What is the quickest way to join two rows together?
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John . Smith
Dec 8, 2016, 1:32:52 PM12/8/16
to MyLifeOrganized
What is the quickest way to join two rows together?
i.e. I keep wanting to the first child task onto the end of a part task's name
e.g. I would want:
Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED
Line 2: - Clear bedroom
to now become:
Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear bedroom
i.e. now all on the one line!
BACKGROUND
I am in the habit of writing a task in the form:
[PROJECT NAME] ==> [next action]
e.g. Suppose I had a project like this:
HOUSE ORGANISED [as a Project]
- Clear bedroom [as a task with the Project]
- Clear TV room [as a task with the Project]
- Clean Kitchen surfaces [as a task with the Project]
- Clear Kitchen cupboards [as a task with the Project]
Ideally I like to see:
"HOUSE ORGANISED ==> Clear bedroom"
And then at a single click (on the small triangle before the project's name) I could see all the tasks below it by "un-collapsing" the child tasks.
HOUSE ORGANISED ==> Clear bedroom
Clear TV room
Clean Kitchen surfaces
Clear Kitchen cupboards
Yes, I know that I want to see just the first task within the project, obviously I could use the MLO functionality of "Show Next Actions", however there are problems:
1. I want very quickly (i.e. at a single click) see what all the other tasks within the project are. And in order to to this in MLO using/not using Show Next Actions, I would need to change workarea (i.e. tab). And this is rather clunky.
2. The project name "HOUSE ORGANISED" must be made into a MLO Project (e.g. using Alt+J) . This is only a slight pain but...
3. Any other parent tasks that have not been made into MLO Projects simply disappear from the "Show Next Actions" view! Which can be extremely confusing.
4. In any case rather than all being on the one line, it would then take up two lines which wastes precious vertical space: i.e.
Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED
Line 2: - Clear bedroom
instead of just:
Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear bedroom
My conclusion is that in many cases I would prefer to not bother with allocating formal MLO Project, and not bother with having to change tabs, I would like to have sub-tasks within a task and simply manually append the next task on the list onto the project's name.
But how can I do this in MLO?
But how can I do this in MLO?
Cheers
J
Dwight
Dec 9, 2016, 1:19:19 PM12/9/16
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
Hi, John. First, let me say that I am surprised to find you clicking
triangles, I thought that you were keyboard-only. You must have found a
better mount? :-)
I know that there are outliner is which "join rows" is a small deal -
MLO's not one. The only way I know to do what you are asking would be
with cut & paste which is cumbersome and I'm sure wholely unacceptable.
But let's go over why Next Actions isn't working for you. I made a new
profile and put in a half dozen or so tasks at the root and then added a
folder named HOUSE ORGANISED with the four child tasks you specified. I
created two tabs: the first one showed the All Tasks view, the second
showed Active Actions. The second tab was set to synch selection with
the first tab, and I had the view specifications showing in the left
hand panel. I changed the first filter from ShowActions:Active to
ShowActions:NextAction and saved the updated view as Next Actions. I
created a third tab and loaded the Active Actions view. In Options:to-do
list format I turned on the top Encode checkbox, turned off encode for
projects, turned on prefix encoding for task path with a path depth of
one, name limit of 20 characters, no start or separator string and enc
string of " - " (blank/dash/blank).
The Next Actions view shows seven tasks, root tasks one through six, and
one that showed
HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear Bedroom
I marked the House task completed and it changed to
HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear TV Room
the six root tasks were undisturbed
In order to view the other tasks involved in house organization, I have
several choices
1. click on the home tab. To go back, click on the nextactions tab. one
click each way. drawback: if you have a lot of concurrent projects like
this they will all be expended at once. But the one you are working on
will be the selected task so it should not be challenging to find.
2. Doubleclick on the current task. Everything past the initial click is
identical to option 1
3. Click on the ActiveActions tab. After the initial click it's the same
as #1. Difference is that #1 gave a hierarchical view which allows you
to see the parents and the completed tasks, also, the view in #1 may
have been sorted which may or may not help.
4. Stay in the current tab. Change the first filter to
ShowActions:Active. When you are done, change it back. Advantage, only
uses a single workspace, if that matters to you. Drawback: two clicks to
change, And a risk that you are going to leave this expanded without
resetting it and get a surprise the next time you use the view and it
doesn't do what it is supposed to.
5. Stay in the current tab but keep the list of available views in the
left sidebar instead of the view definition. Click on "active actions"
to expand, click on "next actions" to revert. Same as #4 but single
click and without the risk of leaving the view incorrectly defined.
Reviewing your concerns:
- you want to expand in a single click. Of the five ways of expanding
shown above, four are single click.
