Extreme Commuting--a checklist ride complete

[Bill Lindsay]

Back at the very beginning of my Rivendell career, in 2009, I was pretty much strictly a roadie.  My Hillborne and the idea of "country bike" opened up my world in many ways.  One of those ways was the idea of enjoying taking the long way from A-to-B.  Over that first year or so I hatched an idea for my 40-mile commute from El Cerrito to Union City.  Rather than treat it as a hilly road ride with a couple dirt trail detours, I contemplated doing it as a 25 mile mountain bike ride with a few road connectors.  I had most of the route in my head, but there were still several trails that I needed to add but had never ridden.  Now that I have a cool GPS unit, I was able to build my route on RideWithGPS and upload it to my device so I wouldn't get lost and wouldn't have to resort to the map 50 times. 

Anyhow, here's my route, discreetly edited to begin at a starting point close-by but not-too-close to my front door.  RideWithGPS Extreme Commuting

I did the ride for the first time this morning, which felt like a cool accomplishment, since I'd been thinking about it for several years.  It was ~42 miles and about 4700 feet of climbing, and it was pretty freaking hard.  There were several pitches that my GPS assessed as >20% grade.  There were rocky, bumpy, rooty sections that made my BMC Monstercross feel like serious underbiking.  The undeniable highlight is that these mountain bike trails are by definition car-free, and that was delightful.  I might decide to do the SFRandonneurs Marin Mountains 200k as a solo Permanent in May, and this Extreme Commute route is a great training ride for that. 

This was one of the 20% grades, which is hard to see in the photo.  My four finger salute was to celebrate passing 4,000 ft of climbing at this point.

So, make a plan, set a goal, see it through and celebrate

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito CA

P.S. One of the reasons I was able to pedal up 20% grades was I just installed my turkey vulture shifter kit from Analog Cycles, which allowed me to run a Deore XT clutch rear derailer with Shimano 10sp indexed barcons (on Thumbies).  I was glad to have a 26x36 low gear. 

[Lum Gim Fong]

My round trip work commute, least miles, is 30 miles. Every year I work up to coupla times per week but usually can’t do more as i never recover fast enough for some reason. I do shorter rides in between. Restaurant runs, etc.

[Deacon Patrick]

If you’re needing recovery between rides you may be riding way past your aerobic threshold and riding yourself into the ground. If so, I recommend getting Phil Maffetone’s book(s) on building aerobic capacity.

With abandon,
Patrick

[Deacon Patrick]

Impressive, Bill! Piecing together routes is a far more challenging endeavour than I ever thought it would be. No matter the system of maps, roads or trails differ in the real world. Part of the challenge I’ve run into is very few people are true all terrain riders, happy to ride quiet roads and back trails. But more and more “adventure routes” and races seem to make great routes in areas I’ve attempted, but they figure it out better than I do. Or I’m hoping they have, as I’m going to try some of their routes this year! Grin. Great job! Over 20% grades are nothing to sneeze at!

With abandon,
Patrick

[Lum Gim Fong]

Definitely nothing to thumb yer nose at either. Congrats, Bill! And thanks for the recommendation Patrick!

[dstein]

Props for accomplishing this. I've ridden through Redwood/JMP to Chabot and on to San Leandro BART sticking to trails the whole way, which is only like a 3rd of this and it kicked my ass (though I started from rockridge bart so I was 5 miles of climbing in already). I don't do long road rides either, usually 25-35 miles so maybe I'm just a lightweight. But anyway, I know those trails and for the people on here not in the area, I can attest they're pretty freaking hard.

[Tim Butterfield]

Great job on the commute.  Mine is less than 30 feet, so no riding for me.

I second what Patrick said and recommend getting one of Phil’s books.  Something to keep in mind that I have discovered with his formula, if you’re over about 50 or so, you might need to add a bpm or several to make up for age skew.

One formula is roughly this:

Level of effort X duration = recovery time

If you can decrease either level of effort or duration, you will likely recover faster.  As Patrick mentioned, a big factor in this is how much above or below your aerobic threshold your level of effort is.  If you can stay comfortably below that threshold, your recovery times will greatly reduce.  Also, if you can convert to burning more fats than sugars as Phil discusses, you can really minimize recovery times or greatly extend durations.  One giant benefit of this, the more you do at that lower level of effort, the faster you can get at that level.  It’s a bit more nuanced than that with building a base before ramping up a level, etc., but that’s the overall effect of it.

