Project Statuses and Autoformat Rules

[MG]

Hi all,

I start this discussion because found an issue in MLO desktop version regarding Project Statuses and Autoformat Rules.

I created an Autoformat Rule for Inactive Project (Not Startet and Suspended) so that everyone in such categories appears faded in my Project List.

I realized only Suspended Projects got this AutoFormat Rule, even its subtasks, but for Not Started Projects only project itself got it (the substasks did not).

Can anyone try it and tell me if I am missing something?

By the way, since this statuses regard hang up projects, why are they check boxes enabled?

Wouldn't it be better to automate to match check boxes enalble/disabled to project statuses changing?

I mean, If I check or uncheck, even accidentaly, a task box for a Not Started/Suspended project, such project keeps being executed.

In my viewpoint that does not make sense.

BR

M

[MG]

Hi all,

Any ideas?

Can anyone help me, please?

Thanks

MG

[Dwight]

HI, MG. I understand that you are confused by the lack of a more automated connection between project status and the status of tasks within the project. Also, I understand that you do not think it makes sense to work on a task that's part of a project that's suspended or not started. If you have different issues than this then I misunderstood, please clarify.

I cannot do anything about providing you a more automated connection, only the developers can do that.

I can explain why I would work on tasks in a project that's not started or is suspended.

I use MLO to manage projects which I do for clients. Billing is generally an hourly rate plus expenses. The tasks involved in planning, execution, and delivery are billable, I track the hours and bill at the agreed-upon rate per hour. There are also non-billable tasks, like preparing a proposal, pre-sales negotiation, billing and collection. Different people manage projects like this different ways; I open the project when the billable hours commence, and close it when the billable hours are complete. So, when I am working on pre-sales, for example, the project is not yet open but the task is active.

-Dwight

[MG]

Hi Dwight,

Thank you for your reply.

Regarding this thread, I pointed two issues regarding Project Statuses.

First:

I created an Autoformat Rule for Inactive Projects (Not Started or Suspended), so that everyone in such categories (status) would appear faded in my Projects List.

What I realized is that, solely Suspended Projects Tasks appear faded, including the project itself.

Regardig Not Started Projects,don't appear faded.

Second:

Regarding all your explanation about Not Started Projects, I understand and agree in such point of view.

But I disagree all about Suspended Projects, since they are different concept relating to Not Started.

For that, their tasks would not be ticked off, unless we change its status to: Not Started, In Progress, others.

As you can try, If a project is in a Suspended status, its subtasks remain enabled for being ticked off.

In which real life situations does it make sense, different from Not Started status?

BR

M

[Stéph]

Hello MG. Maybe you could give us a screenshot of the autoformat rule conditions and where the rule appears in your autoformat rules list? I don't think it's a bug, because I have been able to set font colours and icons for suspended and completed projects.

Stéphane

[MG]

Hi Stéph,

Thank you for your reply.

See attached screenshots regarding this issue.

BR.

M

[Andrei Bacean]

Hi

First suggestion:
Disable the isproject rule.

Second suggestion:
Place the not started and suspended conditions into a group.

Br
Andrei

[arq.mari...@gmail.com]

Hi Andrei,

Thank you for your help.

It works now.

But, despite this, I am still with the doubt and ask:

Why disabling IsProject rule result in this autoformat to have different display?

And, after disabling IsProject, why NotStarted and Suspended Project statuses result also in different displays? I mean, all NotStarted projects child tasks do not display faded, but all Suspended project child tasks display faded.

I will not believe the algorithm takes this into account (does not understand what Dwight explained, regarding Not Started Projects), since the autoformat rule is the same for NotStarted and Suspended project statuses.

Maybe I am wrong or missing something.

I expect MLO Team and Alyona can clarify all of us, about this issue.

If it is a bug? I think it is.

BR

M.

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[Stéph]

I think I've worked it out! Your rule is:

 

(IsProject) AND (ProjectStatus=NotStarted) OR (ProjectStatus=Suspended)

 

(I'm ignoring the extra brackets which you've got round the whole expression, because they don't sub-group any of the terms in it)

 

The order of evaluation of logic terms is: NOT before AND before OR. So, that expression is evaluated as:

1. (IsProject) AND (ProjectStatus=NotStarted) OR
2. (ProjectStatus=Suspended)

The first term only checks "ProjectStatus=NotStarted" for the projects (IsProject), but not for items which aren't projects (ie all the child tasks) - So your formatting for NotStarted projects only applies to the project itself, not to its children.

The second term will check "ProjectStatus=Suspended" whether the item is a project or a child task - So your formatting for suspended projects is applied to both the project and all it's tasks.

 

So, if you want the faded font to apply to all the child tasks of a NotStarted project, you need to delete or uncheck the term "IsProject".

You could also create it as a new rule with just two terms, no sub-rules:

ProjectStatus =NotStarted OR

ProjectStatus=Suspended

 

Please let us know if that makes sense and if it fixes the problem for you.

 

Stéphane

 

On Friday, 7 June 2019 07:33:59 UTC+1, MG wrote:

Hi Andrei,

 

Thank you for your help.