- you find changing tabs clunky. I don't understand why changing tabs is
challenging but two of the five methods work in a single tab.
- you experience a slight pain making the parent a project. There are no
projects here but it would work about the same if you used a project.
- other tasks vanish. No tasks outside of the clean house structure
vanished during this test. The cost of this is that all of your
non-project tasks have to be at root, something that you previously said
was your intention.
- the parent takes up display space. The parent is not displayed in this
test unless all of the subtasks are complete.
To your conclusion, it is incredibly simple to prepend a project name
onto its subtasks using the option described above. The challenge is to
do this only for the next action while continuing to display the other
tasks without the prepend. For that I think you have to use cut and paste
-Dwight
On 12/8/2016 1:32 PM, John . Smith wrote:
>
> Hello
>
> What is the quickest way to join two rows together?
> i.e. I keep wanting to the first child task onto the end of a part
> task's name
>
> e.g. I would want:
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED
> Line 2: - Clear bedroom
>
> to now become:
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear bedroom
>
> i.e. now all on the one line!
>
>
> *BACKGROUND*
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "MyLifeOrganized" group.
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triangles, I thought that you were keyboard-only. You must have found a
better mount? :-)
I know that there are outliner is which "join rows" is a small deal -
MLO's not one. The only way I know to do what you are asking would be
with cut & paste which is cumbersome and I'm sure wholely unacceptable.
But let's go over why Next Actions isn't working for you. I made a new
profile and put in a half dozen or so tasks at the root and then added a
folder named HOUSE ORGANISED with the four child tasks you specified. I
created two tabs: the first one showed the All Tasks view, the second
showed Active Actions. The second tab was set to synch selection with
the first tab, and I had the view specifications showing in the left
hand panel. I changed the first filter from ShowActions:Active to
ShowActions:NextAction and saved the updated view as Next Actions. I
created a third tab and loaded the Active Actions view. In Options:to-do
list format I turned on the top Encode checkbox, turned off encode for
projects, turned on prefix encoding for task path with a path depth of
one, name limit of 20 characters, no start or separator string and enc
string of " - " (blank/dash/blank).
The Next Actions view shows seven tasks, root tasks one through six, and
one that showed
HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear Bedroom
I marked the House task completed and it changed to
HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear TV Room
the six root tasks were undisturbed
In order to view the other tasks involved in house organization, I have
several choices
1. click on the home tab. To go back, click on the nextactions tab. one
click each way. drawback: if you have a lot of concurrent projects like
this they will all be expended at once. But the one you are working on
will be the selected task so it should not be challenging to find.
2. Doubleclick on the current task. Everything past the initial click is
identical to option 1
3. Click on the ActiveActions tab. After the initial click it's the same
as #1. Difference is that #1 gave a hierarchical view which allows you
to see the parents and the completed tasks, also, the view in #1 may
have been sorted which may or may not help.
4. Stay in the current tab. Change the first filter to
ShowActions:Active. When you are done, change it back. Advantage, only
uses a single workspace, if that matters to you. Drawback: two clicks to
change, And a risk that you are going to leave this expanded without
resetting it and get a surprise the next time you use the view and it
doesn't do what it is supposed to.
5. Stay in the current tab but keep the list of available views in the
left sidebar instead of the view definition. Click on "active actions"
to expand, click on "next actions" to revert. Same as #4 but single
click and without the risk of leaving the view incorrectly defined.
Reviewing your concerns:
- you want to expand in a single click. Of the five ways of expanding
shown above, four are single click.
- you find changing tabs clunky. I don't understand why changing tabs is
challenging but two of the five methods work in a single tab.
- you experience a slight pain making the parent a project. There are no
projects here but it would work about the same if you used a project.
- other tasks vanish. No tasks outside of the clean house structure
vanished during this test. The cost of this is that all of your
non-project tasks have to be at root, something that you previously said
was your intention.
- the parent takes up display space. The parent is not displayed in this
test unless all of the subtasks are complete.
To your conclusion, it is incredibly simple to prepend a project name
onto its subtasks using the option described above. The challenge is to
do this only for the next action while continuing to display the other
tasks without the prepend. For that I think you have to use cut and paste
-Dwight
On 12/8/2016 1:32 PM, John . Smith wrote:
>
> Hello
>
> What is the quickest way to join two rows together?
> i.e. I keep wanting to the first child task onto the end of a part
> task's name
>
> e.g. I would want:
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED
> Line 2: - Clear bedroom
>
> to now become:
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear bedroom
>
> i.e. now all on the one line!