Have fun with the experiments.

Tim

On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 6:19 PM Lum Gim Fong <john1...@gmail.com> wrote:

My round trip work commute, least miles, is 30 miles. Every year I work up to coupla times per week but usually can’t do more as i never recover fast enough for some reason. I do shorter rides in between. Restaurant runs, etc.

--

Sent from my IDevice

[Jonathan D.]

Great job Bill. I feel good about my 5 mile commute.

Patrick - What book from Phil should I start with?

[Deacon Patrick]

Jonathan, I used this one: https://www.amazon.com/Big-Book-Endurance-Training-Racing/dp/1616080655/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1524757124&sr=1-1&keywords=phil+maffetone+books

Near as I can tell, any of his books will have his approach, they just have a different target audience. Same content, aimed a different direction with slightly different emphasis and new, often peripheral, info in the newer ones.

One can geek out on heart rate monitoring. I did it all wrong. I occationally checked my heart rate with a phone app, got a feel for what aerobic felt like and haven’t taken my pulse since. That was years ago. I ride to enjoy, not to race, so I’m not looking to eek out every bit, just not drive myself into the ground. Seems to be working. I ride my 5 miles to the trail heads, see folks (20-50 years old) who drove their bouncy bikes there, they take off past me, but I catch them within a mile or two, them bent double, me just cranking along up the hill. When I shifted, however, it was very frustrating, because I felt like I couldn’t move at all without my heart rate going too high. My body had to recover from constantly being anaerobic. That took time. Works a charm though!

With abandon,
Patrick

[Chris Corral]

Wow! Excellent route. Good work!

[Patrick Moore]

I used to commute 30 rt west-east across town, with 7 miles uphill from the river to Juan Tabo, often extending one or both legs by 5 miles N/S along a nice bike path. Yes, it's easy to overdo it, and as I got older (I did this from ~ 1996 to 2008; 41 to 53) I slowed down considerably. Back in the early days when my inbound commute was 16 miles across Rt 66 with 7 miles of gradual climbing on a 67" or 70" fixed, I'd average 54-60 minutes regularly, clock running, and all too often feel beat up. From about 2004 on, I slowed down considerably, 15 mile ver slower route * at 12-13 mph clock running, and it was much more tolerable. I even tried combining riding with the express bus to/from the university, but that was slower than riding the entire route.

*I used to simply ride 'cross-town along Route 66 from Atrisco to Juan Tabo; afterward I went through the university and fair grounds, or took other detours with less, and slower, traffic.

On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 7:19 PM, Lum Gim Fong <john1...@gmail.com> wrote:

My round trip work commute, least miles, is 30 miles. Every year I work up to coupla times per week but usually can’t do more as i never recover fast enough for some reason. I do shorter rides in between. Restaurant runs, etc.

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Auditis an me ludit amabilis insania?

[Bill Lindsay]

Thanks all.  I feel good today, but my legs and shoulders are a bit sore from grinding up the steepies.  I'm thinking about trying the same route next time with my proper mountain bike and comparing my segment times.  There should be definite advantages having 29x2.3" tires and shocks on the rougher stuff, but the drop bars and narrower tires should be faster on the smoother stuff.  Which bike will win?  That's another advantage to Strava, in that you can do semi-objective comparisons. 

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

[Evan E.]

That's an impressive and inspiring commute, Bill. Love that second picture of the trail through the trees.

[Cameron Murphy]

+1 to this. I've been training the last 6 months or so to do the coastal route at Eroica CA, and noticed a huge difference about 2 months in when I started applying some of Dr. Maffetone's ideas. I had been doing 30-45 mile rides at close to threshold the whole time. Making progress, but not a bunch. When I finally started paying attention to keeping my HR down, my HR stared getting much lower for similar effort levels. Previously, my max HR was about 200 bpm, and almost any moderate effort would keep it pegged around 175-180. Now, after probably 1000 miles of training, my max HR seems to be about 185, and moderate efforts keep my HR in the 150-165 range. I don't know exactly what changes have happened, other than I'm much stronger on the climbs, and my endurance is much better.

