next BQ bike review

[jamin orrall]

This came in my latest email from BQ, any ideas what the next bike review is?

Unfortunately, your subscription expired with the Autumn BQ. We are already working on the Winter edition. Among the many exciting articles: a visit to the workshop of maestro J. P. Weigle; a report from the incredible Silk Road Mountain Race; an affordable randonneur bike that rode, performed and handled like my own bike.

[Daniel MacPherson]

 Crust Lightning? I believe a rim-brake version is getting release soon. 

[Andy Bailey Goodell]

I wouldn't hold my breath on either aspect (affordable or performance). He's previously called $5k frames affordable because they should last you a good long time, but that doesn't really mean I can afford to tell my wife that I bought a fancy bike! I can't really envision him reviewing a Crust as perming as well as a meticulously crafted custom bike either. Perhaps a $2-2.5k custom-ish like Lyonsport, Fitz, Norther, Frances, etc. could be nearly as performing to him, but then I'd hesitate to call anything but a Toussaint/Soma GR on the affordable for the masses end. Should be interesting to find out what it is!

On Wed, Oct 16, 2019 at 12:30 PM jamin orrall <hello...@gmail.com> wrote:

This came in my latest email from BQ, any ideas what the next bike review is?

Unfortunately, your subscription expired with the Autumn BQ. We are already working on the Winter edition. Among the many exciting articles: a visit to the workshop of maestro J. P. Weigle; a report from the incredible Silk Road Mountain Race; an affordable randonneur bike that rode, performed and handled like my own bike.

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[Michael Mann]

My first guess is Norther. I have a feeling it rides like a Jan bike.

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 16, 2019, at 11:31 AM, Andy Bailey Goodell <abg...@gmail.com> wrote:



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[Cary Weitzman]

Michael Mann wrote:

My first guess is Norther. I have a feeling it rides like a Jan bike.

Yep, NortherLyon would be my guess. Relatively affordable in the scheme of things. I'm sure the upcoming Crust Canti LB will be a nice bike, but not comparable to one of Jan's personal bikes.

Cary
PTBO.ON.CA

[matthew shroyer]

He did review the all city gorilla monsoon, which is fairly crusty in a lot of ways, including cost.

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[Harald Kliems]

$1800 for a stock geometry f/f = affordable these days? Man, I must be doing it wrong.

As a reminder: Both the SOMA GR and the Surly Midnight Special had pretty decent reviews in BQ.

 Harald.

[Andy Bailey Goodell]

Or a BMC Road+ which is even cheaper and has been getting good reviews even if I find the colors and fork to be unappealing.

Here's a list of 650b frames and their prices as best as I could find them. I might be missing some, but these are what I knew about or could find lately:

Surly Packrat 515
Toussaint Velo Routier 2 525
Soma GR 570
Twin Six Rando 600
Surly Midnight Special 650
Fairdale Rockitship 700
VO Ployvalent 725
Black Mountain Road+ 795
All City Gorilla Monsoon 850
Rawland Ulv 950
Rawland Ravn 950
Crust Romanceur 1275
Endpoint Hunter Gatherer 1300
Crust Lightning Bolt 1350
Stanforth Skyelander 1365
Elephant NFE 1485
Lyonsport L'avecaise 1600
Fitz Cyclez 1775
Box Dog Pelican 1800
Norther Lyon 2000
Norther Allure Libre 2000
333Fab AirLandSea 2250
Frances 2500
Chapman 2750

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/650b/CAFKees0j1Vf0MkzMhXVxS1FqGZYQzzEV8HatTpnjgp-K%2BWDmCg%40mail.gmail.com.

[Michael Mann]

OP quoted response from BQ that said

an affordable randonneur bike that rode, performed and handled like my own bike. 

That narrows the field a lot. Good list of bikes, but not all Jan-style Rando bikes. 

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

On Oct 16, 2019, at 1:11 PM, Andy Bailey Goodell <abg...@gmail.com> wrote:



To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/650b/CACLHWr-349ij_W6yS7huNgOCeF_wGWkkaEYXcLB%3DoGBo5HM_3w%40mail.gmail.com.

[nathaniel nichols]

Black mtn road+ are $695
And Box Dog pelicans are $2000

[Cary Weitzman]

Jan just posted this next issue teaser on Bicycle Quarterly's Instagram:

"Can a $1350 production frame handle this adventure?"

https://www.instagram.com/p/B3tq61wAnKB/

Gotta be the Crust.

