Yearning for ONE method ...

[@TiddlyTweeter]

In the latest TW we have THE AGONY OF RICHES ...

As of today we have 16 (yes, SIXTEEN) kosher ways of saving TiddlyWiki ...

https://tiddlywiki.com/#GettingStarted



Is there ONE that works with everything (EVERY PLATFORM) that is easy to set up?

Best wishes
Josiah
 

[Mark S.]

Default mechanism works everywhere and requires no set-up.

Maybe what is needed is a grid of techniques vs. abilities to help people decide which approach is best for them.

Or a helper with a series of drop-downs (net-based, no-net, android, i-device, complexity)

-- Mark

[BJ]

I wrote savetiddlers to work the same as tiddlyfox - it has a one click install. The extra step is that you must create a directory in the downloads dirrectory called 'tiddlywikilocations' and move your tiddlywikis there.
BJ

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao Mark S.

I think my "feel" here comes from pretending to be a newbie on the block.

It really is daunting to have TOO MANY options without some kind of guidance about some Square One.

I think you are right that some kind of table or decision tree could help.

Best wishes
Josiah

[@TiddlyTweeter]

Ciao BJ

Right. Its very close to how FF used to be (and good) and also wider.

The issue is that someone hitting TW now using won't automatically know its very relevant.

I was wondering WHICH of the sixteen options are universal. Your saver looks close. But how do we let folk know what is least complex and workable?

[AndrewMc]

Hi All

I decided to create two new local tiddlywikis last night. It has been a long while (several years) since I last did this and I was immediately confused by the options in GettingStarted.
Do I put the TW files in any local folder? Or, do I need to keep them in the Firefox download folder (or sub-folder within that)?

I have seen mention of using links; while I do use Ubuntu Linux, I haven't actually created symlinks before and am not sure how they would apply with TW.
I also use Windows 7 and Android (and possibly Windows 10) for reading my TW, so this just adds to my stress whereby I may need a different setup in each operating system environment.

Like some others in this thread, I would appreciate some guidance.

Cheers
Andrew Mc

[Mark S.]

Which method of saving are you intending to use?

For default saving, your file has to go in the browser downloads directory OR, if you change setting to "ask each time" you can save anywhere.

But, if you save with default saving without "ask each time" each save will be made like file(1), file(2), etc. Which means when you restart your browser you will need to find the last file(x) and launch that one.

If you use BJ or Mario's save plugin, then for BJ's your file location is

<download directory>/tiddlywikilocations/file or
<download directory>/tiddlywikilocations/<one or more subdirectories>/file

and for Mario's it's

<download directory>/<tw you set>/file   or
<download directory>/<tw you set>/<one or more subdirectories>/file

This sounds limiting, but you can put a symbolic link (linux) or a junction (windows) in <file or location> which can point to anywhere else on your hard drive.

You can find information for making symbolic links (linux) or junctions (windows) on line. I don't know what kinds of links are available for Macs, but I assume they have them also.

Hopefully this clears things a little,

Mark

[coda coder]

Someone should add this as a PR.

Nailed.

On Thursday, November 16, 2017 at 9:17:39 PM UTC-6, Mark S. wrote:

Which method of saving are you intending to use?

For default saving, your file has to go in the browser downloads directory OR, if you change setting to "ask each time" you can save anywhere.

But, if you save with default saving without "ask each time" each save will be made like file(1), file(2), etc. Which means when you restart your browser you will need to find the last file(x) and launch that one.

If you use BJ or Mario's save plugin, then for BJ's your file location is

<download directory>/tiddlywikilocation/file or
<download directory>/tiddlywikilocation/<directory>/file

and for Mario's it's

<download directory>/<tw you set>/file   or

<download directory>/<tw you set>/<directory>/file

[Riz]

For android users, in case Antidwiki failed to work for you, here is the step by step instructions for an absolute beginner to set up a web-dav server.

1. Install a web-dav server app. The app I used is https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.theolivetree.webdavserver&hl=en

2. Create a folder in your internal memory/internal storage. Let us say, myFolder. Place your TW5s in here.

3. Open the app. Select settings menu of the app (top right corner). Change the following items.

- Network Interface: Loopback
- Home directory: Custom folder
- Custom folder; /sdcard/myFolder

4. Back to the main interface of the app. Start the server.

5. Open your mobile browser and type in the address field: "127.0.0.1:8080"

6. A page will open listing all files you placed in "myFolder". Open a tiddlywiki and try saving after some modifications.

Pros:
- Several Web-dav server apps are available in play store, you are not bound with one.
- Relatively easier to set up. Once the first set is done, subsequent launches is just a matter of starting the server from the app.

Cons:
- So far, external sdcard saving has not worked for me.

Extra tips:
- You can use an app like https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=dk.tacit.android.foldersync.lite&hl=en to sync the "myFolder" to dropbox/gdrive/onedrive.
- If you have like one major Tiddlywiki, you can add a shortcut to it placed in your home-screen. While your TW is open, select "Add to home-screen" from the overflow menu of chrome browser (the three dots menu on the top right).

Personally I am a fan of Tiddlyserver by Arlen and is using the same in android. However, setting it up in android involves a few more steps and might scare a terminal-shy new-comer away, admittedly. Nevertheless, if anyone wants to do it and need help, by all means ask.

