Wrecked my Atlantis

[John G.]

Yesterday, at 5:30 in the morning, I collided head-on with another cyclist. I was on a path along the Hudson river on the Jersey side, and the guy had no lights. And I went over the bars.

Thankfully, I'm all right, but my Atlantis is pretty messed up, and I'd like to get the lists advice . The fork is badly bent, and my local shop thinks that the Head tube maybe messed up. They're stripping it down and sending it to Bilenky to see if it can be realigned. Do any of you think that's a bad move?

I don't want to think about how much worse it would've been if I had been riding a carbon bike. I'm pretty bummed. The worst part is that the other guy swore at me and threw my water bottle at me while I was lying on the ground. Called me some names I won't repeat here, and rode off before I was even able to get up. Sometimes I really hate riding around here.

Anyway, be safe out there and hug your Rivendells tonight!

[bill.b...@gmail.com]

John, how are YOU? I’m always more sore the next day, so make sure you are extra good to your body and mind. Bilenky sound like a great choice for repair advice. Bikes can be replaced, no matter how wonderful.

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 Yesterday, at 5:30 in the morning, I collided head-on with another cyclist. I was on a path along the Hudson river on the Jersey side, and the guy had no lights.  And I went over the bars. 

 Thankfully, I'm all right, but my Atlantis is pretty messed up,  and I'd like to get the lists advice . The fork is badly bent, and my local shop thinks that the Head tube maybe messed up. They're stripping  it down and sending it to Bilenky to see if it can be realigned. Do any of you think that's a bad move?

 I don't want to think about how much worse it would've been if I had been riding a carbon bike.  I'm pretty bummed. The worst part is that the other guy swore at me and threw my water bottle at me while I was lying on the ground.  Called me some names I won't repeat here, and rode off before I was even able to get up.   Sometimes I really hate riding around here.

Anyway, be safe out there and hug your Rivendells tonight!

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[jeffrey kane]

Damn John,

Very sorry to hear that -- and glad to hear you're not hurt. I frequent paths along both sides the Hudson, often as early as 6:00 - 6:30am. No doubt it was pretty much pitch black at that hour yesterday.

I'd guess if your shop thinks your frame warrants a trip to Belinky they're likely correct -- those guys know what they're doing and aren't unfamiliar with Rivs, either.

Can't speak to the bottle throwing cyclist .. but I know what you mean. 

[Lee Legrand]

I will 3rd that recommendation.

I do not know of any frame builders in NJ but the closest one I believe is Stephen Bilenky so your frame is going to the right place. Glad you are ok as well. There is also Winter Bicycle that recently moved from the west coast here so that is two in the vicinity but Bilenky should do you well.  Make sure you stop by the bike show which I believe will be soon in Pennsylvania started by Bilenky.

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[John G.]

Thanks, guys! Glad to hear Bilenky comes highly recommended. I checked out the Philly show last year, and it was awesome. I'm definitely pretty damn sore, but I'm honestly just relieved that I'm in one piece.

Gotta give a shout out to my local shop, Jersey Cycles. They were a sympathetic shoulder to cry on, and immediately started working to get my Atlantis back in shape. I think they were almost as upset as I was.

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[Lee Legrand]

New Jersey Cycles in Linden or Elizabeth?

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[Jon Dukeman,central Colorado]

So sorry but glad you are okay.
Check underneath the down tube just behind the head tube for any bulges. Commonly caused by head on crashes.
I hope you are back on the road soon.
Jon

[Matt B.]

Ouch! That sucks, especially with the other guy adding insult to injury. Really glad to hear you're OK man.

I wouldn't be surprised if your Atlantis can't be made good as new--  I bent a fork pretty badly on my touring bike a few years ago and that was fixable (no damage evident to the HT or DT).  Also just this summer bent the fork on my Quickbeam when a falling tree landed on my front wheel in a freak JRA incident. The fork was bent and a cantilever boss was sheared off that time-- luckily Riv sent me a replacement fork for reasonable money, but otherwise I think the old fork is fixable with some proper re-alignment and a torch.