Cary
PTBO.ON.CA

[Nathan Briles]

That oval head badge looks pretty similar to the other crust head badges. Probably the new lightning bolt

[Igor]

Where do you see a photo that shows an oval headbadge?

[Igor]

I cropped and increased the exposure, you're welcome everyone, it's a Crust

https://www.flickr.com/photos/14767344@N07/48918306526/in/dateposted-public/

[David Cummings]

I still don't see it...  Where's the oval headbadge? Isn't it covered by a bag?  The decal on the down tube kinda sorta could be Crust, but still hard to tell.  

[Nathan Briles]

Maybe I'm wrong about the head badge. I was looking at the bike in front and the bottom of the lever kinda looked like a head badge last night lol

[Cary Weitzman]

David Cummings wrote:

I still don't see it...  Where's the oval headbadge? Isn't it covered by a bag?  The decal on the down tube kinda sorta could be Crust, but still hard to tell.  

Comparing it to a similar shot of the prototype on The Radavist:

https://media.theradavist.com/uploads/2019/09/Ultra-Romances-Crust-Bikes-Lightning-Bolt-2.jpg?fit=2000,2000&quality=75

Looks pretty dang close. Same decal colours and position, same braze-ons on the fork. Probably the same bike and Matt passed it on to UltraRomance after Jan's test was finished.

Jan's teasing about this is very annoying, to me anyway, as I was seriously considering sending my favorite frame off to be converted to 650b. If the new LBs are that nice I'd rather keep it as my occasional fast 700x32 bike and add a LB to the stable. Now I have to wait and see, but it's likely that the bikes will show up before the review, and like the violet BM Road+ sell out quickly.

Cary
PTBO.ON.CA

[Alex Wetmore]

Made me think of the Box Dog Pelican.  Are those still in production?  What was the price point?

I'm friends with Jan but have no insider info.

alex

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Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2019 12:19 PM
To: 650b <65...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [650B] next BQ bike review

 

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[John W]

Pelicans were $2K but I don’t believe they are in production.

[Nathan Briles]

Assuming it is the crust; how do y'all feel about the rim brakes? Its the only thing really giving me pause about this frame so far. I just feel like the rim options aren't as good as a carbon disc wheelset or something.

[Andy Bailey Goodell]

It'll be interesting to see what he says about Crust. I recall some comments he made about the Rawland Stag being dismissive of lower cost bikes even when the tubing and rando style was there. Rawlands were more like $700 back then, but there's not much else out there for reasonable light tubing rim brake rando bikes today in that price range. Has he reviewed the $700 BMC Road+? That's gotten plenty of praise here and is about half the cost of a Crust. Mentally to me $1350 isn't far from $1600 which gets a L'avecaise (assuming prices haven't changed).

On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 12:45 AM Nathan Briles <nbril...@gmail.com> wrote:

That oval head badge looks pretty similar to the other crust head badges. Probably the new lightning bolt

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[Omar Sandoval]

Crust just posted another prototype that looks even more similar: https://www.instagram.com/p/B3xJkqNgtUl/

[John W]

Would love to see a production bike of this caliber that wasn't low trail.

[Scott Stulken]

So buy the disc brake version that already exists if you want disc brakes?  ;^)

I'm still pretty content with rim brakes and am glad for diversity in the 650B market.

- Scott

[Nathan Briles]

They're all gone! Been waiting for a restock for awhile

[Scott Stulken]

D'oh, you're right!  Maybe they'll make some of both.  :^)

- Scott

[satanas]

How does on find out anything about Crust? I've tried getting on their email list more than once but nada, and everything seems to be sold out by default. :-(

Great stuff and very helpful once you get hold of them, but it's hard to keep on top of things.

Later,
Stephen (who's not fond of Instaspam)

[matthew shroyer]

For crust, calling them or watching instagram is the best way to tell what is going on. 

I am still gathering parts to finish my bombora...

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[Andrew L]

I notice comments about Stags because I’ve had one for a while. About 3-4 years back Jan made the dismissive comments about production bikes like the Stag, but in BQ62 2 years back he was nicely positive about the Stag that came along on a ride, when he swapped with a riding companion whilst reviewing the 333fab Air Land Sea. It’s good to have some passing confirmation from someone who compares these things that he thinks the the Stag is rewarding to pedal, but I liked mine already and have not planned to get rid of it.

