Waves Plugins with Flo Tools

[Jesse Kragiel]

Hey y'all! Does anyone know if it's possible to create some sort of plugin view where the Waves tool bar is accessible with Flo Tools to load plugin presets and such things? I've gotten sighted people to click on the load screen, and a menu comes up that's accessible with Voiceover, but getting there independently is a different story altogether. The Waves stuff sounds better than anything else I have, and I'd even love to use the IR reverbs, but at this point, that's impossible since we have no way of loading impulse files. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

[CHUCK REICHEL]

Hi Jesse,

Email this guy at Waves and tell him about the ir impulses.

Amir Vinci <am...@waves.com>

Don't forget to mention Apples screenreader VoiceOver.

He'll get it happening for you. :)

PS I use the Waves IR every session! :)

Talk soon

Chuck

On Feb 28, 2017, at 10:37 AM, Jesse Kragiel wrote:

Hey y'all! Does anyone know if it's possible to create some sort of plugin view where the Waves tool bar is accessible with Flo Tools to load plugin presets and such things? I've gotten sighted people to click on the load screen, and a menu comes up that's accessible with Voiceover, but getting there independently is a different story altogether. The Waves stuff sounds better than anything else I have, and I'd even love to use the IR reverbs, but at this point, that's impossible since we have no way of loading impulse files. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

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[Jesse Kragiel]

Thanks Chuck! You and some of the other PT vets sure are a blessing and a help to us newbies.

Sent from my iPhone

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[Slau Halatyn]

Hi Jesse,

Yes, it's absolutely possible to do that and once people have done it for a plug-in and shared it, others can benefit from it. I don't use Waves plug-ins (although I have a couple of their bundles). One issue with the Waves toolbar is that it dynamically changes along with the particular plug-in. So, for example, the location of the Load button in the L2 plug-in is different from the X Click Load button. I have no idea how much the plug-in toolbars differ among the various Waves plug-ins. I've created a plug-in view for the L2 with the basic toolbar button positions and they work for bringing up menus and such. I'm not likely to spend the time mapping out coordinates for the various controls but, of course, other users are free to do so and share the plug-in views.  If you're not subscribed to the PTAccess Drop Box, forward the email address you use and I'll send an invite. There you'll find some of the plug-in view documents.

Best,

Slau

On Feb 28, 2017, at 10:37 AM, Jesse Kragiel <jessek...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hey y'all! Does anyone know if it's possible to create some sort of plugin view where the Waves tool bar is accessible with Flo Tools to load plugin presets and such things? I've gotten sighted people to click on the load screen, and a menu comes up that's accessible with Voiceover, but getting there independently is a different story altogether. The Waves stuff sounds better than anything else I have, and I'd even love to use the IR reverbs, but at this point, that's impossible since we have no way of loading impulse files. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

[Jesse Kragiel]

Thanks Slau! The email I use is jessek...@gmail.com, same as for this list! Thanks so much!

Sent from my iPhone

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[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Now adays, can a sighted person install Waves plugins and activate them totally on their own with no sighted help. I know in the past, even after they apparently, from what I hear dropped the iLok scheme, it still! wasn't all that accessible.

 

I'm just wonderring what the status on this is.

 

I have the custom presets for the CLA2A, and have had someone sighted help me get those installed, but I'm now seriously considerring looking at more of those plugs. I just don't know what's accessible or for that mind, if any of these offer trials so I can try them in perspective with my own sessions before actually buying 'em. It's one thing to hear someone else's session that used them, but I really want to hear them with my own stuff to see if it would be worth my investment.

 

Chris.

[Jesse Kragiel]

You still need sighted assistance for Waves Central which installs and activates plugins.

Sent from my iPhone

--

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Dang! That stinks!

 

Chris.

 

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[TheOreoMonster]

Sighted assistance is still needed, however waves support is good about using team viewer to get you up and running if needed. Demos of the plug ins are available and you will need to activate the demos through the same method I using waves central I believe. 

