ANN: Django website redesign launched

[Jannis Leidel]

Hi everyone,

We're incredibly proud to share with you the new design of the Django website, the documentation and the issue tracker.

This is a long time coming and we couldn't be happier to finally ship it :)

As you can imagine, there will be bugs, so please bear with us and report issues to the issue tracker at https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/issues

More infos about the redesign and its history can be found in the blog post:

https://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2014/dec/15/announcing-django-website-redesign/

Happy coding, everyone!

Jannis

[Bobby Mozumder]

Looks great. Thanks.

Will this same look apply to the admin backend?

-bobby

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[Святослав Бульбаха]

Looks great! Just surfing around website and it's changed. Cool! :D

среда, 17 декабря 2014 г., 0:09:55 UTC+8 пользователь Jannis Leidel написал:

[ramesh naidu]

Thats a Fantastic feel

Ramesh

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[Travis Swicegood]

It looks great.  Awesome work, everyone involved!

Jannis/Russ -- y'all mentioned a style guide in the blog post, but I don't see one in the docs.  Is that available somewhere?

-T

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[Carlos Aguilar]

Awesome work

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[Patrick Guido]

Really nice! Great job!

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[Jannis Leidel]

> On 16 Dec 2014, at 17:45, Travis Swicegood <tra...@domain51.com> wrote:
>
> It looks great. Awesome work, everyone involved!
>
> Jannis/Russ -- y'all mentioned a style guide in the blog post, but I don't see one in the docs. Is that available somewhere?

Yeah, it's semi-public right now since we don't have a good section yet to put it in, but you can check out here: https://www.djangoproject.com/styleguide/

Jannis

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[Jannis Leidel]

> On 16 Dec 2014, at 17:17, Bobby Mozumder <bmoz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Looks great. Thanks.
>
> Will this same look apply to the admin backend?

Very unlikely, this was about redesigning the public Django websites.

Jannis

> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/django-developers/C76CB2DE-D6D2-4154-8B78-F096B392FEF9%40gmail.com.

[Torsten Bronger]

Hallöchen!

Jannis Leidel writes:

> We're incredibly proud to share with you the new design of the
> Django website, the documentation and the issue tracker.

It's certainly beautiful but may I suggest to add contrast a bit?
For my laptop monitor / my eyes, e.g. "Note" boxes or source code
snippets have almost the same bright background as the rest.

Tschö
Torsten.

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[Jannis Leidel]

> On 16 Dec 2014, at 20:00, Torsten Bronger <bro...@physik.rwth-aachen.de> wrote:
>
> Hallöchen!
>
> Jannis Leidel writes:
>
>> We're incredibly proud to share with you the new design of the
>> Django website, the documentation and the issue tracker.
>
> It's certainly beautiful but may I suggest to add contrast a bit?
> For my laptop monitor / my eyes, e.g. "Note" boxes or source code
> snippets have almost the same bright background as the rest.

Yeah, we're investigating that right now in various other places. Could you for the sake of completeness open a ticket (https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/issues) describing which areas in particular you've found problematic?

Thanks,
Jannis

> Tschö
> Torsten.
>
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>

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[Schmitt, Christian]

Somehow I hate it. The website is the worst website I've seen since a long time.

The contrast is really aweful.

The issue Tracker got unusable due to the colors that aren't focused on readability.

Overall it looks like a mess, just to have a new design.

Doesn't look like a designer or a graphic guy had his hands on that.

I can't realized why some should replace a good and usable design which had some practical usage and also a good readability with the "thing" we have now.

Sorry but I will stick to the old docs as for now or use the PDF ones with my custom style (since your colors are aweful, too).

Django should focus on a clear design which is helpful for readability and not this stupid mess.

2014-12-16 22:48 GMT+01:00 Brad Rice <brad...@gmail.com>:

I noticed today when I went in to look something up. I like it.

