overheating on Universal M-50

[Capn_Earl]

I'm looking for advice about a stubborn overheating problem on my 1996 Universal M-50.  Engine runs at about 165 degrees until I push it into it's 2,000-2500 RPM range, then it overheats starting at 180 degrees.  (It will sit at dock in neutral and run 2000-2500 without a problem, it is just when it is under load that it overheats.)

I've addressed the usual suspects:  impeller, thermostat, tightened belt, cleaned the heat exchanger, coolant is topped off, verified water flow from the seacock through to the exhaust elbow, inspected elbow (there was corrosion built up and had to dislodge it).  I have not replaced the sensor but thought it was at least reading different temp levels and reporting them, but...  My next step is getting someone with a heat gun to shoot some temps.

Any other ideas?

Capn_Earl
Voyager CR38

[ron Gmail]

I would remove the heat exchanger , take a very long drill bit that easily fits into the channels, and hand twist through the salt deposits. 

Ron Acierno

Director, PTSD Clinical Team RHJ VAMC Charleston SC

Professor, Psychiatry

Medical University South Carolina

Executive Director

Veterans on Deck 501c3

Sent from my iPhone

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[curtis hoffman]

  Use a product called RYDLYME...

rydlymemarine.com

[Mike Nixon]

That I did too.  Had it looked at by an experienced sailor who said it was "pristine clean".  I used  a steel rod.  Was not too crusty to start with but "boiled it" in vinegar as recommended by this person.  Came out very clean as a result.

Capn_Earl
Voyager CR38
Currently in Orange Beach, Al.

[Fragile Habitat]

The problem with the drill idea or using welding rods or straight wire is that if you have any kind of sharp edge on it as you push it down the holes you risk puncturing the holes making it useless or unknowingly draining out your fresh water coolant into the Sea.

 

There are a whole lot of "green" products to soak that thing in.

 

Also, depending where your Zinc is on the heat exhanger or somewhere else, it could have broken off and blocking the flow in the system.

[curtis hoffman]

RYDLYME does the whole deal. My marina gets big money descaling engines and heat exchangers using it. 

Paul 42-16

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[Norris & Karen Palmer]

Yes, that’s it!

 

I have a bottle in my garage but it was raining so hard I couldn’t get out there…

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

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[Keith Laker]

Earl,

What quality of anti-freeze do you use?  A cheap brand compared to a quality brand can make all the difference.   

For the first few years of our ownership of 'Briez' I had repeated problems with the Yanmar 4JH UTE overheating.  Like you,  I ran through all the usual culprits and cleaned out the heat exchanger twice.  Nothing fixed the problem for long - at anything like 85% or more of full power the over-temp alarm would go off within minutes.

I ultimately spoke about this with a Yanmar representative at one of the shows.  He admitted that the cooling circuit capacity was a little marginal on that particular engine model,  but he asked me what anti-freeze I used.   I had been using just something cheap - but at his suggestion I flushed out the system with a mild acid cleaner and a). filled it with ionised water instead of tap water and b). put some quality Texaco Havoline anti-freeze in.   We've never had a recurrence of the problem since.

Frankly I was amazed and would have been sceptical if someone else had told me this.   As I recall the Yanmar rep. told me that cheap brands of anti-freeze have much higher levels of silicate in them than decent brands.  Have a look at page 4 of the following link which seems to confirm the same: http://ldmarineservice.com/files/yanmar_bulletins.pdf

I appreciate it's a different engine to yours,  but it might be worth a try :-)

Best wishes,

Keith Laker

'Briez' NE400-14

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[Capn_Earl]

Wow, this is very interesting Keith.  I read in the link of the Yanmar bulletin  that you attached they also recommend draining the coolant every 500 hours or every year, whichever comes first.  I've had Voyager two years and have never changed the coolant.  I do not see from any maintenance records that it has been changed out by the previous owner either.  The boat came with some Prestone antifreeze leftover in a jug so I assume that is what has been in it.

Thanks Keith.

[Norris & Karen Palmer]

I am a new member to the group.

 

Does the group have a owners web site?

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/caborico/-/uqc0tJZT3TMJ.

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[Larry Barker]

No not that I know of. This is it but you will find a lot of good people and excellent info here.

Larry Barker

Venteux

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On Nov 18, 2012, at 6:36 AM, "Norris & Karen Palmer" <4pa...@centurytel.net> wrote:

I am a new member to the group.

 

Does the group have a owners web site?

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

<image003.png>

[Cab...@aol.com]

We had one at one time, but we all started using this. Anyway welcome to the group.

 

Breck Caine CR 38 #19

[June Ruby]

Welcome to the group, Norris and Karen!

June and Duane Ruby

SeaClearly

CR42 #14

On Nov 18, 2012, at 6:36 AM, "Norris & Karen Palmer" <4pa...@centurytel.net> wrote:

I am a new member to the group.

 

Does the group have a owners web site?

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

<image003.png>

[Norris & Karen Palmer]

Thank you,

 

I am having a Cabo Rico Northeast 400 being surveyed to-day.

 

It sure is a great design for the Pacific Northwest.

