This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
mu'o
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I don't understand. What's a cfika?his
On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wrote:On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika2, for
> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be -- a work
of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibly many
other things). Consider:
la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a girl --
it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could possibly mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wrote:On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika2, for
> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be -- a work
of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibly many
other things). Consider:
la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a girl --
it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could possibly mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
Well, may be it's not that something is wrong with {sera'a/pe/srana} but rather wrong usage and/or glossing.srana x1 pertains to/is germane/relevant to/concerns/is related/associated with/is about x2.ckini x1 is related to/associated with/akin to x2 by relationship x3.If we arbitrarily chose parts of those definitions we'd get
srana x1 is relevant to x2
ckini x1 is relevant to x2
which is nonsense.
If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.mu'o
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 11:09 PM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wrote:On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika2, for
> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be -- a work
of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibly many
other things). Consider:
la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a girl --
it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could possibly mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
Well, may be it's not that something is wrong with {sera'a/pe/srana} but rather wrong usage and/or glossing.srana x1 pertains to/is germane/relevant to/concerns/is related/associated with/is about x2.ckini x1 is related to/associated with/akin to x2 by relationship x3.If we arbitrarily chose parts of those definitions we'd get
srana x1 is relevant to x2
ckini x1 is relevant to x2
which is nonsense.
ckini wouldn't be that. For one thing, you left out the x3, and for another, it isn't "relevant", it's "related". The Cold War isn't relevant to WWII, but it is related (by being a direct result of it).
If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 11:09 PM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wrote:On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika2, for
> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be -- a work
of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibly many
other things). Consider:
la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a girl --
it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could possibly mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
Well, may be it's not that something is wrong with {sera'a/pe/srana} but rather wrong usage and/or glossing.srana x1 pertains to/is germane/relevant to/concerns/is related/associated with/is about x2.ckini x1 is related to/associated with/akin to x2 by relationship x3.If we arbitrarily chose parts of those definitions we'd get
srana x1 is relevant to x2
ckini x1 is relevant to x2
which is nonsense.
ckini wouldn't be that. For one thing, you left out the x3, and for another, it isn't "relevant", it's "related". The Cold War isn't relevant to WWII, but it is related (by being a direct result of it).
If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
(Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing as whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For example, {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters should use zo'e instead.)
(Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing as whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For example, {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters should use zo'e instead.)
I think the CLL says almost the same.If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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Roosevelt is pertinent to the Great Depression, but he is most certainly /not/ the topic of it.
(Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing as whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For example, {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters should use zo'e instead.)
I think the CLL says almost the same.If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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FWIW, I define {srana} in lojban as follows:{.i lo ka ce'u srana ce'u cu ka ce'u bu'a ce'u}And actually being able to say *what* that bu'a is is what led me to a post much earlier about "srana3", which indeed, I now realise, would make {srana} essentially identical to {ckini}.(With a srana3, the definition becomes {.i lo ka ce'u srana ce'u cu ka ce'u ce'u me'au ce'u})Thus, I currently believe that srana can be defined in terms of ckini as such:{.i lo ka ce'u srana ce'u cu ka ce'u ce'u ckini lo ka co'e}Things that are relevant to each other are simply related by an obvious relationship.
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How do you get "is dedicated to" out of "is related to"?
Besides, someone was trying to say that a more-than-five-letter word meaos "dedicate". How is that possible, when it's not a gismu?
On 3 Gru, 05:15, Jonathan Jones <eyeo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 3:33 PM, Annie <park.an...@asb.gaggle.net> wrote:I think you're confusing "brivla" and "selbri" here. There are no
> > How do you get "is dedicated to" out of "is related to"?
>
> I'd like to know that myself.
>
> > Besides, someone was trying to say that a more-than-five-letter word meaos
> > "dedicate". How is that possible, when it's not a gismu?
>
> I think you're confusing "brivla" and "gismu" here. Firstly, gismu are not
> the only words in Lojban that mean something. Every native and most
> borrowed words have some kind of meaning. Secondly, there are many
> different kinds of brivla besides gismu, tanru, lujvo, and fu'ivla being
> the most common, but there are other types I don't feel like getting into
> (, like the kind that use {me}).
brivla besides gismu, lujvo and fu'ivla. tanru is not a word, so it's
not a predicate word.
I also think that lojban-beginners is an awful place to start learning
Lojban. L4B or wave lessons would be much better, but I don't know
about their accessibility for blind people.
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mu'o
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I don't think {nu} is good for describing relationships, rather {ka}.
When in doubt, you can always use {su'u}. I get the feeling that {nu}
is somewhat overused.
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On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 1:34 AM, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:I don't think {nu} is good for describing relationships, rather {ka}.