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[Alex Gaynor]

Hi Christian,

While I'm sure you didn't mean it this way, your email frankly makes you sound like an jerk, and that tone is not appropriate for this list.

You've not substantiated any of your claims, other than that it your personal preference.

If you'd like to make specific, *actionable* suggests or feedback, that's fine, but just shitting on other people's hard work is not.

Alex

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[Joe Tennies]

So, I agree sorta with what I think Christian was stating.I don't particularly care for the color scheme. I'm making a slightly modified markup in GIMP. I'm just wondering if there's a reason the original color scheme was abandoned? I only ask because I actually really liked it. Was there a driving reason as it was honestly the identity of Django in my mind. In particular, I find it interesting that's there's an official Django color that is usually the background to the logo (#092E20 - as defined on https://www.djangoproject.com/community/logos/), yet that's not the background to the logo on the main site.

That stated, I like the general content and layout now.

Quick mockup color change: http://imgur.com/DsrKIpw and http://imgur.com/puW01nn

It's basically pulling back the old colors. (My guess is that documentation now looks like it used to, but I can't verify.)

Obviously, if there was a good reason for the color change, then my changes are pointless. I just think it's losing the identity.

- Joe

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[Daniele Procida]

On Tue, Dec 16, 2014, Schmitt, Christian <c.sc...@briefdomain.de> wrote:

>Somehow I hate it. The website is the worst website I've seen since a long
>time.
>The contrast is really aweful.
>The issue Tracker got unusable due to the colors that aren't focused on
>readability.
>
>Overall it looks like a mess, just to have a new design.
>
>Doesn't look like a designer or a graphic guy had his hands on that.
>I can't realized why some should replace a good and usable design which had
>some practical usage and also a good readability with the "thing" we have
>now.
>
>Sorry but I will stick to the old docs as for now or use the PDF ones with
>my custom style (since your colors are aweful, too).
>
>Django should focus on a clear design which is helpful for readability and
>not this stupid mess.

As the message you replied to indicated, various people worked very hard on this.

Your comments are unkind and hurtful, and also completely useless, since they don't identify a single specific problem or improvement.

Here's the code <https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/>; you're welcome to help improve it if you can.

In the meantime I have removed you from our email lists, since your tone is not welcome here. Please don't come back unless you can communicate in a more acceptable way.

Daniele

[Jorge C. Leitão]

Dear Django community,

I would like to congratulate you very much for this. I'm very pleased to see that the work in Django is much better presented to the world, which I think we all agree is an important component of the project.

Generally speaking, I like very much the overall look and feel of the website. I imagine it is very hard to agree on them, specially since it is a component that has some intrinsic subjectivity.

I have a question regarding the layout:

In the previous website there was a noticeable difference between the website UI and the UI of the issue tracker. Are we aiming to keep that difference or do we aim to make them indistinguishable?

This is because it seems that some elements of the tracker were changed to blend with the new look, but others don't. Specifically:

- In the main content of the issue tracker the horizontal lines have a shadow in the bottom; The other sections don't.

- In the issue tracker, some content is boxed (e.g. wiki), while other doesn't (new ticket), and the boxes are corner-rounded (while the website has rounded elements besides buttons).

- In the wiki of the issue tracker, the font seems to be "blurred"(?), compare with sidebar.

I would prefer the same look of the issue tracker for consistency, but since that section of the website is aimed to developers of Django, there can be a rational to make it different. Could we clarify this so we know what is a bug to report and what is an intended feature?

In any case, the quality of Django website conveys now much better the quality of the Django project. Thank you for that.

Cheers,

Jorge

[Torsten Bronger]

Hallöchen!

Daniele Procida writes:

> [...]

>
> In the meantime I have removed you from our email lists, since
> your tone is not welcome here. Please don't come back unless you
> can communicate in a more acceptable way.

Is this customary procedure on this mailing list in such cases?
Normally one simply ignores postings/authors one doesn't like. I
hope that banned users don't have the answers to my questions. ;-)
Besides, a sock puppet is made in minutes ...

