Re: Was, Re: The theology of number, (Now) The Universe Learns (not released on April 1st)

[spudb...@aol.com]

Politically, we have had violent riots and arson since may 2020, which cost more lives then were lost at the Capital riot. Billions of dollars damaged, and charges dropped against those who were criminals. For Jan 6, looks like all groups who participated were infiltrated beforehand. In any case that was identical to the nazi tactic via the Reichstag Fire. Same principle, same attempt to ignore what went on in the streets during 2020/1933.

On the Boltzmann Brain, it was proposed by Albrecht and Sorbo, back in 2004, and Leonard Susskind in 2008. Fascinating if true, and things still go on if it's not? Believing in God is not what I am offering, just a consideration using physics. Not anyone's favorite? Fine, life rolls on and bills need to get paid.

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On Sunday, June 20, 2021 Lawrence Crowell <everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

What you offer as a way the universe got started, through Boltzmann brain, is one reason some people see BBs as pernicious. If the whole of existence is some mental projection within a BB then all of physics implodes. The instability of de Sitter spacetime makes BBs improbable however,

LC

On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 5:38:26 PM UTC-5 spudb...@aol.com wrote:

I've offered up the notion that the universe got started by a perhaps a boltzmann brain (singular) and is run by the BB. Bruno thinks this proposal is sub-ridiculous, ask him! Me? I still see it as plausible and charming. I have no proposal for testing this possibility. Leave that for the cosmologists.

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On Friday, June 18, 2021 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List <everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

On 6/18/2021 2:38 AM, John Clark wrote:

On Thu, Jun 17, 2021 at 7:23 PM <spudb...@aol.com> wrote:

>Socialists who do mass murder are no better than religious people who do mass murder. Can we agree on this premise? 

Yes. And can we agree on the premise that Black Lives Matter protesters who broke into a Burger King  ARE BETTER than Trump's thugs who broke into the Capitol Building and even the Senate Chamber itself in order to prevent the democratic election of the next President of the United States as demanded by the US Constitution? Saying otherwise would be like saying a firefly is the same as a supernova because they both produce light. 

> We have our own religions and sometimes without a god

You're trying to leech all meaning out of a word. People like to say nonsense like the above because they like the way the English word "religion" sounds and don't care what it means; it's the same reason they redefined the word "God" in such a vague way that everybody would have to say they believe in God. I believe I can't lift my car off the ground because gravity is too strong, so I believe in a higher power, so I must believe in "God". I believe that grey amorphous blobs exist, so I must believe in "God".  

“People are more unwilling to give up the word ‘God’ than to give up the idea for which the word has hitherto stood”
    --- Bertrand Russell

Brent

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[John Clark]

On Sun, Jun 20, 2021 at 4:50 PM spudboy100 via Everything List <everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> For Jan 6, looks like all groups who participated were infiltrated beforehand. In any case that was identical to the nazi tactic via the Reichstag Fire. 

And you just keep getting sillier and sillier.  But Spud my boy let's put the lunacy on hold for a second and get serious because I want to ask you 2 important questions. Considering the fact that millions of people were enraged because police seemed to feel they had the right to murder black people at will, do you honestly think if the democratic mayors that you hate so much had done as you advised and ordered the police to attack the Black Lives Matter protesters with fire hoses and attack dogs as Bull Connor did with the civil rights protesters of the 1950s and 60s would weed today have a more peaceful nation and would the entire police brutality issue just have vanished? I don't.  And on January 6 considering the fact that the capital police were only about two minutes ahead of Trump's mob, if the police defending the building had acted one bit LESS aggressively do you think Mike Pence or Nancy Pelosi would be alive today. I don't.

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

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[spudb...@aol.com]

Yeah John, I do know that there are unlawful killings by police. This cuts across the color bar, I believe, because we are a nation of laws, as the attorneys who rule us all constantly quote John Adams. The laws are created in all 50 states and territories by lawyers. Thus, the nation of laws, are in truth a nation of lawyers, at least the ruling class is. Do I believe that many shootings are unjustifiable? Yes. How is it that law enforcement gets acquitted if the prosecutor decides to go to trial? One is that the laws are written by lawyers, who allow law enforcement defense attorneys to follow the letter of the law and say it was justifiable homicide. 