On Saturday, October 19, 2019 at 6:28:20 AM UTC+11, Andy Bailey Goodell wrote:
> It'll be interesting to see what he says about Crust. I recall some comments he made about the Rawland Stag being dismissive of lower cost bikes even when the tubing and rando style was there. Rawlands were more like $700 back then, but there's not much else out there for reasonable light tubing rim brake rando bikes today in that price range. Has he reviewed the $700 BMC Road+? That's gotten plenty of praise here and is about half the cost of a Crust. Mentally to me $1350 isn't far from $1600 which gets a L'avecaise (assuming prices haven't changed).
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 18, 2019 at 12:45 AM Nathan Briles <nbril...@gmail.com> wrote:
> That oval head badge looks pretty similar to the other crust head badges. Probably the new lightning bolt
>
>
>
> --
>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "650b" group.
>

> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to 65...@googlegroups.com.

[John Guild]

It’s the new Lightning Bolt, and I believe the switch to rim brakes and move away from copper fillets will lighten the frame up nicely. I have the disc version, and it’s one of the nicest handling bikes I’ve ever owned, but it does feel quite heavy. I think most of the extra weight is in the fork.

Pretty excited about this one. I’ve thought about asking Matt if I could get a MUSA lightning Bolt built up by Darren Larkin, but I think this would get me 95% of the way there.

[Paul Sherman]

The talk at FFD was that this version of the Lightning Bolt would be 7/4/7 (presumably OS) tubing. I didn’t ask Matt about it myself though.

Paul
NYC

[Tim Quinlan]

I saw a clip where Crust confirmed that they sent a bike to BQ. The segment with Crust starts at 4:28 of https://youtu.be/nEDra8YR8-s

[Nathan Briles]

Some new pics also went up on their Instagram today. I can't really tell, but it doesn't look like it's Reynolds 853. I'm curious what the tubing specs and price is. It seems like it should be quite a bit cheaper than the old LB

[Pat Smith]

Do you all feel that a BQ is a subscription that's worth having? May be good to throw to a family member as a Christmas present idea.

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 12:30:35 PM UTC-4, jamin orrall wrote:

This came in my latest email from BQ, any ideas what the next bike review is?

Unfortunately, your subscription expired with the Autumn BQ. We are already working on the Winter edition. Among the many exciting articles: a visit to the workshop of maestro J. P. Weigle; a report from the incredible Silk Road Mountain Race; an affordable randonneur bike that rode, performed and handled like my own bike.

[Harald Kliems]

If they'll make it in "large-enough-for-me," I'll be really tempted, maybe replacing my SOMA Grand Randonneur. But that's a big if.

[Nathan Briles]

They said they're making up to a 62 I think

[Eric Daume]

I really enjoy BQ. They have a very strong bias in what they like, but their bikes tests and features are far better than any other bike magazine. 

Eric

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[satanas]

Are any details actually known yet? I've no idea how to use IG, the images can't be enlarged on Android from links posted here and unfortunately Crust don't seem to supply info in any other way. :-(

Later,
Stephen (who thinks social media is an oxymoron)

[Stephen Poole]

Yeah, maybe - it depends on your tolerance for propaganda. I let my subscription lapse because Jan's bike reviews seemed largely to be a soapbox for him to spout off ad nauseam about The One True Way everything should be. The Japanese industry and historical stuff was interesting, but the tests appealed to me about as much as the Murdoch press - bad for my blood pressure.

Of course, if you're a fully paid up disciple of the gospel according to Jan this might not bother you.

Later,

Stephen

[Andy Bailey Goodell]

I asked for it several years back and read it, but interest waned after a few years. A lot of it at the time was Jan's custom fabricated bike stuff and his anecdotes about bike physics that he writes as scientific fact. I had a hard time enjoying the writing when I felt like I was filtering everything like "oh sure, of course your $90 tires don't ever flat". Every time he'd comment about a good-enough aspect about bikes being terrible compared to how Rene Herse would have made a custom better was another bit of interest lost and those aspects eventually turned me off to it. The bike reviews were also way above my pay grade, so I found it less useful once my stable was full (with $400 frames). I did find it shaped what I like about bikes, and now that it's stuck I don't care too much to read about disc brakes, carbon Calfees, or why their taillight is best because it's not visible from the side.

