Gayatri Dhyanashloka

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venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 14, 2018, 5:45:28 AM7/14/18
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Dear Learned Members,


The attached Shloka of Gayatri is from the Bodhayana Brahmakarma Samucchaya. 

There is some controversy on the correct shloka wrt guna/ gada (shubhram kapalam gunam/gadam)..

I am confused on whether Gayatri Devi is holding a gada or guna (what is this in terms of instrument?).

Can you please clarify which is the appropriate word here?

Many thanks,

Venkat

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Venkata Sriram

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Jul 14, 2018, 6:49:27 AM7/14/18
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Both the variations are correct.  

gadA - mace
guNa - rope

rgs,
sriram

venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 14, 2018, 6:53:22 AM7/14/18
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Dear Sir: Thanks for the clarification. 

Are there separate sources for each version?

Thanks.

Venkata Sriram

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Jul 14, 2018, 6:56:01 AM7/14/18
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Namaste,

Considering these पाठभेदाः, it is always better to learn the anuSTAna, mantra-shAstra etc. from one's spiritual preceptor otherwise confusions arise.  

I learnt Chandi Sapthasathi under a great sanskrit scholar.  While learning, I used to compare with other books like Gita Press, Ramakrishna Mutt Publications, Chowkhamba, Sringeri Mutt Publication etc.  Slight variations were there.  I used to ask whether our pATha is correct or not.  Our acharya used to nod that ours is absolutely correct and no need to worry and that's how he learnt from his acharya.  Then I compared the meanings by referring Amarakosha etc. and found to be correct in meanings. 

This is how the tradition is followed.  Without tradition and acharya, one is bound to get confusions when one encounter pATha-bhEdAs.  One should have sound knowledge of sanskrit and also have a good sampradAya teacher.

rgs,
sriram

On Saturday, July 14, 2018 at 3:15:28 PM UTC+5:30, venkat veeraraghavan wrote:

venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 14, 2018, 7:29:09 AM7/14/18
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Dear Shri Sriram ji--

I agree 100% on all the points you make. But in these times where even my father and grandfather have no clue and since "Brahmopadesam" is given father to son, where do I look for a sampradayic teacher?

Thanks,

Venkat

venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 14, 2018, 8:27:37 AM7/14/18
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Also what does She have in Her hands where it says ankushakashAh (elephant's goad and ? (I always thought that was the rope? ))...
Is there a root source for this sloka? There is a mention in Sarada Tilaka, but since it was a compendium the original source has to  be earlier.
This begs the next questions:

1. Why a dhyana sloka for Gayatri when the devata of the "gayatri mantra" is Savita?
2. The rk 3.62.10 RV is called the Savitri and the mantra preceded by pranava and mahavyahriti is traditionally called Gayatri. But where does this unified form of "Gayatri" have its place/ significance with 5 heads 10 hands and different instruments in each hand?

Although in Narayana Up. the AvAhana mantra with AyAtu varadA devI...ending in the mantra with 7 vyahritis, the form of the Devi is not mentioned as in muktA vidruma...

Can you please write in detail about these points if possible?

Many thanks,

Venkat 

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 14, 2018, 3:04:23 PM7/14/18
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Some use 

ध्येयस्सदा सवितृमण्डलमध्यवर्ती नारायणस्सरसिजासनसन्निविष्टः। 
केयूरवान् मकरकुण्डलवान् किरीटी हारी हिरण्मयवपुः धृतशङ्खचक्रः॥ 

as dhyaana s'loka in stead of 

मुक्ताविद्रुम  ...

I was told that 

Vaishnavas use  ध्येयस्सदा .......

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

guNa is bowstring , not rope.

---------------------------------------------------------
तत्त्वार्थवर्णात्मिकां

is the clue /key /कीलकं

to realise that all the other descriptions are related to the tattva.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Those who do not want to do saakaara dhyaana may discard this verse and retain only

यो देवस्सवितास्माकं .....

for dhyaana.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The aayudhas in the saakaara dhyaana s'loka muktaavidruma .. are not unusual. Their taattvikaartha in the images of all the devatas is almost the same.

gadaa is more usual than guNa among these.