In democrat ruled zones this is always prevalent. It is always prevalent because the police unions, like all unions fund the democratic party. The democratic party lawyers write the laws this way, in exchange for campaign donations. For Black folks rioting, stealing, and committing arson, they may say they are doing this to "protest," but I say they instead wish to show Black Power (like with Huey Newton, remember) and have fun, and get free stuff from the looted place. When Black criminals attack Asians and Jews, the democrats are silent or very weak. Do you really think this goes unnoticed? 

In summary police brutality (an older but more honest term) doesn't excuse mugings, attack, arson and theft. But they would say 'white privilege' which is fine. 

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[John Clark]

On Sun, Jun 20, 2021 at 9:42 PM <spudb...@aol.com> wrote:

> For Black folks rioting, stealing, and committing arson, they may say they are doing this to "protest," but I say they instead wish to show Black Power (like with Huey Newton, remember) and have fun, and get free stuff from the looted place.

 

That of course is yet another of your lunatic crackpot conspiracy theories, this time with a dash of racism mixed in, but for the sake of argument let's assume for a moment that it's true. So the hell what? Are Black people breaking windows a good enough excuse for Donald J Trump to violate his oath of office and attempt a coup d'état on January 6, 2021 to nullify the results of the 2020 presidential election and stay in power despite that being a flagrant violation of the Constitution, when Abraham Lincoln didn't even thing the Civil War was a good enough excuse to cancel the 1860 presidential election? I agree with Lincoln, I don't think so either.

And you never even attempted to answer the 2 questions I asked you in my last post so I repeat them here:

1)  Considering the fact that millions of people were enraged because police seemed to feel they had the right to murder Black people at will, do you honestly think if the Democratic mayors that you hate so much had done as you advised and ordered the police to attack the Black Lives Matter protesters with bludgeons, fire hoses and attack dogs as Bull Connor did with the civil rights protesters of the 1950s and 60s would we today have a more peaceful nation and would the entire police brutality issue have just calmed down and vanished?

2)  On January 6, considering the fact that the capital police were only about two minutes ahead of Trump's thugs, if the police defending the building had acted one bit LESS aggressively or skillfully do you think Mike Pence or Nancy Pelosi would be alive today?

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

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mva2John K

[John Clark]

I wrote: 

>when Abraham Lincoln didn't even thing the Civil War was a good enough excuse to cancel the 1860 presidential election?

Correction: I should've said the 1864 presidential election.  

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

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aohn K

[Lawrence Crowell]

On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 6:15:23 AM UTC-5 johnk...@gmail.com wrote:

On Sun, Jun 20, 2021 at 9:42 PM <spudb...@aol.com> wrote:

> For Black folks rioting, stealing, and committing arson, they may say they are doing this to "protest," but I say they instead wish to show Black Power (like with Huey Newton, remember) and have fun, and get free stuff from the looted place.

 

That of course is yet another of your lunatic crackpot conspiracy theories, this time with a dash of racism mixed in, but for the sake of argument let's assume for a moment that it's true. So the hell what? Are Black people breaking windows a good enough excuse for Donald J Trump to violate his oath of office and attempt a coup d'état on January 6, 2021 to nullify the results of the 2020 presidential election and stay in power despite that being a flagrant violation of the Constitution, when Abraham Lincoln didn't even thing the Civil War was a good enough excuse to cancel the 1860 presidential election? I agree with Lincoln, I don't think so either.

Spuds is officially in my looney toon file.. He is just like the right winged maniacs all upset over critical race theory, Much of this just diversionary nonsense to keep people's attention away from GOP misfeasance of government and treasonous activity. It is unfortunate that potatohead is reflective of about 1/4 to 1/3 or so of Americans. USA is becoming a nation of neurotic idiots.

LC

[spudb...@aol.com]

My take, is that of Orange guy really wanted things to go to hell and manipulate things to work in his favor, he would've sent 5 million to DC, rather than 500, savvy? My feeling is he could have if that was his ambition. Your excusing black racist and white communist street thugs is appalling, since rather than attacking the centers of power, they simply went on a riot arson plan, in democrat run cities, where their jail stays were eliminated due to the rulers of said dem zones, governors, prosecutors, judges, state legislators. 

