Testers needed for new save extension 'savetiddlers'

[BJ]

I think that 'savetidders' (formerly bsaver) is about finished, and needs some testings on different platforms. So I would be grateful if people could try it. Remember don't use your own tiddlywikis  for testing this extension!!!

The install instructions are here: https://github.com/buggyj/savetiddlers

cheers

BJ

[coda coder]

Testing report ...

Platform: Win7, x64

Browser: Firefox Nightly 58.0a1 (2017-11-07) (64-bit)

Saving works.

I see no evidence of backups.

This never happened: "A test file needs to be downloaded (and then delete) to find the location of the download directory as there is no api for reading the download directory location, and this is seen by the user."

[coda coder]

On Tuesday, November 7, 2017 at 1:56:05 PM UTC-6, coda coder wrote:

I see no evidence of backups.

Ah.  I just found the Settings page. :/

[coda coder]

On Tuesday, November 7, 2017 at 1:56:05 PM UTC-6, coda coder wrote:

This never happened: "A test file needs to be downloaded (and then delete) to find the location of the download directory as there is no api for reading the download directory location, and this is seen by the user."

BJ... Perhaps you meant "this is NOT seen by the user"?  I can see "readTiddlySaverInstruction*.html" in my downloads dropdown which says "File moved or missing".

And if that's how it works, I think you should explain what's happening, end-to-end, because, on the face of it, that seems bad.

[BJ]

HI Coda,
thanks for giving it a try. Backups are disabled by default and need it be enabled in the settings. In order to be certain of the download dir, a test file needs to be downloaded. As it serves no purpose for the user, it is deleted. But this looks strange. An alternative would be not to delete the test file, and put a message to the user inside of it.

[Ton Gerner]

Hi BJ,

Linux Mint 17.3
Firefox development ed. 57.0b14 (64-bit)

Saving works.
Backup folder and backup made.

Cheers,

Ton

[Mark S.]

Hi BJ

With your beta, I was able to change a single to make it work with Windows (pathing). Then I was able to use tiddlywinks/<junction> where <junction> was a link to any starting directory on my hard-drive. It worked great and allowed me to use existing TW5 and external resources just like with TF.

But the full-blown plugin won't allow the save. It says it can't do that and attempts to save in the Downloads directory. I'm guessing that it's being overprotective and doesn't understand that it's OK to use the junction just like a directory.

Could there be an override so the user can tell the system to go ahead and use the joint directory?

The way it was with the Beta, it was virtually indistinguishable from the TF saver.

Thanks!
Mark

Win 7, 64, 57.0b11

[coda coder]

On Tuesday, November 7, 2017 at 2:48:36 PM UTC-6, BJ wrote:

HI Coda,
thanks for giving it a try.

YW.

Backups are disabled by default and need it be enabled in the settings. In order to be certain of the download dir, a test file needs to be downloaded. As it serves no purpose for the user, it is deleted. But this looks strange. An alternative would be not to delete the test file, and put a message to the user inside of it.

Right.  A mysterious download showing up looks sinister.  Make it much more transparent what's going on.

[okido]

Hello BJ,

I can confirm that saving works on linux opensuse 13.2, FF57Beta and Save Tiddlers 0.2.
The backups are made but, it creates extra subfolders with the name backup in the backup folder after the first backup is written.
Also the file names break, the first backups are with twnameYYYY-MM-DD and after a few backups it changes to twnameYYYYMMDD.hhmmss and it is written to a new folder backup.

Have a nice day, Okido

Op dinsdag 7 november 2017 20:30:39 UTC+1 schreef BJ:

[BJ]

HI Mark,

I am unsure of what are your junctions,

there will be a path to the download folder, maybe

c:\....\downloads\tiddlywikilocations\

so do you have

c:\....\downloads\tiddlywikilocations\fakedir going to c:\....\realdir

?

[BJ]

Hi Okido,
would you be using tiddlywiki classic?

[BJ]

thank Ton

[okido]

Yes, I use TWc 2.9, Okido

[Mark S.]

Junctions are like links in Linux. I'm not sure if they're like hard links or symbolic links.

Yes, I have a directory like

C:\Users\Mark\Downloads\tiddlywikilocations\twtests

where twtests is a link (junction) to

C:\temp\twtests

which has various TW5 files.

This setup worked with the beta. I'm curious whether a similar setup will work under linux. It basically makes it so that the only difference between TS and TF is that you need to set up directory links in tiddlywikilocations.

Thanks!
Mark

[BJ]

 I think what you are seening is the result of having backups enable inside your tiddlywiki and in the extension, so from the tiddlywiki you get twname and  twnameYYYYMMDD.hhmmss, then you get twnameYYYY-MM-DD from the extension and probably twname.YYYYMMDD.hhmmssYYYY-MM-DD  as well

[BJ]

this setup with symbolic links works with ubuntu 14.04
I will try booting up my window machine and see what the problem with junctions is.