I don't know other occasions where guNa is separately mentioned wthout dhanus.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There is an older thread with links to other still older threads on gaayatri





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Nagaraj Paturi
 
Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.


BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies
 
FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,
 
(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )
 
 
 

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 12:14:17 AM7/15/18
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Probably on the basis of त्रीक्षणैः and इन्दुनिबद्धमकुटां some people opined that there is S'ava influence on मुक्ताविद्रुम .......

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 12:30:51 AM7/15/18
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Regarding five faces 


seems to be connecting many fives with the five faces. 

Among them, the following seems to be almost matching with the five colours.

The Lord of space is Vishnu.  The goddess of fire is Maheshwari power.  The Lord of wind is Sun.  The Lord of earth is Shiva and the Lord of water is Ganapati Ganesh.  In this manner the 5 gods of our body are the Lords (existence) of the 5 elements (KAPILTANTRA). 

  Vishnu = Pearl colour  

  goddess of fire  = Red colour 

Sun = Golden colour 

Shiva = Black colour 

Ganapati Ganesh = White colour 


Subrahmanyam Korada

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Jul 15, 2018, 12:46:27 AM7/15/18
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नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

It is गदाम् but not गुणाम् -- 

if you take गुणाम्  then you have to resort  to मत्वर्थलक्षणा ---- गुणाम् means  तद्विशिष्टधनुः - and it is गौरवम् ।

वाच्यार्थानुपपत्तिः लक्षणाबीजम् ।  लक्षणा  is a पददोष as per पूर्वमीमांसा ।

Most of the people do not apply पदवाक्यप्रमाणशास्त्रs in वाक्यार्थनिर्णय which depends on पदार्थनिर्णय ।

धन्यो’स्मि





Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
Professor of Sanskrit, CALTS,
University of Hyderabad,
Ph:09866110741(M),91-40-23010741(R),040-23133660(O)
Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada

rniyengar

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Jul 15, 2018, 1:16:45 AM7/15/18
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Dear Prof.Paturi
Could you please clarify which "Vaishnava Sampradaya" as you were told do not use  मुक्ताविद्रुम  ....   in preference to the other  ध्येयस्सदा ...
References from Nityaanusandhaana texts of either Maadhwa or RaamaanujIya MaThas would be helpful.
Thanks
RN Iyengar
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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 1:24:26 AM7/15/18
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"I was told" is not a reference based academic statement. It was a statement I heard as part of a general conversation. 

The person who mentioned this to me , said that he observed it in the Sri VaishNava /Ramanuja paddhati Sandhyavandanam and his Sri Vaishnava friends mentioned to him that their gurus instructed them to use dhyeyassadaa for dhyaana s'loka. 

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rniyengar

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Jul 15, 2018, 2:27:47 AM7/15/18
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Oh ! I see; just some gossip.

venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 15, 2018, 4:47:03 AM7/15/18
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Thank you for the clarifications Shri Nagaraj ji and Shri Korada ji:

Shri Korada ji: I am still not completely clear about why gadAm is preferred to guNAm - do please explain this in layman's terms? Thanks. Also how do we apply traditional heuristics when a certain version has been given down by the rshis? (Was it? or was it a later addition?) Which is why it is even more important to find out the original source for this dhyanasloka.

The "dhyeyah sadA" dhyana sloka is basically one to Surya Narayana and is part of the upasthAna mantras in YV sandhya. 

One of the reasons for guNa without dhanus could be that the sAvitrI unlike other mantras is an output routed back to the source in the sense that it is a prayer requesting Savita to stimulate our "dhiyah" so in that sense the devI provides the bow-string and the dhanus is provided by the sadhaka  (just speculating here).

