Will you describe what the mission statement (for lack of a better
term) for this wiki is? Why would I edit at this address rather
than the wiki at lojban.org? What makes them different?
-Alan
On Mon, Sep 24, 2012 at 10:47:47AM -0700, la gleki wrote:
> Basically it's MediaWiki (the same engine as in Wikipedia). I also
> installed rss and wysiwyg (for editing a-la text processor) plugins.
> Let's test it.
This is a project I could really find myself getting behind, and I
also have some concerns. Would you, gleki, or someone else involved
be willing to discuss them with me?
* I'd like to hear at least a basic outline on the theory of why the
existing Lojban wiki got to it's current (rubbish?) state and what
will be different this time.
* Sort of to the same point: this community starts far more
projects than it finishes. This impacts the wiki, because a page
will get written but then becomes unmaintained and eventually
becomes part of the long tail of pages that are out of date but
still vaguely relevant. Is starting this wiki also a commitment
to curate it? Asked another way: is this project different from
the other projects that are started but not completed or
maintained?
* Last week I needed the redirect feature of Lojban's tiki software
enabled. I was able to contact Robin on IRC and ask him to enable
it, and he did so later than day. Who is the support person for
this wiki? Any idea of how responsive you'll be?
* I have several templates that I would like to use on this wiki.
They require the Cite and ParserFunctions extensions. Will the
support person add these extensions please? /me starts timer.
Thank you! I have made a deep investment in mediawiki and use it in
every other community I participate in. I'd love to see lojban.org
use this software, but I don't understand why it fixes and/or is
better than the current wiki.
Awesome Lindar, thank you for your replies.
I'd like to outline a problem I have right now and see how much
overlap there is with your ideas for this wiki.
I was recently invited to work on opencog[1]. Specifically I was
asked to modify my parser, jbogenturfa'i[2], to provide Lojban
abstract syntax trees to OpenCog to support the Natural Language
Processing (NLP) research happening there.
If I'm going to succeed in making Lojban part of OpenCog, I need to
provide reference quality context sensitive help for the grammar and
vocabulary so a researcher can make sense of what they're looking at,
above.
This could all be done with mediawiki: I essentially need a grammar
dictionary and grammar reference rolled into one, all linked together
using some templates.
Is this sort of thing compatible with what you have in mind? Something
I could use to programatically link parts of a Lojban abstract syntax
tree to pages that answer questions like "WTF is KOhA?"
-Alan
This is a project I could really find myself getting behind, and I
also have some concerns. Would you, gleki, or someone else involved
be willing to discuss them with me?
* I'd like to hear at least a basic outline on the theory of why the
existing Lojban wiki got to it's current (rubbish?) state and what
will be different this time.
* Sort of to the same point: this community starts far more
projects than it finishes. This impacts the wiki, because a page
will get written but then becomes unmaintained and eventually
becomes part of the long tail of pages that are out of date but
still vaguely relevant. Is starting this wiki also a commitment
to curate it? Asked another way: is this project different from
the other projects that are started but not completed or
maintained?
* Last week I needed the redirect feature of Lojban's tiki software
enabled. I was able to contact Robin on IRC and ask him to enable
it, and he did so later than day. Who is the support person for
this wiki? Any idea of how responsive you'll be?
* I have several templates that I would like to use on this wiki.
They require the Cite and ParserFunctions extensions. Will the
support person add these extensions please? /me starts timer.
Awesome Lindar, thank you for your replies.
I'd like to outline a problem I have right now and see how much
overlap there is with your ideas for this wiki.
I was recently invited to work on opencog[1]. Specifically I was
asked to modify my parser, jbogenturfa'i[2], to provide Lojban
abstract syntax trees to OpenCog to support the Natural Language
Processing (NLP) research happening there.
I believe that using Lojban for NLP research makes certain classes of
NLP problems go away, allowing you to focus on other potentially more
fruitful classes of problems instead. The hypothesis is that these
other classes of problems, once explored and perhaps even solved, make
the first class of problems more tractable.
"assert(Lojban == NLP bootstrap)", if you will.