Point: If police could "murder black people at will," there'd be 500K deaths over a couple of years.

Point: No, "he dem pols that I hate so much" condoned, encouraged, and accepted the rioting and violence as a useful political tool. This, then, was the true Insurrection. As Stalin said in 1930, "always accuse the enemy of what you are doing."

You really want to change the mortality rates with the police?

1) Change the laws about the rules of engagement. Your dem politicians won't do this, as stated before.

2) Advise people to be very cautious in resisting arrest because it can be ruled as justifiable homicide. 

I don't see dem politicians or Black democrat attorneys going out and doing this, so why?

My belief is for these celebs, "One rule for me, and one rule for thee." We can see this behavior consistently with dem pols like Lori Lightfoot in Chicago, the mayors in Portland and  St Louis and indicated in this WaPo article.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/09/03/mayors-portland-st-louis-protests/

One either wants to solve troubles, or one wants to use troubles as an excuse control others?

Virtue signaling and self righteousness is but one reason I booked, years ago, from Team, Dem. 

-----Original Message-----
From: John Clark <johnk...@gmail.com>
To: spudb...@aol.com
Cc: everyth...@googlegroups.com <everyth...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Mon, Jun 21, 2021 7:14 am
Subject: Re: Was, Re: The theology of number, (Now) The Universe Learns (not released on April 1st)

[spudb...@aol.com]

Well, Lawrence, I identify you and just another academic tyrant who seeks to branch out beyond the supreme soviet of the university, and rule others outside of it. . The most dedicated of the academics are usually to be found in the Humanities of universities, but yes, you'll do. No free speech, no discussion, rule by administration, so forth. One would expect more from a researcher than ideological worship but I know this has never been true.  Specifically, Phillip Lenard, and Troyfim Lysenko

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-2-pro-nazi-nobelists-attacked-einstein-s-jewish-science-excerpt1/

https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/12/trofim-lysenko-soviet-union-russia/548786/

Oh yes, and it now appears that bad Orange Man may have been correct on the mobility origin of the Wuhan Flu? Shocking if true!! Fauci told one of his academic fellows in China, that, "We're all in this together," Now this was an example of hope over experience.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-57268111

If being treasonous to the party is a bad thing, excellent! The party is not the government, your ideology is not the government, your views are not in the Constitution. If you want to accuse the Reps of ,malfeasance and treason, then list specific instances and indicate how you arrived at this conclusion, via citations?. If you're uninterested in this, excellent, again! Meaning ideology over reason again- the essence or progressivism. That is a dem thing nowadays of course. It's another reason I bolted the Party.

Via Con Dios

-----Original Message-----
From: Lawrence Crowell <goldenfield...@gmail.com>
To: Everything List <everyth...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Mon, Jun 21, 2021 11:26 am
Subject: Re: Was, Re: The theology of number, (Now) The Universe Learns (not released on April 1st)

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[John Clark]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 2:46 PM <spudb...@aol.com> wrote:

>Your excusing black racist and white communist street thugs is appalling,

Well Spud the list of questions I have asked that you will not or cannot answer keeps growing, it has now increased from 2 to 5.  

1) When the hell did I excuse "black racist and white communist street thugs"?

2) Is the difference between a present day white communist street thug and a present day white Viking street thug the same as the difference between a dragon and a unicorn?

 

3) Are Black people breaking windows a good enough excuse for Donald J Trump to violate his oath of office and attempt a coup d'état on January 6, 2021 to nullify the results of the 2020 presidential election and stay in power despite that being a flagrant violation of the Constitution, when Abraham Lincoln didn't even thing the Civil War was a good enough excuse to cancel the 1864 presidential election?

4)  Considering the fact that millions of people were enraged because police seemed to feel they had the right to murder Black people at will, do you honestly think if the Democratic mayors that you hate so much had done as you advised and ordered the police to attack the Black Lives Matter protesters with bludgeons, fire hoses and attack dogs as Bull Connor did with the civil rights protesters of the 1950s and 60s would we today have a more peaceful nation and would the entire police brutality issue have just calmed down and vanished?

