Print to lpt.txt from RSX-11M

[Eric N]

I added a printer to the simh RSX-11M boot.ini file:

attach LPT lpt.txt

However, when I attempt to print a file, it just gets stuck in the print queue.  How do I configure RSX-11M to recognize the new printer device?  Do I have do a full sysgen?

Eric N.

[Anton Lavrentiev]

You have to start the queue, attach the printer to the print processor, and then it'll work:

Since the Queue Manager has already been started in the stock system, the queue wasn't just assigned properly:

>QUE /LI

** PRINT QUEUES **

PRINT  =>

** BATCH QUEUES **

BATCH  => BAP0

You can see, the PRINT queue is unassibles, and there's no print processor.

We can add it like this:

>QUE LP0:/CR:P

>QUE LP0:/SP

>QUE /LI

** PRINT QUEUES **

PRINT  =>

LP0    => LP0

** BATCH QUEUES **

BATCH  => BAP0

Now you see, there's LP0 now, the print processor for LP0:

Finally, we assign this print processor as the destination print queue:

>QUE LP0:/AS:PRINT

>QUE /LI

** PRINT QUEUES **

PRINT  => LP0

LP0    => LP0

** BATCH QUEUES **

BATCH  => BAP0

So the PRINT queue will despool to LP0, which is controlling the LP0: device.

You can now print with "PRINT filename"...

As a small step further, if you are going to use the LP: as a device (like with the /SP flags for utilities),

you also need a connector task, PRT... -- that task emulates the device then submits the output produced

by the program as a print job to the Queue Manager (so it basically shields the LP0: from the direct use).

I see that the PRT... task is already in place.  So try using

PIP filename/SP

and see if it works...

Details:  AA-FD12A-TC_RSX-11M-PLUS_V3.0_System_Management_Guide_Jul85.pdf on bitsavers

Unfortunately, the most recent version of this manual there, for version RSX11Mplus_V4.x, was using color ink (red)

and wasn't scanned properly, so all the commands there have been whitened out.  You can only see

 

DCL>

MCR>

in the pages, since the actual commands were shown in red, and disappeared in B/W scan (treated as white on white LOL).

Hope this helps,

Anton

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[Eric N]

Wow, that worked, thanks!  Is it correct to add these commands to the LB:[1,2]STARTUP.CMD file to make the printer setup persistent?

Eric N.

[Anton Lavrentiev]

Well, usually the queue manager stuff goes into [1,2]QMGSTART.CMD ,
which is invoked from [1,2]STARTUP.CMD

BTW, all the queue commands that I showed in my previous email are in
that file, they are just commented out.

So the easiest would be to uncomment them, and voila!

HTH,
Anton

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[Eric N]

I see it now.  I added the following lines to the bottom of [1,2]QMGSTART.CMD and printing to the attached LPT device works now with a simple PRINT <FILE> command (just make sure you hit Ctrl-E to halt the simulator to get it to flush to lpt.txt):

        QUE LP0:/CR:P
        QUE LP0:/SP

        QUE LP0:/AS:PRINT

One note: The QUE commands above did not work when I added them to the [1,2]STARTUP.CMD file.

Eric N.

[Johnny Billquist]

Nope. But the queue system is pretty complex and advanced. And setting
it is a whole manual on its own.
http://mim.update.uu.se/manuals/rsx/batch.pdf

But check if you don't have a [1,2]QMGSTART.CMD, which you can edit
around a bit, and just run.
But I can't remember if there are a couple of things you need to do
before that command file, which are a one-off type of thing.
The manual do explain it all, but is a bit of an effort to get through it.

Johnny

--
Johnny Billquist || "I'm on a bus
|| on a psychedelic trip
email: b...@softjar.se || Reading murder books
pdp is alive! || tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol

[Eric N]

The printing is good now, but here is another semi-related question (I'm totally new to RSX-11 and the PDP-11 so this is quite the learning journey):

  Where is the best place to put start-up settings like the setting for lower case (SET /LOWER=TI:)?

I can add this to [1,2]STARTUP.CMD and it works fine, but it seems like a better location would be LOGIN.CMD in my local USER directory.  The problem is that after I edit LOGIN.CMD and attempt to save the file, I get the following error:

    Output file could not be created
    File name:DU0:[USER]LOGIN.TMP;1
    IE.NSF - No such file   

Other files edit and save just fine.

Eric N.