Hard to say how much is due to working on aerobic fitness vs just the increased training volume, but I'm pretty happy with my progress either way.

(I was moderately strong and fast before, but would hit a wall around 35-40 miles and just be done. Unfortunately, I haven't even lost any weight. I'm actually about 5 lbs heavier than last year, but about 10% faster, and didn't have much trouble with the 90 miles at Eroica.)

Cameron Murphy
San Marcos, CA

[David Stein]

I need to dive more into the Dr. Maffetone stuff and maybe that will help answer my question, but no matter how much or long or often I ride, my legs kill me after 30-40 miles and 4k feet of climbing. I remember riding with someone on this group (Ahem, Tony) on a ride last year where my quads were killing me on a climb, and my fellow rider was very non-chalantly "oh, weird, my legs never seem to hurt". great, i thought at the time, and threw it off to genetics. Surely genetics help. But does this sort of training help for the non-athletically inclined in terms of not having your legs crap out on you?

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[Cameron Murphy]

I'm sure genetics plays a part, but quite a bit comes down to training and probably diet.  I started eating low carb about two years ago, and noticed after the rough first month or two of riding that my legs no longer burned on climbs.  (Overall speed and power took a hit during that transition, but recovered and eventually surpassed previous levels.)   I've read as much research as I can find on the subject, and apparently, fat adapted athletes do a much better job recycling the lactic acid that causes muscles to "burn".  Lactic acid metabolism isn't as efficient as burning glycogen, but it does produce energy.  As a nice side effect, it doesn't build up to levels that cause pain or muscle damage, at least not for me any more.  I can ride hard enough to feel like throwing up, and my heart will be about to explode, but my legs don't particularly hurt.  When I've gone too hard for too long, my legs simply start to lose power. It feels like I'm pressing the gas, and nothing happens.  (And I don't get any significant muscle soreness a day or two later like I used to.)

From my (evolving) understanding of exercise and cycling, there are basically two main energy pathways for us humans:  Breaking down stored fat, or burning glycogen, a stored form of sugar that requires minimal oxygen for use.   At lower intensities, your body uses more fat burning, as it takes 2-3x more oxygen to break down then glycogen.  As intensity increases, you rely more and more on glycogen.  That's great, until you run out of glycogen (Most folks only have ~2000 calories of glycogen available, and it can't be replenished as fast as you can burn it.)   The whole goal of aerobic training is to improve your bodies ability to burn fat, so that you use a greater % of fat, and spare as much of the glycogen as possible for high intensity efforts.

I know that like most carb fueled Americans, I was lousy at burning fat.  If I wasn't eating semi-regularly, I would get very hungry, and I didn't have much endurance.  Regardless of any other aspects of a low carb diet, I did get much better at burning fat.  I found that I could fast for a day at a time without much hunger, and I haven't experienced a "bonk" like I had before. Where I used to run out of energy after 1:30 to 2:00 of hard riding, now I'm good for 2-3x as much, without any particular energy intake.  (I get maybe 300 calories from my electrolyte drink mix over a 5 hour ride.)   I'm sure this isn't all due to low carb and focusing on aerobic training, but I know I saw pretty rapid gains after somewhat plateauing on my previous training much closer to my limits for shorter rides.

I don't think low carb is perfect for all athletes, but for cycling, especially long distance cycling it seems to have some real benefits.  (Research seems to show your peak power and explosive efforts take a bit of a hit compared to a high carb diet.)

Cameron Murphy

San Marcos, CA

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[Deacon Patrick]

D Beer Stein (don’t sign you name I get to have fun with it. Grin.),

Ignore genetics. Ain’t nuffin’ you can do ‘bout that. And it’s likely far less a factor than people like to think. Reality is we all come from hearty stock, ‘cause our lines are a couple million years old. Grin. So, nature, it is what it is and you’ve been dealt a pretty good hand, if only you can get the noise of confused (failure to) nurture out of the way so your body functions as God engineered it. Double grin. Learn to stop messing things up and it’s surprising how smoothly and better the body works. Grin. Here’s what I did...