Awesome Lindar, thank you for your replies.I'm just Regular Lindar. Awesome Lindar is on holiday after translating an entire game in a week.I'd like to outline a problem I have right now and see how much
overlap there is with your ideas for this wiki.My ideas stop at, "It'd be neat if I could update the news on the front page of lojban.org without having to permanently erase the old news or do crazy shit like that. Also I understand MediaWiki mark-up better than whatever crap this is. I'd actually make/edit pages if we used... pretty much anything else.". I'm not doing any of the work, design, etc. I'm very loosely supervising the project by fiat. Anybody is welcome to challenge me for supervisory.
iesk
Thank you. I have three questions. What sort of things should I write in that wiki? How do I say 'What sort of things should I write in that wiki?' (or a less non-native rephrasing) in Lojban? Are you going to copy the lojban.org tiki into the wiki for a start? (I don't know if there is a tikiwiki-mediawiki converter or what not.)
iesk
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/jHR5HmxdY4kJ.
Thank you. I have three questions. What sort of things should I write in that wiki? How do I say 'What sort of things should I write in that wiki?' (or a less non-native rephrasing) in Lojban? Are you going to copy the lojban.org tiki into the wiki for a start?
(I don't know if there is a tikiwiki-mediawiki converter or what not.)iesk
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
You have to go here: http://www.lojban.overt-ops.com/index.php?title=Template:Ralju to edit that text.
Lindar's a member of the LLG? I remember the suggestion coming up and for another person too, but I don't remember it happening.
kozmikreis
What does the logo in the upper left part of the screen stand for? Oh, and the opening page is currently filled with some non-Lojban text. Maybe the standard propaganda ( http://www.lojban.org/tiki/la%20lojban.%20mo?no_bl=y ) would be fitting?
iesk
Thank you for the clarification.What does the logo in the upper left part of the screen stand for?
Oh, and the opening page is currently filled with some non-Lojban text. Maybe the standard propaganda ( http://www.lojban.org/tiki/la%20lojban.%20mo?no_bl=y ) would be fitting?
iesk
2. Not only I should have sftp access to that root folder (who is familiar with MediaWiki? Whom can we trust?)3. I haven't found appropriate extension to localise wiki pages on the fly like it is done in Tiki.
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/2qiOP1A6weoJ.
Has anyone visited the website of the conlang toki pona?
http://tokipona.net/tp/ClassicWordList.aspx
Not overwhelming impressing but quite nice. I like their kind of hieroglyphs .ui.
I really like the idea of having a better website for lojban .ausai
I'm not a computer programmer, I often feel a bit limited when I discuss things in english (no one out there who can translate from swedish to english for me? ;)
, I don't have much time (but I really like constructing lujvos (systematically; subject by subject), so I'm probably going to contribute in that way a loot in the future).
Anyhow, I've just got some proposals for your project. The most of it sounds awesome, but here what comes to my mind:
* I think it's important with a very esthetic, clear and distinct layout, so visitors easily find the information they're looking for and also having a good impression of the lojban language (and community). I really must say that the current lojban.org doesn't looks rather dull :(
* What I really would like to have is a list of all lojban projects, current status (completed, almost completed but open for editing, suggested but not yet started etc), project last updated-info, click to become a member in the respectively project group, project cathegories like translation projects, technical projects, social projects, vocabulary, vote for how important you think each project is etc. It is very important to get an overview of the status of the whole lojban devolopment I think.
* Forum with distinct cathegories/subjects, instead of the mailing list.
I don't think if all this is possible to work out, but this is my vision of what the lojbanic internet community ba se binxo.
How do you say "good luck" in lojban?
On Saturday, November 10, 2012 10:36:58 PM UTC+4, jongausib wrote:I really like the idea of having a better website for lojban .ausai
I'm not a computer programmer, I often feel a bit limited when I discuss things in english (no one out there who can translate from swedish to english for me? ;).e'u mi'o tavla bau lo jbobau vau u'iru'e, I don't have much time (but I really like constructing lujvos (systematically; subject by subject), so I'm probably going to contribute in that way a loot in the future).
Anyhow, I've just got some proposals for your project. The most of it sounds awesome, but here what comes to my mind:
* I think it's important with a very esthetic, clear and distinct layout, so visitors easily find the information they're looking for and also having a good impression of the lojban language (and community). I really must say that the current lojban.org doesn't looks rather dull :(So is it dull or not dull?