Please give a description of what else she holds along with the ankushah? It says: "ankushakashah"



On Sunday, July 15, 2018 at 10:16:27 AM UTC+5:30, korada wrote:
नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

It is गदाम् but not गुणाम् -- 

if you take गुणाम्  then you have to resort  to मत्वर्थलक्षणा ---- गुणाम् means  तद्विशिष्टधनुः - and it is गौरवम् ।

वाच्यार्थानुपपत्तिः लक्षणाबीजम् ।  लक्षणा  is a पददोष as per पूर्वमीमांसा ।

Most of the people do not apply पदवाक्यप्रमाणशास्त्रs in वाक्यार्थनिर्णय which depends on पदार्थनिर्णय ।

धन्यो’स्मि





Dr.Korada Subrahmanyam
Professor of Sanskrit, CALTS,
University of Hyderabad,
Ph:09866110741(M),91-40-23010741(R),040-23133660(O)
Skype Id: Subrahmanyam Korada

On Sat, Jul 14, 2018 at 3:15 PM, venkat veeraraghavan <vvenk...@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Learned Members,


The attached Shloka of Gayatri is from the Bodhayana Brahmakarma Samucchaya. 

There is some controversy on the correct shloka wrt guna/ gada (shubhram kapalam gunam/gadam)..

I am confused on whether Gayatri Devi is holding a gada or guna (what is this in terms of instrument?).

Can you please clarify which is the appropriate word here?

Many thanks,

Venkat

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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 5:15:18 AM7/15/18
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After getting enlightened that my conversation that I quoted was just a gossip I went in search of Srivaishnava sources and realised that muktaavidruma being replaced by some other s'loka is not factual, the Sri Vaishnava procedure does indeed have muktaavidruma in it. 

But this search resulted in my getting to know of another interesting verse included in a text of Sri Vaishnava Sandhyavandanam procedure, that is very much similar to dyeyassadaa in viewing nArAyaNa as savitrmaNDalamadhyavartI:

arkamaNDala-madhyastham sUryakoTisamaprabham |

brahmAdi-sevyapAdAbjam naumi brahma ramAsakham ||

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


http://www.ramanuja.org/sv/bhakti/archives/jun99/0059.html

Rama,

The following is taken from the Ahnika of Tirukkudandai Gopala
Desikan (18th century), who set a standard for Vaidika anushThAna
in the sampradAya. My sandhyA krama is nowhere near so detailed,
and what I reproduce below is taken purely from my understanding 
of the text, so I apologize in advance for any errors.
After arghya-pradAnam and tarpaNam, the details for gAyatrI japa
are as follows.

1) Rshi-chandas-devatA nyAsa for the prANAyAma mantra --
   praNava and vyAhRtis, then for gAyatrI, then for 
   gAyatrI-Siras (om Apo jyotIraso'mRtam brahma bhUr-bhuvas-suvar om)

2) bodily nyAsa (?) for the seven vyAhRtis
   bhU: -- feet
   bhuva: -- calves (jangha)
   suva: -- knees
   maha: -- thighs and belly button
   jana: -- throat, heart, and abdomen
   tapa: -- face
   satyam -- top of the head (mastaka)

3) Meditation on some particular forms. They are not named, but from
   the description, they are male forms, presumably of Narayana.

4) Now, first anga-nyAsa of just the gAyatrI (no vyAhRtis):
   up to savituh -- jnAnAya hRdayAya nama:
   vareNyam -- aiSvaryAya Sirase svAhA
   up to devasya -- Saktyai SikhAyai vaushaT
   dhImahi -- balAya kavacAya hum
   up to yonah -- tejase netrAbhyAm vaushaT
   last word -- vIryAya astrAya phaT

5) First part of gAyatrI dhyAnam -- muktA-vidruma...
   
6) vyApaka nyAsam using the gAyatrI-Siras 
   ("SiromantreNa karAbhyAm Sira:prabhRti pAdAntam 
     vyApakanyAsam kRtvA...")