 

It works now.

 

But, despite this, I am still with the doubt and ask:

 

Why disabling IsProject rule result in this autoformat to have different display?

 

And, after disabling IsProject, why NotStarted and Suspended Project statuses result also in different displays? I mean, all NotStarted projects child tasks do not display faded, but all Suspended project child tasks display faded.

 

I will not believe the algorithm takes this into account (does not understand what Dwight explained, regarding Not Started Projects), since the autoformat rule is the same for NotStarted and Suspended project statuses.

 

Maybe I am wrong or missing something.

 

I expect MLO Team and Alyona can clarify all of us, about this issue.

 

If it is a bug? I think it is.

 

BR

 

M.

 

 

 

No dia 05/06/2019, às 20:04, Andrei Bacean <bacean...@gmail.com> escreveu:

 

 

Hi

 

First suggestion:

Disable the isproject rule.

 

Second suggestion:

Place the not started and suspended conditions into a group.

 

Br

Andrei

 

 

 

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[arq.mari...@gmail.com]

Hi Stéph,

Your explanation is concise.

It is deep and intelligible, though Andrei presented the same solution.

The key point is “The order of evaluation of logic terms is: NOT before AND before OR.” and so forth regarding it.

I got it and even though I did not tried that out (I will), does make sense.

+1 for you and Andrei.

Now I am convinced it is not a bug.

BR

M

No dia 07/06/2019, às 16:08, Stéph <stephane...@gmail.com> escreveu:

I think I've worked it out! Your rule is:

 

(IsProject) AND (ProjectStatus=NotStarted) OR (ProjectStatus=Suspended)

 

(I'm ignoring the extra brackets which you've got round the whole expression, because they don't sub-group any of the terms in it)

 

The order of evaluation of logic terms is: NOT before AND before OR. So, that expression is evaluated as:

1. (IsProject) AND (ProjectStatus=NotStarted) OR
2. (ProjectStatus=Suspended)

The first term only checks "ProjectStatus=NotStarted" for the projects (IsProject), but not for items which aren't projects (ie all the child tasks).

The second term with check "ProjectStatus=Suspended" whether the item is a project or a child task - So your formatting for suspended projects is applied to both the project and all it's tasks.

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[MG]

Hi Dwight,

 

Thank you for your reply.

 

Regarding Project Management procedures, I can understand the NotStarted project status.

 

But, let me disagree with you, at a certain point, about Suspended status.

 

I agree with you when you approach Suspended status like NotStarted in some cases, but I disagree if I see the other side of Suspended status.

 

I mean, there are projects, in life that will be suspended at all and will “never” re-start, which means their child tasks should never be ticked off until we change the status to InProgress or NotStarted.

 

You question “Perhaps I would want to record these tasks within the project?”

 

I would reply: yes, since they are part of the project.

 

If I would not record such tasks within the project, but need them to be solved before it to start, that would lead me to the concept of Tasks Dependencies, before the change of project status to “re-start” (manually).

 

I hope it makes sense and think MLO Team should manage it, so that all tasks would not be enabled for being ticked off when in a Suspended status.

P.S. - I will try to manage these tasks relationship so that MLO Win autoformat reach my needs about project managemet statuses (NotStarted and Suspended) and dependecies, because I thing all ingredients are there.

 

BR

 

M.

On Sunday, June 2, 2019 at 6:50:28 AM UTC+2, Dwight wrote:

[Mário Gourgel]

Hi all,

 

I realized and it works as expected.

 

Dependencies is the solution for displaying/not displaying tasks on filtering “Next Actions by Projects”.

 

This, in my opinion, is the solution for managing NotStarted projects, since that projects will remain halted until one decide to start it (or them).

 

As is mentioned in my last post, MLO has all ingredients for this approach.

 

In the filter “Next Actions by Projects”, if a task pertains to a project and cannot start (we decide it)  before another it is dependent upon, it will not be displayed in this view - even the project main task (parent).

 

If, additionally, we filter such tasks grouping them by project, all dependent tasks (or projects) on another task to start (or restart) will not be displayed until that one is completed (ticked off).

 

This is great for two reasons:

 

First we can manage NotStarted projects in relation to dependent tasks, to start a project, and this way we avoid NotStarted projects tasks to be ticked off, even accidentally, since it will not display in the filter.

Second we focus solely on tasks we want.

 

But, this will not happen if there will not have non-dependent tasks in the process: the NotStarted projects tasks (or project itself) will display and ticked off accidentally (undesirable) if one do not want.

 

This raises the same issues for Suspended and Completed project statuses (for me, all suspended and completed project statuses tasks should be disabled until one change to NotStarted, InProgress statuses), unless we reserve some tasks to be completed after project ending.

Because if there are no tasks to be performed after a project has been finished, any project completed task will remain uncompleted (does it make sense, beyond above explanation?). I mean, any project task with project status changed to completed remain 0%.

 

So, I let this into consideration to MLO Team to solve this issues.

 

BR.

 

M.

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