* What I really would like to have is a list of all lojban projects, current status (completed, almost completed but open for editing, suggested but not yet started etc), project last updated-info, click to become a member in the respectively project group, project cathegories like translation projects, technical projects, social projects, vocabulary, vote for how important you think each project is etc. It is very important to get an overview of the status of the whole lojban devolopment I think.Everything that you just said is not a programmer's work. The "programmer" 's work has already been done.Just register and start developing the wiki.Everything that is true for Wikipedia is true for our LMW so if you have some problems you can contact Wikipedia developers (there are plenty of them on the planet) and then implement it's features in LMW. If you need extra administrative rights just inform me.
* Forum with distinct cathegories/subjects, instead of the mailing list.Probably although i'm against splitting the community into separate forums. On the other hand, the more lojbanic places the better.
I don't think if all this is possible to work out, but this is my vision of what the lojbanic internet community ba se binxo.
How do you say "good luck" in lojban?di'aiAnd again many suggestions, no actual work.i mutce lo ka lojbo fadni vau uinai
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/rZnI8czUylgJ.
On Saturday, November 10, 2012 10:36:58 PM UTC+4, jongausib wrote:I really like the idea of having a better website for lojban .ausai
I'm not a computer programmer, I often feel a bit limited when I discuss things in english (no one out there who can translate from swedish to english for me? ;).e'u mi'o tavla bau lo jbobau vau u'iru'e, I don't have much time (but I really like constructing lujvos (systematically; subject by subject), so I'm probably going to contribute in that way a loot in the future).
Anyhow, I've just got some proposals for your project. The most of it sounds awesome, but here what comes to my mind:
* I think it's important with a very esthetic, clear and distinct layout, so visitors easily find the information they're looking for and also having a good impression of the lojban language (and community). I really must say that the current lojban.org doesn't looks rather dull :(So is it dull or not dull?dull
* What I really would like to have is a list of all lojban projects, current status (completed, almost completed but open for editing, suggested but not yet started etc), project last updated-info, click to become a member in the respectively project group, project cathegories like translation projects, technical projects, social projects, vocabulary, vote for how important you think each project is etc. It is very important to get an overview of the status of the whole lojban devolopment I think.Everything that you just said is not a programmer's work. The "programmer" 's work has already been done.Just register and start developing the wiki.Everything that is true for Wikipedia is true for our LMW so if you have some problems you can contact Wikipedia developers (there are plenty of them on the planet) and then implement it's features in LMW. If you need extra administrative rights just inform me.Ok, I'll check it out. Could you give me administrative rights please and I'll see what I can do.
> The wiki has moved to http://mw.lojban.org/
Does this mean we're officially moving to MediaWiki?
Is it ok to migrate an entire page from TikiWiki, leaving a "This page has moved to ..." message there?
Does this mean we're officially moving to MediaWiki?No!Is it ok to migrate an entire page from TikiWiki, leaving a "This page has moved to ..." message there?No! Copy them, don't move them for now. Don't touch the old wiki for now.The answer is pretty simple. If we show that we are active and able to improve the quality of lojbanic wikithen I'm sure we will officially move. What lojbanistan consists of if not of active jbopre?
But if we appear to be lazy, inactive then the answer is "do not rock the boat! Leave everything as it is!"However, as at least two active people (lindar and J Camaron) were dissapointed with the current wikiI wanna urge you to develop this wiki so that normal people, not only geeks can start styudying and enjoying this language.
P.S. If anybody can theoretically migrate the whole Twiki to Mediawiki using some script please inform me.
Pages for geeks can always be moved under "Discussions" tab as it is accepted in Wikipedia. (Twiki lacks this feature).
mu'o
I agree. The focus of this new wiki should be the promotion on works in Lojban and the indication of where to find learning resources. We should aim to make it as user-friendly and up to date as possible (the old wiki's dead links can be a pain) so that nintadni will have an easy time learning the language. We should try to promote the community as being warm and open.
What I think would be neat is that we could try maintaining some kind of roster of jbopre, with self-reported levels of proficiency, activity in the community, and a list of works produced or other community contributions.