Diet: become a fat burner and see what happens. Transition takes time and can be frustrating. So what? You come from hearty stock, remember?
Move smart: This includes effort level (aerobic for all but occational and short efforts), body mechanics (floor living strengthens core and limbers muscles so no stretching is needed ever, just go). Transition for all this takes time and can be frustrating. So what? You come from hearty stock, remember?
Move regularly: Use your human motor whenever possible. Invest in sythe, use a hand saw, walk, run, bike rather than drive when it’s within 15 miles. Get rid the appliances save for a few carefully chosen ones. Grind coffee by hand. You get the idea. Move. Regularly. Transition takes time and can be frustrating. So what? You come from hearty stock, remember?

Grin.

With abandon,
Patrick

[Evan E.]

Hi Deacon Patrick,

"Become a fat burner and see what happens." < Could you please explain, in one paragraph, how to become a fat burner? I ask because a few year ago I read "Eat Bacon Don't Jog," and I liked it, and I followed its diet regimen for at least five months straight, and still today I eat a low-carb diet with eggs for breakfast, and plenty of coconut butter and coconut oil and grass-fed butter and sardines and kale and chicken and walnuts, etc. But I'm still pretty sure I couldn't wake up in the morning, eat a teaspoon of butter, go for a brisk four-hour ride, and feel great. For that I'd need to be a true fat-burner, right? 

If I need to read and follow another food-and-exercise book, I'm willing. But I'd much rather just read a paragraph from you. So please, if you're willing, do tell us how we can burn fat and ride with abandon.

Thank you,

Evan Elliot

SF, CA

[Deacon Patrick]

Hey Evan! Based on what you wrote, you don’t need a paragraph from me. You got it. Discipline may be the issue? In a given day how much sugar, flour, and other carbs are you getting? You know you’re reaching a point of your body being effecient at burning fat (which can take a while to heal back to after a high carb diet, I noticed several shifts at roughly 3mo, 9mo, 18mo) when you discover you’ve gone 24+ hours without eating anything and in that same time biked for 4+ hours and never bonked. Fat burning isn’t an all or nothing prospect though. There are basically three levels of “low carb” diets, the high and low end being the ones to be in. Ketogenic essentially eliminates all carbs (except leafy greens), and the liver converts protein to the small amount of glucose the body requires. The body converts fat into ketones for fuel, including for the brain, which functions better on ketones for a variety of reasons, which is why a ketogenic diet is great for anyone with neurological issues. The upper end of low carb involves eating 2-4 fistfulls of healthy carbs (potatoes, yams, white rice, etc.), not entering ketogenic, but providing for the body’s basic glucose needs directly through diet. Between those two is no man’s land ... too many carbs to trigger ketogenic systems, too few to provide for the body’s needs, so a lot of effort to feel horrible. Grin.

Hopefully that helps a wee bit?

With abandon,
Patrick

[Palmer]

Hi Evan,
Not to step on Deacon Patrick’s toes, but if you keeps carbohydrates under 100 grams per day you should have effortless weight maintenance. Closer to 50gr is getting close to ketosis but will accelerate fat loss. I agree you are close to being fat adapted if not there already. We are all a little different, the nice thing is you should be able to listen to your body because you don’t have the noise of of glucose and insulin regularly.
Tom Palmer
Twin Lake, MI

[Evan E.]

Deacon Patrick:  Thanks for your paragraph! It helps a lot. I suspect that I may be in the middle of low-carb diets. While on most days I eat almost zero carbs, each Saturday I eat a restaurant basket of tortilla chips and about once a week I'll eat white rice with dinner. So maybe those carbs put me in no man's land? Also, I'm guessing I don't eat enough, period, because my weekday lunches are small. Also, I'm skinny, so I'm thinking I have almost no fat reserves.

Tom: Thanks for the info. I agree that I may be close to being fat-adapted, but I'm not sure I'm good at listening to my body. So I'll work on that!

Evan

[Deacon Patrick]

Evan,

You may not be getting enough fat colaories. I put butter on my burger (or whatever meat I’m having). We buy ground beef with 25% fat, and it gets made into a sauce or simply put with the meat. Essentially, 80-90% of my calories come from fat. I eat 1-2 meals a day. “Breakfast” is coffee with cream. Lunch is my main meal, unless I skip it, then dinner is (and generally bigger). Dinner is usually 3 eggs of some sort (amazing nutrition in them thar yokes!). To be Ketogenic the rule of thumb is 25 grams of carbs or less per day. To be healthy low carb, the rule is 200-400 grams per day (I think, reference the Perfect Health Diet for details on that as I don’t eat that way, but my wife and daughters do — they didn’t do well on ketogenic).

