Thirty-three crore gods of the Hindus

[Arvind_Kolhatkar]

Dear Group,

I came across a paper at http://www.namami.org/kriti%20rakshana_7vol/11/pdf/final%20newsletter.pdf that suggests that originally there were 33 gods (8 वसु, 11 रुद्र, 12 आदित्य, 2 द्यावापृथिवी, total 33.)  In support is cited शतपथ ब्राह्मण ४.५.७.२.

I traced शतपथ ब्राह्मण ४.५.७.२ at http://fiindolo.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gretil/1_sanskr/1_veda/2_bra/satapath/sb_04_u.htm, where the text is in the Roman script as aṣṭau vasavaḥ | ekādaśa rudrā dvādaśādityā ime eva dyāvāpṛthivī trayastriṃśyau trayastriṃśadvai devāḥ

I transliterate it in DevanAgarI as 

अष्टौ वसव:। एकादश रुद्रा द्वादशादित्या इमे एव द्यावापृथिवी त्रयस्त्रिंश्यौ त्रयस्त्रिंशद्वै देवा:...

 

(The concept of 33 gods is also shared by the Avesta.)

The paper goes on to suggest that the misinterpretation of the word कोटि to mean 'a crore' has led to the idea of 33 crore gods.  The word कोटि should be interpreted as 'supreme, preeminent, excellent'.  This, indeed, is one of the senses attached to this word in MW.  The paper suggests that I-Tsing and Tibetan masters who translated Buddhists texts till the 8th century used this meaning for the word कोटि.  At some stage thereafter this meaning was forgotten and कोटि became 'a crore'. leading to 33 crore gods of the Hindus.

I request scholars here to comment on this interpretation.

Arvind Kolhatkar, Toronto, March 08, 2012.

[Sunder Hattangadi]

Brihadaranyaka Upanishad has this dialogue between Yajnavalkya and Sakalya:

 

http://www.celextel.org/108upanishads/brihadaranyaka.html?page=3

III-ix-1: Then Vidagdha, the son of Sakala, asked him.
‘How many gods are there, Yajnavalkya ?’ Yajnavalkya
decided it through this (group of Mantras known as) Nivid (saying),
‘As many as are indicated in the Nivid of the Visvadevas –
three hundred and three, and three thousand and three’.
‘Very well’, said Sakalya, ‘how many gods exactly are there,
Yajnavalkya ?’ ‘Thirty-three’. ‘Very well’, said the other,
‘how many gods exactly are there, Yajnavalkya ?’ ‘six’.
‘Very well’, said Sakalya, ‘how many gods exactly are there,
Yajnavalkya ?’ ‘Three’. ‘Very well’, said the other,
‘how many gods exactly are there, Yajnavalkya ?’ ‘Two’.
‘Very well’, said Sakalya, ‘how many gods exactly are there,
Yajnavalkya ?’ ‘One and a half’. ‘Very well’, said Sakalya,
‘how many gods exactly are there, Yajnavalkya ?’ ‘One’.
‘Very well’, said Sakalya, ‘which are those three hundred
and three and three thousand and three ?’
III-ix-2: Yajnavalkya said, ‘these are but the manifestation of them,
but there are only thirty-three gods.’ ‘Which are those thirty-three ?’
‘The eight Vasus, the eleven Rudras and the twelve Adityas –
these are thirty-one and Indra and Prajapati make up the thirty-three’.

 

The implication is that any word other than 'One' is metaphorical, and 'sahasra'

indicates infinite, just as in Gita 11:12 the divine brilliance is compared to a thousand suns.

 

 

Regards,

 

sunder

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[satyajit Borwankar]

I had read somewhere that कोटि can be interpreted as "classes/classifications" "types" or "groupings". May be this is just an interpretation post facto to fit the meaning concieved by the interpreter.

 

Satyajit

[Sunder Hattangadi]

Would someone quote the exact sentence where the word 'koTi' occurs?  Thanks.

 

 

Regards,

 

sunder

From: satyajit Borwankar <satya...@gmail.com>
To: sams...@googlegroups.com

[Ajit Gargeshwari]

1. Chandra, Lokesh. Buddhism: Art and values : A collection of research papers and keynote addresses on the evolution of Buddhist art and thought across the lands of Asia. International Academy of Indian Culture and Aditya Prakashan, 2007. Retrieved 15 October 2011. ("A popular but unfounded belief has been spread that Hindus have 33 crore (33,00,00,000) gods. It is a misunderstanding of the Vedic concept of the State, and hence a misinterpretation of the word koti. Thirty-three divinities are mentioned in the Yajur-veda, Atharva-... Tibetan masters who translated Sanskrit texts into Tibetan, rendered koti by rnam which means 'class, kind, category'. The thirty-three supreme deities are specified in the Satapatha-brahmana 4.5.7.2 as: 8 Vasus + 11 Rudras + 12 Adityas...")
2. Joe David Brown; Time-Life Books (1961), Joe David Brown, ed., India, Time, Inc. "Though the popular figure of 330 million is not the result of an actual count but intended to suggest infinity, the Hindu pantheon in fact contains literally hundreds of different deities [...]"
3.  Lynn Foulston, Stuart Abbott. Hindu goddesses: beliefs and practices. pp. 1–2.