[Anton Lavrentiev]

You could have just uncommented (removed the .; from the beginning of
the lines) in that file, as I previously suggested
(I show the line numbers below):

---
47 .; .IFNINS LP0 INS $LPP/TASK=LP0

56 .; QUE LP0:/CR/NM

66 .; .SETF LP0
67 .; CON ESTAT LP0:
68 .; .IF <EXSTAT> EQ 120001 .SETT LP0
69 .; .IFT LP0 QUE LP0:/SP/FL:2/LOWER/FO:0

83 .; .IFT LP0 QUE LP0:/AS:PRINT
---

BTW, line 69 starts the processor with two flag pages (/FL:2) for
every job... You may want to change that to 0 (no flag page) or 1
(just one).

HTH,
Anton

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[Anton Lavrentiev]

> http://mim.update.uu.se/manuals/rsx/batch.pdf

Well, that's a wrong manual -- a user manual, and for setting up the
Queue Manager, you need the System Management Guide, which describes
maintenance commands

http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/rsx11/RSX11Mplus_V3.0_Jul85/AA-FD12A-TC_RSX-11M-PLUS_V3.0_System_Management_Guide_Jul85.pdf
or (newer but with problems I noted ealier):
http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/rsx11/RSX11Mplus_V4.x/7/AA-JS14A-TC_RSX-11M_PLUS_V4.0_RSX-11M-PLUS_and_MicroRSX_System_Management_Guide_Sep87.pdf

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[Anton Lavrentiev]

> (SET /LOWER=TI:)

If you want to change that permanently, the best way is to start VMR
and run SET /LOWER=TT0: SET /LOWER=TT1: etc for all terminals :-)

> INS $VMR
> VMR
Enter filename: [1,54]RSX11M
VMR> SET /LOWER
LOWER=TT3:
LOWER=TT4:
LOWER=TT5:
LOWER=TT6:
LOWER=TT7:
LOWER=TT10:
LOWER=TT11:
LOWER=TT12:
VMR> SET /LOWER=TT0:
VMR> <Ctrl/Z>
> REM VMR

Next time you boot, the console will have the lowercase capability :-)

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[Anton Lavrentiev]

> File name:DU0:[USER]LOGIN.TMP;1
> IE.NSF - No such file

Did you enable named directories with

> SET /NAMED

?

[Johnny Billquist]

On 2021-02-08 05:41, Anton Lavrentiev wrote:
>> http://mim.update.uu.se/manuals/rsx/batch.pdf
>
> Well, that's a wrong manual -- a user manual, and for setting up the
> Queue Manager, you need the System Management Guide, which describes
> maintenance commands

Damn. You're absolutely right. Went way too fast on that one.

> http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/rsx11/RSX11Mplus_V3.0_Jul85/AA-FD12A-TC_RSX-11M-PLUS_V3.0_System_Management_Guide_Jul85.pdf
> or (newer but with problems I noted ealier):
> http://bitsavers.org/pdf/dec/pdp11/rsx11/RSX11Mplus_V4.x/7/AA-JS14A-TC_RSX-11M_PLUS_V4.0_RSX-11M-PLUS_and_MicroRSX_System_Management_Guide_Sep87.pdf

Still blank and white, but with red and blue test readable, and for
version 4:
http://mim.update.uu.se/manuals/rsx/manager.pdf

More specifically, chapter 3 is about setting up the queue system.

Johnny

[Johnny Billquist]

On 2021-02-08 05:55, Anton Lavrentiev wrote:
>> File name:DU0:[USER]LOGIN.TMP;1
>> IE.NSF - No such file
>
> Did you enable named directories with
>
>> SET /NAMED
>
> ?

Enabling named directories allows you to set your default to a named
directory, and changes how protection UICs are handled.
You can still refer to a named directory, even when you are not in named
mode.

My first reaction would to to check if the directory DU0:[USER] even exists.

And if that is the case, then I would check what protection UIC the OP
is running under, and who is the owner and what is the protection of the
directory. I wouldn't expect to get an IE.NSF in such situation, but
just to make sure...

As for getting lowercase, doing it through VMR is an option, partially.
But in general, I would place SET /INQUIRE=TI: in LB:[1,2]SYSLOGIN.CMD,
which is better for getting a general terminal setup at login, and then
possibly also add SET /LOWER there, but this could then be overridden in
user specific LOGIN.CMD files, if wanted.

The thing about "partially" is that you obviously cannot do this for LAT
or TELNET terminals, since those devices are created dynamically after
boot. So they don't exist in VMR.

Johnny

[Eric N]

Here is what I figured out and the path I took to have lower case set automatically at login:

For the USER account:

1. I decided to edit the LOGIN.CMD file in my USER directory to set lower case (SET /LOWER=TI: ). 

2. To do so, you have edit the file as SYSTEM and not USER.

3. login as SYSTEM, then EDT DU0:[USER]LOGIN.CMD.

For the SYSTEM account:

1. create the LOGIN.CMD file with the same entry (there isn't one in the home directory by default).

