What evidence indicates that the certainty of God's existence must be earned (JP)

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janp...@gmail.com

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Sep 28, 2008, 12:03:09 AM9/28/08
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It makes us wonder "how it is possible that our 'parent' is the most
rich being of the entire universe, means God - who owns everything
that exists, yet the significant majority of people are happy from the
upbringing that this 'parent' gave us"? On the other hand, noticeable
proportion of people from human so-called "rich homes", typically
display a deep grievance to their parents, for giving them
insufficient preparation to challenges of the real life.

The "Ariadna thread" which led me to the discovery of methods which
God uses to make the majority of people happy from the upbringing that
they received from God, I encountered by a pure accident in Kuala
Lumpur in August 2008. I waited then for my turn to a dentist and out
of boredom I took to my hand one amongst these colourful magazines
which typically are offered in dentists' waiting rooms. In this
magazine I started to read rather an interesting article about the
fate and about the upbringing of children from rich families. The
article argued and documented logically that typically children of
rich parents, which in the childhood receive everything that they wish
in the best quality of it and without any effort or long waiting, grow
up into consumption oriented egoists, socially handicap misfits,
complainers, etc., which have then serious problems with living in a
real society, which fast waste away the inherited fortune, and which
not so rarely die as drug addicts or homeless beggars. Therefore, one
amongst vital tasks of wealthy parents is the intentional introduction
of goals to be accomplished, rewards and punishments, discipline,
structure, role models, effort, duties, etc., to the life and
upbringing of their children - so that these children acquire the
desirable attributes of character which are automatically appearing in
children of poor parents. I perfectly agreed with the author of that
article, because in my life I knew in person several cases of children
of rich parents whom "went into dogs". Of course, I treated this
article as a temporary entertainment and even did NOT note its title
nor editorial data.

Only some time after reading this article I realised that us - means
all humans, are just like these children of rich parents. After all,
our "parent", means God (see the web page "god.htm"), is very rich -
he owns the entire universe. So if He wants He could "spoil" us as
much as He likes, flooding us for free and without any effort with
everything that we only could want to have. But then we would become
socially handicapped misfits - like typical children of rich parents.
Fortunately, because our parent, means God, is infinitively clever and
predicting, He intentionally introduced to our lives various goals to
be accomplished, rewards and punishments, effort, duties, etc. In this
manner God shapes in us all desirable attributes of the character, so
that we become perseverant seekers of truth, capable of putting effort
and labour into whatever we try to accomplish, so that we do NOT give
up in face of first obstacles that we encounter, etc., etc.

In order to efficiently shape our characters in a required manner, God
created something that the philosophy of totalizm calls the "moral
field (for details of what is this "moral field" - see the web page
"totalizm.htm"). This "moral field" is equally invisible like
gravitational field. But it still causes that accomplishing anything
in the human lives that is moral, comes only with a great effort and
with a significant contribution of our own labour - because it
requires the climbing upwards in this invisible "moral field". Of
course, "the cognitive knowledge and certainty of the existence of God
is the most moral accomplishment of humans that anyone amongst us can
only earn". Therefore the accomplishment of cognitive knowledge and
certainty that God does exist requires from each one amongst us the
contribution of a huge effort of climbing upwards in this "moral
field". This in turn means that the evidence for the existence of God
does NOT hit us in eyes just by itself - like it is done by
advertisements from television or from streets. In order to notice and
recognise the evidence for the God’s existence we must firstly work
hard and earn it with our own labour of climbing uphill in this "moral
field" - in spite that there is a wealth of this evidence present in
practically every place into which we may look.

Actually, that there is such a thing as the "moral field", and that
this field really works, people noticed a long time ago. For example,
the action of this "moral field" is already described in a number of
proverbs and sayings - e.g. consider the well-known proverb "no pain,
no gain", or another version of it "no sweat, no sweet". These
proverbs express the empirical finding of our ancestors that the so-
called "moral field" really does exists and really does work, and
therefore nothing that is moral and beneficial for people comes to us
just by itself, but we must earn it with our heavy effort and labour.