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[CHUCK REICHEL]

Hi,

Yes Waves will remote in to your box and take care of all that for you.

Drop Amir an email and tell him you need help with Waves because of their VoiceOver accessibility issues;

Amir Vinci <am...@waves.com>

Amir Vinci is Director of Pro Audio Products Waves Audio Ltd He's just under the CEO! ;)

While your at it heres the CEO and He checks this email address below;

Gilad Keren <gi...@waves.com>

Talk soon

[Jesse Kragiel]

Amir's the man! I emailed him this mrning and he got right back with me. It may not be overnight, but Waves seems to care about our needs, and that's a wonderful thing! They make incredible sounding plugins, and right now, I'm absolutely in love with the SSL series! They add character to a mix just by adding them, even without tweaking anything!

Sent from my iPhone

[John Covici]

I heard waves has a great auto gain plug in which I would love to use
-- is it possible with voiceover?

Thanks.

On Tue, 28 Feb 2017 11:18:43 -0500,
Slau Halatyn wrote:
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--
Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is:
How do
you spend it?

John Covici
cov...@ccs.covici.com

[Jesse Kragiel]

Most controls in their plugins are exposed, so I'm sure it's possible. Which plugin are you referring to?

Sent from my iPhone

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[John Covici]

Well, I can't remember the name, but someone at Sweetwater told me
about a waves plugin that did autogain and I would like to use this
with pt. I will have to check and see what kind of license I already
have, etc.

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

I'm curious why things are not accessible, if they care about accessibility? It's been now what... almost 4 years, if not more, since I first heard about these guys, and things still are not any more accessible than they were back in the days?

 

In you all's defense, yes, they will help remote in and take care of things for you, but that still should never be a sollution for considerring good accessibility, and now with A11Y being where it is, I'm not sure this would fall under that, probably not, but, still...

 

Chris.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Jesse Kragiel

To: ptac...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, February 28, 2017 5:38 PM

Subject: Re: Waves installation?

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Are you talking about the CLA2A? That's kind of an auto gain. It's a compressor, but in a sense, that's basically kind a what it does, is to auto gain things.

 

Chris.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: John Covici

To: ptac...@googlegroups.com

[Jesse Kragiel]

Chris, a few things actually stand in the way. One of them is the cross-platform nature of the plugins. They write the foundational code once to make it work in both Mac and Windows. The other thing is that they run within what ever host they're installed in. The other hurtle is that Apple itself has not made the mouse pointer accessible at all. If there were a way for us to actually hear what was under the mouse, then there's probably a lot more we could actually do regarding many plugins that sighted people take for granted. The first line of questioning may need to go to Apple, as an accessible way to move and hear what the mouse pointer lands on could really make a difference. Waves has a large install base, and very little of it is blind. They're completely aware of their software's limitations, and are doing what they can to help us, including even expressing interest in doing so. You forget that just a few years ago, neither Logic nor Pro Tools were accessible for us at all! Windows users still can't enjoy PT, and the Sonar solution we used to enjoy is now 6 or 7 versions out of date. I'd say access has come a long way, and first and foremost, we should be thankful for what we have, while continuing to encourage developers to work on solutions for us. We got here, not because we were bullies, but because we were politely expressive in wanting access.

Sent from my iPhone

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Very valid points made. I stand corrected, and apologize. My comments were uncalled for. Forgive me.

[Jesse Kragiel]

Oh I wasn't trying to be patronizing, but in this day where everyone feels entitled, and protests and makes a scene when they feel they've been slighted, it's always good to remember that those tactics sometimes get results, but not the ones we necessarily want. It's kinda like when the NFB thought it would be cute to discuss a class action against Avid and other companies. I much prefer things going the way they are with healthy dialog between us and manufacturers. Full access may take longer, but in the end, I believe the level of it will be far better.

Sent from my iPhone

[CHUCK REICHEL]

Hi Jesse,

Just to give a bit of Waves accessibility history.