With abandon,
Patrick

[Evan E.]

Hey Deacon:  I agree. Even though I do eat coconut oil at breakfast, often eat almond butter at lunch, and eat olive oil at dinner, I'm still likely not getting enough fat calories. Also, I'm probably not getting 2,000 calories each day. Cannot imagine eating just two meals a day. But hey, I'll keep working on it. Thanks again.

Evan

[Surlyprof]

Bill's post on extreme commuting prompted me to take the path less ventured home last week.  If I ride home instead of taking the train, I usually ride out of San Jose through not the most picturesque neighborhoods but eventually, it connects to the road that skirts along the base of the hills that surrounds the East Bay from San Jose up.  This is a beautiful route along horse ranches and meadows but I've always wondered what it would be like to ride the bike path up to Alviso and the bay and then cut over to the Fremont area.  I would love to report that it was a delightful experience full of nicely cared for trails, beautiful vistas and gorgeous views of the bay but... I cannot.  My extreme commuting turned into "extremely awful commuting".  Riding from San Jose north on the Guadalupe River Trail you get to see firsthand the massive number of homeless people who have been priced out of the bay area.  Campsites and abandoned shopping carts everywhere.  People were washing their clothes in the river!  It gave the bay area a real third world feel.  The trail came out of the woods and along the San Jose airport and then on to the back sides of a large number of generically repetitive buildings housing various tech companies.  Nothing to see there.  It also opened up to full exposure to the winds coming down off the bay.  This was the start of 14-15 miles of steady headwinds. The ride also featured trails that ran alongside the 237 freeway (more shopping carts) and miles of bike lane-ish stretches along 5 lanes of Fremont Road heading into Fremont.  With few stop lights in that area, cars were whizzing by at 60-70 mph.  

Eventually, I made it home to a delightful greeting by our joyful dogs.  I'm happy to report that my trusty Hillborne hauled me and my office the entire 19-20 miles without a hitch or a flat (lots of glass on this route).  I now know what the path less taken is like and won't be rushing back.  And, I got to see this totally tubular Hunquapillar in the wild:  https://photos.google.com/search/_tra_/photo/AF1QipPSbtDW_64rz3xB6kxN2yJgZnHHdAOYHvt13hyi

Valuable lessons learned and a great workout was had.  Check!

John

On Wednesday, April 25, 2018 at 1:01:11 PM UTC-7, Bill Lindsay wrote:

[Bill Lindsay]

A. I'm touched that my post inspired somebody to try something new
B. I'm bummed that the something new that somebody tried was unpleasant
C. I flatly reject that trying one new thing and not liking it justifies never trying any new thing.  Maybe that's not what John meant when he said (and I quote):

" I now know what the path less taken is like and won't be rushing back"

The path less taken is not one thing.  If you find a lame route, don't take it again.  If you find a great route, take it again.  It breaks my heart to think this one adventure has you giving up adventure entirely.  Again, I hope that's not what you meant

Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA

[Surlyprof]

Not to worry, Bill. I’m just not rushing back to THAT path. I refuse to be that easily discouraged as I’m trying a new direction tonight. It will involve horse farms, it will involve hills and it may involve a backyard crossing. I’ll have to channel the spirit of Manny on that one (especially if there is a fence).

Thanks for the inspiration.

John

[Bill Lindsay]

APPROVE

[Justin, Oakland]

I spend a considerable amount of time hiking these trails and ride them in small parts as well. This is, as most everything you do is, most impressive. Almost as impressive as Deacon P turning every thread into one about nutrition. ;)

How do I do a commute like this to my current job as a stay at home dad?

-J

[Bill Lindsay]

Justin asked:  "How do I do a commute like this to my current job as a stay at home dad? "

I doubt he meant it sincerely, but every smart aleck joke question has a kernel of truth or sincerity in it.  So I'll answer as if Justin was sincerely asking.