So now I can print to LPT.txt and execute any command at login, which was my ultimate goal - woo!

Eric N.

[Johnny Billquist]

If it only works for you to edit DU0:[USER]LOGIN.CMD when you log in as
the system user, then it's all about file protection.

I would say it's obviously wrong to solve it the way you did. If you
have a user named USER, that user should own and have the rights to work
with his home directory.

Fix that the right way. :-)
Change owner and protection of DU0:[0,0]USER.DIR

Johnny

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>
> >
>
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> || on a psychedelic trip
> email: b...@softjar.se || Reading murder books
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[Eric N]

>>Change owner and protection of DU0:[0,0]USER.DIR

That looks to be the next thing I'll have to figure out.

[Johnny Billquist]

Finding this out is trivial:

PIP DU0:[0,0]USER.DIR/FU

will show something like:

.pip du0:[0,0]user.DIR/fu


Directory DU0:[0,0]
9-FEB-21 15:53

USER.DIR;1 (35,1) 2./2. C 08-JUN-05 00:21
[200,1] [RWED,RWED,RWED,R]

Total of 2./2. blocks in 1. file


This shows that in my case, the owner is [200,1], and the protection is
[RWED,RWED,RWED,R]

And the four fields are: system,user,group,world
And for each you have: Read, Write, Extend, Delete

Changing the protection is easy.
PIP DU0:[0,0]USER.DIR/PR/WO:RWED

for example, would change the world access to RWED.


Changing ownership is a bit more tricky, though. For some reason, PIP
don't have a way of changing ownership in general for a file.
However, if you have DECnet installed, NFT can be used to change
ownership. (See NFT HELP PROT)

Else, the easiest way is to create another directory, rename all the
files over, remove the USER directory, and recreate it. When creating a
directory, you can explicitly tell who the owner of the directory should
be. (See HELP UFD)

Johnny

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[Eric N]

Thanks! This is outstanding info to have.  One follow-up question:

- The USER account is UIC [200,1] and the [USER] named directory is [200,1] so why does USER not have permission to edit a file in this directory?  Is there a way to set permissions for specific files within a directory like UNIX?

[Johnny Billquist]

Well, the first thing to check is if the USER account actually is [200,1].

Next, yes of course each file have a permission. It's just the same as
the thing with the directory itself, as I wrote previously.
Apply the same things to any file.
Obviously, in this case we're then talking about DU0:[USER]LOGIN.CMD.
Check owner and protection.

But I do not understand that you would get an IE.NSF error if the
"problem" was with LOGIN.CMD itself.

One thing to remember is that in RSX, if you edit an existing file, you
will create a new file. The existing file will still around, and is not
affected by you creating a new file. That's what file versions do for you.

Second - you really need to log out, and log in as USER. It's not enough
to just change to that directory.
SET /UIC will show who you actually are. If you log in as USER, that
should give back [200,1] (obviously). Otherwise, you're in trouble. But
since this should basically also come from the information in the
account file, if it's correct in there, it shouldn't be possible that
this would end up wrong.

And to point out one more thing: users are always a UIC. The name you
use to log in is just the last name registered in the account file. And
it's only usable/relevant at login. After that, you only have
directories and UICs. The last name is not possible to use anywhere
else. It is shown if you list currently logged in users, but that's
about it.

Johnny

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>
>
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> || on a psychedelic trip
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>

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[Eric N]

There is something particular about this LOGIN.CMD file.  It's the only file that is visible if you do DIR DU0:[200,1].  The rest of the USER files are in [USER] and show as the defaults when you do a DIR.

>>SET /UIC will show who you actually are. If you log in as USER, that should give back [200,1] (obviously).

1. >set /uic gives me the following:

        Protection UIC:  [200,1]

2. I can only edit DU0:[200,1]LOGIN.CMD as SYSTEM.

3. When I edit the LOGIN.CMD file as system, I see a new copy of LOGIN.CMD in the [USER] directory (I can't edit either file as USER).

So USER can edit any file that is in [USER] but does not have the ability to edit a file that is in [200,1].  I'm using the default PiDP RSX-11M system image so everyone should be seeing the same issue.

[Anton Lavrentiev]

> PIP [200,1]/LI/FU
shows:

LOGIN.CMD;1 (1356,1) 1./1. 18-DEC-1998
02:46:23 [200,1] [RWED,R,R,R]

Meaning the file is read-only for USER, GROUP, and WORLD; only SYSTEM
(UIC member 1-7) are able to edit the file.

But the file does belong to [200,1], which the USER's UIC.

So when you logged in as "USER", just change the protection of the
file, to allow yourself to edit it:

> PIP [200,1]LOGIN.CMD/PR/OW:RWED

then you can edit the file, and you may want to change the protection
back to read-only with:

> PIP [200,1]LOGIN.CMD/PR/OW:R

Hope this helps.

