Fender Choice

[Zack]

Hey All -

Poked around with search and couldn't find anything.

I am about to get my Sam.  It's a 64 cm.  I am getting the Dureme 40's.  

I wanted to get the hammered honjo fenders, but am now thinking that they won't fit.  What do you guys think?  Anyone have the same/similar setup on a Sam that can comment on fit issues?  Suggestions?  

Appreciate all help in advance.  

Thanks!

[tomm]

Congrats on your new SH!

To my knowledge the largest hammered Honjos are only 43 mm wide. I
have a set on my AHH with 32 mm Marathons. They are just wide enough
to be fully functional. My Jack Browns or 35 mm Marathons "fit" but
aren't super functional in that the fender doesn't cover as well and
water sprays out the side. If you want metal fenders you might want
to consider the Berthoud 50 mm stainless fenders. I want to switch my
hammered Honjos for a pair of the 50 mm Berthouds since the Honjos
really do limit the size tire.

[Benedikt]

I've got some 700x32's tucked under VO's 45mm hammered fenders and
they fit fine on my Hillborne. I tried to fit a 40mm tire in there
and it was a no go so you would need larger then 45mm fenders. I took
a measurement of the frame and the front fork right around where my
fenders sit and it's about 50mm's of clearance. That leaves you with
limited choices. You might be able to modify a slightly larger fender
and still fit it in there.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/neutralbuoyancy/5472880725/in/set-72157607896493013/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/neutralbuoyancy/5782663355/in/set-72157607896493013/

[Benedikt]

VO's got some in 52mm although they aren't hammered.

On Jun 28, 11:33 pm, Benedikt <neutralbuoya...@comcast.net> wrote:
> I've got some 700x32's tucked under VO's 45mm hammered fenders and
> they fit fine on my Hillborne.  I tried to fit a 40mm tire in there
> and it was a no go so you would need larger then 45mm fenders.  I took
> a measurement of the frame and the front fork right around where my
> fenders sit and it's about 50mm's of clearance.  That leaves you with
> limited choices.  You might be able to modify a slightly larger fender
> and still fit it in there.
>

> http://www.flickr.com/photos/neutralbuoyancy/5472880725/in/set-721576...http://www.flickr.com/photos/neutralbuoyancy/5782663355/in/set-721576...

[Zack]

Solid, thank you!

I think it's going to come down to the Longboards vs. Berthouds then.  

[Ediblestarfish]

Here's my view on the SKS/Esge Longboard fenders.

I have 38mm Schwalbe 650b's on my 54cm AHH with 45mm SKS/Esge Longboard fenders.  Tight fit, but it works; not sure I would try it with 40mm tires.  Adjustment is pretty easy, but takes a long time to tweak it to precise tolerances so it stays centered. 

Main problem is that they are flexy and hit a resonant frequency under certain conditions that shake the whole bike.  E.g., at higher speeds, the gigantic flap at the bottom of the extended front fender would catch a lot of wind and start hitting the tire, which drove me nuts.  Quickly took the flaps off both fenders.  That helped, but didn't get rid of it entirely.

About the only thing I like about them is that they are relatively light, and don't get that 'twang' when you kick up pebbles.  I can move at relatively moderate or slow speeds without issues. 

I can't say this will happen to you, or anyone else, but I'm eying some metal fenders to see if it can reduce of eliminate the problems I have.

[Minh]

Just for reference i have 48mm (i'm pretty sure) fluted VO fenders and
i had to squeeze them at the chainstay a bit to get them to fit. I
think 50mm, you might need to snip a little bit off. on my fenders
i'm running 37mm tires that measure out closer to 35mm, i think 40mm
on mine would be tight, i think 37mm would be no problem.

[Zack]

I wonder if your experience with the longboards has to do with the fact that you are running 650s.  Either way, good to know.  

I think I am going to have riv build up the sam with the longboards, that way at least i have a set of fenders i know works (rather than having to snip metal/bend it at the chainstays, overall wrestle with them).  

The flaps are the ugliest thing about them, i considered taking them off and adding some leather or the sackville ones anyways.  The front cap thing with the branding is ugly too.  

[Zack]

Does anyone have experience running the 50mm Berthouds on a Sam?  Wondering if I'll have to modify the fender to get it to work.  Thanks in advance!  I am closing in on my delivery date for my first Riv, I can't wait.  

[Michael Hechmer]

Zach,  I suspect you are trying to mix apples and raspberries!  I have hammered honjos on my Rambouillet with 28 mm tires, and switched from fluted honjos to steel Vo's on my Ebisu with either 32s, 35s, or 38s (35 actual), and SKS on my '84 Trek 620, my wife's 83 Specialized Sequoia and our Bilenkey travel tandem. Although no contact with the SKS long board, that's a fair amount of experience, and here's what I have learned.

The Al. fenders are super light weight and work best on a rondonee or go fast, paved road bike.  They are less durable than other choices and will have more problems sooner if ridden constantly over rough roads.  They look great and have lasted 7 years on my Rambouillet.

