Recording and playback - Exporting the recordings as a single video

[uday kiran]

Hi,

I think the ability to create a single video file (atleast with the presentation, presenters desktop, webcam video and chat) will be a big plus so that the video can be exported to different systems / devices. Popcorn js as of now is very flexible but limited in it's own ways.

There is an issue filed already - https://code.google.com/p/bigbluebutton/issues/detail?id=1215

Tried to explore ways to contribute to this - There are no tools or libraries to help converting popcorn timeline and media to a single video. Looks like the only way is to take all these pieces and encode them into a single mp4 using a tool like ffmpeg. This seems to be quite some work looking at the huge number of events and info BBB captures.

Are there any discussions going on about this implementation ?

Any leads to do this in a better way ? Any pointers would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

[Fred Dixon]

Hi Uday,

We have this feature as an open enhancement request (we're now using GitHub to track issues)

   

    https://github.com/bigbluebutton/bigbluebutton/issues/1969

However it isn't part of the 1.0 development cycle (currently in beta).   We tend to focus our efforts on the current release, finish it, and then look at the items of highest priority for the next release.  See

  http://docs.bigbluebutton.org/support/faq.html#when-will-feature-x-be-implemented

To get a high level view of the features ahead, see

  http://docs.bigbluebutton.org/support/road-map.html

Regards,... Fred

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[udaya...@expertus.com]

Fred,

Thanks for the reply. I will keep a watch on the issue through github.  Will also see if i either i can come up with a way to contribute here or be able to work with one of the developers when it's a right time.

Regrads.

[Travis Kemen]

I did come across https://github.com/palexang/bbb-download as a way to generate a single file to export but I had to do some tweaking to make it work with my last install.

Travis

[uday kiran]

Travis, thanks a lot for pointing out. Will give this a try. 

[Romeo S]

Dear Travis,

Could you elaborate what tweaking you had to do in order to make it work?  I've just gave it a try and wasn't able to make bbb-download work properly.  As a first step I had to re-compile ffmpeg with x264 and MP3 support.  Now the process goes as far as converting the slides into a single MP4 file, however the timing is incorrect and the audio trimming also fails (audio_trimmed.m4a could not be found).  Any thoughts?

Thank you very much!

Kind regards,
Romeo 

[Romeo S]

Just as a note in case someone might find this useful:  the issue was that I missed to add --enable-libfdk-aac when recompiling ffmpeg.  Now bbb-download works great.  To summarize, the following codecs are needed when recompiling ffmpeg for bbb-download:

sudo ./configure --enable-version3 --enable-postproc --enable-libvorbis --enable-libvpx --enable-libx264 --enable-libmp3lame --enable-libfdk-aac --enable-gpl --enable-nonfree

Keep in mind that you still need to compile/install the additional codecs before recompiling. I compiled libx264 according to the following guide:
https://trac.ffmpeg.org/wiki/CompilationGuide/Quick/libx264

libmp3lame and libfdk-aac can be added through the package manager:
apt-get install libfdk-aac-dev
apt-get install libmp3lame-dev

Cheers,
Romeo

[HostBBB.com]

Neat work,

One of the considerations here, is the legal patents centered around encoding some of these formats like mp3 and h264.    Great for playing around with making it work, or using in a non North American/European country where patents my not apply,  but not really deployable in the enterprise or large scale university setting.

Want to make sure sys admins in this forum don't take this and deploy it their companies without at least understanding the possibly implications.

You can get a license and much better commercial encoder,  or use some of the cloud transcoding services like amazon if your volume it low.