Tschö,

[Baptiste Mispelon]

Hi Jorge,

First off, thank you for your feedback, it's very much appreciated.

Regarding your question about Trac, the differences in UI that you list are definitely not intended.

Ola Sitarska and me did some work to try and adapt the new design to Trac but it's proven to be difficult.

Could you please file some issues at https://github.com/django/code.djangoproject.com/issues (this is the repository of our Trac instance)?

If you'd like to try your hand at fixing those issues, I'd be happy to get you started on installing Trac locally. You can get in touch with my by email or on IRC (#django-websites on Freenode).


Have a nice day,
Baptiste

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[Baptiste Mispelon]

Hi Torsten,

As far as I know, it's not often that people get kicked out of this
mailing list (note that Christian was kicked out, not banned, so he can
join back if he'd like) so I'm not sure what's "customary".

However, we strive to create a friendly and inclusive community here, so
toxic and insulting behavior is not simply ignored.

In this instance, I think Daniele's response was appropriate and I stand
by it too.

I hope that answers your question.

Cheers,
Baptiste

PS: The mailing list is publicly viewable at
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/django-developers. It's only for
posting here that you need to be registered.

[Tino de Bruijn]

Hi,

First of all, thanks for all the effort! It was due for a little overhaul.

Not sure if I am still allowed to voice my opinion, but here it is: I don't like it that much. Or at least, I prefer the old layout a lot more, especially for the docs. I'll try to explain why:

- It's all green, a bit of contrast would be nice. The yellow worked well for this, the red doesn't.

- It's spaced out too much, therefore requires a lot more scrolling and provides less oversight (see below)

- It's main font is a serif font, which is not optimal for on screen reading (If you want to use serif, switch headings and body)

- The font does not look crisp (can be because it's serif, or something with my comp, dunno)

- It's so default! Django had a nice and special colourscheme and look. Now it's a bit of a one-in-a-million design...

The main problem is the (line-)spacing though. Compare (made on a 13' screen):

The old layout gives a lot more overview (while the content is smaller!), especially in the TOC, which is a good thing when you are browsing the documentation.

I messed around with the margins and line-heights and got this, which I think is a bit better. Denser, and still well readable:

Does anybody agree on that and should I create a pull request?

Hope I didn't step on anybody's toes by the way :)

Tino

ps. Styling the ul in the TOC is a bit hard in Chrome inspector, because there is no parent with a class, only with a "role", and somehow the inspector doesn't honour child selectors with attributes (ie. [role="complementary] li)

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[Daniele Procida]

On Wed, Dec 17, 2014, Torsten Bronger <bro...@physik.rwth-aachen.de> wrote:

>> In the meantime I have removed you from our email lists, since
>> your tone is not welcome here. Please don't come back unless you
>> can communicate in a more acceptable way.
>
>Is this customary procedure on this mailing list in such cases?

People are very rarely as discourteous as that, so it doesn't happen often.

We have a code of conduct for the community <https://www.djangoproject.com/conduct/>.

>Normally one simply ignores postings/authors one doesn't like.

It wasn't something I simply didn't "like". It was unkind and disparaging remarks (not to mention aimed at people who had put in a lot of collaborative effort on behalf of the community, and at their work).

It's not acceptable here and won't be tolerated, whoever is making the remarks or whom they're aimed at.

>I hope that banned users don't have the answers to my questions. ;-)
>Besides, a sock puppet is made in minutes ...

He's not banned; he's welcome back here at any time. It's the tone that's not permitted.

Daniele

[Rakan Alhneiti]

God job everyone!

Do you think the Overview page should have the logos of the "Sites using Django"? it would be more visually appealing, in addition, people might be more aware of the logos than just plain names. What do you think?

Best Regards,

Rakan

[Rob]

On Tuesday, December 16, 2014 5:58:00 PM UTC-5, Christian Schmitt wrote:

Somehow I hate it. The website is the worst website I've seen since a long time.