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[Michael Mann]

I've had a subscription for years and i still find value in every issue. It has definitely informed my taste in bicycles and style of riding. I attended a BQ unmeeting and probably will again. But I'm also uncomfortable with the drift in emphasis towards high-end carbon gravel gravel bikes that are too rich for my taste and which I just find aesthetically ugly. And Jan's focus on incremental gram shaving and incremental speed improvements just leaves me cold; it's got zero to do with my bike world. Even he admits on occasion that scientifically we have to hit peak supple at some point. And then he's off on a chase...

That said, I'm glad for his voice, for his opinion, for his dogged pursuit of his vision. It's not everything, but it is singular.

Mike

Mike

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/650b/CACLHWr-SQ9eUpQdwEHwHrg-ZA8zQ8YvvHz%3DHEgYg8dq9j%3DW8EA%40mail.gmail.com.

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Michael Mann

[Michael Mann]

Russ at Path Less Pedaled just interviewed Matt at the Philly Bike Expo, and the new bike was featured prominently in the interview. Matt acknowledged it had been reviewed, and stated clearly it is a "Jan bike," and that if you turned BQ upside down and shook it, this bike would fall out. He also joked about the upcoming review possible killing Crust Bikes. But he was smiling.

https://youtu.be/nEDra8YR8-s

Mike

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[Tyler Summerhays]

I worked in the cycling industry for a few years and one way to keep my interest in cycling was by reading Jan’s blog simply because his experiences with products where different from what I dealt with on a daily basis. I’ve now enjoyed BQ for several years. Not every issue is spectacular, nor every review, but I appreciate his different approach and viewpoint. That said, I get caught up in his views against modern bikes that sometimes makes me not want to ride my bikes because they’re no low-trail randonneur bike. I think that is because he’s very persuasive in my eyes. But then I buckup, get on my diverge and fall in love with that bike. Sure, I’ve got issues with the bike but none of them make me hate riding it. Infact sometimes it’s the opposite. But with that said, I’m watching this Crust Canti-LB with great interest.

[Michael Mann]

Russ from Path Less Pedaled just interviewed Matt and profiled the bike at the Philly Bike Expo. Matt literally said it’s a Jan bike and if you turned BQ upside down and shook it this bike would fall out. He acknowledged it was reviewed and joked about it possibly being the end of Crust if Jan didn’t like it. But he was smiling.

https://youtu.be/nEDra8YR8-s

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 8, 2019, at 8:03 AM, satanas <nsc.e...@gmail.com> wrote:

Are any details actually known yet? I've no idea how to use IG, the images can't be enlarged on Android from links posted here and unfortunately Crust don't seem to supply info in any other way. :-(

Later,
Stephen (who thinks social media is an oxymoron)

[Murray Watson]

It was also featured over here a few weeks ago.

https://theradavist.com/2019/09/ultra-romances-crust-lightning-bolt-is-lighter-than-a-soft-whisper/

Murray Watson - Melbourne, Australia

[Michael Mann]

I still subscribe and I find value in every issue. But I’m also turned off by the drift towards carbon bikes I just find Aesthetically ugly. And Jans obsession with incremental gram shaving and incremental speed improvements is of no value to me in my bike world. Even he occasionally acknowledges that scientifically at some point we have to reach peak supple. And then he’s off on another chase.

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 8, 2019, at 8:14 AM, Andy Bailey Goodell <abg...@gmail.com> wrote:



To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/650b/CACLHWr-SQ9eUpQdwEHwHrg-ZA8zQ8YvvHz%3DHEgYg8dq9j%3DW8EA%40mail.gmail.com.

[Steve Palincsar]

I wouldn't characterize it as a "drift towards carbon" as much as it is keeping up with the development of all-road bikes.  Jan obviously thinks it's a big deal that manufacturers, not just custom builders, have picked up on this idea and are running with it.  But look at what he most recently had built for himself:

Gram-shaving was a big deal for the Weigle CdM bike that Jan commissioned in 2017 -- they were explicitly trying for lightest bike, which indeed they achieved -- but aside from a few weight-weenie parts like titanium brake pad and cable hanger bolts and tubular fender stays, I don't see much evidence for a blanket charge of "obsession."

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/650b/976223C2-2CB9-4E8C-A62A-ECB5068C3488%40gmail.com.

-- 
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia 
USA

[Scott Stulken]

I dig BQ, and recently renewed my subscription, along with snagging a couple of back issues.  There is a clear editorial bias -- toward fast, comfortable bikes that can tackle all kinds of terrain for days and nights on end -- but I've made my peace with it.  ;^)

As for the "carbon" thing:  I firmly believe Rene Herse and Alex Singer would have played with the stuff were it available at the time.  They were looking ahead, not back.