7) "arka maNdala-madhyastham" -- meditation on Narayana
   within the orb of the sun 

8) 3 prANAyAmas 
   (So far, most of us would have skipped steps 2-7)

9) sankalpa for japa

10) gAyatrI AvAhanam with "AyAtu varadA devi"
   
11) Now, further gAyatrI dhyAnam, with
    the "prAtar dhyAyAmi gAyatrIm" sloka mentioned earlier
-----    -------   -------   --------
-----    -------   --------  --------
(Highlighting mine)

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Aravinda Rao

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Jul 15, 2018, 5:38:42 AM7/15/18
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Namaskars, 

In my understanding sandhya-vandanam is not exactly the upasana of Surya but of the cosmic being Hiranyagarbha, as the Vedanta says. It is a samashti upasana as opposed to vyashti upasanas such as Hanumad upasana, Saraswati upasana etc. The vyashti upasana is similar to the viswarupa upasana seen in the chapter 11 of the Gita. Krishna himself tells Arjuna, 'Why are you interested in these small manifestations? See my cosmic form which is sarva-devatatmaka"(10-49). 
The Aditya-hridayam too is a samshti upasana as we can see reference to all god-forms in it. 

 As  you all know, the advaitic tradition of kara-nyasa (similar mantras for anga-nyasa too) says as follows:

Om, tat-savituh -Brahmatmane angushtabhyam namah,
varenyam -Vishnvatmane tarjanibhyam namah,
bhargo devasya -Rudratmane madhyamabhyam namah,
dhimahi- satyatmane anamikabhyam namah
dhiyo yo nah -jnanatmane kanishtikabhyam namah 
prachodayat -sarvatmane kara-tala kara-prishtabhyam namah.

The Vedanta teachers say that this is referring to Satyam-Jnanam-Anantam Brahma which is beyond the thri-murthi-s. The first three are manifestations in Hiranyagarbha whereas the Brahman is the only reality.

I am sorry for not using the IAST.

Aravinda Rao K

Aravinda Rao

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Jul 15, 2018, 5:40:52 AM7/15/18
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Error in the second line. Kindly read as 'The samashti upasana is similar to the viswarupa upasana in the Gita'.

Aravinda Rao

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 6:19:52 AM7/15/18
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In 

The Sacred Books Of The Hindus Vol.xx


at 


In the Chapter VII

Sandhya of the Rig Vedins,

I found another Gayatri Dhyana 

ॐ हंसॉपरि पद्मासनस्थां रक्तवऋणां चतुर्मुखीं द्विभुजां अक्षसूत्रकमण्डलुकरां रक्ताम्बरधरां ब्रह्मणः सदृशां गायत्रीं 

(इति ध्यात्वा  ऋष्यादिन्यासं  कुर्यात् )




Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 7:30:20 AM7/15/18
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At a Sri Vaishnava web source:


I found:

......    ........ .......    .........

2. pratardhyayami gayatrim ravimandala madhyagam RugvEdamuccArayantIM raktavarnam kumarikam akshamala karam brahmadaivatyam hamsa vahanam madhyan dinetu savitrim ravimandalamadhyagam yajurvedam vyaharantim SvEtAM SUlakarAMSivAm yuvatim rudradevatyam dhyayami vrushaba vahanam sayam sarasvatim SyAmAM ravimandala madhyagam samavedam vyaharantim cakrayudhadharam SuBAM dhyayami vishnudaivatyam vruddham garudavahanam


......   .....  ......  .........    ...........

....... ....... ........ .......  ........

19.   OmApO jyotiraso mrutam brahma BUrBuvassuvarOm (while chanting the above mantra, perform Atma parisuddhi with the two palms by gently touching from head to toe) arkamandala madhyastham suryakotisamaprabam brahmadi sevya padabjam naumibrahma ramasakam (meditate on gaayatrii devi in the form of light which is 10 million times brighter than the Sun -suryakotisamaprabam saying above mantra) trih prananayamya ::(perform pranayama thrice) :: OM BUH, OM BuvaH, OM suvah, OM mahah,... OM BUH, OM BuvaH, OM suvah, OM mahah,... OM BUH, OM BuvaH, OM suvah, OM mahah,... (after pranayamam thrice, hold the palms in san^kalpa posture) SrI BagavadAj~jayA, SrImannArAyaNa prityartham, pratah sandhya ashtottara Sata sankyaya (108) (or) :: ashtavimsati sankyaya (28) (minimum) gatri mahamantrajapam karishye

.......     ..........    ..........   ...........