>
>
>
> I am in the habit of writing a task in the form:
> [PROJECT NAME] ==> [next action]
>
> e.g. Suppose I had a project like this:
> HOUSE ORGANISED [as a Project]
> - Clear bedroom [as a task with the Project]
> - Clear TV room [as a task with the Project]
> - Clean Kitchen surfaces [as a task with the Project]
> - Clear Kitchen cupboards [as a task with the Project]
>
> Ideally I like to see:
> "HOUSE ORGANISED ==> Clear bedroom"
>
> And then at a single click (on the small triangle before the project's
> name) I could see all the tasks below it by "un-collapsing" the child
> tasks.
> HOUSE ORGANISED ==> Clear bedroom
> Clear TV room
> Clean Kitchen surfaces
> Clear Kitchen cupboards
>
>
> Yes, I know that I want to see /*just*/ the first task within the
> I am in the habit of writing a task in the form:
> [PROJECT NAME] ==> [next action]
>
> e.g. Suppose I had a project like this:
> HOUSE ORGANISED [as a Project]
> - Clear bedroom [as a task with the Project]
> - Clear TV room [as a task with the Project]
> - Clean Kitchen surfaces [as a task with the Project]
> - Clear Kitchen cupboards [as a task with the Project]
>
> Ideally I like to see:
> "HOUSE ORGANISED ==> Clear bedroom"
>
> And then at a single click (on the small triangle before the project's
> name) I could see all the tasks below it by "un-collapsing" the child
> tasks.
> HOUSE ORGANISED ==> Clear bedroom
> Clear TV room
> Clean Kitchen surfaces
> Clear Kitchen cupboards
>
>
> project, obviously I could use the MLO functionality of "Show Next
> Actions", however there are problems:
>
> 1. I want very quickly (i.e. at a single click) see what all the other
> tasks within the project are. And in order to to this in MLO using/not
> using Show Next Actions, I would need to *change workarea* (i.e. tab).
> Actions", however there are problems:
>
> 1. I want very quickly (i.e. at a single click) see what all the other
> tasks within the project are. And in order to to this in MLO using/not
> And this is rather clunky.
>
> 2. The project name "HOUSE ORGANISED" *must *be made into a MLO Project
>
> (e.g. using Alt+J) . This is only a slight pain but...
>
> 3. Any other parent tasks that have not been made into MLO Projects
> simply disappear from the "Show Next Actions" view! Which can be
> extremely confusing.
>
> 4. In any case rather than all being on the one line, it would then take
> up two lines which wastes precious vertical space: i.e.
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED
> Line 2: - Clear bedroom
> instead of just:
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear bedroom
>
>
> My conclusion is that in many cases I would prefer to not bother with
> allocating formal MLO Project, and not bother with having to change
> tabs, I would like to have sub-tasks within a task and simply manually
> append the next task on the list onto the project's name.
>
> But how can I do this in MLO?
>
> Cheers
>
> J
>
> --
>
> 3. Any other parent tasks that have not been made into MLO Projects
> simply disappear from the "Show Next Actions" view! Which can be
> extremely confusing.
>
> 4. In any case rather than all being on the one line, it would then take
> up two lines which wastes precious vertical space: i.e.
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED
> Line 2: - Clear bedroom
> instead of just:
> Line 1: HOUSE ORGANISED - Clear bedroom
>
>
> My conclusion is that in many cases I would prefer to not bother with
> allocating formal MLO Project, and not bother with having to change
> tabs, I would like to have sub-tasks within a task and simply manually
> append the next task on the list onto the project's name.
>
> But how can I do this in MLO?
>
> Cheers
>
> J
>
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John . Smith
Dec 13, 2016, 7:04:28 AM12/13/16
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Dwight
Wow - I had no idea that all that stuff with the Todo List format, showing the Task Path was even possible! I learned various things there - thank you!
Yes that looks useful. But I shall need to digest this properly when I have more time and revert...
In the meantime I have two other related problems:
A) How can I get to show not just ONE next action within a major project but THREE?
To explain: I find that quite often the actions within a project are neither to be executed strictly "in series" nor completely in parallel. i.e. If I have a large number of actions within a project I don't want it to overwhelm my view by showing them all, nor to I want to just show one project because the next 2 or 3 can often be done simultaneously (i.e. "in parallel").
I am have been assuming that "Next THREE Actions" is probably impossible in MLO but if anyone out there knows, Dwight would know!
B) Forced Next
I know that this is an 'old chestnut' that has been previously discussed but I cant remember the conclusion!
But in GTDNext there is an extremely useful featured which they call "Forced Next" which allows the user to manually put additional tasks onto the Next (one) Actions view. I have never quite managed to create some such thing in MLO. The obvious thing to try is to create a flag called say "ForcedNext", but I don't think there was any way to create a view that shows NextActions AND Flag="ForcedNext".