When in doubt, you can always use {su'u}. I get the feeling that {nu}
is somewhat overused.
{nu} is the NU equivalent of {lo}. It's never wrong.
On 5 Gru, 10:43, Jonathan Jones <eyeo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 1:34 AM, ianek <jane...@gmail.com> wrote:No. {su'u} is the NU equivalent of {lo}: generalized abstractor (how);
> > I don't think {nu} is good for describing relationships, rather {ka}.
> > When in doubt, you can always use {su'u}. I get the feeling that {nu}
> > is somewhat overused.
>
> {nu} is the NU equivalent of {lo}. It's never wrong.
x1 is [bridi] as a non-specific abstraction of type x2
{nu} is "generalized event abstractor; x1 is state/process/achievement/
activity of [bridi]."
That means, {nu} can stand for each of: {za'i}, {pu'e}, {mu'u},
{zu'o}, maybe {li'i} (but I doubt that; experience is not an event),
but not for {du'u}, {jei}, {ka}, {ni}, {si'o} and of course {su'u},
which is more general.
On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 5:22 AM, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:On 5 Gru, 10:43, Jonathan Jones <eyeo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 1:34 AM, ianek <jane...@gmail.com> wrote:No. {su'u} is the NU equivalent of {lo}: generalized abstractor (how);
> > I don't think {nu} is good for describing relationships, rather {ka}.
> > When in doubt, you can always use {su'u}. I get the feeling that {nu}
> > is somewhat overused.
>
> {nu} is the NU equivalent of {lo}. It's never wrong.
x1 is [bridi] as a non-specific abstraction of type x2
{nu} is "generalized event abstractor; x1 is state/process/achievement/
activity of [bridi]."
That means, {nu} can stand for each of: {za'i}, {pu'e}, {mu'u},
{zu'o}, maybe {li'i} (but I doubt that; experience is not an event),
but not for {du'u}, {jei}, {ka}, {ni}, {si'o} and of course {su'u},
which is more general.
Hey, I'm just telling you how it is. I'm not saying that {nu} should be the default, it just happens to be that it IS.
la'o gy. Jonathan Jones .gy cu cusku di'eNo, it's not. You're wrong. Why can't you accept that even after several people have shown you that you're wrong? You're providing the beginners that this list is dedicated to with misinformation.
Hey, I'm just telling you how it is. I'm not saying that {nu} should be
the default, it just happens to be that it IS.
{nu} is not the default, so it's *not* always right. You can't djuno a nu, nor can you zenba a nu.
mu'o mi'e la selpa'i
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pilno zo le xu .i lo dei bangu cu se cmene zo lojbo je nai zo lejbo
doị mèlbi mlenì'u
.i do càtlu ki'u
ma fe la xàmpre ŭu
.i do tìnsa càrmi
gi je sìrji se tàrmi
.i taị bo da'i pu cìtka lo gràna ku
.
.
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la Jonathan Jones cu cusku di'eOut of curiosity, what makes you think that it's the current state of the language? What are you basing this claim on?
As I said, I'm not saying that I agree with it, nor am I saying I think
it's correct. What I AM saying is that that is how it is, regardless of
whether it makes sense, regardless of what the definitions of the
various NU are, and regardless of whether it should be something else.
That said, I do happen to agree with you. That, however, is not my
point. This is not my opinion, it is the current state of the language.
mu'o mi'e la selpa'i
--
pilno zo le xu .i lo dei bangu cu se cmene zo lojbo je nai zo lejbo
doị mèlbi mlenì'u
.i do càtlu ki'u
ma fe la xàmpre ŭu
.i do tìnsa càrmi
gi je sìrji se tàrmi
.i taị bo da'i pu cìtka lo gràna ku
.
.
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mu'o
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Here's a hypothetical example of why I don't agree that srana "x1 is pertinent/relevant to x2" could be used to mean "dedicated to":
Let us say that I wrote a book, and upon its being published, I gave it the dedication "To my wife, for putting up with me as I wrote this". Then is would be true that
{lo mi cukta cu ckini lo mi speni lodu'u ca nu mi ciska ku sy. se fanza mi}.
However, other than the dedication, my wife has nothing to do with the book- the story contained within has absolutely nothing to do with my wife in any way, except in that she may find it enjoyable to read, which has nothing to do with the decision to dedicate it to her, and so
{lo mi cukta cu na srana lo mi speni},
it's in no way pertinent to/relevant to/concerning/about my wife.