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:30:11 PM UTC-4, John G. wrote:

[John G.]

Jersey Cycles in Jersey City!

[Kainalu V.]

Yikes! Heal up quick. Hopefully you've got another bike to roll in the meantime while it's off in the capable hands of Bilenky (get some S&S couplers while they're bringing it back to new?) And in the future may you never need frame correction, but if you do and want to stay local, Johnny Coast is great and in Brooklyn - http://coastcycles.nyc/

-Kai

BK NY

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:30:11 PM UTC-4, John G. wrote:

[Mark in Beacon]

Sorry to hear this, John. I'm glad you are okay. I see too many riders around my town riding without lights, or even light clothing. In fact, I was thinking the other night, coming home from a friend's house, I'm more likely to crash into another cyclist I didn't see that to get bonked by a car.

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:30:11 PM UTC-4, John G. wrote:

[William!]

Glad you are OK, John! Sucks that the other guy was such a jerk about it. Who does that??

I wrecked my Atlantis last winter, just got it back from TiCycles with new tubes, new fork and a new paint job. You might check your home owners or renters insurance policy to see if they might cover it. In my case they did (driver did not stay on scene).

[Lee Legrand]

Did not know they had a cycle shop in Jersey city. One of the most diverse cities in New Jersey, also one of the most crowded cities since it is close to New York City.

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[dougP]

John:

That's one vicious crash, and one seriously irresponsible party.  If you need a new fork, Rivendell may have some available, but you'd need to call them to confirm.  If so, that would save the hassle of color matching, assuming your Atlantis is the original color.

dougP

[Patrick Moore]

Dammit, I'm sorry, and I wish you'd been able to tackle the son of a bitch and hold him for satisfaction. Asshole.

I'd have taken a baseball bat to, if not the rider, at least his bike.

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[Philip Williamson]

I’m sorry to hear this. On the upside, Bilenky is more than legit. Frankly, the repair work will ADD value to the bike.

Philip
www.biketinker.com
Santa Rosa, CA

[Leslie]

Glad you're alright, and sorry about the attitude of the other fellow...   

Bilenky is great: I had RBW send some dropouts to Bilenky so they could replace the bent hanger: did a *beautiful* job on the metalwork. 
https://www.flickr.com/photos/leslie_bright/24133962382/in/album-72157623199721925/
(They would have powder-coated it for me, too, but I wanted to preserve as much of the original paint, so I had them not deal w/ the paint after they did the metalwork, then I painted the rear ends of the triangles.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/leslie_bright/23946265090/in/album-72157623199721925/)

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:30:11 PM UTC-4, John G. wrote:

[Lee Legrand]

To Patrick Moore,

It's Jersey.  Home of bad drivers and cyclist who ride on sidewalks and against traffic on regular basis.  You have to be extra careful getting around NJ since everyone tends to be Formula 1 race car drivers and the way they drive, they translate that into the cycling habits as well.  One last thing, if he did the violence as you suggested, he would have been in worst shape. We tend to be more coarse in our language and attitude and if violence erupts, it will erupt in a way that you did not intend it to since his bicycle shop location tells me he lives near the major cities. Jersey city and cities around that location are near the NYC were most of their jobs are and people tend to live in those locations.  Those locations have a dense population so people can be hostile and the NYC environment of fast pace makes it worst.  Sometimes, you have to let things go, even when you are right.

--

[alan lavine]

John,

Are you referring to "River Road" that runs through Palisades Interstate Park?  We ride there all the time, and the riders heading south reach very fast speeds, because they can.  I said to my wife just the other day that when riding in the city, the other cyclists have become more dangerous than the cars. Especially in Jersey.  Especially when crossing the GW bridge.  Its just nuts.

Glad you are OK, but it'll be rough getting out of bed tomorrow.  My best..

Alan

NYC

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:30:11 PM UTC-4, John G. wrote:

[Lee Legrand]

Its New Jersey Alan.

Home of the worst drivers.

