CrossMgrVideo
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Craig MacIntyre
Nov 3, 2024, 8:26:32 AM11/3/24
to CrossMgrSoftware
I keep coming back to this ... this is such an amazing tool. I wish we could use it stand alone to be honest.
Let me explain. Crossmgr is really really good. But for our 5km timing part of the business it is not what this is designed for. We use other software for that. But being a poor part time timer we cannot afford the FinishLynx solution. So for finish line backup we use either a kludge solution of OBC and VCL with a couple of webcams or just a homesecurity solution. Neither ideal.
So if there was a way to trigger this not using Crossmgr we could have a real solution. I realize that the simple solution might be set up a separate timing station out of interference range of the actual one and adjust buffer times to let the camera still grab "video" but that seems a bit sketchy. We may try that at an event we have coming up that is just a goofy holiday thing.
Any other thoughts or am I just looking for something that cannot happen.
Jonathan Rosen
Nov 3, 2024, 8:35:29 AM11/3/24
to crossmgr...@googlegroups.com
Simple solution is to set the time to something like -1 + 2 and just just click record every time you see a runner, then you'll end up with plenty of photos for reference. You could also run Cross Manager with RFID to generate the triggers and just ignore the cross manager data since you're scoring the race with other software.
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Craig MacIntyre
Nov 3, 2024, 9:20:01 AM11/3/24
to crossmgr...@googlegroups.com
Thanks Jon
The simple solution may be out best option for now. The problem with the second approach for me is that the software I am using right now is using RFID so to get the triggers to activate Video I would have to have a completely separate system set up. And in such a way that the RFID reader I am using doesn't interfere with the other one for official timing. I thought about doing it in front of the finish line and setting a delay on the video capture but overall that seems like a lot of work.
Right now the solution we are experimenting with is Blue Iris software and a couple of cameras (one across the line, one behind the line looking at athletes to identify bibs (kind of like IdLynx does). You can set the cameras for motion control and they use a buffer so you don't miss anything but as it is security camera software, navigation to specific frames is not ideal. But it seems like the best option we have without spending a fortune. I wish I did more events that required FinishLynx so could justify the cost but right now it would just be an expensive toy
To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/crossmgrsoftware/CAC7BV2yP-ESU50ECbPC6geURoNGn8nrHB15Xom7bVWz%2BAi6DPw%40mail.gmail.com.
Craig MacIntyre
Clothes make the man. Naked people have little or no impact on society. Mark Twain
Kim Wall
Nov 3, 2024, 9:26:01 AM11/3/24
to CrossMgrSoftware
CrossMgrVideo can be triggered by the 'fire' button on a USB HID
joystick. No CrossMgr needed.
I use this as a backup against tag read problems, with an infrared beam break across the finish line, connected to an Arduino that can emulate a USB HID. Works well.
Kim.
I use this as a backup against tag read problems, with an infrared beam break across the finish line, connected to an Arduino that can emulate a USB HID. Works well.
Kim.
Craig MacIntyre
Nov 3, 2024, 10:16:57 AM11/3/24
to crossmgr...@googlegroups.com
I remember reading that you said (Kim) that this was not fully stable - did you get that sorted out?
Craig MacIntyre
spOKeLAHOMA
Custom Wheels and Bikes - Let us build your dream
spOKeLAHOMA
Custom Wheels and Bikes - Let us build your dream
111 N Broadway
Tecumseh, OK 74873
405-777-6213 (shop)
405-777-6213 (shop)
405-742-0736 (cell)
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Kim Wall
Nov 3, 2024, 10:59:21 AM11/3/24
to crossmgr...@googlegroups.com
I had various issues making a beam-break that worked properly outdoors
on a budget. Current solution has the (AliExpress quality) sensor unit
mounted at the end of half a metre of drainpipe to keep the sunlight
out, and a generous helping of Scotchlite applied to the far-side RFID
antenna as a target. Easy to set up and usable range of a little over
10m. The problem is that in a HPV race there's no perfect height to
mount it at - the beam needs to be low enough to catch the lower
machines (eg. handcycles), which means it can fail to catch a
skinny-tyred high-racer at speed.