The 33 celestial gods.

The Brihadaranyak Upnishad says that there are mainly thirty-three gods who are important in the celestial world in terms of the performance of Vedic rituals and the yagyas. Other celestial gods are affiliates to them. They are: eight Vasus, eleven Rudras, twelve Adityas (forms of sun god), god Indra and god Prajapati.

The eight Vasus are: agni (god of fire), prithivi (goddess of the earth), vayu (god of the wind), antarikch (god of the space), aditya (sun god), dyo (god of the luminous sky), chandrama (moon god) and nakchatra (god of the nakchatras, asterism. Nakchatras are 27, called Magha, Rohini etc.)

These gods are associated with Vedic ceremonies only.

some more links

http://www.crystalinks.com/indiadieties.html

http://www.aussieeducator.org.au/reference/general/religion/hinduism.html

http://www.religionfacts.com/hinduism/deities.htm

http://vedabase.net/k/koti

For a list of Hindu deties

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Hindu_deities

Regards

Ajit Gargeshwari

[Arvind_Kolhatkar]

Dear Group members,

Can someone actually trace the text or the authority from where the above-described mix-up between the two alternative meanings of the word 'koTi' started.  In other words, where was the word 'koTi' was first used in the sense of '10 million' instead of in the sense of 'a superior category'?

Arvind Kolhatkar, Toronto, May 11, 2012.

[Ajit Gargeshwari]

The word "crore" is derived from the Prakrit word krodi , denoting "ten million" in the Indian numbering system, which has separate terms for most powers of ten from 10⁰ up to 10¹⁹. The crore is known by various regional names in modern languages, all derived from the Sanskrit word कोटि koṭi.

koṭi — ten million; SB 3.11.40
koṭi — of millions; SB 5.17.4
koṭi — millions; SB 10.66.39
koṭi — ten million; CC Adi 1.37
koṭi — ten million; CC Adi 1.39
koṭī — millions; CC Adi 1.85-86
koṭi-koṭīṣu — in millions and millions; CC Adi 2.14
koṭī — tens of millions; CC Adi 2.15
koṭī — tens of millions; CC Adi 2.15
koṭi — ten million; CC Adi 3.79
koṭi koṭi — innumerable; CC Adi 7.16
koṭi koṭi — innumerable; CC Adi 7.16
koṭi — millions; CC Adi 7.60
koṭi — countless; CC Adi 7.170
koṭi — millions; CC Adi 8.40
koṭi koṭi — hundreds and thousands; CC Adi 10.160
koṭi koṭi — hundreds and thousands; CC Adi 10.160
koṭi — millions; CC Adi 12.76
koṭi koṭi — hundreds and thousands; CC Adi 15.21
koṭi koṭi — hundreds and thousands; CC Adi 15.21

All meaning got from http://vedabase.net/k/koti

Regards
Ajit Gargeshwari

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[Hnbhat B.R.]

I could not understand the attempt the meaning of every word to Vedic Usages to be authentic. The meaning of Vedic Vocabulary is related to Vedic passages only. The Comparative method attaches the meaning with the parallel passages to the words in Vedic Literature while tradition attaches the meaning following Nirukta school.

Now coming to the instances cited, he cited only to specific usages from literary texts and not from any गणित texts for the use of कोटि in which he has the meaning crore or शतलक्षसंख्या. Now coming to the question of त्रयस्त्रिंशत् कोटिः for the देवता-s NUMBER, confused for meaning numeral word कोटि for the word 

 He now asked Yajnavalkya, ‘Yajnavalkya, are you indeed the best Vedic scholar among us ?’

 Yajnavalkya replied, ‘I bow to the best Vedic scholar, I just want the cows’. 

The above line is the guide line before any attempt to solve the riddle. The above conversation is between the Royal Scholar Asvala and the sage Yajnavalkya (the greatest of the philosophers who contributed to Shatapatha, and Brihadaranyaka). We can see the humbleness of Yajnavalkya and the royal voice of the interrogator. 

This being pointed out, I just attempt to have look at the problem with my limited knowledge. As the above passage has the possibility of the variable of numbers from one to one crore which is explained by the short expression in English "manifestation". Note it is the English translation and not the original word from the text.

As the statements in Vedic corpus are concerned, they could be explained away as "meaningless statements" and "self-contradictory" as put by Yaska, the extant commentary of the Vocabulary of Vedic corpus, " अनर्थका हि मन्त्राः १,१५"  "अथ अपि विप्रतिषिद्धार्था भवन्ति १,१५ः `` एक एव रुद्रो अवतस्थे न द्वितीयः `` असङ्ख्याता सहस्राणि ये रुद्रा अधि भूम्याम् "  and dismiss them as meaningless. On the other hand, we can reconcile them along with the traditional commentators after Yaska.