But in GTDNext there is an extremely useful featured which they call "Forced Next" which allows the user to manually put additional tasks onto the Next (one) Actions view. I have never quite managed to create some such thing in MLO. The obvious thing to try is to create a flag called say "ForcedNext", but I don't think there was any way to create a view that shows NextActions AND Flag="ForcedNext".
Wait, it's coming back to me, now - or was that the intractable problem?!
General point:
Having recently been experimented with competing products I keep coming back to the same feeling. MLO really is amazing in so many ways. BUT personally I keep finding that it's like "the monkey's claw", all the really important things that I want a task management system to do aren't just difficult, after hours of trying complicated workaround, it turns out that they all have terrible unwanted side effects that are worse than the original problem. To me it is clear that MLO has long ago lost the battle of overwhelming the new users with too many features, but unfortunately they haven't quite finished job of making it technically possible to do all the really important things.
J
Dwight wrote:
Dwight wrote:
> <mailto:mylifeorganized+unsub...@googlegroups.com>.
Dwight
Dec 13, 2016, 12:28:51 PM12/13/16
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
John: when you find that your question is no longer relevant to the
title of the thread you should start a new thread please. But to avoit
being a PITB I will answer these two new questions here.
I do not know any way to see "the action after the next action" or "the
action after that". But if you have clumps of tasks that can be pursued
simultaneously and others that have to be sequential I know how to do
that. Imagine a project with seven tasks, where numbers 2 and 3 can run
in parallel and also numbers 5 and 6 can run in parallel. Dont use "next
actions". Look at an "active actions" view. Set "complete tasks in
order" for the project, then set it up like this:
Project
> Task 1
> Folder 1
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 4
> Folder 2
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
> Task 7
To remind you of the outcome of your prior discussions on forced next
actions, it would be easy to construct an advanced filter that would
show all tasks where
((NextAction = true) OR (Flag = ForcedNext))
except for one thing; NextAction is not defined as an advanced filter
criterion. You submitted a proposal for this to be implemented, I
supported it, you did not do much cheer leading to try to raise support
from the community, there was not a huge outcry for this feature and so
far no implementation plans have been revealed.
-Dwight
> > an email to mylifeorganiz...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>
> > <mailto:mylifeorganiz...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>>.
> > <mailto:mylifeo...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>>.
> <https://groups.google.com/group/mylifeorganized>.
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mylifeorganized/476464dc-d657-4e73-a980-2b1618ea8174%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
title of the thread you should start a new thread please. But to avoit
being a PITB I will answer these two new questions here.
I do not know any way to see "the action after the next action" or "the
action after that". But if you have clumps of tasks that can be pursued
simultaneously and others that have to be sequential I know how to do
that. Imagine a project with seven tasks, where numbers 2 and 3 can run
in parallel and also numbers 5 and 6 can run in parallel. Dont use "next
actions". Look at an "active actions" view. Set "complete tasks in
order" for the project, then set it up like this:
Project
> Task 1
> Folder 1
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 4
> Folder 2
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
> Task 7
To remind you of the outcome of your prior discussions on forced next
actions, it would be easy to construct an advanced filter that would
show all tasks where
((NextAction = true) OR (Flag = ForcedNext))
except for one thing; NextAction is not defined as an advanced filter
criterion. You submitted a proposal for this to be implemented, I
supported it, you did not do much cheer leading to try to raise support
from the community, there was not a huge outcry for this feature and so
far no implementation plans have been revealed.
-Dwight
> > <mailto:mylifeorganiz...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>>.
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John . Smith
Dec 13, 2016, 12:53:51 PM12/13/16
to MyLifeOrganized
PS
Dwight I have found a major flaw in your proposal, for using Next Actions which is that what you suggest only works in the root directory. Whereas I am using a different folder for each of my Areas of Life. The problem is that the Next Actions view in MLO hides all stand-alone tasks. And MLO fails to treat tasks that are within a Folder as if they were in the root directory.
The only workaround I can find is to manually make all my standalone task become "Projects"! (This is slightly painful to remember to hit Alt/J for every standalone task...).
Obviously if you make everything in sight into a Project, then the Next Action view simply would simply shows everything in sight! So in order to just have only the genuine next actions within each project become visible in the Next Actions view, I would need to make sure that all actions within a project are NOT be flagged-up as being also Projects.
Obviously if you make everything in sight into a Project, then the Next Action view simply would simply shows everything in sight! So in order to just have only the genuine next actions within each project become visible in the Next Actions view, I would need to make sure that all actions within a project are NOT be flagged-up as being also Projects.
This would be possible. Although given that I like to move stuff rather fluidly between projects and actions this wouldn't be ideal.