--

[John Hawrylak]

I live in far southern NJ, very rural.  Although the northern people may be tougher, the driving up in the Newark area is not much differnet than in Philly or any major city.  I would be careful about too many stereotypes.

John Hawrylak

Woodstown NJ 

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:46:23 AM UTC-4, Lee Legrand wrote:

Its New Jersey Alan.

Home of the worst drivers.

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 10:41 AM, alan lavine <ciga...@gmail.com> wrote:

John,

Are you referring to "River Road" that runs through Palisades Interstate Park?  We ride there all the time, and the riders heading south reach very fast speeds, because they can.  I said to my wife just the other day that when riding in the city, the other cyclists have become more dangerous than the cars. Especially in Jersey.  Especially when crossing the GW bridge.  Its just nuts.

Glad you are OK, but it'll be rough getting out of bed tomorrow.  My best..

Alan

NYC

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:30:11 PM UTC-4, John G. wrote:

Yesterday, at 5:30 in the morning, I collided head-on with another cyclist. I was on a path along the Hudson river on the Jersey side, and the guy had no lights.  And I went over the bars.

 Thankfully, I'm all right, but my Atlantis is pretty messed up,  and I'd like to get the lists advice . The fork is badly bent, and my local shop thinks that the Head tube maybe messed up. They're stripping  it down and sending it to Bilenky to see if it can be realigned. Do any of you think that's a bad move?

 I don't want to think about how much worse it would've been if I had been riding a carbon bike.  I'm pretty bummed. The worst part is that the other guy swore at me and threw my water bottle at me while I was lying on the ground.  Called me some names I won't repeat here, and rode off before I was even able to get up.   Sometimes I really hate riding around here.

Anyway, be safe out there and hug your Rivendells tonight!

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[Deacon Patrick]

Och! Makes me thankful I mostly have to deal with the occasional bear, mountain lion, and buck deer and bull elk in rut. Thankful your mostly OK. Heal well, and keep that beautiful positive attitude!

With abandon,

Patrick 

[Lee Legrand]

Hi John,

I live in NJ and in the north.  It is not a stereotype, unfortunately.

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[Garth]

I feel for ya John , had more than my share of "stuff happens" !

As "tempting" as revenge in some manner seems, it only turns the "victim" into a "perp" and it never ends, now both parties are both perps and victims and all is chaos. Once is more than enough, thank you !

Just today on a lonesome and wide open 2 lane stretch of coarse chip 'n seal tarmac road a car approaching me suddenly started fishtailing towards me.... I was about to dive into the grassy ditch, but a wheel in the grass on one side and then one in the other side .... he righted his car and drove on by . Wow, that was my halloween adrenaline rush for the year !

[John Hawrylak]

Deacon

If called by a panther, don't anther

John Hawrylak

Woodstown NJ

[Eric Floden]

Ooo

Shades of Ogden Nashbar...

--

[Deacon Patrick]

Aye, John. If they try to horn in on my, I put things on paws, then hoof it so I needn't bearly claw my way free.

With abandon,

Patrick

[John Hawrylak]

Eric

Double Ooo,  I never would have thought of adding the bar to Nash.

I really enjoyed this

John Hawrylak

Woodstown NJ

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 7:47:18 PM UTC-4, ericf3 wrote:

Ooo

Shades of Ogden Nashbar...

On Oct 13, 2017 4:44 PM, "John Hawrylak" <John.H...@verizon.net> wrote:

Deacon

If called by a panther, don't anther

John Hawrylak

Woodstown NJ

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 7:09:50 PM UTC-4, Deacon Patrick wrote:

Och! Makes me thankful I mostly have to deal with the occasional bear, mountain lion, and buck deer and bull elk in rut. Thankful your mostly OK. Heal well, and keep that beautiful positive attitude!

With abandon,

Patrick 

On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 5:30:11 PM UTC-6, John G. wrote:

Yesterday, at 5:30 in the morning, I collided head-on with another cyclist. I was on a path along the Hudson river on the Jersey side, and the guy had no lights.  And I went over the bars.