Live long and prosper,
Riz

[BJ]

actually the directory for "savetiddlers" is tiddlywikilocations. There are more difference between mine and Mario's "file-backups" solution:

  - savertiddlers works the same as tiddlyfox - it is a one click save - with  "file-backups" there is a two click initial save for each tiddlywiki.

Sometimes you may not want to move you tiddlywiki - savetiddlers does not insist that you move all your tiddlywikis - it open a file choose dialogue to choose a different location to save to, whereas  "file-backups" insists that you move your tiddlywikis.


savetiddlers works with all versions of tiddlywiki, file-saver only works with tiddlywiki5.

savatiddlers works with chrome (and other chromium based browsers) file-backups does not.

savetiddlers has a once a day backup with date appended to name, file-backup uses a rotational backup of files, with appending (A), (B) etc

"sva"On Friday, November 17, 2017 at 4:17:39 AM UTC+1, Mark S. wrote:

Which method of saving are you intending to use?

For default saving, your file has to go in the browser downloads directory OR, if you change setting to "ask each time" you can save anywhere.

But, if you save with default saving without "ask each time" each save will be made like file(1), file(2), etc. Which means when you restart your browser you will need to find the last file(x) and launch that one.

If you use BJ or Mario's save plugin, then for BJ's your file location is

<download directory>/tiddlywikilocation/file or
<download directory>/tiddlywikilocation/<directory>/file

and for Mario's it's

<download directory>/<tw you set>/file   or

<download directory>/<tw you set>/<directory>/file

[PMario]

---------------- probably OT ---------------

On Friday, November 17, 2017 at 6:59:32 AM UTC+1, BJ wrote:

actually the directory for "savetiddlers" is tiddlywikilocations. There are more difference between mine and Mario's "file-backups" solution:

  - savertiddlers works the same as tiddlyfox - it is a one click save - with  "file-backups" there is a two click initial save for each tiddlywiki.

You are right. .. but the 2 clicks are only needed the very first time a new TW is detected.

This behaviour is only needed, since the browser doesn't give us the actually configured downloads directory. We need to save a file, to see, where it is saved, to be sure.

This will be a feature request for the mozilla and chrome devs. ... I didn't create it yet, since I need to prepare a minimal test case, so they see, that this API is needed.

 

Sometimes you may not want to move you tiddlywiki - savetiddlers does not insist that you move all your tiddlywikis - it open a file choose dialogue to choose a different location to save to, whereas  "file-backups" insists that you move your tiddlywikis.

That's not true.

If you open a TW that is outside of the browser downloads directory it needs to insist, because we can only save to the downloads directory and its subdirectories.

As long as a TW is opened inside the download dir, it is just saved. ... The 2 click initial save is still needed. See above.

As I did review my own intro videos, I did see some workflow improvements, which are implemented atm but I didn't want to have a fixed directory structure like: tiddlywikilocations

 

savetiddlers works with all versions of tiddlywiki, file-saver only works with tiddlywiki5.

That's right. but TWclassic will follow soon.

 

savatiddlers works with chrome (and other chromium based browsers) file-backups does not.

That's right. I do intend to port it to Chrome, but that's low on my priority list.

 

savetiddlers has a once a day backup with date appended to name, file-backup uses a rotational backup of files, with appending (A), (B) etc

That's right. And once this bug is fixed in TW, we both will have much more interesting options to create "out of order" saves. Which can be managed entirely by users.

 

I didn't want to start a competition with the file-backups AddOn, I just wanted to have a choice.

The "tower of hanoi" backup rotation schema, is in my head for years, as an alternative for the LessBackupsPlugin from TWcalssic. Since the file names are 100% predictable, there is no need for any internal management algorithm, that can run out of sync. The only parameter, that is really important for the AddOn at the moment is the "save-counter". ... And if the above mentioned bug ist fixed, even this one can be eliminated.

have fun!
mario

[PMario]

On Friday, November 17, 2017 at 4:17:39 AM UTC+1, Mark S. wrote:

and for Mario's it's

<download directory>/<tw you set>/file   or

<download directory>/<tw you set>/<directory>/file

With "file-backups" AddOn It can be:

a) <download directory>/file.html   or

b) <download directory>/<dir you set>/file.html   or

c) <download directory>/<dir you set>/<dir you set>/file.html  .... and so on.

I personally use option b) and link it with a windows directory link (junction).

-m

[Mark S.]

Reposting with fixes:

Which method of saving are you intending to use?

For default saving, your file has to go in the browser downloads directory OR, if you change setting to "ask each time" you can save anywhere.

But, if you save with default saving without "ask each time" each save will be made like file(1), file(2), etc. Which means when you restart your browser you will need to find the last file(x) and launch that one.

If you use BJ or Mario's save plugin, then for BJ's plugin (https://github.com/buggyj/savetiddlers) your file location is

<download directory>/tiddlywikilocations/file or
<download directory>/tiddlywikilocations/<one or more subdirectories>/file

and for Mario's plugin (https://github.com/pmario/file-backups#installation) it's

<download directory>/<subpath you set>/file or
<download directory>/<subpath you set>/<one or more subdirectories>/file

[AndrewMc]

Hi Mark

Thanks for your info and in particular your initial question. This made me go back and look again at the options. I have decided that for these two TW, I will use TiddlyDesktop. This is working well so far.
I am finding the information in this thread very useful.

Cheers
Andrew Mc