What I think would be neat is that we could try maintaining some kind of roster of jbopre, with self-reported levels of proficiency, activity in the community, and a list of works produced or other community contributions.Probably this is realised through additional templates. It's absolutely not a problem provided that you give me some links to Mediawiki-based (i.e. ~ looking the same as Wikipedia) web-sittes that have such feature. Then I'll do the rest of work to import that feature too LMW.
On Tue, Nov 13, 2012 at 04:21:14AM -0800, la gleki wrote:
> * We're making a fresh start, so why not keep it clean?
I've put a lot of work in writing and organizing TWiki pages. I'm
happy to have them migrated to mediawiki, but I'm more-or-less being
told that the work I've done on TWiki isn't valuable ("fresh start").
Basically it's MediaWiki (the same engine as in Wikipedia). I also installed rss and wysiwyg (for editing a-la text processor) plugins.Let's test it.What would you like to see in it? What to change in formatting of pages?
Let me see if I understand:
1) you create a new platform and obsolete the work I've done.
2) you make it my problem that my data isn't available.
There is a ‘bug’ (or inconvenience): The wiki seems to be set up in English.
So, the menu is in English if you are not logged in.
And, what’s worse, it seems that to-be-translated pages can only be created in English, so the software considers all other language versions as translations from the English, which is probably very bad, and certainly bad looking in what I think/hope is going to be a Lojbanic wiki for everybody.
I'm 100% onboard with improving the user experience of our wiki: I
find the TWiki frustrating in that regard too. I'm not certain what
tools mediawiki gives us to mitigate this problem: it's a function
of the content rather than the platform [snip]
Here's what I've learned about the current Tiki Wiki: it has 2,363 articles. You can see a full list of them here: http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-listpages.php
Here's what I've learned about the current Tiki Wiki: it has 2,363 articles. You can see a full list of them here: http://www.lojban.org/tiki/tiki-listpages.phpWhat I can't seem to do is get a full "dump" (export) of the articles. It might be that the feature isn't turned on by the administrator. Instructions for doing so are here: http://doc.tiki.org/Wiki+Config#DumpsThere is a python script (http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:TikiWiki_Conversion) which converts TikiWiki dumps to MediaWiki XML files. It requires the dumped .tar file; also requires MySQL access to the Tiki server to "create an XML dump of the metadata for the Tiki images". The instructions for doing so are on the page linked in this paragraph.Now that I've fooled with the MediaWiki translate feature a little bit, I see that it is kind of finicky, and it defaults to English, and that, for example, "ralju_ckupau/en" means the same thing as "ralju_ckupau" (except that the article title does not depend exclusively on the URL in the "/en" version).
A bit chaotic perhaps, but less demanding for users/editors, I believe.
-iesk
- setting the default (= menu display and so on) language to Lojban (logged in users may be able to change it for themselves);
Please, no.
I have no time and lousy net access until at least Thursday, may give my reasons later. If Joe-Newbie voices count in any way, please count mine as a 'no' to defining another (budding) Lojban environment as English-centric.
-iesk
mu'o
mi'e .alyn.
--
.i ma'a lo bradi cu penmi gi'e du
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
$wgCapitalLinkOverrides[ NS_FILE ] = false;
Hi!
I am a project admin for Tiki and I'd like to share some information.
1- On this list, some refer to Twiki and some to Tiki. These are two distinct projects.
Tiki Wiki CMS Groupware (or just Tiki) is in PHP http://tiki.org
Twiki is in Perl http://twiki.org
It's important that you know this, so if you do some research and comparison, you'll be looking at the right tool.
2- Changing tools takes time & energy and data is lost. What features are you missing in Tiki?
Tiki has been for several years now, the Free and Open Source Web Application with the most built-in features
http://tiki.org/FOSS+Web+Application+with+the+most+built-in+features
Let me repeat that to be very clear. Of all the web applications in the World, Tiki is the FOSS web app with the most built-in features. Chances are, what you need/want is just a checkbox away. You can use for much more than just a wiki but everything to do with the community (forums, blog, calendar, issue/task tracker, etc.)