 Thankfully, I'm all right, but my Atlantis is pretty messed up,  and I'd like to get the lists advice . The fork is badly bent, and my local shop thinks that the Head tube maybe messed up. They're stripping  it down and sending it to Bilenky to see if it can be realigned. Do any of you think that's a bad move?

 I don't want to think about how much worse it would've been if I had been riding a carbon bike.  I'm pretty bummed. The worst part is that the other guy swore at me and threw my water bottle at me while I was lying on the ground.  Called me some names I won't repeat here, and rode off before I was even able to get up.   Sometimes I really hate riding around here.

Anyway, be safe out there and hug your Rivendells tonight!

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[Mark in Beacon]

Yes, Lee, actually what you wrote is the definition of "stereotype": a widely held but fixed and oversimplified image or idea of a particular type of person or thing.

There are nutballs behind the wheel or on wheels in all fifty States and many other places around the world. There are also many responsible drivers and cyclists in New Jersey and elsewhere. There are lots of people in between these two poles. Some people living in cities are hostile. Many are not. Some people who own Rivendells only wear wool underwear. Many do not. Etc.etc. etc.

[Lee Legrand]

It is not a particular person or thing.  New Jersey drivers are pretty bad. Not all but if you live in upper NJ driving down many main roads, you will find it the case.  I have never heard of anyone complain about any state drivers unlike NJ drivers.  These are facts people who live in upper NJ will complain will tell you.  Part of the reason for this is because the state is very congested and main roads can become pretty crowded to the point of a parking lot.  30 minute drives turn into hour or more during the week.  Summer is pretty bad since many people are going to the shore.  As a person who has lived here all my life, I pretty much try to stay off of the road.  I do not know if you live in the state or not but if you do not, you do not know what you are talking about.

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[Lee Legrand]

I rescinded my last comment since it sounds rude but NJ drivers are not like every driver in the 50 states no more than NJ/ NYC residence are like every other resident in the fifty states.  Some states spring different people based on the environment there.  I do think NJ/NYC residence are more aggressive and can be course than say CA,WA or Oregon residence. All due the environment which one is from and what people pick up from the environment as norm.  So a person can do something that is normal but be wrong in doing so because so many do it as well.  When it comes to driving, I think this is the case.  I cant speak for other states but driving in NJ and speaking to people in NJ which I am familiar with more, there is an aggressiveness and yes, this does not mean everyone and I doubt it is just a few but a moderate size.  The more you move away from the populus area of the north, the more I think you wont see it as much. This is my last comment because this post is not about NJ but a John Rivendell Atlantis.

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 10:27 PM, Lee Legrand <krm...@gmail.com> wrote:

It is not a particular person or thing.  New Jersey drivers are pretty bad. Not all but if you live in upper NJ driving down many main roads, you will find it the case.  I have never heard of anyone complain about any state drivers unlike NJ drivers.  These are facts people who live in upper NJ will complain will tell you.  Part of the reason for this is because the state is very congested and main roads can become pretty crowded to the point of a parking lot.  30 minute drives turn into hour or more during the week.  Summer is pretty bad since many people are going to the shore.  As a person who has lived here all my life, I pretty much try to stay off of the road.  I do not know if you live in the state or not but if you do not, you do not know what you are talking about.

[Grant @ Rivendell]

Hey John,

Echo all the sympathies etc from the great emo support and good advice group here. Here's what Riv can add--

We have an unofficial non-policy of mimizing the financial fixit or replacement pain for hard-luck cases, accidents. Let me repeat the unofficial part. We do it often as we hear and are able to.

Thought on repair: almost always an option on a lugged steel bike, but most practical when you're on tour in the Seychelles. Seven or so times a year Riv riders wreck their bikes and want to know whether they're wrecked enuf to hav to fix. Our public answer is always super prudent---yes if it's a bent dropout, No if it's a bent fork, Yes if only one tube is wrinkled or minorly buckled but nit enuf to steepen the head tube angle; No if top AND down tube are buckled badly. Replacing both tubes often means rplacing the head tube too, and the whole shebang -- with new fancy paint--can cost $1,400.

