmetry
group. For instance, swapping Alice with her reflection is an element
of the symmetry group of Alice's universe...
In the study of orbifolds, identify ourselves with the image we see
behind the looking glass -- we stop distinguishing between the two
'different' copies of ourselves. The mirror halves the world (if we
extend it indefinitely in every direction), equating each point on one
side with a point on the other. We only need to understand one half."
http://www.geom.uiuc.edu/education/math5337/Orbifolds/introduction.html
So maybe we only need to understand Live Jack. ;)
Anyway, I think the producers have certainly dropped plenty of hints
about Alice and rabbits and holes (oh my!). As for chirality, there's
Montand, Ray Mullen, and Marvin Candle.
S1E3 Ray: I'm a lefty.
Johnn...@webtv.net
>
>Yes, it may be that mirror image flight paths, if
> they indeed exist, originate from the point at
> which the "incident" occurred. One path would
> continue NE toward L.A., and the other would
> go NW, toward Bali.
>
the scene of Penny and Desmond fumbling with his tie in the mirror, just
after Desmond woke up in the past.
But anyways... Let's say a mirror image was created when the jet
contacted the island's barrier. ...Would this cause the mirror image
pilot to fly the jet towards Bali? Doesn't make sense. ...Even if his
radios and compass was haywire, he could still do a rough estimate of
direction via the sun (or stars) ...Jon
thinbluemime
> On Jan 4, 7:31�pm, thinbluemime <thinbluem...@tbm.com> wrote:
>> Like I said, I am not clear on how Dead Jack, and Live Jack could
>> coexist �
>> in the same dimension.
>> But I want to believe :)
>>
>> Got any pictures for this visually dependent, conceptionally impaired �
>> Lost Fan?
>
> I find the whole concept of the Alice Universe extremely confusing,
> too. But I can see how the concept of chirality, or handedness, might
> work. Dead Jack and Live Jack are chiral mirror images of each other,
> like our left and right hands. If you lay one on top of the other,
> facing the same direction, they don't match up. They're both Jack,
> but not exactly the *same* Jack. But in an Alice Universe, the two
> Jacks (matter and antimatter) are indistinguishable from each other.
The 'Jack In A Mirror' concept just jogged my memory. In season 2, after
Anna and Libby are shot, Jack goes into the Swan Bunker bathroom to wash
up and regain his composure. Do you remember this scene? He looks into the
mirror but just before he does, he shifts his weight from one foot to the
other, adjusting the contents in his medical bag.
At the time, I capped that episode, it bugged the heck out of me. It just
didnt seem right, So much so, I clipped that small video section, posted
it, and we discussed it at some length.
At the time, I thought Jack's mirror image, did not exactly mirror Jack's
actual movements.
Much later, when cleaning the server for storage space, I removed the
video file. I know I have it archived somewhere, Oh lordy...the archival
mess..
But in the meantime, a review of that episode on DVD may be enough.
Interesting concept tdciago!!
thinbluemime
> tdc...@aol.com (tdciago) wrote:
>>
>> Yes, it may be that mirror image flight paths, if
>> they indeed exist, originate from the point at
>> which the "incident" occurred. One path would
>> continue NE toward L.A., and the other would
>> go NW, toward Bali.
>>
> Every time you mention the mirror image, I can't help thinking back to
> the scene of Penny and Desmond fumbling with his tie in the mirror, just
> after Desmond woke up in the past.
>
Ding Dang...again a memory jog.....The scene you mention Jon was also
peculiar. Penny and Desmond at the mirror tieing Desmonds tie.
I am recalling from memory, without reviewing the ep for this posting.
The mirror reflection has a 'red' object. At the time of the episode I
looked all around the room and could not find this mirrored red object.
No, it's not the partially painted red wall, where Desmond took a fall.
The red object appears in the furthest right mirror pane, when facing it
as Penny and Daesmond did. The mirror object seems to be on the
dresser/vanity/table , behind and to Desmonds left.
thinbluemime
wrote:
Here is the link to the discussion after "?" Season 2 Episode 21
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.tv.lost/msg/d562f7170b6cfcf1
To keep the URL's short and neat, this is only the link to the original
thread post. To see the full discussion, click on "Message from discussion
Jack's Mirror Image" to expand the thread.
(again, the flash video is gone, I will hunt for it :( )
thinbluemime
wrote:
> Here is the link to the discussion after "?" Season 2 Episode 21
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.tv.lost/msg/d562f7170b6cfcf1
>
> To keep the URL's short and neat, this is only the link to the original
> thread post. To see the full discussion, click on "Message from
> discussion Jack's Mirror Image" to expand the thread.
