kivy license

[Slavina]

Hello Mathieu, Thomas, Gabriel, Akshay, Brian, and Jeff,

 

I'd like to find out if you guys have any future plans to offer Kivy under a commercial license. If so, I'd be interested to find out more about the time frame and other details. Please, respond directly to me: slavi...@gmail.com

 

 

Thank you!

Slavina

[Slavina]

Hi guys,

any response would be greatly appreciated! I'm evaluating your framework for use in a commercial product and we are trying to avoid and pitfalls that the LGPL license might present.

Please let me know at your earliest convenience.

If you don't plan on having a commercially licensed Kivy offering, then I'd really appreciate more insight on how LGPL affects software written in Python (since LGPL is mostly in regards to C/C++).
It seems like there's a lot of gray area there.


Best Regards,
Slavina

[ZenCODE]

Hi Slavia

Perhaps it's just me, but it's really not clear what you mean by the "pitfalls of the LGPL" license. You can release closed source, proprietary apps using Kivy and not give away your code (given that python and often be reverse engineered) . The only cravat is that if you change the actual Kivy code, you must contribute this back (that's my understanding anyway).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Lesser_General_Public_License

It's a wonderfully free, fair, open and generous license, one that our commercial company is 100% behind. The pitfall is..? ;-)

Thanks

[B. Jack]

I think M$ propaganda is the reason so many companies misunderstand free software licenses such as the (L)GPL.  That M$ refers to the (L)GPL as a 'cancer' should indicate their malice towards free software a mile away.

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Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2013 19:44:45 -0700
From: zenkey....@gmail.com
To: kivy-...@googlegroups.com
Subject: [kivy-users] Re: kivy license

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[Slavina Koleva-Carulli]

Hi,

 

 

LGPL is tricky and it's interpretation of Python software is not entirely clear, because of the terminology static vs dynamic library, as well as the term inheritance, which implies derivative work. From Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_Lesser_General_Public_License):

 

The main difference between the GPL and the LGPL is that the latter allows the work to be linked with (in the case of a library, 'used by') a non-(L)GPLed program, regardless of whether it is free software or proprietary software.^[1] The non-(L)GPLed program can then be distributed under any terms if it is not a derivative work. If it is a derivative work, then the program's terms must allow for "modification for the customer's own use and reverse engineering for debugging such modifications." Whether a work that uses an LGPL program is a derivative work or not is a legal issue. A standalone executable that dynamically links to a library, through a .so, .dll, or similar medium, is generally accepted as not being a derivative work (as defined by the LGPL). It would fall under the definition of a "work that uses the Library". The following is an excerpt of paragraph 5 of the LGPL version 2.1:

A program that contains no derivative of any portion of the Library, but is designed to work with the Library by being compiled or linked with it, is called a "work that uses the Library". Such a work, in isolation, is not a derivative work of the Library, and therefore falls outside the scope of this License.

Essentially, if it is a "work that uses the library", then it must be possible for the software to be linked with a newer version of the LGPL-covered program. The most commonly used method for doing so is to use "a suitable shared library mechanism for linking". Alternatively, a statically linked library is allowed if either source code or linkable object files are provided.^[

^{--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------}

 

Open source software is wonderful but any company that creates proprietary software which includes LGPL licensed pieces has to ensure that those pieces don't make their proprietary software open source.

 

My goal here is to ensure exactly that. Here's another link that talks a bit about Python:

http://stackoverflow.com/questions/8580223/using-python-module-on-lgpl-license-in-commercial-product

It suggests that it SHOULD be ok, however, inference, common sense, and 'someone said so' are really not solid legal arguments ...

 

Thank you for your input.

 

Regards,
Slavina

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[ZenCODE]

Thanks for that. Very informative. Unfortunately, I can't really comment or give advice on the legal side, but for myself, I'm going on trust here. Anyone who releases under the LGPL must have good intentions and are not going to sue the moment you get successful. 

The important thing is to give credit and give back. It's a symbiotic relationship. Helping others is ultimately helping yourself. We are not islands, but sit on the work of thousands of others. Honor that, and I doubt there will be issues.

Disclaimer: That is probably not good legal advice, so don't quote me. I'm getting sappy. Too happy. Been coding Kivy since 4 this morning (woke up, realized I should subclass FloatLayout i.s.o. Button, had to code it), so it's to be expected ;-)

[ZenCODE]

Have you seen this? https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/kivy-users/AYOBaI11TnY

Kivy is now MIT licensed. And I'm guessing that's mainly based on your concerns. Now tell me these peeps do not rock! ;-) Kivy FTW!

[Slavina]

this is awesome news!!! thanks for the update.

 

The Kivy team DOES rock!