Between us, the sole fact that there is and that works such a thing as
this "moral field", is also a direct and a clear evidence for the
existence of God. After all, without the intelligence of God, the
stupid universe would NOT be able to develop such a situation that
everything moral and beneficial for people requires the contribution
of effort of climbing uphill in this moral field, while everything
that is immoral and detrimental for people comes with an easiness of
slipping down in this moral field. Thus, in order to gain the
certainty of the existence of God just from the existence and action
of this "moral field", it is enough to watch what happens to our
contribution of labour during carrying out moral and immoral actions.
(But it is worth to remember, that these "moral" and "immoral" actions
must fulfil the totaliztic definition of "morality" - as e.g.
religions define morality in a different way than the philosophy of
totalizm does it.)

From the practical point of view it is quite vital to become aware how
actually God causes that the evidence about His existence must be
discovered and earned with our personal effort by each one amongst us
separately through laborious climbing uphill in the "moral field" -
and all this in spite that there is a huge body of this evidence
available in practically every subject area. As it turns out God
utilised for this purpose a whole array of various means and manners.
The most important amongst these is the "continual maintaining of
every person in the uncertainty of the God's existence". About why and
how God Himself keeps intentionally all people in the uncertainty of
His own existence, is already written comprehensively in items #F2 and
#F3 of the totaliztic web page "evil.htm" (i.e. the web page about
origins of evil on the Earth), in items #D1 and #D2 of the web page
"ufo.htm" (i.e. the web page with replies to fundamental questions
about UFOnauts and UFO vehicles - e.g. whether they do exist, how they
function, etc.), and also in post number #157E to blogs of totalizm as
well as on the thread
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.philosophy/browse_thread/thread/664add681beb520f/112aef6737969e9b
. I am NOT going to repeat here these descriptions. This web page I
rather devote to make the reader aware, that because of this our
uncertainty about the God's existence, and because of this our inborn
lack of trust towards every claim concerning God, each one of us must
contribute a huge amount of effort and work to be able to notice and
to recognise the first evidence for the existence of God which he or
she encounters, and to acquire the certainty that God really does
exist.

At this point it is also worth to emphasize, that NOT all people must
always put a huge effort in acknowledging the evidence for the
existence of God, means in acquiring the cognitive certainty that God
does exist. Reasons why it is so are most comprehensively explained in
item #F5 of the totaliztic web page "evil.htm" (i.e. the web page
about origins of evil on the Earth) and in item #D6 of the web page
"ufo.htm" (i.e. the page with replies to fundamental questions about
UFOnauts and UFO vehicles - e.g. whether they do exist, how they
function, etc.). It turns out that these people who learned such
evidence during one amongst their previous reincarnations, and who
during that reincarnation acquired the certainty that God does exist,
in the present life do NOT need to put again the effort into such
learning. This is because in the present life they can just remind
themselves these previous items of evidence and remind this previous
certainty that God does exist. The reason is that the knowledge and
certainty which we earned with heavy labour during one amongst our
previous reincarnations remain to our disposal forever. So in the
present life it is enough to just remind to ourselves this knowledge
and certainty. Therefore for some readers it will suffice that e.g.
they just read the web page "god_proof.htm", and whatever is contained
in it will remind them their own knowledge and certainty, which they
earned already a long time before, e.g. during one amongst their
previous reincarnations.