2a) "I can't embed pictures on tiki pages like on MediaWiki" -> embedding pictures exists, just need to activate. All wikis handle pictures! And coming to Tiki10 (now in Alpha): the World's first full-featured both Open Source and Web-based screencasting solution: http://doc.tiki.org/Screencast Not only can it take a snapshot of your desktop, you can even draw on the image, or even record your screen with audio! Having audio recordings of Lojban terms in wiki pages would be cool, no?
2b) "MediaWiki seems to provide better editing support and, most importantly, a place to shove all of our discussions"
Tiki has:
http://doc.tiki.org/Comments
http://doc.tiki.org/Inline+comments
Please let me know what better editing support you need.
The wiki toolbar (with buttons for bold, italic, etc.) is not activated on lojban.org Go try demo.tiki.org to see what it's like normally.
http://doc.tiki.org/Toolbar
2c) "fresh start"
Tiki has a powerful category system. You could categorize all pages, and from the category, have a different theme or permissions. So eventually, old pages can be kept but not visible by anonymous users.
http://doc.tiki.org/Category
This permits a fresh start without the risk of duplicating data.
3- Tiki has superb multilingual handling. It's all detailed here:
http://wiki-translation.com/tiki-download_wiki_attachment.php?attId=55&download=y
I challenge anyone to find a more advanced system. I presented several times, including at the latest WikiMania:
https://wikimania2012.wikimedia.org/wiki/Submissions/Cross-lingual_Wiki_Engine
No one has anything like this. Wikipedia has a different instance for each language. This makes it difficult to do content tracking, although they have a system to track the corresponding page-link in the other language. But this means that you need to add a new MediaWiki instance for each language. In Tiki, you just add a page, and no extra work is needed to add a new language.
4- Here is an example of a community than went from MediaWiki to Tiki, to have more features:
http://www.ogre3d.org/tikiwiki/Ogre+Wiki+Help
Not only is Tiki the web app with the most built-in features, no other major CMS / Web app has released more major versions in the last 4 year:
* 2009-05: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki3 LTS
* 2009-11: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki4
* 2010-06: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki5
* 2010-11: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki6 LTS
* 2011-06: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki7
* 2011-11: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki8
* 2012-06: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki9 LTS
* 2012-11: http://doc.tiki.org/Tiki10 (in alpha at the moment)
To be fair, WordPress also had 8 major releases during the same approximative time frame (http://wordpress.org/about/roadmap/). More recently than Tiki, Typo3 and Joomla! have moved to a 6-month release cycle. But in all these cases, with their extension-based model, not all features are ready at the same time. And sometimes, extensions are never ported to the next version. Thanks to the Tiki model, we have inherent synchronized releases
http://tiki.org/Model#Inherent_synchronized_releases
With over 50% of browser usage on the rapid release cycle (Chrome and Firefox), it makes perfect sense for web applications to have a rapid release cycle as well. Tiki is well positioned to take advantage of all the innovations! However, some people are happy with the current feature set, and Long Term Support (LTS) versions were introduced in 2009, and more recently, we doubled the support period: http://info.tiki.org/Version+Lifecycle
Tiki turned 10 years old last month
http://info.tiki.org/article201-A-Decade-of-Tiki
Tiki reached 500 contributors with commit access (top project on SourceForge.net)
http://info.tiki.org/article188-Tiki-reaches-500-contributors-with-commit-access
Listen to the podcast!
Tiki Passed 1 Million Downloads
http://info.tiki.org/article192-Tiki-Passes-1-Million-Downloads
Tiki wins People's Choice: Best Free CMS of the CMS Critic's awards
https://info.tiki.org/article206-Tiki-wins-People-s-Choice-Best-Free-CMS
Tiki was named best "Best Web Tool" by WebHostingSearch.com
http://info.tiki.org/article197-Tiki-Named-Best-Web-Tool
And for previous news, see 2011 Year in Review:
http://info.tiki.org/article181-2011-Year-in-Review
I think you'll agree: it's pretty impressive!
And Tiki has features that MediaWiki will never have.
There is also the Interactive Translation feature: http://doc.tiki.org/Interactive+Translation
This permits web-based, in-context translations of the interface. So community members can translate not only the content but also the app to Lojban!