- Scott

[Mark Bulgier]

Steve Palincsar wrote:

> look at what he most recently had built for himself:

Maybe this has been commented on before, but did you notice those little fender flaps are removable, to reduce aero drag on dry days?  He left them off for PBP.  Cute feature.

I'm close to pure vintage myself -- have never ridden a bike with any kind of brifters, and the only carbon bike I ever owned was a 1976 Exxon Graftek.  Which I sold without ever riding it even once.  But I still read BQ pretty much cover to cover, even the carbon bike reviews.  I'd rather walk than buy one of those [jk], but it doesn't bother me that they're there.

To those complaining: is there some other magazine you like better?  I'm not saying you shouldn't complain, not judging, really!  It's not a rhetorical question.  No other magazine I know of comes close to the quality of an average BQ issue, but if there's something else out there I should be reading, let me know.

Mark Bulgier

[David Cummings]

On Friday, November 8, 2019 at 5:37:10 PM UTC-7, Mark Bulgier wrote:

I'm close to pure vintage myself -- have never ridden a bike with any kind of brifters, and the only carbon bike I ever owned was a 1976 Exxon Graftek.  Which I sold without ever riding it even once.  But I still read BQ pretty much cover to cover, even the carbon bike reviews.  I'd rather walk than buy one of those [jk], but it doesn't bother me that they're there.

 

[Andy Bailey Goodell]

Honestly I don't find the time to read magazines. I like shorter bits of info, and so emails like 650/ibob are where I get my fix. More recently Reddit too: r/xbiking and r/bikecommuting. And a handful of Instagram accounts. I like the option to skip stuff that doesn't interest me, but when it's a printed I feel obligated to read it all and then feel like I wasted time reading about something I didn't want to.

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[Mark Bulgier]

Andy Bailey Goodell wrote:

Honestly I don't find the time to read magazines. I like shorter bits of info, and so emails like 650/ibob are where I get my fix. More recently Reddit too: r/xbiking and r/bikecommuting. And a handful of Instagram accounts. I like the option to skip stuff that doesn't interest me, but when it's a printed I feel obligated to read it all and then feel like I wasted time reading about something I didn't want to.

I do spend time on digital media (obviously -- I'm here ain't I?), but I still like the printed magazine experience.  Holding it in my hands; even the need to wait for it seems to (perversely?) heighten the enjoyment.  Not for everyone, I know.  I'm guessing the younger generations have little interest in dead-tree media.

While Reddit et al. expose you to a much wider range of opinions, the problem is they're mostly crap!  OK I exaggerate, but there aren't many people doing in-depth research or longer-form writing.  It's mostly bite-size, seldom a meal. 

[Michael Mann]

“titanium brake pad and cable hanger bolts and tubular fender stays”

In my book that’s obsession with gram shaving. Not bad, but not my jam.

And my point about carbon bikes is that I personally find them ugly. It’s not a performance thing; I just don’t like fat tubes that break like plastic. that’s me.

Mike

Sent from my iPhone

[Kieran J]

Not to mention the fact that the bike Steve posted has a prototype "modern" interpretation indexed RH drivetrain consisting of a rod-operated FD and an indexed version of an RD designed almost a century ago. 

Jan is still very much ensconced in the classical genre, while also evaluating (and critiquing) all that new new stuff. I think it makes for interesting variety.

KJ

On Friday, November 8, 2019 at 3:44:49 PM UTC-8, Steve Palincsar wrote:

I wouldn't characterize it as a "drift towards carbon" as much as it is keeping up with the development of all-road bikes.  Jan obviously thinks it's a big deal that manufacturers, not just custom builders, have picked up on this idea and are running with it.  But look at what he most recently had built for himself:

Gram-shaving was a big deal for the Weigle CdM bike that Jan commissioned in 2017 -- they were explicitly trying for lightest bike, which indeed they achieved -- but aside from a few weight-weenie parts like titanium brake pad and cable hanger bolts and tubular fender stays, I don't see much evidence for a blanket charge of "obsession."

On 11/8/19 11:35 AM, Michael Mann wrote:

I still subscribe and I find value in every issue. But I’m also turned off by the drift towards carbon bikes I just find Aesthetically ugly. And Jans obsession with incremental gram shaving and incremental speed improvements is of no value to me in my bike world. Even he occasionally acknowledges that scientifically at some point we have to reach peak supple. And then he’s off on another chase.