5)  On January 6, considering the fact that the capital police were only about two minutes ahead of Trump's thugs, if the police defending the building had acted one bit LESS aggressively or skillfully do you think Mike Pence or Nancy Pelosi would be alive today?

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis8x

t5v

sss

mva2John K

[spudb...@aol.com]

With respect, I do know what I am talking about. You simply disagree for ideological reasons, with what I have stated. Fine, but this is not using reason, nor, is it applying cause and effect, nor, observation, nor measuring in units. It is simply how one feels. You use, what is often the easiest tactic humans possess, dismissal. I use it myself at least as a first pass over information presented especially if it is unwelcome data. 

That academics over the decades have sold-out is beyond dispute. Heisenberg's regard for Einstein did not prevent him from heading Adolf's atomic bomb program, for example. On regard that totalitarianism has permeated universities is a weekly occurrence, but in this 2014 paper, it even shows how it has penetrated the universities, entirely. 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/300897022_Education_and_the_'New_Totalitarianism'_How_Standards_for_Reporting_on_Empirical_Studies_of_Education_Limit_the_Scope_of_Academic_Research_and_Communication

So, as I have stated before, we agree on nothing, thus, no room for any sensible compromise. Team, progressive believes it is winning and it may be, but I suspect not. My additional fear or suspicion is that the economic and political damage the elites are doing now (akin to the behavior of the elites in 1913) will cause big problems. With ideology being such a feature with Team, dem, I suspect that the only answer will be a split. 

For example, I'd rather try to live in DeSantis's Florida, or even Abbott's Texas, then dwell within Newsome's California or Cuomo's NY state. Real world examples. Despite your brilliance, it could be stated that academics have lost our trust, likely one of the results of Covid? When the economy gets kicked to the curb, expect a sea change with a plurality of the US public. Not everyone of course. 

-----Original Message-----
From: Lawrence Crowell <goldenfield...@gmail.com>
To: spudb...@aol.com
Sent: Mon, Jun 21, 2021 3:29 pm
Subject: Re: Was, Re: The theology of number, (Now) The Universe Learns (not released on April 1st)

You simply do not know what you are writing about.

LC

[spudb...@aol.com]

Now you are kind of asking an alternate history question? If you wish me to defend the Confederacy, which as I recall, started censoring mail from outside the slave states, (11 years before the Confederacy was declared!!), I would say hell no. Should Lincoln has said, screw this and attacked first? I'd have to be a historian or read what one said regarding this? 

What I think you are really asking is should Trump have called of the election? Again, hell no. My thought is that if he wanted to be a schmuck and not do anything regarding possible election fraud, waiting until AFTER the election was idiotic. He obviously didn't send teams of Rep lawyers to the states as the democrats did in 2020. That is all on Orange Man. Did he get cheated on by the oligarchs, the dem state officials, and the like? I have no way of knowing?? We don't have any great evidence of this, so, I peg his loss the public reaction to Covid, but that is just a guess. 

If he did want an Overthrow as you passionately state, then sending 2-5 million people into DC would have better assured this rather than 500< schmucks. They did it themselves on Facebook. They were infiltrated super easy by the authorities. You are really bending the paperclip way out of shape if you accuse Trump of being part of a cabal and then screwing up his "Permanent Presidency." One of his character flaws is that he craved the approval of his elitist fellows in DC, Wall Street, Entertainment.

https://www.emmys.com/video/donald-trump-megan-mullally-green-acres-emmys-2006

 Not me, I am just a pitiful serf arguing science and politics with a small group of progressives, who despise any disagreement.

-----Original Message-----
From: John Clark <johnk...@gmail.com>
To: spudb...@aol.com
Cc: everyth...@googlegroups.com <everyth...@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Mon, Jun 21, 2021 7:38 am
Subject: Re: Was, Re: The theology of number, (Now) The Universe Learns (not released on April 1st)

[John Clark]

On Mon, Jun 21, 2021 at 4:18 PM <spudb...@aol.com> wrote:

> If he did want an Overthrow as you passionately state, then sending 2-5 million people into DC would have better assured this rather than 500< schmucks.