21.  savitrya RuShiH visvamitrah Sirasi devi gayatri CandaH savita devata yodevo savitasmakam dhiyo dharmadi gocarah prerayet tasya yadbargah tadvarenya mupasmahe AdityamaNDalE dhyayet paramatmana mavyayam vishnum caturbujam ratna kundalair mandita~gganam sarva ratna samayukta sarvabarana BUShitAm EvaM dhyatva japennityam mantra mashtottaram Satam gayatri japam ::(at least 28 times) OM BUrBuva ssuvah tatsavitur vareniyam BargO devasya dhimahi dhiyo yonah pracodayat OM BUrBuva ssuvah punah prananayamya :: gayatri upasthanam :: OM BUH, OM BuvaH, OM suvah sa~gkalpah(hold the palms in sa~gkalpa posture ) :: SrI BagavadAj~jayA SrIman narayana prityartham pratah sandhya gayatri upasthanam karishye


---------  --------- --------- ---------

23.  abivadanam :: abivadaye (******) (******) (******) (******) RuShEya pravaranvita (******) gotrah (******) sutrah (******) SSAKAdhyAyI SrI (******) SarmAnAmAhaM asmiboh dik vandanam :: OM pracyai dise namah Facing East OM dakshinayai disenamah Facing South OM praticyai disenamah Facing West OM udicyai disenamah Facing North Face East for the following vandana-s OM UrdhvAyanamaH show the folded palms upwards OM adharaya namah show the folded palms to the ground OM antarikshaya namah show the folded palms upwards OM BUmyai namah show the folded palms to the ground OM vishnave namah show the folded palms straight ahead dhyeyassada savitrumandala madhyavarti narayanah sarasijasana sannivishtah keyuravan makarakundalavan kiriti hari hiranmaya (hiranyaya) vapuh dhruta Sa~gKa cakrah Sa~gKa cakra gada pane dvaraka nilayacyuta govinda pundarikaksha raksha mam SaraNAgatam namo brahmanya devaya gobrahmana hitaya ca jagaddhitaya krushnaya SrI govindaya namo namah

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 15, 2018, 3:28:13 PM7/15/18
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pratardhyayami gayatrim ravimandala madhyagam RugvEdamuccArayantIM raktavarnam kumarikam akshamala karam brahmadaivatyam hamsa vahanam 

madhyan dinetu savitrim ravimandalamadhyagam yajurvedam vyaharantim SvEtAM SUlakarAMSivAm yuvatim rudradevatyam dhyayami vrushaba vahanam

 sayam sarasvatim SyAmAM ravimandala madhyagam samavedam vyaharantim cakrayudhadharam SuBAM dhyayami vishnudaivatyam vruddham garudavahanam 


Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 1:46:54 AM7/16/18
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An interpretation of Muktavidruma from the form to its the ideas signified by the form:

Venkata Sriram

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Jul 16, 2018, 2:36:33 AM7/16/18
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Namaste Venkat ji,

Pls refer the गायत्री तन्त्रं for the dhyAna shloka you encountered ie., गुणं.

..................
.................

Go to तृतीय पटलः and study गायत्री कवचं

rgs,
sriram

Venkata Sriram

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Jul 16, 2018, 2:57:41 AM7/16/18
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Namaste,

Also, pls refer to the गायत्री रहस्यं which gives the meaning for गुणं.  It is यज्ञोपवीतं 

............
........

The entire books details out the dhyAna shloka with गुणं and in Pg. No. 54, it gives out the meaning of dhyAna-shloka.

rgs,
sriram

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 3:00:28 AM7/16/18
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Shri Korada ji: I am still not completely clear about why gadAm is preferred to guNAm - do please explain this in layman's terms? Thanks. Also how do we apply traditional heuristics when a certain version has been given down by the rshis? (Was it? or was it a later addition?) 