J
On the up-side I guess I could manually flag any actions up as being "Forced Next" actions (see my previous comment) simply by making any action I wanted to see on the the Next Actions list become a project (e.g. using Alt/J)
Dwight
Dec 13, 2016, 1:04:38 PM12/13/16
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
True. You previously stated that you found folders to be a waste of time
so I was assuming that you would have lots of standalone tasks at the
root. If that no longer applies, I would suggest forgetting about next
actions, and setting all of the projects or folders where you want to
see next actions as "complete tasks in order"
-Dwight
On 12/13/2016 12:53 PM, John . Smith wrote:
> PS
> Dwight I have found a major flaw in your proposal, for using Next
> Actions which is that what you suggest only works in the /root/
> > <mailto:mylifeorganiz...@googlegroups.com>.
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mylifeorganized/7f260b43-f245-477c-9941-936596dfccef%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
so I was assuming that you would have lots of standalone tasks at the
root. If that no longer applies, I would suggest forgetting about next
actions, and setting all of the projects or folders where you want to
see next actions as "complete tasks in order"
-Dwight
On 12/13/2016 12:53 PM, John . Smith wrote:
> PS
> Dwight I have found a major flaw in your proposal, for using Next
> directory. Whereas I am using a different folder for each of my Areas of
> Life. The problem is that the Next Actions view in MLO hides all
> stand-alone tasks. And MLO fails to treat tasks that are within a Folder
> as if they were in the root directory.
>
> The only workaround I can find is to manually make all my standalone
> task become "Projects"! (This is slightly painful to remember to hit
> Alt/J for every standalone task...).
>
> Obviously if you make everything in sight into a Project, then the Next
> Action view simply would simply shows everything in sight! So in order
> to just have only the /genuine/ next actions within each project become
> Life. The problem is that the Next Actions view in MLO hides all
> stand-alone tasks. And MLO fails to treat tasks that are within a Folder
> as if they were in the root directory.
>
> The only workaround I can find is to manually make all my standalone
> task become "Projects"! (This is slightly painful to remember to hit
> Alt/J for every standalone task...).
>
> Obviously if you make everything in sight into a Project, then the Next
> Action view simply would simply shows everything in sight! So in order
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John . Smith
Dec 13, 2016, 1:35:27 PM12/13/16
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Dwight
[message crossing, btw!]
> You previously stated that you found folders to be a waste of time
To be fair I have now tried so many different configurations of everything insight I am losing count!
I'm probably being a bit thick about this but in your example...
Project
> Task 1
> Folder 1
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 4
> Folder 2
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
> Task 7
If I make the Project which contains all 7 tasks set to "Complete subtasks in order", the only task that is now visible is Task 1.
Also what impact does creating those Folders actually have?
In general "Complete subtasks in order" only seems to work for one layer of subtasks. i.e. If Task 1 any children or grandchildren e.g.
> Task 1
> > Task 1.1
> > > Task 1.1.1
> > > Task 1.1.2
> > > Task 1.1.3
> > Task 1.2
> > Task 1.3
Then all of the above would be visible, yes?
John . Smith
Dec 13, 2016, 1:42:27 PM12/13/16
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Dwight
What do you think of my proposal to keep using the Next Actions, and to make sure that all standalone tasks are given the Alt/J treatment (painful but possible)?
That way any tasks within a genuine project that I wanted to do "Forced Next" could be made into Projects too...
J
Dwight Arthur
Dec 13, 2016, 5:47:22 PM12/13/16
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
Hi. John. It sounds as though that would work for you. It would not work for me because it would take too much effort to get and keep all the tasks set to be projects that need it.
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Dwight
Dec 13, 2016, 6:25:20 PM12/13/16
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
The folder counts as a subtask but it is one that does not need to be
marked complete. So at the beginning of the process, the project has
five steps: Task 1, Folder 1, Task 4, Folder 2, Task 7. These steps will
be done sequentially. When the next step is a folder, the folder itself
need not be marked complete but the step cannot be considered complete
until the uncompleted subtasks are done. There is no "complete subtasks
in order" set for the folders, so the subtasks of each folder are done
in parallel.
The result is, initially Task 1 is shown. When task 1 is completed,
tasks 2 and 3 are shown together and can be done in any order. Suppose 3
is done first, then task 2 remains visible and is the only task for this
project that's visible. When task 2 is completed, task 4 is shown, When
task 4 is completed, tasks 5 and 6 show together. When they have each
been completed task 7 is shown and then the project is done.
As I said, this does not show you "the task after the next task" or "the
task after that" but it does allow you to specify certain groups of
tasks as acceptable to execute simultaneously, or in parallel. In this
case, tasks 2 and 3, and tasks 5 and 6 were designated as parallel
tasks. The folders are just there because it makes it easier to compose
and to read. The most efficient form for this same project would be
Project
> Task 1
> Task 4
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 7
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
This project is exactly equivalent to the one with the folders, in terms
of what is visible at each point and what happens when any particular
task is completed. Although is presents the tasks in strictly numerical
order it appears to the human eye to be out of order, which is why the
version with the folders is easier to read.