In the same way, the statements in Brihadaranyaka and Shatapatha have two different views to be reconciled. Otherwise, the same with the Upanishad-s also happen; there are mutually contradictory statements :

which once says सदेव सोम्य इदमग्र आसीत् .... and again the same poses  असद्वा इदमग्र्म आसीत् ततो वै सदजायत तदात्मान हुम स्वयमकुरुत तस्मात् तत सुकृतं उच्च्यते इति   

Now coming to the confusion about the word कोटि. It is used as numeral in mathematics and geometrical apex point in geometry. The second is literally used to refer to the highest point or supreme position in any field or group which could be interpreted as superiority. Now it is not seen used as adjective as guessed by the writer of the article to be interpreted as "The word कोटि should be interpreted as 'supreme, preeminent, excellent'.  Here is the extract of the entry in MW:

(H2) कोटि [p= 312,3][L=56458]f. the curved end of a bow or of claws , &c , end or top of anything , edge or point (of a sword) , horns or cusps (of the moon) MBh. &c[L=56459]the highest point , eminence , excellence Pan5cat. Ratna7v. Sarvad.[L=56460]" a point or side in an argument or disputation " , (if there are two) " alternative " » -द्वय below[L=56461]the highest number in the older system of numbers (viz. a Krore or ten millions) Mn. Ya1jn5. MBh. &c[L=56462]the complement of an arc to 90 degrees[L=56463]the perpendicular side of a right-angled triangle Su1ryas.[L=56464]Medicago esculenta L.

as can be seen in 

यदा यदा परां कोटिम् अभ्यारोहति यौवनम् / वल्गन्ति सरसाः कामास् तदा नाशाय केवलम् // योगवासिष्ठ//

This is the  position those who follow the dictionary and Classical Sanskrit for understanding the Vedic Passages. I cannot comment anything on the interpretation otherwise. But I have seen the basic गणदेवता are 33 which are grouped as named in the शतपथ. which later has become enlarged at the time अमरकोश listed them:

( १. १. १९) आदित्यविश्ववसवस्तुषिताभास्वरानिलाः॥  

१. १. २०) महाराजिकसाध्याश्च रुद्राश्च गणदेवताः॥

of which only three are enumerated आदित्य (१२) वसु(८) रुद्र (११) plus द्यावापृथिवी (२) = ३३

पुराण-s enumerate the remaining groups of देव-s.

"आदित्या विश्ववसवस्तुषिता भास्वरानिलाः।
महाराजिकसाध्याश्च रुद्राश्च गणदेवताः॥"

आदित्या द्वादश प्रोक्ता विश्वेदेवा दश स्मृताः।
वसवश्चाष्टसंख्याताः षट्त्रिंशत् तुषिता मताः॥
आभास्वराश्चतुः षष्टिर्वाताः पञ्चाशदूनकाः।
महाराजिकनामानो द्वे शते चापि विंशतिः॥
साध्या द्वादश विख्याता रुद्राश्चैकादश स्मृताः।
एते च संहता देवास्तत्रादित्याः स्वनामतः॥" इति जटाधरः

Anyhow, there is एकदेवतावाद and also अनेकदेवतावाद both variant views accepted in निरुक्त of यास्क who explains them. 

अयुतं प्रयुतं चैव शङ्कुं पद्मं तथार्बुदम्। 

खर्वं शङ्खं निखर्वं च महापद्मं च कोटयः।। 2-88-3a 2-88-3b. 

मध्यं चैव परार्धं च सपरं चात्र पण्यताम्। एतन्मम धनं 

The numerals listed for betting in the gambling. The exaggerated expression indicated by the word कोटि as in:

सेवार्थमागतास्तत्र ब्राह्माणी ब्रह्मकोटयः ।।
लक्ष्मीनारायणानां च कोटयः समुपागताः ।
गौरीकोटिसमेतानाम् रुद्राणां मपि कोटयः ।।
मन्त्रिणीदण्डिनीमुख्याः सेवार्थ याः समागताः ।
शक्तयो विविधाकारास्तासां संख्या न विद्यते ।।

Arvind asked for the association of त्रयस्त्रिंशत् wth the word  कोटयः or कोटि in usage confused for crore the numeral. and no where  in the article or any messages in reply it was not taken up. Only this can give guess for the confusion theory and not the existence of confused usage. Even the confusion could be with the superior state and not the adjective superior was meant for the word as claimed to be the real meaning in the article for which also no usage is found on a general search.

This is message is just in view of Aravindji's recent message. Otherwise, much has been said about the article in different messages and the different meanings from vedabase data has been offered recently from the Vedic usages for the वर्ड कोटि.

Thanks for all who contributed to the discussion of the topic.  

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Dr. Hari Narayana Bhat B.R. M.A., Ph.D.,
Research Scholar,

Ecole française d'Extrême-OrientCentre de Pondichéry

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