So I suggest:
1- Make a list of what you want
2- Upgrade Tiki to latest version (your version seems to be 2 years old)
3- Then, decide to keep or change.
Best regards,
M ;-)
PS. Below is a copy-paste of a generic list of Top Reasons to Use Tiki:
- A confident and future-proof choice :
- Over a million downloads and counting
- Tiki has been nominated for, and received, several awards
- Uses top-notch Underlying technologies:
- A vibrant community
- IRC chat room, discussion forums, documentation, etc.
- If you want hired help, or want to offer services, there is a Tiki Service Provider program
- Tiki is a community recursively building a community management system, which is called Dogfooding
- Tons of features:
- Over 1,500 unique features/options making it the Free and Open Source Web Application with the most built-in features
- Ideal for most use cases, such as Collaboration, Publishing, Commerce, Social networking, Office productivity tools, E-learning, etc.
- Has the breadth and depth to most likely address your specific needs as it has been developed through the collaborative work of hundreds of contributors for over 10 years.
- Features are built-in
- No need to research, choose, download and install additional modules/extensions/plugins: There is no feature duplication. All the features are built-in, collaboratively maintained by the community, so you avoid the pain of abandoned modules/plugins/extensions.
- Everything works with everything: The whole community collaborates on the features instead of having modules/extensions/plugins which may have incompatibilities. Turn everything on and it will work. Try that with modules/extensions/plugins!
![]()
- Quick timely upgrades: When a new version of Tiki comes out, you can upgrade right away and all the features are available.
- Interoperable:
- Open Collaboration: If you need a new feature, join the community and let's work together. If you are a developer, check out How to get commit access
- Innovation: For the latest and greatest and quick access to new features, use the rapid release cycle, with 2 new major releases per year. No other major web applications has had more major releases since 2008. On average, developers update the code (with new features and fixes) over a dozen times every day.
- Stability: For a super stable system with very few changes: Use the Long Term Support (LTS) versions, which is supported for 3.5 years.
- Easy install: You can use the 1-click installers. All the features, languages, etc. are available in the basic install.
- Easy to configure : All features/options are activated from the web-based control panel.
- Adaptable: By default, only a small number of basic, commonly-used features appear in the control panel. As your needs grow, you can also display advanced and experimental features/options.
- Easy upgrades: Upgrade from any past version to any supported version in one step. (so you can upgrade from 2.x to 15.x)
- No need to deal with diverse release dates of core software vs modules/plugins/extensions
- No lock-in: Community supported, no single vendor.
- Free: free & open source software, licensed as LGPL.
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/lH2tnZE8HmAJ.
To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
It's not a question of if the default language is English or not. It's a question of whether we present a Lojban-only page to a newcomer. I think showing a Lojbanic interface and Lojban-only content to a newcomer is not friendly.
If the primary language is Lojban, are you, doi la gleki. .e la .iesk., fine with importing all the pages from TWiki to LMW? Lots of them are in English.
ni'oI'm holding off any work I said or hinted I'd be doing (working on the community portal and migrating) until I get a clear picture of what the site organization is going to be [1]:* Who is the target audience?
* What content will it have, in what language?
As far as I understand, there are two interests at hand:* Target audience: Lojban speakers* Content: Anything in Lojban? / Translation projects, Lojbanic writings, Lojbanists index* Target audience: Lojban learners* Content: Learning materials in English and other languages around the worldIf this is the case, I think it's not out of the question to maintain two separate wikis for each: lojban.org and ckule.lojban.org.
In MediaWiki, there is a way to share the extensions folder and such to lessen the admininstrative task. If there are corresponding pages between the two, they can be linked to each other in the way Wikipedia links pages in other languages.Any thoughts?[1] This is partly an excuse to focus my time on helping CLL1.1; I'm not a good multitasker.
mu'o
It's not a question of if the default language is English or not. It's a question of whether we present a Lojban-only page to a newcomer. I think showing a Lojbanic interface and Lojban-only content to a newcomer is not friendly.