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 8, 2019, at 8:14 AM, Andy Bailey Goodell <ab...@gmail.com> wrote:



I asked for it several years back and read it, but interest waned after a few years. A lot of it at the time was Jan's custom fabricated bike stuff and his anecdotes about bike physics that he writes as scientific fact. I had a hard time enjoying the writing when I felt like I was filtering everything like "oh sure, of course your $90 tires don't ever flat". Every time he'd comment about a good-enough aspect about bikes being terrible compared to how Rene Herse would have made a custom better was another bit of interest lost and those aspects eventually turned me off to it. The bike reviews were also way above my pay grade, so I found it less useful once my stable was full (with $400 frames). I did find it shaped what I like about bikes, and now that it's stuck I don't care too much to read about disc brakes, carbon Calfees, or why their taillight is best because it's not visible from the side.

On Fri, Nov 8, 2019 at 9:44 AM Pat Smith <pbsm...@gmail.com> wrote:

Do you all feel that a BQ is a subscription that's worth having? May be good to throw to a family member as a Christmas present idea.

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019 at 12:30:35 PM UTC-4, jamin orrall wrote:

This came in my latest email from BQ, any ideas what the next bike review is?

Unfortunately, your subscription expired with the Autumn BQ. We are already working on the Winter edition. Among the many exciting articles: a visit to the workshop of maestro J. P. Weigle; a report from the incredible Silk Road Mountain Race; an affordable randonneur bike that rode, performed and handled like my own bike.

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[J L]

I’ll weigh in here.

There are some things about (and in) the content of BQ that I don’t like much.

What I do like lately are the ride reports and the photography. There was an article a few issues ago about a group of cyclists riding in north east Africa. They met up with a pro road cyclist in Eritrea and got to spend some time riding with him and learning about the local cycling culture. That bike trip is something I’m not likely to do on my own and it was a nice read. It seems like every new issue has at least one article highlighting a specific region or type of ride.

Jason
SF, CA

[Stephen Poole]

Thanks Murray.  ;-)

[Steve Palincsar]

And where else do you find that in a cycling magazine?  It's quite refreshing in my opinion to see modern claims and enthusiasms being knowledgeably contrasted with and evaluated against classic prior art. 

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[Steve Palincsar]

What does "obsession" mean?  I looked it up and found this:  "an idea or thought that continually preoccupies or intrudes on a person's mind."   Not just "occasionally," or "considered where appropriate under special circumstances," but continually.   I submit that a few Ti bolts and a tubular fender stay out of the entirety of the RH catalog do not constitute an obsession.  I think their presence in the RH catalog is closer to something like this: "We've developed and tested these things for a special purpose and they've proven themselves in practice, the R&D's been done and the costs paid; why not make them available for general sale?" 

I don't care for the look of carbon bikes and so-called modern components either, and agree with your opinion that they are ugly.   Here's what I like:

I honestly don't know whether this bike has those Ti brake bolts and tubular fender stays or not.   If not, I wouldn't bother to change to them.

-- 
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia 
USA

[Bill M.]

I really didn't need pic's of UltraRonnie in a Speedo with my breakfast.

Bill

Stockton, CA

[alan lavine]

I suscribe and enjoy reading it, although as time passes, I find that less and less content is relevant to the kind of riding I do.  Few of us, I would guess, ride like Jan, and that, together with his known biases, helps me to interpret what I'm reading.

Nonetheless, I feel he has made substantial contributions to our bike knowledge (supple wide tires being one example that has changed my riding habits) and deserves our respect and thanks.  Just like Grant at Riv, I don't buy the whole package, but I've adopted some of this knowledge for my personal benefit.

Best,

Alan NYC

[Mitch H]

I spent a couple days last week “bagging” covered bridges in Parke County Indiana. Pretty tame conditions but the rough gravel and macadam roads (compared to my local S. MIchigan) did not reduce my enjoyment because I rode a custom bike modeled on BQ: thin steel tubing, wide supple tires, fenders, lights, bags. No hand or butt pain, no cleanup needed despite some rain.

If I’d had ridden my pre-BQ bike (Soma Smoothie w/ 28 mm Gatorskins, tiny bag, no fenders or lights) it would have been much less pleasant.

Without BQ I would have had no idea about this kind of cycling. It’s been a game changer.