The contrast is really aweful.

The issue Tracker got unusable due to the colors that aren't focused on readability.

Clearly.  My audit extension flags 47 contrast problems on the home page alone.  The site is not very accessible contrast wise.

Doesn't look like a designer or a graphic guy had his hands on that.

It clearly had a designer,  but they don't grok usability.

I hate to be "that guy" but this is not really an improvement other than it works on mobile now ...

[Daniele Procida]

We'd hate you to be "that guy" too. However, so far you are "that guy", since merely announcing that you have identified numerous accessibility issues is useless.

The repository is <https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com>. It's all open. If you're able to suggest or make improvements, you know what to do if you want to stop being "that guy".

Daniele

[Rob]

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 8:39:21 AM UTC-5, Daniele Procida wrote:

We'd hate you to be "that guy" too. However, so far you are "that guy", since merely announcing that you have identified numerous accessibility issues is useless.

Ok.  Tell the designer to google "chrome accessibility tester extension" and install the first match.

It will then flag the places where the Web Content Accessibility Guidelines are not being followed; http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG/#visual-audio-contrast

The repository is <https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com>. It's all open. If you're able to suggest or make improvements, you know what to do if you want to stop being "that guy".

I'm not a designer.  I can't make good suggestions on how to improve things, since I would most definitely make it worse.

 

[Stan]

On Wednesday, December 17, 2014 12:59:10 PM UTC+1, Tino de Bruijn wrote:

Hi,

- The font does not look crisp (can be because it's serif, or something with my comp, dunno)

The association of roboto font and -moz-osx-font-smoothing: grayscale rule maybe ?
Under code.djangoproject.com, removing the text-shadow: 0 0 (trackhacks.css) rule enhance the anti-aliasing.
 
Cheers,

Stan

[Bobby Mozumder]

For the Documentation, one suggestion I have is that the body font that’s more different from the source code font.

It looks like you’re using Roboto (a Helvetica clone) for the body text and Incosolota for the source code. They’re a little too similar. Also, Roboto isn’t a good font for descriptive sentences and paragraphs. It’s more of a short text font for titles, subheadline, and captions.

You generally don’t write long paragraphs with Helvetica, and you shouldn’t do that in Roboto either.

-bobby

[Raphael Michel]

Hi,

I agree with Tino in most points.
Thanks to the volunteers who did this and I really love the fact,
that I can finally browse the docs on a mobile device. Great!

But there certainly is a loss of both originality and the readability.
Both of these things are no blockers and don't make the new design
really bad, but both are things worth improving.

For originality, bringing back some of the old colors could help. They
suited Django very well and looked less like a million other pages out
there. I can't really help here, as I am no talented designer.

For readability, I like Tino's suggestion as well as the tickets [1]
and [2]. I think with minor improvements like a modified line height,
more bold headlines and more contrast in boxes and code, this
documentation could be both as modern as the new design and as readable
as the old one :)

Am Wed, 17 Dec 2014 12:58:37 +0100
schrieb Tino de Bruijn <tin...@gmail.com>:

> Does anybody agree on that and should I create a pull request?

Absolutely, sounds good!

Cheers,
Raphael


[1] https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/issues/216
[2] https://github.com/django/djangoproject.com/issues/198

[Thomas Leo]

The new Design looks great! Awesome job!

One thing I really like about https://docs.python.org/3/ is the ability to show/hide the side bar. The new design features a very large sidebar, being able to toggle it would be awesome. 

Also as previously mentioned trac doesn't look right yet.

[Fred Stluka]

+1 for keeping it courteous. 

The Django community is far and away the most helpful e-group
of people I've seen in 30 years of programming in dozens of
languages.  That post was much ruder than anything I've ever
seen on a Django forum, and did deserve to be addressed.

Thanks, Danielle!

--Fred

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