Also Cisco has some binaries http://www.openh264.org/faq.html that if you link to, can be covered.

regards,

Stephen

hostbbb.com

On Wednesday, February 24, 2016 at 1:42:32 PM UTC-5, Romeo S wrote:

Just as a note in case someone might find this useful:  the issue was that I missed to add --enable-libfdk-aac when recompiling ffmpeg.  Now bbb-download works great.  To summarize, the following codecs are needed when recompiling ffmpeg for bbb-download:

sudo ./configure --enable-version3 --enable-postproc --enable-libvorbis --enable-libvpx --enable-libx264 --enable-libmp3lame --enable-libfdk-aac --enable-gpl --enable-nonfree

Keep in mind that you still need to compile/install the additional codecs before recompiling. I compiled libx264 according to the following guide:
https://trac.ffmpeg.org/wiki/CompilationGuide/Quick/libx264

libmp3lame and libfdk-aac can be added through the package manager:
apt-get install libfdk-aac-dev
apt-get install libmp3lame-dev

Cheers,
Romeo

On Wednesday, February 24, 2016 at 3:05:42 PM UTC+2, Romeo S wrote:

Dear Travis,

Could you elaborate what tweaking you had to do in order to make it work?  I've just gave it a try and wasn't able to make bbb-download work properly.  As a first step I had to re-compile ffmpeg with x264 and MP3 support.  Now the process goes as far as converting the slides into a single MP4 file, however the timing is incorrect and the audio trimming also fails (audio_trimmed.m4a could not be found).  Any thoughts?

Thank you very much!

Kind regards,
Romeo 


On Wednesday, December 30, 2015 at 7:38:48 PM UTC+2, Travis Kemen wrote:

I did come across https://github.com/palexang/bbb-download as a way to generate a single file to export but I had to do some tweaking to make it work with my last install.

Travis

On Wednesday, December 30, 2015 at 4:27:23 AM UTC-6, udaya...@expertus.com wrote:

Fred,

Thanks for the reply. I will keep a watch on the issue through github.  Will also see if i either i can come up with a way to contribute here or be able to work with one of the developers when it's a right time.

Regrads.

On Tuesday, December 29, 2015 at 7:38:49 PM UTC+5:30, Fred Dixon wrote:

...

[Romeo S]

Dear Stephen,

Thank you very much for pointing that out.

If I am not mistaken, when it comes to h264 there is a license free grace limit of 100'000 "units" per year:
http://www.mpegla.com/main/programs/AVC/Documents/avcweb.pdf  (page 8)

MP3 is probably another story but at this stage I am only testing out the different solutions to exporting the BBB recordings to a portable format.

Kind regards,
Romeo

[Chad Pilkey]

The 100,000 units on page 8 of that PDF refers to encoder/decoder manufacture and sale which shouldn't apply in this case.

The relevant terms for a service providing access to recordings can be found on page 9. The section on page 9 that would apply to for your use would depend on how your end users are accessing your content. Free access vs. pay per-recording vs. monthly subscription, etc. Each access method has different price points and all could be applied to a service built around BBB.

The other thing is that even if you think you would fit within one of the tiers I believe you still have get a license from MPEG LA and you would likely be required to report your numbers on a regular basis to show that you still don't owe them royalties.

[Romeo S]

Thank you Chad, that makes sense.  Although I am not an expert in the field of codec licensing, my guess would be that for in an academic setting, where the users are not charged to use the services built around BBB the following would apply (page 9):

Internet Broadcast AVC Video (not title ‐ by ‐title,not subscription) –no royalty for life of the AVC Patent Portfolio License

[Create Webinar]

Here is the script that produces downloadable material for BigBlueButton. Working on 1.1 and 2.0 version https://github.com/createwebinar/bbb-download. It's a fork from https://github.com/alpapado/bbb-download with fixes for new BBB versions

[Kirk Pathumanun]

Thanks CreateWebinar.com  and awesome script and the business model !

Regards,

Kirk

[Gustavo Cardenas]

is not working anymore??

[Henry L]

It's not working with me.

I'm in doubt if it's just permission or the Post Scripts are broken in the bbb. 

Calling direct by download.py works.

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/bigbluebutton-dev/fgBtutpCjUc

[Ghazi TRIKI]

Hello,

The script does work for 2.2 after some testing, it has some bugs, sometimes it fails to convert files in 2.0.