The Waves tool bar use to be accessible back in the day!

They have been made aware of the change in accessibility for a while now.

Thats the reason I posted those email addresses.

Its now time for Waves to hear from the blind engineers out there not just my self or Mike!

A very easy quick accessibility feature "fix" you guys might mention is for Waves   to provide the pro tools presets for there plugs with all Waves plugs at installation.

As usual professional courtesy  and spell checking is always a nice idea! :)

So heres the CEO and His top guys email to let them know I'm not the only 1 out here!

Gilad Keren <gi...@waves.com>, Amir Vinci <am...@waves.com>

Even if  you don't own any Waves products let them know "nicely" your $ is waiting on them to do the right thing!

Talk soon

Chuck

[Jesse Kragiel]

Chuck,

I mentioned the preset thing to Amir in my email of yesterday. It really does almost seem quicker for them to be able to make the toolbar accessible though, or at least give us a key command to open the presets list. I definitely do love their stuff though!

Sent from my iPhone

[CHUCK REICHEL]

Hi Jesse,

,

Great.

The presets and key commands are a good quick fix.

In fact the key commands would make it faster for sighted users I believe.

Not having to direct the mouse and so forth and so forth. :)

May be we can get 50 or 100 of the list to make the same suggestions to Amir and see them implemented ASAP!

Jesse, What part of the "globe" are you located in?

Talk soon

Chuck

[TheOreoMonster]

Hey Jesse, 

Can you clarify what you mean the mouse pointer and hearing wats under it isn’t accessible? In VO settings I can set VO cursor to follow mouse pointer and move the mouse or track pad and have VO report whats under the mouse. I have used this numerous times to click on checkboxes and buttons on websites and etc that didn’t respond to keyboard commands. This was also a great work around for accessing the menus extra area or the status bar back in the days of it not being accessible. However this can only work if the element under the mouse is visible to VO already. So in this case it seems the wave toolbar would first need to be visible to VO before using the mouse would be a worthwhile solution. So was just a little confused by what you meant if you don’t mind clarifying.

Thanks, 

[Jesse Kragiel]

In other words, make the mouse pointer as accessible on Mac as Jaws used to on the PC. Yes, the elements would have to be accessible to VO, but there should be a way to make them so. At this point, if we can't get to something with the keyboard in VO, then VO won't read its elements with the mouse either.

Sent from my iPhone

[TheOreoMonster]

I imagine they are probably referring to the line of rider plug ins. Vocal rider, bass rider etc.  You set the max  and minimum amount of gain and it will “ride the vocal or bass” for you to keep it in that range that you set.  Supposed to be a work around for having to write automation to do this.  Some compressors like the one mentioned in the previous email can do similar things but its doing it by limiting or compressing the dynamic range of the audio so it can keep it closer to one level. The rider plug ins just essentially turn the volume up and down with out actually effecting the audio in any way if I understand how they   work correctly. 

[Slau Halatyn]

This is no different from any concern over UI elements being accessible to the OS. Actually, this is both the pro and con. As Steve said, items that are visible can be spoken when navigated over with the mouse but, by that same token, if they're visible, one need not use the mouse, per se. The issue with plug-ins is that they are their own environment and can be authored in any of several different development platforms. Unfortunately, it's not as easy as saying to a developer, "Hey, make your toolbar accessible, please." This has to be a coordinated effort with not only Avid but other DAW platforms. Keyboard shortcuts will get us most of the way but some things will be more challenging and there isn't a simple solution. Nevertheless, raising awareness is OK but, without the cooperation of the other dAW platforms, we're spinning our wheels.

[John Covici]

I will have to ask again and see what it was.

On Wed, 01 Mar 2017 08:56:36 -0500,
Christopher-Mark Gilland wrote:
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[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

I know you weren't, but still, the way I responded probably wasn't the most appropriate, admittedly.

 

Anyway, it's all good.