What Prof. Korada was saying was:

It can not be guNam because

guNa = bowstring

guNam + hastair vahanteem --> carrying the bowstring in hand 

this description is not tenable because one holds bow not bowstring

it can be made tenable by arguing that holding bowstring means holding bow only because of metaphor (lakshaNaa)

but (such?) lakshaNaa is a dosha (defect of expression) as per poorvameemaamsaa. 

Since we need to assume that the respected/ revered verse can not have a dosha, we have to infer that the word there is gadaam not guNam. 

Venkatraghavan S

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Jul 16, 2018, 3:19:55 AM7/16/18
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Namaste Sri Paturiji,
In advaita texts, it is said that when there is anvaya / tAtparya anupapatti with the vAcyArtha, the lakshyArtha must be taken.
Is that not an accepted principle in pUrva mImAmsA? 

Assuming both versions are from valid sources (smritis etc.), both have to be accounted for. It is when only one of them is known to be from a valid source (or true), that we can use the rule that that which gives an appropriate meaning using vAcyArtha itself must be taken as the correct one.

Thanks
Venkatraghavan


Nagaraj Paturi
 
Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.


BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies
 
FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,
 
(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )
 
 
 

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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 3:24:17 AM7/16/18
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I was paraphrasing Prof. Korada's words.

For me, no one holds a bow by its string. A bow is held always by the hard bow only. 

So holding a bowstring can not be a metaphor for holding a bow. 

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BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies
 
FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,
 
(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )
 
 
 

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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 3:25:00 AM7/16/18
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> Please give a description of what else she holds along with the ankushah? It says: "ankushakashah"

Total number of hands 10

Aayudhas (not weapons in the conventional sense but objects and gestures in hands):

1. Varada mudra (image attached)

2. Abhaya mudra (image attached)

3. Ankus’a = elephant's goad ( a collection of images attached)

4. Kas’a =whip  ( a collection of images attached)

5. S'ubhra Kapaala = white /empty /clean skull (used as a bowl)

6. Gadaa = 'mace'  ( a collection of images attached)

7. S’ankham = conch shell 

8. Chakram = disc/wheel shaped weapon

9 & 10. Aravindayugalam = a pair of lotuses





1_abaya_hasta.jpg
2_varad_hasta.jpg
Ayudha.jpg

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 3:32:22 AM7/16/18
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Sriram ,

If guNam = yajnopaveetam ,

how can we connect it to hastair vahanteem?

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Venkata Sriram

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Jul 16, 2018, 3:57:13 AM7/16/18
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Namaste,

She holds that in Her hand.  

That aside, guNa means rope / lace etc.  So, the translator took it as 'upavItaM'.  May be, we can take it as rope.  

A similar dhyAna shloka is chanted for Goddess Durga also which I chant everyday.

विद्युद्‌दाम समप्रभां मृगपति स्कन्धस्थितां भीषणां 
कन्याभिः करवाल खेट विलसद्धस्ताभिरा सेविताम्‌ 
हस्तैश्चक्रगदासि खेट विशिखांशचापं गुणं तर्जनीं 
विभ्राणामनलात्मिकां शशिधरां दुर्गां त्रिनेत्रां भजे

rgs,
sriram

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 5:07:10 AM7/16/18
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> She holds that in Her hand.  

--- How can we justify this? reference or logic?


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venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 16, 2018, 5:08:25 AM7/16/18
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Dear Shri Venkata Sriramji:

Thank you for the sources.

Is there a dating for Gayatri Tantram and who compiled it?

Many thanks again.

Dear Shri Nagaraj ji --> Yajnopavita is also a valid interpretation given that the AvAhana mantra says "shatkukshih panchashIrshOpanayane viniyOgah" which some translators interpret as the Deity presiding over the Upanayana ceremony.