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[Johnny Billquist]

On 2021-02-12 21:47, Anton Lavrentiev wrote:
>> PIP [200,1]/LI/FU
> shows:
>
> LOGIN.CMD;1 (1356,1) 1./1. 18-DEC-1998
> 02:46:23 [200,1] [RWED,R,R,R]
>
> Meaning the file is read-only for USER, GROUP, and WORLD; only SYSTEM
> (UIC member 1-7) are able to edit the file.

Well, technically groups 1-10, not 1-7. But no matter, the difference
isn't making a difference here anyway.

> But the file does belong to [200,1], which the USER's UIC.
>
> So when you logged in as "USER", just change the protection of the
> file, to allow yourself to edit it:
>
>> PIP [200,1]LOGIN.CMD/PR/OW:RWED
>
> then you can edit the file, and you may want to change the protection
> back to read-only with:
>
>> PIP [200,1]LOGIN.CMD/PR/OW:R
>
> Hope this helps.

Good points.

However, I would also like to know what is actually the login directory
of the user? If the OP claims that if he just do a DIR, he sees files in
DU:[USER], then it would suggest that this would be the default and home
directory. In which case, anything in [200,1] shouldn't really matter.
But he, with a system user, edits [200,1]LOGIN.CMD, and that is what is
executed at login, then it sounds as if this is the default and home
directory, and [USER] is pretty irrelevant.

I think some clarification about the account would help, along with a
few details on files and protections.

So, if the OP could show the information for the user USER in ACNT looks
like (just past the whole thing), and the results of the following commands:

PIP DU:[0,0]200001.DIR/FU,USER.DIR,[200,1]LOGIN.CMD,[USER]LOGIN.CMD

Then we should really have all the information required. (Assuming the
OP is logging in as USER, and that is when things don't work as expected.)

Johnny

[Anton Lavrentiev]

> technically groups 1-10

Oops, the favorite off-by-one thing :-)

This is what I see on that disk image

UIC=[200,1] FULL NAME="USER, A.NEW" PASSWORD="USER" HOME="SY00:[200001]"
LAST LOGIN="12-DEC-2019 23:32:32" ON="TT5:"
TOTAL NUMBER OF LOGINS=0003.
ACCOUNT NUMBER=0000. CLI="MCR" SESSION="USR"

200001.DIR;1 (34,1) 1./1. C 18-DEC-2018
06:48:45 [200,1] [RWED,RWED,RWED,R]
USER.DIR;1 (35,1) 2./2. C 18-DEC-2018
06:48:45 [200,1] [RWED,RWED,RWED,R]

[200001]:
LOGIN.CMD;1 (1351,1) 1./1. 18-DEC-1998
02:46:21 [200,1] [RWED,R,R,R]

[USER]:

LOGIN.CMD;1 (1356,1) 1./1. 18-DEC-1998
02:46:23 [200,1] [RWED,R,R,R]

> TYPE [200001]LOGIN.CMD
.ENABLE QUIET
.IF <CLI> EQ "MCR" SET /DCL=TI:
.DISABLE QUIET
.IF <DIRECT> NE "[USER]" SET DEFAULT [USER]/NAMED
.ENABLE QUIET
TYPE HELLO.TXT

> TYPE [USER]LOGIN.CMD
.ENABLE QUIET
.IF <CLI> EQ "MCR" SET /DCL=TI:
.DISABLE QUIET
.IF <DIRECT> NE "[USER]" SET DEFAULT [USER]/NAMED
.ENABLE QUIET
TYPE HELLO.TXT

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[Eric N]

These were some great tips.  Being able to read and set permissions in RSX has been very helpful.  To put everything in one message, here are the options for viewing and changing privilege settings for the SYSTEM, OWNER, GROUP and WORLD fields using [200,1]LOGIN.CMD as an example:

1. Viewing permissions:

>>PIP DU0:[200,1]LOGIN.CMD/fu

[200001]:
LOGIN.CMD;1 (1351,1) 1./1. 18-DEC-1998
02:46:21 [200,1] [RWED,R,R,R]

2. Set permissions of the file owner to RWED:

>> PIP [200,1]LOGIN.CMD/PR/OW:RWED 

3. View permissions again:

>>PIP DU0:[200,1]LOGIN.CMD/fu

LOGIN.CMD;7         (15603,642)     1./5.            13-FEB-2021 19:22
  [200,1]  [RWED,RWED,R,R]

*To change permissions for group, world or system per #2 above, use these parameters:

/GR[#]:RWED
/WO:RWED
/SY:RWED

Eric N.