If the primary language is Lojban, are you, doi la gleki. .e la .iesk., fine with importing all the pages from TWiki to LMW? Lots of them are in English.
ni'oI'm holding off any work I said or hinted I'd be doing (working on the community portal and migrating) until I get a clear picture of what the site organization is going to be [1]:* Who is the target audience?* What content will it have, in what language?As far as I understand, there are two interests at hand:* Target audience: Lojban speakers* Content: Anything in Lojban? / Translation projects, Lojbanic writings, Lojbanists index* Target audience: Lojban learners* Content: Learning materials in English and other languages around the world
Le samedi 1 décembre 2012 01:03:26 UTC+1, entot a écrit :It's not a question of if the default language is English or not. It's a question of whether we present a Lojban-only page to a newcomer. I think showing a Lojbanic interface and Lojban-only content to a newcomer is not friendly.(I guess its 'friendlier' than piping interested people through English when it isn't necessary.)
If the primary language is Lojban, are you, doi la gleki. .e la .iesk., fine with importing all the pages from TWiki to LMW? Lots of them are in English.
Since I have so far not contributed anything useful to LMW, my opinion does not weigh much.
I repeat that my idea of the wiki was that there be no 'primary language' for content pages. Everybody would write pages in the language(s) of their preference. I don't think it likely that there will be systematic translations of all LMW pages in all LMW languages (whichever that may be). Most content will probably be in English anyway (TWiki imports included), who would translate all that stuff? So why not have a page in, say, French, link to relevant pages in, say, English, Lojban, … I have been arguing *against* any primary language, because that would, to my understanding, mean that you have to write (or wait for somebody to write) a page about 'broda' in the primary language before you can add a page about 'broda' in the language that you want.
Unfortunately I have no idea of a mechanism of creating a wiki without any primary language.
Earlier today I was having a technical issue with translating -- basically, after editing and saving a "message" in the translation interface, a dialog box would pop up with a "tpt-unknown-page" error. However, now the problem has disappeared and translating works again, so I'm not sure what caused it.Another problem, as I try to add a new page, is that I can't upload images (specifically, I'm trying to add standard Wikimedia message box images, such as the "!" information bubble and a pencil-and-paper icon). Upon clicking the "Upload" button at the bottom, I get:Upload Warning: Could not create directory "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/7/7e".Many people seem to think that it's a problem with folder write permissions. There is discussion here: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Thread:Project:Support_desk/Trouble_uploading_after_installation
On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:10:34 AM UTC+4, vruxir wrote:Earlier today I was having a technical issue with translating -- basically, after editing and saving a "message" in the translation interface, a dialog box would pop up with a "tpt-unknown-page" error. However, now the problem has disappeared and translating works again, so I'm not sure what caused it.Another problem, as I try to add a new page, is that I can't upload images (specifically, I'm trying to add standard Wikimedia message box images, such as the "!" information bubble and a pencil-and-paper icon). Upon clicking the "Upload" button at the bottom, I get:Upload Warning: Could not create directory "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/7/7e".Many people seem to think that it's a problem with folder write permissions. There is discussion here: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Thread:Project:Support_desk/Trouble_uploading_after_installationThe fact is that those directories have already been 777-ised. Earlier we could upload images. I really don't know what happened.
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/-zJ25Ymxw20J.
To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.
On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 2:32 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:10:34 AM UTC+4, vruxir wrote:Earlier today I was having a technical issue with translating -- basically, after editing and saving a "message" in the translation interface, a dialog box would pop up with a "tpt-unknown-page" error. However, now the problem has disappeared and translating works again, so I'm not sure what caused it.Another problem, as I try to add a new page, is that I can't upload images (specifically, I'm trying to add standard Wikimedia message box images, such as the "!" information bubble and a pencil-and-paper icon). Upon clicking the "Upload" button at the bottom, I get:Upload Warning: Could not create directory "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/7/7e".Many people seem to think that it's a problem with folder write permissions. There is discussion here: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Thread:Project:Support_desk/Trouble_uploading_after_installationThe fact is that those directories have already been 777-ised. Earlier we could upload images. I really don't know what happened.
It's possible that some recent changed modified the permissions and they need to be +w again.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/lojban/-/y5svWYKJWGUJ.
To post to this group, send email to loj...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+un...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.