(Obviously this sort of problem is eminently solvable with more
expensive optical kit, by using a pressure-switch to detect wheels or by
making everyone ride the same type of bicycle.)
As for the software side, I'm using my own build with various tweaks to
CrossMgrVideo, so can't vouch for the official build, but the joystick
triggering seems reliable up to the point where the GUI hangs because of
intensive database access. IME it will continue to capture video when
triggered by CrossMgr in this state, and since this tends to happen when
lots of triggers come in close together, it usually captures what you're
looking for anyway. (I've added a mode to my CrossMgrVideo that avoids
reading anything back from the database, in the hope that might keep the
GUI responsive, but it's not had proper real-world testing.)
I've also put a generous debounce delay in the Ardunio, so it won't send
more than one button press per second, which gives CrossMgrVideo less
work to do.
TBH, most of our work over the last year has concentrated on RFID tag
reliability (making a proper effort to work out which tags are iffy,
testing new tags on problematic materials in-situ before races, that
sort of thing). We've got to the point where for our usual BHPC races
we might expect a handful of missed reads in a race (usually due to
occlusion by carbon fibre fairings passing close to the antenna), so the
IR triggering is much less important.
The World HPV Championships in August were chaotic, mostly due to a
minority of riders not attaching tags properly. (Lesson for next time:
People don't read instructions, scrutineers should attach the timing
tags.) The IR trigger allowed us to recover missed lap times for most
of them. Unfortunately, it's traditional to finish the event with an
endurance race, where maybe half the field will stop at some point, and
it's not at all obvious whether a rider has stopped or had a missed
read. CrossMgrVideo is helpful, but in that situation you're still
looking for the absence of a needle in a haystack.
Kim.
On 03/11/2024 15:16, Craig MacIntyre wrote:
> I remember reading that you said (Kim) that this was not fully stable -
> did you get that sorted out?
>
> Craig MacIntyre
>
> spOKeLAHOMA
> Custom Wheels and Bikes - Let us build your dream
> www.spokelahoma.com <http://www.spokelahoma.com>
on a budget. Current solution has the (AliExpress quality) sensor unit
mounted at the end of half a metre of drainpipe to keep the sunlight
out, and a generous helping of Scotchlite applied to the far-side RFID
antenna as a target. Easy to set up and usable range of a little over
10m. The problem is that in a HPV race there's no perfect height to
mount it at - the beam needs to be low enough to catch the lower
machines (eg. handcycles), which means it can fail to catch a
skinny-tyred high-racer at speed.
(Obviously this sort of problem is eminently solvable with more
expensive optical kit, by using a pressure-switch to detect wheels or by
making everyone ride the same type of bicycle.)
As for the software side, I'm using my own build with various tweaks to
CrossMgrVideo, so can't vouch for the official build, but the joystick
triggering seems reliable up to the point where the GUI hangs because of
intensive database access. IME it will continue to capture video when
triggered by CrossMgr in this state, and since this tends to happen when
lots of triggers come in close together, it usually captures what you're
looking for anyway. (I've added a mode to my CrossMgrVideo that avoids
reading anything back from the database, in the hope that might keep the
GUI responsive, but it's not had proper real-world testing.)
I've also put a generous debounce delay in the Ardunio, so it won't send
more than one button press per second, which gives CrossMgrVideo less
work to do.
TBH, most of our work over the last year has concentrated on RFID tag
reliability (making a proper effort to work out which tags are iffy,
testing new tags on problematic materials in-situ before races, that
sort of thing). We've got to the point where for our usual BHPC races
we might expect a handful of missed reads in a race (usually due to
occlusion by carbon fibre fairings passing close to the antenna), so the
IR triggering is much less important.