A large number of items of scientific evidence for the existence of
God is provided on the totaliztic web page "god_proof.htm". Of course,
because of the action of the "moral field", and also because of the in-
born scepticism of people towards all matters concerning God, this
scientific evidence for the existence of God represents only kinds of
"traffic signs" which indicate where exactly someone may accomplish
most easily the certainty that God really does exist. But in order
someone actually gained this certainty, he or she firstly must
overcome a so-called "barrier of awareness" which requires a great
contribution of personal effort and labour to be put into learning any
truth that is very important for us. An illustrative example of the
"evidence for the existence of God" is the fact revealed to people by
present physics and stating that "electromagnetic waves have the
transverse character". For the majority of people, including into this
also the majority of so-called "scientists", this fact means NOTHING.
After all, they did NOT overcome yet the "barrier of awareness" which
normally makes impossible for them the complete understanding of the
link that it has with the existence of God. However, in these people
who already overcame this barrier and found themselves on a required
"level of initiation into the knowledge", this transverse character of
electromagnetic waves means that such waves propagate along the border
between two separate worlds (i.e. our world and the "counter-world"),
and thus that these waves are a physical evidence for the existence of
the counter-world filled up with intelligent counter-matter - means
the evidence for the existence of God. (For more details about this
physical evidence for the existence of counter-world in which God does
live, and thus also for the existence of God - see item #D3 from the
web page "dipolar_gravity.htm" (i.e. see the web page about the
Concept of Dipolar Gravity), or see post number #134E from blogs of
totalizm as well as the thread
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.logic/browse_thread/thread/9d7e62b9be872ac3/2d70a1621314beb6#2d70a1621314beb6
.)

The explanations presented above are adopted from items #A3, #B1 and
#B2 of the totaliztic web page "god_proof.htm", update of 25 September
2008, or later. The latest update of this web page should be available
from several web sites of totalizm One amongst these web sites is "
www.jan-pajak.com " - which is available under the address http://jan-pajak.com
and which always presents (just for brief periods of time) the most
recently updated web page of totalizm.

It is also worth to know that practically all totaliztic web pages are
availabe at each address (server) of totalizm. Therefore independently
from the web page "evil.htm", each address (server) linked from here
should also offer all other web pages of totalizm - unless some of
these pages were sabotaged, or are so new that I had no time yet to
upload these at a given address (server). (But in a case when for some
reasons a page is unavailable under a given address, still at this
address a MENU should be available which has links to other addresses
(servers) of totalizm, on which a given web page should already be
accessible.) Thus, if someone wishes to view descriptions from any
other totaliztic web page, e.g. from a web page listed in this post,
or listed in other totaliztic posts, then in the above addresses the
name "evil.htm" is just enough to exchange for a name of the web page
that he or she wishes to view, e.g. for the name of web page
"oscillatory_chamber.htm", "eco_cars.htm", "boiler.htm",
"fe_cell.htm", "free_energy.htm", "telekinetics.htm",
"dipolar_gravity.htm", "nirvana.htm", "totalizm.htm", "evil.htm",
"god.htm", "god_proof.htm", "bible.htm", "evolution.htm",
"wszewilki_jutra_uk.htm", "malbork_uk.htm", "memorial.htm",
"newzealand.htm", "partia_totalizmu_uk.htm", "fruit.htm",
"text_1_5.htm", "explain.htm", "day26.htm", "ufo_proof.htm",
"katrina.htm", etc., etc.

If here the above text is difficult to read, or links from it refuse
to work, then it is worth to know that this post is repeated on
several blogs of totalizm, subsequent ones amongst which can be
accessed at following internet addresses:
http://www.getablog.net/totalizm
http://totalizm.wordpress.com
http://totalizm.blox.pl/html
http://totalizm.myblog.net
On these blogs it is also worth to read the previous post number #157E
(or previous thread http://groups.google.com/group/alt.philosophy/browse_thread/thread/664add681beb520f/112aef6737969e9b
), which explains that God intentionally maintains people in the lack
of certainty of His existence. Thus the content of the previous post
complements the content of this post.

With the totaliztic salute,
Jan Pajak

THE BORG

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Sep 28, 2008, 12:27:32 AM9/28/08
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Before you can even begin to "prove" whether or no any God does or does not
exist you must ascertain how you view God.
If you view as all encompassing - and can be verified and proved by creation
and evidenced in rain and wind and snowfall.
Or if you view as some bod of the Old Testament who preferred Jews.
Or if you view as a threefold God as in the Hindu writings - as the Creator,
Preserver and Destroyer. Three separate people.
Or maybe as a group of males and females as in the Gods of Olympus.
Or maybe as a Godhead - or Collective Mind - a One huge intelligence made up
of many individuals.