[David Heuring]

he script  converts to .mp4 some of the time in BBB 2.0. It's random. though. I contacted CreateWebinar to ask why it doesn't do it for every recording, and they responded once but it's been radio silence since then.  It would be great to have these recordings more easily available for download.  Haven't tried download.py.

[Anton]

Hi All

Does anyone have any new news on this?

I have tried but it isn't converting my recordings in version 2.2

[David Heuring]

Yeah, well, I contacted them and they sounded receptive to fixing this.  I actually gave them access to the server for a first-hand look.  They never came through with a fix and eventually I gave up waiting for them after emailing 2-3 times for an update.  It initially worked some of the time in BBB 2.0-beta for me, but it was random.  It's too bad because I thought this was pretty cool and would extend the BBB recordings to an mp4 format where I could do video editing.  Alas, no cigar for these guys!

[Anton]

Oh no  :(  I really need this as I have to give students a mp4 file which I can download and give to them to view later without using data

Is there perhaps someone else that can guide us on this? Maybe where to start to fix it or have a working solution?

[Kirk Pathumanun]

I can vouched for the whole community that BBB has no intention of ever providing the technical support for converting recorded videos to mp4 since it was a strategy policy that came from Fred ( feel free to search my bulletin messages exchanged with Fred about this) even now the screenshare recording format is not functional on 2.2 just the presentation format that works.

Regards,

Kirk 

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[David Heuring]

To be clear, I was referring to "createwebinar.com" and not the BBB developers.  They offered a script on this board to convert to .mp4, which I tried since I was anxious to edit BBB recordings. It only worked some of the time in 2.0. I also joined their site because it offers a way to manage BBB recordings externally, but ultimately, they never fixed the script.  So, like I said, no cigar. 

On Wednesday, April 24, 2019 at 2:55:16 PM UTC+7, Kirk Pathumanun wrote:

I can vouched for the whole community that BBB has no intention of ever providing the technical support for converting recorded videos to mp4 since it was a strategy policy that came from Fred ( feel free to search my bulletin messages exchanged with Fred about this) even now the screenshare recording format is not functional on 2.2 just the presentation format that works.

Regards,

Kirk 

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[Fred Dixon]

Hi everyone,

> I can vouched for the whole community that BBB 

 

Kirk does not speak on behalf of myself, the core developers, the project, or the community.  

He is an individual in this forum who has, in the past, expressed his opinions on what features the developers on the project should focus their efforts.  

> has no intention of ever providing the technical support for converting recorded videos to mp4 since it was a strategy policy that came from Fred 

I am the product manager for BigBlueButton.  I've been the project manager for over ten years, shepherding the development through its releases (http://docs.bigbluebutton.org/support/road-map.htmll).  

What Kirk is referring to is this open feature

  https://github.com/bigbluebutton/bigbluebutton/issues/1969

Specifically, the ability to download a recording of all content in a session as a single video file.  There are a number of companies in the BigBlueButton community that offer this feature as part of their hosting for BigBlueButton.  You can see some of them listed at

  https://bigbluebutton.org/commercial-support

The revenue they earn from hosting of BigBlueButton has allowed them to accelerate the development of BigBlueButton over the years.  They are following the traditional open source business model where they help organizations run BigBlueButton at scale (think of a WordPress hosting company vs. the WordPress product).

We believe in the social benefit and entrepreneurial opportunities of open source.  I have personally watched many open source projects fail because they never created a viable business model.  We wanted to avoid that fate this fate with BigBlueButton and, more importantly, and provide a solution that solves one of the biggest challenges our planet faces: the ability for instructors to deliver high-quality online education in virtual classes.   There are other companies, such as Moodle, that follow a similar philosophy (think of Moodle as non-realtime online learning and BigBlueButton as realtime).  Moodle as over 100,000 installations world-wide and is the most highly used learning management systems.  see

  https://www.lmspulse.com/tag/market-share/?utm_medium=301&utm_source=moodlenews.com

I point this out because there is a very healthy ecosystem around Moodle with lots of companies earning revenue from offering value added services.  Over time, we've seen Moodle's core encompass some of this value added features (which is what has happened with BigBlueButton over the years as well), and there is always room for companies that offer value add to Moodle to continue to grow and support Moodle.