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
cfikax1 is a work of fiction about plot or theme x2 by author x3ciksix1 explains x2 to x3 with explanation x4cilrex1 learns x2 about x3 from x4 by methodctucax1 teaches to x2 ideas x3 about subject x4 by method x5djunox1 knows fact x2 about x3 by epistemology x4dracix1 is a drama or play about x2 by x3 for audience x4 with actors x4fackix1 discovers x2 about x3jdicex1 makes decision x2 about x3jimpex1 understands x2 about x3morjix1 remembers x2 about subject x3And my question isWhy memorising so many places when they could be replaced by a BAI formed from a hypothetical brivlabroda = x1 is the theme/topic of x2; x2 is about x1
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la Jonathan Jones cu cusku di'e
Here's a hypothetical example of why I don't agree that srana "x1 is
pertinent/relevant to x2" could be used to mean "dedicated to":
Let us say that I wrote a book, and upon its being published, I gave it
the dedication "To my wife, for putting up with me as I wrote this".
Then is would be true that {lo mi cukta cu ckini lo mi speni lodu'u ca
nu mi ciska ku sy. se fanza mi}.
(You forgot a "lo" before after "ca".)
However, other than the dedication, myHere is a non-hypothetical example from my own experience: Whenever I create something, for example when I compose a piece or when I write a book or any such thing, I always dedicate it to someone (and it's always a different person each time). If someone was familiar with my musical pieces and wanted to refer to one of them, I would consider it entirely correct to use srana/pe thus:wife has nothing to do with the book- the story contained within has
absolutely nothing to do with my wife in any way, except in that she may
find it enjoyable to read, which has nothing to do with the decision to
dedicate it to her, and so {lo mi cukta cu na srana lo mi speni}, it's
in no way pertinent to/relevant to/concerning/about my wife.
mi nelci lo do zgike se finti .i pu zi tinju'i lo do se finti pe la'o me. Han Ga Eun .me
Or:
mi pu zi tinju'i lo srana be la'o me. Han Ga Eun .me
"I like your compositions. I just listened to your Han Ga Eun piece."
That's the easiest way to distinguish them, especially since I don't give my pieces names. pe/ne/srana are by nature vague and rely on context. And I think that's a good thing.
mu'o mi'e la selpa'i
--
pilno zo le xu .i lo dei bangu cu se cmene zo lojbo je nai zo lejbo
doị mèlbi mlenì'u
.i do càtlu ki'u
ma fe la xàmpre ŭu
.i do tìnsa càrmi
gi je sìrji se tàrmi
.i taị bo da'i pu cìtka lo gràna ku
.
.
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"danlu" means "x1 is an animal of species x2". I meant that the set of
cats is a subset of the set of all animals. Is vlasisku not usable by
blind people? I suppose so. vlasisku.lojban.org
mu'o mi'e ianek
On 2 Gru, 18:22, Annie <park.an...@asb.gaggle.net> wrote:
> What is danlu? How can mlatu be a subset of anything? I honestly think the whole thing is crazy.
>
> Sent from my iPod
>
> On Dec 2, 2012, at 10:14 AM, ianek <jane...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2 Gru, 14:02, Jonathan Jones <eyeo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 2:48 AM, la gleki <gleki.is.my.n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:32:48 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 1:03 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 11:15:01 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>>>> On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 12:00 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> >>>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 10:50:42 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>>>>>> On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 11:09 PM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
> >>>>>>>>> On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
>
> >>>>>>> Sorry, it should be
> >>>>>>> * srana x1 is releted to x2*
> >>>>>>> * ckini x1 is related to x2 by relationship x3*
>
> >>>>>> Well, by that definition, srana is {ckini fi zi'o}, which makes them
> >>>>>> synonyms in the same way that litru is to klama (litru = {klama zi'o zi'o}).
>
> >>>>> Haven't you read my previous post? I mean that choosing words from full
> >>>>> definitions ARBITRARILY can lead to this result which is nonsense.
> >>>>> ju'o it's all bad glossing.
> >>>>> I suggest that srana refers to topic and ckini means "to be associated
> >>>>> with".
> >>>>> to dedicate is {finfriti}, {tecu'u} etc.
>
> >>>> No, ko'a srana ko'e means that ko'a is relevant to ko'e, i.e. ko'a has
> >>>> something to do with ko'e.
>
> >>>> While it is true that the topic of something is pertinent, something
> >>>> which is pertinent is not necessarily the topic.
>
> >>> Then what is your opinion about my first post? Is it true that "topic"
> >>> brivla has right to exist on it's own?
>
> >> My opinion is that sera'a serves the purpose. As I said, "that which is
> >> pertinent to A" is a superset of "the topic of A".
>
> > So what? By analogy: why would we have {mlatu} when it's clearly a
> > subset of {danlu}, so danlu serves the purpose of "x1 is a cat"?
>
> > mu'o mi'e ianek
>
> >>> Roosevelt is pertinent to the Great Depression, but he is most certainly
> >>>> /not/ the topic of it.