>
> (again, the flash video is gone, I will hunt for it :( )
>
>
I found it. Let the video fully load, and then stare at Jack's reflection
in the mirror, keeping Jack in your peripheral vision.
The 2 movements still, after a year and a half of the original post, do
not seem to match.
http://www.lostdude.com/lostflash/jackmirror6/jackmirror6.html
tdciago
> But anyways... Let's say a mirror image was created when the jet
> contacted the island's barrier. �...Would this cause the mirror image
> pilot to fly the jet towards Bali? �Doesn't make sense. ...Even if his
> radios and compass was haywire, he could still do a rough estimate of
If we assume that there's a wormhole involved, passing through the
mirror (the island without the button being pressed?) could have
instantly transported the plane to the Sunda Trench. The web page I
quoted previously states, "The mirror halves the world (if we extend
it indefinitely in every direction), equating each point on one side
with a point on the other." In such a scenario, the Sunda Trench
location would be the island's equivalent point. It's the other end
of the wormhole.
I don't think the plane was ever intentionally flown toward Bali, not
even in an alternate reality. The hijacking scenario would only be a
cover-up that would explain the location of the wreckage to the rest
of the world.
Johnn...@webtv.net
>
>Ding Dang...again a memory jog.....The scene
> you mention Jon was also peculiar. Penny
> and Desmond at the mirror tieing Desmonds
> tie.
>
phase any one. ...Nevertheless, that little scene still always struck me
as odd.
I'll have to check that episode out again, I can't remember those other
oddities you mentioned about it. ...But now you've got my mind to
working... What about those different shots down in the Swan bunker
where (some one here -- probably yourself) had noticed the furniture had
changed? ...Could that have any relationship to this mirror image
idea? ...Jon
thinbluemime
The only furniture I can remember moving around in the swan bunker was the
ping pong table, and that darn lava lamp.
Following this same train of thought though, when Desmond was in Widmore's
office, remember the 'Dharma' type work of art on the wall, that moved or
mirrored from one side of the room to the other?
BTW, dark ufo site has pics up of the new Maxwell site logo, that
resembles a compass rose.
I'll say more about this later, but note the West-East designations on the
face of the Maxwell Logo, are REVERSED.....
thinbluemime
Somewhere on the net is a picture of the earth land masses in two colors.
The blue shows the earth's land masses, continents etc, as they would
normally appear on a map.
The red shows the mirror image of the same land masses, only reversed of
course, superimposed over the blue.
Any point on this map represents a line drawn thru the center of the
earth, and indicates the corresponding 2 points on the earth's surface
that are on the exact opposite positions on the earth.
I can not find the map, because I can't remember the technical name for
the map :(
Somebody has got to know the tech name for this illustration.
Johnn...@webtv.net
>
>If we assume that there's a wormhole
> involved, passing through the mirror (the
> island without the button being pressed?)
> could have instantly transported the plane to
> the Sunda Trench. The web page I quoted
> previously states, "The mirror halves the
> world (if we extend it indefinitely in every
> direction), equating each point on one side
> with a point on the other." In such a scenario,
> the Sunda Trench location would be the
> island's equivalent point. It's the other end of
> the wormhole.
>
but I still think there's a relationshp to alternate time-lines.
Perhaps those mirror images (IE: Desmond looking in the mirror with his
tie) depict shots from an alternate reality. ...Consider Desmond
turning the key in the Swan station. ...Part of him zipped through that
mirror back to an earlier stage in his life, but yet his essence still
remained in the bunker, and sooner or later he would return to this very
spot to turn the key, once he got the boat and sailed to he island.
..Jon.
tdciago
> The only furniture I can remember moving around in the swan bunker was the �
> ping pong table, and that darn lava lamp.
There's a "Changing Hatch" web page that noted the changes. I think
the stereo was different, for example.
http://www.cs.iastate.edu/~andorfc/paint.html
> Following this same train of thought though, when Desmond was in Widmore's �
> office, remember the 'Dharma' type work of art on the wall, that moved or �
> mirrored from one side of the room to the other?
>
> BTW, dark ufo site has pics up of the new Maxwell site logo, that �
> resembles a compass rose.
> I'll say more about this later, but note the West-East designations on the �
> face of the Maxwell Logo, are REVERSED.....