First you must define and ascertain the nature and definition of "God" in
order to prove whether or no he/she/they/it exist.
You cannot go by one bit of writing in one story in one Bible on Earth in
order in order to locate any person or people who humans consider have some
control over them and who are the reason for the existence of Earth.
If you are talking of the Universe - have you considered if there is any
other sentient life out there other than human?
What of Earth and animals and insects - would they have the same as humans?
How can humans know or recognize if they do find any supposed God - if they
do not know who or what they are looking for?
THE BORG

<janp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
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Immortalist

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Sep 28, 2008, 12:31:12 AM9/28/08
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On Sep 27, 9:03 pm, janpa...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> From the practical point of view it is quite vital to become aware how
> actually God causes that the evidence about His existence must be
> discovered and earned with our personal effort by each one amongst us
> separately through laborious climbing uphill in the "moral field" -
> and all this in spite that there is a huge body of this evidence
> available in practically every subject area. As it turns out God
> utilised for this purpose a whole array of various means and manners.
> The most important amongst these is the "continual maintaining of
> every person in the uncertainty of the God's existence".

What would constitute evidence of his existence if it as you say this
evidence must be earned?

> At this point it is also worth to emphasize, that NOT all people must
> always put a huge effort in acknowledging the evidence for the
> existence of God, means in acquiring the cognitive certainty that God
> does exist.

If we have cognitive certainty that God does exist how is it
justified? In order to be certain it must be impossible for God not to
exist but if we look at all parts of your argument it is likely that
some of the premises will be inductive and probable and would not in
that case make it impossible for God to not exist.

HardySpicer

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Sep 28, 2008, 12:56:07 AM9/28/08
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On Sep 28, 5:27 pm, "THE BORG" <theb...@homesweethome.com> wrote:

Resistance is futile, you will be assimilated...

DuhIdiot

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Sep 28, 2008, 1:40:32 AM9/28/08
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janp...@gmail.com, on 28 Sep 2008, in alt.atheism, decided this was a worthy
use of a
keyboard:

<snip>

> Only some time after reading this article I realised that us - means
> all humans, are just like these children of rich parents. After all,
> our "parent", means God (see the web page "god.htm"), is very rich -
> he owns the entire universe. So if He wants He could "spoil" us as
> much as He likes, flooding us for free and without any effort with
> everything that we only could want to have. But then we would become
> socially handicapped misfits - like typical children of rich parents.
> Fortunately, because our parent, means God, is infinitively clever and
> predicting, He intentionally introduced to our lives various goals to
> be accomplished, rewards and punishments, effort, duties, etc. In this
> manner God shapes in us all desirable attributes of the character, so
> that we become perseverant seekers of truth, capable of putting effort
> and labour into whatever we try to accomplish, so that we do NOT give
> up in face of first obstacles that we encounter, etc., etc.

Load of crap.

If he's God he can simply give us "all desirable attributes of the character"
pre-installed, with no chance of us becoming spoiled brats.

If OTOH this world, in all its shittiness, is the best means he could come up
with to turn us into what he wants us to be, then he is a moron beyond all
reckoning.

<snip>

If you're supposed to be some type of Christian, btw, you're heretical. The
jeezoids teach that this world cannot forge us into beings worthy of heaven,
into which we can only be admitted by God's unearned grace.

Then there's the question of how many "desirable attributes of the character"
have a chance to get instilled in the millions of humans who die in infancy.
God: "So, little Aloysius, what did you learn in your six weeks on Earth?"
Aloysius: "Hmmm. Sucking titties, good. Being in a burning house, not so
good."

Then...well, you get the idea: you're a fucking dumbass. Odd how theism is
such a reliable indicator for that problem...