BTW the "Task 1" project that you presented below, assuming that "task
1" itself is marked "subtasks in order" and that no other task has this
marking, would be executed as follows: tasks 1.1.1, 1.1.2 and 1.1.3
would be shown all at the same time. After all three were complete, then
tasks 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 and finally task 1 will be displayed one-at-a-time
sequentially.
-Dwight
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mylifeorganized/d7bd23ac-60bf-4513-b126-721a28d2e61b%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
marked complete. So at the beginning of the process, the project has
five steps: Task 1, Folder 1, Task 4, Folder 2, Task 7. These steps will
be done sequentially. When the next step is a folder, the folder itself
need not be marked complete but the step cannot be considered complete
until the uncompleted subtasks are done. There is no "complete subtasks
in order" set for the folders, so the subtasks of each folder are done
in parallel.
The result is, initially Task 1 is shown. When task 1 is completed,
tasks 2 and 3 are shown together and can be done in any order. Suppose 3
is done first, then task 2 remains visible and is the only task for this
project that's visible. When task 2 is completed, task 4 is shown, When
task 4 is completed, tasks 5 and 6 show together. When they have each
been completed task 7 is shown and then the project is done.
As I said, this does not show you "the task after the next task" or "the
task after that" but it does allow you to specify certain groups of
tasks as acceptable to execute simultaneously, or in parallel. In this
case, tasks 2 and 3, and tasks 5 and 6 were designated as parallel
tasks. The folders are just there because it makes it easier to compose
and to read. The most efficient form for this same project would be
Project
> Task 1
> Task 4
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 7
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
This project is exactly equivalent to the one with the folders, in terms
of what is visible at each point and what happens when any particular
task is completed. Although is presents the tasks in strictly numerical
order it appears to the human eye to be out of order, which is why the
version with the folders is easier to read.
BTW the "Task 1" project that you presented below, assuming that "task
1" itself is marked "subtasks in order" and that no other task has this
marking, would be executed as follows: tasks 1.1.1, 1.1.2 and 1.1.3
would be shown all at the same time. After all three were complete, then
tasks 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 and finally task 1 will be displayed one-at-a-time
sequentially.
-Dwight
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John . Smith
Dec 14, 2016, 7:42:14 AM12/14/16
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Dwight
Ah - I hadn't quite realised that a Folder in MLO cannot be marked as completed. And that in the Active tasks view, MLO's "Complete subtasks in order" will hide a folder it if it does not contain any uncompleted tasks.
Ah - I hadn't quite realised that a Folder in MLO cannot be marked as completed. And that in the Active tasks view, MLO's "Complete subtasks in order" will hide a folder it if it does not contain any uncompleted tasks.
OK so yes, using a folder would certainly be one way of getting a number of subtasks to appear simultaneously in a project that had "Complete subtasks in order" set. The only problem is that the Folder itself is a slightly artificial construct (that my have no obvious name for example)
However there are problems with the form you suggest i.e.
Project
> Task 1
> Task 4
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 7
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
> Task 1
> Task 4
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> Task 7
> > Task 5
> > Task 6
One problem is that Task 4 and Task 7 have become out of sequence.
e.g. After Task 1 is completed, you would see Task 4 which looks like it should be done before Task 2 and Task 3.
Project
> Task 4
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
> > Task 2
> > Task 3
Moreover if you do complete task 4 early then if you also tick it off as being completed, then Tasks 2 and Task 3 would disappear from view prematurely - not good!
Reflecting on all of this, I think one of my problems is that:
A) because I think in shapes, all my instincts are to create a mind map by subject area, but then when it comes to priority - i.e. the sequence in which I need to execute things... that is a totally different dimension and not remotely the same thing priority.
A) because I think in shapes, all my instincts are to create a mind map by subject area, but then when it comes to priority - i.e. the sequence in which I need to execute things... that is a totally different dimension and not remotely the same thing priority.
Moreover:
B) I also like to sort things by relative priority (i.e. priority relative to each other)
However it is dangerous to conflate subject area with priority as they are clearly totally different concepts.
AH-HA! I have just had a mini-breakthrough regarding my need for "Forced Next".
If I create a flag called ForcedNext, if I then create a view that has "Show Actions: All" and I create an Advanced filter of:
ActiveAction is true OR
Flag = ForcedNext
In this view it will show the first Active action and it will also show any actions that I have flagged up as being ForcedNext.
Better yet, if I want to see visually (with only minimal reading) what that task is by subject area I can set Show Hierarchy to Yes.
Or if I want a more compact view I can of course switch the hierarchy off.