There have been quite a few references to reversals and mirrors
throughout the show. Remember Sun's reflection, both in a mirror and
in a window? I think this was when she was having the affair with Jae
Lee. I also recall some scene on the beach in which one character
sees another coming up to him when looking in a broken mirror. At
some point, a reversed image of the Big Dipper was also shown in the
sky. (See http://lost-forum.com/showthread.php?t=13175 ).
And then, of course, there's _Bad Twin_. The main characters are
mirror twins: one is right-handed and one is left-handed.
tdciago
> resembles a compass rose.
> I'll say more about this later, but note the West-East designations on the �
> face of the Maxwell Logo, are REVERSED.....
It may be a compass-clinometer:
"The compass rose is properly reversed for use as a sighting compass.
The reversed compass rose causes initial confusion with novices, but
in use it is obvious why the compass rose must have East and West
reversed. When you are sighting directly North, the compass needle
will point to North. If you turn 90 degrees to your left, you will be
sighting due West, but the compass needle rotated 90 degrees to the
right, which reads West on a properly reversed compass rose."
http://www.stanleylondon.com/compclin.htm
"An inclinometer or clinometer is an instrument for measuring angles
of slope (or tilt), elevation or inclination of an object with respect
to gravity. It is also known as a tilt meter, tilt indicator, slope
alert, slope gauge, gradient meter, gradiometer, level gauge, level
meter, declinometer, and pitch & roll indicator...
Tilt sensors and inclinometers generate an artificial horizon and
measure angular tilt with respect to this horizon. They are used in
cameras, aircraft flight controls, automobile security systems, and
special switches. Also used for platform leveling, boom angle
indication, anywhere tilt requires measuring."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clinometer
"The clinometer is an optical device for measuring elevation angles
above horizontal. The most common instruments of this type currently
used are compass-clinometers from Suunto or Silva. Compass clinometers
are fundamentally just magnetic compasses held with their plane
vertical so that a plummet or its equivalent can point to the
elevation of the sight line."
http://mysite.du.edu/~jcalvert/astro/abney.htm
thinbluemime
MsEllen50
I agree! I think I found some info that may add to this theory...check
this out:
http://www.rense.com/general26/poles.htm
I posted my theory to coincide with this on my blog...
http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.ListAll&friendID=307927589
Ellen :)
tdciago
> If we assume that there's a wormhole involved, passing through the
> mirror (the island without the button being pressed?) could have
> instantly transported the plane to the Sunda Trench.
In the Find 815 ARG, Sam is feeling discouraged:
(Taken from http://find815.blogspot.com/ )
"Ughh...
I think I have made a big mistake.
At the moment, we're about 300 km off the Indonesian coast, in an area
called the Sunda Trench, deep waters around 7000 meters in some parts.
And sure enough, the Christiane I's mission is to search for a sunken
slave trading ship called the 'Black Rock' that disappeared in 1881
while it was returning from a gold mining expedition around Papua New
Guinea.
And all that's real exciting but, what's it have to do with 815?
I'm starting to wonder what the hell I'm doing here.
I thought following this lead will give me something to do, besides
sit around and think, but sailing up and down over miles and miles of
ocean, looking for a needle in a haystack 7000 meters deep
unfortunately gives you nothing but time to think.
And what else makes me wonder if this is all worth it is I received
another email.
This Maxwell group... I don't know what to make of it... just
incomprehensible numbers.
Can't make any sense of it, no matter how long I stare at it.
Maybe I just... read too much into the first email...
It's just somebody having a laugh... They saw me off the TV... well,
some joke, I think i'll just get off at the next port.
No, there's nothing to find out here."
________________________________
The question is, why is the Christiane I looking for the Black Rock in
the Sunda Trench, which is WEST of Papua New Guinea, when reports said
that the ship inexplicably sailed EAST from Papua New Guinea the last
time it was seen. Does someone know something about a wormhole that
exists between a certain point in the Pacific and a certain point in
the Sunda Trench? Was that information possibly written down by
Magnus Hanso? And has someone gotten hold of the evidence?
I'm beginning to wonder if all the dialogue references to throwing
rocks are hinting that the Black Rock was *thrown* from the Pacific to
the Indian Ocean. Now, we've all seen the Black Rock on Craphole
Island, and we've also seen Oceanic flight 815's wreckage there. Yet
Naomi claims that flight 815 was found at the bottom of the Sunda
Trench. Will the Christiane I find *both* the Black Rock and flight
815 in the trench?