>
> >>>>> (Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing as
> >>>>>> whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For example,
> >>>>>> {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or
> >>>>>> destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters should use
> >>>>>> zo'e instead.)
>
> >>>>> I think the CLL says almost the same.
>
> >>>>>>>>> If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is
> >>>>>>>>> relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> mu'o mi'e .aionys.
>
> >>>>>> .i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
> >>>>>> (Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
>
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>
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I first thought that ckini had something to do with being related to someone like fatherhood, brotherhood, auntness (?) etc.
Guess I was wrong then. So how do you say: "Are you related?" in lojban, as in relatives. Maybe something with lanzu?
But family for my swedish ears is more like close relatives, your household or they who you share your life with, not your cousins wife or something similar.
FWIW, I define {srana} in lojban as follows:{.i lo ka ce'u srana ce'u cu ka ce'u bu'a ce'u}And actually being able to say *what* that bu'a is is what led me to a post much earlier about "srana3", which indeed, I now realise, would make {srana} essentially identical to {ckini}.(With a srana3, the definition becomes {.i lo ka ce'u srana ce'u cu ka ce'u ce'u me'au ce'u})Thus, I currently believe that srana can be defined in terms of ckini as such:{.i lo ka ce'u srana ce'u cu ka ce'u ce'u ckini lo ka co'e}
Things that are relevant to each other are simply related by an obvious relationship.
.i mi'e la tsani mu'o
On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 2:48 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:32:48 PM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 1:03 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, December 2, 2012 11:15:01 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 12:00 AM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, December 2, 2012 10:50:42 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:
On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 11:09 PM, la gleki <gleki.is...@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sunday, December 2, 2012 1:30:39 AM UTC+4, aionys wrote:On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 6:17 AM, tijlan <jbot...@gmail.com> wrote:On 1 December 2012 12:09, ianek <jan...@gmail.com> wrote:An about, a thematic focus, is more specific than that. cfika2, for
> This is just what {se srana} or {selra'a} is.
instance, may be as much relevant to cfika1 as cfika3 may be -- a work
of fiction cu srana both its plot and its author (and possibly many
other things). Consider:
la .alis. cfika sera'a lo nixli
This doesn't necessarily say that the plot revolves around a girl --
it could as well be saying the work is dedicated to a girl.
I'm sorry, I don't see how anything based on {srana} could possibly mean "dedicated to". You'll have to explain.
Well, may be it's not that something is wrong with {sera'a/pe/srana} but rather wrong usage and/or glossing.
srana x1 pertains to/is germane/relevant to/concerns/is related/associated with/is about x2.
ckini x1 is related to/associated with/akin to x2 by relationship x3.
If we arbitrarily chose parts of those definitions we'd get
srana x1 is relevant to x2
ckini x1 is relevant to x2
which is nonsense.
ckini wouldn't be that. For one thing, you left out the x3, and for another, it isn't "relevant", it's "related". The Cold War isn't relevant to WWII, but it is related (by being a direct result of it).
Sorry, it should be
srana x1 is releted to x2
ckini x1 is related to x2 by relationship x3
Well, by that definition, srana is {ckini fi zi'o}, which makes them synonyms in the same way that litru is to klama (litru = {klama zi'o zi'o}).
Haven't you read my previous post? I mean that choosing words from full definitions ARBITRARILY can lead to this result which is nonsense.ju'o it's all bad glossing.I suggest that srana refers to topic and ckini means "to be associated with".to dedicate is {finfriti}, {tecu'u} etc.
No, ko'a srana ko'e means that ko'a is relevant to ko'e, i.e. ko'a has something to do with ko'e.
While it is true that the topic of something is pertinent, something which is pertinent is not necessarily the topic.
Then what is your opinion about my first post? Is it true that "topic" brivla has right to exist on it's own?
My opinion is that sera'a serves the purpose. As I said, "that which is pertinent to A" is a superset of "the topic of A".
Roosevelt is pertinent to the Great Depression, but he is most certainly /not/ the topic of it.
(Btw, in my view, zi'o doesn't say that there is no such thing as whatever place it's in, but just that it's not important. For example, {ko'a klama zi'o zi'o ...} doesn't mean there /isn't/ an origin or destination, it just means that they don't matter. Dissenters should use zo'e instead.)
I think the CLL says almost the same.If {srana} really gives us thematic role then all the other "is relevant to" meanings can be assigned to {ckini/seki'i}.
--
mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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mu'o mi'e .aionys.
.i.e'ucai ko cmima lo pilno be denpa bu .i doi.luk. mi patfu do zo'o
(Come to the Dot Side! Luke, I am your father. :D )
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