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CORRECTING DR. MANTIK

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David Von Pein

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Dec 19, 2009, 10:46:01 AM12/19/09
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http://www.BlackOpRadio.com/black453a.ram

On December 17, 2009, conspiracy advocate Dr. David Mantik made an
appearance on Len Osanic's "Black Op Radio" (linked above).

During this radio appearance, Dr. Mantik tells the audience that
there's something fishy about the fact that President Kennedy's lead
autopsy surgeon, Dr. James Humes, had told Dr. Pierre Finck that a set
of X-rays had already been taken of JFK prior to Humes' phone call to
Finck on 11/22/63, with Mantik saying this:

"This means only one thing--and it's inescapable. The body must
have been there BEFORE 8:00, or these X-rays could not have been taken
so that Humes could make his call [to Dr. Finck] a few minutes after
eight [o'clock]."

Now, apparently Dr. Mantik has never bothered to read Dr. James Humes'
Warren Commission testimony (or maybe Mantik has merely chosen to
ignore it), which has Humes saying this to Arlen Specter and the
Commission:

DR. HUMES -- "The President's body was received at 25 minutes before
8, and the autopsy began at approximately 8 p.m. on that evening. You
must include the fact that certain X-rays and other examinations were
made before the actual beginning of the routine type autopsy
examination."

ARLEN SPECTER -- "Precisely what X-rays or photographs were taken
before the dissection started?"

DR. HUMES -- "Some of these X-rays were taken before and some during
the examination which, also maintains for the photographs, which were
made as the need became apparent to make such."

These words (repeated below) spoken by Dr. Humes during his Warren
Commission session on 3/16/64 (less than four months after the
President's autopsy) totally destroy David Mantik's theory about
something suspicious going on with regard to JFK's body at Bethesda
Naval Hospital on the night of Kennedy's autopsy:

"The President's body was received at 25 minutes before 8." --
James J. Humes; March 16, 1964 [at 2 H 349, linked below]

http://history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh2/html/WC_Vol2_0179a.htm

Does Dr. Mantik think that Dr. Humes was lying through his teeth when
he told the Warren Commission that JFK's body arrived at 7:35 PM (vs.
the 8:00 figure that Mantik seems to want to believe)?

Once again, it appears that the simplest of tasks (i.e., looking up
Dr. Humes' testimony) is able to thoroughly debunk a conspiracy
theorist's imaginative speculation surrounding certain elements of the
JFK assassination.

BTW, Dr. Humes said exactly the same thing to the HSCA in 1978 when it
comes to the topic of "When did JFK's body arrive at Bethesda?".
Here's what Humes said in '78 to the HSCA (which perfectly aligns with
his WC testimony from 14 years earlier):

DR. HUMES -- "The President's body, as I recall, arrived about 7:30 or
7:35."

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/m_j_russ/hscahume.htm

http://www.DavidVonPein.blogspot.com

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David Von Pein

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Dec 19, 2009, 12:20:00 PM12/19/09
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http://groups.google.com/group/alt.assassination.jfk/browse_thread/thread/c24c461be6e86619


>>> "Humes fudged and fibbed. So let's rely on DOCUMENTARY evidence instead. When did the President's plain shipping casket arrive? See Boyajian document: He wrote that the time of arrival was "18:35 pm"." <<<

Which translates to 6:35 PM (EST). Which means that that particular
"shipping" casket (if a casket of that nature ever existed in the
first place) couldn't possibly have contained the body of President
Kennedy, because JFK's body departed Andrews AFB at approx. 6:15 PM
EST, and it was certainly more than just a 20-minute ride (via fairly
slow-moving hearse/ambulance) from Andrews to Bethesda.

So, Dr. Humes' estimate of 7:30 to 7:35 for the arrival time of JFK's
casket is a much more reasonable (and almost certainly accurate)
estimate.

Besides, any type of "official" "18:35" arrival time at Bethesda for
JFK's casket certainly doesn't help out Dr. Mantik's theory regarding
the caskets, because Mantik seems to want to believe (via his 12/17/09
Black Op appearance) that JFK's body "officially" arrived at Bethesda
at 8:00 exactly, not 6:35 (18:35).

But, then too, since Mantik is apparently a believer in David Lifton's
batch of "body-altering" nonsense, I suppose Mantik also believes that
there were TWO "official" times for casket arrivals at Bethesda that
night (even though I think it would have been physically impossible to
get JFK's body to Bethesda by 6:35 PM on November 22nd, even if you DO
swallow Lifton's silliness about body alteration).

François Carlier

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Dec 19, 2009, 6:04:36 PM12/19/09
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Very good post, as usual.

You talk sense, and I congratulate you for that.

Now, I must say that I consider Mantik a quack, if I may say so, a
charlatan, a "Lifton double".