And of course Hierarchy view is useful if I want to change the sort order without resorting to a "manual sort" which always gets me confused later.
I can then work through these views to pick off the "focus on today" tasks using stars.
OK this sounds v promising - now to put it into practice. More later
J
Dwight
Dec 15, 2016, 12:52:17 AM12/15/16
to mylifeo...@googlegroups.com
Hi, John. I mentioned that the more efficient form of the project
"appears to the human eye to be out of order" and you clearly have a
strong case of this but I promise you, the order is correct. Type this
in and run it, you will see what I mean. After task 1 is done the next
one to appear is not 4, it's 2 and 3 together. task 4 cannot appear
because it is inactive, due to having uncompleted subtasks. Only when
the subtasks are completed can the parent appear.
Your "moreover" point is valid though I would say it differently.
Setting up the tasks in this form means that checking off task 4 means
that you have completed (or cancelled) tasks 2, 3, and 4. If you have
completed task 4 out of order but still need 2 and 3, you would have to
re-order the tasks.
Anyhow, since you are a "thinking in shapes" person you should probably
avoid this, as well as any sort of reverse polish notation.
-Dwight
On 12/14/2016 7:42 AM, John . Smith wrote:
> Hi Dwight
>
> Ah - I hadn't quite realised that a Folder in MLO /cannot/ be marked as
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mylifeorganized/0352cbbb-c937-4878-a266-11ba2acc9f32%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
"appears to the human eye to be out of order" and you clearly have a
strong case of this but I promise you, the order is correct. Type this
in and run it, you will see what I mean. After task 1 is done the next
one to appear is not 4, it's 2 and 3 together. task 4 cannot appear
because it is inactive, due to having uncompleted subtasks. Only when
the subtasks are completed can the parent appear.
Your "moreover" point is valid though I would say it differently.
Setting up the tasks in this form means that checking off task 4 means
that you have completed (or cancelled) tasks 2, 3, and 4. If you have
completed task 4 out of order but still need 2 and 3, you would have to
re-order the tasks.
Anyhow, since you are a "thinking in shapes" person you should probably
avoid this, as well as any sort of reverse polish notation.
-Dwight
On 12/14/2016 7:42 AM, John . Smith wrote:
> Hi Dwight
>
> completed. And that in the Active tasks view, MLO's "Complete subtasks
> in order" will hide a folder it if it does not contain any uncompleted
> tasks.
>
> OK so yes, using a folder would certainly be one way of getting a number
> of subtasks to appear simultaneously in a project that had "Complete
> subtasks in order" set. The only problem is that the Folder itself is a
> slightly artificial construct (that my have no obvious name for example)
>
>
> However there are problems with the form you suggest i.e.
>
> Project
> > Task 1
> > Task 4
> > > Task 2
> > > Task 3
> > Task 7
> > > Task 5
> > > Task 6
>
> One problem is that Task 4 and Task 7 have become out of sequence.
> e.g. After Task 1 is completed, you would see Task 4 which looks like it
> should be done /before /Task 2 and Task 3.
> in order" will hide a folder it if it does not contain any uncompleted
> tasks.
>
> OK so yes, using a folder would certainly be one way of getting a number
> of subtasks to appear simultaneously in a project that had "Complete
> subtasks in order" set. The only problem is that the Folder itself is a
> slightly artificial construct (that my have no obvious name for example)
>
>
> However there are problems with the form you suggest i.e.
>
> Project
> > Task 1
> > Task 4
> > > Task 2
> > > Task 3
> > Task 7
> > > Task 5
> > > Task 6
>
> One problem is that Task 4 and Task 7 have become out of sequence.
> e.g. After Task 1 is completed, you would see Task 4 which looks like it
>
> Project
> > Task 4
> > > Task 2
> > > Task 3
>
> Moreover if you do complete task 4 early then if you also tick it off as
> being completed, then Tasks 2 and Task 3 would disappear from view
> prematurely - not good!
>
>
> Reflecting on all of this, I think one of my problems is that:
> A) because I think in shapes, all my instincts are to create a mind map
> by subject area, but then when it comes to /priority/ - i.e. the
> Project
> > Task 4
> > > Task 2
> > > Task 3
>
> Moreover if you do complete task 4 early then if you also tick it off as
> being completed, then Tasks 2 and Task 3 would disappear from view
> prematurely - not good!
>
>
> Reflecting on all of this, I think one of my problems is that:
> A) because I think in shapes, all my instincts are to create a mind map
> sequence in which I need to execute things... that is a totally
> different dimension and not remotely the same thing priority.
>
> Moreover:
>
> B) I also like to sort things by relative priority (i.e. priority
> relative to each other)
>
> However it is dangerous to conflate subject area with priority as they
> are clearly totally different concepts.