[Mark S.]

Hey, it's working now! Did you make an update in the last few hours? Or did just need to reboot FF?

Thanks!

Mark

[TonyM]

Tested Windows 10, FF 56.0.2 (64bit)
Save and Backups fine

• Double click from windows explorer opens in default browser
• Open from windows shortcut in default browser FF Ok

Who cares where the file is if you have a bokmark to it, likewise for my NodeJS and TiddlyServer wikis.

BJ, You have come close if not where we need to be with FireFox 57+ Good work.

I was testing Chrome,

But the extension reports

There were warnings when trying to install this extension:

Unrecognized manifest key 'applications'.

And I seem unable to turn off select directory during download, and as a result I must save in the download folder.

Interestingly I saw this

chrome://settings/content/automaticDownloads?search=download

Ask when a site tries to download files automatically after the first file (recommended)

With a List of Deny and Allow and an ability to add!

Regards

Tony

[TonyM]

Found Chrome Setting Here In chrome this is in the advanced options in the 'Downloads' section.
As displayed on the Plugin/Extension Settings - not in online install instructions

[TonyM]

Oh, I can leave In Fire Fox Always ask you where to save files OK (which I like) as below I cant in Chrome)

Chrome Prior to Version 62.0.3202.75 (Official Build) (64-bit) and including this version
On WIndows 10

Works well. Good work again.

Additional in Chrome

Added Allow to site file:///Users/username/Downloads/tiddlywikilocations/empty.html
using aforementioned  chrome://settings/content/automaticDownloads?search=download

Still Working

Re-enabled Ask where to save each file before downloading

Same Problem as Documented.

Regards
Tony

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 14:00:40 UTC+11, TonyM wrote:

[TonyM]

Post Script,

Sadly in Chrome, for some reason we can add a file link to a tiddlywiki to desktop
Settings > More Tools > Add to Desktop

Which is a pity as we can not then make a browser based "Application" for our wikis.

Regards
Tony

[Mark S.]

On Tuesday, November 7, 2017 at 7:00:40 PM UTC-8, TonyM wrote:

Who cares where the file is if you have a bokmark to it, likewise for my NodeJS and TiddlyServer wikis.

The reason you care where the TW file lives is if you have external resources (PDF's,images, text files) that you want to reference by relative paths below the TW file.. With this arrangement, you can copy your TW and it's containing directory off to a flash drive, a cloud drive, a web site, a tablet, etc. and still have it work just like it did on the desktop.

-- Mark

[TonyM]

Mark,

I agree but what does it matter if the root folder is Here C:\Data\TW5\Instances, here C:\Users\username\Documents\References or Here C:\Users\username\Downloads\tiddlywikilocations

Especially when links, shortcuts quick access links even libraries (in Windows) a library can be set to ant folder, Then each actual wiki file can also have its own bookmark, short cut etc....

It is nice that we have tiddlywikilocations  because we need not share the folder with all and sundry downloads.

I would be tempted to call the folder tiddlywikidata or tiddlywikifiles to suggest it contains actual data not only transitory downloads, should some one think to delete it.

By the way in Firefox I just changed the default download directory to C:\data\Downloads which removes the user name from the path.

Just musing.

Tony

[TonyM]

BJ,

PS. By the way in Firefox I just changed the default download directory to C:\data\Downloads which removes the user name from the path.
Despite returning to the setting to Always ask you where to save files (which I prefer) Save tiddlers continues to work as planned. It clearly uses the set download path, not the selected one.

Regards
Tony

[Mark S.]

It matters because your downloads directory and sub-directory may not be part of your regular backup. It matters because your main data directory may be on an entirely different drive. You want to be free to use TW where you need it, and not have to re-arrange your entire data directory structure just to meet the whims of a limited saving mechanism.

Anyway, with BJ's system and Windows junction links, it's possible to have it all -- so why not?

-- Mark

[TonyM]

I would love it all too, just saying though, I don't disagree, but I want to suggest from some users perspective;

That we don't normally manage "websites" using file folders. So if you think of tiddlywiki as a website, or even an application, as it is in many ways with tiddlyserver, nodeJS and even TiddlyDesktop now, where its location is a bookmark in a browser, a URL in a browser, then where it is stored, is in someways only about setup.

Advanced users are the most likely to want more I think, and yes we are advanced users, so we want more.

Note my late reply placing the download directory elsewhere.

Regards
Tony

[BJ]

I didn't know there was a 2.9.

You should either not enable backups with the savetiddlers extension or disable backups in your tiddlywiki

On Tuesday, November 7, 2017 at 11:04:45 PM UTC+1, okido wrote:

[JM]

Worked out fine on Win10 Prof, FF 56.* and 57 - I used a junction, too.