>  now the screenshare recording format is not functional on 2.2 

Good catch, we opened an issue to take a closer look.  

  https://github.com/bigbluebutton/bigbluebutton/issues/7297

We achieved a major milestone with the conversion of the Flash client to the HTML5 client.  The quality (and development) of BigBlueButton is accelerating with every release, and now that we can build upon the full browser stack, you'll see this trend continue in the future.

Will you see the .mp4 recording format in the core of BigBlueButton 2.2-beta?  Not in this release cycle.  We provide the presentation recording format in BigBlueButton 2.2-beta that encompasses all the content share during the session.  It plays back in browser for the instructor and students.  We also have plans to offer a notes recording format that encompasses the final state of the shared notes.

Will you see the .mp4 recording format in the future of BigBlueButton?  Yes.  As with other successful projects, the BigBlueButton's core becomes more capable over time, the commercial companies gradually expand their value add into other areas.  So it was with Moodle, and so it will be with BigBlueButton.

 

Regards,... Fred

[Kirk Pathumanun]

Acknowledged on your usual deflection and obviously it’s not the project’s “priority” since 2012 

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[Fred Dixon]

Hi Kirk,

> Acknowledged on your usual deflection and obviously it’s not the project’s “priority” since 2012 

The priority of the project is to provide remote students a high-quality online learning experience.   

Recordings is an important part of the equation.  Another way of stating the above is to create a healthy ecosystem around the development, release, and support  -- both open source, such as you see in these forums, and commercial -- of a world-class web conferencing system.   The end result is BigBlueButton, but BigBlueButton doesn't exist without that healthy commercial community.  

A key component of the community is commercial companies that have business models that support growth.  There are many open source projects that have succeeded in this, and a whole lot more that have failed.  

We want BigBlueButton to be in the category of projects that succeed.   That involves making choices as to what features go into the core, and the value added features that commercial can offer around the core.   It's worth pointing out that BigBlueButton is open source and anyone can develop on top of it.  

You may not agree with our decisions on which features go into the core -- I think that part is pretty clear :-) -- but this thread gives us an opportunity to explain the reasoning behind how we make these decisions in order to increase the value of BigBlueButton, the BigBlueButton community, and our ability to deliver a solution for that individual instructor who is trying to engage remote students around the world.

Regards,.. Fred

[Anton Meyburgh]

Thanks for the feedback and for an awesome product!

[German Acevedo]

Hi,

Regarding: >  now the screenshare recording format is not functional on 2.2 

I updated yesterday my server to 2.2.0-beta5 (877) and just now I tried to record my screenshare and everything is working fine.

You can see my recording in this URL (the screenshare starts at 00:28):

https://miaulavirtual.micoope.com.gt/playback/presentation/2.0/playback.html?meetingId=0d42270aefc6f09c336eebbe88aeecf8f8ac9f14-1556206457451

Regards,

German

[Kirk Pathumanun]

Of course not I tested screenshare recording format 2 weeks ago and it failed spectacularly with only the presentation format still works. However the 2.0 version both work just fine. You might have to wait a bit since “recording” is not the BigBluebutton main priority as Fred stated on his letter. I rest my case on the recording lol

Regards,

Kirk

--

[Fred Dixon]

Hi everyone,

> You might have to wait a bit since “recording” is not the BigBluebutton main priority as Fred stated on his letter. 

For clarification, we make sure the recording formats provided in BigBlueButton -- presentation, podcast, and screenshare all work well.  They are an important part of each release.  We've got an issue opened to confirm that screen share is working with 2.2-beta, see

   https://github.com/bigbluebutton/bigbluebutton/issues/7297

Don't hesitate to let us know if you see any issues in the recording formats.

Regards,... Fred

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