Thanks,

Venkat  

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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 5:11:36 AM7/16/18
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Sri Venkat Veeraraghavan-ji,

> She holds that in Her hand.  

--- How can we justify this? reference or logic?

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venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 16, 2018, 5:12:24 AM7/16/18
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Dear Shri Nagaraj ji--> Many thanks for explaining Shri Koradaji's post to me.
Thanks again!!!

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Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 5:24:32 AM7/16/18
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>  May be, we can take it as rope.  

--- Is rope found among aayudhas elsewhere? Is there an image from a sculpture or an explanation for rope anywhere ? Is there a justification for rope ?

Nagaraj Paturi

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Jul 16, 2018, 5:26:26 AM7/16/18
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From Apte:  

गुणः [गुण्-अच्]  ................ .............. -5 (a) A single thread or string. (b) Thread, string, rope, cord, मेखलागुणैः Ku.4.8;5.1; तृणैर्गुणत्व- मापन्नैर्वध्यन्ते मत्तदन्तिनः H.1.32; यतः परेषां गुणग्रहीतासि Bv.1. 9 (where गुण also means 'a merit'). -6 The bow- string; गुणकृत्ये धनुषो नियोजिता Ku.4.15,29; कनकपिङ्गतडिद्- गुणसंयुतम् R.9.54. -7 The string of a musical instrument; कलवल्लकीगुणस्वानमानम् Śi.4.57. -8 A sinew. ................. .............. .........

Subrahmanyam Korada

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Jul 17, 2018, 7:17:38 AM7/17/18
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नमो विद्वद्भ्यः

I am thankful to Vidvan Paturi for the help in explaining the concept of लक्षणा ।

Vidvan Veeraraghavan may note --

वाचकशब्द  denotes वाच्यार्थ thru अभिधावृत्ति ।

लक्षकशब्द denotes लक्ष्यार्थ thru लक्षणावृत्ति ।

व्यञ्जकशब्द denotes व्यङ्ग्यार्थ thru व्यञ्जनावृत्ति ।

गङ्गायां घोषः (the cowshed is in Ganges) - अभिधा denotes the वाच्यार्थ - there is a cowshed in Ganga -

 this is a sentence wherein there is अन्वयानुपपत्ति / वाच्यार्थानुपपत्ति / तात्पर्यानुपपत्ति । 

A cowshed cannot be there in a stream called Ganga - 

now लक्षणा enters the scene - says गङ्गायाम् is a लक्षकशब्द and it means -गङ्गातीरे -- लक्ष्यार्थ is to be taken , not वाच्यार्थ।

Then why should the speaker employ such a sentence | He is a sane person --

now व्यञ्जना enters the scene -- says - गङ्गायाम् is a व्यञ्जकशब्द and some व्यङ्ग्यार्थ is meant --

शैत्यम् and पावनत्वम् are the प्रयोजनम् ( for employing such a sentence )

Varanasi is on Ganges , London is on Thames etc

'The bus is coming ' -- is an example of लक्षणा ( a bus cannot come spontaneously - it is rather made to come) . Similarly,
in शास्त्रs there are many instances .

You cannot say - ’ the hill is coming ’ and apply लक्षणा ।

Come back to the original question --

is it गदाम् or गुणाम् --

there is a set of deciding factors of meaning enumerated by Bhartrhari in वाक्यकाण्ड of वाक्यपदीयम् (taking the cue from 
महाभाष्यम् of Patanjali -- अर्थात् प्रकरणाद्वा ) and the same is quoted in all major Alankara works , मञ्जूषा etc --

संयोगो विप्रयोगश्च साहचर्यं विरोधिता ।
अर्थः प्रकरणं लिङ्गं शब्दस्यान्यस्य सन्निधिः॥
सामर्थ्यमौचिती देशः कालो व्यक्तिः स्वरादयः।
शब्दार्थस्यानवच्छेदे विशेषस्मृतिहेतवः ॥

शब्दार्थस्य अनवच्छेदे = when the वाच्यार्थ is doubtful ; विशेषस्मृतिहेतवः = will be the causes of deciding the meaning .

