Terms for database replication

[Tom Evans]

Please revert this change as soon as possible.

If the project has become so PC sensitive that the word "slave" is no
longer permitted to be uttered, then "replica" is an alternate term,
but "primary" is not.

Have you ever set up "primary-primary replication"? No, neither have
I. Master-master replication is common, please do not take it upon
yourselves to re-program our vocabulary.

I have a primary master, I do not have a primary primary!

Cheers

Tom

[Cal Leeming [Simplicity Media Ltd]]

For once, I'm going to +1 you Tom.

Cal

Tom

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[Justin Holmes]

I think I agree that "primary" is a bad choice.  Can you suggest something other than master?  Something that will address the concerns posed in the past two threads?

I saw that someone suggested "leader" and "follower" - I haven't thought through whether I find this more palatable.

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[Malcolm Box]

FWIW, I think the main objection is to the word "slave", not to "master". Otherwise we'll be renaming the git branches soon...

So "master" / "replica" would work.

Malcolm

[Justin Holmes]

I don't want to devolve completely into an etymological circlejerk here, but my sense is that "master" in the VCS sense is like "master key," rather than describing the interpersonal relationship of involuntary servitude.

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[Flavio Curella]

I just want to clarify a few misunderstanding that I keep seeing popping up.

1. If you read the original ticket, https://code.djangoproject.com/ticket/22667 you will notice that my original concern wasn't the word 'master', nor the word 'slave', but the usage of both terms together. What basically I wanted to do was renaming that specific database configuration known as master/slave to something else. Turns out, primary/replica was already there.

2. Contrary to popular belief, the words 'master' and 'slave' have not been banned from the documentation.

3. I sure have no intention or hope to change the English language used by billions of people. That's kind of a big task to accomplish.

4. I neither have any intention of telling people what they should use. By all means, use whatever you feel like it's best. The intention here was to change just what Django uses in its docs.

[Unai Zalakain]

Greetings!

>I saw that someone suggested "leader" and "follower" - I haven't
>thought through whether I find this more palatable.

Well, as an individualist I am, I find those terms quite uninviting too.
Hoping to downplay it a bit, what about BDSM terms "Dominant" and
"Submissive", "Dom" and "Sub" or "Top" and "Bottom"?

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unai

[Alex Gaynor]

Hi everybody.

The Django core developers have made our decision on the terminology we're going to use; I'd ask that you stop using django-developers to debate this further.

Alex

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[Cal Leeming [Simplicity Media Ltd]]

Yup, the BDFL is still strong in this one ;)

Cal

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[Tom Evans]

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 5:08 PM, Justin Holmes <jus...@justinholmes.com> wrote:
> I don't want to devolve completely into an etymological circlejerk here, but
> my sense is that "master" in the VCS sense is like "master key," rather than
> describing the interpersonal relationship of involuntary servitude.
>

And in databases, it means the connection on which you can "master"
records. Words have many meanings.

[Justin Holmes]

OK.  How about "canon" and "replica" ?

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[Tom Evans]

On Thu, Jun 5, 2014 at 8:07 PM, Justin Holmes <jus...@justinholmes.com> wrote:
> OK. How about "canon" and "replica" ?

I think we all get sent to the naughty step if we continue to discuss
this, so I will just say that "master" is being used as an adjective
in this context, it is the master database, or the master connection,
or indeed master branch. "Master" as in slavery is when it is used as
a noun. A few dictionary definition of the adjective "master":

"of or pertaining to a master from which copies are made: master film;
master matrix; master record;master tape."
"Being an original from which copies are made."
"an original from which copies can be made; especially : a master
recording (as a magnetic tape)"

No other word is suitable because this word universally encapsulates
this concept, not just in IT, but in all aspects of all trades that
make copies of things.

Tom

[Stan]

Alex,

With all due respect (I mean it),
The perception from the outside is that you didn't put the Django project best interest on the first line in that PR / merge but something more personal (plus being a confusing merge in terms of computer science).

Cheers

[Alex Gaynor]

You're entitled to your own opinions, but you aren't entitled to your own facts. The terms primary/replica are extremely well established, perhaps even moreso than master/slave: https://imgur.com/a/pCp3d, the suggestion that this is a gross violation of computer science nomenclature is pure fiction. Further, the terms master/slave do not accurately describe the setup the documentation is referring to, with replication schemes like Wal-E (where a "slave" never even communicates with a "master") or PostgreSQL's chained replication (where a "slave" can replicate to another "slave"), the desire to cling to these misleading terms is simply perplexing.

Alex

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[Aymeric Augustin]

Everyone,

It’s exciting to see that much energy directed at Django! At the same time, it’s sad to see it tragically misused.

If you want to help, there are currently 124 pull requests on GitHub, 133 patches on Trac and 38 new tickets, all needing a review.

Any of these would be a better use of your time than this wording issue on which the core team has already made a final decision.

Thank you,

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[1] http://dashboard.djangoproject.com/

[Justin Holmes]

Aymeric +1

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