--
J. B. Mashburn, the sad left tail of the bell curve
alt.atheist #2295, http://questioner.www2.50megs.com/list1.html
EAC Chief Of Maintenance for God's cloaking device - 14 billion years and not
one glitch!
"What a day, when you can look it in the face and hold your vomit." - Faith
No More

DuhIdiot

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Sep 28, 2008, 1:45:32 AM9/28/08
to
THE BORG, on 28 Sep 2008, in alt.atheism, decided this was a worthy use of
a keyboard:

<snip>

> You cannot go by one bit of writing in one story in one Bible on Earth


> in order in order to locate any person or people who humans consider
> have some control over them and who are the reason for the existence of
> Earth.

Sure you can. Go by this post.

The universe exists so that I might be miserable and angry. You are scenery
in this play starring me.

<snip>

Sanity's Little Helper

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Sep 28, 2008, 4:25:54 AM9/28/08
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<janp...@gmail.com> barked:

> Subject: What evidence indicates that the certainty of God's existence must be earned (JP)
<snipped 232 lines of fanciful, self-indulgent rambling>
By making a virtue of ignorance, and making toil of it?

http://www.amishrakefight.org/gfy

--
David Silverman
aa #2208
Defender of Civilisation
Lord Mayor of Dis
Q: WDJW?"
A:"Necesito algunas piezas para mi cortacéspedes." - Jesus

Not authentic without this signature.

John Baker

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Sep 28, 2008, 4:33:17 AM9/28/08
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On Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:03:09 -0700 (PDT), janp...@gmail.com wrote:


None.

Next question.

Richo

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Sep 28, 2008, 5:30:13 AM9/28/08
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On Sep 28, 2:03 pm, janpa...@gmail.com wrote:

None whatsoever.

Any more questions?

Mark

ZerkonX

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Sep 28, 2008, 10:29:19 AM9/28/08
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On Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:03:09 -0700, janpajak wrote:

> God - who owns everything

except a good PR outfit.

Josef Balluch

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Sep 28, 2008, 4:18:57 PM9/28/08
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On Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:03:09 -0700 (PDT), janp...@gmail.com wrote:


[ snip an amazing amount of twaddle ]


So to summarize, Sparky, you want people to look for a god of the gaps. I'm
so glad we were able to clear THAT up.

Your homework for today is to produce a sound philosophical justification
for a god of the gaps. Take your time and do a thorough job. Use both sides
of the page if needed.


Regards,

Josef


One man's theology is another man's belly laugh.

-- Robert Heinlein

janp...@gmail.com

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Sep 29, 2008, 12:34:44 AM9/29/08
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On Sep 28, 5:27 pm, "THE BORG" <theb...@homesweethome.com> wrote:
> Before you can even begin to "prove" whether or no any God does or does not
> exist you must ascertain how you view God.
> If you view as all encompassing - and can be verified and proved by creation
> and evidenced in rain and wind and snowfall.
> Or if you view as some bod of the Old Testament who preferred Jews.
> Or if you view as a threefold God as in the Hindu writings - as the Creator,
> Preserver and Destroyer.  Three separate people.
> Or maybe as a group of males and females as in the Gods of Olympus.
> Or maybe as a Godhead - or Collective Mind - a One huge intelligence made up
> of many individuals.
>
> First you must define and ascertain the nature and definition of "God" in
> order to prove whether or no he/she/they/it exist.
...
YES, this is exactly what I have done. You can read the scientific
definition of God, provided by the "theory of everything" called the
"Concept of Dipolar Gravity", on the web page http://jan-pajak.com/god.htm
(in turn the Concept of Dipolar Gravity, which provided this
scientific definition of God, is explained briefly on the web page
http://jan-pajak.com/dipolar_gravity.htm - where you can also download
a free copy of the monograph that describes this "theory of
everything"). Note that if you summarise briefly this definition, then
God turns out to be a huge natural program that self-evolved in the
liquid computer called "counter-matter" (from this "liquid computer
actually is made everything that exists in the entire universe). In
turn description how God self-evolved in this natural liquid computer
called "counter-matter" is described in "part #C" of the web page
"god_proof.htm" to which links are provided at the begining of this
thread - i.e. in my original post.
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