Mitch Hull in Battle Creek

[Harald Kliems]

On Friday, October 18, 2019 at 4:49:31 PM UTC-5, Scott Stulken wrote:

D'oh, you're right!  Maybe they'll make some of both.  :^)

Website says the disc LB will also be back in stock in Feb. So I guess they are indeed making a batch of both disc and canti.

 Harald.

[David Parsons]

On Sunday, November 10, 2019 at 1:27:14 PM UTC-8, Mitch H wrote:

... Gatorskins ... it would have been much less pleasant.

(shudder)  That's 80% of the problem right there!

-david parsons

[Alex Wetmore]

When did you let your subscription lapse Stephen?

I'd say that the reviewer bias changed quite a bit about 3 or 4 years ago.  The Jones review would count as the turning point for me.  His reference bike the last few years is often a high trail Firefly All-Road.  Bikes don't need to be 7/4/7 standard diameter tubing with sub-40mm trail and impeccably built to get a good review anymore.  I'm not going to argue that Jan doesn't have his biases, just that the variety and styles of bikes have changed.  His pool of co-reviewers has also expanded quite a bit.

The other thing that has changed is that the magazine has taken a shift from being rando focused to having more of a touring/adventure focus.  I also really like the contributions by Natsuko who adds both a women's point of view and an excitement about destinations and the scenic aspects of the journey.

I was pretty heavily involved as a technical contributor 10 years ago and am mostly just a reader now, but the current magazine has even more for me to connect with than the issues from 10 years ago.  I'm a bike tourist (who loves backroads dirt routes) and commuter, but not a rando.

alex

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From: 65...@googlegroups.com <65...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Stephen Poole <nsc.e...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, November 8, 2019 8:09 AM
To: Eric Daume <eric...@gmail.com>
Cc: Pat Smith <pbsm...@gmail.com>; 650b <65...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [650B] next BQ bike review

 

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[jack loudon]

Alex: "is often a high trail Firefly All-Road."

Jan's Firefly has 37 mm of trail, per his geometry diagram in BQ Issue 56.   I am a bit surprised he hasn't added fenders to his Firefly though.

Jack

On Monday, November 11, 2019 at 7:03:41 AM UTC-8, Alex Wetmore wrote:

When did you let your subscription lapse Stephen?

I'd say that the reviewer bias changed quite a bit about 3 or 4 years ago.  The Jones review would count as the turning point for me.  His reference bike the last few years is often a high trail Firefly All-Road.  Bikes don't need to be 7/4/7 standard diameter tubing with sub-40mm trail and impeccably built to get a good review anymore.  I'm not going to argue that Jan doesn't have his biases, just that the variety and styles of bikes have changed.  His pool of co-reviewers has also expanded quite a bit.

The other thing that has changed is that the magazine has taken a shift from being rando focused to having more of a touring/adventure focus.  I also really like the contributions by Natsuko who adds both a women's point of view and an excitement about destinations and the scenic aspects of the journey.

I was pretty heavily involved as a technical contributor 10 years ago and am mostly just a reader now, but the current magazine has even more for me to connect with than the issues from 10 years ago.  I'm a bike tourist (who loves backroads dirt routes) and commuter, but not a rando.

alex

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From: 65...@googlegroups.com <65...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of Stephen Poole <nsc....@gmail.com>

Sent: Friday, November 8, 2019 8:09 AM
To: Eric Daume <eric...@gmail.com>
Cc: Pat Smith <pbsm...@gmail.com>; 650b <65...@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: [650B] next BQ bike review

Yeah, maybe - it depends on your tolerance for propaganda. I let my subscription lapse because Jan's bike reviews seemed largely to be a soapbox for him to spout off ad nauseam about The One True Way everything should be. The Japanese industry and historical stuff was interesting, but the tests appealed to me about as much as the Murdoch press - bad for my blood pressure.

Of course, if you're a fully paid up disciple of the gospel according to Jan this might not bother you.

Later,

Stephen

On Sat, 9 Nov. 2019, 03:00 Eric Daume, <eric...@gmail.com> wrote:

I really enjoy BQ. They have a very strong bias in what they like, but their bikes tests and features are far better than any other bike magazine.

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[Alex Wetmore]

Oops, sorry about the misinformation.  I forgot that he had a steel fork made for it to get low trail.