In the present case --

if you take गुणाम् (which has got several meanings) - rope - since it lacks अर्थ ( purpose it serves - what is the purpose
of holding a rope? ) / औचित्यम् ( propriety - what is the propriety of holding a rope ?) / सामर्थ्यम् ( capacity - is the rope
capable as a proper weapon ?) -- therefore the term , as per वाच्यार्थ is not suitable .

So at वाच्यार्थ level itself the term गुणाम् failed and as such you cannot go to लक्षणा - 
that too मत्वर्थलक्षणा - ’ गुणा means  a गुणा having a bow ’ -- this is too much - therefore it should be गदाम् and not गुणाम् ।

Sometimes , we come across some usages that have come down to us but they are अविचारितरमणीय ( not put under the
scanners - पदवाक्यप्रमाणशास्त्राणि and therefore are beautiful) .

Just go back to the posting on अपरस्परसंभूतम्  and see how great scholars erred for 1200 years !

A suggestion - better get equipped by learning व्याकरणम् etc with a competent गुरु at least for one year.

धन्योस्मि









venkat veeraraghavan

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Jul 17, 2018, 7:41:39 AM7/17/18
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Dear Shri Koradaji,

Thank you for your detailed explanation.

" A suggestion - better get equipped by learning व्याकरणम् etc with a competent गुरु at least for one year. "--> Can you suggest books /persons and other resources sir?

Thanks,

Venkat

Dr.BVK Sastry(G-MAIL)

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Jul 18, 2018, 3:55:30 AM7/18/18
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Namaste

 

On the term  < gadaa /  guna>   - why ‘gadaam’ ?  For further contemplation please.

 

1. guna – based explanation is already detailed .

 

Every change in the icon description  and change in position  has a specific purpose.

Example: the representation of  24 forms of Vishnu as ‘ Keshava, Naarayana..’ have shifted arrangements of  chakra, shankha, gadaa, …’.

 

Explore the following also for understanding  the meaning of the term ‘ gadaa’ and plausible iconic representations. Some meanings may fit only in a context; some wont fit at all ! . Meaning source is Cologne dictionary listing.  

 

gaḍā :       (H2) [Cologne record ID=62479] [Printed book page 342,3]

gaḍa m. a kind of gold-fish (the young of the Ophiocephalus Lata or another species, Cyprinus Garra), L.  a  screen, covering, fence, L. [ID=62480] , a moat, ditch, L. [ID=62481]

 

  गदा :    (H2) [Cologne record ID=62869] [Printed book page 344,2]

               गद m. a sentence, MBh. i, 1787  , disease, sickness, Suśr.; Ragh. &c. [ID=62870]

     

                     N. of a son of Vasu-deva and younger brother of Kṛṣṇa, MBh.; Hariv.; BhP. [ID=62871]  of another son of Vasu-deva by a different mother, ix, 24, 51 [ID=62872]

     

गद n. poison, L. [ID=62873]

     

गदा a f. a series of sentences, RāmatUp. ii, 5, 4 [ID=62874]  a mace, club, bludgeon, MBh.; R. &c. [ID=62875]    Bignonia suaveolens, L. [ID=62876]  N. of a musical instrument [ID=62877]  of a constellation, VarBṛ.; Laghuj. [ID=62878]

     

v.l. for गधा, TS. Sch. (cf. अ-गद, अ-विज्ञात-ग्°.) [ID=62879]

     

(H2) [Cologne record ID=62900] [Printed book page 344,3]

गदा b f. of °द q.v.     an impediment, L. [ID=62482]

     

N. of a district (part of Malva, commonly Garha or Garha Maṇḍala), L. [ID=62483]

     

gaḍā f. (in music) a kind of Rāgiṇī (cf. tṛṇa-g°, payo-g°.) [ID=62484]   

 

 

Regards

BVK Sastry

Nagaraj Paturi

 

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.

 

 

BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

 

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

 

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

 

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

 

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )

 

 

 

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