 

 

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

[Mickey Panayiotakis]

Nice!

ON the website: we have a rudimentary page that's basically a placeholder for a few files that the group here has uploaded.  BUt first, the wealth of information is on the group archives, which I'm sure you found already on Google Groups.

The documents are linked to from http://www.croa.us/

mickey

[Keith Laker]

Hey,  sounds like fun!  I hope all goes well with the survey and purchase.

We've owned NE 400 hull number 14 for 12 years now and still can't think of a better combination out there.  It's a good sailboat - and can be exceptionally good on certain points of sail.  That considerable beam makes her very stiff and comfortable when motoring too.  However - for a motorsailer,  I think the engine noise can be intrusive.  It might have improved on later boats.  What hull number are you buying?

Best wishes

Keith Laker

On Nov 18, 2012, at 16:15, "Norris & Karen Palmer" <4pa...@centurytel.net> wrote:

Thank you,

 

I am having a Cabo Rico Northeast 400 being surveyed to-day.

 

It sure is a great design for the Pacific Northwest.

 

 

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

<image003.png>

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

[Norris & Karen Palmer]

I actually don’t know we have just done the survey and its being written up and its not on yachtworld.

 

Its good to hear about it especially all the write ups so favorable.

 

We currently have a Fisher 34 motor sailer with a Westerbeke 69 hp.

 

This boat seems so comfortable and spacious and bright.

 

You can get to the engine with no problems, lots of storage, you can do everything without having to go out on deck.

 

You know the rest!

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

[Mickey Panayiotakis]

Fisher! good looking boats.I saw a fisher catamaran one time. IT looked like two monohulls with a bit in-between. Met the guys briefly on the La Trappe  creek in MD.

Y

[Keith Laker]

Funnily enough when I bought Briez,  the only other boat seriously in contention was as Fisher 34! That had the reputation of having the best sailing performance of all the Fishers. (Sorry - I've taken this thread rather off topic)

Keith Laker

Sent from my mobile

On 19 Nov 2012, at 01:13, "Norris & Karen Palmer" <4pa...@centurytel.net> wrote:

I actually don’t know we have just done the survey and its being written up and its not on yachtworld.

 

Its good to hear about it especially all the write ups so favorable.

 

We currently have a Fisher 34 motor sailer with a Westerbeke 69 hp.

 

This boat seems so comfortable and spacious and bright.

 

You can get to the engine with no problems, lots of storage, you can do everything without having to go out on deck.

 

You know the rest!

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

<image003.png>

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

[Clay]

..another reason for possible over heating:

http://www.challengers101.com/CoolantMix.html

Clay AA3JY

s/v 'Tango'
CR 34
 

[Norris & Karen Palmer]

The Fisher is a True, heavy get you anywhere solid vessel, but the Cabo 400 is just so much more roomier and comfortable.  Getting on and off is so great, the visual through the pilot house is great, getting to the engine is great, the head and shower is great, the galley is gormet, inside and outside steering, never having to get on deck in howling winds to reef, can’t wait.

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

[Capn_Earl]

Latest update:

Had a mechanic looking at the engine with me today.  There is an oil pressure sensor that the previous owner had added.  We noticed that it was showing a high reading when idling - 60 psi when it should have been around 20 psi or so.  We changed oil and filter to see if we could bring that down.  We disconnected the high temp alarm at the gauge to determine if it was the oil pressure causing the alarm or the high temp when we went out for a sea trial.

Once out the engine temp gauge began to creep up to 180 but went no higher.  The mechanic used the heat gun sensor and saw no place on the engine, besides the exhaust, was over 158 degrees.  The oil pressure gauge remained at low 60's - still too high.  But the new fireboy CO monitor that I had installed was beeping every 30 seconds with the green light on - the manual indicated that the voltage to it was too low, thus the beeping.  We saw that the engine was not charging the batteries per the link2000.  Then the system did begin charging and all three sensors began to behave correctly - the oil pressure gauge went to 40 psi, the temp gauge went to 165, the heat sensor still read 158 degrees and the Fireboy quit chirping. 

Fiver or ten minutes later the system again quit showing a charge and the gauges corresponded to their erroneous levels, a sign of some electrical problem.  Over 20 minutes it went off and on about three times.  I was somewhat relieved to know that we have at least cleared the engine of significant problems.  (However, I still want to flush the freshwater system as you had mentioned Keith.)

A side note - when back at the dock without any shore power, the link2000 shows battery bank 1 at a 12.65 V level and battery bank 2 at 12.7 V.  The Fireboy behaves as it should in this condition.

I have to leave the boat for several weeks but will post what we find in our next big adventure chasing this down.  Thanks for everyone's input.

Capn_Earl
Voyager CR38

On Saturday, November 17, 2012 7:18:55 AM UTC-5, Capn_Earl wrote:

[Norris & Karen Palmer]

What a mystery.

 

This should be sent to the manufacturer!

 

From the Salish Sea

48’ 34.099 Degrees North

123’ 10.456 Degrees West

Norris & Karen Palmer

Photo by Mayaswhalewatch.biz

 

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