It's still quite unlike most of his bikes.

alex

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From: 65...@googlegroups.com <65...@googlegroups.com> on behalf of jack loudon <jwlo...@gmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2019 9:52 AM
To: 650b <65...@googlegroups.com>

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[Ford Bailey]

There is nothing else that compares to BQ. I find the writing very good, especially Jan's descriptions of long rides. I feel like I'm there. I'm also glad that the BQ bicycle bias has broadened to include more modern bikes.

BQ tries to explore riding and the bikes that best enable people to ride, in all terrain and all kinds of weather. The riding is the most important aspect, not the bikes. 

My main frustration with BQ is that I can't zoom in to enlarge the pictures !

[Hahn Rossman]

He would have added fenders except that firefly welded the bridges in too low. 

Hahn 

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[Daniel Jackson]

Rossman with the SHADE

[Evan Estern]

It's likely that if BQ never existed, none of us would be here discussing the finer points of 650B wide tired cycling.  The two bikes (a Stag and a Norther Lyon) I've ridden and enjoyed for the past 7 years would probably never have been made either. It's the only magazine of any type that I subscribe to, and when a new issue comes out it's the highlight of my week. I guess I'm a fan.

[David Cummings]

It’s a fact that I wouldn’t have two Treks with forks re-takes to low trail in my stable without BQ. I wouldn’t be riding the way I do without BQ. I’m not a randonneur in terms of high mileage rides, but I ride in the self-supporting style of randonneurs and love the aesthetic.

I “discovered” that there was more to cycling than racing in BQ and learned about fascinating history (especially liked the frenchy side of it) previously unknown to me.

BQ is far more than a bicycle review rag, it’s a way of cycling life they I like to participate in at my own speed.

David “just ride bikes” in MT

[Andy Bailey Goodell]

Jan Heine on the book of face posted this today: "We’ve already put 100s of miles on the soon-to-be-releases @crustbikes Canti Lightning Bolt, now it’s time for the photo studio. Full report to come in the Winter 2019 Bicycle Quarterly. #bqtestbikes". So yes, it is a Crust.

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[Ken Freeman]

And isn't it rather cool to read about the existence of an indexed Nivex-based rear derailleur?  Talk about a personal vision of ideally merging the ancient and modern!

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Ken Freeman
Ann Arbor, MI USA

[Steve Palincsar]

Let's not forget, they tried indexing back in the 1940s but it died due to lack of interest.  (Of course, if you only have 3 gears how great is the need for indexing?)

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[jack loudon]

Alan's comments (below) mirror my experiences closely, with regard to both BQ and Rivendell.  I was a subscriber in the VBQ days (and also Rivendell Reader) and still frequently buy BQ issues at my LBS, but find the topics less relevant to my interests and riding style (no fault of BQ).  

My main objection is that the magazine often reads like an infomercial.  Jan is certainly entitled to his biases, but these days I'm not inclined to pay $10 to read about them.  An example was the review of the Specialized Sequoia in Issue 59, where a mediocre bike was transformed by Compass tires.  The bike was reportedly very stiff and uninspiring, but replacing the stock tires with his own Switchback Hill tires "...,changed the character of the bike.  Suddenly it was 'planing' for me as the flex in the tires made up for the overly stiff frame."   What does this mean?  That we don't need a flexy frame to experience planing, only his tires?  I don't know; it's confusing to me, and it doesn't 'pass the smell test' as we used to say in construction.  I've learned a lot from VBQ and BQ over the years and acknowledge the contribution Jan has made to our bicycling world.  But in the end, we read stuff and then make up our own mind about its value to us.

I hope I'm not being too hard on BQ but with Rene Herse they are in the difficult position of both selling a magazine and selling products which are frequently featured in their magazine.  Some of you have asked: "what would you have him do - give up the magazine or give up his products?"  Well, I would love to see Jan continue development of his excellent products but have the magazine become a separate and truly independent entity.  

Just my 2 cents, not that anybody asked :)

Jack 

On Sunday, November 10, 2019 at 5:26:07 AM UTC-8, alan lavine wrote:

I subscribe and enjoy reading it, although as time passes, I find that less and less content is relevant to the kind of riding I do.  Few of us, I would guess, ride like Jan, and that, together with his known biases, helps me to interpret what I'm reading.

[Tim Quinlan]

On Sunday, November 10, 2019 at 8:26:07 AM UTC-5, alan lavine wrote:

...

I don't buy the whole package, but I've adopted some of this knowledge for my personal benefit.

...

That's a great way to look at most things in life, not just bike dogma