About an hour before Trump's thugs broke into the capital Trump gave an inflammatory speech to about 30,000 schmucks not 500, and postulating what would've been a smart thing for Trump to do is irrelevant because Trump is not smart.  

> You are really bending the paperclip way out of shape if you accuse Trump of being part of a cabal and then screwing up his "Permanent Presidency."

On December 19 Trump tweeted that it  was “statistically impossible” for him to have lost the presidential election and told his zombie hordes that they would be a “big protest in DC on 6 January" and ordered them to “Be there, it will be wild!”

On January 1  Republican Congressman  Louie Gohmert said "You have no remedy’. You have to go to the streets and be as violent as Antifa.”

On January 6 in a warm-up act Trumps lawyer Rudy Giuliani told a crowd of 30,000 "let’s have trial by combat.

We will not take it any more” .

In the main event on January 6 Trump told the crowd "we won this election, and we won it by a landslide". You don't concede when there's theft involved. Our country has had enough. We will not take it anymore. You will have an illegitimate president. That is what you will have, and we can't let that happen.If you don't fight like hell you're not going to have a country anymore. You’ll never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength, and you have to be strong … I know everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building. We're going to walk down to the Capitol and we're going to cheer on our brave senators and congressmen and women, and we're probably not going to be cheering so much for some of them.

Trump was lying of course, he was too cowardly to march with them, Trump went back to hide in the safety of the White House

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

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[Lawrence Crowell]

On Monday, June 21, 2021 at 3:18:32 PM UTC-5 spudb...@aol.com wrote:

Now you are kind of asking an alternate history question? If you wish me to defend the Confederacy, which as I recall, started censoring mail from outside the slave states, (11 years before the Confederacy was declared!!), I would say hell no. Should Lincoln has said, screw this and attacked first? I'd have to be a historian or read what one said regarding this? 

Again, you never know what you write about. The Confederates fired the first shots at Ft Sumter. 

LC

[spudb...@aol.com]

You misunderstand or I was not clear. I was postulating about what alternative (as in an imaginary turn of events) indicated by John Clark writing about what actions are justified versus unjustified? John seems to lean to the notion that BLM-Antifa violence, aggression, arson; was superior or understandable, compared to the January 6th riot at the Capitol, that John believes was instigated by Trump. I hold that both rioters are unjustified, and ineffectual, in any case. 

Yes, the South attacked first, yes the South provoked the North as well, yes the Slave states believed in unbridled "free market," which enriched the plantation owners, at the expense of the lives of the slaves, for growing cotton and tobacco for sale into Europe, principally Britain & France. The UK outlawed slave trade in the Atlantic and stopped slave ships since 1837 (British Navy). Yet, they still purchased tobacco and cotton from the South, and I believe Lincoln's cabinet was concerned that either the UK or France would militarily side with the Confederacy, for money, for land, for tobacco and cotton. 

If you really want to disengage from politics and history, as we agree on nothing, and we are not alone in this, nationally, why not change the focus and get back to physics which is your specialty? I can continue to fight on, but you don't care for what I say, truth or not,  that's fine. Here,. from Quanta, claiming that mathematics ultimately is the best tool currently for understanding how the universe works, It' almost Bruno-esque in it's analysis. The claim is that yes, Dr. Sagan, you can't fool me. It's Fields all the way down. 

https://www.quantamagazine.org/the-mystery-at-the-heart-of-physics-that-only-math-can-solve-20210610/

-----Original Message-----

From: Lawrence Crowell <goldenfield...@gmail.com>
To: Everything List <everyth...@googlegroups.com>

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[John Clark]

On Tue, Jun 22, 2021 at 1:04 PM spudboy100 via Everything List <everyth...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> John seems to lean to the notion that BLM-Antifa violence, aggression, arson; was superior or understandable, compared to the January 6th riot at the Capitol,

Actually John thinks that NOTHING in American history is comparable to the events of January 6, except for when the capital was occupied by invading British troops in 1814.  And to repeat what I asked before, WHAT THE HELL DOES THE BLM MATTER HAVE TO DO WITH TRUMP'S ATTEMPTED OVERTHROW OF THE  GOVERNMENT AND THE US CONSTITUTION ON JANUARY 6, 2021?! 

John K Clark    See what's on my new list at  Extropolis

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