If WF built the frame, they'll beat those prices. Coordinate with us, ship to them and deal with them as directly as possible, and the price will be close to half what it is elsewhere--plus shipping, of course. They don't offer the same for toyo-built frames.

Alternatively, we can offer (always unofficially) a sympathy price on a new frame. You send us the old one you box, your freight), and you get a new one cheap--whether it's the same model, an equivalent (Appaloosa, in this case), or another unequalent model--like a Roadeo, Clem, whatever.  The point is, we understand your sitution and unofficiially try to help make it better. When our inventory is good, it's easier.

This IS unofficial, but we'e done it several times in the past, when the stars are aligned, the customer is a typical nice-fantastic Riv-liker, and we're in a good mood and things don't get complicated by third-party input, friends or relatives or bikeshops speaking for you, and so on!

Grant

[Alan LaVine,]

In my experience, there is a kernel of truth in most stereotypes. When the same anecdotal observation is repeated over and over, it turns into a stereotype.  Which means it happens commonly but not always.

Alan

NYC and frequent rider in NJ.

Sent from my iPad

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[Mark in Beacon]

Be the change, Lee. Be the change.

Mark in Beacon, 20yrs NYC, Mom Lives Jersey Shore

[Lynne Fitz]

+1 on Rivendell helping out on a crashed bike. My Bleriot is better than new!

[Garth]

In regards to certain drivers(or any stereotype) in certain areas being "the worst" , I have lived in a number of areas and I have often heard those locals to the area exclaim it. I won't bother to say where, because it's every-where and no-where. It does not matter the time either, it's the same now as it was then, pick any then. It is in the eye( I ) of the beholder, self-identification .

[Ann L]

I'm really sorry about the bike.  I  hope it turns out to be fixable.  I'm also glad you weren't seriously hurt.

[Lee Legrand]

Garth,

Cant speak for anywhere else besides NJ since this is where I spent most of my time. We can always generalize by saying there are bad drivers everywhere, of course there is, but what of size do we see it? I do not know everywhere but I do know of my driving experience in Jersey.  Its of moderate size and although there are drivers of different states that come thru, my experience of out of state drivers is that there are not as risky oriented as New Jersey drivers and they tell me it is tough going thru Jersey because of the traffic and driving style here.

To John,

Keep us posted on what you do with your Atlantis.

On Sat, Oct 14, 2017 at 11:34 AM, 'Ann L' via RBW Owners Bunch <rbw-owne...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

I'm really sorry about the bike.  I  hope it turns out to be fixable.  I'm also glad you weren't seriously hurt.

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[Joe Bernard]

This stereotype is certainly true about San Francisco compared to other cities around here. Different areas have different vibes, and the one in SF is cut-thrust-pounce. You quickly adapt to that style of driving or find yourself being pushed out of the way all day. It's simply not true that all areas share the same style.

[John G.]

Again, thanks for the advice and sympathy, everyone. I don't want to overgeneralize NJ drivers, but I think the abiding sense of danger I feel when riding in Hudson/Bergen is more a matter of incredibly congested and poorly maintained roads than ill intent. There's a ton of great riding in other parts of the state, and the drivers are mostly friendly.

Finally: I always wondered why Rivendell emphasized the strength and safety of their bikes. I get it now. This would've been so much worse on CF bike.

[John Hawrylak]

John G

What have you decided on your repair method???   

John Hawrylak

Woodstown NJ

[William R.]

Hi John,

Sorry to hear of your accident. Hope you are feeling better. I live across the river in Westchester. It’s not hard to imagine such a thing happening. These things happen anywhere.

Are you thinking about Grants Appaloosa option? Not sure what size Atlantis you have, but if you are interested in seeing and/or trying one, I’ve got one. It’s a 58. Same intended purpose as an Atlantis, but different, I love mine.

Bill in Westchester, NY