Emulate the good side of Jamulus with Jacktrip and folks ?

[Laurent S.]

Hello,

I'm new to JackTrip and found it very useful in my self testing.

It is a low CPU software which works very fine with my fiber connection and JitteBuffer to -q 8.

My the two user groups are using Jamulus to jam online.

But the main disadvantage of Jamulus is that it handles signal lossely and does not allow to send a multitrack to a sound ingeneer to live mix.

i've found how to do the multitrack mix with the help of QJackTrip which has a nice feature that allow to get the command line once the options have been set !

But i can't figure out an easy way to be able to see input level meters of all participants and to mix each musician headphone output (by the sound ingeneer or the musician) without sending a multitrack to each participant.

Any advice on how to do that ?

BR,
Laurent

[Laurent S.]

Hello,

I think I would need a client/server mixer sur as non-mixer but
multiplatform ... May be ardour can do that ?

Any suggestions ?

Kind Regards,
Laurent

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[Michael Dessen]

Hi Laurent,

If I understand your question then yes, you’d probably need to route to/from a DAW. There are apps that integrate mixing within Jack itself, but they can be tricky to set up and use. Here’s a solution for that (and other related functions) in Max that I made to work on a macOS server, and might work on a Windows server too, if you could find the right virtual audio device (but I haven’t tested that):
https://github.com/michaeldessen/Jacktrip-Max-Mixer

Ardour might be the easiest thing, esp. if you’re on Linux, though I’m not sure how you’d control submixes remotely (i.e. to let each player control their own monitor mix, which is the purpose of that Max app). I’ve also been told by someone here (Marcin) that Reaper is good for this, using its web client interface, so remote players can control their own mixes as in the Max app above.

In short, there are lots of possible solutions but none built into JackTrip itself quite yet. Good luck,

Michael

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[Laurent S.]

Hello,

Thanks for sharing your solutions.

Indeed I am on Linux but in my groups, we have Mac and Windows users too ... I forgot to mention that the jacktrip server is on ubuntu.

The use of REAPER or Ardour would mean extra significant CPU/MEM usage that i would like to avoid ... Especially on my old pc server !

What I'm looking for, is a very fast solution like Non-mixer (which can be found on KXStudio repo in deb format) to use with JACK and allowing distant control. I've tried to use X11 forwarding with Non-mixer. It adds 5% CPU usage to my old celeron CPU so i think i cannot set one for each user in the group we are 11 and jacktrip takes already 40% ! But anyway 5% CPU for the input level meters and for being able to adapt the mix to our ear is a lot ! (IMO). With a client/serveur architecture, the GUI would be handled by the clients and not by the server so that would reduce drastically the CPU usage ...

Anyway, if some are interested, X11 forwarding will allow you to use the mixer on remote Linux or with the help of an extra software on Mac (?) and Windows (XMing).

I would be interested in JMess too but it does not target Windows platform ... (I wonder why ?)

Kind Regards,

Laurent

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[Laurent S.]

Hello,

Finally, i decided to use both software : Jamulus and Jacktrip with Jack.

Jamulus for musicians, JackTrip for broadcasting each musician inputs to a Reaper Machine on the internet and then cast to icecast2 on the cloud using butt ... All softwares are multiplateform

This work good in my self test on local area. I'm going to test it over internet.

Kind Regards,

Laurent

[Seablade -]

FYI Ardour likely won't be to much additional CPU usage over anything like Non, etc.  By default Ardour is pretty light on resources.  Also for your purpose it might be worth looking at OSC and touchosc to see if you could control the monitor mixes out of Ardour as well.

If you truly want a 'mixer' interface, then looking at Mixbus which has DSP on top of Ardour and some simplified routing for Stereo destinations, could make sense, but since you are running DSP at that point CPU usage might be more of an issue, but it is likely the DSP you are already looking to add for most mix sessions (EQ and Dynamics for the most part, though there is saturation on the busses).

    Seablade

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[Laurent S.]

Thanks Seablade for your help.

I've already think of using OSC but I changed my mind. I want a simple solution to setup. A solution that lets me and my group play music over internet and broadcast on icecast2.

In a precedent message, I share with you the solution I decided to test.

My aim is to be able to listen the concert with a good quality on phones (especially if WIFI is activated).

[Hilpoltsteiner Michael]

For a simple solution, maybe Jamulus server using the singlemixserver branch is interesting for you. In that special branch, only the first client, which connects to the server, gets the mixing capabilities, the following ones don't see any mixer. So the first client is used by the sound engineer who adjusts the levels for all connected musicians. There is also a second branch "mastermix" which offers some more features, but with the same principle - one person controls the sound for all others.

I use the singlemixserver to mix my chorus rehearsals with 30 - 40 participants - works great. All singers have a JackTrip device/image, connect to an unmanaged server where the singlemixserver instance is running. I have - besides the VS-Client - a Jamulus instance running on a Mac which I use as a Mix-Client.

Michael

[Laurent S.]

Thanks Michael,

The solutions you describe seems very well but limited in the fact that no external audio effect can be used to alter sound and create a real mix from the musicians sound like on a real scene with a sound ingeneer.