>
>
> AH-HA! I have just had a *mini-breakthrough* regarding my need for
> different dimension and not remotely the same thing priority.
>
> Moreover:
>
> B) I also like to sort things by relative priority (i.e. priority
> relative to each other)
>
> However it is dangerous to conflate subject area with priority as they
> are clearly totally different concepts.
>
>
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Dwight Arthur
Dec 15, 2016, 7:34:22 AM12/15/16
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John . Smith
Dec 15, 2016, 8:16:17 AM12/15/16
to MyLifeOrganized
Hi Dwight
Now I'm with you. What you describe about Task4 only appearing after Task2 and Task3 have been completed is true in the 'no hierarchy' view but not in the 'with hierarchy' view, yes?!
Fwiw, currently I seem to use both!
Fwiw my ForcedNext action flag is seems v useful so far :)
Fwiw, it does involve quite complex Advanced filters though. The problem is that unlike Show Actions:Active, just setting ActiveAction=true in advanced filters doesn't seem to pay attention to either a task's Start Date nor hidden-in-to-do status, so this has to be done manually.
So to recap, if I am using "complete subtasks in order" in order to have a Flag for my desired "ForcedNext" functionality whereby I can have additional tasks of my own manual choosing appear I in my customised version of 'active tasks' view, I now have an advanced filter that looks like this:
(not(HideInToDo)) AND
((StartDateTime on or before now) OR (StartDateTime does not exist)) AND
((ActiveAction) OR (Flag=~ForcedNext))
Seems to work so far... :^)
One slight problem is that "complete subtasks in order" only seems to filter for ONE layer of hierarchy. i.e. It filters out children but not grandchildren deriving from those children's children.
i.e. suppose you had a structure of data as follows:
Project A
> Task1
> > Task1.1
> > > Task1.1.1
> > > Task1.1.2
> > > Task1.1.3
> > > Task1.1.4
> > > Task1.1.5
> > Task1.2
> > > Task2.1.1
> > > Task2.1.2
> > > Task2.1.3
> > Task1.3
> Task2
> Task3
> Task4
If you make Project A set to be ["Complete subtasks in order"], then in Active tasks with hierarchy on view, what you would now see would be ALL of the following:
Project
> Task1
> > Task1.1
> > > Task1.1.1
> > > Task1.1.2
> > > Task1.1.3
> > > Task1.1.4
> > > Task1.1.5
> > Task1.2
> > > Task2.1.1
> > > Task2.1.2
> > > Task2.1.3
> > Task1.3
i.e. Only Task2, Task3 and Task4 are actually hidden by using "Complete subtasks in order".
ASIDE: Of course only the following would be visible in Plain List view:
Task1.1.1
Task1.1.2
Task1.1.3
Task1.1.4
Task1.1.5
Task2.1.1
Task2.1.2
Task2.1.3
Task1.3
Whereas my real point here is that if I use the filter "Show Actions:NextActions", the filtering does (for better or worse) go right to the END of the hierarchy and all one would see is this:
Project A
> Task1
> > Task1.1
> > > Task1.1.1
Or in list view (without either prefix or postfix) one would just see:
Task1.1.1
[ASIDE: I find it surprising that one doesn't need to even make 'Project A' become an MLO Project for this to work - it just sort of assumes that the first action in the tree *is* part of a project.]
However if of course you want to have a sub-project elsewhere in the hierarchy, you would just need to set it as a MLO project. e.g. In the structure below, suppose I wanted Task3 to be a sub-project
Project A
> Task1
> > Task1.1
> > > Task1.1.1
> > > Task1.1.2
> > > Task1.1.3
> > > Task1.1.4
> > > Task1.1.5
> > Task1.2
> > > Task2.1.1
> > > Task2.1.2
> > > Task2.1.3
> > Task1.3
> Task2
> Task3
> > Task3.1
> > > Task3.1.1
> > > Task3.1.2
> > > Task3.1.3
> > > Task3.1.4
> > > Task3.1.5
> > Task1.2
> Task4
If Task3 is set as an MLO project what would be visible in Next Actions with hierarchy on would be the following:
Project A
> Task1
> > Task1.1
> > > Task1.1.1
> Task3
> > Task3.1
> > > Task3.1.1
Or in plain list view the Next Actions would simply be:
Task1.1.1
Task3.1.1
So is there any way of making "Complete subtasks in order" apply to SUB-subtasks, as it's a slight pain to have to mark my sub-tasks with their own "Complete subtasks in order" in order to stop unwanted grand-children from appearing!?
This was the reason I abandoned "Complete subtasks in order" originally - for larger, more complex projects you have to keep applying it in multiple places in order to stop grandchildren from flooding the view!
J
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