Steel fenders are the heaviest, but also the sturdiest.  They will hold together the best under rough conditions, but, like Al. fenders they have a bead along the inside of the fender that restricts tire size (8mm) in a way that plastic fenders do not.  I went through 2 pairs of Al fenders  on my go everywhere Ebisu bike before switching to steel, which have held up very well.

Plastic fenders work really well when when you are trying to maximize tire size or (as I do with the tandem) fit them into a suitcase.  They don't rattle but they do get knocked out of alignment more easily than either Al or steel.  

Full length fenders, like my honjos or VO steel also create problems when you try to mount them to fork locked car racks, even the ATOK uplift.  But the standard SKS with a big honking mudflap will fit.

So, they are not as elegant looking but our tandem has standard SKS with a big flap that almost reaches the ground.

If you are wanting to run 40 mm tires, I'm guessing you want something to ride on more than new black top.  My rec. would be either steel or standard plastic with a big flap.

keep the rubber side down,

michael

Westford Vt, where the roads are dirt and horses out number people and bikes combined.

[PATRICK MOORE]

My experience with plastic, steel and aluminum fenders: plastic:
Zefal, SKS, Planet Bike, Gnahsbar; steel: Berthoud; Aluminum: Honjo
and Velo Orange.

Weight, with all hardware: Honjo, aluminuim, 559X50: 1 lb even.
Berthoud stainless steel, 584X 50: 1 1/2 lb even.
SKS, 559X50: 2 lb even.

I have not measured my apparently high-value 700X 622X 35 LeFols on the Herse.

Durability: The metals -- all of them, take your pick -- have been
much more rigid than the plastics -- all of them. The aluminum Honjos
were more dent resistant than the SS Berthouds, but cracked at the
rear brake bridge after about 3K miles, due I think to the tension I
had imposed on the rear to get a pretty curve. We'll see how long the
replacement Berthoud ss ones last.

BUT! I expect that good alums without pre-imposed stresses, might
indeed be the sturdiest of the lot: Jan Heine, who certainly puts on
the miles, seems to agree, tho' I can't find the reference -- it is
the Winter, 2010 issue of BQ, I think, that has excruciatingly
detailed and boring installation instructions for such fenders.

So: long windup to saying: don't discount the strength of good alum
fenders: properly installed they may well be the sturdiest kind
available.

Dunno how old the LeFols are; the Herse (at least frame + built-fer
front and rear racks) dates from 1958). And, for f***-it-all abuse, I
say, assert, maintain, proclaim, asseverate, project and insist that
good plastic fenders -- not loser Gnashbar or other off brands, but
true, genuine, red-blooded American Plant Bike and SKS (dammit! SKS
*are* ***American!!!***, in value and quality if not provenance!)
brands will probably stand up best to wholly egocentric,
dont-give-a-flying-*u** abuse.

Patrick "Berthoud Stainless 559X45; Velo Orange 622 X 35; PB 622X60;
LeFol 622X32 -- and many, many, MANY others before these" Moore

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Albuquerque, NM
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[Zack]

thank you for the rundown!

i am definitely leaning toward the SS 50mm Berthouds - the stainless seems to meet my needs best (looking good, long-lasting, etc)

anyone know if they will fit on a big new Sam?  

[Rob]

Nice summary Patrick. 

If you can find a pair, you might consider adding the Berthoud composite fenders to the mix of fenders to think about. I got a set a year ago from Peter White Cycles, which I mounted on my 650b Saluki running ~37mm Schwalbe Marathons, but it doesn't appear he's importing them now. Here's a link to them on the Berthoud site: http://www.gillesberthoud.fr/anglais/fiche_detaillee/fiche.php?refArticle=211PLA50

I think they're a bit lighter than the SKS/Esge composites because of the single set of aluminum stays (as opposed to double steel stays) and more important than the couple ounces or whatever difference in weight, they're visually less cluttered. Important on a bike that's already cluttered with racks n' such! :)

Here's the bike with the fenders: http://www.flickr.com/photos/robharrison/5337359747/in/set-72157624011191725/

They've held up really well. No rattles, resonances or any other issues. It's possible, because they don't have the bead around the edges like metal fenders, that they don't deflect water back to the inside as much as metal fenders, but I've no experience with metal fenders with which to compare, and I'm happy with the results they give.

Rob in Seattle

[PATRICK MOORE]

Nice bike, and thanks for the reference -- was not aware that Berthoud
made plastic ones. I've already broken a Honjo rear, as I said; we'll
see how long the present Berthoud ss ones last. If and when they
break, I will take a close look at the composites: better looking than
SKSes and if they use the single aluminum stay, better hardware. And,
they are nice and long.

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[Kelly Sleeper]

I just ordered 60mm for my Bomadil hoping to fit and cover the big apple. 700x50. Mainly I wanted extra length front to protect light.
Great info pat thanks for taking the time to type it all out.