You have again proved that he -- and his friend Fetzer -- (both claim that
the Zapruder film was altered, among other conspiracy ideas) is incompetent,
and his attempts at showing that there was a consiracy are doomed to
failure.

/Fran�ois Carlier/

"David Von Pein" <davev...@aol.com> a �crit dans le message de
news:5c3189b0-923c-4520...@z41g2000yqz.googlegroups.com...

lazu...@webtv.net

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Dec 19, 2009, 8:11:16 PM12/19/09
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What are Von Pein's qualifications and Dr. Mantik's? You probably would
believe Humes over Mantik( destroyed his notes-first draft of Autopsy
Report, and was wrong by 4 to 5 inches on the entrance wound for one of
the headshots...Humes has no credibility at all period. As Horne says"
he's a very skilled liar"......Laz

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David Von Pein

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Dec 20, 2009, 12:56:24 AM12/20/09
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>>> "Humes has no credibility at all, period. As [Doug] Horne says, "he's a very skilled liar".....Laz" <<<


"Laz", as usual, has written an idiotic post above.

If Dr. James Humes was "a very skilled liar", he would have never
admitted to burning ANY autopsy-related materials.

But since Humes WASN'T a liar and had no reason to hide anything
(including the burning of autopsy papers), he told the truth.

His conscience was clear, and his testimony about "burning" stuff
(when he certainly could have just kept his mouth shut about it)
supports that fact.

http://www.The-JFK-Assassination.blogspot.com

Gil Jesus

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Dec 20, 2009, 7:28:41 AM12/20/09
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On Dec 19, 8:11�pm, lazuli...@webtv.net wrote:

> What are Von Pein's qualifications and Dr. Mantik's?

Von Pein has no qualifications.

All he has is a keyboard.

Chuck Schuyler

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Dec 20, 2009, 11:25:43 AM12/20/09
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If we're going to solve the case on "qualifications", you certainly
are off the list. Unless "Spittle-Faced YouTube Pirate" now counts for
something.

What do you bring to the case, Gil? An Associates degree? Kooktards
like you are the ones who think they can Google and YouTube their way
toward a solution to the JFK "mystery". If it wasn't so laughably
absurd it would be sad...grown men who believe thousands of men and
women framed innocent American Hero Ozzie Rabbit (whom CT researcher
Martin Shackelford actually belives scouted/picked the motorcade
route) so the plotters could have their evil war in 'Nam, oil
depletion allowance, Cuban invasion, unfettered mafia operations, etc.

Collectively, Kooktards like you, Rossley, robcap, Sam McClung, Laz,
Walt, etc. also believe in UFO's at Roswell, the Loch Ness Monster,
Bigfoot, Bush knocked down the WTC, Roosevelt knew about Pearl Harbor
in advance, the CIA hypnotized Sirhan Sirhan, the FBI killed MLK Jr.,
and so on. This doesn't make you wrong about the JFK murder per se,
but it dose show that you are (collectively) raving, nutty Kooktards.

Do you honestly think that something as vast as what you Kooktards
propose--a multi agency, multi gunmen ambush in broad daylight in
front of hundreds of people, many with cameras, movie cameras, etc.
could succeed? Don't you think something simpler would've been
proposed? Poisoning his food? Crashing his Marine One helicopter? How
about waiting until next November to see if he even gets reelected?
How about leaking stories about his non-stop womanizing or his
proveable lies about his health to others in his party or the press to
weaken him politically?

Don't you find it odd that with each passing year more books with more
theories purporting to give us the real scoop on JFK's murder are
published? Shouldn't the theories be narrowed down by now? On one
hand, we have the basic template that Oswald killed JFK and Tippit on
his own, and on the other hand, we have anything else you can imagine.
The JFK murder is unique in that the list of suspects expands each
year. Heck, you even promoted the possibility that Connally may have
whipped a pistol out from the floorboards of the limo and snapped off
a round at JFK! Put another possible suspect on the list, right Gil?
To the non-insane, this is a sure sign that something bigger,
psychologically, is going on with the JFK murder, and that it's not
about a man in a window tragically firing a few bullets at some men in
a car.

One word neatly summs up the Kooktard Krowd:

P-A-R-A-N-O-I-D.

To you guys, the USA is evil. It killed its Crown Prince Camelot
President who was a noble man bent on changing the status quo (Hope-
and-Change before the new Hope-and-Change) and the evil right-wing
powerbrokers who wanted America to remain AmeriKKKa couldn't take it,
so they framed a lefty (who was really a righty pretending to be a
lefty for the CIA).

Get a job, Gil. Get out in that snow in Philly today and shovel a
sidewalk for a senior citizen to show some holiday spirit. Do
something, anything, to get your mind off of the wacky, nutty, weird
things you believe were going on in Dealey Plaza on 11/22/63.


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