Today I wanted to give it a try on Ubuntu 16.10, but unfortunately the add-on is not accessible due to a technical problem with the add-on itself. :-(

I'm a bit lucky that Ubuntu still offers FF 56.* and I am willing to do some alpha- or beta-testing. ;-)

[BJ]

I am just testing a new release, it should be ready within the hour.

[JM]

WFM - Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:57.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/57.0, Ubuntu 16.04 LTS, using a symlink.

Thank you!

[Alfonso Arciniega]

Thanks for the extensions, BJ,

Tested on Windows 10

On Chrome 62.0 it works fine.

On Firefox 57.0, it works though not straightforward. I always the following message: "TW not in tiddlywikilocations within the download directory.

 using default download directory" which is not true, and have to select the tiddlywikilocations directory (under my default Downloads directory) manually.

Any clues?

Second thoughts: any way there may be more than one backup file per day?

[BJ]

Hi Alfonso,
It is not the windows download directory but the default directory set in the firefox configuation, which is set in the firefox preferences.

I am not planing adding any extra backup options at the moment, but Mario has a different saving scheme - https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tiddlywiki/19LF5KynLAc/9nEybNVXCAAJ

cheers
BJ

[Alfonso Arciniega]

Thanks for your prompt answer, BJ,

However, my default Firefox download directory is the same as my Windows download directory. The issue is still there...

Cheers,

Alfonso

[BJ]

Unforturnately I do not have window 10. savetiddlers does display diagnostic information in firefox's console. If you could copy these massages and post them here it would help alot.

Try this in the tab that you have tried to save (and you see the file choose dialogue in place of success)

To get to the console press firefox hamburger icon to open the main menu, select 'Web Developer' then select 'Browser Console'.

you should see a messages like:

"savetiddlers: not in ......"

thanks
BJ


here's a picture of the hamburger menu - it may be different in windows
https://cdn.ghacks.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/firefox-57-touch-menu.png

[Sylvain Naudin]

Le mardi 7 novembre 2017 20:30:39 UTC+1, BJ a écrit :

I think that 'savetidders' (formerly bsaver) is about finished, and needs some testings on different platforms. So I would be grateful if people could try it. Remember don't use your own tiddlywikis  for testing this extension!!!

The install instructions are here: https://github.com/buggyj/savetiddlers

cheers

BJ

Hi BJ,

I've tested it 2 days ago at work with success on a Win7 desktop.

At home on my fresh Fedora 27, it's doesn't work sadly. I correctly create the subdir tiddlywikilocations on the default Download directory (Téléchargement in french), but every time it save the popup say me "TW not in tiddlywikilocations within the download directory.
 using default download directory", but it is !

OK, so I've test with another folder (Public), and it work. So it's because of accent in path.

For my information, is tiddlywikilocations hard coded ? Can we chose our name in a future ?

And like TonyM it work if we use the second option to ask where Firefox have to save other files. Good.

Cheers,

Sylvain

[BJ]

Hi Sylvain,
thanks for the feedback.

I am putting the 'tiddlywikifiles' in the options so it can be change (I am just finishing the release). I will investigate the accent visa-vi Téléchargement.

all the best
BJ

[BJ]

sorry but the directions I gave for seeing the console messages should have said 'Browser Console' not 'Web Console'

On Saturday, November 18, 2017 at 4:24:08 AM UTC+1, Alfonso Arciniega wrote:

[BJ]

I can see there is a problem with the accents

[Alfonso Arciniega]

This figure shows the settings for downloading at FF 57.0 64 bit in Windows 10:



And the console shows the following messages:


Hope this help,

Alfonso

[BJ]

thanks for the info. There is another debug window 'Browser Console' (not 'Web Console') that should have a line like:

savetiddlers: failed path /home/buggyj/Téléchargement!=/home/buggyj/Téléchargement

that shows the actual comparison that failed.

It would help me a lot if you could find that line (Browser Console is unfortunately a shared debug screen)

cheers

BJ

[Alfonso Arciniega]

The Browser Console is shown below:



By the way, tried in FF 57.0 64 bit on an Apple Mac macOS Sierra v10.12.16 and it works fine there. The issue appears to be only on Windows 10.

Cheers,

Alfonso

[BJ]

thanks!
so the c:\ has changed to a C:\ in the path

[Alfonso Arciniega]

BJ,

...and the solution to this issue is...

On Sunday, November 19, 2017 at 12:41:33 AM UTC-7, BJ wrote:

thanks!
so the c:\ has changed to a C:\ in the path

Cheers,

Alfonso

[BJ]

It is fixed it in the next version - which I am just testing, so it will be ready tomorrow.

I  dont know if this was caused by typing a small c:\  or a C:\ - in any case it is fixed.