I think you should volunteer for Oakland Composite Mountain Bike Racing.  They have an incredible group of kids riding for them, and they do really great work, particularly servicing minority riders, girls, and economically challenged high schoolers in Oakland.  It's one of the best ways I know of to get Oakland teens outdoors and enjoying the spectacular public spaces available in the hills above Oakland.  Ride with them once or twice a week, and they will beat your ass into shape faster than you can say "un-Racer".  Working withe El Cerrito High School has been a true fountain-of-youth experience for me both physically and emotionally.  Short, intense, sometimes unpleasantly difficult mountain bike rides are one of the more efficient ways to get a TON of fitness out of VERY limited exercise time.  Committing to a team like that is a way to force discipline on yourself that normally might take joining a gym, or some other lame self-imposed and costly arrangement. 

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

[Jonathan D.]

I would add for Justin, get a child bike seat or a trailer. Start biking with your kid to all their activities, friend visits or to new parks. It is a fun way to explore and spend time together.

[Justin, Oakland]

Bill-
That’s a great idea. I will look into it for sure!

Sadly she’s only 4.5 months - with great head control - so I’ve got at least another 4.5 months to go. I’m off all next school year tho with nearest return to work date being sept 2019. Plenty of time to bike with her!

-J

[Bill Lindsay]

It would be great to see you out there next racing season, J-Smooth.  Maybe we can get Manny to show up as well representing Albany High. 

The final race of the year: California State Championships, is this weekend in Petaluma.  Our most likely podium contenders from ECHS are Matt Garrison (Varsity Boys) and Madeleine Hill (JV Girls). 

Coach Bill

ECHS Gauchos

[Kellie]

Bill: from your start ride to Union City Blvd. and cut in at Eden shores. From there a NO CAR route, some of it gravel, all the way to High St. in Oakland. Depending on how many miles you want there's bailout Bart stations all the way to Richmond. The trail I'm suggesting skirts the Bay with beautiful wetlands to ride through. That'll be about 25 miles (maybe more) one way to Fruitvale Station.

[Justin, Oakland]

Kellie-
What’s the route? Inquiring minds in a East Oakland want to know! Do you have a GPS or google map?

-J

[Bill Lindsay]

I think that's essentially the Bay Trail.  I really like climbing, but I have done the Bay Trail route a few times.  Not in the last 5 years, though

Bill

[Kellie Stapleton]

Will post after the meeting I’m in…

--

[Kellie]

Justin, here's the link: https://ridewithgps.com/routes/27535193 

Fruitvale BART to Coyote Springs. Both Union City and Fremont BART not far from Coyote Springs. Coyote Springs is fun in and of itself. Crandall Creek trail is the termination at Coyote Springs but if you go the other way, Alameda Creek trail, it goes all the way to Mission Blvd. Also, the bike path over the Dumbarton Bridge interfaces at Coyote Springs. Cut across to the South Bay via the Dumbarton Bridge..... the choices are endless.

Yes Bill, much is SF Bay Trail.

[Bill Lindsay]

Thanks for the route, Kellie

I'll report back when I follow it.  :-)

BL in EC

[Surlyprof]

This is fantastic!  Thanks, Kellie.  I live in Niles and have been looking for a good route up the bay.  This looks perfect.

John

On Thursday, May 17, 2018 at 6:56:21 PM UTC-7, Kellie wrote:

[Kellie Stapleton]

Hi John: I thought of you when I heard about your experience down the Guadalupe. I used to ride that a lot when I lived on the peninsula. I feel sad to hear about the area for a lot of reasons. Let me know how you like it.

[Kellie]

Hey John: where's "the road that skirts along the base of the hills that surrounds the East Bay from San Jose up?"

On Monday, May 14, 2018 at 11:24:34 AM UTC-7, Surlyprof wrote:

[Surlyprof]

Kellie,

It’s Piedmont. From campus I can take 11th up to Taylor and turn right toward the hills. It eventually becomes Mabury. A left on White later becomes Piedmont. That’s out near Alum Rock Park. It’ll take you as far as Jacklin which you can turn off and keep riding along the east sound wall of 680. It comes to an end at Scott Creek which, unfortunately, you have to take down into Fremont traffic (Warm Springs Rd).