The World HPV Championships in August were chaotic, mostly due to a
minority of riders not attaching tags properly. (Lesson for next time:
People don't read instructions, scrutineers should attach the timing
tags.) The IR trigger allowed us to recover missed lap times for most
of them. Unfortunately, it's traditional to finish the event with an
endurance race, where maybe half the field will stop at some point, and
it's not at all obvious whether a rider has stopped or had a missed
read. CrossMgrVideo is helpful, but in that situation you're still
looking for the absence of a needle in a haystack.
Kim.
On 03/11/2024 15:16, Craig MacIntyre wrote:
> I remember reading that you said (Kim) that this was not fully stable -
> did you get that sorted out?
>
> Craig MacIntyre
>
> spOKeLAHOMA
> Custom Wheels and Bikes - Let us build your dream
> 111 N Broadway
> Tecumseh, OK 74873
> 405-777-6213 (shop)
> 405-742-0736 (cell)
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 3, 2024 at 8:26 AM Kim Wall <kim...@gmail.com
> <mailto:kim...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> CrossMgrVideo can be triggered by the 'fire' button on a USB HID
> joystick. No CrossMgr needed.
>
> I use this as a backup against tag read problems, with an infrared
> beam break across the finish line, connected to an Arduino that can
> emulate a USB HID. Works well.
>
> Kim.
> On Sunday 3 November 2024 at 13:26:32 UTC craig.m...@gmail.com
> Tecumseh, OK 74873
> 405-777-6213 (shop)
> 405-742-0736 (cell)
>
>
> On Sun, Nov 3, 2024 at 8:26 AM Kim Wall <kim...@gmail.com
> <mailto:kim...@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> CrossMgrVideo can be triggered by the 'fire' button on a USB HID
> joystick. No CrossMgr needed.
>
> I use this as a backup against tag read problems, with an infrared
> beam break across the finish line, connected to an Arduino that can
> emulate a USB HID. Works well.
>
> Kim.
> On Sunday 3 November 2024 at 13:26:32 UTC craig.m...@gmail.com
> <mailto:craig.m...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I keep coming back to this ... this is such an amazing tool. I
> wish we could use it stand alone to be honest.
> Let me explain. Crossmgr is really really good. But for our
> 5km timing part of the business it is not what this is designed
> for. We use other software for that. But being a poor part
> time timer we cannot afford the FinishLynx solution. So for
> finish line backup we use either a kludge solution of OBC and
> VCL with a couple of webcams or just a homesecurity solution.
> Neither ideal.
> So if there was a way to trigger this not using Crossmgr we
> could have a real solution. I realize that the simple solution
> might be set up a separate timing station out of interference
> range of the actual one and adjust buffer times to let the
> camera still grab "video" but that seems a bit sketchy. We may
> try that at an event we have coming up that is just a goofy
> holiday thing.
> Any other thoughts or am I just looking for something that
> cannot happen.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "CrossMgrSoftware" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send an email to crossmgrsoftwa...@googlegroups.com
> <mailto:crossmgrsoftwa...@googlegroups.com>.
>
> I keep coming back to this ... this is such an amazing tool. I
> wish we could use it stand alone to be honest.
> Let me explain. Crossmgr is really really good. But for our
> 5km timing part of the business it is not what this is designed
> for. We use other software for that. But being a poor part
> time timer we cannot afford the FinishLynx solution. So for
> finish line backup we use either a kludge solution of OBC and
> VCL with a couple of webcams or just a homesecurity solution.
> Neither ideal.
> So if there was a way to trigger this not using Crossmgr we
> could have a real solution. I realize that the simple solution
> might be set up a separate timing station out of interference
> range of the actual one and adjust buffer times to let the
> camera still grab "video" but that seems a bit sketchy. We may
> try that at an event we have coming up that is just a goofy
> holiday thing.
> Any other thoughts or am I just looking for something that
> cannot happen.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "CrossMgrSoftware" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send an email to crossmgrsoftwa...@googlegroups.com
> To view this discussion visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/crossmgrsoftware/fc7e32c0-bfa4-41c4-947f-9e909a19034en%40googlegroups.com <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/crossmgrsoftware/fc7e32c0-bfa4-41c4-947f-9e909a19034en%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>.
>
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