I did attempt the hill route I thought I’d figured out the other day. Continuing past Scott Creek Road I thought could go up the hills through neighborhoods with one potential backyard crossing. There were hills but I never got to them. I was foiled by a gated community. I guess no one can go in but residents and guests. Defeated, I had to go back down Scott Creek Rd where there are now concrete barriwrs in the bike lane due to construction. More nerve racking than usual. So much for the scenic route.

John
Still determined to find a scenic route from San Jose to Niles Canyon.

[Matt Beecher]

This has been a fun and interesting read.  When I first started riding in my adulthood, I was living in Georgia and commuting to/from the EPA in Athens, GA.  I think I went from a 20 minute driving commute to a 30 minute riding commute, since I could simply start riding through the quad at UGA.  I was fortunate then that I had access to showers at work.  I loved and miss that job, but gave it up for my wife, who I love far more.  

I am going to be changing positions with my current employer next month, going from 80% travel to about 5%-10%.  With that in mind, I am thinking about trying for the long commute myself.  Fortunately, 90% of the route is on a bike path; the Fox River Trail for those that are interested.  There is only one stretch of an uphill ride that scares me in the morning and I hope my dual lights keep me safe.  

When I first started working for my employer, I sometimes rode home on Friday nights and back on Saturday mornings to get my car.  It is a 34 mile one-way ride, so I am planning to drive in Monday and ride home that night, then ride back in on Tuesday and drive home Tuesday night, etc.  I've already got dynamo and battery lights, panniers, and a couple options for fendered commuter bikes (Atlantis, Saluki, '85 Trek 720, and a Boulder somethin-or-another).  

I'll have my own office and a decent sized desk, so I will plan to bring clothes on Mondays, but I am nervous about how I will smell.  As someone born with anosmia, or at least not having a memory of the sense, I am very paranoid that I will not sufficiently remove the stink when wiping myself down in a bathroom.  Given my friends and family aren't into cycling, I have nobody close to ask, but would you expect to stink if you took an old facecloth to use to wipe yourself down about 15 minutes after you get in?  I've heard of using baby wipes as well, but do those work better?  

I'll probably start with riding home on Fridays for a few weeks, then work myself up to one to/from commute for a month, then try adding more commuting time.  

Matt in Oswego, IL

[Kellie]

The Eastbay Skyline Trail is here: http://gurmeet.net/hiking/hikes/East_Bay_Skyline_National_Recreation_Trail.html

Gives a lot of info about the trail divided into 4 sections from Wildcat Canyon Park in Richmond to Cabot Lake. All DIRT. I haven't ridden all of it, but if someone does please give a report. Gives trailheads and places to park, water, photos, etc.

[Bill Lindsay]

I followed Kellie's lowland East Bay Route today.  There's a fair bit of stopping and meandering, and the crosswinds off the bay were quite strong today, but it was a very cool alternative to my normal hill route.  There's a good stretch of gravel road where your are right next to the water of the bay and a good mile removed from the nearest hosing development.  The mile gap is filled with restored wetlands.  It's cool to be inside the San Francisco Bay Metropolis, and yet be that isolated. 

Bill Lindsay

El Cerrito, CA

On Thursday, May 17, 2018 at 6:56:21 PM UTC-7, Kellie wrote:

[Kellie Stapleton]

Bill, glad u liked it!

[Sean Kline]

Bill, Kellie and all: I’ve loved this thread.

(Since I live near El Cerrito Plaza Bart and work near Civic Center BART, I don’t have a good biking commute these days.)

Inspired, I decided to bike 2.5 hours from Daly City (BART) to Half Moon Bay Thursday after work for a business meeting Friday morning. It was a busy workweek, so I didn’t get organized to map the ride carefully—just typed ‘to’ and ‘from’ into Google Maps and took off on my Sam.

I’ve had some truly bad routes using Google alone, but this time I was gifted an amazingly beautiful ride through quiet neighborhoods of Daly City before a climb up into the mountains in Pacifica over and down the other side on a dirt trail and eventual quiet back streets to Half Moon Bay. Though I love the view of the Pacific from Highway 1, it can be a hairy ride, especially at rush hour and on weekends. On the ride yesterday, I didn’t ride Highway 1 once.

Sean

(Sent from phone)

[Bill Lindsay]

That’s amazing Sean! Here’s to taking the long way! Fantastic!

BL in EC

[Kellie]

YAY Sean!